Guild Wars 2

I like the token idea very much. Imho it should be not too easy to get enough tokens though. If the chance is 1%, you really should have to gather 100 tokens to get the ascended weapon imho. There should be other rewards which are cheaper though (like exotics for 20 tokens or tonics for 5 etc. Ascended weapons are quite expensive to craft, so this should also be reflected in the amount of tokens these cost.

Good idea.

it’s all about the RNG versus guaranteed rewards again. In the Living Story updates Anet learned that it’s a good choice if people with little luck can get the reward through hard work also. Why not implement this here too? Instead of fortune scraps people now get Sunless Tokens with new rewards worth working towards to.

I like RNG in this situation. Please don’t screw it up. Lets keep it. Its fun to have RNG in these situations because if you do get the reward, it feels special!! And if yo don’t well it gives you something to come back for.

SkylightMoon.1980:

I like RNG in this situation. Please don’t screw it up. Lets keep it. Its fun to have RNG in these situations because if you do get the reward, it feels special!! And if yo don’t well it gives you something to come back for.

And if too few get it the event dies as not enough show up to complete it. So which is more important a few feeling special or the event remaining populated? I think the latter.

Essence Snow.3194:

SkylightMoon.1980:

I like RNG in this situation. Please don’t screw it up. Lets keep it. Its fun to have RNG in these situations because if you do get the reward, it feels special!! And if yo don’t well it gives you something to come back for.

And if too few get it the event dies as not enough show up to complete it. So which is more important a few feeling special or the event remaining populated? I think the latter.

That won’t happen. If people don’t get it, it gives them incentive to come back and keep getting it. A lot of people will work at something like that. This community has too many people who want to get a fitting reward on the first try. It doesn’t work like that.

And if too few get it the event dies as not enough show up to complete it. So which is more important a few feeling special or the event remaining populated? I think the latter.

I agree. With a constant flow of tokens people will rather try it again and again than with a random chance nobody knows… precursor chance?! – I’ll give up already.

wait a minute… aren’t dragon encounters already a part of the new ascended crafting system? I guess you can gather mats for the generic ascended weapons only, but not the specific Tequatl ascended weapon though.

SkylightMoon.1980:

Essence Snow.3194:

SkylightMoon.1980:

I like RNG in this situation. Please don’t screw it up. Lets keep it. Its fun to have RNG in these situations because if you do get the reward, it feels special!! And if yo don’t well it gives you something to come back for.

And if too few get it the event dies as not enough show up to complete it. So which is more important a few feeling special or the event remaining populated? I think the latter.

That won’t happen. If people don’t get it, it gives them incentive to come back and keep getting it. A lot of people will work at something like that. This community has too many people who want to get a fitting reward on the first try. It doesn’t work like that.

It won’t? After the initial surge of players going for the achievement it’ll become like other world events with low chances….ie devoid of players. Look at the last completed times on some of them. Historical evidence shows us this……that being our best predictor of future occurrences, I see no reason to think it won’t happen.

What reason is there that it won’t?

Teq need more than 80 players who are over L65+ and well geared.
What about zhatian? Only 5 ppl kill it
Who is boss? Who is claw?

Teq event must fail if below 80 ppl? Will it pull players to very high servers?

SkylightMoon.1980:

Essence Snow.3194:

SkylightMoon.1980:

I like RNG in this situation. Please don’t screw it up. Lets keep it. Its fun to have RNG in these situations because if you do get the reward, it feels special!! And if yo don’t well it gives you something to come back for.

And if too few get it the event dies as not enough show up to complete it. So which is more important a few feeling special or the event remaining populated? I think the latter.

That won’t happen. If people don’t get it, it gives them incentive to come back and keep getting it. A lot of people will work at something like that. This community has too many people who want to get a fitting reward on the first try. It doesn’t work like that.

Not really. Claw of Jormag can drop both the Breath of Jormag, which is quite expensive to craft, and precursors. I barely see anyone bothering with him.

And they can simply make Tequatl’s unique Ascended skin cost something like 100 kills of Tequatl.

I support the ticket idea. No one will do Tequila and your efforts will go to waste if all he drops are a few rares and greens.

Also, I hope theres a sever wide announcement when it shows up on any sever as well. It needs a ton of people to take down and not everyone uses a tracker.

Xae Isareth.1364:

Also, I hope theres a sever wide announcement when it shows up on any sever as well. It needs a ton of people to take down and it everyone uses a tracker.

well the options to form tequatl battalions (e.g. the finger killing group) shows up in the lfg-UI. I guess it shows only up when he is going to arrive soon, can’t confirm it though.

EDIT: man I have to be blind, those are player created. Still usefull when players post groups for dragon encounters when those are up

GUILDWARS.2184:

Teq need more than 80 players who are over L65+ and well geared.
What about zhatian? Only 5 ppl kill it
Who is boss? Who is claw?

Teq event must fail if below 80 ppl? Will it pull players to very high servers?

It stands out of question, that Anet has a great deal with reworking the whole personal story, with the battle against Zhaitan, if they start to change the mechanics of the little bosses…

Come on, if Tequatl gets now a much more epic battle mechanics, then its not ok, if they let the lame Zhaitan Battle, as it is…

Zhaitans battle shouldn’t be designed for a 5 man group.
The whole thing about it should be designed for like a 50 man group or so in a huge raid style mission. Then the whole battles there would feel also alot more epic.
and people wouldn’t have to group up, the game with just throw 50 random people together.
People would have to split up and do multiple different tasks at the same time, like some going onto a task of the vigil, one of the priory and one goes for the task of the order of whispers.
Zhaitan has to become a multi stage battle where you have to fight him on land, as also the air and maybe finally in a kind of special created realm from him, the Underworld at the final phase, somethign along the way like that.

I hope we will see more boss changes until the end of this year coming, especially the mega bosses like Shatterer, Jormags Claw ect. and alot of the dungeon Bosses especially.

Xae Isareth.1364:

He’s awesome now. Can’t wait to try it out.

But Anet, please also make it so that he’s definitely worth the time and effort to take down. Make him more rewarding than the other dragon bosses for a start.

Ideally, make him drop tokens which you can then exchange for his unique drops (like how dungeons work) instead of a RNG fest where it drops at a 0.001% chance.

Otherwise there will be a flux of people chasing after it because its new content, then it’ll just go back to being even more dead than it was before this update as he now takes longer to kill.

Dont give arenanet the idea for new currency.
Please
The game has more than it should.

^ and why not? Whats do bad about linking items to different currency so not everything gets screwed over by inflation?

I’m not even going to bother with the revamped bossfights.
Farming champions in orr and frostgorge is a lot easier and with much better rewards.

In before the new Karka Queen.

SkylightMoon.1980:

Essence Snow.3194:

SkylightMoon.1980:

I like RNG in this situation. Please don’t screw it up. Lets keep it. Its fun to have RNG in these situations because if you do get the reward, it feels special!! And if yo don’t well it gives you something to come back for.

And if too few get it the event dies as not enough show up to complete it. So which is more important a few feeling special or the event remaining populated? I think the latter.

That won’t happen. If people don’t get it, it gives them incentive to come back and keep getting it. A lot of people will work at something like that. This community has too many people who want to get a fitting reward on the first try. It doesn’t work like thakittens

not that ppl want to get stuff the first try, its just ppl dont want to get the stuff on their millionth or billionth try. RNG is stupid. This game needs more things where a player can work to achieve goals to earn rewards not herpakitten .001% chance of this cool new super awesome skin GLBRO deal we got.

Besides the tequatl is a 1 time per day boss and if they make it rng you might as well. So you will actuly have to spend days on top of days for your daily chest from tequatl. Rather then that why not make it drop a guranteed token everytime you kill it AND a daily chest. The token you can get when ever you beat tequatl not once a day. You would need X amount of tokens to spend on stuff for tequatl stuff. Just like the dungeon vendors you could have an area with monster hunters that trade you phat loot for the tokens you worked for. Could be like dragon hunters and stuff that sell the loot.

cesmode.4257:

Xae Isareth.1364:

He’s awesome now. Can’t wait to try it out.

But Anet, please also make it so that he’s definitely worth the time and effort to take down. Make him more rewarding than the other dragon bosses for a start.

Ideally, make him drop tokens which you can then exchange for his unique drops (like how dungeons work) instead of a RNG fest where it drops at a 0.001% chance.

Otherwise there will be a flux of people chasing after it because its new content, then it’ll just go back to being even more dead than it was before this update as he now takes longer to kill.

Dont give arenanet the idea for new currency.
Please
The game has more than it should.

currency is better then rng. Plus you dont have to store it in your bank anymore its with you all the time. I know too much currency is bad but its simple and is specific on what you need to do for what you need to spend on.

Wait a sec…where did you find out Tequila Sunrise is changing?

Avatara.1042:

Wait a sec…where did you find out Tequila Sunrise is changing?

http://www.twitch.tv/guildwars2/b/454437568

About an hour in devs give a sneak peak,

PS, she is a clicker, gets really annoying.

A token system is the way to go for all RNG content above basic mobs and events. It was done well in another game I played, where the items offered for the tokens (required so many of the specific event to be completed) were the same that had a chance to drop from the event normally. Best system I have seen.

Please keep in mind that everyone will soon be running account wide 300% magic find. When I run that high of magic find in gear, my drops greatly increase.

Lunar Sunset.8742:

Avatara.1042:

Wait a sec…where did you find out Tequila Sunrise is changing?

http://www.twitch.tv/guildwars2/b/454437568

About an hour in devs give a sneak peak,

PS, she is a clicker, gets really annoying.

Ah. Cheers.

Xae Isareth.1364:

He’s awesome now. Can’t wait to try it out.

But Anet, please also make it so that he’s definitely worth the time and effort to take down. Make him more rewarding than the other dragon bosses for a start.

Agreed. The absolute worst thing that could happen with this guy is taking him down, getting your daily rare, and then getting only blues and greens from the chest. If this guy is going to be such a pain to kill, there had better be guaranteed amazing rewards for doing it every single time. It’s also gotta be better than champ farming in Queensdale.

The most important thing about the rewards needs to be that it rewards the team who was able to muster the organization and develop a strategy, and that they have access to rewards from the kill that others in the area do not for simply “being there.”

I have a thread specifically on this started yesterday, if it throws this thread off topic too far: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/New-Tequatl-Rewards-Guild-Recognition/

Mosharn.8357:

currency is better then rng. Plus you dont have to store it in your bank anymore its with you all the time. I know too much currency is bad but its simple and is specific on what you need to do for what you need to spend on.

Currency isn’t fun. RNG is more engaging because it can happen at any time, not after a calculated amount of time saving up your pennies. That stuff is for real life budgeting, not a fantasy video game. You may enjoy chores, not me.

Zeldain.5710:

Mosharn.8357:

currency is better then rng. Plus you dont have to store it in your bank anymore its with you all the time. I know too much currency is bad but its simple and is specific on what you need to do for what you need to spend on.

Currency isn’t fun. RNG is more engaging because it can happen at any time, not after a calculated amount of time saving up your pennies. That stuff is for real life budgeting, not a fantasy video game. You may enjoy chores, not me.

No its not. Having played Vindictus for a long time, where getting anything involves selling your soul to the RNG gods and one particular item required to make the then endgame gear had a 1/850 chance to drop in a thrice-weekly raid, I can tell you this.

RNG makes people feel like they’ve just wasted their time it makes getting anything into a set of independent events where if you didn’t roll 20 on a 100 sided dice, well, that was your time wasted.

Also, people often play for a sense of achievement. There’s no sense of achievement from getting lucky and rolling a good item.

yup if they don’t make the loot worth it then it won’t ever be done. Just as reference on Crystal Desert (the server i’m on) the Karka queen hasn’t been done in 189 hours…

Zeldain.5710:

The most important thing about the rewards needs to be that it rewards the team who was able to muster the organization and develop a strategy, and that they have access to rewards from the kill that others in the area do not for simply “being there.”

No, if they were going to do that then they would’ve made this a Guild mission-type of thing.

Killing the Dragons is supposed to be in everyone’s best interest. Not just the best interests of one big guild.

Zeldain.5710:

Currency isn’t fun. RNG is more engaging because it can happen at any time, not after a calculated amount of time saving up your pennies. That stuff is for real life budgeting, not a fantasy video game. You may enjoy chores, not me.

RNG is great if you get lucky and massivelly sucks if you don’t. Currency isn’t fun in and of itself, but it tracks your progress at a visible rate and ensures that your efforts are never wasted.

Blaine Tog.8304:

Zeldain.5710:

The most important thing about the rewards needs to be that it rewards the team who was able to muster the organization and develop a strategy, and that they have access to rewards from the kill that others in the area do not for simply “being there.”

No, if they were going to do that then they would’ve made this a Guild mission-type of thing.

Killing the Dragons is supposed to be in everyone’s best interest. Not just the best interests of one big guild.

If they do this right, it won’t be possible for anyone BUT a big organized guild to pull it off. So why should a passer-by have the same rights for putting in none of the same effort?

Zeldain.5710:

If they do this right, it won’t be possible for anyone BUT a big organized guild to pull it off. So why should a passer-by have the same rights for putting in none of the same effort?

Because they still showed up to the fight. It’s conceivable that the fight may not even have succeeded without that outside help. Would you prefer everyone fails together than everyone succeeds together?

If we’re going to talk about a Dragon’s General fight that’s not rewarding, let’s look at Jormag first… mainly b/c “the Claw” is in a zone with with one of the most egregious Champ “circuits” in the game drawing off whatever player force was already present in the zone. The Claw’s constantly respawning champions don’t even need to drop Boxes, they just need to go back to dropping Corrupted Cores & Lodestones like they used to drop. People actually WANTED those things, even more than they want Champ Boxes.

World boss adds should drop loot, but if the event goes on for too long, they will stop dropping it. That should give nice drops without being able to meaninglessly prolong the event to farm it.

Zeldain.5710:

Blaine Tog.8304:

Zeldain.5710:

The most important thing about the rewards needs to be that it rewards the team who was able to muster the organization and develop a strategy, and that they have access to rewards from the kill that others in the area do not for simply “being there.”

No, if they were going to do that then they would’ve made this a Guild mission-type of thing.

Killing the Dragons is supposed to be in everyone’s best interest. Not just the best interests of one big guild.

If they do this right, it won’t be possible for anyone BUT a big organized guild to pull it off. So why should a passer-by have the same rights for putting in none of the same effort?

Because otherwise it would be a 50-man raid instead of a world boss, because you;re not involving the world, you’re involving 50 people from a select guild.

Having said that, I think I would actually prefer this to be a 50-man raid…

Stark.1350:

Please keep in mind that everyone will soon be running account wide 300% magic find. When I run that high of magic find in gear, my drops greatly increase.

Or, Anet will uniformly reduce drop rates.

Lord Kuru.3685:

Stark.1350:

Please keep in mind that everyone will soon be running account wide 300% magic find. When I run that high of magic find in gear, my drops greatly increase.

Or, Anet will uniformly reduce drop rates.

Hopefully it’ll help balance out the spiking demand for t6 mats.

Or make it drop tokens which are guild ( or alliance, when alliance system comes) bound. This way, guilds will get more value and for example officers/members should vote who will get tokens in the guild. This would add a competition between guilds in PvE and being in a guild would really mean something. Not like now, when most of people dont really care who they represent .

Xae Isareth.1364:

Not really. Claw of Jormag can drop both the Breath of Jormag, which is quite expensive to craft, and precursors. I barely see anyone bothering with him.

And they can simply make Tequatl’s unique Ascended skin cost something like 100 kills of Tequatl.

I’m not sure a direct comparison can be made at all. EVERY change to Jormag has only served to make the fight longer and less rewarding — nothing new has been added to that fight in the slightest.

If the fight mechanics are genuinely compelling, people like me will be willing to run it regardless of rewards. That, + people seeking the unique skins should keep the completion popping for a while. Aside from that, NO content is popular forever, and it would be silly to expect it to be so.

Xae Isareth.1364:

^I’d rather not. That’s create more grief than the game can handle and would potentially destroy guilds from inside out. When I played RuneScape, I was an admin in a big guild who often had to decide if a member should receive the splits from a boss kill, and you do not want that job, its horrible and makes people hate you.

Also, what about people who aren’t a part of a guild?

So instead of tracking dragon events being optional, it’s now become mandatory.

GREAT IMPROVEMENT!

Blaine Tog.8304:

Zeldain.5710:

If they do this right, it won’t be possible for anyone BUT a big organized guild to pull it off. So why should a passer-by have the same rights for putting in none of the same effort?

Because they still showed up to the fight. It’s conceivable that the fight may not even have succeeded without that outside help. Would you prefer everyone fails together than everyone succeeds together?

“Showing up” for the fight is no longer enough. That is exactly what they talked about in the livestream.

They want to make players communicate, coordinate and strategize… that does simply not happen in the open world with any manner of player wandering around, and if it can be killed that way, then they will have failed in their mission.

So the passer-by should get the loot they always would have, but the in-charge group should get the rare pieces.

Xae Isareth.1364:

Having said that, I think I would actually prefer this to be a 50-man raid…

I think that’s what they should have done, actually. Came up a lot in beta (at least form me!)

Why not slap down a little green glowy star in the area that represents and instanced copy that an organized guild group could enter… the open world stays as is, but the challenge is in the instance.

Seems like that would have been the best of both worlds.

Zeldain.5710:

“Showing up” for the fight is no longer enough. That is exactly what they talked about in the livestream.

They want to make players communicate, coordinate and strategize… that does simply not happen in the open world with any manner of player wandering around, and if it can be killed that way, then they will have failed in their mission.

Everyone just showing up and flailing isn’t going to get it done. A guild working together with a bunch of extra players adding their DPS will (assuming the encounter is designed properly) have a better chance of succeeding than a guild working by itself. And given the number of hit points this thing appear to have, my guess is you’ll need all the raw DPS you can get, in addition to coordination and planning.

You’ve seen Star Wars: A New Hope, right? Should Han have been blown off by the Rebels because all he did was fly in at the end and fire a few shots? No, he got his Medal just like Luke did and nobody in the history of movie-watching has ever argued that Luke should’ve whined to the Princess that Han got the same Medal as him, or that Han wouldn’t have shown up unless he knew he was getting the same Medal as Luke.

People should be encouraged to help each other out and facilitate each other’s goals. That’s been a central pillar of GW2 and I don’t see Anet turning their back on that philosophy now.

Blaine Tog.8304:

You’ve seen Star Wars: A New Hope, right? Should Han have been blown off by the Rebels because all he did was fly in at the end and fire a few shots? No, he got his Medal just like Luke did and nobody in the history of movie-watching has ever argued that Luke should’ve whined to the Princess that Han got the same Medal as him, or that Han wouldn’t have shown up unless he knew he was getting the same Medal as Luke.

People should be encouraged to help each other out and facilitate each other’s goals. That’s been a central pillar of GW2 and I don’t see Anet turning their back on that philosophy now.

Well, I was at game 6 of the Stanley Cup finals this year, but the Blackhawks still haven’t told me when my day with the cup will be.

There are asinine examples that can be trotted out on both sides of the argument.

The bottom line is, they could have easily made them work like this when the game launched, but they chose not to. Now, they are asking for players to come up with extra effort and coordination (and no doubt time) to be able to sucessfully pull this off on a regular basis. A real teamwork-driven goal.

Why should someone not on the team get the same rewards just for showing up? Why would anyone expect them to, is the real question?

Again – those drive-by players can get the loot they always have. But restrict the chance to get rare loot only if you are part of the core organized group to kill it.

ANet is done with tokens unless they can hard time gate them (like guild commendations). Dungeon speed runners taught them the folly of tokens in the first two months of the game.

Zeldain.5710:

Well, I was at game 6 of the Stanley Cup finals this year, but the Blackhawks still haven’t told me when my day with the cup will be.

There are asinine examples that can be trotted out on both sides of the argument.

Just because you intentionally chose an example that makes no sense doesn’t mean no example can ever make sense.

There’s clearly a difference between a character participating in Teq’s take-down (dealing potentially hundreds of thousands of points of damage over the course of the event) and someone observing a sporting event. You’re describing an instanced raid. Teq is not an instanced raid.

Zeldain.5710:

Why should someone not on the team get the same rewards just for showing up?

Because the fight doesn’t belong to the Guild. It belongs to the server. A guild, whether out of the goodness of its heart, for marketing purposes, or just because they want the loot it offers and can’t get it unless someone steps up to the plate, can spearhead it but it’s still intended to be an event the server can rally around.

Giving everyone the same loot strikes the right balance between avarice and altruism, avarice because of human nature, altruism for community-building.

In any case, we’re talking in circles. I’m confident that I’m describing the system Anet has chosen.