Guild Wars 2

Aeolus.3615:

Dawdler.8521:

Mounts, lol… Player housing, even more lol… Marriage system?! Downright laughable.

Its real simple. There are two types of peoples we want to bring back to the game: Roleplayers and WvWers.

(…)

Those are the things this engine almost ignore, we have a wvw model that almost doesn’t work, full of “unfixed glitches”, map design is what we know, full stacked server to cap a tower etc, and looks like the number of max players is far from reach the 500 per server.
About rolleplay i dont even understand why people choosed gw2 for roleplaying when theres mmo’s with politicals options and full control of the map.

Uh I should have thought it was obvious; because they like the lore and the setting it gives.

cesmode.4257:

eisberg.2379:

Season 2 Living story brought me back to Guild Wars 2, because how they are conducting the season 2 this time around. Other than expansion pack, all the other stuff listed in the original post would not have brought me back.

In the words of Vayne,

You are one person. You do not represent the many, and there are many others that are not like you…therefor whatever you say is not fact.

Actually everything he said is a fact. He knows exactly why he came back. That’s fact. And it’s a fact that casts doubts on the title of this thread. And he said the other stuff on the list wouldn’t have brought him back. He would know that too.

What he didn’t do was comment on or about anyone else. So how is it not fact?

cesmode.4257:

eisberg.2379:

Season 2 Living story brought me back to Guild Wars 2, because how they are conducting the season 2 this time around. Other than expansion pack, all the other stuff listed in the original post would not have brought me back.

In the words of Vayne,

You are one person. You do not represent the many, and there are many others that are not like you…therefor whatever you say is not fact.

ok, the OP states Living Story won’t bring people back. I came back because of Living Story, therefore living story brought people back. And it is a fact that I came back because of living story, therefore what I state is a fact.

Vayne.8563:

cesmode.4257:

eisberg.2379:

Season 2 Living story brought me back to Guild Wars 2, because how they are conducting the season 2 this time around. Other than expansion pack, all the other stuff listed in the original post would not have brought me back.

In the words of Vayne,

You are one person. You do not represent the many, and there are many others that are not like you…therefor whatever you say is not fact.

Actually everything he said is a fact. He knows exactly why he came back. That’s fact. And it’s a fact that casts doubts on the title of this thread. And he said the other stuff on the list wouldn’t have brought him back. He would know that too.

What he didn’t do was comment on or about anyone else. So how is it not fact?

So, he says he came back to GW2 because he likes LS season 2. You say fact.

So when I say I didnt come back because LS sucks, what is that?

Vayne.8563:

Xenon.4537:

Dusty Moon.4382:

Xenon.4537:

Dusty Moon.4382:

Xenon.4537:

Kohlteth.3715:

~Guild Wars (GvG)

So basically Arenas like WoW ?

They are nothing alike… Did you play GW1?

You can already do GvG in OS and in sPvP (5 vs 5). Why do we need something special?

What guilds do in OS is not “real” GvG. It’s community-organized zerg bashing. It’s interesting and all that, but “real” GvG was an official game type with matchmaking structure, rewards, and special maps. It involved specifically tailored game modes like capture the flag. Comparing that to the GvG in OS is like saying Halo or Counter Strike is the same as Gary’s Mod.

It is REAL GvG – sorry – just because it does not fit your GW1 definition of GvG. It istill GvG.

“My definition.”

Right. Because I made up my own personal definition out of thin air. Forget the fact that GvG in GW1 ever existed as a definition of “GvG.”

Here, I have an idea. Lets go grab a boulder. I’ll put it in the middle of Rata Sum. My team of random people starts at the Artificer station. Yours starts at the Leatherworking station. First team to get the boulder back to base wins. This will be the official Capture the Flag game! Now that we invented that, all other “definitions” of CTF are invalid and Anet should never waste time making a “real” CTF gametype…

Does anyone else see how ridiculous this is?

@Dusty Moon

Look I’m not trying to belittle your OS GvG. I’m sure it’s complex and competitive and all that. But it is simply…

Not

The

Same

…as GvG from GW1. We call that “real” GvG because it was an actual game mode developed by Anet, not an ad-hoc community-created activity. It’s like saying “real” football is what the NFL does as opposed to the football that your friends might play in the back yard.

But GvG will never ever be the same as Guild Wars 1 without dedicated healers. With the ability to dodge roll. This game is different because it’s built to be different. I’m pretty sure if GvG were duplicated and we dropped Guild Wars 2 characters into it, it wouldn’t be anything like Guild Wars 1 players would want it to be.

You’re right. They can’t copy/paste GW1 into GW2. But they can develop GW2 GvG along the same lines from scratch. The way game design works is they set a goal and work towards it. They figure out what works and what doesn’t and change things accordingly, but they always have their eye on the goal. What was GW1 GvG?

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Guild_versus_Guild

So here we have a PvP game mode where two structured teams face off on a unique map with unique mechanics.

Victory Conditions:
- kill enemy guild lord npc
- enemy team reaches 60% death penalty
- time runs out, and the more aggressive team wins

Map Mechanics:
- environmental effects
- NPCs
- Flag stand: a central point which grants 10% moral boost if held for 2 minutes

All of these things are easily possible in GW2. In fact many of them already exist in current sPvP conquest.

1. Enemy guild lord and NPCs already exist in Forest of Niflhel and Legacy of the Foefire.
2. Flag stand buff: this already exists in the form of capture points and buffs such as those on Temple of the silent storm. Also Spirit Watch has an orb which is mechanically the same as a capture the flag game.
3. Environmental effects: this is like saying all player’s have -50% endurance or move 25% slower in certain areas. The frost fractal has a health degen environmental effect before you kill the first boss.
4. Timer and aggression: this already exists in the form of each team trying to reach 500 points first, while having a hard time limit on the match.

So at the end of the day, GvG could be created by combining different elements of things which already exist in GW2 and have been proven to work. The only difference is that GvG would involve a matching system using guilds, and it would have significantly different objectives. Rather than focusing on holding capture points, GvG involves more attack and defense of the base and the guild lord. The capture point grants a buff rather than passively raising your team’s score.

Vayne.8563:

Xenon.4537:

Dusty Moon.4382:

Xenon.4537:

Dusty Moon.4382:

Xenon.4537:

Kohlteth.3715:

~Guild Wars (GvG)

So basically Arenas like WoW ?

They are nothing alike… Did you play GW1?

You can already do GvG in OS and in sPvP (5 vs 5). Why do we need something special?

What guilds do in OS is not “real” GvG. It’s community-organized zerg bashing. It’s interesting and all that, but “real” GvG was an official game type with matchmaking structure, rewards, and special maps. It involved specifically tailored game modes like capture the flag. Comparing that to the GvG in OS is like saying Halo or Counter Strike is the same as Gary’s Mod.

It is REAL GvG – sorry – just because it does not fit your GW1 definition of GvG. It istill GvG.

“My definition.”

Right. Because I made up my own personal definition out of thin air. Forget the fact that GvG in GW1 ever existed as a definition of “GvG.”

Here, I have an idea. Lets go grab a boulder. I’ll put it in the middle of Rata Sum. My team of random people starts at the Artificer station. Yours starts at the Leatherworking station. First team to get the boulder back to base wins. This will be the official Capture the Flag game! Now that we invented that, all other “definitions” of CTF are invalid and Anet should never waste time making a “real” CTF gametype…

Does anyone else see how ridiculous this is?

@Dusty Moon

Look I’m not trying to belittle your OS GvG. I’m sure it’s complex and competitive and all that. But it is simply…

Not

The

Same

…as GvG from GW1. We call that “real” GvG because it was an actual game mode developed by Anet, not an ad-hoc community-created activity. It’s like saying “real” football is what the NFL does as opposed to the football that your friends might play in the back yard.

But GvG will never ever be the same as Guild Wars 1 without dedicated healers. With the ability to dodge roll. This game is different because it’s built to be different. I’m pretty sure if GvG were duplicated and we dropped Guild Wars 2 characters into it, it wouldn’t be anything like Guild Wars 1 players would want it to be.

This was my exact point. GW2 IS NOT GW1 and will never be. Hence, GvG will not be the same nor could it ever be the same.

Want GW1 GvG – play GW1.

cesmode.4257:

Vayne.8563:

cesmode.4257:

eisberg.2379:

Season 2 Living story brought me back to Guild Wars 2, because how they are conducting the season 2 this time around. Other than expansion pack, all the other stuff listed in the original post would not have brought me back.

In the words of Vayne,

You are one person. You do not represent the many, and there are many others that are not like you…therefor whatever you say is not fact.

Actually everything he said is a fact. He knows exactly why he came back. That’s fact. And it’s a fact that casts doubts on the title of this thread. And he said the other stuff on the list wouldn’t have brought him back. He would know that too.

What he didn’t do was comment on or about anyone else. So how is it not fact?

So, he says he came back to GW2 because he likes LS season 2. You say fact.

So when I say I didnt come back because LS sucks, what is that?

I have several guildmates that have TOLD me they came back because of LS2. That is a fact.

Sorry, but Vayne is right about what this poster said is fact. The poster was commenting on why he came back, not other people. So how can that NOT be a fact?

What you asked about yourself also is fact. You believe the LS sucks and didn’t come back because of it. I see in no place where anyone disputed that. So it is a fact. No one said it was not.

It sounds like you are trying to deflect admitting you were wrong about saying that what the poster said wasn’t fact IMO.

All, this is game is a B2P game just like GW1. GW1 had people bouncing in and out all the time. Nothing will change that.

Dusty Moon.4382:

Vayne.8563:

Xenon.4537:

Dusty Moon.4382:

Xenon.4537:

Dusty Moon.4382:

Xenon.4537:

Kohlteth.3715:

~Guild Wars (GvG)

So basically Arenas like WoW ?

They are nothing alike… Did you play GW1?

You can already do GvG in OS and in sPvP (5 vs 5). Why do we need something special?

What guilds do in OS is not “real” GvG. It’s community-organized zerg bashing. It’s interesting and all that, but “real” GvG was an official game type with matchmaking structure, rewards, and special maps. It involved specifically tailored game modes like capture the flag. Comparing that to the GvG in OS is like saying Halo or Counter Strike is the same as Gary’s Mod.

It is REAL GvG – sorry – just because it does not fit your GW1 definition of GvG. It istill GvG.

“My definition.”

Right. Because I made up my own personal definition out of thin air. Forget the fact that GvG in GW1 ever existed as a definition of “GvG.”

Here, I have an idea. Lets go grab a boulder. I’ll put it in the middle of Rata Sum. My team of random people starts at the Artificer station. Yours starts at the Leatherworking station. First team to get the boulder back to base wins. This will be the official Capture the Flag game! Now that we invented that, all other “definitions” of CTF are invalid and Anet should never waste time making a “real” CTF gametype…

Does anyone else see how ridiculous this is?

@Dusty Moon

Look I’m not trying to belittle your OS GvG. I’m sure it’s complex and competitive and all that. But it is simply…

Not

The

Same

…as GvG from GW1. We call that “real” GvG because it was an actual game mode developed by Anet, not an ad-hoc community-created activity. It’s like saying “real” football is what the NFL does as opposed to the football that your friends might play in the back yard.

But GvG will never ever be the same as Guild Wars 1 without dedicated healers. With the ability to dodge roll. This game is different because it’s built to be different. I’m pretty sure if GvG were duplicated and we dropped Guild Wars 2 characters into it, it wouldn’t be anything like Guild Wars 1 players would want it to be.

This was my exact point. GW2 IS NOT GW1 and will never be. Hence, GvG will not be the same nor could it ever be the same.

Want GW1 GvG – play GW1.

As I explained in an above post, it is possible for them to recreate GvG in the same spirit of the original. That’s what they call a spiritual successor. FromSoft did that with Demons Souls → Dark Souls. Acting like it is impossible to recreate something in a new environment is just unimaginative. For example, asexual cloning is not the only way to create new life. Plenty of species reproduce sexually by combining old material into new forms. However, those species don’t spontaneously generate new species. A human child is basically the same as it’s parents, but it isn’t a digital copy.

cesmode.4257:

So when I say I didnt come back because LS sucks, what is that?

The first part (“didnt come back”) can be considered fact (if, in fact, you arent playing at all – in which case, why are you on these forums so much), but the second part is opinion (“LS sucks”). It would be a fact if you said you didnt come back because you didnt think you would like the new LS.

To the OP, I have been seeing an uptick in the number of my guildees playing again in the past two weeks, but havent inquired about whether or not its related to the living story. The reality is – it doesn’t really matter why. I just like seeing more people around.

Xenon.4537:

Dusty Moon.4382:

Vayne.8563:

Xenon.4537:

Dusty Moon.4382:

Xenon.4537:

Dusty Moon.4382:

Xenon.4537:

Kohlteth.3715:

~Guild Wars (GvG)

So basically Arenas like WoW ?

They are nothing alike… Did you play GW1?

You can already do GvG in OS and in sPvP (5 vs 5). Why do we need something special?

What guilds do in OS is not “real” GvG. It’s community-organized zerg bashing. It’s interesting and all that, but “real” GvG was an official game type with matchmaking structure, rewards, and special maps. It involved specifically tailored game modes like capture the flag. Comparing that to the GvG in OS is like saying Halo or Counter Strike is the same as Gary’s Mod.

It is REAL GvG – sorry – just because it does not fit your GW1 definition of GvG. It istill GvG.

“My definition.”

Right. Because I made up my own personal definition out of thin air. Forget the fact that GvG in GW1 ever existed as a definition of “GvG.”

Here, I have an idea. Lets go grab a boulder. I’ll put it in the middle of Rata Sum. My team of random people starts at the Artificer station. Yours starts at the Leatherworking station. First team to get the boulder back to base wins. This will be the official Capture the Flag game! Now that we invented that, all other “definitions” of CTF are invalid and Anet should never waste time making a “real” CTF gametype…

Does anyone else see how ridiculous this is?

@Dusty Moon

Look I’m not trying to belittle your OS GvG. I’m sure it’s complex and competitive and all that. But it is simply…

Not

The

Same

…as GvG from GW1. We call that “real” GvG because it was an actual game mode developed by Anet, not an ad-hoc community-created activity. It’s like saying “real” football is what the NFL does as opposed to the football that your friends might play in the back yard.

But GvG will never ever be the same as Guild Wars 1 without dedicated healers. With the ability to dodge roll. This game is different because it’s built to be different. I’m pretty sure if GvG were duplicated and we dropped Guild Wars 2 characters into it, it wouldn’t be anything like Guild Wars 1 players would want it to be.

This was my exact point. GW2 IS NOT GW1 and will never be. Hence, GvG will not be the same nor could it ever be the same.

Want GW1 GvG – play GW1.

As I explained in an above post, it is possible for them to recreate GvG in the same spirit of the original. That’s what they call a spiritual successor. FromSoft did that with Demons Souls -> Dark Souls. Acting like it is impossible to recreate something in a new environment is just unimaginative. For example, asexual cloning is not the only way to create new life. Plenty of species reproduce sexually by combining old material into new forms. However, those species don’t spontaneously generate new species. A human child is basically the same as it’s parents, but it isn’t a digital copy.

I don’t think it is. That is the point. In GW1, you had very specific trinity roles to play in GvG (unless you were using a flavor of the day team build). How can that be done? You can have some semi-specific roles in GW2 but they change depending on the situation. You would have to go back to the trinity game design to get the same GvG style and that will not happen in GW2.

You are using very poor analogies to talk about GvG but you never really explained how they can get the GW1 GvG flavor. Using asexual cloning (you meant reproduction) as an example analogy? lol Too funny and has nothing to do with gaming at all. GW2 is a game that plays so unlike GW1 as to almost be, dare I say, a game apart.

Funny because it has and it happens every time so…. i think your talking for your self and small groups of like minded ppl.

I’m one of the players that left. Though I obviously liked GW2 and I am still curious about it enough to check up on it once in a while exactly and precisely in hopes they implement or improve content / features which would make me come back.

I played GW2 from open beta until about 5-6 months ago, and while I do not represent all players that have left, I represent many, either in 1 by 1 reasons or combined. In my play time I spend roughly around $350 ish total on gems (roughly around $15 a month just like monthly sub games), + the initial deluxe game edition purchase.

I played WvW and PvE alike, although gravitated towards WvW.

So here are my reasons that I left and things A-Net would need to do for me to re-download, re-install and play GW2 again:

1. Off-Peak-Time population imbalance in WvW and general population imbalance. Address this issue and at least greatly, and I do mean greatly improve it. EOTM was their experiment in this direction, but the implementation of it was extremely poor and you have the current result.

2. GWEN meta in WvW. Address it and re-balance so that ALL professions are equally playable. As an ex-commander I would love to see professions such as rangers and other professions as much more then just “sympathy carries”. Unfortunately I haven’t seen a single step taken by the devs in this direction throughout the entire balancing passes. Not one. Everything is either based on SPVP or PvE dungeons it seems.

3. Zerker meta in PvE. Same as the GWEN meta in WvW it got super stale to the point where I just stopped running dungeons and fractals. Did I run it on non-zerker builds ? Sure, plenty of times, but why bother doing a 10-15 minute run in 30-60 minutes ? Again no real steps taken in this direction. The whole ferocity change etc. accomplished nothing to help with this. Its like putting a small band-aid on a hacked off limb.

4. Lack of new maps in WvW, not EOTM, since that isnt really WVW.

5. RNG. EXTREMELY BAD SYSTEM When I left I had around 280k kills in WvW alone, + around 2-3 times that in PvE events, dungeons, maps, LS, etc.. Thats a lot of lootbags, not a single precursor.

6. Had to farm for my legendaries instead of actually performing something legendary. Seriously, why do people that complain about such a simple thing such as WvW map completion think they deserve an item with a title of legendary in it ? And why can it be bought with gems ? Wheres the legendary in the legendary ? This aspect of it left an extremely bad taste in me. The whole process other then map completion and the basic dungeon runs is just stupid.

7. Better AI and better PvE encounters, especially dungeon bosses, so that game utilizes the control and support builds as it was originally meant to instead of just zerker builds.

So thats what made me leave. Now for things that the OP mentioned:

Mounts – Maybe, but only if they were implimented as an actual legendary legendary items, not farmengaries.

Guild Halls – meh, for what ? Already have banks, crafting stations, etc. available, what functionality could a guild hall have that would make people hang out in it instead of a city ? I think this would be a waste of resources and its something I wouldn’t even consider on my list of coming back.

Expansion Pack – only if it included new WvW maps and fixes for the time zone pop imbalance and GWEN meta fix in it.

New Skills New weapons – Not really. Outside of zerker PvE meta and GWEN WvW meta or condi meta if roaming, how about make the current ones actually balanced instead of limiting the playable builds ? If I could play different builds to same effectiveness across all my 80s, that is what would make me come back, not new ones when the old are so broken.

Marriage – couldn’t give a crap, waste of resources.

Housing – couldn’t give a crap, waste of resources, whats it for ? What am I gonna do with it ? store my stuff which I already do in the bank ? Look at it ?

New Races – nice touch but not what would make me come back.

Mini Pets and anything related – The only change that I would like to see to these is so that ALL of them could be sold for gold. They are absolutely and totally useless to me.

New SPVP maps ? How about new game modes instead ? Lots and lots of game modes, the maps can be OK, its the meta that sucks.

Basically, anything that has to do with fluff, anything that has to do with LS, is to be completely ignored by myself as well as a large percentage of people that have left the game when considering if we are to come back. Only things that matter is core systems and maps. And A-Net seems to do just about everything except addressing these.

cesmode.4257:

eisberg.2379:

Season 2 Living story brought me back to Guild Wars 2, because how they are conducting the season 2 this time around. Other than expansion pack, all the other stuff listed in the original post would not have brought me back.

In the words of Vayne,

You are one person. You do not represent the many, and there are many others that are not like you…therefor whatever you say is not fact.

I would say everything he posted was FACT. His post was simply a synopsis of his personal experience in regard to the new content. I don’t see where he made the claim “since I feel this way, everyone else must too!”, you seem to imply his post states.

Along those lines, I would say ALL evidence I have seen DOES point to many old players returning despite what Living Story Haters want everyone to believe. The OP stating it will not does not make it FACT either.

Living story does bring people back. I know at least 3 players personally who came back SPECIFICALLY because they wanted to see the story.

Dusty Moon.4382:

I don’t think it is. That is the point. In GW1, you had very specific trinity roles to play in GvG (unless you were using a flavor of the day team build). How can that be done? You can have some semi-specific roles in GW2 but they change depending on the situation. You would have to go back to the trinity game design to get the same GvG style and that will not happen in GW2.

You are using very poor analogies to talk about GvG but you never really explained how they can get the GW1 GvG flavor. Using asexual cloning (you meant reproduction) as an example analogy? lol Too funny and has nothing to do with gaming at all. GW2 is a game that plays so unlike GW1 as to almost be, dare I say, a game apart.

Again and again you repeat the part where GW1 is a different game, and again and again I agree with you. You keep ignoring the part where, with a little imagination, it is easy to envision GvG in GW2. They don’t need to bring the trinity back for that. I don’t have any idea where you pulled that idea from.

With your logic, it would be impossible for any new game to ever be created. Don’t you realize new games are derivative of old ones? That goes for ALL things. New things are always somehow derived from old things.

By the way, I DID explain how they could do GvG in GW2. You seem to have missed that post.

Xenon.4537:

http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Guild_versus_Guild

So here we have a PvP game mode where two structured teams face off on a unique map with unique mechanics.

Victory Conditions:
- kill enemy guild lord npc
- enemy team reaches 60% death penalty
- time runs out, and the more aggressive team wins

Map Mechanics:
- environmental effects
- NPCs
- Flag stand: a central point which grants 10% moral boost if held for 2 minutes

All of these things are easily possible in GW2. In fact many of them already exist in current sPvP conquest.

1. Enemy guild lord and NPCs already exist in Forest of Niflhel and Legacy of the Foefire.
2. Flag stand buff: this already exists in the form of capture points and buffs such as those on Temple of the silent storm. Also Spirit Watch has an orb which is mechanically the same as a capture the flag game.
3. Environmental effects: this is like saying all player’s have -50% endurance or move 25% slower in certain areas. The frost fractal has a health degen environmental effect before you kill the first boss.
4. Timer and aggression: this already exists in the form of each team trying to reach 500 points first, while having a hard time limit on the match.

So at the end of the day, GvG could be created by combining different elements of things which already exist in GW2 and have been proven to work. The only difference is that GvG would involve a matching system using guilds, and it would have significantly different objectives. Rather than focusing on holding capture points, GvG involves more attack and defense of the base and the guild lord. The capture point grants a buff rather than passively raising your team’s score.

cesmode.4257:

Vayne.8563:

cesmode.4257:

eisberg.2379:

Season 2 Living story brought me back to Guild Wars 2, because how they are conducting the season 2 this time around. Other than expansion pack, all the other stuff listed in the original post would not have brought me back.

In the words of Vayne,

You are one person. You do not represent the many, and there are many others that are not like you…therefor whatever you say is not fact.

Actually everything he said is a fact. He knows exactly why he came back. That’s fact. And it’s a fact that casts doubts on the title of this thread. And he said the other stuff on the list wouldn’t have brought him back. He would know that too.

What he didn’t do was comment on or about anyone else. So how is it not fact?

So, he says he came back to GW2 because he likes LS season 2. You say fact.

So when I say I didnt come back because LS sucks, what is that?

Thats the same as to say : i don’t eat hamburgers so nobody eats hamburgers.

If you had said : LS won’t bring back every player .. then it would be relevant, however you more or less said “LS brings back no players at all”, and in that fact only one player that returns proves you already wrong.

And in the end the same could be said about expansion .. since i bet there are also people that won’t come back if we get an expansion that fulfills all your personal dreams.