New EULA
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I like the change from “sole and absolute” to “reasonable” discretion everywhere. They also made it clear that while the account is still non-transferable, it doesn’t prevent you from reselling the DVD or Blu-Ray containing the game.
They also softened the language for deleting gems from “any reason, including without limitation” to “fraudulent activities”.
Generally it’s replacing “NCSOFT” with “ArenaNet” and “software” with “game” and including some specific language for Germany.
Edit: missing "s
We are heroes. This is what we do!
RIP City of Heroes
RIP City of Heroes
(edited by Behellagh.1468)
I am curious though. If people had actually read what they were agreeing to instead of blindly choosing ‘Agree’, would this even been an issue?
And one more question. Why does this bother the people who didn’t read the EULA in the first place? They obviously didn’t care enough about what it contained the first time they agreed to it.
I really hope there is no plans for something like a ‘premium’ account type deal which is in most korean f2ps mmos. This is the sneaky way of putting in a ‘sub’ without going against what they have said.
ie. you can play for free but expect low drop rates, exp, rewards, etc unless you pay premium every month.
If something like this happens, I will uninstall GW2 and never play this game or any other made by anet ever again.
Didn’t see this post until now, but can you elaborate a bit more on the “monitoring” clause? The language here seems extremely permissive and basically (if I’m reading it correctly, I’m not a lawyer) allows you guys to monitor our entire computer. Since the game runs as Administrator/root it can make system calls that can tell you anything you want to know about our computer/files/programs running/sensitive stuff stored in RAM. Is that really necessary? To me it seems overly broad and invasive. Do you guys have a policy about storing that information? Retention timelines, etc? It just makes me nervous that my data can be blindly collected by you guys under this contract.
Section in question:
ArenaNet HAS THE RIGHT, BUT NO OBLIGATION, TO MONITOR OPERATION OF ANY SERVICE, CONTENT OR GAME AT ANY TIME AND IN ANY MATTER, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO MONITORING COMMUNICATIONS AND COMMUNICATIONS INTERFACES, STORAGE DEVICES, RANDOM ACCESS MEMORY, OR CPU PROCESSES RELATED TO HARDWARE YOU USE WITH THE GAME. SUCH MONITORING MAY ALSO INCLUDE, BUT IS NOT LIMITED TO, MONITORING FOR THE PURPOSES OF DETECTING THE GAME UNDER SECTION 8© or 8(e). YOU CONSENT TO THE FOREGOING MONITORING AND ACKNOWLEDGE THAT ArenaNet MAY, AT ANY TIME, AND IN ANY MANNER, COMMUNICATE ANY INFORMATION BETWEEN HARDWARE YOU USE WITH THE GAME AND ANY MECHANISM ArenaNet MAY CHOOSE FOR SUCH COMMUNICATIONS. YOU ALSO ACKNOWLEDGE THAT AS A RESULT OF SUCH MONITORING ArenaNet MAY IN ITS REASONABLE DISCRETION TAKE ANY ACTION, OR NO ACTION WHATSOEVER, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO:
CHANGING ANY PORTION OF THE SERVICE, CONTENT OR GAME;
SEEKING RECOURSE AGAINST YOU BY WAY OF ANY PROCEEDING ARENANET DEEMS APPROPRIATE UNDER THE CIRCUMSTANCES; AND/OR
DETERMINING THAT YOU ARE NOT IN COMPLIANCE WITH ALL PROVISIONS OF THIS AGREEMENT AND TERMINATING YOUR ACCOUNT UNDER SECTION 3(b). ARENANET HAS THE RIGHT, BUT NO OBLIGATION, TO PROVIDE YOU WITH NOTICE BEFORE SUCH TERMINATION.
All professions level 80| Champion Paragon, Phantom, Genius
Phoenix Ascendant [ASH] | Rank 80
Phoenix Ascendant [ASH] | Rank 80
ACCOUNT AND PAYMENTS TO ArenaNet
Periodic Payments Related to Accounts, Service and Content – ArenaNet may, in its reasonable discretion, require You to pay to establish or maintain any Account, to use any Service or to use any Content. You acknowledge that if You are required to do so, but do not, then ArenaNet may terminate Your Account under Section 3(b). You additionally acknowledge that ArenaNet may require such payments on any basis it deems appropriate in its reasonable discretion, including but not limited to any per-use or periodic basis (such as a number of hours, days or months). And You acknowledge that ArenaNet may, in its reasonable discretion, establish the timing and form in which such payment must be made, including but not limited to credit cards or online payment services.
A little worrying for the future?
Sounds like a P2P endeavor going on for the future of GW2?
Mud Bone – Sylvari Ranger
(edited by Im Mudbone.1437)
Didn’t see this post until now, but can you elaborate a bit more on the “monitoring” clause? The language here seems extremely permissive and basically (if I’m reading it correctly, I’m not a lawyer) allows you guys to monitor our entire computer. Since the game runs as Administrator/root it can make system calls that can tell you anything you want to know about our computer/files/programs running/sensitive stuff stored in RAM. Is that really necessary? To me it seems overly broad and invasive. Do you guys have a policy about storing that information? Retention timelines, etc? It just makes me nervous that my data can be blindly collected by you guys under this contract.
Section in question:
ArenaNet HAS THE RIGHT, BUT NO OBLIGATION, TO MONITOR OPERATION OF ANY SERVICE, CONTENT OR GAME AT ANY TIME AND IN ANY MATTER, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO MONITORING COMMUNICATIONS AND COMMUNICATIONS INTERFACES, STORAGE DEVICES, RANDOM ACCESS MEMORY, OR CPU PROCESSES RELATED TO HARDWARE YOU USE WITH THE GAME. SUCH MONITORING MAY ALSO INCLUDE, BUT IS NOT LIMITED TO, MONITORING FOR THE PURPOSES OF DETECTING THE GAME UNDER SECTION 8© or 8(e). YOU CONSENT TO THE FOREGOING MONITORING AND ACKNOWLEDGE THAT ArenaNet MAY, AT ANY TIME, AND IN ANY MANNER, COMMUNICATE ANY INFORMATION BETWEEN HARDWARE YOU USE WITH THE GAME AND ANY MECHANISM ArenaNet MAY CHOOSE FOR SUCH COMMUNICATIONS. YOU ALSO ACKNOWLEDGE THAT AS A RESULT OF SUCH MONITORING ArenaNet MAY IN ITS REASONABLE DISCRETION TAKE ANY ACTION, OR NO ACTION WHATSOEVER, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO:CHANGING ANY PORTION OF THE SERVICE, CONTENT OR GAME;
SEEKING RECOURSE AGAINST YOU BY WAY OF ANY PROCEEDING ARENANET DEEMS APPROPRIATE UNDER THE CIRCUMSTANCES; AND/OR
DETERMINING THAT YOU ARE NOT IN COMPLIANCE WITH ALL PROVISIONS OF THIS AGREEMENT AND TERMINATING YOUR ACCOUNT UNDER SECTION 3(b). ARENANET HAS THE RIGHT, BUT NO OBLIGATION, TO PROVIDE YOU WITH NOTICE BEFORE SUCH TERMINATION.
hope they like looking at a os system they got already . as well as gaming file for the game and the forum,s . that is all i got on my comp and noting else LMAO !!!!!!!!!!!!!
ACCOUNT AND PAYMENTS TO ArenaNet
Periodic Payments Related to Accounts, Service and Content – ArenaNet may, in its reasonable discretion, require You to pay to establish or maintain any Account, to use any Service or to use any Content. You acknowledge that if You are required to do so, but do not, then ArenaNet may terminate Your Account under Section 3(b). You additionally acknowledge that ArenaNet may require such payments on any basis it deems appropriate in its reasonable discretion, including but not limited to any per-use or periodic basis (such as a number of hours, days or months). And You acknowledge that ArenaNet may, in its reasonable discretion, establish the timing and form in which such payment must be made, including but not limited to credit cards or online payment services.
A little worrying for the future?
Sounds like a P2P endeavor going on for the future of GW2?
yes it sure does have that ring to it very much so . even tho they say and keep saying it will be free to play . makes one wounder with this how far away that is. and if so . time for a new game then and Anet will have lost a customer. in the mean time let us all enjoy the game and hope it never becomes a pay to play deal
I’m very interested to know that about that too eleshazar… I’m also curious about this-
“We and our third party advertising and analytics providers use tracking identifiers (such as Clear GIFs, pixels, web beacons) to track the online movements of web users. Unlike cookies, tracking identifiers are tiny graphics that are embedded invisibly on web pages or in HTML-based emails. We and our third party providers may place tracking identifiers on our Sites that track what other websites you visit (both before and after visiting the Sites) to obtain information about the effectiveness of advertisements on our Sites as well as on other websites and to help us improve our business and our Sites.”
Is it just the websites we visit before and after or are we giving it permission to track us constantly? And does not agreeing to this EULA stop this occurring?
ACCOUNT AND PAYMENTS TO ArenaNet
Periodic Payments Related to Accounts, Service and Content – ArenaNet may, in its reasonable discretion, require You to pay to establish or maintain any Account, to use any Service or to use any Content. You acknowledge that if You are required to do so, but do not, then ArenaNet may terminate Your Account under Section 3(b). You additionally acknowledge that ArenaNet may require such payments on any basis it deems appropriate in its reasonable discretion, including but not limited to any per-use or periodic basis (such as a number of hours, days or months). And You acknowledge that ArenaNet may, in its reasonable discretion, establish the timing and form in which such payment must be made, including but not limited to credit cards or online payment services.
A little worrying for the future?
Sounds like a P2P endeavor going on for the future of GW2?
Other than the name change from “NCSOFT” to “ArenaNet” and “sole and absolute” to “reasonable” that paragraph always existed in the EULA. This has been pointed out again and again in this thread.
This was the original.
Periodic Payments Related to Accounts, Service and Content — NCSOFT may, in its sole and absolute discretion, require You to pay to establish or maintain any Account, to use any Service or to use any Content. You acknowledge that if You are required to do so, but do not, then NCSOFT may terminate Your Account under Section 3(b). You additionally acknowledge that NCSOFT may require such payments on any basis it deems appropriate in its sole and absolute discretion, including but not limited to any per-use or periodic basis (such as a number of hours, days or months). And You acknowledge that NCSOFT may, in its sole and absolute discretion, establish the timing and form in which such payment must be made, including but not limited to credit cards or online payment services.
We are heroes. This is what we do!
RIP City of Heroes
RIP City of Heroes
(edited by Behellagh.1468)
I’m very interested to know that about that too eleshazar… I’m also curious about this-
“We and our third party advertising and analytics providers use tracking identifiers (such as Clear GIFs, pixels, web beacons) to track the online movements of web users. Unlike cookies, tracking identifiers are tiny graphics that are embedded invisibly on web pages or in HTML-based emails. We and our third party providers may place tracking identifiers on our Sites that track what other websites you visit (both before and after visiting the Sites) to obtain information about the effectiveness of advertisements on our Sites as well as on other websites and to help us improve our business and our Sites.”
Is it just the websites we visit before and after or are we giving it permission to track us constantly? And does not agreeing to this EULA stop this occurring?
Oh, I didn’t even see that part. What section was that under? Fortunately NoScript will help with a bunch of those things, although embeded iframes (clear gifs/pixels) are a little bit harder to stop from tracking you.
All professions level 80| Champion Paragon, Phantom, Genius
Phoenix Ascendant [ASH] | Rank 80
Phoenix Ascendant [ASH] | Rank 80
I miss a “disagree” and “Plz don’t bother me I just want to play GW2” button.
I miss a “disagree” and “Plz don’t bother me I just want to play GW2” button.
The ‘please don’t bother me I just want to play’ button is the same as the Agree button. You don’t actually have to read the agreement to play, you just have to accept it. (Although one of the things you are agreeing to is that you’ve read and understood it.)
The ‘disagree’ button is the little x in the corner of the launcher. If you don’t agree then you can’t play the game. (If there’s something in particular you genuinely disagree with, or have concerns about, you could maybe contact Anet to discuss it. But I wouldn’t expect it to change quickly if it changed at all and if you want to play you do have to agree to it.)
Danielle Aurorel, Dear Dragon We Got Your Cookies [Nom], Desolation (EU).
“Life’s a journey, not a destination.”
“Life’s a journey, not a destination.”
Staff has said themselves that they’re not adding a sub model, so let’s move on cause it’s been in the EULA since 2005.
What I find interesting is Anet removing almost all mention of NCSoft from the document, that’s definitely new and unusual.
I miss a “disagree” and “Plz don’t bother me I just want to play GW2” button.
The ‘please don’t bother me I just want to play’ button is the same as the Agree button. You don’t actually have to read the agreement to play, you just have to accept it. (Although one of the things you are agreeing to is that you’ve read and understood it.)
The ‘disagree’ button is the little x in the corner of the launcher. If you don’t agree then you can’t play the game. (If there’s something in particular you genuinely disagree with, or have concerns about, you could maybe contact Anet to discuss it. But I wouldn’t expect it to change quickly if it changed at all and if you want to play you do have to agree to it.)
Well, you’re right in theory, but in practice stopping playing is not a viable option after you spent hundreds or thousands of hours and quite some money on your characters. And that is my point. Once you’re in with a decent investment of your time, you’re locked in and they can ask anything in the EULA. Players will agree to it to just get access to their chars back.
Oh, I didn’t even see that part. What section was that under? Fortunately NoScript will help with a bunch of those things, although embeded iframes (clear gifs/pixels) are a little bit harder to stop from tracking you.
It’s under – (1) Collection of Personal Information – Cookies and Related Technologies
I will contact Anet directly to see what they have to say and post back here, as I know most have high regard for their privacy ; ).
@Quickfox – that is true, but the onus (or choice) is still on the individual. Personally, while I take no issue with every single action being tracked/monitored in game, extending beyond the game is an invasion of privacy. Likewise while playing, if data (i.e. hard drives) are being checked which isn’t game related, that would also be an issue.
At that point, before agreeing to this EULA I would weigh up the option of where the game’s headed and if it’s worth supporting into the future.
you know when gw2 crashes and like.. asks to send an error report?
It takes a dump file, sends it to anet, their boffins take care of the rest so they can patch things.
and you know like when you’re in like… sweeden, but decide to take your latop or w/e to say… germany… how does it know who is where and whats doing what?
Data collection.
F-Secure did a good thing, put ‘free wifi’ on the tube in london with the clause stating they would take your first born son if you accept.
Anet arent the NSA… you dont have to worry about that kinda kitten
gravity is my arch-nemesis.
As you say alicatrawz – it asks to send an error report hence the need to have certain questions answered in regards to EXACTLY what we are giving consent to by signing EULA.
This isn’t about worry, I’m fully aware of what the snowden files produced and who’s getting what, this is about choice and values and what you choose to uphold/perpetuate.
Still no response by Anet yet…
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