Guild Wars 2

Hey guys, so i came from WOW to gw2, and like it saw far.. everything is new to me and its great. gfx is AMAZING :O

Anyway, 1 thing that bothers me is the amount of abilities on each char’

for example, with my guardian now (greatsword) i have 4 abilities that hits mybe with a side effect and a grab(cc) ability.. and ofcurse 3-4 more from the one i choose my self..

as a hunter in wow – 3 full bars (3X10) abilities that i just use in fight, and 5-7 more less common.

i just feel that i allways repeat the same buttons..

So please, tell me, is it feel like that at 80? classes gets more deep?
and for ex wow players – esp’ in pvp – what did u like here more then wow?

i need some motivation guys, help me with that.

Sagi.

well actually everything in pve can be done by just autoattacking…

OP you a min late pal.
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Unique-Skills-vs-Skills-that-just-Boon/first#post1977086

Utilities have hilariously long cool downs and your best defense is hitting the dodge-roll button at the right time.

You have to be on your toes a lot more than other similar mmo’s. But, ya, it’s not an incredibly deep game by most standards.

While it may be true that a few of the weapon skills seem useless its entirely not true that you use 30 skills actively in a fight as any class in wow.

I played Rift, which has a skill system like WoW. I had three buttons I used, all of them macros. All of them, for the most part, were variations on a theme. This one did X damage with a long cooldown, this did less damage with a shorter cooldown. You macro them together in order of efficiency.

By comparison, what I do in Guild Wars 2 combat is far more visceral.

So what keeps you in game?
i allways liked that i have lots of options in the heat of battle..
to go fully offensive or change to def’ in seconds… that i have abilities agaits X
and abilities agaits Y..

right now i feel i use the main attack (1) while keeping the rest (2) damage abilities on CD.
its just really bothers me, because outside of that, the game is really looks great, i just afraid that i will get bored fast after X time of doing the same.

Another thing – you dont need tankers/healers in pve, u also cant see the dps of the group
so how you tell which player is good in pve or bad?
how can you tell this group will do X doungen much faster then Y group?

Xta.7458:

So what keeps you in game?
i allways liked that i have lots of options in the heat of battle..
to go fully offensive or change to def’ in seconds… that i have abilities agaits X
and abilities agaits Y..

right now i feel i use the main attack (1) while keeping the rest (2) damage abilities on CD.
its just really bothers me, because outside of that, the game is really looks great, i just afraid that i will get bored fast after X time of doing the same.

Play an ele….problem solved. lol

I did played ele’ just because i felt they have lots of options.. but i just hate playing casters.. i like toe to toe fights :\

Xta.7458:

I did played ele’ just because i felt they have lots of options.. but i just hate playing casters.. i like toe to toe fights :\

Use dual daggers, that’s pretty close. lol

Xta.7458:

I did played ele’ just because i felt they have lots of options.. but i just hate playing casters.. i like toe to toe fights :\

I agree. the game needs a Melee equivalent of the Ele.

Like a Melee Shaman Class or something with Attument changes for different elements, but with melee instead of ranged theme for most of the weapons.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/I-feel-I-am-ready-for-some-new-classes/first#post1976928

agree.

they put so much work on everything in the game, from gfx, animations, sounds (npc talks!) amount of great and the look of the gear on each players..

but it seems they just forgot about the class it self.. every class in the game could use 3-5 more slots in the action bar.

Engineers are mid-range, generally. They’re also a ton of fun and a kit Engineer has about as many abilities as most WoW classes (hunters and warlocks excluded) :P

As an ex-WoW player, I had the same worries when initially reading about the game. However, I feel like in WoW, the majority of classes end up using 2-5 spells in a given fight, occasionally they may use a few other high cooldown abilities if necessary. The difference in this game is you need to focus a lot more on dodging incoming hits and your positioning is very important.

You end up using about the same amount of abilities, but I think my APM is a lot higher in GW2 than it ever was in WoW. PvP is probably about the same, but I do miss some random utility spells that WoW had. It was nice to have your entire toolkit available rather than having to pick a few to have during a given fight.

Be honest and tell us how many of those 30 hunter skills were actually useful. On my warlock, sure I did have 7 summon skills, but I only used one per game type (imp in pve, succubus duel etc). The 4 dots, I put into 1 macro. So out of 70+ skills as a warlock, I only ever used 5 on a daily basis. Raids could be done pretty much by spamming shadow bolt and life tap.

GW2 forces you to limit the skills you can use, which means every skill becomes far more valuable. In GW2 I use 10 out of 10 skills, in WoW I used 5 out of 70.

The GW2 skill system is deep, but it’s not complex.

IndigoSundown.5419:

The GW2 skill system is deep, but it’s not complex.

^

I use all of my skills all the time and every choice makes difference and can be quite crucial.
And about pvp? Go watch some of thew ne streams that are poping up (see BLU42 for example) and you’ll get some notion of how hectic and how crucial each skill can be.

marnick.4305:

Be honest and tell us how many of those 30 hunter skills were actually useful. On my warlock, sure I did have 7 summon skills, but I only used one per game type (imp in pve, succubus duel etc). The 4 dots, I put into 1 macro. So out of 70+ skills as a warlock, I only ever used 5 on a daily basis. Raids could be done pretty much by spamming shadow bolt and life tap.

GW2 forces you to limit the skills you can use, which means every skill becomes far more valuable. In GW2 I use 10 out of 10 skills, in WoW I used 5 out of 70.

Most of them are useful. Way more than GW2 has in its ranger class all together.
http://www.wowhead.com/class=3/hunter
^——the proof, See for your self——^

I find the limited skills almost the challenge in itself. Going into a Battle I have to choose which 3 utilities help most in a given fight. Do I take a stun breaker, more stats, a wall, an extra kit for healing etc. In some ways the limitations are what adds the challenge. I think if I could roll into a fight with every utility as an option it might make things much easier.

Though I do feel a lot of the Elites need looking at, there are too many classes where I find one Elite stapled to my bar as there are so few situations where the other Elites would be useful.

papryk.6273:

well actually everything in pve can be done by just autoattacking…

Only one button can be set to autoattack so I don’t know what the heck you are talking about… we have almost no “control” in this game compared to some and FAR more than others.

That said, we have eight plus a few “f” abilities on some characters, it’s not a lot but a game that isn’t even a year old yet, I think it’s doing very well.

I remember back in the days when WOW was this young… yeah, let’s wait ten years and see where the devs have taken this game, ’cause if the dialog additions and the new dungeons are any hint? We will have this game going a very long time with better and better options unless the devs just flat out just give up caring.

Xta.7458:

Another thing – you dont need tankers/healers in pve, u also cant see the dps of the group
so how you tell which player is good in pve or bad?
how can you tell this group will do X doungen much faster then Y group?

In most content in GW2 it doesnt matter if the player is good or bad, paying attention or watching tv. In the few difficult bits you notice the bad players since you constantly run over to revive them because they stood in the fire (or similar absent-minded things).

thanks for all the comments.

in wow (atleat pvp, i dont pve) u use 80%+ of your abilities
ofcurse you wont use “teleport: Orgrimar” when you are in the arena xD

Anyway, i find lots of good things in gw2, i just hope my guardian wont bored me soon..
(i’m only 16 but i feel i saw all he have to offer, and from now on, its only numbers improvements)

I like it this way. I was playing WoW for 4 years (quit for good just before the whole Pandas thing). I first played GW1 (in between WoW breaks) and I was really sold to the whole 8 skills concept. IMO it is awesome, because you don’t have to be a pianist this way and there is an added value of flexible builds where you can “create” a spec yourself and not go by the mostly predetermined road.

10 skills make it natural to play while the build flexibility retains the whole feel of depth. IMO, having 3 full bars of skills and then the “mod” wars to control it all is pretty much an outdated design.

IMO, it provides a right level of complexity without you having to bind 20 keybinds on top of movement, just to control your character. IMO, the real complexity should come from preparing beforehand, taking tactical decisions and using right tools at the right time, like it is done in MOBA games.

Xta.7458:

thanks for all the comments.

in wow (atleat pvp, i dont pve) u use 80%+ of your abilities
ofcurse you wont use “teleport: Orgrimar” when you are in the arena xD

And yet a whole lot of those WoW abilities are complete filler. You buff for the sake of having something to debuff, not because these buffs are any use (underwater breathing in arenas?). A lot of skills are redundant and could be cleaned up by proper design. Who needs portal skills in a game where travel is fast and easy for example, why have skills for mounts. Removing 70% of the skills in WoW would result in a far better game.

At least for PVE, the GW2 system is far superior. I actually use my skills instead of having 4 bars of filler on my screen.

Anyway, i find lots of good things in gw2, i just hope my guardian wont bored me soon..
(i’m only 16 but i feel i saw all he have to offer, and from now on, its only numbers improvements)

Isn’t that the case in WoW too? It’s just bigger numbers. Why not stay at lvl 20 with 480 hp. Has the exact same end effect as lvl 100 with 200000 hp.

Xta.7458:

Hey guys, so i came from WOW to gw2, and like it saw far.. everything is new to me and its great. gfx is AMAZING :O

Anyway, 1 thing that bothers me is the amount of abilities on each char’

for example, with my guardian now (greatsword) i have 4 abilities that hits mybe with a side effect and a grab(cc) ability.. and ofcurse 3-4 more from the one i choose my self..

as a hunter in wow – 3 full bars (3X10) abilities that i just use in fight, and 5-7 more less common.

i just feel that i allways repeat the same buttons..

So please, tell me, is it feel like that at 80? classes gets more deep?
and for ex wow players – esp’ in pvp – what did u like here more then wow?

i need some motivation guys, help me with that.

Sagi.

So, in WoW you have 3×10 = 30 abilities

With your Guardian you will be using:
5 Weapon set 1
5 Weapon set 2
3 Virtues
1 Healing
3 Utilities
1 Elite
= 18

Also, you will be using DODGE a lot, weapon swap is also an action that triggers abilities (sigils that work when you swap). Moreover, in PvE you will use many different utilities, on my Guardian I change my utilities all the time to be more effective in a given situation. In Tournament PvP where your abilities are locked you won’t be able to do that, but still there are lots of abilities to use.

Then you have abilities that activate after other abilities, Elite Tomes grants you 5 new skills, Spirit Weapons grant you new skills as well. And the thing is, you will be using all those abilities a LOT…

Contrary to popular belief, you don’t have much less abilities available to you.

Xta.7458:

I did played ele’ just because i felt they have lots of options.. but i just hate playing casters.. i like toe to toe fights :\

You could reroll to an engineer! Their utilities can be swaped in for kits, and every kit gives another 5 aditional new skills. Aswell they always have 14 skills equipped becuase of their toolbelt. With 3 kits you’ll have acces to 26 at the same time

Less abilities is better. The Hud in WoW is a mess!

I disagree, you can customize your HUD in WoW any way you want. By default all the numbers and clutter is terrible yes but with a little effort you fix that right up. On my rogue I use 20+ abilities regularly nothing I have is useless like people seem to think. But defending a game that has a massive hate train for the sake of hating even though it has changed dramatically over the years is a lost cause ;p

@OP, nothing changes at high level, you will still be spamming the same skills… and get used to your auto attack because that will be 99% of what you do on a lot of the proffs and hilariously enough it is usually the best DPS as well. I and many others are still waiting for more skill variety but it will probably not ever come in current design.

Mathias.9657:

hilariously enough it is usually the best DPS as well.

DPS rotations are boring and unnecessary. They don’t add anything fun or engaging to the gameplay. Why do you feel that having 4 (filler) skills that have to be used in a particular order to be of any use?

Gaidax.7835:

I like it this way. I was playing WoW for 4 years (quit for good just before the whole Pandas thing). I first played GW1 (in between WoW breaks) and I was really sold to the whole 8 skills concept. IMO it is awesome, because you don’t have to be a pianist this way and there is an added value of flexible builds where you can “create” a spec yourself and not go by the mostly predetermined road.

10 skills make it natural to play while the build flexibility retains the whole feel of depth. IMO, having 3 full bars of skills and then the “mod” wars to control it all is pretty much an outdated design.

IMO, it provides a right level of complexity without you having to bind 20 keybinds on top of movement, just to control your character. IMO, the real complexity should come from preparing beforehand, taking tactical decisions and using right tools at the right time, like it is done in MOBA games.

Couldn’t have said this better.

Onshidesigns.1069:

Less abilities is better. The Hud in WoW is a mess!

Exactly. And with mods, it gets even worse. You barely see anything except the HUD. Now you could say: well, then don’t use them – but that’s not an option, you’ll be forced to do so.

Xta.7458:

thanks for all the comments.

in wow (atleat pvp, i dont pve) u use 80%+ of your abilities
ofcurse you wont use “teleport: Orgrimar” when you are in the arena xD

Anyway, i find lots of good things in gw2, i just hope my guardian wont bored me soon..
(i’m only 16 but i feel i saw all he have to offer, and from now on, its only numbers improvements)

Thought the same thing on my Guardian and just ended up enjoying the content and learning the game then I realised that once you understand these things, you re-evaluate how you play. All of a sudden the Guardian became a totally different character for me…

The fact that you have to move and dodge, while attacking, makes all the difference. No one could seriously keep track of 30 skills, while also keeping positioning in mind.

This game is ALOT different from other MMOs. You do have a limited skillset but it adds alot actually, when you have to choose what you will use, making sacrifices as you are not able to have everything(on most classes anyway :P).

No castbars.. you look at enemy animations.. and you dodge when you are supposed to Gw2 combat is fun and when you get used to it you will most likely love it. I know it took me a long time to get used to it ^^

Xta.7458:

i’m only 16 but i feel i saw all he have to offer, and from now on, its only numbers improvements

While you won’t be able to unlock more skills after around level 30, you do unlock higher tiers of traits. The traits bring a lot more interesting play into the mix, so while you’ll be using the same small number of key presses for your skills, you’ll actually have the options to be doing much more with each press. There is a huge difference in how interesting it is to just play the game at level 30 and at level 80. At 30, you have all your weapon and utility skills, and your elite skill, but only the first trait tier unlocked. At 80, when you have all traits available and 70 trait points to spend, combat actually become a lot of fun. Stick with it, and remember that we all feel your pain every time we decide to level an alt =D

Xta.7458:

right now i feel i use the main attack (1) while keeping the rest (2) damage abilities on CD.
its just really bothers me, because outside of that, the game is really looks great, i just afraid that i will get bored fast after X time of doing the same.

You will get bored, especially in pve, where it’s much more repetitive, you’ll go through all weapons and will get bored of all of them. This game needs more skills, each weapon should have not fixed set of skills, but rather a list of skills available to choose from, auto-attack should become just a white attack like in wow and free 1st skill slot for a sterling skill, because right now it’s just a boring filler in already very short skill bar. And more viable utility skills ofc, a list of F1-4 skills to choose from. Imo thats what this game needs, otherwise 1-3 months, and you’ll get bored to death, unless they release bunch of new content, but then you’ll get bored again as soon as you’re through with this new content.

The combat system in GW2 is different than those found in games like WoW. In WoW, the priority is on your skill rotation – most abilities either synergize with others or cooldowns/ability costs are set up in such a way as to make hitting a series of abilities in a particular order reward the player with greater DPS or healing.

With a few possible (soft) exceptions, there are no skill rotations in GW2. Instead, most of your pure damage is tied to 2-3 buttons. The remaining abilities are situational skills. This makes for a different (yet still engaging and fun) playstyle. It also separates the good players from the mediocre ones in different ways than in a game like WoW – the guardian who uses reflection abilities in the volcano fractal or shares aegis during big spike attacks – the thief that knows how to shadowstep or keep interrupts rolling – the necro who keeps enemies from stacking boons and keeps weakness up on the target 100% of the time – etc.

I think where people have the biggest issue is that, in GW2, there are very few (high level fractals and some arah paths) fights where these situational abilities are even semi-required – whereas, in a game like WoW, if people didnt know their rotations, they couldnt complete some raid encounters.

While I find the current system engaging and fun personally, I do think this is an area they could improve. Fights like the one in the new F&F dungeon are a step in the right direction – fights where playing smart make a difference.

All of that said, I think if you take the time to learn the roles the guardian (or any profession you play) can play and master them, you may find it a more enjoyable experience than games with a more skill rotation based approach (regardless of the number of skills).

Its a tighter but better defined list in this game. And you don’t play by cycling cooldowns only. Mobility and coordination to work combo fields, dodging, and other elements play a major role here.

I wish more games would cut down on actionbar bloat.

I too come from WoW, and its a bit shocking at first, but once you get used to it the benefits will likely become more clear.

Don’t forget about weapon swapping. Use up those abilities, and when they are on CD swap to your next weapon set.

Wolfheart.1938:

Mathias.9657:

hilariously enough it is usually the best DPS as well.

DPS rotations are boring and unnecessary. They don’t add anything fun or engaging to the gameplay. Why do you feel that having 4 (filler) skills that have to be used in a particular order to be of any use?

Synergy is more entertaining to me than sitting there having my auto attack do a rotation, and yes they have a built in rotation. It’s just less engaging.

Why do you feel pressing 1 button as opposed to 4 is more fun? Rotations like in WoW aren’t just 1234 either, it all depends on the situation you’re in what skills you use after. I don’t always have 4-5 finishers on my rogue up. It isn’t that simple, sometimes I go straight for burst and ignore increased attack speed and healing which are more for prolonged fights.

There is never a be all end all rotation that you do every time. GW2 definitely has rotations they are just hidden well. Thief: autoattack until revealed done, stealth backstab repeat. Mes: get clones up, shatter. I could go on, but you get my point. I could even go so far as to point out the amazing builds like unicorn sin that just spams 3 and autoattack, 2 buttons not counting the occasional caltrops and dodge.

Combat isn’t quite as dynamic in other MMOs but they certainly excel with skill usage and variety. Maybe if utilities weren’t on hilariously long cooldowns I wouldn’t get so bored? GW1 did it right with autoattack not being a skill, then having 8 skills to work with and you can change them out at any time in an outpost in a pool of thousands of skills, plus elites actually felt ELITE even with their incredibly short cooldowns in comparison of what we have now.

How we went from that to this is… I don’t even know. Baffling.

Mathias.9657:

Wolfheart.1938:

Mathias.9657:

hilariously enough it is usually the best DPS as well.

DPS rotations are boring and unnecessary. They don’t add anything fun or engaging to the gameplay. Why do you feel that having 4 (filler) skills that have to be used in a particular order to be of any use?

Synergy is more entertaining to me than sitting there having my auto attack do a rotation, and yes they have a built in rotation. It’s just less engaging.

Why do you feel pressing 1 button as opposed to 4 is more fun? Rotations like in WoW aren’t just 1234 either, it all depends on the situation you’re in what skills you use after. I don’t always have 4-5 finishers on my rogue up. It isn’t that simple, sometimes I go straight for burst and ignore increased attack speed and healing which are more for prolonged fights.

There is never a be all end all rotation that you do every time. GW2 definitely has rotations they are just hidden well. Thief: autoattack until revealed done, stealth backstab repeat. Mes: get clones up, shatter. I could go on, but you get my point. I could even go so far as to point out the amazing builds like unicorn sin that just spams 3 and autoattack, 2 buttons not counting the occasional caltrops and dodge.

Combat isn’t quite as dynamic in other MMOs but they certainly excel with skill usage and variety. Maybe if utilities weren’t on hilariously long cooldowns I wouldn’t get so bored? GW1 did it right with autoattack not being a skill, then having 8 skills to work with and you can change them out at any time in an outpost in a pool of thousands of skills.

How we went from that to this is… I don’t even know. Baffling.

Mesmers get clones up and then shatter? lol. Do you main a mesmer?

Different shatters accomplish different things. Which shatter you use, one of the four, could sell depend on the situation. In fact, there’s a lot of strategy in just when and how to bring clones up as a mesmer. And not all mesmers even use clones some, like me, perfer phantasm builds. I shatter a whole lot less than a clone mesmer.

One thing you always have to watch as a mesmer is how close your target is to death, because summoning your clones on a dying target means waiting for your recharge before casting it on the next target.

If you’re playing the profession badly you’re just calling up clones and blowing them up, mindlessly. If you’re playing the profession well, it’s a bit more involved.

I shared your initial concern coming from Rift, Wow, EQ, EQ2, etc. Where at max level you had literally 30-50 abilities to use and choose from depending on the situation.

I can say after really getting into GW2 and giving it the time it deserves the last few months, lack of abilities is NOT a problem in GW2, once you unlock your utilities and weapon swapping, you have 20+ abilities at your disposal at any given time, and most of them are actually useful and not just situational. Not to say some of them aren’t that great, but they really nailed it for skill selection in this game.

I was a skeptic at first but by level 40ish I was convinced the abilities, while simple, make for some complex situations.

No it’s not more involved, and I was using random build examples obviously.. pve is faceroll man everyone does the same rotations every time, don’t even try to deny it lol. Playing your build, all you do is get phantasms up and watch them pwn while you autoattack. I’ve played every proff and the most engaging character is the Elementalist, it’s unfortunate I don’t like caster classes because I would love for my thief to play that way.

inb4 sometimes you switch to S/S and blur frenzy.

Mathias.9657:

No it’s not more involved, and I was using random build examples obviously.. pve is faceroll man everyone does the same rotations every time, don’t even try to deny it lol. Playing your build, all you do is get phantasms up and watch them pwn while you autoattack. I’ve played every proff and the most engaging character is the Elementalist, it’s unfortunate I don’t like caster classes because I would love for my thief to play that way.

inb4 sometimes you switch to S/S and blur frenzy.

I don’t know, dungeons are part of PVe and some of that stuff isn’t quite faceroll easy.

Vayne.8563:

Mathias.9657:

No it’s not more involved, and I was using random build examples obviously.. pve is faceroll man everyone does the same rotations every time, don’t even try to deny it lol. Playing your build, all you do is get phantasms up and watch them pwn while you autoattack. I’ve played every proff and the most engaging character is the Elementalist, it’s unfortunate I don’t like caster classes because I would love for my thief to play that way.

inb4 sometimes you switch to S/S and blur frenzy.

I don’t know, dungeons are part of PVe and some of that stuff isn’t quite faceroll easy.

I will give you that one but even dungeons besides fractals are not hard with a competent group – in fact you see some decent play there, the only time I ever use my group utility. In places like CoF though it’s just zerg boss with quickness > collect loot > repeat.

I’ve been in groups where we take the slaver down in literally 7 seconds, it’s hilarious design. That is supposed to be a dungeon boss?? Youtube some dungeon speed runs for a good laugh.

Mathias.9657:

Vayne.8563:

Mathias.9657:

No it’s not more involved, and I was using random build examples obviously.. pve is faceroll man everyone does the same rotations every time, don’t even try to deny it lol. Playing your build, all you do is get phantasms up and watch them pwn while you autoattack. I’ve played every proff and the most engaging character is the Elementalist, it’s unfortunate I don’t like caster classes because I would love for my thief to play that way.

inb4 sometimes you switch to S/S and blur frenzy.

I don’t know, dungeons are part of PVe and some of that stuff isn’t quite faceroll easy.

I will give you that one but even dungeons besides fractals are not hard with a competent group – in fact you see some decent play there, the only time I ever use my group utility. In places like CoF though it’s just zerg boss with quickness > collect loot > repeat.

I’ve been in groups where we take the slaver down in literally 7 seconds, it’s hilarious design. That is supposed to be a dungeon boss?? Youtube some dungeon speed runs for a good laugh.

COF path 1 is still only 1 path of Cof. Plenty of guys still wipe in CoF path 3.

Xta.7458:

thanks for all the comments.

in wow (atleat pvp, i dont pve) u use 80%+ of your abilities
ofcurse you wont use “teleport: Orgrimar” when you are in the arena xD

Anyway, i find lots of good things in gw2, i just hope my guardian wont bored me soon..
(i’m only 16 but i feel i saw all he have to offer, and from now on, its only numbers improvements)

I would like you to post all these abilities that you use :P

I play a Guardian in Guild Wars 2, I sure can say that I use 100% of my skills, all 18 of them.

First 5 Weapon skills, the other 5 Utility Skills (That I change too according to encounters)

And also a Weapon swap with additional skills, and then my 3 Virtues.

That’s 15 skills I use 100%, which all does different things.

What skills do you use on your Hunter :P?

It’s one step closer to action rpg where you want to use the right skill/ability/power at the right time, and where movement/positioning/timing are everything.

So much better this way – in fact they could have pushed it even more… (better camera, crosshairs and targeting).

Play any dungeon outside of CoF path 1.

If you are looking for a good Melee build, try a Hammer/GS Guardian, dagger/dagger ele, or a Greatsword ranger.

Substance E.4852:

Utilities have hilariously long cool downs and your best defense is hitting the dodge-roll button at the right time.

You have to be on your toes a lot more than other similar mmo’s. But, ya, it’s not an incredibly deep game by most standards.

By deep, he means more buttons to push, more particle effects….dps is still the same though. All standing in one place.

I like the 5 skills slots per weapon. I just wish there were, say, 15 skills per weapon to choose from to put into those 5 skill slots.