Guild Missions [merged]
I can accept the completion of Ascended gear, but was there really ever a huge demand for it? I’d like more interesting chest drops – I don’t care if it’s a Quaggan backpack or loot (ok, I’d prefer a pet) – but just something. It’s like opening a present & finding socks. But I don’t think we need a gear grind to maintain motivation.
lol i completely forgot that I could buy them with laurels + ectos. Now i can buy my accessories without have to log on when my guild decide to use the quest. Another question if I got invites for 30guilds and can I do 30 quests and get the itens in one day?
Ouroboro Knight’s [OK]
It wouldn’t be as big a problem if they didn’t make guild missions a much easier way to get Ascended accessories. Compare the following (and assume you have 8x 80s that need gearing, just as a reference point):
If you’re part of a big guild that will eventually have all five guild mission types unlocked, you will need only 192 guild commendations and 80 gold. The guild commendations would take just over 19 weeks to collect, and you can earn them concurrently with laurels for Ascended amulets (or tonics/pets/etc).
If you’re part of a small guild and aren’t able to earn guild commendations, you would have to collect 640 laurels and 800 globs of ectoplasm (market price of 240-320 gold). The much higher gold cost notwithstanding, that’s 16 months of laurel collecting, and you cannot earn them concurrently with laurels for Ascended amulets (or tonics/pets/etc).
The bottom line comparison is you can acquire amulets and accessories for all 8 toons in 6 months (6 months of laurels for amulets, concurrently with the 4.5 months for accessories) with a large guild, while the same acquisition would require 22 months for a small one (6 months and 16 months consecutively).
Considering Fractals are for groups of five, is there a specific motivation for why a team from a small guild requires 3-4x the cost in both time and gold to obtain the same amount of gear? Until there are other ways of obtaining this gear (i.e. via the Fractals themselves, or elsewhere), this seems poorly designed.
Mind you, I’m not saying ANet should cater guild missions to tiny 1-5 member guilds, but I just don’t see a reason why there should be an uneven playing field (determined by guild size) with regard to Fractals.
This also hurts the guild recruitment of smaller guilds. It was already more difficult to recruit over much larger guilds with 24/7-persistent magic find and karma boosts (or who could pump them out easier), but now…. anyone with Ascended aspirations (or even collectors of tonics/pets) will be that much more disinclined to join a smaller guild.
Do you want to enjoy legendaries? Then you have to work/pay for it.
Do you want the rewards at the end of a dungeon? Then you have to work/pay for it
Do you want to enjoy guild missions? Then you have to have to work/pay for it.The first two are rewards and are primarily focused on cosmetics.
The last is saying you have to WORK/PAY to play supposedly “free” content. Hmm… And as far as that goes anyway, how much WORK is it exactly to join a 400 man guild and be another faceless name?This is an MMO. The name of the game is longevity. Larger guilds with stocks of inf now have a reason to BE a large guild. Small guilds now have a goal that they can towards and if they’re such a tight knit group as everyone claims they are, then the journey should serve to bring them closer together.
This is just silly. If large guilds add nothing inherently to our game experience, why should they be encouraged at all? Why should new guilds be discouraged from ever forming?
You do realize that 400 man guilds are usually HARDCORE, right? Guilds like ESF kick you out if you are inactive for two days. Other than that, I like my existing guild. Why should I join another guild who requires 100% representation? I must admit though, I am under increasing pressure by ANET to do so.
400 man guilds? I thought 200 was big. I cannot imagine having to report in, to a guild, to let them know I have the flu… Or am going on vacation. Or just don’t feel like playing. Way to make it like a job!
I don’t feel under pressure to join a large guild. If I had harbored any such impulse, the behavior of large guild representatives (“I’m an officer!”) solidified my resistance. I’m sure there are some nice ones, where people don’t speak to each other in that manner, but from what I’ve seen, it’s way too open for abusiveness. So it isn’t pressure – it’s, ‘is this game still what I thought it was when I decided to invest my time in it, & when I lured a bunch of friends to play with me?’
So it seems to me that what all this really boils down to is the Ascended Gear.
If the carrot wasn’t BiS gear, then most small guilds would be fine with having the missions at their own pace, for their own sake.
If you didn’t have to grind out Fractals (which isn’t for everyone) in order to get a BiS backpiece, most folks would be fine with Fractals. They’d play or not as desired. Now I realize you can get a backpiece out of the MF with a recipe, but that’s so stupid expensive it doesn’t really make you feel any better about having to do Fractals if that’s not your cup of tea.
Everyone is equal when it comes to the amulets (despite how annoying the timegating is) because nobody has any particular advantage over anyone else, and the dailies can be accomplished pretty much anywhere just by playing the game.
See the difference, ArenaNet? People just want to play the game. I, personally, feel like I’m starting to be buried into an Ascended pit that I can’t dig my way out of fast enough. I think alot of others do, too.
Please, for the love of Guild Wars, stop now with the Ascended gear. We have backpieces and a complete set of accessories. Let’s leave it at that, and just get on with the business of making a really good game instead. That way, when you implement new stuff, people will actually be excited about it.
Well said!
(I personally set foot in Fractals only once, drew the possibly incorrect conclusion that they would be a repetitive grind once you memorized the fights, and left.)
The existence of the ascended gear is distorting, even perverting, gameplay both for the people seeking the BIS gear and for the players around them (just look around Queensdale at 4pm). It’s also changing my play from “go have fun” to “go grind”, which emotionally puts me back in a game I chose to leave.
I’d like ArenaNet to go back to making this the game I chose to come to, not turning it into the ones I left.
What’s worse is it’s turning into an older, less polished version of the games we chose to leave. Even though my previous MMO was a gear-grind, you could accomplish that gear-grind on the same level playing field. The carrot and the method of obtaining that carrot were reasonably linked (e.g. the carrot was BiS gear for 10- or 25-man raid progression, and your guild only had to be big enough to field the 10- or 25-man raids). Not so here, where the carrot is Ascended gear for 5-man Fractal progression, and the method is joining a large guild. The latter is nowhere near necessary for the former.
That part has been confusing me, too. Our largest group size has been 5. Suddenly, we need – apparently – a minimum of 20 people to do the first tier?
The group size, the community that could help each other ‘in the field’ without having to be partied – all that contributed to our decision to choose this game, when we had all vowed to never touch another mmo again.
It’s such an odd shift! I don’t really get the reason. I fully understand & appreciate the reason for guild events – but why lock out anything other than huge guilds? It just seems nonsensical.
They should never have introduced a new gear tier and put it behind grind gates. At least they are trying to negate the consequences of making some of the ascended gear available with a currency that’s obtainable without grinding. But still, they should have merely introduced new exotics with unique looks in the fractals or even different sets of armor and weapons (all exotic) but different in looks so that people who want to grind FotM will not be better off regarding statistics but by having unique gear.
It really went against their philoshopy of not having to grind to get to the fun stuff. Now the fun part is that a guy with ascended gear will have a better chance in defeating you in combat in WvWvW than a guy with merely exotic. Especially if both are highly skilled.
Prince Rurik and Lady Althea. Anyone else see the incompatibilty here?
guild missions should have higher duration or should be able to active more often.
This, i have no idea why this isn’t from the start, it’s so obvious.
Having just tried a T1 bounty with my small guild. We had about 5 people for this. Don’t even bother unless there are people on the map willing to help you. They take too long to kill, even if you do what most guilds are doing (sending one to each map to halt NPC movement).
I was looking forward to guild missions. I was trying to be optimistic about them, despite the initial shock of the influence amount. I don’t want to have to join a large guild just to be able to do the new content. I shouldn’t have to join a large guild. I’m honestly baffled at how ANet thought this was a good idea.
Gelda Nebilim – Nagare [NGE] – Crystal Desert
http://youtube.com/user/Royblazer
http://youtube.com/user/Royblazer
Over 1600 and still no word of them…THAT is what’s baffling me.
Foran Lonewind – Mesmer
Gwens Avengers
Riverside
Gwens Avengers
Riverside
Having just tried a T1 bounty with my small guild. We had about 5 people for this. Don’t even bother unless there are people on the map willing to help you. They take too long to kill, even if you do what most guilds are doing (sending one to each map to halt NPC movement).
I was looking forward to guild missions. I was trying to be optimistic about them, despite the initial shock of the influence amount. I don’t want to have to join a large guild just to be able to do the new content. I shouldn’t have to join a large guild. I’m honestly baffled at how ANet thought this was a good idea.
This is depressing to hear. My guild is also about 5 people. 3 of us are pretty active but the other 2 are not able to be as active due to real life constraints.
Anyway, we are still working to unlock the missions (we haven’t been online much lately though) but it doesn’t seem to be much hope in being able to complete them.
Dalishya Aibreann=80R/80T/80EL Eternal Night-Crystal Desert
“You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.”
“You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.”
If you’re part of a big guild that will eventually have all five guild mission types unlocked, you will need only 192 guild commendations and 80 gold. The guild commendations would take just over 19 weeks to collect, and you can earn them concurrently with laurels for Ascended amulets (or tonics/pets/etc).
It’s actually even worse – you forgot that you can get earrings in a mission drop.
Granted, we don’t know the chance yet.
And the laurel calculation will be skewed even more when the next ascended pieces are introduced (i don’t even want to guess how much they will cost, but surely more than earrings – increasing cost seems to be the current trend.)
Actions, not words.
Remember, remember, 15th of November
Remember, remember, 15th of November
Having just tried a T1 bounty with my small guild. We had about 5 people for this. Don’t even bother unless there are people on the map willing to help you. They take too long to kill, even if you do what most guilds are doing (sending one to each map to halt NPC movement).
I was looking forward to guild missions. I was trying to be optimistic about them, despite the initial shock of the influence amount. I don’t want to have to join a large guild just to be able to do the new content. I shouldn’t have to join a large guild. I’m honestly baffled at how ANet thought this was a good idea.
On the flip side, with a big guild, lack of coordination can be detrimental to a lack of fun for some members. We sent scouts to find the bounties beforehand. It was easy for scouts to miss info with guild chat coming fast and furious while looking at the surroundings. When the decision was made to actually start, people missed the notice. WP links were provided but poor directions once you got to the WP led people to hare off in the wrong direction. Some folks didn’t get to fire a shot because of these factors and because the bounties died really fast.
Hopefully, now that these missions are live and ANet can data mine with large and small samples across many servers, they will make some adjustments.
Having just tried a T1 bounty with my small guild. We had about 5 people for this. Don’t even bother unless there are people on the map willing to help you. They take too long to kill, even if you do what most guilds are doing (sending one to each map to halt NPC movement).
I was looking forward to guild missions. I was trying to be optimistic about them, despite the initial shock of the influence amount. I don’t want to have to join a large guild just to be able to do the new content. I shouldn’t have to join a large guild. I’m honestly baffled at how ANet thought this was a good idea.
Oh! We’re on the same server! There are just 3 of us playing regularly now – (2 are off for some work thing) but we’d be happy to help. We each have several 80s, so we could offer up one of each to your guild. We’re still slowly & painfully opening Art of War, but maybe we could eventually do some reciprocal missions. I have a guardian, mesmer & warrior which seem to be generally helpful, so you’d certainly be welcome to one of them. (I also have a ranger, thief, & engineer, but I’m a horrible thief, a fairly inept hunter, & I’m never quite sure what to do with the engineer, other than drop my son’s framerate with grenades & various explosions.
So last night a few of us noticed under the ranks tab in guild that only guild leaders have permissions to active missions content (however it appears us officers can activate the built upgrade) this is a big problem as our 2 ‘guild leaders’ have both been deployed in the army and won’t have internet for at least a month. Does anybody know if, like the ranks tab says, only the guild leader/highest rank can activate missions? Or can us officers who have been left in charge do it? (Obviously we don’t want to accidentally using the upgrade before people are ready)
If it is only the highest rank this is a massive issue and I’m sure we wouldn’t be the only ones with this problem
Do you guys know if I can get the commendations even if the guild is from other server but I’m guesting there?
Daniel Cousland – Darkhaven
Make the guild puzzles available at start, they look really fun and it seems that only a fraction of the population will get to experience them.
Well, our guild finished our first T1 bounty mission today. I’m pretty happy with how this content turned out. I’ve never seen this much guild conversation in this game. Any guild I joined before was dead quiet… but things have really done a 180 in response to this content. I think ANet has hit the nail on the head in getting the sleeping PVE side of the game to wake up. They were smart to sort of push the playerbase into making this content work for them (get a big guild, afford the upgrades, coordinate a 15 zone bounty, etc…) Those are challenges people can rise to and at the same time just start to realize the fact that there are other real people playing the game. They aren’t just graphics.
Having just tried a T1 bounty with my small guild. We had about 5 people for this. Don’t even bother unless there are people on the map willing to help you.
You can see in any guide that there are 15 targets to cover. Of course there’s a problem there if you did it with 5 people. Why not just rep a big guild and still hang with your buddies?
(edited by TurtleofPower.5641)
It wouldn’t be as big a problem if they didn’t make guild missions a much easier way to get Ascended accessories. Compare the following (and assume you have 8x 80s that need gearing, just as a reference point):
If you’re part of a big guild that will eventually have all five guild mission types unlocked, you will need only 192 guild commendations and 80 gold. The guild commendations would take just over 19 weeks to collect, and you can earn them concurrently with laurels for Ascended amulets (or tonics/pets/etc).
If you’re part of a small guild and aren’t able to earn guild commendations, you would have to collect 640 laurels and 800 globs of ectoplasm (market price of 240-320 gold). The much higher gold cost notwithstanding, that’s 16 months of laurel collecting, and you cannot earn them concurrently with laurels for Ascended amulets (or tonics/pets/etc).
The bottom line comparison is you can acquire amulets and accessories for all 8 toons in 6 months (6 months of laurels for amulets, concurrently with the 4.5 months for accessories) with a large guild, while the same acquisition would require 22 months for a small one (6 months and 16 months consecutively).
Considering Fractals are for groups of five, is there a specific motivation for why a team from a small guild requires 3-4x the cost in both time and gold to obtain the same amount of gear? Until there are other ways of obtaining this gear (i.e. via the Fractals themselves, or elsewhere), this seems poorly designed.
Mind you, I’m not saying ANet should cater guild missions to tiny 1-5 member guilds, but I just don’t see a reason why there should be an uneven playing field (determined by guild size) with regard to Fractals.
This also hurts the guild recruitment of smaller guilds. It was already more difficult to recruit over much larger guilds with 24/7-persistent magic find and karma boosts (or who could pump them out easier), but now…. anyone with Ascended aspirations (or even collectors of tonics/pets) will be that much more disinclined to join a smaller guild.
I agree. Laurels take way too long to get. I mean, only 1 a day and it’ll take a month just to get a single ascended item, considering that you play every single day. Guild missions you can get 2 commendations per mission. The only issue is influence and time, but it is exponentially faster than laurels. However, in big guilds they don’t care if you are online or not, they’ll just go ahead and do the mission right when it is done building.
Having just tried a T1 bounty with my small guild. We had about 5 people for this. Don’t even bother unless there are people on the map willing to help you.
You can see in any guide that there are 15 targets to cover. Of course there’s a problem there if you did it with 5 people. Why not just rep a big guild and still hang with your buddies?
Why should we have to? This is the question everyone’s asking. Why did Anet make content exclusively for large guilds without a single thought for the small guilds made up of local friends and family? Is it so wrong for us to enjoy hanging out with people we know IRL and want content to do with them?
~Kasaeva
Sea of Sorrows
Sea of Sorrows
The content is really wonderful. However, the fact that small guilds are excluded is what hurts me the most.
The Iron Hall [HALL] [Desolation] Join Now!
Over 1600 and still no word of them…THAT is what’s baffling me.
It’s not going to happen. They’re going to say:
“It appears that most of the people who had an opinion about the issue have already voiced their thoughts.”
And
“Thank you all for your feedback and participation. We appreciate you sharing your thoughts with us.”
Then they’ll close the thread unanswered. And that, my friends, will be that.
Because it’s happened before when people have created mega-threads of concern for this game.
Well, they might come up with a suitable non-answer like this that leaves them a lot of wiggle-room.
Having just tried a T1 bounty with my small guild. We had about 5 people for this. Don’t even bother unless there are people on the map willing to help you.
You can see in any guide that there are 15 targets to cover. Of course there’s a problem there if you did it with 5 people. Why not just rep a big guild and still hang with your buddies?
Why should we have to? This is the question everyone’s asking. Why did Anet make content exclusively for large guilds without a single thought for the small guilds made up of local friends and family? Is it so wrong for us to enjoy hanging out with people we know IRL and want content to do with them?
Because it’s larger scale content. I know it sounds strange, but many people like large scale content in MMO’s. Does everything in the game need to cater to incredibly small groups of people? What does the game currently offer for challenge to larger guilds? Absolutely nothing aside from guild missions. What’s achievable by a 5 person guild is meaningless to a larger guild. It would be too easy and rather boring.
If you’re so stubborn not to want to enjoy the content with a larger group of people, then go about getting your earrings with laurels and ectos. But don’t trivialize the content just because you don’t want to play with anyone outside your 5 person circle of trust.
~Tarnished Coast~
Stobie, I feel like your opinion is known at this point. You have like 1000 of the 1600 posts in this thread. We get it, you’re in a small guild that can’t do this content… we get it. The amount of time you’ve spent complaining in this thread could be better used forming an alliance with other small guilds on your server to do the content… or you could just rep a larger guild. All larger guilds aren’t filled with child-eating ogres like most people seem to think.
Child eating ogres would be preferable……
Dalishya Aibreann=80R/80T/80EL Eternal Night-Crystal Desert
“You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.”
“You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.”
All larger guilds aren’t filled with child-eating ogres like most people seem to think.
Child eating ogres would be preferable……[/quote]
Lol second that. It’s not fear that keeps me from large guilds. It’s lack of desire to put up with several hundred people who can hide behind a computer monitor and act like complete (fill in the blank). Believe it or not, I like my friends more than I do these people.
Having just tried a T1 bounty with my small guild. We had about 5 people for this. Don’t even bother unless there are people on the map willing to help you.
You can see in any guide that there are 15 targets to cover. Of course there’s a problem there if you did it with 5 people. Why not just rep a big guild and still hang with your buddies?
Why should we have to? This is the question everyone’s asking. Why did Anet make content exclusively for large guilds without a single thought for the small guilds made up of local friends and family? Is it so wrong for us to enjoy hanging out with people we know IRL and want content to do with them?
Because it’s larger scale content. I know it sounds strange, but many people like large scale content in MMO’s. Does everything in the game need to cater to incredibly small groups of people? What does the game currently offer for challenge to larger guilds? Absolutely nothing aside from guild missions. What’s achievable by a 5 person guild is meaningless to a larger guild. It would be too easy and rather boring.
If you’re so stubborn not to want to enjoy the content with a larger group of people, then go about getting your earrings with laurels and ectos. But don’t trivialize the content just because you don’t want to play with anyone outside your 5 person circle of trust.
I agree that larger scale content in the game is a good thing. However, I do not agree that people are being “stubborn” for not wanting to join a raid … uh, I mean big guild. Guilds are social groups, particularly small ones. In other games, people in small guilds Pug raids all the time. GW2’s guild scene is a bit more complex than that because of the influence thing.
I still say that the community needs to accept that these missions are meant for large groups, and that ANet needs to fess up that this content is just not aimed at small guilds. If they’d said that from the start … well, there would still have been upset, but dashed expectations were going to produce worse reactions than an up-front announcement that they were making large-scale content.
I was part of a 10-man guild, everyone an IRL friend.
After this content came, we had to make a decision to join a new, much bigger guild (as we were afraid of not unlocking everything fast enough/not being able to complete missions)
We are okay with being in the guild, however — we would much prefer being in old guild due mostly to guild chat and fooling around/having able to see everyone without scrolling down the guild window/etc.
Content itself is excellent. However, I just wish that there were ways for smaller guilds like us to experience it as well.
It’s your own preconceived notions about large groups and your inability or unwillingness to join that is the problem.
A little bit of research into joining a guild will go a long way. I did before launch and am currently in a wonderful and helpful guild full of great people. We finished bounty tier 3 earlier this evening and had a great time.
I’m sure if I had joined just any random guild spamming chat with recruitments, yes I suppose i’d be rolling the dice. A little effort and research goes a long ways. But in the end, it’s a YOU problem that is not enabling anyone from joining a good larger guild.
~Tarnished Coast~
All larger guilds aren’t filled with child-eating ogres like most people seem to think.
Child eating ogres would be preferable……
Lol second that. It’s not fear that keeps me from large guilds. It’s lack of desire to put up with several hundred people who can hide behind a computer monitor and act like complete (fill in the blank). Believe it or not, I like my friends more than I do these people.
[/quote]
Exactly. And why shouldn’t you? They are friends. Why wouldn’t you want to have fun playing with them?
I am sure there are nice people in large guilds. I have no desire to wade through the horrid ones and put up with abusive brats to find them though.
Many comments made here by people in large guilds, and those speaking on their behalf, have really confirmed my feelings…..Avoid at all costs.
Dalishya Aibreann=80R/80T/80EL Eternal Night-Crystal Desert
“You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.”
“You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.”
It’s your own preconceived notions about large groups and your inability or unwillingness to join that is the problem.
A little bit of research into joining a guild will go a long way. I did before launch and am currently in a wonderful and helpful guild full of great people. We finished bounty tier 3 earlier this evening and had a great time.I’m sure if I had joined just any random guild spamming chat with recruitments, yes I suppose i’d be rolling the dice. A little effort and research goes a long ways. But in the end, it’s a YOU problem that is not enabling anyone from joining a good larger guild.
What is this venom for small guilds?
I have had experience dealing with/being in large guilds to know they are not for me. I fail to understand how a small guild wanting to see game content takes anything away or hurts you (large guilds) in anyway.
There seems to be this odd, childish…glee in doing something someone else can’t. Like a small child enjoying taking away something from someone else.
Simply because someone else can get a “shiny” does not make yours any less special.
People in small guilds are NOT saying “We can’t do this so NO ONE should.” We are simply asking that these things be accessible to all play styles…as Anet advertised. We are not trying to take anything away from anyone. We want to work just as everyone else. We are just asking for the chance.
It takes a stunning lack of empathy to not understand that people get different things out of playing. Some people are more extravert (outwardly social) and others are more reserved. Some of us have dealt enough with large guilds to know it doesn’t work for our play style. It is remarkably self focused to assume everyone enjoys the same thing.
Dalishya Aibreann=80R/80T/80EL Eternal Night-Crystal Desert
“You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.”
“You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.”
(edited by Cora.9745)
It’s your own preconceived notions about large groups and your inability or unwillingness to join that is the problem.
A little bit of research into joining a guild will go a long way. I did before launch and am currently in a wonderful and helpful guild full of great people. We finished bounty tier 3 earlier this evening and had a great time.I’m sure if I had joined just any random guild spamming chat with recruitments, yes I suppose i’d be rolling the dice. A little effort and research goes a long ways. But in the end, it’s a YOU problem that is not enabling anyone from joining a good larger guild.
So in short, it’s his problem and he should join a large guild to have access to the games premier content to progress in gear stats to be able to compete or even meet the requirements to enjoy any group content.
Read this thread again.
Kash
NSP
NSP
It’s your own preconceived notions about large groups and your inability or unwillingness to join that is the problem.
A little bit of research into joining a guild will go a long way. I did before launch and am currently in a wonderful and helpful guild full of great people. We finished bounty tier 3 earlier this evening and had a great time.I’m sure if I had joined just any random guild spamming chat with recruitments, yes I suppose i’d be rolling the dice. A little effort and research goes a long ways. But in the end, it’s a YOU problem that is not enabling anyone from joining a good larger guild.
What is this venom you seem to have for small guilds?
I have had experience dealing with/being in large guilds to know they are not for me. I fail to understand how a small guild wanting to see game content takes anything away or hurts you (large guilds) in anyway.
There seems to be this odd, childish…glee in doing something someone else can’t. Like a small child enjoying taking away something from someone else.
Simply because someone else can get a “shiny” does not make yours any less special.
I didn’t see venom for small guilds in there, which means you’re probably projecting. I can see exasperation with the reactions, and notably a fatigue of getting the answer “but I don’t want to” back to his seemingly reasonable solutions.
And yes, I put it like that not because they’re unreasonable,. You shouldn’t have to abandon a smaller guild to do this, and you shouldn’t necessarily have to conform into a larger guild atmosphere. But we’ve got some events now where listening and comprehending what’s going on is key, and at least one entire area full of meta chains where it is vital to at least communicate what’s going on.
There does come a point where you have to dial back the pride of being a small unit and work with someone else. And there comes a time when a bigger guild has to either decide they want to remain “100% rep required” or if they want to put an effort in to help other people get to the content and enjoy it if they want. We’ve seen a couple times that smaller guilds will band together if they feel okay about it, and I’ve seen at least one ad for a large guild going “We’re mission-ready and we don’t require 100% rep. We don’t bite.”
Seeking assistants for the Asuran Catapult Project. Applicants will be tested for aerodynamics.
It’s your own preconceived notions about large groups and your inability or unwillingness to join that is the problem.
A little bit of research into joining a guild will go a long way. I did before launch and am currently in a wonderful and helpful guild full of great people. We finished bounty tier 3 earlier this evening and had a great time.
I’m sure if I had joined just any random guild spamming chat with recruitments, yes I suppose i’d be rolling the dice. A little effort and research goes a long ways. But in the end, it’s a YOU problem that is not enabling anyone from joining a good larger guild.
Sorry, no. Small guild players need to accept that the content is not for them OR that they have to make some different social arrangements. However, peoples’ social preferences should not be considered a problem because of a game. Had you offered your suggestion without the blame, I’d have just given you a +1 rather than replying. As it is, your target audience is going to react to the zing, not the message.
I didn’t see venom for small guilds in there, which means you’re probably projecting. I can see exasperation with the reactions, and notably a fatigue of getting the answer “but I don’t want to” back to his seemingly reasonable solutions.
And yes, I put it like that not because they’re unreasonable,. You shouldn’t have to abandon a smaller guild to do this, and you shouldn’t necessarily have to conform into a larger guild atmosphere. But we’ve got some events now where listening and comprehending what’s going on is key, and at least one entire area full of meta chains where it is vital to at least communicate what’s going on.
There does come a point where you have to dial back the pride of being a small unit and work with someone else. And there comes a time when a bigger guild has to either decide they want to remain “100% rep required” or if they want to put an effort in to help other people get to the content and enjoy it if they want. We’ve seen a couple times that smaller guilds will band together if they feel okay about it, and I’ve seen at least one ad for a large guild going “We’re mission-ready and we don’t require 100% rep. We don’t bite.”
At that point we’re putting aside reasons we chose this game over others. We’re scrapping the idea of guilds and creating factions or mini servers which everyone will have to join to have access to the content to obtain gear stats. Join large guilds to run scheduled raids.
Kash
NSP
NSP
It’s your own preconceived notions about large groups and your inability or unwillingness to join that is the problem.
A little bit of research into joining a guild will go a long way. I did before launch and am currently in a wonderful and helpful guild full of great people. We finished bounty tier 3 earlier this evening and had a great time.I’m sure if I had joined just any random guild spamming chat with recruitments, yes I suppose i’d be rolling the dice. A little effort and research goes a long ways. But in the end, it’s a YOU problem that is not enabling anyone from joining a good larger guild.
What is this venom for small guilds?
I have had experience dealing with/being in large guilds to know they are not for me. I fail to understand how a small guild wanting to see game content takes anything away or hurts you (large guilds) in anyway.
There seems to be this odd, childish…glee in doing something someone else can’t. Like a small child enjoying taking away something from someone else.
Simply because someone else can get a “shiny” does not make yours any less special.
People in small guilds are NOT saying “We can’t do this so NO ONE should.” We are simply asking that these things be accessible to all play styles…as Anet advertised. We are not trying to take anything away from anyone. We want to work just as everyone else. We are just asking for the chance.
It takes a stunning lack of empathy to not understand that people get different things out of playing. Some people are more extravert (outwardly social) and others are more reserved. Some of us have dealt enough with large guilds to know it doesn’t work for our play style. It is remarkably self focused to assume everyone enjoys the same thing.
It’s meant to be larger scale content meant for more people.
It’s not big guild versus small guild. It’s just easier for larger guilds to co-ordinate people.
There’s nothing stopping any small guild from recruiting other small guilds to help them with the content in exchange for the help in return when they can unlock the content.
Will it be harder to co-ordinate? Probably. But not impossible. You’re basically asking for handouts at the moment because your guild is too small. Why should 100/200/300 person guilds suffer through painfully easy content simply to make 5 person guilds feel relevant. If it remains your choice to remain in extremely small groups for larger group content, I feel like you should have to give a little.
You can even get the rewards for the content without doing the content through laurels and ectos, it’ll just take a little longer.
The complaints are rather ridiculous to be honest and it reeks of entitlement.
It’s an MMO.
~Tarnished Coast~
There does come a point where you have to dial back the pride of being a small unit and work with someone else. And there comes a time when a bigger guild has to either decide they want to remain “100% rep required” or if they want to put an effort in to help other people get to the content and enjoy it if they want. We’ve seen a couple times that smaller guilds will band together if they feel okay about it, and I’ve seen at least one ad for a large guild going “We’re mission-ready and we don’t require 100% rep. We don’t bite.”
Maybe it’s not about pride. Maybe it’s about preference. As a member of either a large or small guild, I would not be comfortable with not representing. If I’m going to be a part of a group, I’m going to participate with that group as much as my game-play preferences allow. I won’t say that all who are reluctant to be in two guilds feel the same way, but it might be that, or something like that, for some of them.
Having just tried a T1 bounty with my small guild. We had about 5 people for this. Don’t even bother unless there are people on the map willing to help you.
You can see in any guide that there are 15 targets to cover. Of course there’s a problem there if you did it with 5 people. Why not just rep a big guild and still hang with your buddies?
Why should we have to? This is the question everyone’s asking. Why did Anet make content exclusively for large guilds without a single thought for the small guilds made up of local friends and family? Is it so wrong for us to enjoy hanging out with people we know IRL and want content to do with them?
Because it’s larger scale content. I know it sounds strange, but many people like large scale content in MMO’s. Does everything in the game need to cater to incredibly small groups of people? What does the game currently offer for challenge to larger guilds? Absolutely nothing aside from guild missions. What’s achievable by a 5 person guild is meaningless to a larger guild. It would be too easy and rather boring.
If you’re so stubborn not to want to enjoy the content with a larger group of people, then go about getting your earrings with laurels and ectos. But don’t trivialize the content just because you don’t want to play with anyone outside your 5 person circle of trust.
It’s fine if they want to create content for huge groups of people. The problem is they advertised it for the generic term: guilds. Guilds come in all shapes and sizes. Since they did not specify large guilds it was assumed that the content was for all guilds, which is clearly not the case at this moment in time. Had they created and stated that the content was specifically for large guilds, it would have been assumed that content was coming for smaller guilds as well. Despite the fact that this content seems to have been solely created with large guilds in mind, there does not seem to be any plans for small-guild-oriented content.
The out-cry here is for Anet to be honest with us. If they only mean to create content for large guilds, they need to tell us so that the rest of us can stop wasting time in a game that is not meant for us. If they mean to create content or fix the current content for small guilds they should say that so that we can stop flooding the forums with questions and wait patiently.
In addition, I have no desire to trivialize content. Nor do I wish to take away the content from large guilds. I don’t think it would be hard to make it available to smaller guilds as well. If they scaled down the influence cost based on membership or scaled up the influence gain based on membership it would solve the initial problem of accessing it. Then, if they used their dynamic event scaling methods on the content (again, based on membership) it would also allow us to complete it. The two goals don’t have to be mutually exclusive.
Lastly, there is no reason for you to be sarcastic and snippy. You are entitled to play the way you want to and your opinion and everyone else is entitled to the same. I merely questioned his assumption that large guilds were the only way to participate when Anet has not stated that. They advertised from the beginning that they wanted us to be able to ‘play the way we want.’ If that is true, then there should be no issue with us wanting to play content with a small guild.
~Kasaeva
Sea of Sorrows
Sea of Sorrows
Having just tried a T1 bounty with my small guild. We had about 5 people for this. Don’t even bother unless there are people on the map willing to help you.
You can see in any guide that there are 15 targets to cover. Of course there’s a problem there if you did it with 5 people. Why not just rep a big guild and still hang with your buddies?
Why should we have to? This is the question everyone’s asking. Why did Anet make content exclusively for large guilds without a single thought for the small guilds made up of local friends and family? Is it so wrong for us to enjoy hanging out with people we know IRL and want content to do with them?
Because it’s larger scale content. I know it sounds strange, but many people like large scale content in MMO’s. Does everything in the game need to cater to incredibly small groups of people? What does the game currently offer for challenge to larger guilds? Absolutely nothing aside from guild missions. What’s achievable by a 5 person guild is meaningless to a larger guild. It would be too easy and rather boring.
If you’re so stubborn not to want to enjoy the content with a larger group of people, then go about getting your earrings with laurels and ectos. But don’t trivialize the content just because you don’t want to play with anyone outside your 5 person circle of trust.It’s fine if they want to create content for huge groups of people. The problem is they advertised it for the generic term: guilds. Guilds come in all shapes and sizes. Since they did not specify large guilds it was assumed that the content was for all guilds, which is clearly not the case at this moment in time. Had they created and stated that the content was specifically for large guilds, it would have been assumed that content was coming for smaller guilds as well. Despite the fact that this content seems to have been solely created with large guilds in mind, there does not seem to be any plans for small-guild-oriented content.
The out-cry here is for Anet to be honest with us. If they only mean to create content for large guilds, they need to tell us so that the rest of us can stop wasting time in a game that is not meant for us. If they mean to create content or fix the current content for small guilds they should say that so that we can stop flooding the forums with questions and wait patiently.In addition, I have no desire to trivialize content. Nor do I wish to take away the content from large guilds. I don’t think it would be hard to make it available to smaller guilds as well. If they scaled down the influence cost based on membership or scaled up the influence gain based on membership it would solve the initial problem of accessing it. Then, if they used their dynamic event scaling methods on the content (again, based on membership) it would also allow us to complete it. The two goals don’t have to be mutually exclusive.
Lastly, there is no reason for you to be sarcastic and snippy. You are entitled to play the way you want to and your opinion and everyone else is entitled to the same. I merely questioned his assumption that large guilds were the only way to participate when Anet has not stated that. They advertised from the beginning that they wanted us to be able to ‘play the way we want.’ If that is true, then there should be no issue with us wanting to play content with a small guild.
Well said.
I am getting the feeling that there are a lot of us who are feeling the same way. We are just trying to make others understand and it’s falling on deaf ears. Or worse, the people twisting our words to make them mean what they want.
It is really, really depressing but, I have never seen more people agree on a gaming topic than I have on this one. That I have seen so many people say the exact same thing I have been feeling-here and on other sites. That does give me some hope. Not that Anet will change anything really, but more that those that think they are the majority….really are not.
Dalishya Aibreann=80R/80T/80EL Eternal Night-Crystal Desert
“You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.”
“You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.”
At that point we’re putting aside reasons we chose this game over others. We’re scrapping the idea of guilds and creating factions or mini servers which everyone will have to join to have access to the content to obtain gear stats. Join large guilds to run scheduled raids.
Has someone said that? I mean, that’d be true in the old days when you wouldn’t have more than 1000 people on a server. I know I didn’t say you would be forced at gunpoint into this, and I feel the need to reiterate once more that the trinkets aren’t worth the headache of doing it that way. Skip them. You can skip them. It won’t make that much difference if you don’t have the earrings on.
I don’t think they even work for Agony Resistance so really they’re just for the prestige and the small edge in stats. Which doesn’t matter except in a single situation. You want the prestige of having them? Go do the content for them. You wanted Obsidian Armor? Go spend the money or swallow doing endless runs of UW/FoW for the materials.
Maybe it’s not about pride. Maybe it’s about preference. As a member of either a large or small guild, I would not be comfortable with not representing. If I’m going to be a part of a group, I’m going to participate with that group as much as my game-play preferences allow. I won’t say that all who are reluctant to be in two guilds feel the same way, but it might be that, or something like that, for some of them.
It definitely may be about preference instead of pride. But pride is what I hear a lot of. Pride to be part of a small guild and not the “server-killing monoliths”. Pride to “not be one face in 500”. Pride to be “a member, not a number”. They’re the people who should really look and see how badly they want to do this.
There are three options right now. Get over the limitation and know you’re not going to get access to everything. Get around the limitation by getting help and giving help when it’s needed. Or join a large guild you find not objectionable to do the content.
Technically, there is a fourth and fifth: come here and ask either politely or not for ArenaNet to pretty please revisit the system so more people have the hope of doing it. Or quit the game.
I’m a big fan of #2 then #1. And I’ll resort to #3 before #5.
Seeking assistants for the Asuran Catapult Project. Applicants will be tested for aerodynamics.
Having just tried a T1 bounty with my small guild. We had about 5 people for this. Don’t even bother unless there are people on the map willing to help you.
You can see in any guide that there are 15 targets to cover. Of course there’s a problem there if you did it with 5 people. Why not just rep a big guild and still hang with your buddies?
Why should we have to? This is the question everyone’s asking. Why did Anet make content exclusively for large guilds without a single thought for the small guilds made up of local friends and family? Is it so wrong for us to enjoy hanging out with people we know IRL and want content to do with them?
Because it’s larger scale content. I know it sounds strange, but many people like large scale content in MMO’s. Does everything in the game need to cater to incredibly small groups of people? What does the game currently offer for challenge to larger guilds? Absolutely nothing aside from guild missions. What’s achievable by a 5 person guild is meaningless to a larger guild. It would be too easy and rather boring.
If you’re so stubborn not to want to enjoy the content with a larger group of people, then go about getting your earrings with laurels and ectos. But don’t trivialize the content just because you don’t want to play with anyone outside your 5 person circle of trust.It’s fine if they want to create content for huge groups of people. The problem is they advertised it for the generic term: guilds. Guilds come in all shapes and sizes. Since they did not specify large guilds it was assumed that the content was for all guilds, which is clearly not the case at this moment in time. Had they created and stated that the content was specifically for large guilds, it would have been assumed that content was coming for smaller guilds as well. Despite the fact that this content seems to have been solely created with large guilds in mind, there does not seem to be any plans for small-guild-oriented content.
The out-cry here is for Anet to be honest with us. If they only mean to create content for large guilds, they need to tell us so that the rest of us can stop wasting time in a game that is not meant for us. If they mean to create content or fix the current content for small guilds they should say that so that we can stop flooding the forums with questions and wait patiently.In addition, I have no desire to trivialize content. Nor do I wish to take away the content from large guilds. I don’t think it would be hard to make it available to smaller guilds as well. If they scaled down the influence cost based on membership or scaled up the influence gain based on membership it would solve the initial problem of accessing it. Then, if they used their dynamic event scaling methods on the content (again, based on membership) it would also allow us to complete it. The two goals don’t have to be mutually exclusive.
Lastly, there is no reason for you to be sarcastic and snippy. You are entitled to play the way you want to and your opinion and everyone else is entitled to the same. I merely questioned his assumption that large guilds were the only way to participate when Anet has not stated that. They advertised from the beginning that they wanted us to be able to ‘play the way we want.’ If that is true, then there should be no issue with us wanting to play content with a small guild.
If everything is scaled to accommodate the size of your guild, and content is done as easily in groups of 2 or 3 as it is with 30 or 40… then what is the point of guilds in the first place? I’m sorry this content doesn’t conform to the way you want it to work without the smallest bit of effort.
~Tarnished Coast~
So -if Guild Missions were expanded to allow something for small guilds to do – how exactly is that ‘trivializing’ the large-scale bounties?
It’s your own preconceived notions about large groups and your inability or unwillingness to join that is the problem.
A little bit of research into joining a guild will go a long way. I did before launch and am currently in a wonderful and helpful guild full of great people. We finished bounty tier 3 earlier this evening and had a great time.I’m sure if I had joined just any random guild spamming chat with recruitments, yes I suppose i’d be rolling the dice. A little effort and research goes a long ways. But in the end, it’s a YOU problem that is not enabling anyone from joining a good larger guild.
Research only goes so far.
There is no simple place, or people to ask, to get honest answers about how much drama is in a guild or how much favoritism and eliteism there is. Nor how much abuse you might face in there, or if the chat is rampant with subject matter you’d really rather not see.
In my time in various games I’ve been through…prolly twenty someodd large player run organizations and none have been a good experience. I was happy to be able to avoid that here…least till now. Especially when some will try branding you a guild jumper for leaving their poor guild atmosphere to move to another.
So -if Guild Missions were expanded to allow something for small guilds to do – how exactly is that ‘trivializing’ the large-scale bounties?
What if they offered a single guild bounty hunt worth 5 guild merits that is achievable by a small group and only offers 1 personal commendation?
You’re still looking at12 weeks for enough commendations for an earring and many more weeks to use the guild merits on upgrades. That wouldn’t trivialize larger group effort and is a compromise for smaller groups. It’s just a suggestion on my part.
There really does need to be incentives for group content in MMO’s, it’s always been that way. These games are always more fun when you get out and meet some new people in the gameworld. Honestly, we all share a common passion for the genre so we at least have that much in common. It’s not like everyone you run into is the anti-you out to ruin your experience.
~Tarnished Coast~
So -if Guild Missions were expanded to allow something for small guilds to do – how exactly is that ‘trivializing’ the large-scale bounties?
What if they offered a single guild bounty hunt worth 5 guild merits that is achievable by a small group and only offers 1 personal commendation?
You’re still looking at12 weeks for enough commendations for an earring and many more weeks to use the guild merits on upgrades. That wouldn’t trivialize larger group effort and is a compromise for smaller groups. It’s just a suggestion on my part.
There really does need to be incentives for group content in MMO’s, it’s always been that way. These games are always more fun when you get out and meet some new people in the gameworld. Honestly, we all share a common passion for the genre so we at least have that much in common. It’s not like everyone you run into is the anti-you out to ruin your experience.
The question still has not been answered. What does it take away from or “hurt” a large guild if small guilds can do SOMETHING too?
Dalishya Aibreann=80R/80T/80EL Eternal Night-Crystal Desert
“You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.”
“You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.”
(edited by Cora.9745)
Maybe it’s not about pride. Maybe it’s about preference. As a member of either a large or small guild, I would not be comfortable with not representing. If I’m going to be a part of a group, I’m going to participate with that group as much as my game-play preferences allow. I won’t say that all who are reluctant to be in two guilds feel the same way, but it might be that, or something like that, for some of them.
It definitely may be about preference instead of pride. But pride is what I hear a lot of. Pride to be part of a small guild and not the “server-killing monoliths”. Pride to “not be one face in 500”. Pride to be “a member, not a number”. They’re the people who should really look and see how badly they want to do this.
There are three options right now. Get over the limitation and know you’re not going to get access to everything. Get around the limitation by getting help and giving help when it’s needed. Or join a large guild you find not objectionable to do the content.
Technically, there is a fourth and fifth: come here and ask either politely or not for ArenaNet to pretty please revisit the system so more people have the hope of doing it. Or quit the game.
I’m a big fan of #2 then #1. And I’ll resort to #3 before #5.
I’m also not going to sell pride short. It’s worked as a motivation for a lot of people in a lot of small and large organizations. That said, I also think people need to accept the reality of this content rather than hanging on to the expectations generated by the way the content was communicated pre-launch. Oh, and there’s a sixth option, which is to decide you don’t give a kitten about the new missions and go about your in-game business — which is distinguished from your #1 by not making a big deal about it in the first place.
So -if Guild Missions were expanded to allow something for small guilds to do – how exactly is that ‘trivializing’ the large-scale bounties?
What if they offered a single guild bounty hunt worth 5 guild merits that is achievable by a small group and only offers 1 personal commendation?
You’re still looking at12 weeks for enough commendations for an earring and many more weeks to use the guild merits on upgrades. That wouldn’t trivialize larger group effort and is a compromise for smaller groups. It’s just a suggestion on my part.
There really does need to be incentives for group content in MMO’s, it’s always been that way. These games are always more fun when you get out and meet some new people in the gameworld. Honestly, we all share a common passion for the genre so we at least have that much in common. It’s not like everyone you run into is the anti-you out to ruin your experience.The question still has not been answered. What does it take away from or “hurt” a large guild if small guilds can do SOMETHING too?
It takes away the MMO. It takes away the accomplishment of many people working together to accomplish a goal or task. If that isn’t something that appeals to you I’m not sure why you play the genre. One thing (guild missions) out of everything you can do in this game doesn’t conform to your small guild and you act as if your sky is falling.
~Tarnished Coast~
As already mentioned, even though we look forward to participating in this new content we are fearful of our player base. Being a small to medium sized guild we already had to sink 40 gold into influence in order to get started researching the Guild Bounty track.
Seeing as we need to upgrade our tree levels at least twice for each of the other branches, we’re looking at either sinking in much more money than we have or waiting a very long time for the rest of the content.
We fear that during this waiting period many of our current players will leave us in search of larger guilds who can easily afford the required influence points.
Smaller guilds will without a doubt have an even harder time coming up with the influence needed leading to a lot of them bleeding out.
It is our opinion that, as a direct result of this implementation, many guilds will be destroyed.
Having said that, I refuse to believe this has been done intentionally and as such look forward to a near future solution.
Gabriel Ironfist
Seafarer’s Rest
Seafarer’s Rest
So -if Guild Missions were expanded to allow something for small guilds to do – how exactly is that ‘trivializing’ the large-scale bounties?
What if they offered a single guild bounty hunt worth 5 guild merits that is achievable by a small group and only offers 1 personal commendation?
You’re still looking at12 weeks for enough commendations for an earring and many more weeks to use the guild merits on upgrades. That wouldn’t trivialize larger group effort and is a compromise for smaller groups. It’s just a suggestion on my part.
There really does need to be incentives for group content in MMO’s, it’s always been that way. These games are always more fun when you get out and meet some new people in the gameworld. Honestly, we all share a common passion for the genre so we at least have that much in common. It’s not like everyone you run into is the anti-you out to ruin your experience.The question still has not been answered. What does it take away from or “hurt” a large guild if small guilds can do SOMETHING too?
It takes away the MMO. It takes away the accomplishment of many people working together to accomplish a goal or task. If that isn’t something that appeals to you I’m not sure why you play the genre. One thing (guild missions) out of everything you can do in this game doesn’t conform to your small guild and you act as if your sky is falling.
That still does not answer the question. HOW does it take anything away? The large guild still exists. The large content can still exist. The only thing that is added, is a smaller group can do it too. So, still an mmo.
Again, how does that take anything away?
Dalishya Aibreann=80R/80T/80EL Eternal Night-Crystal Desert
“You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.”
“You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means.”
(edited by Cora.9745)