Please don't nerf anything else
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OP, here’s the thing: The idea concept was sound. 400 hero points to unlock an elite specialization with hero point challenges in Heart of Maguuma providing 10 per completion sounds about right. People who were psyched up about HoT and went ahead and got map completion in Pact Tyria would only have to complete 19 HP challenges to unlock their specialization. That’s about 1.5 Heart of Maguuma maps worth. That’s reasonable.
Until you realize that the Heart of Maguuma HP challenges aren’t the same as the Pact Tyria HP challenges in terms of accessibility.
In Pact Tyria, any character could solo accomplish any of the HP challenges without much difficulty in under a couple of minutes. In Heart of Maguuma, half the HP challenges are gated in some form or another by masteries and the other half are Champion boss fights with a 5 minute time limit. This means a character can’t just go to all the hero points and complete them solo to unlock their specialization before experiencing the new content. They have to experience the new content first in order to earn the experience for the masteries, or they have to acquire some help from others in order to defeat the champions within the allotted 5 minutes and not everyone wants to wait around doing nothing at a champ HP for more players to show up.
So, on paper, Anet’s original reasoning for elite specializations costing 400 points sounded good. But once it was implemented with the difficulty and accessibility they wanted the hero challenges to have, it was no longer balanced properly for a fun experience.
I don’t agree with you, OP. I want my legendaries the moment I buy and log into the game. All of them. I also want to have 999,999 gold on every character. Why bother grinding all that stuff? This isn’t Grind Wars 2… Just give that to us ANET.
Why would you take the time to post such nonsense?
Comparing the majority of the community’s sentiment about lowering the HP cost of Elite Specializations to them demanding, or even wanting, legendaries, in any number, and an astronomical amount of gold is… the only word that comes to mind is stupid.
Making such a ridiculous post doesn’t come across funny, sarcastic or even satirical, but it does speaks volumes about immaturity, dysfunctional sense of humor and the complete ignorance of the aforementioned. Zero contribution to the topic, the original post, the ensuing discussion or anything else meaningful.
Maybe if you didn’t try so hard… you wouldn’t have to.
Just some food for thought.
The most try hard post of the thread. Well done! Glad you got so bent out of shape on someone on a video game thread. Speaks volumes about immaturity, dysfunctional sense of humor and the complete ignorance of the aforementioned. Zero contribution to the topic, the original post, the ensuing discussion or anything else meaningful.
;)
It’s simple really. What if you were one of the first players to get an eighty and they patched the game so it only takes 65% of the XP. You would be ticked too.
Those are hours they won’t get back. The content that was difficult to do because they only had a few of the elite traits and skills are now easier for everyone thus lessening their achievement even more.
Sure it’s great for the rest of us, especially for those of us that map completed core Tyria as it’s not 79% fewer HoT HPCs to unlock it all, as oppose to 38% fewer for those who never did an HPC in core Tyria.
We are heroes. This is what we do!
RIP City of Heroes
RIP City of Heroes
What do you mean “they got nerfed in half”? You mean they only require 250 points now? Ah so you’re annoyed that you spent all your hero points on the elite spec then the cost was reduced so you decided to create a topic to complain about it? The thing is a lot of people really wanted to play the spec however they did not have the hours or the effort/will to go explore every hero point to earn the spec so this reduction to 250 hero points is completely justified and has no negative effects or down sides. No one is harmed, people are happy and get to play/try their new specs. Please show me where the negativity in that change is.
I really don’t have the time to craft a legendary, does that mean A-net should make legendaries easier to get for people like me?
NSPride <3
OP, here’s the thing: The idea concept was sound. 400 hero points to unlock an elite specialization with hero point challenges in Heart of Maguuma providing 10 per completion sounds about right. People who were psyched up about HoT and went ahead and got map completion in Pact Tyria would only have to complete 19 HP challenges to unlock their specialization. That’s about 1.5 Heart of Maguuma maps worth. That’s reasonable.
Until you realize that the Heart of Maguuma HP challenges aren’t the same as the Pact Tyria HP challenges in terms of accessibility.
In Pact Tyria, any character could solo accomplish any of the HP challenges without much difficulty in under a couple of minutes. In Heart of Maguuma, half the HP challenges are gated in some form or another by masteries and the other half are Champion boss fights with a 5 minute time limit. This means a character can’t just go to all the hero points and complete them solo to unlock their specialization before experiencing the new content. They have to experience the new content first in order to earn the experience for the masteries, or they have to acquire some help from others in order to defeat the champions within the allotted 5 minutes and not everyone wants to wait around doing nothing at a champ HP for more players to show up.
So, on paper, Anet’s original reasoning for elite specializations costing 400 points sounded good. But once it was implemented with the difficulty and accessibility they wanted the hero challenges to have, it was no longer balanced properly for a fun experience.
Funny how you are saying hero challenges should be soloable and only take a couple minutes.
I don’t know what your definition of challenge is, but that is not mine.
NSPride <3
I actually agree with OP and I am also dissapointed about the change. I still haven’t fully unlocked any E-Spec, but every time I went on, I was looking forward to work towards it. Some actually like to work towards something in games and not get everything shoved up their kitten. Those people have a right to express their discontent about the change.
I honestly don’t give a crap about “first blabla” or anything like that. The whole thing just reminds me of a spoiled child that wants something from their parents and wont stop crying until they give in.
So there was a time when the word grind was used to describe countless hours of farming mobs to get rep of a faction up or farming countless mobs to get some materials for hours or days
Now it seems playing the actual new content to achieve something is considered grind as well. I really ask myself why some people play a game at all.
Funny how you are saying hero challenges should be soloable and only take a couple minutes.
I don’t know what your definition of challenge is, but that is not mine.
I’m not saying that at all. I’m saying the ones in Pact Tyria were that way. Not that they should be that way.
I’m saying that the developers balanced the 400 point cost for the elite spec on the assumption HP challenges in HoT would be equally accessible as the ones in Pact Tyria, when that isn’t the case. This assumption made the cost unbalanced when HoT challenges are gated in their implementation.
When they announced 400 hero points for the elite specs I thought “Ah, a challenge”, especially as I have a character of every class.
Now that challenge has been stolen by whiners – the very same whiners that will be complaining that they have nothing left to do in a week’s time…..You would have thought Anet would have learned by now – a bunch of vocal whiners complain about something new being too hard so Anet make it easier and then those very same whiners complain they have nothing left to do because it was too easy.
It has happened every time Anet have released new content and will carry on happening until Anet say “Hey you keep saying you wanted challenges”.
LOL. The challenge was not stolen from you or anyone else. You are free to farm every single hero point in the expansion and all of Tyria, what you don’t seem to get, is that if you have to do all that before getting the elite specialization…. exactly what are you going to do with those elite specializations afterwards, rerun the content again and pretend you don’t remember it?
Run the new and improved watered down fractals ?
Stand in Lion’s Arch and flex your kitten at everyone and show off your flashy new elite spec gear and ask them if they’re jelly?
Seriously though, alot of people were hoping to experience the new content with the new elite specs, lowering the HP requirement makes that more possible by balancing the progression of the elite specs with the players progression through the content.
Not everyone wants to grind HP to the point of annoyance, I get it, but to be totally honest, I had about 300 HP on most of my characters already before HoT launched, and mostly before it was even announced. Prior to the nerf of skill point scrolls and their conversion to to spirit shards, those scrolls were as plentiful as mirrors in the Kardashian household, and we had to use them purchase things required for legendaries and other epic items . I, like most others that wanted such things did lots of farming for loot… and had many stacks of said scrolls.
I have several thousand spirit shards because of that conversion… but I also have lots of toons with hundreds of Skill Points/Hero Points, so 250 or 400 doesn’t really make much of a difference to me, to be honest. Are you going to infer that I stole the challenge from you also?
There are plenty of challenges and journeys available in GW2, and many more added with Heart of Thorns, Legendary Armor, new Legendary Weapons as well as Legendary Back Items not to mention the many, many millions of XP you will have to grind to complete the all of the Mastery tiers.
The only thing that was “stolen” was maybe your ability to tell people who are having difficulty completing elite specs, smuggly, that you finished yours the first week and inferring that you are better and more “hardcore” then those “whiners” because of it.
If you play Guild Wars 2 to try and rub your ingame accomplishments in the face of others, or feel that proving you can out grind or commit more time to playing then other people with less time to play, or patience for tedium, that’s your right, but it doesn’t make it any less laughable or silly.
Personally I think the fact that Raids went from “a major feature of the HoT expansion” to " the first leg will be included at launch" to " Raids will be released at a later date" is a topic much more worthy of complaints and would certainly provide justification for feeling like something has been “stolen” from the Heart of Thorns experience, but things like this happen, and Anet most likely felt that the raid content was not quite ready for release, and apposed to releasing such a MAJOR facet of the game in sub par par state, they decided to take a little more time to get them right.
Anyway, just keep playing and doing your thing, enjoy YOUR experience with the new content, try not to let it be ruined stressing over trivial things like being mad that someone less elite then you will be able to unlock their elite specs before you have a chance to rub thier nose in your eliteness.
Just remember, a bad, a noob or a casual driving a reaper… is still just a bad, a noob or a casual driving a reaper. Hang out in PVP and roflstomp them if you feel the need to show people how awesome you are or grind out that legendary armor and stand around in Lion’s Arch and answer questions about how hard it was, and how much faster you were able to get it done then all the noobs and casuals as you bathe in their admiration and jealousy, but for kittensake don’t get mad because they are able to play their elite specs with a few less hours of grinding then you were 4 days after launch.
OP, here’s the thing: The idea concept was sound. 400 hero points to unlock an elite specialization with hero point challenges in Heart of Maguuma providing 10 per completion sounds about right. People who were psyched up about HoT and went ahead and got map completion in Pact Tyria would only have to complete 19 HP challenges to unlock their specialization. That’s about 1.5 Heart of Maguuma maps worth. That’s reasonable.
Until you realize that the Heart of Maguuma HP challenges aren’t the same as the Pact Tyria HP challenges in terms of accessibility.
In Pact Tyria, any character could solo accomplish any of the HP challenges without much difficulty in under a couple of minutes. In Heart of Maguuma, half the HP challenges are gated in some form or another by masteries and the other half are Champion boss fights with a 5 minute time limit. This means a character can’t just go to all the hero points and complete them solo to unlock their specialization before experiencing the new content. They have to experience the new content first in order to earn the experience for the masteries, or they have to acquire some help from others in order to defeat the champions within the allotted 5 minutes and not everyone wants to wait around doing nothing at a champ HP for more players to show up.
So, on paper, Anet’s original reasoning for elite specializations costing 400 points sounded good. But once it was implemented with the difficulty and accessibility they wanted the hero challenges to have, it was no longer balanced properly for a fun experience.
Funny how you are saying hero challenges should be soloable and only take a couple minutes.
I don’t know what your definition of challenge is, but that is not mine.
I didn’t see where he said that at all, why are you making up reasons to be kitten-hurt?
Funny how you are saying hero challenges should be soloable and only take a couple minutes.
I don’t know what your definition of challenge is, but that is not mine.
I’m not saying that at all. I’m saying the ones in Pact Tyria were that way. Not that they should be that way.
I’m saying that the developers balanced the 400 point cost for the elite spec on the assumption HP challenges in HoT would be equally accessible as the ones in Pact Tyria, when that isn’t the case. This assumption made the cost unbalanced when HoT challenges are gated in their implementation.
It is an assumption that the "developers balanced the 400 point cost for the elite spec on the assumption HP challenges in HoT would be equally accessible as the ones in Pact Tyria. "You can not know that for sure. By all means, it is logical that they knew they would not be as accessible, and therefore made each worth 10.
NSPride <3
When did Arenanet ever explicitly state that GW2 specifically targets casuals? Show me this so I can finally stop being confused.
I have 15 characters with 200 heropoints from tyria, I am glad I now only need 5 challenges and I might actually be soloing them…
I have doen a few heropoints yesterday… stood waiting… asked for help in LFG whcih appeared in 10-15 minutes, then killed the champ on the skillpoint and moved on….
I unlocked the better part of my reaper this way…. I had only 50 (60?) more HP to go for the last 2 shouts… but have seen the reaper in actionn a little
On the one side this wil save me a LOT of work, on the other side…. I do not care really if I unlocked them in 1 map or 4 maps….
23 lvl 80’s, 9 times map, 4ele, 4ncr, 3war, 3grd, 3rgr, 2thf, 2msm, 1eng, 1 rev.
Been There, Done That & Will do it again…except maybe world completion.
Been There, Done That & Will do it again…except maybe world completion.
So there was a time when the word grind was used to describe countless hours of farming mobs to get rep of a faction up or farming countless mobs to get some materials for hours or days
Now it seems playing the actual new content to achieve something is considered grind as well. I really ask myself why some people play a game at all.
Truer words have never been spoken
I agree.
It’s funny how people wanted PvE that “Didn’t Suck”, “Wasn’t Trivial” ….The moment we got that the backlash was so massive that anet catered to it.
Kinda saddening really.
I hope the raid team has more of a tougher stance to nerfing content than the team who made this rushed decision.
People =/= a small amount of players that live on the forums
The real people, the ones playing the game and don’t visit the forums every day, might surprise you are quite casual and numerous, they also have the right to play the game as much as you do
Some people that wanted bragging rights about being the first to have the herald, etc. are now apparently upset…
Don’t understand it but there it is.
I’m positive i was one of the first people who got Herald, (grinded it out ith my guildies helping me on the first day) and i’m stil really happy about this change, now i don’t have to worry about having to do all that stuff again on my alts (9 of em left!) and i already did it for my Reaper too!.
See, i can still brag even though the points are reduced!
(This was a joke post btw)
Some people that wanted bragging rights about being the first to have the herald, etc. are now apparently upset…
Don’t understand it but there it is.
I’m positive i was one of the first people who got Herald, (grinded it out ith my guildies helping me on the first day) and i’m stil really happy about this change, now i don’t have to worry about having to do all that stuff again on my alts (9 of em left!) and i already did it for my Reaper too!.
See, i can still brag even though the points are reduced!
(This was a joke post btw)
I don’t think she understands people don’t actually care about that kind of stuff.
This is a band-aid solution.
By reducing the full elite unlock to 250, some characters will be eventually stockpiling a quite big amount of hero points, so when (if) another elite spec is released in the (probably distant) future, developers might find themselves with some nasty problem.
If there are new zones/content involved, they’ll have to either make the new hero challenges to provide a ridiculously high amount of points (sort of what we have right now in HoT) or introduce a specific new type of hero points (which probably should have been the case).
If, on the other hand, elites are designed so they consume the excess of available hero points, players will complain again about the grind (of old content in this case, whihc is probably even worse).
Eventually, they will probably have to overhaul the system, again.
The 400 Hero Points weren’t the problem, the dumbed down and absolutely terrible skill/trait unlocking system is.
If there’s a finite amount of Hero Points with no other purpose but unlocking traits and utility skills, it would make total sense for a fully unlocked character to require most if not all of them (specially after providing an alternative unlock method for WvW players).
A complete character build, however, uses only a small subset of traits/utilities so, if it were possible to make selective purchases with the hero points, just a small subset of them would be needed to run most of the xpac content with a perfectly viable elite spec.
Any small tweak to that initial build would require just a few hero points and probably would not feel grindy at all.
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