Guild Wars 2

INTRODUCTION

hello everyone. Today I’m attempting to create a better system for build creation and better management of the already existing resources(and adding new ones) of every class.
(not sure if this should go in profession balance or here, i hope i made the right choice!)

This Idea came to me the other day and i made a thread about it
(you can see the original thread here: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/how-about-utilizing-base-stats/first#post3501016)
but at that point it was not completed and people did not pay much attention to it, so i though i will redo it properly this time!

Please read the whole post carefully before judging it. Comment your opinion, or your suggestion for improvement, point out mistakes and judge for yourselves if this system is actually better!
Well then lets begin!

As you have may have already noticed, guild wars 2 has become a game where variety is almost nonexistent. I’m talking about builds. Everyone is focused on damage and other builds are shunned.
1. Why is that?
2. How can we prevent it?

The answer is simple.
1. The reason why everyone is focused on damage, is because you can support yourself and do damage at the same time. This is the root of all problems.
2. You will have to read this whole thread carefully and examine the possibilities of this new system.

lets look the roles of players in a dungeon(example): (average organized group)
4 berserk warriors (direct damage focused builds)
1 berserk guardian

1.before the fight, warriors give might and fury to the group(support)
2.at the start warriors+guardian stack vulnerability on boss (conditions)(bleeding+burning)
3.warriors put banners to increase damage (strength/discipline) or to increase defense (defense/tactics) both a form of support.
4.during the fight, the guardian provides protection/condition cleansing/ aegis/healing which are all forms of support.
5.all players can support themselves with a variety of healing skills not depending much on your build

What seems off to me, is that a direct DAMAGE focused player can support other players and himself so much, while applying passive damage on top of direct damage.
What is the point of support/condition builds then? This includes all other builds that exist in the game but for the sake of convenience i use these major categories.
This is what should be changed. Builds should be able to to do what the were made for and not have all forms of playing styles.
Lets attempt to improve it!

• Lets look at a group with variety:
  2 direct damage focused players
  1 condition damage focused player
  1 support focused player
  1 profession stat focused player

This kind of group, as an organized group, would be laughable cause there is no need for something other than direct damage. BUT this can be fixed by giving roles.
If a direct/condition damage player was not able to support himself enough,
Little access to might/fury and heal and a support player was able to give might/fury and heals but lack damage himself then it these two categories would work very well together and 2 of those would surpass the ONLY damage combo as an only damage player would not be able to buff(support) himself.

NOW lets see how we can make this happen, efficiently!

STEP 1 : “re-creating” the trait system

this system is based on a new board of traits. A massive background of your character’s capabilities, Where individuality is proved useful.

The resources (points) of this board are the already existing base stats, but increased.
This new system will have a pool of 5000-7000 points waiting to be spent however you like.
It sounds huge! Well it is huge!
These points will be spent 1 by 1, 10 by 10 or directly to the line you need to reach.

The board will have each of the following lines separately:

• power/attack (major stat)
• precision (major stat)
• critical chance (minor stat)
• toughness (major stat)
• vitality (major stat)
• health points (minor stat)
• condition damage (major stat)
• condition duration (minor stat)
• boon duration (major stat)
• healing power (major stat)
• critical damage (minor stat)
• profession specific line (major stat)

4 lines per page to ease the eye.

7 TIERS per major line
3 TIERS per minor line

SOME skills and some part of weapon skills/conditions/finishers are now locked and can only be unlocked through traits
example:

• “for great justice”, gives 3 stacks might(4sec), fury is unlocked at boon duration 6th tier)
• leap finisher on weapon skills is locked and can be unlocked at healing tier 1.

the goal here is to nerf every aspect of the skills a player has, and give him the chance to unlock them through traits, thus making a 5 dps build in a dungeon unable to support themselves, through might/fury and defensive boons,
This will cause supporters to be in a powerful spot in groups as they will provide the team with the right mean to achieve their goal.
A group with 5 dps will be visibly worse than 4 dps+support.

• This is just an example, but the ultimate goal im trying to achieve, is 3-5 different very specific builds that alone would not be that good, together they synergize in such a way that the difference will be visible.

note : I will mainly use guardian/warrior to explain as they are two classes more people are familiar with (and I am also).

STAT LINE FORM

lets have a look at how every stat line will look and how you can utilize it correctly.
The following are all examples, some exagerated, some not, just to see how specialized builds can be achieved, but not, a best “can do everything” one.

Last tier will always be superior to the others with elite traits
costs 300 points, instead of 200

7 TIERS and 7 minor tiers

POWER (warrior)

minor tier 2: for great justice is now unlocked(only might)

TIER 2 : power 350 [total points spent: 400]
(possible selections of traits)

• power is increased by 1 % every time you kill while in combat
• greatsword auto attack now hits +1 target (initial targets : 1)
• hundred blades range now is increased to 130 (initial: 110)
• 5% chance to gain might (1) (5 seconds) when hit.
• signet of might now gives 120 power(initial value: 80)
  ……..
  minor tier 4:hundred blades final strike damage x1,1

TIER 4. power 700 [total points spent: 800]

• auto attack now gains 80% of weapon strength.
• gain 200 power for 5 seconds when rallying
• might now gives +5 power (initial: 25)
• bulls charge is now unlocked
• gain frenzy(4s) if you’re struck below the health threshold [40%]

minor tier 5: allies gain 100
……..

minor trait 7: damage bonus 5%, when endurance is below 50%

TIER 7 power 1250 [total points spent :1500]

• ALL damage is now increased by 7%
• You gain frenzy (1.5 sec) every time you spent your adrenaline
• you gain 150 power when wielding a mace on your off hand
• 7% of power is converted to vitality
• banner of strength now gives 210 power and 210 condition damage
• non critical hits have a damage boost of 15%

PRECISION (warrior)

minor tier 1: critical hits are unlocked

Tier 1: presicion 175 [total points spent: 200]

• all attacks have 90% chance to hit (initial: 80%)
• you gain 2% precision every time you miss a hit while in combat
• you gain 2% chance for every axe you wield
• missed hits now stack might(4 sec)
• attacks with longbow have 5% increased crit chance

minor tier 2: signets have 10% passive boost
…….
minor trait 4: longbow projectiles have now 15% chance to pierce targets

TIER 4 : precision 700[total points spent: 800]

• killshot now has 20% increased crit chance
• 10% chance to gain might(5sec) on a critical hit.
• greatsword has 4% chance increased when you have more than 50% adrenaline
• gain 5% chance when wielding a sword in your offhand
• greatsword skills have now reduced cooldown by 20%

minor trait 5: rifle shots have 7% chance to become unblockable
……

minor trait 5: unlocks critical hits on damage other than weapon damage.

TIER 7 precision 1250[total points spent 1500]

• 100% crit chance cap is now removed, you have X%(your chance above 100%) chance to hit 3x damage
• cirt hits have 30% chance to steal life(scales with healing power)
• you and your allies have 9% chance to apply vulnerability(5sec) on crits
• your allies gain 7%crit chance
• sword autoatack speed is increased by 1.1

lets have a look at some other random tiers:

CONDITION DAMAGE warrior

TIER 1 cond: 100 [total points spent 200]

• gain 0.5% cond damage boost every time you are hit for more than 10% of your life while in combat
• “on my mark” now applies 8 stacks of vulnerability(7 sec) (initial: 5 )
• might now gives +5 cond damage (initial : 25)
• increases damage to confused foes 20%

minor trait 2: unlocks bleeding conditions on melee weapon skills

BURST (brawn) warrior

minor trait 6:gain extra adrenaline on kill(12)
TIER 6 burst recharge rate 35% [total points spent 1200]

• hits now grant 1.5x adrenaline
• burst skills have damage increase while your endurance is low(damage increase 15%)
• for every level of adrenaline you gain 75 power
• your adrenaline is refilled when you rally
• vengeance has 100% chance to rally

minor trait 7:weapon swapping recharges faster (5sec)

HEALING POWER warrior

minor trait 3: healing surge is unlocked

TIER 3 healing power 300 [total points spent 525]

• all healing skills have 10% chance to heal a nearby ally for the same amount
• gain 400 healing power when you drop below the health threshold (threshold: 20%)
• you and your allies gain regeneration(5s) when your health drops below 50%(45 sec cooldown)(radius: 450)
• transfer 10% of your health to the ally with the lowest health, when you use a stance.
• burst skills have 20% chance for AOE condition removal

minor tier 4: shake it off now applies to 5 targets(initial 3)

now lets look some of the guardian lines

BOON DURATION guardian

minor tier 4: blast finishers are now unlocked

TIER 4 boon duration 25% [total points spent 700]

• all protection you apply last 15% longer
• shouts have 10% increased boon duration
• gain 5% boon duration when wielding a mace
• you and your allies gain retaliation 5 sec whenever you are struck for more than 10% of you HP (40 sec cooldown)(3 targets)
• critical hits grant might to you and your allies(10sec)

minor tier 5: shield skills have 20% reduced cooldown
………….

minor 7 tier: skills with finishers have 10% duration reduction

TIER 7 : boon duration 45% [points spent 1350]

• All boons you apply through finishers have 35% increased duration
• finishers now can trigger 2 fields
• 5 man cap is removed, the boons you apply now, are applied to 7 targets
• transfer a boon to 2 allies when you critically hit.
• blast finishers have a chance of applying a random boon(beside normal boons)(15 sec duration)

HEALTH POINTS guardian(as i thought about it this seemed kind of unnecessary but i’ gonna leave it hear until i hear your opinions)
(minor stat, only three tiers, where each of the tiers only have 2 selections )

TIER 1 : [points spent 175]

• healthpool is increased by 70%(initial: 5500)
• shelter and signet of resolve have 20% reduced cooldowns

TIER 2 : [points spent 350]

• healthpool is increased by 100%(initial: 5500)
• litany of wrath and healing breeze have 20% reduced cooldowns

TIER 3 : [points spent 550]

• healthpool is increased by 140%(initial 5500)
• base healing is increased by 20%

HEALING guardian

minor tier 5 : aegis heals on removal(scales with healing power)

TIER 5 healing: 500 [total points spent 875]

• all symbols heal allies (scales with healing power)
• gain 150 healing power when wielding a staff
• empower allies now is cast while moving
• regeneration you apply has 10% increased duration
• meditations have a chance of removing aoe condition removal
  (20% chance)

minor trait 6: shield skills have 20% more duration
……

minor trait 7: elite skills have 20% more duration

TIER 7

• gain 400 healing power while wielding Tome of courage, duration is incrased by 25% and cooldown is reduced by 15%
• all healing skills have 40% chance to heal Aoe for 20% of the amount
• when an ally falls below the threshold transfer 25% of your reaming health to him(threshold=10%, 55 sec cooldown)
• staff autoattack heals for a small amount(heal=20, scales with healing power)
• signet of mercy has 20% channeling duration reduction, 20% cooldown reduction and applies to 2 targets

CONDITION DAMAGE guardian

Tier 5

• every burn you apply is now 2nd degree(damage per tick 2.1x initial damage)
• when you apply a condition you have 20% chance to remove a boon
• allies gain 150 condition damage
• gain 250 ondition damage while below 50% health
• your allies have 1 condition on weapon attoattack unlocked (applies to 2 allies)

VIRTUES guardian

minor trait 6: virtue of resolve is applied to 1 ally (initial 1)

tier 6

• virtue of courage now is applied every 16 sec
• virtue of resolve is renewed each time you rally
• virtue of justice applies aoe burning
• when all virtues are activated gain 1 sec invulnerability

minor trait 7: virtue of justice applies 2nd degree burn

enough with the examples, lets look a bit at the requirements for this method.

FIRST there will be a huge nerf that will also not allow you to use every part of your already existing skills, that way you have to spend your points into creating a build from scratch, with already existing base points, differently distributed.

As you see there are some stats that I have included which are currently not base stats, but are increased with equipment, which in my opinion is wrong and should not be that way.

SECOND there will probably be a need for a small nerf on equipment to keep stats in balance with the existing bosses and not make bosses harder.

THIRD there needs to be an introduction of a massive variety of new skills that keep these new builds balanced and unique, as 5000 points will give you huge chances at creating your own build.

LASTLY cooperation will be a big part of the game, as not working with each other will be proved fatal. Learning your role/s will be an important part of the game, and people will have the choice of selecting the play style that is best fitting to them.!

Ultimately there is no need for massive basic changes and rework of the mechanics of the game, as long as we’re messing with numbers, so i’ll try to keep it at that, hoping im not mistaken.

I will keep this post for pros and cons, which will come up from our discussion, as i haven’t had enough time to type this out due to my excitement at showing you all!
share your opinion and comment any question you might have, I’ll clear any complicated/unclear parts of the post.

(reserved) for future use

seems like a good idea, i’d like to see it happen

bumping, I’d like some feedback, give me your opinions people!

Well I’m not going to comment on specifics as that will be up to the devlopers, but they general idea behind it is something I completely agree with.

Condition users are useless because every direct damage build also applies conditions. Support is useless because evert direct damage build also applies every boon with nearly 100% uptime in a group.

Remove conditions (both offensive and defensive) from everyone that isn’t specifically speced for it and do the same with boons and you’ve suddenly made roles important and useful.

Then make content actually challenging and have the solution be support and debuffs not MOAR DPS!!!!11! Then all of a sudden zerker is just one of many possible useful roles instead of the only role.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

Condition users are useless because every direct damage build also applies conditions. Support is useless because evert direct damage build also applies every boon with nearly 100% uptime in a group.

Remove conditions (both offensive and defensive) from everyone that isn’t specifically speced for it and do the same with boons and you’ve suddenly made roles important and useful.

Thats exacly my point!
ANET though seems to think that a crit damage nerf was needed, to fix berserker dominance
I wonder how long it will take them to realize, that damage is not the problem.

You can find a huge variety of problems who are the reason for the current meta.
One reson is summed up nicely in this post:
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/CDI-Character-Progression-Horizontal/page/61#post3491959

Well. I read your whole idea and … I think I’m actually liking it. Some parts do seem a little problematic to me:

• Power stacking… well it is still possible that a player will simply stack all his points in power/precision. All the buffs you provide would make him beyond strong, stronger than the zerk warrior we see today. Would that mean he loses his healing skill? Can he then equip an utility in place of the heal?
• Variety… seems something which will be restricted by making skills dependent on points spent.

All in all it’s a nice try, but it would involve a mass of work to redo the traits, and won’t mean a fix necessarily. Zerk warrior would most probably still be the best because he gets all the damage and support isn’t really needed in a dungeon, whatever you change in traits.

If you delete dodging, conditions, healing skills and every form of support from zerk warrior… what did you just do? You went back to the trinity. I don’t think the trinity is bad, but it isn’t a fix.

Sirendor.1394:

Well. I read your whole idea and … I think I’m actually liking it. Some parts do seem a little problematic to me:

• Power stacking… well it is still possible that a player will simply stack all his points in power/precision. All the buffs you provide would make him beyond strong, stronger than the zerk warrior we see today. Would that mean he loses his healing skill? Can he then equip an utility in place of the heal?
• Variety… seems something which will be restricted by making skills dependent on points spent.

All in all it’s a nice try, but it would involve a mass of work to redo the traits, and won’t mean a fix necessarily. Zerk warrior would most probably still be the best because he gets all the damage and support isn’t really needed in a dungeon, whatever you change in traits.

If you delete dodging, conditions, healing skills and every form of support from zerk warrior… what did you just do? You went back to the trinity. I don’t think the trinity is bad, but it isn’t a fix.

1. ALL these examples, are something i came up with on the spot, by no means meant to be actual traits. Those would need serious work and examination before perfection.

2. Even if someone stacks all of his points at power/precision, there is still a cap, preventing you from using them all at 1 or 2 stats.
BUT making such a specific build would mean that you need support from another player to survive and do damage, cause dead zerker=0 dmg.

3. healing skills and all forms of support will not be removed completely, just severely nerfed through trait system ONLY in very specific builds.

bonus:
-lets say we have:
5 zerkers (specific build)
5 organized group with 3 direct damage/1 cond damage/ 1 support

-if a berserker can do 1 damage unbuffed(he cannot apply buffs to himself to make any difference , if build is very specific) then the first group will do 5 total damage
-if a berserker can do 1.25 damage buffed / a condition can do 1.15 but unlock conditions(vulnerability etc) in party members giving a total boost of 0.5 damage in all party
and a support(while providing team with buffs, might/fury etc) can do 0.7 buffed then the total damage in the group is 6.2
meaning that a group with one kind of specific builds(5 berserk) is inferior at damage to a combinations of different specific builds.
Thats the goal here, since damage will always be the ultimate goal

4. Also i don’t think that support is not needed at dungeons, when you take away most of the support in damage builds there will be natural need for that.

Lastly i repeat: you don’t delete/remove completely support from damage and vice verca, but you massively nerf it and make it attainable from traits.
In that way you control high damage builds easily, while providing variety in organized/pug groups.

Alright that’s a lot clearer now to me.
It might work, but still would require a mkitten of work.
Kudos for the post though!