Guild Wars 2

Zenith.7301:

IndigoSundown.5419:

Leo G.4501:

naiasonod.9265:

Leo G.4501:

What if the boss’ telegraph attack was still pretty strong, but during the channel of a certain one, it blocks critical hits, has heightened armor and if interrupted, he kind of “explodes” doing AoE CC and ripping all your boons away? If he uses the attack and lands it, he follows up with quick flurries of weaker hits but while doing so is much more vulnerable to damage for a time?

Yeah, that sounds overcomplicated and would lend to being broketastic from the moment it were implemented on into the rest of the game’s lifestpan.

I shudder to imagine them trying to make something that complex playable for the average GW2 player.

Hah, I love this attitude.

Pretty much amounts to “ACCEPT THE GAME THE WAY IT IS! FLAWS, REPEAT TACTICS AND ALL!” I mean, geeze, you’re basically not even trying

And you’re trying to add complicated mechanics that target a specific stat choice. Why “blocks critical hits?” Why not “blocks all hits?” I’m fine with more interesting fights, but not with targeting play styles because some people don’t understand the concept of opportunity cost.

There’s no opportunity cost to a zerker playstyle when you can use a guardian and the evade mechanic to mitigate most of its weaknesses. Please stop trying so hard to paint zerker playstyle as this incredibly risky affair.

I’ll take a full zerker group to my fractal 50’s any day over some PVT or condi spec garbage. I’ll take heavies over some necro or ranger as well. Nothing poses a risk if you can kill it before it becomes a threat and a guardian is feeding your group aegis+ reflect making you virtually immune to dying for enough time to wipe out the threat.

A “block all attacks” mechanic would even hurt condi specs far more than power specs because most condi specs mainatain condi stacks through cd skills while power specs get the majority of their damage from autoattacks. A single blocked autoattack is not the same as getting a 8 sec cd condi skill blocked.

AI SHOULD target playstyles. There should be mobs resistant to direct damage and mobs that spam conditions so that groups have a variety of specs in them instead of the usual full zerker.

If the game doesn’t encourage variety in group composition, then every single comp will just try to maximize damage.

Exactly, the risk goes to almost 0 due to blocks, reflecs, icebow #5 and the fact most stuff just dies before you take any dmg. For some classes your “skillful rotation” is mostly autoatk. Also full of passive playstile like: drop a banner, have signets that you never activate, summon AI (frost spirit), etc…

Anet is creating more mobs/bosses variety in the new maps. But the old dungeons from 2.5 years ago seems to be long forgotten in time promoting bad build variety and stacking around only 2 stat combination.

IndigoSundown.5419:

Leo G.4501:

naiasonod.9265:

Leo G.4501:

What if the boss’ telegraph attack was still pretty strong, but during the channel of a certain one, it blocks critical hits, has heightened armor and if interrupted, he kind of “explodes” doing AoE CC and ripping all your boons away? If he uses the attack and lands it, he follows up with quick flurries of weaker hits but while doing so is much more vulnerable to damage for a time?

Yeah, that sounds overcomplicated and would lend to being broketastic from the moment it were implemented on into the rest of the game’s lifestpan.

I shudder to imagine them trying to make something that complex playable for the average GW2 player.

Hah, I love this attitude.

Pretty much amounts to “ACCEPT THE GAME THE WAY IT IS! FLAWS, REPEAT TACTICS AND ALL!” I mean, geeze, you’re basically not even trying

And you’re trying to add complicated mechanics that target a specific stat choice. Why “blocks critical hits?” Why not “blocks all hits?” I’m fine with more interesting fights, but not with targeting play styles because some people don’t understand the concept of opportunity cost.

Because if it just blocked all hits, you just run away with no choice in the matter. Besides, if he blocked everything, he couldn’t punish you for foolish use of CC which would stop the strong hit but CC you in return (along with ripping your boons).

I’m not targeting a particular playstyle (he’d block critical hits for parts of the battle. that’s certainly no worse than mobs that cleanse occasionally or are extremely resistant to conditions). No, it’s also meant to target carelessness. It’s also meant insert some unorthodox options like, somebody stand and take the hit so the others can blow him up while he’s vulnerable during the flurry of attacks after. Shouldn’t be too tough. If he’s capable of downing a zerk-geared character there are players to rez or utilities readied to do the same, or just someone with toughness or vitality to absorb the hit and bunker down during the flurry.

Of course, the other options would be block/dodge/invuln the hit. No damage occurs, mob stays in a defensive state for a while longer (higher armor, blocks crits). Then he continues on with regular actions for a while.

I mean, you’re trying to say this is complicated. There are some fights recently introduced that are downright puzzles to figure out what’s going on. I would assume, when a target starts reeling back behind his shield for 4-5sec and all your attacks are doing little damage, that’s self explanatory. Someone’s bound to get hit by this attack and trigger these new flurry of actions and I’d asume someone would notice their attacks are doing way more damage than normal during that period.

But then this is just me brainstorming ideas. The most criticized so far is “it’s complicated!” without explaining what is complicated and why. And feel free to imagine your own ideas. I’m sure they’d be brilliant, not complicated and very varied.

Mapisto.2154:

things.

Coming from a bunker warrior that went full zerk, I can attest to the fact that trading all defense for damage is the farthest you can get from lazy. being unable to soak damage/ take more than a few hits forces you to pay more attention to actually staying alive; there’s much more to it than doing big damage.

I agree condis should have a pve buff to make those more viable, but I believe your viewpoint for zerk is a bit off.

Leo G.4501:

naiasonod.9265:

Leo G.4501:

xDudisx.5914:

Harper.4173:

xDudisx.5914:

hybrid.5027:

xDudisx.5914:

Looks like you are trying to underrate the gear just to say that zerker is not a problem. Try running meta traits with nomads and see how much dps you will lose.

The DPS you’d lose is largely irrelevant when you consider that you’d be essentially unkillable.

Yeah, clearlly irrelevant. That is why we see everyone running nomads, clerics, dire, etc and no one running zerker/assassin.

Have you considered that people don’t run those because they don’t need to be unkillable?

Have ever thought that the reason they would be unkillable is because dungeon’s bosses are doing too little dmg and when they do it is concentrated in slow telegraphed skills? If bosses had more armor, less hp, more dmg, and hit more often the game would be much more balance for all the other stat combination available. The reason defensive stats are useless now is because there is little to no unavoidable dmg in pve.

What if the boss’ telegraph attack was still pretty strong, but during the channel of a certain one, it blocks critical hits, has heightened armor and if interrupted, he kind of “explodes” doing AoE CC and ripping all your boons away? If he uses the attack and lands it, he follows up with quick flurries of weaker hits but while doing so is much more vulnerable to damage for a time?

Yeah, that sounds overcomplicated and would lend to being broketastic from the moment it were implemented on into the rest of the game’s lifestpan.

I shudder to imagine them trying to make something that complex playable for the average GW2 player.

Hah, I love this attitude.

Pretty much amounts to “ACCEPT THE GAME THE WAY IT IS! FLAWS, REPEAT TACTICS AND ALL!” I mean, geeze, you’re basically not even trying

Accept it or don’t, I really don’t care what you do. I’ll be over here being reasonably happy with most of what there is, yes, even with its flaws.

But I’ll go on with that, and you go on being however you prefer. In the end, Anet’s gonna do what Anet wants no matter what you, I or Smokey the Bear say about anything.

Azure The Heartless.3261:

Mapisto.2154:

things.

Coming from a bunker warrior that went full zerk, I can attest to the fact that trading all defense for damage is the farthest you can get from lazy. being unable to soak damage/ take more than a few hits forces you to pay more attention to actually staying alive; there’s much more to it than doing big damage.

I agree condis should have a pve buff to make those more viable, but I believe your viewpoint for zerk is a bit off.

People get that viewpoint from open world and a dungeon tour that consists of ACp1/p2. Those places yeah you can kill things before they get to hit you more than once and the one hit doesn’t kill you. It’s only when you get into more challenging content do you get that “ohh crap, i’m gonna die”.

I mean hell my Thief is squishy enough that a single kick from lupi downs it, the difference between that and survival can simply be the time of week with the WvW bonuses, by like wednesday I can take a kick

Jerus.4350:

Azure The Heartless.3261:

Mapisto.2154:

things.

Coming from a bunker warrior that went full zerk, I can attest to the fact that trading all defense for damage is the farthest you can get from lazy. being unable to soak damage/ take more than a few hits forces you to pay more attention to actually staying alive; there’s much more to it than doing big damage.

I agree condis should have a pve buff to make those more viable, but I believe your viewpoint for zerk is a bit off.

People get that viewpoint from open world and a dungeon tour that consists of ACp1/p2. Those places yeah you can kill things before they get to hit you more than once and the one hit doesn’t kill you. It’s only when you get into more challenging content do you get that “ohh crap, i’m gonna die”.

I mean hell my Thief is squishy enough that a single kick from lupi downs it, the difference between that and survival can simply be the time of week with the WvW bonuses, by like wednesday I can take a kick

Or, you can dodge the kick, which has a huge tell. Or a guardian can simply pop his aegis anytime it comes up so you don’t even need to worry about it.

Honestly, I feel non-Berserker builds are exactly as rewarding as you expect them to be. That is, if I bring my heal-bombs engineer somewhere the raw tankiness of me and people around me is astonishing. Far in excess of what the best zerker-setup could ever possibly hope for.

Now the problem:
Nothing in dungeons (open-world PvE is actually very much different in more recent releases) remotely promotes using non-zerker setups because damage is supposed to be avoided, not survived, and enemies are supposed to be killed fast enough.

That is the root issue.
Newer LS releases kinda do this better. The mobs are varied and have rather specific special effects which reward highly focused ability / gear / trait setups.

xDudisx.5914:

Harper.4173:

xDudisx.5914:

hybrid.5027:

xDudisx.5914:

Looks like you are trying to underrate the gear just to say that zerker is not a problem. Try running meta traits with nomads and see how much dps you will lose.

The DPS you’d lose is largely irrelevant when you consider that you’d be essentially unkillable.

Yeah, clearlly irrelevant. That is why we see everyone running nomads, clerics, dire, etc and no one running zerker/assassin.

Have you considered that people don’t run those because they don’t need to be unkillable?

Have ever thought that the reason they would be unkillable is because dungeon’s bosses are doing too little dmg and when they do it is concentrated in slow telegraphed skills? If bosses had more armor, less hp, more dmg, and hit more often the game would be much more balance for all the other stat combination available. The reason defensive stats are useless now is because there is little to no unavoidable dmg in pve.

Have you considered that bosses behave this way in the game because the entire game ( bosses included) is created to cater to a casual audience who would perform very badly if bosses had “more armor, less hp, more dmg and hit more often”. They would probably get destroyed more easily and – being unable to complete content – would become frustrated and lose interest in the game.

That would in turn cause less money spent on the gem store and lower revenues.

There’s a reason the game is like this with super big 1-hit attacks from bosses that become easy to dodge once you learn how to.

What you describe as “better balance” is just increasing difficulty – which is something they don’t want to do.

They made a base difficulty level ( that’s pretty easy to begin with) and you can take that level and make it easier and slower or faster and harder depending on what gear you choose to wear and can perform well in.

Leo G.4501:

maha.7902:

so you block the big choreographed one, and then just double dodge (or if extra dodge needed, energy sigil so you can triple dodge) through the flurry of damage?

A block wouldn’t be considered ‘connecting’ though. So he wouldn’t go into the flurry of attacks therefore he would remain ‘armored’ for a time. Invulnerable also sort of just cancels attacks rather than connecting (from experience).

You eat the attack using Endure Pain and then frenzy dps through the vulnerable flurry part.

Zenith.7301:

IndigoSundown.5419:

Leo G.4501:

naiasonod.9265:

Leo G.4501:

What if the boss’ telegraph attack was still pretty strong, but during the channel of a certain one, it blocks critical hits, has heightened armor and if interrupted, he kind of “explodes” doing AoE CC and ripping all your boons away? If he uses the attack and lands it, he follows up with quick flurries of weaker hits but while doing so is much more vulnerable to damage for a time?

Yeah, that sounds overcomplicated and would lend to being broketastic from the moment it were implemented on into the rest of the game’s lifestpan.

I shudder to imagine them trying to make something that complex playable for the average GW2 player.

Hah, I love this attitude.

Pretty much amounts to “ACCEPT THE GAME THE WAY IT IS! FLAWS, REPEAT TACTICS AND ALL!” I mean, geeze, you’re basically not even trying

And you’re trying to add complicated mechanics that target a specific stat choice. Why “blocks critical hits?” Why not “blocks all hits?” I’m fine with more interesting fights, but not with targeting play styles because some people don’t understand the concept of opportunity cost.

There’s no opportunity cost to a zerker playstyle when you can use a guardian and the evade mechanic to mitigate most of its weaknesses. Please stop trying so hard to paint zerker playstyle as this incredibly risky affair.

I’ll take a full zerker group to my fractal 50’s any day over some PVT or condi spec garbage. I’ll take heavies over some necro or ranger as well. Nothing poses a risk if you can kill it before it becomes a threat and a guardian is feeding your group aegis+ reflect making you virtually immune to dying for enough time to wipe out the threat.

A “block all attacks” mechanic would even hurt condi specs far more than power specs because most condi specs mainatain condi stacks through cd skills while power specs get the majority of their damage from autoattacks. A single blocked autoattack is not the same as getting a 8 sec cd condi skill blocked.

AI SHOULD target playstyles. There should be mobs resistant to direct damage and mobs that spam conditions so that groups have a variety of specs in them instead of the usual full zerker.

If the game doesn’t encourage variety in group composition, then every single comp will just try to maximize damage.

The only reason you think zerker isn’t a risky affair is because you’ve probably been running with good zerker players.

Because if you go to FOTM 50 – like you said in your example – and take only zerker people there’s a very high chance those zerker people doing FOTM 50 are people that have dedicated a lot of their time to the game ever since release and are very very skilled.

There are loads of bad zerkers out there – but not seeing them is the problem here.

a guardian is feeding your group aegis+ reflect making you virtually immune to dying for enough time to wipe out the threat.

And for every guardian doing this in zerker gear there are at least 3-4 who have no idea what they are doing.

AI SHOULD target playstyles. There should be mobs resistant to direct damage and mobs that spam conditions so that groups have a variety of specs in them instead of the usual full zerker.
If the game doesn’t encourage variety in group composition, then every single comp will just try to maximize damage.

1) If you see my post above you’ll understand why combat wasn’t designed to counter specific play styles – it would make things too complicated and too hard for the average player.
The vast majority of people in this game want to go in – do content – and clear it without being challenged. Nobody wants to wipe over and over again – frustrate the player and ultimately they’ll be less likely to spend cash.
Nobody wants to be stomped in PVE in a similar fashion to sPVP.

2)Variety – in a forced way is basically the trinity all over again.

“LFG 1 condi cleanser”
“LFG 1 condi dps”
“GLF 2 heal spam”

More “variety” means more needing x class for y role which ultimately will create more toxicity since you can no longer play your class the way you want since you have to play that one role that is now required because the content has been changed in such a way that no longer can anyone doing anything complete.
Now you have to be doing y role with x class to complete.

Harper.4173:

More “variety” means more needing x class for y role which ultimately will create more toxicity since you can no longer play your class the way you want since you have to play that one role that is now required because the content has been changed in such a way that no longer can anyone doing anything complete.
Now you have to be doing y role with x class to complete.

This is exactly why i like the way gw2 is structured. You really can do almost anything with any class, its just it takes a little bit longer with some and shorter with others. I find zerker to give more variety to many builds compared to other ones. Since you are only focussing on maximum dps through raw attacks, you never really tie your character down do doing only one thing. I switch my build in zerker gear so often and swap weapons (from inventory not like just swapping to the second set) on elementalist and guardian so often that it really makes my characters versatile in every situation. In AC all my characters go full dps with support only from utilities, fractals i put as much support into the build whiles sacrificing some dps. Its these kinds of changes that separate knowledgable players from just 1 spamming zerkers and its also what makes berserker my favorite build. Other builds can be versatile as well, but theres nothing wrong with zerker and it isnt as hindering to change and creativity as people on this thread make it seem

Carighan.6758:

Honestly, I feel non-Berserker builds are exactly as rewarding as you expect them to be. That is, if I bring my heal-bombs engineer somewhere the raw tankiness of me and people around me is astonishing. Far in excess of what the best zerker-setup could ever possibly hope for.

Now the problem:
Nothing in dungeons (open-world PvE is actually very much different in more recent releases) remotely promotes using non-zerker setups because damage is supposed to be avoided, not survived, and enemies are supposed to be killed fast enough.

That is the root issue.
Newer LS releases kinda do this better. The mobs are varied and have rather specific special effects which reward highly focused ability / gear / trait setups.

The key word here is the “newer” LS releases.

LS releases are newer. Dungeons are not. Every single time ANet release new content, people hail the “end of the berserker meta” when the fact of the matter is just that most people simply aren’t good at the game and while they can faceroll ancient dungeon content, when presented with a new challenge they just get blasted to pieces and then stick on their defensive armour since they don’t want to or haven’t bothered to learn the choreographs.

For example, people always complain about terragriffs (or w/e it’s spelled) being too hard and then some guy makes a video where he just brain afk kills one on his thief with literally zero effort involved in a full glass setup.

So here’s how human nature works in video games.

> Player meets content
> Player gets face kicked in
> Player builds defensively and gradually gets through content
> If player faces this content again they now know what to do
> Builds more offensively since they know which hits to mitigate and how to do so
> Goes as glassy as possible
> ???
> profit

this applies to GW2, this applies to literally every single game ever. I played DA:Origins on normal years ago and it was a hell of an experience (mind you it was one of my first RPGs and I was just garbage anyway), but fast forward in to the future and I now know if I wanted to I could go full glass triple mage party and just explode mobs and bosses with triple fireballs and storm of the century which just decimate everything, and chain cones of cold on bosses since for some reason they’re CC-immune except for that one skill.

I played GW2 on a knights/valk/zerk AH guardian “back in the day” so that I could “be tanky and do decent DPS” and then I grew a pair, learnt how to dodge and just went full damage because I could.

the fact that people want to stop human nature and want builds with the least amount of passive defense to be more on par with builds that stack passive defense kind of just blows my mind. do you know a game where something like this exists? league of legends. there are bruiser champions that can basically just stack tank items and do shed loads of damage because they either have high base damage stats or they deal percentage hp total damage. guess which ones people hate fighting against? yeah, those ones.

Yes well but with Terragriffs the design is clever. You can easily kill them in any armor, but bringing a stable source of movement slow makes their main attack unusable, and hence renders them trivial. Warriors with sword-mainhands for example cannot really be attacked by a terragriff because it’ll just constantly flop around on the ground.

That’s good design. Sword isn’t really a zerker-meta weapon for Warriors, so adding an incentive to use it is good.

But the same already applies to more defensive stats. They make you very tanky, only nothing in the game truly requires you to be tanky much. Newer content more so (not because players find it more difficult, more because of the clusterkitten it often becomes), but in theory defensive stats offer a lot of bonuses in say, explorable AC. Bonuses you never need ,and that’s the reason no one ever uses them.

Also, defensive stats don’t really make you tanky. The difference between a 2.2k toughness toon taking a lv50 fractal archdiviner or Mosmman autoattack and a full zerker is that the full zerker if not a heavy armor toon gets instant downed while the toughness specced toon is left with 20-30% life. It’s the difference between a one shot and a two-shot.

Bosses in high level fractals can’t be tanked, only with a Guardian providing aegis and high prot uptime and healing can it happen. Again, the entire viability of defense is monopolized by a single class.

It’s not the gear that actually provides survivability — it’s the boons provided by a single class (guardian) at a high enough uptime. Characters who gear defensively more than halve their damage output in exchange for marginal defensive gains. The fight gets prolonged, and this game has not enough healing to absorb the damage some bosses put out.

This is why boon-heavy classes like warrior (might, fury), guardian (prot, aegis) and ele (might, fury) rule, and boon deficient classes like ranger and necro and even engineer get benched.

Because boons>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>conditions in this game. They propose that necromancers don’t have access to boons because they have conditions, yet conditions by default do less dps, have stacking limits, and bosses are not even affected by the likes of weakness, cripple, and blinds. All while protection and aegis fully works on bosses.

And not only that, but classes like warrior and guardian with vastly higher innate survivability compared to the rest, seem to output similar damage to massively more fragile classes like elementalist, ranger and thief.

xDudisx.5914:

Exactly, the risk goes to almost 0 due to blocks, reflecs, icebow #5 and the fact most stuff just dies before you take any dmg. For some classes your “skillful rotation” is mostly autoatk. Also full of passive playstile like: drop a banner, have signets that you never activate, summon AI (frost spirit), etc…

LOL.

So you mean using…

1. Blocks (active defense)
2. Reflects (using the proper utility skill for the encounter)
3. Crowd control skills to disrupt bosses
4. Proper DPS rotations

….is bad? And you want to replace those things with passive defenses that you soak up using 0 skill or coordination? LOL again. And you had the nerve to say that my last post was bad. shame on you.

naiasonod.9265:

Leo G.4501:

naiasonod.9265:

Leo G.4501:

xDudisx.5914:

Harper.4173:

xDudisx.5914:

hybrid.5027:

xDudisx.5914:

Looks like you are trying to underrate the gear just to say that zerker is not a problem. Try running meta traits with nomads and see how much dps you will lose.

The DPS you’d lose is largely irrelevant when you consider that you’d be essentially unkillable.

Yeah, clearlly irrelevant. That is why we see everyone running nomads, clerics, dire, etc and no one running zerker/assassin.

Have you considered that people don’t run those because they don’t need to be unkillable?

Have ever thought that the reason they would be unkillable is because dungeon’s bosses are doing too little dmg and when they do it is concentrated in slow telegraphed skills? If bosses had more armor, less hp, more dmg, and hit more often the game would be much more balance for all the other stat combination available. The reason defensive stats are useless now is because there is little to no unavoidable dmg in pve.

What if the boss’ telegraph attack was still pretty strong, but during the channel of a certain one, it blocks critical hits, has heightened armor and if interrupted, he kind of “explodes” doing AoE CC and ripping all your boons away? If he uses the attack and lands it, he follows up with quick flurries of weaker hits but while doing so is much more vulnerable to damage for a time?

Yeah, that sounds overcomplicated and would lend to being broketastic from the moment it were implemented on into the rest of the game’s lifestpan.

I shudder to imagine them trying to make something that complex playable for the average GW2 player.

Hah, I love this attitude.

Pretty much amounts to “ACCEPT THE GAME THE WAY IT IS! FLAWS, REPEAT TACTICS AND ALL!” I mean, geeze, you’re basically not even trying

Accept it or don’t, I really don’t care what you do. I’ll be over here being reasonably happy with most of what there is, yes, even with its flaws.

But I’ll go on with that, and you go on being however you prefer. In the end, Anet’s gonna do what Anet wants no matter what you, I or Smokey the Bear say about anything.

I guess joke’s on you then. You can be reasonably happy (I am!) and still make suggestions to add to the game’s fun. Part of the fun of posting on the forums is speculating, imagining and discussing the game in all its facets.

You, and a good many posters on the forums, are obviously too jaded and unhappy to bother with much of these things. I’d actually suggest taking a break from the game. Most things done in moderation are much better.

hybrid.5027:

xDudisx.5914:

Exactly, the risk goes to almost 0 due to blocks, reflecs, icebow #5 and the fact most stuff just dies before you take any dmg. For some classes your “skillful rotation” is mostly autoatk. Also full of passive playstile like: drop a banner, have signets that you never activate, summon AI (frost spirit), etc…

LOL.

So you mean using…

1. Blocks (active defense)
2. Reflects (using the proper utility skill for the encounter)
3. Crowd control skills to disrupt bosses
4. Proper DPS rotations

….is bad? And you want to replace those things with passive defenses that you soak up using 0 skill or coordination? LOL again. And you had the nerve to say that my last post was bad. shame on you.

1)Active block is ok, but block everything is wrong. In spvp blocks are ok because there are builds that atck fast. In pve most the old brainded bosses have very slow high dps atcks instead of several medium dmg hits.

2) If it negates completly the boss it is bad design. They fixed some bosses so you cant reflect anymore but still need to fix much more.

3) “crowd control” if you think the entire game cc should be limited to icebow #5 been viable then it is clear you have no sense about balance.

4) “proper rotation” a simple rotation that for some classes consists in press 1 or 2 skills and go back to autoatck.

You talk to much about “active skill” but almost all meta builds right now have signets, mantras, etc that they slot and hardly ever activate. Warrior never using adrenaline skill is also passive. Frost spirit and banners are as active as a turret engi in spvp, actually less active because turrets have active skills.

xDudisx, it looks like you have it all figured out. Why don’t you showcase your prowess and knowledge by gathering two other like minded individuals and register for the upcoming Trio Dungeon Tournament and show us how wrong we really are. If what you say is true, then we will all eat our words when you win the tournament.

Registration Thread: http://www.dtguilds.com/forum/m/6563292/viewthread/18674672-guild-wars-2-trio-challenge-registration-thread

Rules Thread: http://www.dtguilds.com/forum/m/6563292/viewthread/18674461-guild-wars-2-trio-challenge-competitive-pve-tournament-official-rules

I look forward to seeing you compete.

Tree.3916:

xDudisx, it looks like you have it all figured out. Why don’t you showcase your prowess and knowledge by gathering two other like minded individuals and register for the upcoming Trio Dungeon Tournament and show us how wrong we really are. If what you say is true, then we will all eat our words when you win the tournament.

Registration Thread: http://www.dtguilds.com/forum/m/6563292/viewthread/18674672-guild-wars-2-trio-challenge-registration-thread

Rules Thread: http://www.dtguilds.com/forum/m/6563292/viewthread/18674461-guild-wars-2-trio-challenge-competitive-pve-tournament-official-rules

I look forward to seeing you compete.

So you want me to play the dumb game mode I don’t like? Is like saying to spvp players that don’t like the actual celestial meta that they should all go play celestial. I played the faceroll zerker builds when I was making one of my legendaries don’t need to play dumb game mode anymore.

In spvp people see the problem and complain about it and then they get fixes. Not all times the fix is fast or complete, but it is a small step in the right direction. Same is valid for pve. The past changes and updates show anet reducing the dmg output making some new content that promote more variety.

Your argument is not valid and is actually an ad hominem (https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/ad-hominem).

The problem here is that there is no problem to fix. The people who balance this game are educated people with degrees in their respective fields. Are you saying that you know more than them and can offer better solutions given the restraints they work with? The fact of the matter is, non berserker builds are rewarded by being allowed to stand in one spot and soak all the damage. That not rewarding enough? Put on some berserker gear and stand in one spot.

xDudisx.5914:

hybrid.5027:

xDudisx.5914:

Exactly, the risk goes to almost 0 due to blocks, reflecs, icebow #5 and the fact most stuff just dies before you take any dmg. For some classes your “skillful rotation” is mostly autoatk. Also full of passive playstile like: drop a banner, have signets that you never activate, summon AI (frost spirit), etc…

LOL.

So you mean using…

1. Blocks (active defense)
2. Reflects (using the proper utility skill for the encounter)
3. Crowd control skills to disrupt bosses
4. Proper DPS rotations

….is bad? And you want to replace those things with passive defenses that you soak up using 0 skill or coordination? LOL again. And you had the nerve to say that my last post was bad. shame on you.

1)Active block is ok, but block everything is wrong. In spvp blocks are ok because there are builds that atck fast. In pve most the old brainded bosses have very slow high dps atcks instead of several medium dmg hits.

2) If it negates completly the boss it is bad design. They fixed some bosses so you cant reflect anymore but still need to fix much more.

3) “crowd control” if you think the entire game cc should be limited to icebow #5 been viable then it is clear you have no sense about balance.

4) “proper rotation” a simple rotation that for some classes consists in press 1 or 2 skills and go back to autoatck.

You talk to much about “active skill” but almost all meta builds right now have signets, mantras, etc that they slot and hardly ever activate. Warrior never using adrenaline skill is also passive. Frost spirit and banners are as active as a turret engi in spvp, actually less active because turrets have active skills.

I have yet to enter a party that blocks everything, and I play with 2 guardians in my party regularly. Also, while ice bow 5 is powerful, it is certainly not the only CC that is used in pve. On bosses however, Anet’s defiance system encourages you to drop the stacks with inferior skills and use the strongest available CC (ice bow 5) when the boss can be cc’ed. However, when in a pickle I have used other skills to interrupt a dangerous attack.

As for rotations, is that not always the case? You use the skills you need at that moment for more dps, useful boons, evades, whatever, then autoattack until you need one of your other skills again or it comes of cooldown if it is preferable to use it as often as possible. If you are referring to GS warriors that only use gs 1,2,3 and even just if they only use GS, they are obviously not playing well and will need to get carried by better players in more difficult content.

The problems you and many people mention with certain cherry picked meta build skills are due to game/skill design. Their active use is less desirable than their passive buffs due to PvE design. Nerfing zerker or making facetanking easier will not change this. Also, even these classes will use their weapon skills to play actively, if not their utility skills, or they will die quickly.

It is odd how many people actually have qualms with encounter design in PvE but somehow believe making facetanking easier will make this better.

OH YEAH. I want to see xDudisx go into that. The game is obviously too easy for him he will crush any competition.

- He figure out a better rotation than everybody else where you only need to use 1 or 2 skills and auto-attacks. Silly me that use 6 skills + 2 different auto-attacks for my dps rotation on my guardian or my 10 skills on my staff Ele. He can do better with 3 skills only WOW.

- He can kill bosses under 5 seconds (duration of Icebow #5) and not only AC. A lot of bosses and the best part is that he don’t even have to try, prepare the right group. He just need the basic meta build and everything die by themselves. Me that was talking with my friends to have the proper composition, have a strategy, make sure to stack might, fury and vulnerability, etc. I’m must be so bad at this game if he can do this without thinking or planning anything.

- He can block everything with his guardian. I mean everything, its braindead.

I thing everybody should just quit the tournament right now because xDudisx will obviously win since he can do the same stuff records run do without even thinking about it, planning or practising.

hybrid.5027:

….is bad? And you want to replace those things with passive defenses that you soak up using 0 skill or coordination? LOL again. And you had the nerve to say that my last post was bad. shame on you.

You might get further in life with taking others serious instead of ridiculing them.

Anyhow, the point is valid. This is a RPG. RPGs are traditionally stat-based games, in older times even going so far as to exposing actual random rolls to capture the atmosphere of pen&paper die rolls.
It is entirely natural for a RPG to have a random chance to critically hit, scales by a stat of your character (you seem to accept this, instead of having to aim your weapon as a part of the enemy not showing armor). It is also entirely natural for such games (not GW2 specifically) to make you dodge a blow passively by some chance scaled by your character’s agility, awareness, perception, anything like that.

This isn’t a weird thing. This is actually what many would expect when playing a RPG.
Now ofc, GW2 never had this and was never advertised as having these systems (except crit!), either.
But at the same time, it’s not really in any way absurd for players to request more passive ways to influence the fight.

Tree.3916:

The fact of the matter is, non berserker builds are rewarded by being allowed to stand in one spot and soak all the damage. That not rewarding enough? Put on some berserker gear and stand in one spot.

I, for one, don’t want to just stand in one spot and soak up damage on non-zerk builds. I want defensive stats to have as much meaning for defensive tactics as offensive stats have to offensive tactics.

For instance, toughness matters some on my Phantasm Mesmer who is traited to utilize phantasms’ attacks, HP and traits to support, survive and fight. But it’s still rather minor and I tend to trade toughness for healing power to simply replenish their HP more easily.

That’s a valid point Carighan. However, the other side of the coin is people coming on here stating as a fact that playing as a berserker is easymode while they clearly don’t have much experience with it, or have run the easiest dungeon paths with it at best.

I can understand why people who know what they are talking about find it hard to take those people serious. Sadly, it is often how these threads start, take this one as an example.

Carighan.6758:

hybrid.5027:

….is bad? And you want to replace those things with passive defenses that you soak up using 0 skill or coordination? LOL again. And you had the nerve to say that my last post was bad. shame on you.

You might get further in life with taking others serious instead of ridiculing them.

Anyhow, the point is valid. This is a RPG. RPGs are traditionally stat-based games, in older times even going so far as to exposing actual random rolls to capture the atmosphere of pen&paper die rolls.
It is entirely natural for a RPG to have a random chance to critically hit, scales by a stat of your character (you seem to accept this, instead of having to aim your weapon as a part of the enemy not showing armor). It is also entirely natural for such games (not GW2 specifically) to make you dodge a blow passively by some chance scaled by your character’s agility, awareness, perception, anything like that.

This isn’t a weird thing. This is actually what many would expect when playing a RPG.
Now ofc, GW2 never had this and was never advertised as having these systems (except crit!), either.
But at the same time, it’s not really in any way absurd for players to request more passive ways to influence the fight.

Actually his point was so far from valid that it was hilarious to me. His point, quite literally, is that effective use of skills, teamwork and planning makes the game too easy. That is seriously the beginning and end of his point. And you seem to find that particular conclusion isn’t absurd? OK, sure.

You’re off on some bizarre tangent about pen and paper RPG and character building systems from games 20 years ago. Sorry dude, that isn’t particularly topical.

Leo G.4501:

I want defensive stats to have as much meaning for defensive tactics as offensive stats have to offensive tactics.

So basically none? Offensive stats are only a passive buff to your dmg, they don’t change how you play, that is done with weapons, trait, runes, sigils, etc. Offensive stats change nothing to that and so defensive stats shouldn’t either, they should only be passive defensive buff like they exactly are right now.

Thaddeus.4891:

Leo G.4501:

I want defensive stats to have as much meaning for defensive tactics as offensive stats have to offensive tactics.

So basically none? Offensive stats are only a passive buff to your dmg, they don’t change how you play, that is done with weapons, trait, runes, sigils, etc. Offensive stats change nothing to that and so defensive stats shouldn’t either, they should only be passive defensive buff like they exactly are right now.

Offensive stats do alter your tactics. With the simple decision of direct or condition (or a blend of the two) is the basic effect it has on your offensive tactics. It also directs your strategies via enemy defeats. One reason many defensive tactics are not used as often is because if you can kill a foe you rally. Killing quickly can bring an ally up so more offense aids in that strategy. Does healing power help you rez faster? Does toughness improve the opportunity of manual rez? Does vitality improve downed health?

You’d be hard pressed to say offensive stats don’t affect your playstyle, at least. You and many people here constantly say “try to stand in one place in zerk gear” which obviously means you utilize various means to defeat while not being defeated and offensive stats plays a larger part in that than defensive stats. Not that defense stats play no part, but if it played a larger or equal part, people would be using them as an alternate tactic, not as training wheels.

Non-zerker gear already have the extra survivability reward. There are zones (i.e. Silverwastes) where condition damage is more effective than raw damage due the type of monsters and their mechanics (some of them move a lot so applying Torment is more effective than chasing them). There are world events-bosses (i.e. Tequatl) where you can’t crit, thereby soldier gear is more effective. Berserker is and will be optimal for dungeons but there are very few PUGS that will kick you for not using it or ask you to ping your gear. Use what you like and make oyur own LFG to avoid this.

Tree.3916:

Your argument is not valid and is actually an ad hominem (https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/ad-hominem).

The problem here is that there is no problem to fix. The people who balance this game are educated people with degrees in their respective fields. Are you saying that you know more than them and can offer better solutions given the restraints they work with? The fact of the matter is, non berserker builds are rewarded by being allowed to stand in one spot and soak all the damage. That not rewarding enough? Put on some berserker gear and stand in one spot.

“there is no problem to fix” yeah maybe that is why we are always getting class balance updates every few months. Because everything was perfect 2.5 years ago and needed no change. It is obviously the opposite. The devs saw the problem and are always moving away from the zerker easy mode in new content and updates. New bosses that you can’t do critical hits, some bosses with more armor, etc…

I guess people are too salty today becuase of losing 125 power hahaha.

Leo G.4501:

You’d be hard pressed to say offensive stats don’t affect your playstyle, at least. You and many people here constantly say “try to stand in one place in zerk gear” which obviously means you utilize various means to defeat while not being defeated and offensive stats plays a larger part in that than defensive stats. Not that defense stats play no part, but if it played a larger or equal part, people would be using them as an alternate tactic, not as training wheels.

But that the major point right there. Stats are passive buff whatever you do. Defensive stats are not good because you can replace them with active defence. And that point right there is unbalancing the PvE game between defense and offense. You are totally right on that point. But where we have different opinion is that you see that as a problem that limit diversity as I see that as a GREAT gameplay design. I don’t want to have defensive stats that give me passive survivability, i want active gameplay that use damage mitigation.

You want fewer big attack and more medium attack so that active defense wasn’t enough by itself and that we need more defensive stats to survive, i want big attack that you can dodge or block and few medium/low attack that you can do nothing about except soak it.

Both design are ok, but GW2 is build around the second one and ppl that love this game, love it because of it. You want another kind of game and its ok, but that not the game that we have now and its not the game that we want. Maybe you are right and anet will change the game in the future to adapt more to the gameplay you prefer and at this moment I’ll cry like a baby and quit the game. We just prefer two style of gameplay that are different and its ok. Now all game need to be the same, they can be different gameplay in different game for different people.

xDudisx.5914:

Tree.3916:

Your argument is not valid and is actually an ad hominem (https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/ad-hominem).

The problem here is that there is no problem to fix. The people who balance this game are educated people with degrees in their respective fields. Are you saying that you know more than them and can offer better solutions given the restraints they work with? The fact of the matter is, non berserker builds are rewarded by being allowed to stand in one spot and soak all the damage. That not rewarding enough? Put on some berserker gear and stand in one spot.

“there is no problem to fix” yeah maybe that is why we are always getting class balance updates every few months. Because everything was perfect 2.5 years ago and needed no change. It is obviously the opposite. The devs saw the problem and are always moving away from the zerker easy mode in new content and updates. New bosses that you can’t do critical hits, some bosses with more armor, etc…

I guess people are too salty today becuase of losing 125 power hahaha.

and that’s just the beginning soon

Ice Storm will get nerfed only functioning to the efficiency of ranger barrage but with chill

Lupi’s projectiles will no longer be reflectable and will go into a constant freak out if you push him into walls.

a man can only dream.

xDudisx.5914:

I guess people are too salty today becuase of losing 125 power hahaha.

Actually losing 125 power from ~3300 (full zerker +25 might) is a loss of 3,8% of stat, and the same 125 power represents 7% of a full nomad + 25 might… so in the end the nerf will, as the ferocity nerf, push more towards having passive attack power (from stat) than active (might stacking). So I’m not sure that the Meta community will be the one that will see much difference.

By the way if you remember the ferocity introduction, they “nerfed” zerker gear but in the same time the “up’ed” the downscaling. That is why the more they “take action against the zerk meta” the shorter the records are.

xDudisx.5914:

Tree.3916:

Your argument is not valid and is actually an ad hominem (https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/ad-hominem).

The problem here is that there is no problem to fix. The people who balance this game are educated people with degrees in their respective fields. Are you saying that you know more than them and can offer better solutions given the restraints they work with? The fact of the matter is, non berserker builds are rewarded by being allowed to stand in one spot and soak all the damage. That not rewarding enough? Put on some berserker gear and stand in one spot.

“there is no problem to fix” yeah maybe that is why we are always getting class balance updates every few months. Because everything was perfect 2.5 years ago and needed no change. It is obviously the opposite. The devs saw the problem and are always moving away from the zerker easy mode in new content and updates. New bosses that you can’t do critical hits, some bosses with more armor, etc…

I guess people are too salty today becuase of losing 125 power hahaha.

Now you are confusing gear with traits…

IllegalChocolate.6938:

and that’s just the beginning soon

Ice Storm will get nerfed only functioning to the efficiency of ranger barrage but with chill

Lupi’s projectiles will no longer be reflectable and will go into a constant freak out if you push him into walls.

a man can only dream.

I wouldn’t mind any of those change. I will still be able to solo Lupi, this will liberate one place on my skill bar for my Ele. They nerfed FGS and the game is better wihtout it, don’t know what tactics we will use if they nerfed Icebow and remove the reflect of Lupi, but i’ll have fun trying to find out something new.

xDudisx.5914:

Tree.3916:

Your argument is not valid and is actually an ad hominem (https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/ad-hominem).

The problem here is that there is no problem to fix. The people who balance this game are educated people with degrees in their respective fields. Are you saying that you know more than them and can offer better solutions given the restraints they work with? The fact of the matter is, non berserker builds are rewarded by being allowed to stand in one spot and soak all the damage. That not rewarding enough? Put on some berserker gear and stand in one spot.

“there is no problem to fix” yeah maybe that is why we are always getting class balance updates every few months. Because everything was perfect 2.5 years ago and needed no change. It is obviously the opposite. The devs saw the problem and are always moving away from the zerker easy mode in new content and updates. New bosses that you can’t do critical hits, some bosses with more armor, etc…

I guess people are too salty today becuase of losing 125 power hahaha.

Considering that Might is being nerfed to try to balance the pvp celestial meta and that they don’t make major balance decisions around pve you conclusions are dubious at best.

Thaddeus.4891:

IllegalChocolate.6938:

and that’s just the beginning soon

Ice Storm will get nerfed only functioning to the efficiency of ranger barrage but with chill

Lupi’s projectiles will no longer be reflectable and will go into a constant freak out if you push him into walls.

a man can only dream.

I wouldn’t mind any of those change. I will still be able to solo Lupi, this will liberate one place on my skill bar for my Ele. They nerfed FGS and the game is better wihtout it, don’t know what tactics we will use if they nerfed Icebow and remove the reflect of Lupi, but i’ll have fun trying to find out something new.

Will mostly just go back to straight melee in the center of the room which is how I personally liked it to begin with.

I think berserker builds should be more rewarding. If i play full nomads gear i can facetank everything, but with berserker gear i have to dodge the bosses attacks or i will die. I think thats quite unfair.

Tree.3916:

Your argument is not valid and is actually an ad hominem (https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/ad-hominem).

The problem here is that there is no problem to fix. The people who balance this game are educated people with degrees in their respective fields. Are you saying that you know more than them and can offer better solutions given the restraints they work with? The fact of the matter is, non berserker builds are rewarded by being allowed to stand in one spot and soak all the damage. That not rewarding enough? Put on some berserker gear and stand in one spot.

It is really rich that someone talking about ad hominems goes on and makes an argument for authority right after talking about logical fallacies and on top of that making a circular argument.

IllegalChocolate.6938:

Will mostly just go back to straight melee in the center of the room which is how I personally liked it to begin with.

Well except for some specific boss, we mostly kill at the center of the room right now.

There is a lot of boss that were corned only because of FGS. Pugs still continue to corner because they don’t know any better, but that doesn’t mean that its a good idea. Not corner the boss in those instance is faster and easier.

Some bosses are better in corner because they are easier that way, but not the best way to do it. CoE Alpha is a good exemple. You are better just rushing to him and killing him in place, but its safer to corner him.

Some bosse are better in corner because you can exploit them or use questionable tactics that will eventually be fixed.

And very few boss are really best killed in a corner and its only when the boss come with a lot of trash or adds that you want to come at you or if you want to boss to be far away from something like the Tar elemental in Arah path 1. You corner him only to give your team enough time to immobilize him to death and not run the geyzers 4 times.

Quick! Everybody pull up the logical fallacies page on Wikipedia and search for more options!

Zenith.7301:

Tree.3916:

Your argument is not valid and is actually an ad hominem (https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/ad-hominem).

The problem here is that there is no problem to fix. The people who balance this game are educated people with degrees in their respective fields. Are you saying that you know more than them and can offer better solutions given the restraints they work with? The fact of the matter is, non berserker builds are rewarded by being allowed to stand in one spot and soak all the damage. That not rewarding enough? Put on some berserker gear and stand in one spot.

It is really rich that someone talking about ad hominems goes on and makes an argument for authority right after talking about logical fallacies and on top of that making a circular argument.

Here is some evidence to back up my claims…
Lupicus vs 5 Full Clerics https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZgRUtK7LkM
Lupicus vs 5 of the same class for each class
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OamhniesRfg&list=PLrtWAmj0-iOpWgRRX9BOyoLhrn5jGkg7P

Lupicus vs 5 Meta Group (in 2013…)https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KAK-QYShjro

Which one of those can you just stand and eat all attacks? I’ll give you a hint… it’s the first one.

What we see here in these videos is that content is balanced in such a way that any gear type can complete the content.

What we have here is people who think absorbing damage is not rewarding enough (with which I agree, learning active defense is the most rewarding thing in this game) and think that their “toughness” or “vitality” should contribute to their overall damage which is just absurd.

xDudisx.5914:

I guess people are too salty today becuase of losing 125 power hahaha.

Yeah, right…

Thaddeus.4891:

Leo G.4501:

You’d be hard pressed to say offensive stats don’t affect your playstyle, at least. You and many people here constantly say “try to stand in one place in zerk gear” which obviously means you utilize various means to defeat while not being defeated and offensive stats plays a larger part in that than defensive stats. Not that defense stats play no part, but if it played a larger or equal part, people would be using them as an alternate tactic, not as training wheels.

But that the major point right there. Stats are passive buff whatever you do. Defensive stats are not good because you can replace them with active defence. And that point right there is unbalancing the PvE game between defense and offense. You are totally right on that point. But where we have different opinion is that you see that as a problem that limit diversity as I see that as a GREAT gameplay design. I don’t want to have defensive stats that give me passive survivability, i want active gameplay that use damage mitigation.

You want fewer big attack and more medium attack so that active defense wasn’t enough by itself and that we need more defensive stats to survive, i want big attack that you can dodge or block and few medium/low attack that you can do nothing about except soak it.

Both design are ok, but GW2 is build around the second one and ppl that love this game, love it because of it. You want another kind of game and its ok, but that not the game that we have now and its not the game that we want. Maybe you are right and anet will change the game in the future to adapt more to the gameplay you prefer and at this moment I’ll cry like a baby and quit the game. We just prefer two style of gameplay that are different and its ok. Now all game need to be the same, they can be different gameplay in different game for different people.

Beware Thaddeus! If you’re happy with the way it generally works now and don’t believe that Anet is holding their breath awaiting this thread’s consensus, he’ll conclude that you’re just jaded and need to take a break from the game!

Its kinda funny, really – we have dungeons in which we can do everything from go full easy mode in carebear land all the way over to darksouls hard just depending on what gear and party comp we run with (and much in between), and it’s clearly too much freedom to actually choose froe many.

So, I’ll go sugar and specially speculate something – I hope they normalize all dungeon parties to zerker stats.

Get good or go home. This would simplify the matter entirely, remove all worry on anyone’s part about everyone being proudly statted for maximum kill efficiency and would push the required skill bar up to complete all dungeons, thus expanding the achievement value of so doing.

It’s my new platform on this topic now. I shall defend it without mercy.

naiasonod.9265:

snip

Nike had a good idea for normalizing stats. All gear is Celestial and trait distribution would control the stats on characters.

Tree.3916:

naiasonod.9265:

snip

Nike had a good idea for normalizing stats. All gear is Celestial and trait distribution would control the stats on characters.

I could dig it. That’d be a rather decent baseline, in fact.

naiasonod.9265:

Tree.3916:

naiasonod.9265:

snip

Nike had a good idea for normalizing stats. All gear is Celestial and trait distribution would control the stats on characters.

I could dig it. That’d be a rather decent baseline, in fact.

I agree, but I doubt something like that will ever happen.
People would rage even more about how they can´t be “special snowflakes”, which apparently is “what MMOs are about” for a lot of people.

Threads like this are rather pointless I feel (same old arguments as usual). Still, it amazes me how they´ve kept popping up so consistently for basically two years now and yet, I STILL do not understand what exactly the problem is.

No one is forced to run a specific set of gear under any circumstances. As far as I can tell, you can complete everything in this game using whichever stat combination you like. Naturally, people have become better since launch, therefore more people started using purely offensive stats for better kill-times/faster completion of content.
You don´t like the “active playstyle” associated with offensive stat combinations, or simply can´t pull it off? Fine. Use something else and stop bothering other people

xDudisx.5914:

Tree.3916:

Your argument is not valid and is actually an ad hominem (https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/ad-hominem).

The problem here is that there is no problem to fix. The people who balance this game are educated people with degrees in their respective fields. Are you saying that you know more than them and can offer better solutions given the restraints they work with? The fact of the matter is, non berserker builds are rewarded by being allowed to stand in one spot and soak all the damage. That not rewarding enough? Put on some berserker gear and stand in one spot.

“there is no problem to fix” yeah maybe that is why we are always getting class balance updates every few months. Because everything was perfect 2.5 years ago and needed no change. It is obviously the opposite. The devs saw the problem and are always moving away from the zerker easy mode in new content and updates. New bosses that you can’t do critical hits, some bosses with more armor, etc…

I guess people are too salty today becuase of losing 125 power hahaha.

It’s like you almost ignored that the might nerf, the “tough armor”, and the “can’t be crit” affects non zerkers too.

They nerfed might stacking, not “zerker easy mode”. Everyone got their dps scaled back if they use might at all. Which, in parties, is a guarantee.

At what point does “wow, this tree sure can take a lot of damage, better sacrifice all the damage I have for armor so I can stare at it” become a reasonable train of thought?

No matter how far Anet moves back the damage cap, the main focus of zerker is to get from point A to point B as fast as possible, since the road in between has been traveled to disgusting exhaustion. “As fast as possible” is not a quantifiable number that Anet can remove from the game. It will always be the top end of the damage range they give us to work with, unless they want to go against good game design and cause unpredictable 1hKO procs to offset the “learning mob patterns and no longer needing to defend against them” process.

Skoigoth.9238:

naiasonod.9265:

Tree.3916:

naiasonod.9265:

snip

Nike had a good idea for normalizing stats. All gear is Celestial and trait distribution would control the stats on characters.

I could dig it. That’d be a rather decent baseline, in fact.

I agree, but I doubt something like that will ever happen.
People would rage even more about how they can´t be “special snowflakes”, which apparently is “what MMOs are about” for a lot of people.

Threads like this are rather pointless I feel (same old arguments as usual). Still, it amazes me how they´ve kept popping up so consistently for basically two years now and yet, I STILL do not understand what exactly the problem is.

No one is forced to run a specific set of gear under any circumstances. As far as I can tell, you can complete everything in this game using whichever stat combination you like. Naturally, people have become better since launch, therefore more people started using purely offensive stats for better kill-times/faster completion of content.
You don´t like the “active playstyle” associated with offensive stat combinations, or simply can´t pull it off? Fine. Use something else and stop bothering other people

I suspect the real issue here is exactly what you say, leading to a lot of ‘But I wanna do special snowflake damage in my carrion/nomads/rampager/Valkyrie set! Its not fair that I have to actually think or, or, or…or try, and, and, and…and then there’s those people that demand zerker in groupfinder and I’M NOT GOOD ENOUGH AHGAHD but I didn’t say that it isn’t true, I’m TOO GOOD FOR YOU! NYEAH! LEAVE BRITNEY ALONE (I’m Britney!)"

So, that might be a touch overdramatic, though I think its apt to what I perceive as being the real problem here – going even mostly zerker requires a very aggressive playstyle to just survive it, and it really sets apart those that know their build and class from those that don’t, as skill with it is your biggest survival tool.

I dunno. I have friends that won’t even try zerker builds because they’re scared of being embarrassed. They’ll run valk armor and weapons with zerk trinkets and sometimes bewilder at how people survive with even fewer hp and no toughness at all. I don’t think they’re garbage – I think they’re accustomed to the thing they’ve used the most and are fundamentally afraid of ridicule if they step out of the comfort zone and try full glass cannon, especially while anyone’s present to see them fumbling with the learning curve.

I’d be willing to bet some shiny nickels that some of the fangriest anti-zerk campaigners are people that either cannot make it work for them for any or no reason at all, or won’t even try to.

People these days don’t often think to try to make their own gaming experience more rewarding, lastly of all. I’m not on their level when it comes to sheer amazingness yet, but some of my soloing friends do it just to see if they can, just to do it faster than they did before – refining and perfecting, tweaking and throwing the new attempt into the blender and going ‘WILL IT BLEND? LET’S FIND OUT!’

I think if people in general took a little bit more responsibility for entertaining themselves with the tools provided, they’d find that the array of tools provided is actually pretty impressive, and just because something (zerker in this case) might be the favorite meta for speedclear and fast kill efficiency doesn’t mean its the only possible thing one can have fun with.

And I’d say that if you’re not having fun doing whatever you’re doing in a game, then you are absolutely and definitively doing it wrong, no matter why you’re doing it or what gear you’re wearing.

xDudisx.5914:

I guess people are too salty today becuase of losing 125 power hahaha.

Well Why would I care my might stack goes from 875 to 750? I’m comforted by the act you lose 125 power as well, Oh and I almost forgot 125 condition dmg… LOL!

It don’t mean a thing…

I posted in another thread Instead ofthe AC P2 boss dying in 5 seconds he’ll be dying in 5.175 seconds… Well that’s gamebreaking.

In other news today a-net nerfed might, The problem is if a critter needed 30 hits to die it now needs 31… We are outraged??…