Guild Wars 2

What investors would or would not do with stock in Anet is irrelevant because they’re a wholly owned subsidiary of NCSoft so there isn’t any stock to buy or sell. They can invest in NCSoft of course, but that would be based on how the company is doing as a whole, not Anet on their own.

And because they’re privately owned we don’t know anything about how much money NCSoft puts into Anet. For all we know the reported profits seem low because the full cost of running the company, including developing new products, is taken out first and what NCSoft sees is pure profit.

But as far as I’m concerned all of this is irrelevant to us as players. The more important info is in the AMA: they have 250 developers, split into various teams and they’re working on a whole variety of projects including changes to HoT, a new expansion and new living story and something for WvW. Whether any of that is any good (and therefore according to some people whether it counts as new content or can be dismissed because they personally don’t enjoy playing it) is of course up for debate but we’ll argue that one when we come to it.

JustTrogdor.7892:

Why do so many people seem excited at the prospect of GW2/HoT failing?

I don’t think anyone in their right mind wants to see GW2 failing and shutting down. People that deliberately want GW2 to die are really short-sighted and vengeful, something I disapprove.

I get it that people are angry and want to vent their frustrations. Personally I am not at all happy with the direction this game took with HoT: particularly the profession balance in PvP and WvW; grind walls for things we could access before; gimmicks in WvW borderlands and overpowered guild additions behind grind wall.

That said, I really really really hope ArenaNet makes a sharp turn toward a more balanced PvP environment, improvements on WvW and less grind in general (yes, the no-grind manifesto).

TLDR; I rather cry than cheer if HoT and GW2 fail.

I don’t think you can be sure about what you are stating there but anyway, let’s say that you are right… what changes? Some people, like me, still love the game and look forward to the future and some other hate it but I don’t know why, instead of leaving they prefer to rant on the forums like crazy…. if in the end the company closes, which I don’t think will happen, whatever, people will go to another game, but since it is still up what’s the point?
Are you bragging about how good your investigative skills are? Good job Batman!
If anyone after this post is thinking about leaving gw2 ….
Can I have your stuff?

Behellagh.1468:

The last one in English was in 2013. The Korean site has 2014. The last time ArenaNet was broken out on it’s own was 2012, after that their income is folded into the NC West Holding numbers. NC West includes Carbine and NC Interactive as well as ArenaNet.

I’ve been following NCSOFT since 2004 and I’ve only seen the numbers change once from their initial values but not in terms of game sales, just expenses. So yes, it could change, but that damages the company’s stock value if they have to reissue so for the most part they are on point.

As for when the 2015 audited numbers come out, it appears late March is when it’s normally released. But like I said, they no longer break out ArenaNet from NC West Holdings numbers. But who knows, the NC West run ncsoft.com no longer lists Guild Wars 2 in their games pull down but GW2 is still listed at the bottom of the page menu.

Not since 2012… That basically means that the entire report is impossible to read externally; division numbers can involve multiple moves of money in the intercompany sense (which is probably why they started using division numbers to begin with) with say, a developer swapping to a new team changing the expense report of one team by raising it and another by lowering it. These silent changes happen all the time thus the SoCF.

Lot’s of comments here that border on pure stupidity. A couple of notes:

1. Daewoo aren’t good at predicting anything related to GW2. This was already stated in another comment before me
2. If the expansion was a failure why are they making another one?! have you even considered that?!
3. 300 000 units wouldn’t be bad, considering most MMOs out there have considerably less monthly players than 300 000/
4. THIS IS NOT EVEN CLOSE TO BEING CORRECT!

Why?

First, you are saying that gem sales equate to about 20 million. Wrong. It’s very safe to assume gem sales went down because people were buying HoT. The month I gave 50 bucks for HoT I sure as hell didn’t spend anything on the gem store The “37-20=17” figure is idiotic.

Second, you could pre-order the expansion months in advance. We have no idea how many people ended up doing that, but I was one of them. Meaning the money I gave did not appear in the 4th quarter report at all.

Now let’s see what NcSoft, the ONLY people who know what the hell these numbers really mean, said about this:

1. Low adoption rates of f2p players.
2. Existing players are shelling out enough money
3. Discrepancy between the expectations of HoT and what it was
4. A direct quote from them: “Guild Wars 2 solidified its position as a main revenue driver by adding on expansion pack sales to stable in-game item sales.

So let’s re-cap – we don’t know how much of those 37 million are gem sales. Maybe 20 million, maybe less. Even if that were true, those 17 million are NOT the entire revenue from HoT. What we do know is that Anet are working on a second expansion, which means the first one was a success, and NCSoft STRAIGHT UP SAID GW2 IS DOING FINE.

So it is very safe to assume HoT was NOT a failure. What we CAN argue about, and it would make for a much more interesting discussion, is whether the f2p conversion was a success.

Andulias.9516:

Second, you could pre-order the expansion months in advance. We have no idea how many people ended up doing that, but I was one of them. Meaning the money I gave did not appear in the 4th quarter report at all.

This is (or rather, should be) inaccurate.

Revenue recognition principles require that revenue is only recognized when the product is actually delivered regardless of when the funds are received. In other words it becomes deferred revenue until the release of the expansion and should be reported in the quarter where the expansion launches.

The same is true of costs so the cost of the expansion also should only be recognized when the revenue is and that is only recognized when the service is completed or in this case the expansion goes live. Hopefully NCSoft didn’t choose to do otherwise as that would be problematic when they get audited.

HoT was such a big economical failure that they are already working on the second xpac ;O

If the expansion model becomes less profitable than f2p micro transactions then expect a mobile release 10 years from now. Or GW3 IOS exclusive f2p in 5 years!

14m isnt that bad.
i did like to assume that the 20m isn’t pure gem sales, which means it also include gw2 game sales.

Dantert.1803:

I don’t think you can be sure about what you are stating there but anyway, let’s say that you are right… what changes? Some people, like me, still love the game and look forward to the future and some other hate it but I don’t know why, instead of leaving they prefer to rant on the forums like crazy…. if in the end the company closes, which I don’t think will happen, whatever, people will go to another game, but since it is still up what’s the point?
Are you bragging about how good your investigative skills are? Good job Batman!
If anyone after this post is thinking about leaving gw2 ….
Can I have your stuff?

Why would you presume that because I posted an interpretation of factual financial results that I am ranting?

Nowhere in my OP or subsequent replies have I; at any point, said I dislike the game or want it to fail.

Quite the contrary would be true in fact – clearly (due to the consistent income from Gem store sales) GW2 is a good earner for NC and going forward I expect all of the mistakes that were made with HOT (poor marketing decisions, pricing, and perceived lack of value for money) will be fully addressed for the next Expansion release.

GW2 is a great quality game that quite rightly has a good core of loyal players, however if you believe that no mistakes have been made since launch and that every decision related to the game has been the right one, then you need to get your head out of the sand.

Daroon.1736:

Dantert.1803:

I don’t think you can be sure about what you are stating there but anyway, let’s say that you are right… what changes? Some people, like me, still love the game and look forward to the future and some other hate it but I don’t know why, instead of leaving they prefer to rant on the forums like crazy…. if in the end the company closes, which I don’t think will happen, whatever, people will go to another game, but since it is still up what’s the point?
Are you bragging about how good your investigative skills are? Good job Batman!
If anyone after this post is thinking about leaving gw2 ….
Can I have your stuff?

Why would you presume that because I posted an interpretation of factual financial results that I am ranting?

Nowhere in my OP or subsequent replies have I; at any point, said I dislike the game or want it to fail.

Quite the contrary would be true in fact – clearly (due to the consistent income from Gem store sales) GW2 is a good earner for NC and going forward I expect all of the mistakes that were made with HOT (poor marketing decisions, pricing, and perceived lack of value for money) will be fully addressed for the next Expansion release.

GW2 is a great quality game that quite rightly has a good core of loyal players, however if you believe that no mistakes have been made since launch and that every decision related to the game has been the right one, then you need to get your head out of the sand.

Probably because your interpretation is biased, lacks any factual support and can be very easily disputed (and has been months in advance by NCSoft). or maybe because of the insanely clickbait-y title and clearly shows you want to make it out as a failure. Take a step back and look at this thread and you will see that reaction is pretty logical.

DGraves.3720:

Andulias.9516:

Second, you could pre-order the expansion months in advance. We have no idea how many people ended up doing that, but I was one of them. Meaning the money I gave did not appear in the 4th quarter report at all.

This is (or rather, should be) inaccurate.

Revenue recognition principles require that revenue is only recognized when the product is actually delivered regardless of when the funds are received. In other words it becomes deferred revenue until the release of the expansion and should be reported in the quarter where the expansion launches.

The same is true of costs so the cost of the expansion also should only be recognized when the revenue is and that is only recognized when the service is completed or in this case the expansion goes live. Hopefully NCSoft didn’t choose to do otherwise as that would be problematic when they get audited.

A fair point, but I would imagine this is reserved for the audited version. They specifically stated this is an unaudited version of the report. But you may be right.

Daroon.1736:

GW2 is a great quality game that quite rightly has a good core of loyal players, however if you believe that no mistakes have been made since launch and that every decision related to the game has been the right one, then you need to get your head out of the sand.

Who is saying that there is no problems? No one here. What they ARE saying is the massive assumptions you made in your OP (and even in your title) are most likely wrong.

Andulias.9516:

1. If the expansion was a failure why are they making another one?! have you even considered that?!
   #. 300 000 units wouldn’t be bad, considering most MMOs out there have considerably less monthly players than 300 000.
2. you could pre-order the expansion months in advance. We have no idea how many people ended up doing that, but I was one of them. Meaning the money I gave did not appear in the 4th quarter report at all.

1. Perhaps, if it was a failure, they are intending to fix the perceived problems. Failure to move forward would be a bad sign. Moving forward is not necessarily an indicator one way or the other.
2. Considering the recent article in Fortune citing 1.5M monthly paid player logins just prior to PFF, 300K would represent about 20% HoT adoption. Fwiw, I think they sold more than 300K copies, but how many more I’m not going to guess.
3. It’s standard practice to either report revenue when it accrues or, for game expansion pre-sales, to report that revenue when the game releases. If ANet did the former, then the revenues reported in Q2 and Q3 are remarkably low. In fact, if one accepts minor fluctuation, they are barely above the gem sale revenue from Q1. If ANet did the latter, and if “other GW2 revenue was stable” means that gem sales were about what they’d been in prior quarters, then the OP’s figures are close enough, if rounded.

The point you raise about GW2 performing fine according to NCSoft is also correct. However, that also does not mean that HoT was deemed a success. After all, they said the same in prior quarters when there were no HoT sales included. I believe that both AN and NCS would have expected a lot more sales than there actually were, whatever the real number was.

IndigoSundown.5419:

Andulias.9516:

1. If the expansion was a failure why are they making another one?! have you even considered that?!
   #. 300 000 units wouldn’t be bad, considering most MMOs out there have considerably less monthly players than 300 000.
2. you could pre-order the expansion months in advance. We have no idea how many people ended up doing that, but I was one of them. Meaning the money I gave did not appear in the 4th quarter report at all.

1. Perhaps, if it was a failure, they are intending to fix the perceived problems. Failure to move forward would be a bad sign. Moving forward is not necessarily an indicator one way or the other.
2. Considering the recent article in Fortune citing 1.5M monthly paid player logins just prior to PFF, 300K would represent about 20% HoT adoption. Fwiw, I think they sold more than 300K copies, but how many more I’m not going to guess.
3. It’s standard practice to either report revenue when it accrues or, for game expansion pre-sales, to report that revenue when the game releases. If ANet did the former, then the revenues reported in Q2 and Q3 are remarkably low. In fact, if one accepts minor fluctuation, they are barely above the gem sale revenue from Q1. If ANet did the latter, and if “other GW2 revenue was stable” means that gem sales were about what they’d been in prior quarters, then the OP’s figures are close enough, if rounded.

The point you raise about GW2 performing fine according to NCSoft is also correct. However, that also does not mean that HoT was deemed a success. After all, they said the same in prior quarters when there were no HoT sales included. I believe that both AN and NCS would have expected a lot more sales than there actually were, whatever the real number was.

If we want to spin it on an optimistic view, GW2 is still doing just fine even after all the HoT controversy.

Pessimistically? HoT was not nearly as good as it should have been for sales.

Should we just agree that there was not really a meaningful impact good or bad with HoT then?

IndigoSundown.5419:

Andulias.9516:

1. If the expansion was a failure why are they making another one?! have you even considered that?!
   #. 300 000 units wouldn’t be bad, considering most MMOs out there have considerably less monthly players than 300 000.
2. you could pre-order the expansion months in advance. We have no idea how many people ended up doing that, but I was one of them. Meaning the money I gave did not appear in the 4th quarter report at all.

1. Perhaps, if it was a failure, they are intending to fix the perceived problems. Failure to move forward would be a bad sign. Moving forward is not necessarily an indicator one way or the other.
2. Considering the recent article in Fortune citing 1.5M monthly paid player logins just prior to PFF, 300K would represent about 20% HoT adoption. Fwiw, I think they sold more than 300K copies, but how many more I’m not going to guess.
3. It’s standard practice to either report revenue when it accrues or, for game expansion pre-sales, to report that revenue when the game releases. If ANet did the former, then the revenues reported in Q2 and Q3 are remarkably low. In fact, if one accepts minor fluctuation, they are barely above the gem sale revenue from Q1. If ANet did the latter, and if “other GW2 revenue was stable” means that gem sales were about what they’d been in prior quarters, then the OP’s figures are close enough, if rounded.

The point you raise about GW2 performing fine according to NCSoft is also correct. However, that also does not mean that HoT was deemed a success. After all, they said the same in prior quarters when there were no HoT sales included. I believe that both AN and NCS would have expected a lot more sales than there actually were, whatever the real number was.

I never argued it was a huge success. You can go through the history of my posts and see that I repeatedly stated it wasn’t a huge success. My point is it’s not the failure OP makes it out to be and there is little to no evidence to support his statement.

Well, I like the game so shove that in your quarterly report.

Some of the versions came with Gems, and it’s highly likely many who upgraded temporarily spent less on Gems in that period, and they still made higher profits. That’s not a fail, it’s a simple factor of opportunity costs and a little bit of market cannibalism, as the upgrade likely ate some of the gem sales.

Who cares, though, only people (ignorantly) abusing these numbers are out for ill gain. If you don’t like the game then quit. If you do, but want to improve it, give useful suggestions and stay vigilant and non-toxic in discussion. Otherwise you’re doing no good for anyone and proving at least some amount of ignorance.

Danikat.8537:

What investors would or would not do with stock in Anet is irrelevant because they’re a wholly owned subsidiary of NCSoft so there isn’t any stock to buy or sell. They can invest in NCSoft of course, but that would be based on how the company is doing as a whole, not Anet on their own.

And because they’re privately owned we don’t know anything about how much money NCSoft puts into Anet. For all we know the reported profits seem low because the full cost of running the company, including developing new products, is taken out first and what NCSoft sees is pure profit.

But as far as I’m concerned all of this is irrelevant to us as players. The more important info is in the AMA: they have 250 developers, split into various teams and they’re working on a whole variety of projects including changes to HoT, a new expansion and new living story and something for WvW. Whether any of that is any good (and therefore according to some people whether it counts as new content or can be dismissed because they personally don’t enjoy playing it) is of course up for debate but we’ll argue that one when we come to it.

Gods! The game numbers in the quarterly reports are income NOT profits. The ONLY profit listed is for NCSOFT as a whole.

As it is not NC West Holdings own 100% of ArenaNet stock and NCSOFT owns 100% of NC West Holdings (which includes Carbine and NC Interactive).

Andulias.9516:

A fair point, but I would imagine this is reserved for the audited version. They specifically stated this is an unaudited version of the report. But you may be right.

That’s why I asked if there was an audited version. How the numbers splay out and their actual final reports may differ from how they frame them even if well within law. It is really up to the external audit to decipher what should be where.

ronpierce.2760:

Some of the versions came with Gems, and it’s highly likely many who upgraded temporarily spent less on Gems in that period, and they still made higher profits. That’s not a fail, it’s a simple factor of opportunity costs and a little bit of market cannibalism, as the upgrade likely ate some of the gem sales.

Who cares, though, only people (ignorantly) abusing these numbers are out for ill gain. If you don’t like the game then quit. If you do, but want to improve it, give useful suggestions and stay vigilant and non-toxic in discussion. Otherwise you’re doing no good for anyone and proving at least some amount of ignorance.

I figure the packages with 1/2 price gems reduced gem sales but that’s “offset” buy the deluxe part of the price, so a wash in the end.

Some of the excuses here boggle my mind. Last night, the PvP room I frequent was empty for the first time. My wife cannot get a full map anywhere to get her legendary done. And certain areas are now all but ghosted.

Yes, a certain and new MMO is drawing attention away, but the writing was on the wall long before that came out.

Is HoT fail?

. . .

Can anyone ask that question with a straight face?

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Some of the excuses here boggle my mind. Last night, the PvP room I frequent was empty for the first time. My wife cannot get a full map anywhere to get her legendary done. And certain areas are now all but ghosted.

Yes, a certain and new MMO is drawing attention away, but the writing was on the wall long before that came out.

Is HoT fail?

. . .

Can anyone ask that question with a straight face?

Weird, I was PvPing last night and HotM was popping. When I run metas there are several full servers. I assume you’re talking about the new HoT maps. Certain areas that are “all but ghosted…” I assume you’re referring to the maps that no longer pertain to max level users which has nothing to do with HoT profits.

Is HoT fail? I say not to the length you guys are stating. It nearly doubled its profits from Q3 to Q4. Did you expect HoT to launch gem sales into oblivion? The majority of the game is still vanilla GW2. This isn’t an expansion to the length that most other games deliver. If anything your post is fail.

If you guys want the game to die out so badly… why don’t you just leave? Why make pointless speculation on matters that none of us can truly argue for or against.

DGraves.3720:

Andulias.9516:

A fair point, but I would imagine this is reserved for the audited version. They specifically stated this is an unaudited version of the report. But you may be right.

That’s why I asked if there was an audited version. How the numbers splay out and their actual final reports may differ from how they frame them even if well within law. It is really up to the external audit to decipher what should be where.

And that is one more reason to NOT do ridiculous threads like this one. Because we simply don’t know, but from what we do know, things seem fine

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Some of the excuses here boggle my mind. Last night, the PvP room I frequent was empty for the first time. My wife cannot get a full map anywhere to get her legendary done. And certain areas are now all but ghosted.

Yes, a certain and new MMO is drawing attention away, but the writing was on the wall long before that came out.

Is HoT fail?

. . .

Can anyone ask that question with a straight face?

Can anyone take kitten like this with a straight face? Since when is PvP a good indication of the game’s popularity? What’s better, a PvP room! And has your wife ever heard of taxiing? Because if she hasn’t, please do tell her that if she doesn’t taxi she will be transported to a low pop map and that has NOTHING to do with how many people are actually playing the game!

Are we honestly supposed to take your post seriously?

Andulias.9516:

Lot’s of comments here that border on pure stupidity. A couple of notes:

1. Daewoo aren’t good at predicting anything related to GW2. This was already stated in another comment before me
2. If the expansion was a failure why are they making another one?! have you even considered that?!
3. 300 000 units wouldn’t be bad, considering most MMOs out there have considerably less monthly players than 300 000/

1. This isn’t a prediction but a reported financial result. On it being unaudited this would have been the result taken from the annual report for audit so being unaudited is almost irrelevant. If it wasn’t it would be a false statement and there would be legal repercussions.
2. Because it is the development path of the game moving forward.
3. 300k is bad considering the reported number of players.

morrolan.9608:

1. This isn’t a prediction but a reported financial result. On it being unaudited this would have been the result taken from the annual report for audit so being unaudited is almost irrelevant. If it wasn’t it would be a false statement and there would be legal repercussions.

You definitely don’t work in finance. This is just not true at all. Companies do many things, legal but sketchy, and accounting is not black and white just like economics findings are not “right and wrong”. Model and method are everything and you would be surprised what tales you can weave by postponing this or recognizing that in a crafty way.

morrolan.9608:

Andulias.9516:

Lot’s of comments here that border on pure stupidity. A couple of notes:

1. Daewoo aren’t good at predicting anything related to GW2. This was already stated in another comment before me
2. If the expansion was a failure why are they making another one?! have you even considered that?!
3. 300 000 units wouldn’t be bad, considering most MMOs out there have considerably less monthly players than 300 000/

1. This isn’t a prediction but a reported financial result. On it being unaudited this would have been the result taken from the annual report for audit so being unaudited is almost irrelevant. If it wasn’t it would be a false statement and there would be legal repercussions.
2. Because it is the development path of the game moving forward.
3. 300k is bad considering the reported number of players.

1. Being unaudited is incredibly relevant. See above. I must admit I don’t remember a lot of what I studied way back whenever, but it’s amazing how you can play around with those numbers.
2. Development paths shift rather quickly if something fails. They wouldn’t invest in a second expansion, which also means increased development AND marketing costs, if the first one bombed.
3. 300k is not an official figure. It’s not even close to being accurate by any stretch. It’s completely made up in other words. Also, there is no reported number of players either, nothing coming out of Anet directly. You assume too much on too little info.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Some of the excuses here boggle my mind. Last night, the PvP room I frequent was empty for the first time. My wife cannot get a full map anywhere to get her legendary done. And certain areas are now all but ghosted.

Yes, a certain and new MMO is drawing attention away, but the writing was on the wall long before that came out.

Is HoT fail?

. . .

Can anyone ask that question with a straight face?

Doom and gloom.The PvP scene isn’t dead and I’m not encountering empty maps, unless it’s time for a meta and I don’t use the LFG tool, in which case, everyone else taxied off.

Also a new MMO launched a couple of days ago, and people go check it out, just like when ESO launched and Archeage launched. Yes, it affects the game’s population for a couple of weeks.

Given the nature of BDO, I strongly suspect most people will be back.

Edit; The recent change to PvP dailies has a big affect on the population of PvP rooms as does the season that just started, so yeah, I think you probably are reaching even suggesting your PvP room being empty means anything at all to the state of the game’s PvP.

DGraves.3720:

morrolan.9608:

1. This isn’t a prediction but a reported financial result. On it being unaudited this would have been the result taken from the annual report for audit so being unaudited is almost irrelevant. If it wasn’t it would be a false statement and there would be legal repercussions.

You definitely don’t work in finance. This is just not true at all. Companies do many things, legal but sketchy, and accounting is not black and white just like economics findings are not “right and wrong”. Model and method are everything and you would be surprised what tales you can weave by postponing this or recognizing that in a crafty way.

I would say the same about you, I work in accounting, so I know about public company reporting requirements and the requirements regarding public information that may affect markets.

Regardless, despite the assertions to the contrary, prima facie the figures are bad wouldn’t they do the opposite if they wanted to use unaudited figures to make themselves look good.

As I stated earlier, the audited report will likely come out in a few weeks if previous years are any indication, but it will be in Korean as the last English one is a year behind.

Also since the creation of NC West Holding, ArenaNet’s profit as a subsidiary is no longer reported individually but is folded into NC West Holding’s numbers. NC West Holding includes Carbine and NC Interactive. But it’s possible with ArenaNet’s decision to handle publishing and distribution themselves that they will once again be broken out, but I doubt it. The last time ArenaNet’s profit was listed was for 2012.

This is the page with the audited reports, all PDFs in Korean from 2004-2014

http://kr.ncsoft.com/korean/board/downloadlist.aspx?BID=ir_audit&BC=

This is the page with English PDFs from 2005-2013

http://global.ncsoft.com/global/board/downloadlist.aspx?BID=ir_audit&BC=

Enjoy.

Andulias.9516:

Can anyone take kitten like this with a straight face? Since when is PvP a good indication of the game’s popularity? What’s better, a PvP room! And has your wife ever heard of taxiing? Because if she hasn’t, please do tell her that if she doesn’t taxi she will be transported to a low pop map and that has NOTHING to do with how many people are actually playing the game!

Are we honestly supposed to take your post seriously?

Given that the room has been always full, no matter the hour, yes, it’s a pretty good sign. Been that way, off and on, for the last week since a certain game came out. And yes, my spouse tried taxing multiple times. Is that not a given when I said she couldn’t find a full map?

I know, I know. I shouldn’t believe my experience, but I should definitely believe yours.

At this point, most log in to get their three dailies, and then log right back out to do something else . . . if they log in at all these days.

Yes, I know. Doom and gloom. Funny thing to call reality, but sure. Keep telling yourself the game is fine. Been through this with enough MMOs that ’it’s fine’ is the anthem for anything but fine.

But, again, far be it from me to inject reality and reason into a forum discussion.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Andulias.9516:

Can anyone take kitten like this with a straight face? Since when is PvP a good indication of the game’s popularity? What’s better, a PvP room! And has your wife ever heard of taxiing? Because if she hasn’t, please do tell her that if she doesn’t taxi she will be transported to a low pop map and that has NOTHING to do with how many people are actually playing the game!

Are we honestly supposed to take your post seriously?

Given that the room has been always full, no matter the hour, yes, it’s a pretty good sign. Been that way, off and on, for the last week since a certain game came out. And yes, my spouse tried taxing multiple times. Is that not a given when I said she couldn’t find a full map?

I know, I know. I shouldn’t believe my experience, but I should definitely believe yours.

At this point, most log in to get their three dailies, and then log right back out to do something else . . . if they log in at all these days.

Yes, I know. Doom and gloom. Funny thing to call reality, but sure. Keep telling yourself the game is fine. Been through this with enough MMOs that ’it’s fine’ is the anthem for anything but fine.

But, again, far be it from me to inject reality and reason into a forum discussion.

This is primarily a PvE game. That you even use a PvP room as an argument is absurd and borderline idiotic.

Also, dying games don’t generate tens of millions of dollars. Welcome to reality where factual numbers are more important than biased opinions.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

I know, I know. I shouldn’t believe my experience, but I should definitely believe yours.

I am sorry but your “experience” is not enough to draw any major conclusions. Some PvP room was empty so what – PvP is empty? That’s like saying my local store is out of milk so there is shortage of milk in the world. What is your average queue time in leagues?

I find it curious that Anet has this big “sale every day” promotion going on. With hints that they might bring back much anticipated items. Convenient that this massive “sale” is happening right at the end of the first quarter.
They’ve been saving gem store items away so they could trot them out when they needed a financial boost to make their numbers look better.
No holds barred, so long as the numbers look good. Fools the investors every time.

Neural.1824:

I find it curious that Anet has this big “sale every day” promotion going on. With hints that they might bring back much anticipated items. Convenient that this massive “sale” is happening right at the end of the first quarter.
They’ve been saving gem store items away so they could trot them out when they needed a financial boost to make their numbers look better.
No holds barred, so long as the numbers look good. Fools the investors every time.

Many companies do sales near the end of a quarter or year. It’s nothing unusual.

Neural.1824:

I find it curious that Anet has this big “sale every day” promotion going on. With hints that they might bring back much anticipated items. Convenient that this massive “sale” is happening right at the end of the first quarter.
They’ve been saving gem store items away so they could trot them out when they needed a financial boost to make their numbers look better.
No holds barred, so long as the numbers look good. Fools the investors every time.

This is SOP. I think last March had a similar one day sale all month.

morrolan.9608:

DGraves.3720:

morrolan.9608:

1. This isn’t a prediction but a reported financial result. On it being unaudited this would have been the result taken from the annual report for audit so being unaudited is almost irrelevant. If it wasn’t it would be a false statement and there would be legal repercussions.

You definitely don’t work in finance. This is just not true at all. Companies do many things, legal but sketchy, and accounting is not black and white just like economics findings are not “right and wrong”. Model and method are everything and you would be surprised what tales you can weave by postponing this or recognizing that in a crafty way.

I would say the same about you, I work in accounting, so I know about public company reporting requirements and the requirements regarding public information that may affect markets.

Regardless, despite the assertions to the contrary, prima facie the figures are bad wouldn’t they do the opposite if they wanted to use unaudited figures to make themselves look good.

“Good” and “better” are very different terms. Outright lying is not a business savvy way to do anything but my goodness can you shift values from godawful to “not impressive”.

If you are actually an accountant who does auditing I’m surprised you’ve never seen this.

DGraves.3720:

morrolan.9608:

DGraves.3720:

morrolan.9608:

1. This isn’t a prediction but a reported financial result. On it being unaudited this would have been the result taken from the annual report for audit so being unaudited is almost irrelevant. If it wasn’t it would be a false statement and there would be legal repercussions.

You definitely don’t work in finance. This is just not true at all. Companies do many things, legal but sketchy, and accounting is not black and white just like economics findings are not “right and wrong”. Model and method are everything and you would be surprised what tales you can weave by postponing this or recognizing that in a crafty way.

I would say the same about you, I work in accounting, so I know about public company reporting requirements and the requirements regarding public information that may affect markets.

Regardless, despite the assertions to the contrary, prima facie the figures are bad wouldn’t they do the opposite if they wanted to use unaudited figures to make themselves look good.

“Good” and “better” are very different terms. Outright lying is not a business savvy way to do anything but my goodness can you shift values from godawful to “not impressive”.

If you are actually an accountant who does auditing I’m surprised you’ve never seen this.

Not everyone is as corrupt as you make them out to be.

Ayrilana.1396:

Not everyone is as corrupt as you make them out to be.

I never said many people were corrupt. It is just rare for an auditor to run only into pristine honesty esp. with working with larger corporations or firms with a lot at stake. I do know for a fact that, if truly given the benefit of the doubt, an overwhelmingly high amount of humans are honest and forthright most of the time and naturally shun criminal behavior.

But auditing is all about finding those that don’t [believe in honesty] not distrusting those that are.

The only thing that made me smile was how good Lineage performs compared with all other more recent titles from NCSOFT.

Richard Garriot must be smiling too…

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Some of the excuses here boggle my mind. Last night, the PvP room I frequent was empty for the first time. My wife cannot get a full map anywhere to get her legendary done. And certain areas are now all but ghosted.

Yes, a certain and new MMO is drawing attention away, but the writing was on the wall long before that came out.

Omg you’re right! Our guilds custom arena closed down several years ago. Must be because the game is “dying”.

Why use something like financial reports when we our totally anecdotal evidence instead. Pure genius.

Either way, GW2 has been going steady over the last year and the year before. It recently increased. Maybe by not as much as expected maybe it didn’t maybe the numbers are illogical,but increased.

That doesn’t sound like failing or dying at all.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Andulias.9516:

Can anyone take kitten like this with a straight face? Since when is PvP a good indication of the game’s popularity? What’s better, a PvP room! And has your wife ever heard of taxiing? Because if she hasn’t, please do tell her that if she doesn’t taxi she will be transported to a low pop map and that has NOTHING to do with how many people are actually playing the game!

Are we honestly supposed to take your post seriously?

Given that the room has been always full, no matter the hour, yes, it’s a pretty good sign. Been that way, off and on, for the last week since a certain game came out. And yes, my spouse tried taxing multiple times. Is that not a given when I said she couldn’t find a full map?

I know, I know. I shouldn’t believe my experience, but I should definitely believe yours.

At this point, most log in to get their three dailies, and then log right back out to do something else . . . if they log in at all these days.

Yes, I know. Doom and gloom. Funny thing to call reality, but sure. Keep telling yourself the game is fine. Been through this with enough MMOs that ’it’s fine’ is the anthem for anything but fine.

But, again, far be it from me to inject reality and reason into a forum discussion.