NPE From An Actual New To MMO Player.
No, I mean that this game needs a tutorial instead of dumping down tha game.
The game should explain the downstate rather than locking it off, the game should explain bundles you can pick up rather than removing them, the game should explain class mechanics and skills instead of locking them away. The game got dumbed down because there is no proper tutorial. There are some quick tips you get here and there but they wont help. A one-time tutorial could help new players before they start playing regular, while vetaran players don’t have to bother with the tutorial. At the moment vetaran players, as they level an alt, have to bother with that non-existing mechanics just because it could be too complicated for new players.Well anet thought that the average player would be smart enough to figure the downed state themselves. They just delayed the introduction of it so people would have to deal with one thing at a time.
And as a veteran player I tell you it doesn’t bother me. I level that fast in general that being restricted until level 7 isn’t a hinderance.They don’t only locked the downstate but also the skills of the downstate, which you will unlock later. Yet they’re still not explaining the downstate or its skills.
They may not be explaining the downstate, but it’s easier to read a single skill when you’re down and figure out what it does than four at once.
On the other hand, this is one of the changes I really didn’t like.
They may not be explaining the downstate, but it’s easier to read a single skill when you’re down and figure out what it does than four at once.
On the other hand, this is one of the changes I really didn’t like.
Instead of adding the skills to the weapon overview in the hero panel, they lock them away. Yeah… sounds rational.
They may not be explaining the downstate, but it’s easier to read a single skill when you’re down and figure out what it does than four at once.
On the other hand, this is one of the changes I really didn’t like.
Instead of adding the skills to the weapon overview in the hero panel, they lock them away. Yeah… sounds rational.
So you expect people who just started the game to know about the weapon overview?
(Yeah I’m out)
They may not be explaining the downstate, but it’s easier to read a single skill when you’re down and figure out what it does than four at once.
On the other hand, this is one of the changes I really didn’t like.
Instead of adding the skills to the weapon overview in the hero panel, they lock them away. Yeah… sounds rational.
So you expect people who just started the game to know about the weapon overview?
(Yeah I’m out)
I expect ANet to implement a simple tooltip or a proper tutorial to direct new players to said overview. Something like “If you ask yourself what your weaponskills or your Downstateskills do, just go into your heropanel and look them up”.
Can’t be that difficult.
They may not be explaining the downstate, but it’s easier to read a single skill when you’re down and figure out what it does than four at once.
On the other hand, this is one of the changes I really didn’t like.
Instead of adding the skills to the weapon overview in the hero panel, they lock them away. Yeah… sounds rational.
So you expect people who just started the game to know about the weapon overview?
(Yeah I’m out)I expect ANet to implement a simple tooltip or a proper tutorial to direct new players to said overview. Something like “If you ask yourself what your weaponskills or your Downstateskills do, just go into your heropanel and look them up”.
Can’t be that difficult.
Proper tutorials work for some people and don’t work for others. Nothing works for everyone. That’s why multiple teaching tools should be included.
However if you have the time and resources to implement one, you implement the one that tests shows are most effective.
They may not be explaining the downstate, but it’s easier to read a single skill when you’re down and figure out what it does than four at once.
On the other hand, this is one of the changes I really didn’t like.
Instead of adding the skills to the weapon overview in the hero panel, they lock them away. Yeah… sounds rational.
So you expect people who just started the game to know about the weapon overview?
(Yeah I’m out)
Yes, the weapons overview is definitely a place where downed skills should be added. But that wouldn’t likely help a new player much at all.
They may not be explaining the downstate, but it’s easier to read a single skill when you’re down and figure out what it does than four at once.
On the other hand, this is one of the changes I really didn’t like.
Instead of adding the skills to the weapon overview in the hero panel, they lock them away. Yeah… sounds rational.
So you expect people who just started the game to know about the weapon overview?
(Yeah I’m out)I expect ANet to implement a simple tooltip or a proper tutorial to direct new players to said overview. Something like “If you ask yourself what your weaponskills or your Downstateskills do, just go into your heropanel and look them up”.
Can’t be that difficult.Proper tutorials work for some people and don’t work for others. Nothing works for everyone. That’s why multiple teaching tools should be included.
However if you have the time and resources to implement one, you implement the one that tests shows are most effective.
Tooltips are there for the other half. If people neither use the tutorial, nor the tooltips and then quit because they don’t understand the game, then it’s entirely their fault and other players shouldn’t be crippled just because of the stupidity of a minority.
And what are those tests you’re always talking about? I never heard about someone testing this, exept the Q&A section and I don’t trust those guys, they’ve done too many mistakes in the past.
They may not be explaining the downstate, but it’s easier to read a single skill when you’re down and figure out what it does than four at once.
On the other hand, this is one of the changes I really didn’t like.
Instead of adding the skills to the weapon overview in the hero panel, they lock them away. Yeah… sounds rational.
So you expect people who just started the game to know about the weapon overview?
(Yeah I’m out)I expect ANet to implement a simple tooltip or a proper tutorial to direct new players to said overview. Something like “If you ask yourself what your weaponskills or your Downstateskills do, just go into your heropanel and look them up”.
Can’t be that difficult.Proper tutorials work for some people and don’t work for others. Nothing works for everyone. That’s why multiple teaching tools should be included.
However if you have the time and resources to implement one, you implement the one that tests shows are most effective.
Tooltips are there for the other half. If people neither use the tutorial, nor the tooltips and then quit because they don’t understand the game, then it’s entirely their fault and other players shouldn’t be crippled just because of the stupidity of a minority.
And what are those tests you’re always talking about? I never heard about someone testing this, exept the Q&A section and I don’t trust those guys, they’ve done too many mistakes in the past.
I don’t care who’s fault it is. It’s their fault and Anet’s problem. See, more players is better for the game. Turning away people who’s fault it is is exactly why hard core play is dying.
Many hard core players think everyone learns like them, everyone plays like them, everyone thinks like them. So they raise the bar so high that new people often don’t get a chance. They get abused. They get bullied. They get insulted. And they leave. That’s only a step away from what you’re doing.
These people aren’t like me, so they don’t deserve to play. How does them not playing, their fault or not, help anyone?
Sometimes players are their own worst enemies.
They may not be explaining the downstate, but it’s easier to read a single skill when you’re down and figure out what it does than four at once.
On the other hand, this is one of the changes I really didn’t like.
Instead of adding the skills to the weapon overview in the hero panel, they lock them away. Yeah… sounds rational.
So you expect people who just started the game to know about the weapon overview?
(Yeah I’m out)I expect ANet to implement a simple tooltip or a proper tutorial to direct new players to said overview. Something like “If you ask yourself what your weaponskills or your Downstateskills do, just go into your heropanel and look them up”.
Can’t be that difficult.Proper tutorials work for some people and don’t work for others. Nothing works for everyone. That’s why multiple teaching tools should be included.
However if you have the time and resources to implement one, you implement the one that tests shows are most effective.
Tooltips are there for the other half. If people neither use the tutorial, nor the tooltips and then quit because they don’t understand the game, then it’s entirely their fault and other players shouldn’t be crippled just because of the stupidity of a minority.
And what are those tests you’re always talking about? I never heard about someone testing this, exept the Q&A section and I don’t trust those guys, they’ve done too many mistakes in the past.I don’t care who’s fault it is. It’s their fault and Anet’s problem. See, more players is better for the game. Turning away people who’s fault it is is exactly why hard core play is dying.
Many hard core players think everyone learns like them, everyone plays like them, everyone thinks like them. So they raise the bar so high that new people often don’t get a chance. They get abused. They get bullied. They get insulted. And they leave. That’s only a step away from what you’re doing.
These people aren’t like me, so they don’t deserve to play. How does them not playing, their fault or not, help anyone?
Sometimes players are their own worst enemies.
New players that aren’t even willing to understand the game, which was entirely possible pre NPE, aren’t neither helping the game, nor ANet because they’ll leave quickly and they wont buy gems.
They may not be explaining the downstate, but it’s easier to read a single skill when you’re down and figure out what it does than four at once.
On the other hand, this is one of the changes I really didn’t like.
Instead of adding the skills to the weapon overview in the hero panel, they lock them away. Yeah… sounds rational.
So you expect people who just started the game to know about the weapon overview?
(Yeah I’m out)I expect ANet to implement a simple tooltip or a proper tutorial to direct new players to said overview. Something like “If you ask yourself what your weaponskills or your Downstateskills do, just go into your heropanel and look them up”.
Can’t be that difficult.Proper tutorials work for some people and don’t work for others. Nothing works for everyone. That’s why multiple teaching tools should be included.
However if you have the time and resources to implement one, you implement the one that tests shows are most effective.
Tooltips are there for the other half. If people neither use the tutorial, nor the tooltips and then quit because they don’t understand the game, then it’s entirely their fault and other players shouldn’t be crippled just because of the stupidity of a minority.
And what are those tests you’re always talking about? I never heard about someone testing this, exept the Q&A section and I don’t trust those guys, they’ve done too many mistakes in the past.I don’t care who’s fault it is. It’s their fault and Anet’s problem. See, more players is better for the game. Turning away people who’s fault it is is exactly why hard core play is dying.
Many hard core players think everyone learns like them, everyone plays like them, everyone thinks like them. So they raise the bar so high that new people often don’t get a chance. They get abused. They get bullied. They get insulted. And they leave. That’s only a step away from what you’re doing.
These people aren’t like me, so they don’t deserve to play. How does them not playing, their fault or not, help anyone?
Sometimes players are their own worst enemies.
New players that aren’t even willing to understand the game, which was entirely possible pre NPE, aren’t neither helping the game, nor ANet because they’ll leave quickly and they wont buy gems.
You repeating something doesn’t make it true. As I’ve said elsewhere, there are people in my guild who were dreadful at the game when they started. Didn’t get it at all. If my guild hadn’t found them, they might have left already. Some of them have become quite good. What purpose does turning those people away from the game serve, besides some elitist idea that certain people should be playing these games and not others.
Many people who get turned off or turned away CAN learn and can be taught. Some, of course, can’t as well. Those people will leave.
So Anet makes the game to try to get more people playing longer. What’s your beef with that? What makes you think people who invest more time are more likely to leave?
You repeating something doesn’t make it true. As I’ve said elsewhere, there are people in my guild who were dreadful at the game when they started. Didn’t get it at all. If my guild hadn’t found them, they might have left already. Some of them have become quite good. What purpose does turning those people away from the game serve, besides some elitist idea that certain people should be playing these games and not others.
Many people who get turned off or turned away CAN learn and can be taught. Some, of course, can’t as well. Those people will leave.
So Anet makes the game to try to get more people playing longer. What’s your beef with that? What makes you think people who invest more time are more likely to leave?
If you are interested in a game but don’t get it, you take the help you can get, which could be tutorials and tooltips. If you don’t and you reject both tutorials and tooltips, you wont stay for long anyways.
They may not be explaining the downstate, but it’s easier to read a single skill when you’re down and figure out what it does than four at once.
On the other hand, this is one of the changes I really didn’t like.
Instead of adding the skills to the weapon overview in the hero panel, they lock them away. Yeah… sounds rational.
So you expect people who just started the game to know about the weapon overview?
(Yeah I’m out)I expect ANet to implement a simple tooltip or a proper tutorial to direct new players to said overview. Something like “If you ask yourself what your weaponskills or your Downstateskills do, just go into your heropanel and look them up”.
Can’t be that difficult.Proper tutorials work for some people and don’t work for others. Nothing works for everyone. That’s why multiple teaching tools should be included.
However if you have the time and resources to implement one, you implement the one that tests shows are most effective.
Tooltips are there for the other half. If people neither use the tutorial, nor the tooltips and then quit because they don’t understand the game, then it’s entirely their fault and other players shouldn’t be crippled just because of the stupidity of a minority.
And what are those tests you’re always talking about? I never heard about someone testing this, exept the Q&A section and I don’t trust those guys, they’ve done too many mistakes in the past.I don’t care who’s fault it is. It’s their fault and Anet’s problem. See, more players is better for the game. Turning away people who’s fault it is is exactly why hard core play is dying.
Many hard core players think everyone learns like them, everyone plays like them, everyone thinks like them. So they raise the bar so high that new people often don’t get a chance. They get abused. They get bullied. They get insulted. And they leave. That’s only a step away from what you’re doing.
These people aren’t like me, so they don’t deserve to play. How does them not playing, their fault or not, help anyone?
Sometimes players are their own worst enemies.
New players that aren’t even willing to understand the game, which was entirely possible pre NPE, aren’t neither helping the game, nor ANet because they’ll leave quickly and they wont buy gems.
You repeating something doesn’t make it true. As I’ve said elsewhere, there are people in my guild who were dreadful at the game when they started. Didn’t get it at all. If my guild hadn’t found them, they might have left already. Some of them have become quite good. What purpose does turning those people away from the game serve, besides some elitist idea that certain people should be playing these games and not others.
Many people who get turned off or turned away CAN learn and can be taught. Some, of course, can’t as well. Those people will leave.
So Anet makes the game to try to get more people playing longer. What’s your beef with that? What makes you think people who invest more time are more likely to leave?
the people in your guild were interested and engaged enough to seek a helpful guild. The people who leave in the first 15 levels, are not the same type of people.
Im all for improving retention of new players, i just dont feel that this new system will retain as man players as they will lose on the other side due to a less well designed starter experience. The game basically starts off as a random grind to level 10 with no context, random direction, and few designed explanations. I really dont think this is more engaging to a new random player overall. It may in fact be better for a subset of players who quit because of option shock, but i dont even think the majority who quit early quit for those reasons.
The problem with asking people why they quit, is because they will say something, but that doesnt mean its really the reason they quit.
The amount of strawmanning in this thread could protect several acres of fields from crows.
Resident smug Englishman on the NA servers, just because.
You repeating something doesn’t make it true. As I’ve said elsewhere, there are people in my guild who were dreadful at the game when they started. Didn’t get it at all. If my guild hadn’t found them, they might have left already. Some of them have become quite good. What purpose does turning those people away from the game serve, besides some elitist idea that certain people should be playing these games and not others.
Many people who get turned off or turned away CAN learn and can be taught. Some, of course, can’t as well. Those people will leave.
So Anet makes the game to try to get more people playing longer. What’s your beef with that? What makes you think people who invest more time are more likely to leave?
If you are interested in a game but don’t get it, you take the help you can get, which could be tutorials and tooltips. If you don’t and you reject both tutorials and tooltips, you wont stay for long anyways.
You keep saying it and I still don’t believe it’s true. What you’re really saying is what you would do. You don’t get to talk for other people. Other people might well not go look for help. They may have never needed help in any other kind of game before. You’d turn those people away. Some might leave, some might stay. You’re just making an assumption, but you’ve yet to show any kind of evidence that this is what would happen.
You keep saying it and I still don’t believe it’s true. What you’re really saying is what you would do. You don’t get to talk for other people. Other people might well not go look for help. They may have never needed help in any other kind of game before. You’d turn those people away. Some might leave, some might stay. You’re just making an assumption, but you’ve yet to show any kind of evidence that this is what would happen.
If you buy a game for 30€ or 50€, you don’t stop playing just because you’re wielding weed and don’t know how to get rid of it.
If you playing duing a free trial weekend you either seek to see as much as you can or you don’t care at all. Either way, a tutorial would’ve the same effect without humbling all vetaran players.
They may not be explaining the downstate, but it’s easier to read a single skill when you’re down and figure out what it does than four at once.
On the other hand, this is one of the changes I really didn’t like.
Instead of adding the skills to the weapon overview in the hero panel, they lock them away. Yeah… sounds rational.
So you expect people who just started the game to know about the weapon overview?
(Yeah I’m out)I expect ANet to implement a simple tooltip or a proper tutorial to direct new players to said overview. Something like “If you ask yourself what your weaponskills or your Downstateskills do, just go into your heropanel and look them up”.
Can’t be that difficult.Proper tutorials work for some people and don’t work for others. Nothing works for everyone. That’s why multiple teaching tools should be included.
However if you have the time and resources to implement one, you implement the one that tests shows are most effective.
Tooltips are there for the other half. If people neither use the tutorial, nor the tooltips and then quit because they don’t understand the game, then it’s entirely their fault and other players shouldn’t be crippled just because of the stupidity of a minority.
And what are those tests you’re always talking about? I never heard about someone testing this, exept the Q&A section and I don’t trust those guys, they’ve done too many mistakes in the past.I don’t care who’s fault it is. It’s their fault and Anet’s problem. See, more players is better for the game. Turning away people who’s fault it is is exactly why hard core play is dying.
Many hard core players think everyone learns like them, everyone plays like them, everyone thinks like them. So they raise the bar so high that new people often don’t get a chance. They get abused. They get bullied. They get insulted. And they leave. That’s only a step away from what you’re doing.
These people aren’t like me, so they don’t deserve to play. How does them not playing, their fault or not, help anyone?
Sometimes players are their own worst enemies.
New players that aren’t even willing to understand the game, which was entirely possible pre NPE, aren’t neither helping the game, nor ANet because they’ll leave quickly and they wont buy gems.
You repeating something doesn’t make it true. As I’ve said elsewhere, there are people in my guild who were dreadful at the game when they started. Didn’t get it at all. If my guild hadn’t found them, they might have left already. Some of them have become quite good. What purpose does turning those people away from the game serve, besides some elitist idea that certain people should be playing these games and not others.
Many people who get turned off or turned away CAN learn and can be taught. Some, of course, can’t as well. Those people will leave.
So Anet makes the game to try to get more people playing longer. What’s your beef with that? What makes you think people who invest more time are more likely to leave?
the people in your guild were interested and engaged enough to seek a helpful guild. The people who leave in the first 15 levels, are not the same type of people.
Im all for improving retention of new players, i just dont feel that this new system will retain as man players as they will lose on the other side due to a less well designed starter experience. The game basically starts off as a random grind to level 10 with no context, random direction, and few designed explanations. I really dont think this is more engaging to a new random player overall. It may in fact be better for a subset of players who quit because of option shock, but i dont even think the majority who quit early quit for those reasons.
The problem with asking people why they quit, is because they will say something, but that doesnt mean its really the reason they quit.
Actually not everyone in my guild sought a helpful guild. Many people in my guild were helped because I offered them help when I saw them suffering or confused in the world. I’d see them going around in circles looking for a vista or whatever, chat to them and see if they needed help.
Many people solo these games. Far more people than most would believe. And many people who solo play it like an adventure game. They don’t go to wikis, or you tube or anything.
I know it’s nuts, but that’s my experience.
And my experience is that there are the wikis, the forums, gaming magazines, social media platforms and the chat function in game. Anyone who’s seeking help will find help.
(edited by HHR LostProphet.4801)
And my experience is that there are the wikis, the forums, gaming magazines, social media platforms and the chat function in game. Anyone who’s seeking help will find help.
Okay then. I guess that must say it all. Everyone who seeking help will find help. That’s sort of my point. Not everyone is seeking help. As hard as this is for some of us to understand, some people who don’t get stuff don’t think they need help. It’s quite common, unfortunately.
They try something it doesn’t work, they give up. You’ve never met anyone like that? You’ve never met anyone who would have given up on something and after being encouraged stayed? I find that hard to believe.
The NPE is designed to help people because a lot of people don’t LIKE to ask for help. They feel they should be able to do stuff. If you don’t think that happens, or it’s common, we’ll have to agree to disagree. But I can’t imagine that I’ve met those people all my life and you’ve met none of them.
Anet says they tested this and it worked. Are they lying?
Did they also test non-seasonal temporary content? If so, where? When? On whom?
Trait system redesign? Where, when, and upon whom was that tested?
The Personal Story revision that was delivered along with NPE? Where, when, and upon whom was that tested?
The table is a fable.
And my experience is that there are the wikis, the forums, gaming magazines, social media platforms and the chat function in game. Anyone who’s seeking help will find help.
Okay then. I guess that must say it all. Everyone who seeking help will find help. That’s sort of my point. Not everyone is seeking help. As hard as this is for some of us to understand, some people who don’t get stuff don’t think they need help. It’s quite common, unfortunately.
They try something it doesn’t work, they give up. You’ve never met anyone like that? You’ve never met anyone who would have given up on something and after being encouraged stayed? I find that hard to believe.
The NPE is designed to help people because a lot of people don’t LIKE to ask for help. They feel they should be able to do stuff. If you don’t think that happens, or it’s common, we’ll have to agree to disagree. But I can’t imagine that I’ve met those people all my life and you’ve met none of them.
And my point is that the game don’t has to be adjusted around players who aren’t interested in playing the game but around players who want to explore but need help doing so. That’s why a tutorial and tooltips will always be superior to the NPE changes.
They don’t have to ask anyone to play the tutorial or to read the tooltips. They just have to use them.
(edited by HHR LostProphet.4801)
Anet says they tested this and it worked. Are they lying?
Did they also test non-seasonal temporary content? If so, where? When? On whom?
Trait system redesign? Where, when, and upon whom was that tested?
The Personal Story revision that was delivered along with NPE? Where, when, and upon whom was that tested?
I have no idea what else they tested. I know exactly what you know.
I’m not sure how that’s relevant to the NPE comments anyway.
And my experience is that there are the wikis, the forums, gaming magazines, social media platforms and the chat function in game. Anyone who’s seeking help will find help.
Okay then. I guess that must say it all. Everyone who seeking help will find help. That’s sort of my point. Not everyone is seeking help. As hard as this is for some of us to understand, some people who don’t get stuff don’t think they need help. It’s quite common, unfortunately.
They try something it doesn’t work, they give up. You’ve never met anyone like that? You’ve never met anyone who would have given up on something and after being encouraged stayed? I find that hard to believe.
The NPE is designed to help people because a lot of people don’t LIKE to ask for help. They feel they should be able to do stuff. If you don’t think that happens, or it’s common, we’ll have to agree to disagree. But I can’t imagine that I’ve met those people all my life and you’ve met none of them.
And my point is that the game don’t has to be adjusted around players who aren’t interested in playing the game but around players who want to explore but need help doing so. That’s why a tutorial and tooltips will always be superior to the NPE changes.
Okay, I disagree and we’ll have to leave it at that, because you’re never going to convince me that people that need help doing stuff are going to ask for it. Nor will you convince me we’re better off without those people.
It’s a core disagreement on who should be playing the game, and how best to help them. We’re never going to agree, so I’m going to bed. G’night.
And my experience is that there are the wikis, the forums, gaming magazines, social media platforms and the chat function in game. Anyone who’s seeking help will find help.
Okay then. I guess that must say it all. Everyone who seeking help will find help. That’s sort of my point. Not everyone is seeking help. As hard as this is for some of us to understand, some people who don’t get stuff don’t think they need help. It’s quite common, unfortunately.
They try something it doesn’t work, they give up. You’ve never met anyone like that? You’ve never met anyone who would have given up on something and after being encouraged stayed? I find that hard to believe.
The NPE is designed to help people because a lot of people don’t LIKE to ask for help. They feel they should be able to do stuff. If you don’t think that happens, or it’s common, we’ll have to agree to disagree. But I can’t imagine that I’ve met those people all my life and you’ve met none of them.
And my point is that the game don’t has to be adjusted around players who aren’t interested in playing the game but around players who want to explore but need help doing so. That’s why a tutorial and tooltips will always be superior to the NPE changes.
Okay, I disagree and we’ll have to leave it at that, because you’re never going to convince me that people that need help doing stuff are going to ask for it. Nor will you convince me we’re better off without those people.
It’s a core disagreement on who should be playing the game, and how best to help them. We’re never going to agree, so I’m going to bed. G’night.
Yeah, you want to help players who neither want to ask for help, nor want to use tutorials or tooltips, no matter what the other players think. I say it’s not worth helping them by upsetting normal or experienced players.
Anet says they tested this and it worked. Are they lying?
Did they also test non-seasonal temporary content? If so, where? When? On whom?
Trait system redesign? Where, when, and upon whom was that tested?
The Personal Story revision that was delivered along with NPE? Where, when, and upon whom was that tested?
I have no idea what else they tested. I know exactly what you know.
I’m not sure how that’s relevant to the NPE comments anyway.
It’s a direct response to something you posted in this very thread, so if there’s irrelevance afoot, the source is clear.
Maybe this will help: if they tested these other things and then went ahead with implementing them, which would seem to be a clear indication that they thought these other things ‘worked’, then the notion that they tested NPE ‘and it worked’ is not particularly reassuring.
The table is a fable.
Highly related, everyone should watch it. Devs included.
http://youtu.be/BCPcn-Q5nKE
According to Reddit there are over 3 million active players. If true the npe really wasn’t needed. Over 3 million players from 4.5 million sold is incredible retention.
According to Reddit there are over 3 million active players. If true the npe really wasn’t needed. Over 3 million players from 4.5 million sold is incredible retention.
With all due “respect” to that reddit post, the discussion was 3 million accounts…and what that actually means. The general consensus was that, yes that many “boxes” or copies were sold but that in no way means “active” or current.
According to Reddit there are over 3 million active players. If true the npe really wasn’t needed. Over 3 million players from 4.5 million sold is incredible retention.
With all due “respect” to that reddit post, the discussion was 3 million accounts…and what that actually means. The general consensus was that, yes that many “boxes” or copies were sold but that in no way means “active” or current.
We are talking about different things. I’m referring to the post that talks about how Anet claims they have over 3 million players in present tense. I don’t have much input on it other than Anet says “over 3 million players”.
From the amount of down votes on the posts that say they don’t have that many active players, i’m inclined to believe that some part of the playerbase truly believes what Anet says.
Edit
Kind of interesting. I looked up the job ad and it looks like they changed the wording to indicate that they don’t have 3 million active players. Probably just bad word choice on their part and didn’t realize until reddit brought it to their attention.
(edited by Fernling.1729)
Many hard core players think everyone learns like them, everyone plays like them, everyone thinks like them.
I don’t think that reading a tool tip, or pressing F to interact with a bundle, or the like really qualify as, “hard core.”
Having a appropriate icons that actually mean something would help, when I first started I was like;
!http://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/6/69/Scout.png!
Why do I care about this and ignored it entirely if was say a “?” then I would have know ah-ha help.
What is required is not a stop gap redesign but a tutorial ‘area’ in which any player of any level can return to in the PvE world to learn things, much like the one the PvP side has which would be a good segway into the PvP, maybe even just duplicate the map but tone it for PvE.
Server: Gate of Madness
Many hard core players think everyone learns like them, everyone plays like them, everyone thinks like them.
I don’t think that reading a tool tip, or pressing F to interact with a bundle, or the like really qualify as, “hard core.”
If you were following the conversation, this would mean more.
I was talking about an attitude of those people aren’t good, don’t play like me, don’t go to forums, don’t ask in map chat, so they’re not good enough. It’s an attitude. It’s a bad one.
Actually the gates weaponskills was the thing I wanted to comment on as it confuses me every time when someone complains about it. And now I am forced to talk about all the stuff you wrote? Why? I didn’t even say “Oh but it’s so great” I just said that I don’t believe that anyone ever had all the weaponskills before they would have it now.
But anyway, since you demanded:
Well, since you quoted the entirety of my post, it was kind of implied that you were going to talk about the whole thing. Also, lol at you calling “You realize that I mentioned a lot more than just the weapon skills, right?” “demanding.” Thin skin much?
Dumbed down starting zones: The only thing that bothers me with that is that the repair npc is gone, other than that the starter starter area is that small that it isn’t that bad. The quests – weren’t that smart before that but I do miss feeding the bears in Wayfarer’s. But would a new player notice? Guess not.
Golem chess, transforming into sylvan hounds, snow leopards, feeding the cows, doging bunnies, etc. are all things removed from the starting zones… and yes, there are several people who have said that removing them took out much of the flavor and depth of those zones.
Okay, what else? Profession mechanics, you mean rangers who have no control over their pet anymore? Would be bad for someone doing 1v1 wvw/pvp but since no sane person does wvw/pvp? with an uplevel since the april patch I guess that’s forgiveable. Ranger had been my first character and I think I had better things to do than to think about how to control my pet – I have no opinion on that actually.
Well, if you’d have read people’s posts, many of them said how troublesome ranger pets are now in PvE…no way to call them back if they start aggroing enemies, so rangers stay in combat constantly, or exert any direct control over them. Don’t forget that each profession is pretty much an adrenaline-less warrior until level 5. If I wanted to be a warrior, I would have picked it at the start. Not to mention that each non-warrior’s full profession mechanics aren’t unlock until lvls 17-22.
Burst levelling: No idea what that is.
Burst leveling: Stats and stuff (and in GW2, also skill points) come in large chunks every few levels, instead of a regular increase each level. The problem with this is outlined here.
Yes, you can complain all you want but that doesn’t change that a lot of players ARE lost at the start of this game – I helped quite a lot of them to get through stuff, not only personal story but making gold, exploring, combat etc. The tips popping up at each level aren’t that helpful, new players will likely still have to google a lot of the stuff, but they are reminded that there is more at each new level. A veteran player can click that away in a second and go on playing, or if it doesn’t bother them keep the icon(s) until they can be bothered to open them.
And many of those lost players figured it out by themselves or with other players shortly afterwards.
Also, how do I click away “You will unlock this at level X?”
Oh, I forgot: When I was a new player I used the weapon I already had the skills unlocked as I was doing personal stories with my guildies who were more dead than alive all the time, so trying out new weapons was no option.
And for the players who aren’t “doing personal stories with their guildies who were more dead than alive all the time, so trying out new weapons was no option?” And if having 5 skills on the weapon bar was too overwhelming, I’m not exactly sure who having 5 skills on the weapon bar that you’ve never used before and have no idea what they do is any less so.
Much if this could be understood by simply reading people’s posts instead of just knee-jerking responses.
Well, since you quoted the entirety of my post, it was kind of implied that you were going to talk about the whole thing. Also, lol at you calling “You realize that I mentioned a lot more than just the weapon skills, right?” “demanding.” Thin skin much?
I quote what is the most convenient for me in that moment, sometimes it’s just one sentence if the post wouldn’t be out of context, sometimes it’s the whole post – didn’t know there were rules for that. And yes, I thought it was weird that you dismissed my point but claimed that I would have to answer to all the stuff you wrote – as you can see I wasn’t interested in your other “points” as the stuff I answered on them is more or less nonsense.
Golem chess, transforming into sylvan hounds, snow leopards, feeding the cows, doging bunnies, etc. are all things removed from the starting zones… and yes, there are several people who have said that removing them took out much of the flavor and depth of those zones.
New players won’t know they existed and I don’t see why not being able to transform into an animal would be “dumbing down”.
Well, if you’d have read people’s posts, many of them said how troublesome ranger pets are now in PvE…no way to call them back if they start aggroing enemies, so rangers stay in combat constantly, or exert any direct control over them. Don’t forget that each profession is pretty much an adrenaline-less warrior until level 5. If I wanted to be a warrior, I would have picked it at the start. Not to mention that each non-warrior’s full profession mechanics aren’t unlock until lvls 17-22.
I already answered that.
EDIT: And my ranger had been in combat no matter how often I pressed F2, one funny encounter was when I was trapped in a ship and my pet attacked a boss, my friend had to get on his mesmer to get me out of there, no option to get my pet out of combat.
Burst leveling: Stats and stuff (and in GW2, also skill points) come in large chunks every few levels, instead of a regular increase each level. The problem with this is outlined here.
I have no opinion on that – It’s been a while since I leveled my first character and for all others I already figured out which skills would be the most useful, so I usually have more skillpoints than I want to spend. Also since the trait update there’s no real reason to invest much energy in an character below level 80 as one is underpowered anyway – and that has got little to do with the NPE.
3And many of those lost players figured it out by themselves or with other players shortly afterwards.
Great, and?
Also, how do I click away “You will unlock this at level X?”
If you mean traits see above.
And for the players who aren’t “doing personal stories with their guildies who were more dead than alive all the time, so trying out new weapons was no option?” And if having 5 skills on the weapon bar was too overwhelming, I’m not exactly sure who having 5 skills on the weapon bar that you’ve never used before and have no idea what they do is any less so.
Already answered that in another post not directed at you – in multiple to be honest.
My level 7 warrior has got all weapon skills unlocked, he had 1,5 before he turned into a mule and leveled to level 7 while he was mining my home nodes. Don’t tell me that anyone had all 5 skills unlocked before level 7 with the old system. That is my point. The other thing is: They tried to keep the old system, getting people used to more weaponskills but decided that one hasn’t have to unlock them: thus the level gating.
Much if this could be understood by simply reading people’s posts instead of just knee-jerking responses.
Have a look in the mirror =)
(edited by Jana.6831)
It’s a direct response to something you posted in this very thread, so if there’s irrelevance afoot, the source is clear.
Maybe this will help: if they tested these other things and then went ahead with implementing them, which would seem to be a clear indication that they thought these other things ‘worked’, then the notion that they tested NPE ‘and it worked’ is not particularly reassuring.
For what it’s worth, I don’t recall a developer at Arena.net claiming they “tested” temporary content. I recall their claim being that it was to make the world feel “alive” and that things were always changing.
So, yeah… I’m not quite sure I get the relevance either.
I quote what is the most convenient for me in that moment, sometimes it’s just one sentence if the post wouldn’t be out of context, sometimes it’s the whole post – didn’t know there were rules for that.
Not a “rule” per se, but that’s what people generally take from it.
And yes, I thought it was weird that you dismissed my point but claimed that I would have to answer to all the stuff you wrote
Can you quote where I dismissed your point and claimed that you would “have to answer to all the stuff you wrote?”
as you can see I wasn’t interested in your other “points” as the stuff I answered on them is more or less nonsense.
Translation: Any points I don’t agree with just suck! Who’s dismissing whose points now?
New players won’t know they existed and I don’t see why not being able to transform into an animal would be “dumbing down”.
Several people seem to disagree with you that the changes aren’t dumbing down.
I already answered that.
Umm no you didn’t…you just mentioned ranger mechanics, and not the point that you can’t call them back when they’re attacking enemies. Nor anything about any of the other professions.
I have no opinion on that – It’s been a while since I leveled my first character and for all others I already figured out which skills would be the most useful, so I usually have more skillpoints than I want to spend. Also since the trait update there’s no real reason to invest much energy in an character below level 80 as one is underpowered anyway – and that has got little to do with the NPE.
Meh, maybe. Though burst leveling (or “stat bursts” which is perhaps more accurate) was indeed added by the NPE.
Great, and?
“And” being that these new players who you mentioned did, in fact, figure out what many things you said worked.
If you mean traits see above.
Umm… I was talking about the boxes in your skill bars and hero panel that, when you mouse over them, say some form of “You will unlock this at level X,” you know, what we were just talking about…
Already answered that in another post not directed at you – in multiple to be honest.
My level 7 warrior has got all weapon skills unlocked, he had 1,5 before he turned into a mule and leveled to level 7 while he was mining my home nodes. Don’t tell me that anyone had all 5 skills unlocked before level 7 with the old system. That is my point.
Engineers say hi.
Also, most of my characters unlocked all their weapon skills at or shortly after level 7.
The other thing is: They tried to keep the old system, getting people used to more weaponskills but decided that one hasn’t have to unlock them: thus the level gating.
Really? That’s not what anyone else has said…what they’ve all said is that (in their eyes) the skills are gated to reduce complexity and not to overwhelm new players. Not once has anyone said “Since players don’t really NEED all their weapon skills, we’re just going to arbitrarily lock them away.”
Have a look in the mirror =)
Translation: I know you are, but what am I?
It’s a direct response to something you posted in this very thread, so if there’s irrelevance afoot, the source is clear.
Maybe this will help: if they tested these other things and then went ahead with implementing them, which would seem to be a clear indication that they thought these other things ‘worked’, then the notion that they tested NPE ‘and it worked’ is not particularly reassuring.
For what it’s worth, I don’t recall a developer at Arena.net claiming they “tested” temporary content. I recall their claim being that it was to make the world feel “alive” and that things were always changing.
So, yeah… I’m not quite sure I get the relevance either.
I didn’t quote Colin’s quote from another thread, but I did assume most people would have read it. This is what I could glean from what he said.
After the game was made and they were running it for a while, they noticed that free weekends weren’t turning people into players. They’d play a few levels and stop playing. There were several reasons for this, only one of which was confusion. Pacing and rewards were the other two. They didn’t feel like they were progressing, they pacing was off.
So Anet tested a bunch of stuff, specifically with the mindset of trying to figure out why the early game wasn’t sticky enough. It was obviously sticky enough for those playing now, but you know, we’re not the only people in the world.
So Anet tested tutorials and a bunch of other stuff and found that the stuff they had now, in their test, got people playing longer and for more hours.
I’m sure they didn’t test everything in the game at each point of the game’s existence. They ran into something they considered a problem and set out to solve it.
It’s what businesses often do.
I’m pretty sure they specifically said they didn’t try a tutorial because it would be too difficult to make. I don’t think it was Colin that said it, don’t remember who, but it was in one of the recent interviews.
I could be wrong, I feel like I even remember people talking about.
I was referring to this post.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Game-Updates-Traits/page/43#post4359120
(edited by Fernling.1729)
Actually yes, it is 100% true. It means exactly what I said. Never said anything about dodging, the TP, SPvP, etc. I was talking about weapon skills, PS, dumbed down starting zones, profession mechanics, burst leveling, etc. Surely you didn’t think skill points and diving goggles were the only things gated?
Alright, since I’m already here (I should not, really, spending way too much time on the forums ) anyway: A friend of mine once complained that I have to kill EVERYTHING – and yeah, he’s right, I usually kill everything, sometimes not but that’s unusual – it took me ages to get all the weapon skills, so I wonder how you guys miss out on them if you’re surely not killing as many mobs as I do. That’s kind of an honest but rhetorical question – I can’t believe that any veteran is restricted by the level gated weapon skills, sorry.
You realize that I mentioned a lot more than just the weapon skills, right?
And it’s been pointed out a lot that this new system often ends up being even more confusing, since if I level to lvl 5 using just one weapon and decide to try out a different one, I’m now confronted with 5 new skills that I’ve never seen before. How is that any less confusing that the way it was before?
And anyway, that wasn’t even the point. The point was that the OP stated that since the NPE was made for new players, so vets can’t complain about it. I was pointing out that since the NPE in most cases doesn’t differentiate between new characters created by vets and those created by new players, vets have every reason to complain.
There you are:
First: You say players are restricted by the gated weapon skills
I say that the people have all the skills unlocked at the same level they had it before.
You didn’t say anything before so if I got anything wrong then you should’ve explained it better.
Second part: You say nothing about that in my opinion players can’t be restricted as I don’t believe that anyone ever had the weaponskills unlocked before they have now.
So: You didn’t discuss my point but complained that I didn’t pick your other points – you seem to be a very difficult person.
Edit: If you mean that I should’ve discussed whether or not vets are being restricted by the NPE – maybe but I just wanted to point out that the weapon skill gating is no valid point to me.
And since the trait update destroyed a lot of the leveling process back in April, I don’t really care about further restrictions, so unless the trait mess isn’t somehow sorted I would complain about the restrictions coming from that and not about the NPE since that will be gone once you hit 80.
That is all I wanted to say.
(edited by Jana.6831)
All of the starter zones became a hugh boring tutorial. What has changed? Mobs aren’t dangerous anymore, so you don’t feel the need to learn how to fight.
People make a big deal about the changes to starter zones, but the NPE doesn’t stop you from biting off more than you can chew. I had some friends start playing during the free trial, and we were having some challenging fights above our level in Caledon Forest.
From what I’ve seen, the changes to the starting zones aren’t as sweeping as some people make them out to be.
Well, as I said, at least one of my friends likes it better and feels it explains the game better than the old system. But you know, he’s one guy. It might be that some people will find it worse and some people will find it better.
Supposedly Anet tested it. This free weekend will give them the answers they need. I’m sure if they have to tweak it they will.
If they don’t do surveys on those free weekend accounts then they won’t get any answers. How can you find out what someone likes or dislikes with out asking? Only things the metrics will show is what they did and for how long. Not why.
The obvious metric is comparing the rate of conversion to paid accounts from previous trial periods. Obviously more detailed analysis is required to understand the causes behind any movement, but it’s a good first measure of whether the NPE is having the intended effect.
Its like saying the EotM is a great addition to the game because the metrics show tons of players there. Well when you make the rewards 10x better than the other wvw maps and one of the best farms in the game of course it will have the players. Its not because they like it though, its because they like rewards. If you switched the rate of rewards between the other WvW maps and EotM I guarantee you EotM would be empty compared to the other maps. They want the metrics to show how successful it is though. So they will keep EotM karma train and leave the other WvW maps untouched.
This is why they won’t do surveys. They don’t want the why because it will change the results of their made up metrics. The BS and metrics may work on the higher ups but the players are getting tired of it. With out the players there won’t be a game for them to make up metrics for.
I’ll just put this here to show that ANet do not rely solely on metrics (imagined or otherwise). It’s from https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Misconceptions-regarding-Level-gating/page/4#post4396936 if you want to read the post in full.
- Over a years worth of testing with new players found we were absolutely able to keep them both more engaged, and more likely to return to keep playing Gw2 as a result of the intended system.