Guild Wars 2

I think you did not consider the upgraded infusions with bonus stats almost equal to a full exotic item.
And I am talking about the ascended armor and weapons, to be introduced in a few months.

You speak mostly of what every new mmo goes through..bugs etc things might not work it’s part of life cycle of a game, every mmo out there went through this, but guess what? it gets fixed and the game goes on. People expecting a 100% working game at the beginning is nuts, and did you actually not expect Anet to not add some type of gear progression at all what so ever? That’s a little naive. The gear grind in this game is small compared to other games, literally, I’ve played games where the gear grind is so bad it is completely out of reach.

Also I am a casual as well and I can still do fractals and do what is needed, you are making the situation worse than it is. Sit back and realize how good we actually have it.

Memnoch.2589:

You speak mostly of what every new mmo goes through..bugs etc things might not work it’s part of life cycle of a game, every mmo out there went through this, but guess what? it gets fixed and the game goes on. People expecting a 100% working game at the beginning is nuts, and did you actually not expect Anet to not add some type of gear progression at all what so ever? That’s a little naive. The gear grind in this game is small compared to other games, literally, I’ve played games where the gear grind is so bad it is completely out of reach.

Also I am a casual as well and I can still do fractals and do what is needed, you are making the situation worse than it is. Sit back and realize how good we actually have it.

Never expected it to work, ive expected priority on fixing like most games did! What did i get? Focus on new contents, and the shock that 2!!! designers work on balance, hell yea…

masztipapa.7519:

Memnoch.2589:

You speak mostly of what every new mmo goes through..bugs etc things might not work it’s part of life cycle of a game, every mmo out there went through this, but guess what? it gets fixed and the game goes on. People expecting a 100% working game at the beginning is nuts, and did you actually not expect Anet to not add some type of gear progression at all what so ever? That’s a little naive. The gear grind in this game is small compared to other games, literally, I’ve played games where the gear grind is so bad it is completely out of reach.

Also I am a casual as well and I can still do fractals and do what is needed, you are making the situation worse than it is. Sit back and realize how good we actually have it.

Never expected it to work, ive expected priority on fixing like most games did! What did i get? Focus on new contents, and the shock that 2!!! designers work on balance, hell yea…

You act like this game has been out for years…It launched August 28th for Christ sake! other mmos never had their crap together that quickly have some patience.

Yeah, my son quit a month ago, I’m still playing, but not as much. It’s just not the same game they promised or gave us at launch. I understand the need to adapt, but such a radical departure only a few months after launch? They must have a lot of people leaving the game to do so.

This new direction only fragments the community further.

Also lost motivation (though I still care for this game) because THIS is what I expected with this it:

“So if you love MMORPGs, you should check out Guild Wars 2. But if you hate traditional MMORPGs, then you should really check out Guild Wars 2. Because, like Guild Wars before it, GW2 doesn’t fall into the traps of traditional MMORPGs. It doesn’t suck your life away and force you onto a grinding treadmill; it doesn’t make you spend hours preparing to have fun rather than just having fun […]”

Fractals anyone? Enough said.

Source: http://www.arena.net/blog/guild-wars-2-design-manifesto

Same here. =/

The game changed alot in it’s community, sometimes it is really a singleplayer game because we are simply alone. Not even Guilds are helpfull anymore in theese things. =/

Even with the lack of motivation to keep playing this game, I don’t regret in buying it.

I mainly enjoyed the game for wvw but the grind for legendaries/ascended is just too much to contemplate. I was happy with exotics being top tier. Played every day since release, thought I’d be playing for years, but haven’t logged in since the day after the stat changes to legendaries was announced.

I’m really sad I didn’t play original Guild Wars during it’s prime time. I only started to play it one and a half year ago, and I loved it. I wish I could’ve started to play it sooner.

I logged back in a day ago, but there weren’t many people online at all.

The problem that I see is that, like everything else (life, politics, etc), the wheel that sqeaks the loudest gets the oil. What I’m trying to say is that, when they made this announcement, they specifically stated that they did it because of the people who were complaining that it essentially WAS NOT like other games.

People who enjoy this game, weren’t taking to the forums, because they were pleased with how it was. However, those who wanted the cookie cutter mmo experience, who are used to/expect the grind, didn’t “get” the game and wanted justification (a carrot on a stick) for the money they spent on the game. So they QQd about it, and the team gave in.

The quote in question is this:

“As we watch Guild Wars 2 mature in its Live environment, we have found that our most dedicated players were achieving their set of Exotic gear and hitting “the Legendary wall.” We designed the process of getting Legendary gear to be a long term goal, but players were ready to start on that path much sooner than we expected and were becoming frustrated with a lack of personal progression. Our desire is to create a game that is more inclusive for hardcore and casual players alike, but we don’t want to overlook the basic need for players to feel like they are progressing and growing even after hitting max level. Adding item progression is a delicate process normally undertaken in an expansion, but we feel it’s important to strive to satisfy the basic needs of our players sooner rather than later.”

So the developers rushed the content to shut the people up. I don’t think we’re ever going to get a game that is a “breath of fresh air” because you’re always going to have the people who hit lvl 80 in three days, then start crying “wtf” on the forums, instead of enjoying it. And when they do that, they ruin the experience for everyone else because the devs have to dumb the game down to the lowest-common-denominators who play it.

p.s. – when the devs say “but we feel it’s important to strive to satisfy the basic needs of our players sooner rather than later”, I think they need to realize that post-legendary gear is not a basic need. It’s not OUR fault these players rushed the content. Let us enjoy our kitten game, and give us OUR basic needs.

The people who like this need everyone to keep chasing the carrot so gear grinding will be relevant and they know it, we know raiders only make up a few hundred thousand players on every game they play but once they take over populations drop.

They did some very negative things passively with this new gear grind window, and it IS gear progression simply for the fact that to Enjoy the content you have to grind that specific gear you also have to have that specific gear to fight o ff the specific conditions in that dungeon.

In a game where crafting is largely cosmetic it will automatically be devalued by an instituted gear grind. Who is going to spend good money on vanity items when the game is now being turned on its head to appease ##@$% raiders with Phat loots?

With a gear treadmill and infinitely repeatable dungeons, the amount of tiers they can add is limitless. It only took them a few months to introduce one tier of highly specialized Windowed gear and a new dungeon, not only can they enhance the gear levels for that they can do much more harm in a few more months, Ascended level II or some other notch above. People who do pvp and adventure but sometimes want to do dungeons are just screwed. Raiders like that because they can now control the content by using gear gating with the guilds that have it. Its that exact kind of community destroying garbage that makes EQ2 unplayable and why I cannot stand those people.

So what happens 6 months from now after they have introduced 4 more dungeons and just as many new gear levels and each dungeon has some special armor you have to have to survive it, you think everyone interested in world pvp will want to grind all that crap just to do WvWvW? Or will Bioware.. I mean Anet make some half as good WvWvW only “award” gear like in Wintergrasp so you will still be treated like a sub par citizen with slightly better than crap gear. .. they wouldnt be planning some bs like that now would they.
WvWvW has and will now be a continuous carrot on a stick for you to be FORCED to grind new dungeons and get new gear tiers. So basically it is now WORSE than doing 5 mans or dailies in WOW, no you HAVE to do these dungeons to keep your gear up and you will now HAVE to join guilds of people you probably would rather not be dealing with.

And of course after all that happens they still would not have fixed Necromancers or made WvW or sPVP interesting. But don’t worry they will probably introduce gear score, gear score + pug finder, and new dungeon enhancements maybe tokens and probably even dailies before they ever touch anything to do with pvp.

xiv.7136:

Gehenna.3625:

TL;DR Adding gear progression took away the forgiving attitude people had towards other flaws in the game. Now people reassess and find GW2 lacking as a gear progression game.

That’s because GW2 is not a gear progression game.

3% difference in stats is utterly meaningless, it’s pretty much just a vanity item.

People who cry so hard about this just can’t do maths properly.

Try your math again, son. It’s 20-50% higher stats, without infusion.

AsheRayne.9726:

p.s. – when the devs say “but we feel it’s important to strive to satisfy the basic needs of our players sooner rather than later”, I think they need to realize that post-legendary gear is not a basic need. It’s not OUR fault these players rushed the content. Let us enjoy our kitten game, and give us OUR basic needs.

This ^

They’re falling into the trap of trying to please the type of player who will never be pleased. People who rush to the level cap, then burn through to get the upper tier gear and then demand more… so you keep giving them more, and more, and more as they burn through content as fast as they can, just to get it over with….. and in the meantime all the other gaming mechanics (PvP,WvW, Personal Story, Crafting, etc.) gets left further and further behind.

Now you’ve gone from a game that used to please many different types of players to one that kind of satisfies that one type of hard core group player, but only for a little while, as loing you always have a new tier for them to play. That’s assuming those hard core guys don’t just all go back to WoW, and then your entire game goes out of business, because you built the game around that WoW raiding type of player and ignored everyone else.

I really wish people would go to other cities, LA is nowhere near as beautiful as DR or RATA Sum or BC IMO

Cyric.7485:

Tolmos.8395:

Not only are they refusing to even so much as comment on the fiasco, but they are using the fact we have to play FotM to keep up with the gear grind as we currently have no other choices to PR spin it appearing to be popular? 0_o That’s a fine way to say “We don’t care what our users think. It’s all about what WE want, since that worked so well for Star Wars Galaxies.”

Even though I know I’m wrong, I secretly hope the reason they’re “ignoring” all the complaints is because they’re attempting the same tactic used to teach babies to not cry for attention.

lookitsandrea.8531:

I was in a group with 4 80’s, and as a level 50, nobody complained or commented on my level. In fact, I was the “leader” of the group who started the whole thing – and we finished level 1 in FotM.

No offense but that’s probably because a group of level 20’s being played by monkeys could complete FotM level 1…

Probably the only positive thing I have to contribute to this thread is that Tarnished Coast is a great server with a great community if anyone is looking to jump ship to a new server. I’m currently on FotM level 12 and I have never been gearchecked or anything of the sort. I rarely see people complaining in LA map chat, I rarely see any sort of “elitist” recruitment messages for any dungeon, etc etc. I highly recommend TC for anyone who values a good community, we’re also pretty good in WvW if that’s important to you.

Deuces.

No offense taken haha. I’m just saying… And I’m on TC as well. Really great community here.

Yup, after lost shores I only played a bit of WvW
Now that Planetside 2 is out and its awesome Ive stopped playing GW2 all together

Really sad seeing one patch destroy such a good game
Gear Grind and all players never leaving the maincity /sigh

Kouken.8604:

Really sad seeing one patch destroy such a good game

The exact same thing happened with Star Wars Galaxies. The exact same thing. The best part about it? The patch that killed that game was also released on November 15th. =D

It’s almost like Anet scuttled their AAA MMO as a tribute to SWG. lol It only furthers my belief that the devs were forced into this by some suit clad imbecile and they are taking every opportunity to let us know “It’s not our fault”. =D

The Fractals and ascended gear wasent what broke this game. It was already failing before that.
The once that whine now, are the casuals that are still left.
The hardcore players have already left. And fractals and 1 easy to get set is not nearly enough to bring them back.
The game has many flaws that s made loads of players already leave, such as combat system, holy trinity etc.

Dreamwalker.3617:

I have to admit, there was something in gw1 that’s missing in this game. The feeling of walking through pre-searing Ascalon, escaping a pack of Charr, fighting the Stone Summit, getting betrayed by the White Mantle… I miss those feels.

I agree here.. the feels.. they’re gone. gw1 had soooo much going for it, even after we completed it, most of us happily made a new class and beat it 5-6 more times, and farmed the 15k armor for style. gw2 is just… a mess. a mess they refuse to accept. The story is crap, the way it advances too fast to the lame cutscenes of talking. I will always be around, it’s guild wars, but guild wars 2 just does not get my love. I remember when they brought Sorrows Furnace into gw1, people LOVED IT. The GW2 version of Sorrows Furnace is Fractals… how’s that going for you anet?

Just today, I clicked the icon and pressed LOGIN… then sighed, and closed the window.

I had full exotics before Fractals… now I feel as if I cannot keep up. If I wanted to stay on a gear treadmill, I would have stayed with Warcraft. WoW has a lot more to offer overall for me, but I hated the treadmill so I was thrilled at the release of GW2. I guess I’ll pick up a copy of the PandaLand expansion and reactivate my WoW account. And even though GW2 has no monthly fee, I am not bothered by the $15 per month at WoW.

I alternate between boredom and frustration at this point. It’s not quite “Smedley’s Folly” yet (the nickname I gave to the disastrous secret re-engineering of Star Wars Galaxies), but it’s getting close.

The game feels like a huge “bait and switch”, in that now, if I actually want gear, I’ll have to do what I’ve had to do in every other MMO for years – find a pick-up group, group with them, put up with a few rounds of verbal abuse as I memorize a dungeon, and then, finally, get gear (if I’m lucky) on subsequent, repetitive runs of that dungeon. If I want to continue getting recipes for my various professions, I have to do what I’ve had to do in every other MMO for years – grind, day after day, hoping to obtain the materials needed to get a coveted recipe.
If I want to continue to complete achivements, I have to do with I’ve had to do in every other MMO for years – find a pick-up group, and either run dungeons or PvP. (Seriously, I have to PvP to complete an exploration achievement? And not just PvP, but WvW? Might as well just tell me “don’t work for it – just wait a full round of rotations and ignore all that WvW crap.”)

I can get that experience anywhere. There’s nothing novel there. Why would I want to do it in a buggy, unbalanced, economically damaged game environment that, for an endgame, goes from being wide-open and dynamic to boxed-in and on rails once I hit max level? That hasn’t worked for most games – why do it here?

I can only echo the OPs sentiments.

My motivation levels were already pretty low pre 15th Nov patch. Post patch, it’s almost non existent.

I have a feeling that most people that bought the game based on the manifesto are feeling the same way.

Simply put Im done arguing about whether or not vertical progression is necessary/good or not.

My loss of motivation to play boils down to one thing.

Lack of non-cosmetic grind/having a stat plateau like GW1 was advertised to me, and I bought the game because of that.

Its not about what is right or wrong in game design, its about the game not being what i bought it for to begin with

Me too and I love this game. I was content with making my character look bad kitten But just seeing the amount of grind needed to get ascendead gear just makes me lose motivation. Also have been on the grind for Legendary so there is def no chance of keeping up with getting that gear. The stealth nerf or bug on drops on rares in the cursed shore is discouraging too as now its even harder to make gold/get mats. I wil prob be taking a break from this game for awhile now.

Don’t agree.

Too many people here burned through the game and didn’t take their time. Meanwhile my friend and I both are only in our 50s and have been playing since Sept 25th. Play most nights and 2-3 hours. Been exploring and taking our time and enjoying the game.

I think overall too many people play MMOs way too much now and expect it to not only entertain them for endless hours, but fill whatever empty void they have with free time.

The game only requires 5 people to run the fractals. If you can’t find 5, then you need more friends or a better guild or transfer servers.

I think a lot of you should go back to the other MMO and try/see how green that grass is (and how bad the graphics are) for comparison.

The same complaints being voiced here are being voiced on the WoW forums in their own iterations. Too much grinding. Nothing to do at max level as a solo or small group player. Feels like a job and so on. Tired of running the same dungeons. Trinity fails, etc.

Ryth.6518:

The same complaints being voiced here are being voiced on the WoW forums in their own iterations.

So, WoW is a broken game using 10 year old game mechanics, and that makes it ok for GW2 to do it also?

I don’t get your point.

Raincrow.1840:

Ryth.6518:

The same complaints being voiced here are being voiced on the WoW forums in their own iterations.

So, WoW is a broken game using 10 year old game mechanics, and that makes it ok for GW2 to do it also?

I don’t get your point.

My point is that many of you just need to take a break. Come back when the new content comes out. That is how this game was designed. It’s not designed to entertain you every single day. I’m reading posts by people who play 8-10 hours a day. Absurd. WTF do you expect when you play this game like a job?

xiv.7136:

You will be back to GW2 very quickly.

GW2’s graphics, gameplay, awesome PVP and WvW, being able to dodge etc – just destroys other MMOs, as you will quickly discover.

That did make me laugh.

Answer to thread: The game was overhyped and is a huge fail. I stopped playing way before these grind additions.

Selo.1250:

The game has many flaws that s made loads of players already leave, such as combat system, holy trinity etc.

Combat system is great.

The holy trinity? LOL…they have that in here…its called control, support, damage.

Can’t help most of you just run pure damage and don’t understand the other 2 roles. They do exist and you can spec/gear to be very strong at them. The problem is most don’t know how to.

WoW combat is so boring and mundane. Hey look…the tank grabbed agro. DPS run your rotation. Healer play whack-a-mole…90% of the combat in WoW is that.

Ryth.6518:

My point is that many of you just need to take a break. Come back when the new content comes out. That is how this game was designed.

They DID just release new content. If the answer to new content release is to go play something else, they’ve messed something up in a major way.

Ryth.6518:

WTF do you expect when you play this game like a job?

I don’t play the game like it’s a job. I’m a solo player, somewhat casual. I don’t think you understand the complaints at all. The new fractals REWARD those players who make the game a job, and screws over the rest of us who don’t. Just becuase you don’t realize the impact upper tier gear has on you, the casual player, doesn’t mean it’s not there.

Ryth.6518:

Don’t agree.

Too many people here burned through the game and didn’t take their time. Meanwhile my friend and I both are only in our 50s and have been playing since Sept 25th. Play most nights and 2-3 hours. Been exploring and taking our time and enjoying the game.

I think overall too many people play MMOs way too much now and expect it to not only entertain them for endless hours, but fill whatever empty void they have with free time.

The game only requires 5 people to run the fractals. If you can’t find 5, then you need more friends or a better guild or transfer servers.

I think a lot of you should go back to the other MMO and try/see how green that grass is (and how bad the graphics are) for comparison.

The same complaints being voiced here are being voiced on the WoW forums in their own iterations. Too much grinding. Nothing to do at max level as a solo or small group player. Feels like a job and so on. Tired of running the same dungeons. Trinity fails, etc.

I didn’t like the recent content at all. I was quite happy before it released. Why on earth should I wait for even more grindy content? I don’t get it.

I’ll tell you why this is a horrible game, and this is the first time I’ve posted in a while because I have quit GW2 so I see no need to create a thread and rant but I had a urge this evening to play GW and it just dawned on me how big of a disappointment this game was.

This is far and away the single biggest let down I’ve experienced in my gaming life. What REALLY makes me frustrated is ANet don’t care or just simply can’t see the problem or won’t acknowledge it because the players don’t matter anymore, their share holders do.

ANet doesn’t exist anymore. the only people I still have respect for are people like ree soesbee, because they really have amazing lore writers oh and their art team to of course. But developers just don’t know a thing about what made GW great. It’s obvious they have way too many people on the team at this point and are taking all the wrong suggestions + making all the wrong moves.

But like I said, no longer the ANet we knew. It’s all about revenue now. They want to attract the sheep that we avoided like the plague by playing GW1. That’s what made the game so great, you could get a full set of max armor and switch your build out any time, for free! In Failwars 2 I don’t even have saved build templates and it costs money for some stupid reason, no GvG, no good healing/support. no nothing like GW.

The manifesto of GW2 said that it took all the things we loved about GW1 and put it into a big persistent world, but let me translate this for you: “we took everything you loved about GW1, took a huge dump on it, and made a persistent world.” That’s pretty much how I feel about this failure of a sequel. I knew GW2 would be different, but with the removal of pretty much everything that made GW fun and so replayable it’s just too much of a disappointment to even log in and play.

GW2 has zero replayability, no matter how much content they add. Why? Because the builds are boring, there are no templates to save your builds anyways, you need to grind (lololo remember dat no-grind policy?) multiple different set combinations to even make those builds viable, like who is going to run a full condition build on an armor set with no condition damage? I spent 13g on my exotics and now I’m broke, I kinda have a social life.

Something else amazing about GW1, I could have a life and play an MMO at the same time and experience all the content. I can’t believe people calling GW2 soooo casual, lol clearly you never played GW. Even when I was on vacation or on a weekend from work/life and playing GW for hours on end it would never get boring. Honestly at this point, the way gear and builds work, I believe WoW is even more casual than GW2.

GW has never been about stat’s, but since BlizzNet have done a whopping 180 on everything I guess it is now.

inb4 post deletion + ban, not like it matters since I don’t play anymore. if I were to compare this to an equally horrible letdown I think only FF13 could make the list. what the hell is wrong with gaming companies these days… enjoy your world of guild wars craft, yet another company who sold its soul.

oh by the way, great one time epic event guys.. it was so bugged I couldn’t even do it and I didn’t have time to sit around waiting for hours with everyone else waiting for you to finally reset the servers.

I haven’t exactly lost my motivation to play, but being an explorer type once a game isn’t new any more it’s just looses something for me.
However a lot of people around me are loosing motivation to play so the game is starting to feel a bit empty.

I don’t understand why the ascended and and legendary items needed a stat boost and didn’t just have the infusion slots added to them. To be honest I think a better thing would have been to be able to arrange your own Major and Minor stats. In the same way that in gw1 Green items were ‘best’ but gold items had the same stats but more customization.
I just do not understand at all, I lvoed gw1 because once you were level 20 everyone was on the same playing field. After that you really only worked for skins for your stuff, not stats and it was all down to your own skill rather than the stats of your weapons and armor.
Surely you noticed that people will work for skins. Obsidian armor was the most ridiculously expensive armor in the whole game. I think that’s the the main reason people wanted it, just ebcause it was something to work for.

I also dislike the way that LA is strongly encouraged as the only ‘town’. The other main cities are always dead and theya re so much nicer to be in that LA. Perhaps add free travel to your characters races city? This would make each city feel more alive, and if people want they can still get to LA through the Asura gates. This changes pretty much nothing as everyone can travel to LA for free anyway through pvp. Why not direct it through home cities instead?

Also I really miss Hard Mode from gw1. I reckon it could be brought back as a dungeon style thing where you get in your party of 5, and then enter a personal instance of the area you’re in. Then you get karma and gold for killing everything, maybe there’s a boss as well? I found the vanquisher title to be so satisfying, you could tick off areas of the map and think “I killed everything in that area”
Also Hard Mode really worked, got everyone playing again as people were starting to think “hmm what shall I do now…..”

Possibley the neding 5 people thing could be changed. For me the main reason I was so excited for gw2 is because I wouldn’t be foreced to party with other people/heroes/henchmen in order to achieve something. I liked that you could join up if you wanted but it wasn’t necerssary in order to play.
However now it is, the whole process of finding other people to play with is aggrivating and a waste of time. And by that I mean you can spend a good hour or so trying to find a group of people, which is time not spent just playing. (And for people who don’t have as much time to play it does feel like a useless hour.)
This wouldn’t be a problem if all the ‘good’ items weren’t just in dungeons, or if you could play scaled version of dungeons by yourself or with one other person.

I do have more to say, but long post over for now

Hmmmmmm…

IMO, too many people rush to be the best and have the best in a game. Once they reach a certain plateau that requires too much grind/effort to jump the hurdle, then they begin to complain. Too often such changes to accomondate these complaints result in the game being put off balance for the rest.

A game can offer so much and GW2 has offered (offers) lots. The problem is that the mentality of a gamer is to pursue to be the best, regardless of the theme/type, so once enough players reach a certain high plateau, the game developers need to cater for them – and what best way than to add content which makes it even harder than before to gain something they have not acquired yet.

This is the only logical progression that gamers and gaming industry takes. Things just keep getting harder so that only select few can “boast” about having it done. The only problem is, by that time, majority of players would have moved on because they got bored with it.

I miss the good old days of GW1. I seriously doubt I’ll stick around much longer.

Death Reincarnated.3570:

Hmmmmmm…

IMO, too many people rush to be the best and have the best in a game. Once they reach a certain plateau that requires too much grind/effort to jump the hurdle, then they begin to complain. Too often such changes to accomondate these complaints result in the game being put off balance for the rest.

A game can offer so much and GW2 has offered (offers) lots. The problem is that the mentality of a gamer is to pursue to be the best, regardless of the theme/type, so once enough players reach a certain high plateau, the game developers need to cater for them – and what best way than to add content which makes it even harder than before to gain something they have not acquired yet.

This is the only logical progression that gamers and gaming industry takes. Things just keep getting harder so that only select few can “boast” about having it done. The only problem is, by that time, majority of players would have moved on because they got bored with it.

So tired of the “rushing” excuse, as though GW2’s leveling is supposed to be some epic journey that players deliberately cheated and skipped somehow. The game spoonfeeds you XP at every corner. I have played somewhat casually, usually around 2, never more than 3 hours a night and I got to 80 in less than a month. Leveling itself hasn’t been that amazing either – don’t get me started on the “dynamic, ever-changing world” that actually has less change than WoW’s phasing system.

The problem people had was not the absence of a treadmill, but the complete lack of gameplay options after the level cap apart from backtracking. Everyone knew this game was not supposed to have a treadmill. That’s fine. The big endgame question was, “What is ArenaNet going to bring to the table to replace the treadmill?”. As it turned out, nothing. ArenaNet should have taken the sandbox approach, and given players more freedom in the world, as well as actual choices and lasting consequences to actions. You can see some sandbox elements already – the leveling is pretty directionless, you decide what you want to do and when to do it. The problem is, sandbox games need things to do. In GW2, the entire gameplay boils down to “kill, kill, kill, kill some more”. Nothing else to it. Meanwhile, real sandbox games have player-controlled territory, player built housing and even cities, guild vehicles, inter-player political systems, player-driven economy, etc. If ArenaNet actually made the gameplay in the main PvE world interesting and complex enough, there would not have been endgame complaints.

Guild Wars 2 itself is not a complete game and they are adding new things and modifying the game every few months. Lets all stop looking at the crystal ball and stop predicting the future. Ascended gears are there but you can don’t grind for it and play the game as it is. Let’s just hope the limit ascended gears for PVE only so we have less complain .. maybe?

Tolmos.8395:

Kouken.8604:

Really sad seeing one patch destroy such a good game

The exact same thing happened with Star Wars Galaxies. The exact same thing. The best part about it? The patch that killed that game was also released on November 15th. =D

It’s almost like Anet scuttled their AAA MMO as a tribute to SWG. lol It only furthers my belief that the devs were forced into this by some suit clad imbecile and they are taking every opportunity to let us know “It’s not our fault”. =D

dude you got it all, been working for a while on gaming industry myself and that’s it 90% of the time, games should be developed and published by developers only, those marketing “genius” they can only please 7 years old minded people.

Anyway i think Anet is in that 10% category, have faith this is part of a bigger picture

Losing steam now especially due to the last update but hey, maybe that AMA later will get me inspired to play again?

I haven’t played in a week. The recent changes combined with the countless other issues I’d previously been willing to overlook have just pushed the game over the edge for me.

I’m still following the game to see if they wise up and back down about these changes but I’m not hopeful.

Raincrow.1840:

Ryth.6518:

My point is that many of you just need to take a break. Come back when the new content comes out. That is how this game was designed.

They DID just release new content. If the answer to new content release is to go play something else, they’ve messed something up in a major way.

Ryth.6518:

WTF do you expect when you play this game like a job?

I don’t play the game like it’s a job. I’m a solo player, somewhat casual. I don’t think you understand the complaints at all. The new fractals REWARD those players who make the game a job, and screws over the rest of us who don’t. Just becuase you don’t realize the impact upper tier gear has on you, the casual player, doesn’t mean it’s not there.

I understand the complaints just fine.

Why are you worrying about what other players who want to play this game like a job are doing?

If you want to do it, put a group of 4 others together and complete the FotM and get the gear.

So tired of the “rushing” excuse, as though GW2’s leveling is supposed to be some epic journey that players deliberately cheated and skipped somehow. The game spoonfeeds you XP at every corner. I have played somewhat casually, usually around 2, never more than 3 hours a night and I got to 80 in less than a month. Leveling itself hasn’t been that amazing either – don’t get me started on the “dynamic, ever-changing world” that actually has less change than WoW’s phasing system.

The problem people had was not the absence of a treadmill, but the complete lack of gameplay options after the level cap apart from backtracking. Everyone knew this game was not supposed to have a treadmill. That’s fine. The big endgame question was, “What is ArenaNet going to bring to the table to replace the treadmill?”. As it turned out, nothing. ArenaNet should have taken the sandbox approach, and given players more freedom in the world, as well as actual choices and lasting consequences to actions. You can see some sandbox elements already – the leveling is pretty directionless, you decide what you want to do and when to do it. The problem is, sandbox games need things to do. In GW2, the entire gameplay boils down to “kill, kill, kill, kill some more”. Nothing else to it. Meanwhile, real sandbox games have player-controlled territory, player built housing and even cities, guild vehicles, inter-player political systems, player-driven economy, etc. If ArenaNet actually made the gameplay in the main PvE world interesting and complex enough, there would not have been endgame complaints.

And player controlled territory, housing, cities, vehicles, etc all die out when people leave the game, etc and then the whole concept fails badly and imbalance takes place.

I agree ANet was silly to give so much easy XP along with making leveling easy and quick. You shouldn’t get xp for crafting. You shouldn’t get XP for gathering. Thats why my friend and I don’t do crafting or gathering till max level.

There is nothing at the end of finishing a book. You have to wait for the next one to come out. So just like people who rush through a book, those that rushed through GW2 will have to wait now for the next big content patch.

What exactly does an end game over years of time look like without any kind of gear or vertical progression of items or stats like say wow does? I mean how do you keep players playing the game without any kind of gear progression or items or anything? End game is a different ball game then the journey to get there even if lower zones scale why would anyone bother?
Maybe arena net thought maybe gear treadmill is the best way to do an end game since most casual players will get bored and quit regardless so end game gives more serious players a point to keep playing? I dont know but I would hear suggestions on an end game with no item progression like how you do that.

juiceman.2870:

What exactly does an end game over years of time look like without any kind of gear or vertical progression of items or stats like say wow does? I mean how do you keep players playing the game without any kind of gear progression or items or anything? End game is a different ball game then the journey to get there even if lower zones scale why would anyone bother?
Maybe arena net thought maybe gear treadmill is the best way to do an end game since most casual players will get bored and quit regardless so end game gives more serious players a point to keep playing? I dont know but I would hear suggestions on an end game with no item progression like how you do that.

If you played GW1 you would know the answer to that question. Go look it up.

What is GW1 end game can a GW1 player please explain?

LordYz.8941:

What is GW1 end game can a GW1 player please explain?

Cosmetic rewards + running dungeons and vanquishing, which is when you clear mobs in an entire area or “zone” you get a reward for it. And pvp that wasn’t total garbage when ANet gave a crap about balancing. Also using different builds, a lot of people called it build wars, well because that’s pretty much what it was and it gave the game a lot of replayability.

There were thousands of different skills in GW1. That may be a slight exaggeration as I don’t quite remember the exact number but there was a ton. I would say there was at least around 800 to 1k skills.

It was almost like building a magic deck, always trying to improve and counter the people you played against, instead GW2 took a linear and extremely boring road. Yeah there were meta builds, but meta’s always changed as well. Meta’s don’t change in GW2. Not enough skills or builds honestly.

Were the different builds and tons of skills made available during the first few months of GW1 or introduced over the years?
I am really interested in knowing not trolling.

Tolmos – your writing style reminds me of an EvE player I used to talk with a lot…

In fact the more I read some of these “Waaaaaaah REMEMBER 11/15!!!!” threads the more I suspect the bitter-vets over there decided to try to rebuild old space glory (monopolisation in game, and stagnation of the game) in a single-economy fantasy setting.

Games evolve or die – and a single server full of “rolled at release” types is dead.

With each campaign added they brought new skills and a new profession and campaigns were released quite fast iirc. I looked up the total and there is 1319 skills you could use after eye of the north, I can’t remember how many there was at release because that was over 6 years ago for me.

Raincrow.1840:

Ryth.6518:

My point is that many of you just need to take a break. Come back when the new content comes out. That is how this game was designed.

They DID just release new content. If the answer to new content release is to go play something else, they’ve messed something up in a major way.

Ryth.6518:

WTF do you expect when you play this game like a job?

I don’t play the game like it’s a job. I’m a solo player, somewhat casual. I don’t think you understand the complaints at all. The new fractals REWARD those players who make the game a job, and screws over the rest of us who don’t. Just becuase you don’t realize the impact upper tier gear has on you, the casual player, doesn’t mean it’s not there.

Raincrow, these types of players who think it’s “no big deal” to the casuals will get rude awakenings when they are in WvW and get the hammer dropped on them by enemies that DID get all that “no big deal” grind armors.

Oh there will be plenty of wailing and gnashing of teeth then.

These types have absolutely no vision.

For any players old enough to remember DAoC, and the abomination that was Trials of Atlantis… it’s an all too familiar story of forced-PVEing ruining RvR (exact same thing as WvW here).

I like WvW. I don’t want to PvE any more than was necessary to get to 80 (which honestly isn’t even required if you’re willing to zerg it up in WvW as an uplevel). I don’t want a PvE grind. Period. I left WoW because of that. I quit DAoC because of that. I ditched Rift because of that.

And when I saw it’s arrival here in GW2, my heart sank.

After that, it’s been hard to even give a flip about WvW. Since it’s only a matter of time before I’ll be heavily outclassed in my already outclassed yellows.