Guild Wars 2

Heibi.4251:

Malediktus.3740:

Heibi.4251:

Malediktus.3740:

Yes uncapping would affect us. It would devalue achievement skins, devalue permanent achievements even more and make leaderboard about who can log in the most consecutive days again.

There is no actual value to the skins. You can’t sell them. Legendaries, by your definition are devalued now that any one can make a precursor and don’t have to rely on a infinitesimal drop.

At this point it is not even worth discussing with you anymore. Rarity and demand makes value. Value does not have to mean gold. Since you are after these skins they are obviously valuable to you, too.

So your true motivation was you don’t want anyone else to catch up, which goes against ANeT’s stated reason for the cap in the first place. Which of course with the current cap policy no one will.

You would not catch up with me with infinite daily AP, too. I have the ability to play every day and backup plans for broken computer or internet outages.
So you could only hope for me to quit the game or become very ill.

Heibi.4251:

Naysayers: What’s wrong with having a poll? Are you afraid of the outcome?

Yes actually. The vast majority of player don’t understand kitten about game design. The WvW polls a cop out where players frequently vote for things that actively make the game worse because A ) they don’t understand game design and/or B ) they are just selfishly and shortsightedly chasing short term rewards (much like you are right now).

Have you ever played a game without a level cap? They’re absolute garbage because the only players who can achieve anything or be competitive are the ones who have been around since launch and play nearly 24/7. The daily achievement system cap exists for the same reason level caps do. If they remove the cap the oldest players will forever have a huge insurmountable advantage on new players. Hell it already takes nearly 5 years to hit the cap with the current system. Honestly daily/monthly achievements should never have rewarded achievement points in the first place and only were made that way to create a thinly veiled Skinner-box scheme. The cap is just the best band-aid fix they could put on top of that without taking rewards away from players who had already earned them. You call people who want to keep the cap elitist completely unaware of the irony that since removing the cap would only screw over new players you sir are the one being the elitist kitten.

TL,DR You don’t know kitten about game design and infinitely moving goal posts are bad.

Still no response to my counter suggestion? As it is a middle ground between removing the cap and keeping the cap.

I think it’s fine as is.

Heibi.4251:

Naysayers: What’s wrong with having a poll? Are you afraid of the outcome?

Yes. There is a reason why there is no true democracy in the world. The majority of people has no foresight, just hindsight, is shortsighted, selfish (even altruism has selfish reasons) and is easily manipulateable. So I am worried about any kind of poll/election. It is best to let Anet decide what to do, it is their game and they are professional game designers, so chances are they know better than the majority of players.

Remove the cap or remove daily achievement points and get rid of the achievement point leaderboard. That board really doesn’t show much. Achievement points are not really a competition because there are so many points players that were not around from day one can’t get anymore, so there is no reason to keep it. I don’t think most players even look at it or even care so they might as well just junk it.

JustTrogdor.7892:

Remove the cap or remove daily achievement points and get rid of the achievement point leaderboard. That board really doesn’t show much. Achievement points are not a competition so there is no reason to keep it. I don’t think most players even look at it or even care so they might as well just junk it.

The achievement leaderboard shows a lot more than you think. And again as said earlier Anet never said the AP cannot be played as a competition. The AP are visible to everyone and there is a leaderboard.
So I say it is the otherway around: AP are not a reward track, AP reward chests got only added because people complained about AP not being rewarding
And a lot of people look at the leaderboard, because when I join pug groups there are almost always people who recognize me and know my leaderboard ranking.

Malediktus.3740:

The achievement leaderboard shows a lot more than you think. And again as said earlier Anet never said the AP cannot be played as a competition.

People who were not around since the start can never catch up, so yes it isn’t a competition. There are so many points for LS1 for example that anyone that missed it can’t achieve. The achievement point leaderboard is a measure of nothing because no one can catch up unless they were there for every single opportunity from the start.

Maybe remove all the achievement points that are no longer obtainable from everyone as well as the daily and monthly and make the leaderboard a true competition.

I do not care about the leader board. I will never be close to the top.

However, I do like seeing my achievements points increase as I play the game. I also like getting the armor skins that can not be got by any other way.

If they do not increase the max, I will still play, but not as much.

Anet needs to decide what is best for the entire player base.

I can only speak for myself, but as I log in less and less, I may find myself playing another game.

JustTrogdor.7892:

Malediktus.3740:

The achievement leaderboard shows a lot more than you think. And again as said earlier Anet never said the AP cannot be played as a competition.

People who were not around since the start can never catch up, so yes it isn’t a competition. There are so many points for LS1 for example that anyone that missed it can’t achieve. The achievement point leaderboard is a measure of nothing because no one can catch up unless they were there for every single opportunity from the start.

Maybe remove all the achievement points that are no longer obtainable from everyone as well as the daily and monthly and make the leaderboard a true competition.

It wouldnt be a competition in your definition then either because everyone in the front page of the leaderboard would be tied.
I guess that is what you want, maximum rewards for minimum efforts and everyone be the same.

Not to mention a lot of historical achievements were more difficult than existing achievements. Especially for stuff like reaching legendary in specific seasons, 5 AP for many hours of effort. But also many others such as the marionette achievements or aetherblade dungeon achievements

Seera.5916:

Still no response to my counter suggestion? As it is a middle ground between removing the cap and keeping the cap.

I’ll respond, it actually sounds quite good. You suggested dailies can be 45% of the players total AP. If they keep the 15 000 cap that you can reach doing dailies but have it that after 15 000 you need permanent achievements to get dailiy AP. So if your daily achievement count is 15 000 and your permanent is <18 333 then the daily achievements won’t award AP. If the permanent is >18 333 they can get AP for doing dailies.
I see it as a fair enough compromise, elitists wouldn’t be too annoyed with that as any player that has passed the daily cap would need to work to get daily AP.

For the original post, only making it available to those who have hit the cap. If people who haven’t reached it yet keep playing then the result will effect them at some point. I’m still a long way from reaching the cap. If I keep playing eventually I will. If they do the poll I thing a player who has just bought the game(maybe should be directed to a brief explanation about AP beforehand) should be just as entitled to vote as those at the cap.

The whole question of this thread is not if you agree with the cap or not, it’s about asking ANeT to create a poll to end the subject once and for all. Then, if the poll fails to get rid of the cap, the naysayers can cheer and know that no one will ever get the skins they have.

So make suggestions on how the poll might be worded and lets get ANeT to implement the poll.

Heibi.4251:

The whole question of this thread is not if you agree with the cap or not, it’s about asking ANeT to create a poll to end the subject once and for all. Then, if the poll fails to get rid of the cap, the naysayers can cheer and know that no one will ever get the skins they have.

So make suggestions on how the poll might be worded and lets get ANeT to implement the poll.

If it is to end the subject once and for all then every player should be allowed to vote, not just those who have already reached the cap. Probably with every passing day a new player reaches it, if the poll is held now then every player that does reach it after the closing date will not have had their chance to make their voice heard.

Malediktus.3740:

JustTrogdor.7892:

Malediktus.3740:

The achievement leaderboard shows a lot more than you think. And again as said earlier Anet never said the AP cannot be played as a competition.

People who were not around since the start can never catch up, so yes it isn’t a competition. There are so many points for LS1 for example that anyone that missed it can’t achieve. The achievement point leaderboard is a measure of nothing because no one can catch up unless they were there for every single opportunity from the start.

Maybe remove all the achievement points that are no longer obtainable from everyone as well as the daily and monthly and make the leaderboard a true competition.

It wouldnt be a competition in your definition then either because everyone in the front page of the leaderboard would be tied.
I guess that is what you want, maximum rewards for minimum efforts and everyone be the same.

Not to mention a lot of historical achievements were more difficult than existing achievements. Especially for stuff like reaching legendary in specific seasons, 5 AP for many hours of effort. But also many others such as the marionette achievements or aetherblade dungeon achievements

Ahh but see say someone started playing in say November 2013, they can never catch up even if they play 18 hours a day because so many points are no longer obtainable.

I didn’t say anything about being rewarded so I’m not sure where you got that from. I’m simply stating that the leaderboard is not something that can be a competition because there are historical points no longer available even if they were difficult to obtain. Players that were not there at the time and maybe up for say your legendary challenge can’t get to compete because it isn’t available to them.

So I say remove all historical achievement points that can no longer be earned from players as well as the daily achievement points. Seems fair to me if they want to make the leaderboard mean something. Otherwise just scrap the leaderboard because it is only a measure at the top of players that were there for temporary achievements and doesn’t invite competition from newer players.

Heibi.4251:

The whole question of this thread is not if you agree with the cap or not, it’s about asking ANeT to create a poll to end the subject once and for all. Then, if the poll fails to get rid of the cap, the naysayers can cheer and know that no one will ever get the skins they have.

So make suggestions on how the poll might be worded and lets get ANeT to implement the poll.

A poll will never end the subject once and for all. Only a small subset of players will even do the poll so whatever the solution is can’t be deemed as what the majority of actual players want. So any solution brought by the poll would still meet with players saying they want a change. And posts will still be posted on the matter.

The best way is to discuss possible solutions and help ANet discover a solution that may work better for more players than their current one.

JustTrogdor.7892:

Malediktus.3740:

JustTrogdor.7892:

Malediktus.3740:

The achievement leaderboard shows a lot more than you think. And again as said earlier Anet never said the AP cannot be played as a competition.

People who were not around since the start can never catch up, so yes it isn’t a competition. There are so many points for LS1 for example that anyone that missed it can’t achieve. The achievement point leaderboard is a measure of nothing because no one can catch up unless they were there for every single opportunity from the start.

Maybe remove all the achievement points that are no longer obtainable from everyone as well as the daily and monthly and make the leaderboard a true competition.

It wouldnt be a competition in your definition then either because everyone in the front page of the leaderboard would be tied.
I guess that is what you want, maximum rewards for minimum efforts and everyone be the same.

Not to mention a lot of historical achievements were more difficult than existing achievements. Especially for stuff like reaching legendary in specific seasons, 5 AP for many hours of effort. But also many others such as the marionette achievements or aetherblade dungeon achievements

Ahh but see say someone started playing in say November 2013, they can never catch up even if they play 18 hours a day because so many points are no longer obtainable.

I didn’t say anything about being rewarded so I’m not sure where you got that from. I’m simply stating that the leaderboard is not something that can be a competition because there are historical points no longer available even if they were difficult to obtain. Players that were not there at the time and maybe up for say your legendary challenge can’t get to compete because it isn’t available to them.

So I say remove all historical achievement points that can no longer be earned from players as well as the daily achievement points. Seems fair to me if they want to make the leaderboard mean something. Otherwise just scrap the leaderboard because it is only a measure at the top of players that were there for temporary achievements and doesn’t invite competition from newer players.

It is their own fault (or bad luck if they were too young) if they started playing the game late. Now they have to wait for the early players to quit hunting AP if they want to compete at the very top. Otherwise top 1000 is possible without historic AP. It is only fair that people who played since release and played historical content have an advantage in every aspect.

Malediktus.3740:

JustTrogdor.7892:

Malediktus.3740:

The achievement leaderboard shows a lot more than you think. And again as said earlier Anet never said the AP cannot be played as a competition.

People who were not around since the start can never catch up, so yes it isn’t a competition. There are so many points for LS1 for example that anyone that missed it can’t achieve. The achievement point leaderboard is a measure of nothing because no one can catch up unless they were there for every single opportunity from the start.

Maybe remove all the achievement points that are no longer obtainable from everyone as well as the daily and monthly and make the leaderboard a true competition.

It wouldnt be a competition in your definition then either because everyone in the front page of the leaderboard would be tied.
I guess that is what you want, maximum rewards for minimum efforts and everyone be the same.

That tired straw man again? What a bore.

Leaderboards don’t want competition. They want Special Snowflake status to justify inflated play time. If it’s not a competition, why does a leaderboard exist? If the leaderboard is useless, delete it. If the leaderboard should exist, then perhaps it needs to be purged monthly and old AP banked to prevent being a part of it. That would spur some real competition.

Frankly it doesn’t matter what I want. Anet needs to figure out what way will keep more players playing.

Will a poll do that?……maybe.

If not a poll…how else do you determine.

Rauderi.8706:

Malediktus.3740:

JustTrogdor.7892:

Malediktus.3740:

The achievement leaderboard shows a lot more than you think. And again as said earlier Anet never said the AP cannot be played as a competition.

People who were not around since the start can never catch up, so yes it isn’t a competition. There are so many points for LS1 for example that anyone that missed it can’t achieve. The achievement point leaderboard is a measure of nothing because no one can catch up unless they were there for every single opportunity from the start.

Maybe remove all the achievement points that are no longer obtainable from everyone as well as the daily and monthly and make the leaderboard a true competition.

It wouldnt be a competition in your definition then either because everyone in the front page of the leaderboard would be tied.
I guess that is what you want, maximum rewards for minimum efforts and everyone be the same.

That tired straw man again? What a bore.

Leaderboards don’t want competition. They want Special Snowflake status to justify inflated play time. If it’s not a competition, why does a leaderboard exist? If the leaderboard is useless, delete it. If the leaderboard should exist, then perhaps it needs to be purged monthly and old AP banked to prevent being a part of it. That would spur some real competition.

That tired straw man again? What a bore.
The leaderboards would have more competition if Anet would add more achievements (both skill requirement and grind requirement) that it becomes humanely impossible to do everything. Otherwise as I said earlier everyone who competes at the top will be tied if you remove historical AP. There are only a handful of permanent achievements which prevent you from completing all permanent achievements in a few month to a year, especially if you open your wallet and trade gems to gold.
Sadly the reality is different. Anet is so slow at adding new achievements that many top players only miss historical achievements, 250k kills in WvW and 5k/10k wins in pvp.
I view the leaderboard as an iron man of GW2 and not a 100m race. It shows who has the most dedication and endurance to complete as many things as possible since release of the game. As people give up / quit more people who missed a greater amount of historical achievements will enter the top.

Tom.6478:

Frankly it doesn’t matter what I want. Anet needs to figure out what way will keep more players playing.

Will a poll do that?……maybe.

If not a poll…how else do you determine.

A player poll in the forums/reddit isn’t really going to get a sample useful enough for decision making. It’ll get maybe 200 responses.

But, posing the question to players via an in-game vector would expose the problem and cause unrest (and more accusations of “zomg is this beta”), so I don’t see ANet actually getting any viable feedback from the players. And thus, nothing will be done. Get used to that 15k cap!
(I mean, I already have, so it’s no big deal, and I’m not even maxed out yet.)

Malediktus.3740

The leaderboards would have more competition if Anet would add more achievements (both skill requirement and grind requirement) that it becomes humanely impossible to do everything. Otherwise as I said earlier everyone who competes at the top will be tied if you remove historical AP. There are only a handful of permanent achievements which prevent you from completing all permanent achievements in a few month to a year, especially if you open your wallet and trade gems to gold.
Sadly the reality is different. Anet is so slow at adding new achievements that many top players only miss historical achievements, 250k kills in WvW and 5k/10k wins in pvp.
I view the leaderboard as an iron man of GW2 and not a 100m race. It shows who has the most dedication and endurance to complete as many things as possible since release of the game. As people give up / quit more people who missed a greater amount of historical achievements will enter the top.

So, it’s still a convoluted way of “too bad, so sad, I didn’t want competition anyway.” Can’t have too many people threatening the fragile ego.

But if it is a competition/race of some kind, then it is meaningless without a level playing field. Hence, unattainable AP needs to be filtered out, or, the better solution, the leaderboards dismantled. Then there won’t be anything in there to complain about, especially when doing dailies was so, so hard before the 3/day;10AP change.

Or, is someone afraid to do the dedicated work of doing dailies every day if the cap gets removed?

OP, I feel you. I’ve been dedicated to this game since the release, I’ve spent tons of money on it and one thing I always wanted (once I discovered the Hellfire armor set was earned through daily achievements) was to get that armor. I just recently hit the daily cap and my heart sunk. I was already playing less and less of this game, but now another incentive has been removed for me to log in.

TBH, I’m fed up of us veterans being penalised for sticking around and supporting the game. I know lot of people think that we Vets don’t spend money on the game, but I do, I regularly buy gems to support the development of this game and I’m sick and tired of constant gatings and barriers being thrown into the game just to stifle our progress.

At this point, with the daily cap in place, I see no way of getting my hellfire set, ever and that has basically given me even less reason to log in. Just b/c some 1 complained they could not control themselves in the past, why should I be penalised for it? Especially some 1 who has been dedicated to the game and supported it since its launch.

So my view on this is, remove the cap, no more caps, gating etc. enough is enough.

I like the cap. It incentivizes people to look elsewhere for points. I’ve been doing it for months and I’ve done things I haven’t really thought I’d obtain. Finishing my Story Achievements, Slayer/weaponmaster, and some collections, along with the Current Events I hadn’t done. Shortly I’ll finish Emperor and evetually get the raid ones i don’t have. I never would have gone for those if I gained a steady 10 per day until the end of time. I’m not trying to rank high on the leaderboard, I’m not even on it, I just figure it’s about time I get more as a result of the cap.

I don’t care at all about the leaderboard or anyone else’s place on it. I don’t respect (or disrespect) any player because of their AP (what a silly concept). What I want is to be making steady, reasonable daily progess towards each next chest. Because after all, that’s the point of getting AP. It’s reaching the next chest or the next title. If ANet doesn’t give the AP points that allow this, (and they don’t. They’ve been miserly on event AP) then after you reach cap the chests are extremely far between. 10 points a day plus the content points was very reasonable progress, but then ANet decided to favor the completionists who begged for ANet to control them since they couldn’t control themselves. In doing so they affected all the players who can control themselves.

But after the 15k cap was put in the game the dailies were changed to 10 points max. And this max means that the 15k cap is pointless as the dailies themselves are now capped so that completionists have the cap there to keep them from needing to do all dailies.

I think ANet needs to reconsider the 15k cap. The reason it was put in has been removed with the 10 AP daily max and they should also consider that it’s affecting most strongly those who have been the longest, and I could argue, the most loyal players. And maybe a cap that affects your most loyal players isn’t what is good for the game.

mtpelion.4562:

They should never have given AP for dailies in the first place. Keep the cap, as that puts an eventual end to their mistake.

Agreed, the way I love these achievements is when they put exclusive rewards behind either time-consuming or challenging achievements (like Sentient Aberration and Anomaly even though you can just refer to sites like Dulfy) instead of this flawed AP system.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

I don’t care at all about the leaderboard or anyone else’s place on it. I don’t respect (or disrespect) any player because of their AP (what a silly concept). What I want is to be making steady, reasonable daily progess towards each next chest. Because after all, that’s the point of getting AP. It’s reaching the next chest or the next title. If ANet doesn’t give the AP points that allow this, (and they don’t. They’ve been miserly on event AP) then after you reach cap the chests are extremely far between. 10 points a day plus the content points was very reasonable progress, but then ANet decided to favor the completionists who begged for ANet to control them since they couldn’t control themselves. In doing so they affected all the players who can control themselves.

But after the 15k cap was put in the game the dailies were changed to 10 points max. And this max means that the 15k cap is pointless as the dailies themselves are now capped so that completionists have the cap there to keep them from needing to do all dailies.

I think ANet needs to reconsider the 15k cap. The reason it was put in has been removed with the 10 AP daily max and they should also consider that it’s affecting most strongly those who have been the longest, and I could argue, the most loyal players. And maybe a cap that affects your most loyal players isn’t what is good for the game.

So much this.
P.S. Also, add “I’m Maledictus” option so he will stop derailing thread.

Rising Dusk.2408:

I’ve reached the cap and am extremely thankful that there is a cap. It means that I don’t have to chase some infinite AP source if I want to remain competitive on the AP leaderboard.

A Madonna song taught me something valuable long ago:
“Poor is the man whose pleasures depend on the opinion of another.”
I don´t really see why you should be bothered by a raised cap. If you are worried about staying competitive, you have to deliver day and day, isn´t that the mantra of raiders and achievment hunters in general?

What Malediktus, you or me want should be not really important for Anet. I rank around 90th on my server and have probably played as long as the both of you did too, the difference why you have 30K+ and I have 24K is that there are things I would not touch with a 10 foot pole, so you loose some points on the way.
Many people are going to play less when they reach the cap, I have seen it happen multiple times. Of course I did not ask them all or have a fancy statistic, but you know as good as I do that it does happen. I am about to reach it soon too and I will spend probably much less time in the game then. I don´t raid, dislike PvP to a certain degree and wvw is a business that has ups and downs, so without collection,s the things to do in GW2 that are not of a social nature are pretty fast to look over.

they should not remove the cap, if anything they should remove the daily AP all together. Daily Achievement is not an achievement at all.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

I think ANet needs to reconsider the 15k cap. The reason it was put in has been removed with the 10 AP daily max and they should also consider that it’s affecting most strongly those who have been the longest, and I could argue, the most loyal players. And maybe a cap that affects your most loyal players isn’t what is good for the game.

There was a 10k AP cap at release and a 5k for monthlies, they simply merged them to the 15k cap. The cap wasn’t added at a later time to “fix” things, it existed the moment dailies appeared, the only fix cap they added was for the salvaging achievement because some people had billions of salvages and got 10000000 AP just from salvaging.

Hey guys,

im pretty close to hitting the daily cap because i havnt really been after them
im still about 31.5k ap so i think i have somethign to say about that..^^

im fine with either keeping the cap or removing daily points alltogether
i want people to be able to catch up to us
because it would be quite discourageing for people who are not max daily ap now because they would basicly never ctahc up..

i love having high ap for some extra karma gold find and magic find..

i also love the idea to slowly increase the daily ap by caping it at about 25% or 50% …hell or even 100% of your permanent aps

that way eliteist players could get their aps higher.. but only if they actually do some achivements

So much QQ for such trivial topic….

Want to make everyone happy?
Maintain the current cap as a “soft cap” – still rewarding 10 AP/day
When you hit the 15k soft cap, you then start earning 3 AP/day until you reach a new hard cap (20k maybe? that’s roughly 4 more years to reach the hard cap)

You may say “ah, the same problem will eventually happen when ppl hit the 20k hard cap”, well, when it happens, just convert the soft cap to 20k, and increase the hard cap to 25k with 3AP/day

I don’t think the cap should be removed fordailies. It should be kept at 15K, or newer players would never catch up.

But I also think monthlies should return in the form of seasonal achievements with a separate cap of 5K.

Monthly achievements were bad. They were pointless and they could be done in a day by grinding one spot.

Seasonal achievements would not be like that. And they would not be monthly. They would last 3 months, and they would require specific different things, so they can’t be done by doing one thing over and over like the old monthlies.

Examples of seasonal achievements would be completing each different fractal at any level, all paths from all different dungeons, 3 different raid bosses, capturing and keeping for 10 min 15 different WvW objectives, defeating every world boss, winning 3 unranked/ranked matches on each different PvP map, defeat 5 players of each profession in WvW and PvP, win 3 ranked/unranked matches with each profession, and so on.

Pedroso.4603:

So much QQ for such trivial topic….

Want to make everyone happy?
Maintain the current cap as a “soft cap” – still rewarding 10 AP/day
When you hit the 15k soft cap, you then start earning 3 AP/day until you reach a new hard cap (20k maybe? that’s roughly 4 more years to reach the hard cap)

You may say “ah, the same problem will eventually happen when ppl hit the 20k hard cap”, well, when it happens, just convert the soft cap to 20k, and increase the hard cap to 25k with 3AP/day

Something like that does solve two major issues with the current setup.

1. Honest opinion, dailies are too rewarding on AP. It wouldn’t even need a second hard cap, because spacing it in 5k chunks would take 4.6 years of dailies to reach the new one. I’d be fine with getting 3/day, as the actual daily rewards are also useful.
2. Removing the cap means that veterans get an opportunity to see some growth. Newer players don’t have to worry about the cap for 4 years at 10/day.

It’d require tweaking how the achievements trigger, but having an infinite achievement for Veteran Daily Completion that gives fewer post-cap AP is probably the best compromise.

From the choices in the poll, if you want it removed should only be 2 options. 3 at most with a compromise in between that is done if the vote is not 50% one way. The way the poll you suggested really splits the yes vote.

Poll Questions:
1 – Remove Current Daily Achievement Cap and retroactively award daily achievement points withheld from players who have hit the cap.

2 – Remove Daily Achievement Cap but don’t award withheld daily achievement points from players who have already hit the cap.

3 – Don’t remove the cap, I’m an elitist and don’t want people to be able to get daily achievement points beyond the current cap.

4 – Increase the Daily Achievement Cap by 5000 and retroactively award the withheld achievement points to those who have already hit the cap.

5 – Increase the Daily Achievement Cap by 5000 but don’t award withheld daily achievement points from players who have already hit the cap.

6- Don’t count my vote.

6 doesn’t really matter. Of the 5 choices only 3 is for keeping the cap, 1, 2, 4 and 5 are for removing or raising it. So if from the percentage of the people who voted the first 5 options were:
1.21%
2.16%
3. 22%
4.20%
5.21%

See what I mean? 78% of voters would want the cap to go or change but option 3 would be the one with the highest vote. Say if 30% voted option 3, theres only 70% to be split 4 ways.
If the choices were
1: Remove Cap
2: Compromise(soft cap or allow Daily AP to go up if it is less than a certain percentage of total AP)
3: Keep cap
Then option 2 was done unless it was 50% or more for another option. If it was 50% or more for1 or 3 then that’s fine, its what the majority of voters want.

Phaizran.2573:

If they remove the cap the oldest players will forever have a huge insurmountable advantage on new players..

They already have an insurmountable advantage in the form of thousands of AP that no longer exist.

And that’s leaving aside that an “advantage” means absolutely nothing in this context beyond getting Zenith/Radiant/Hellfire/Pinnacle skins sooner, which are only an advantage in a cosmetic sense.

Move the achievement chests to a repeatable ladder mastery track ( regular → large → heavy → massive → regular → etc. Or, however you’d prefer it to ladder) and you can do whatever the heck you want with APs and AP caps for all I’d care.

~EW

EphemeralWallaby.7643:

Move the achievement chests to a repeatable ladder mastery track ( regular -> large -> heavy -> massive -> regular -> etc. Or, however you’d prefer it to ladder) and you can do whatever the heck you want with APs and AP caps for all I’d care.

~EW

Plus one this player! Two birds with one stone.

Torolan.5816:

Snip
Many people are going to play less when they reach the cap, I have seen it happen multiple times.

I reached the cap this week, could have been before, but this week I noticed it, yesterday I did not bother to log in, not sure I will bother today or maybe until the next story develops.

I said to a friend ingame this week when he was talking about legendary armour, once a game start to exclude its daily casual players and focus’s only on the elitist, its just matter of time before GW2 goes the same way as GW1 into maintenance only.

Like it or not, you need people to keep logging in, for that you have to give them a reason. What the people here are saying that they do not want any competition to their Leadersboard standings, I personally do not care for any of that, since I do not intend to stand killing ambients for hours with a torch and any other weapon I havent completed yet (such skill needed for this it seems). But the daily AP gave me a sense of progression, something to do when I logged in, now there is no point.

I think there is 3 reasonable solutions to this.

I think the easiest, practical, and most fostering solution for a leaderboard and the allowance of infinite progression for players would just be to remove the cap.

I think the 2nd best to minimize the reward work that has to be done by Anet and give a since of the idea above it to raise it every year or expansion.

The 3rd solution would just would put everyone on even grounds would be to divide up AP into two categorizes “Permanent” and “Temporary”. Where as any achievement that remains obtainable in the game forever is “permanent” and anything that is time sensitive is “temporary”. People could do daily achievements to work towards the total temporary AP available if they missed season 1 or any other seasonal AP.

I argued against the cap when they were first talking about adding it 3 years ago. The general support of this stemmed from players who didn’t know how to let go and felt compelled to do all 12 daily goals every day for all 12 achievement points. So to ease the “stress” they added a cap to give these players relief that if they missed a day, it would be okay because there is a ceiling.

I essentially stated that it is poor design to cater the game for people that did not know how to put something down they are not enjoying, and it would on serve to eventually lock people out of AP rewards the rest of us were currently accumulating AP for in season 1. Here we are 3 years later facing that problem.

I will first say, I for one do not care about my position on the leaderboard. I rather fall to the bottom and continue to be rewarded on the same level as everyone else for my daily and keep progressing toward rewards. But, because some people did not know how to stop accumulating ever single AP point the rest of us have to be limited in our means. That is a reward bad design to essentially tell players that you can’t progress on this track like everyone else had because you completed X daily achievements and were not here on day 1.

I am currently around top 50 on the leader-board. Not because I have done every daily from the start, but because I only a few months ago hit a cap people hit years ago and am ahead because i have 99% of temporary AP. There shouldn’t even be a leaderboard if people can stay on top without having to continue to log in on a daily basis and play to maintain their lead over others. That is also bad competing design that tells players, you were not here since day 1, you can never catch up because there is a cap on total points, you lost before you even started.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

I don’t care at all about the leaderboard or anyone else’s place on it. I don’t respect (or disrespect) any player because of their AP (what a silly concept). What I want is to be making steady, reasonable daily progess towards each next chest. Because after all, that’s the point of getting AP. It’s reaching the next chest or the next title. If ANet doesn’t give the AP points that allow this, (and they don’t. They’ve been miserly on event AP) then after you reach cap the chests are extremely far between. 10 points a day plus the content points was very reasonable progress, but then ANet decided to favor the completionists who begged for ANet to control them since they couldn’t control themselves. In doing so they affected all the players who can control themselves.

But after the 15k cap was put in the game the dailies were changed to 10 points max. And this max means that the 15k cap is pointless as the dailies themselves are now capped so that completionists have the cap there to keep them from needing to do all dailies.

I think ANet needs to reconsider the 15k cap. The reason it was put in has been removed with the 10 AP daily max and they should also consider that it’s affecting most strongly those who have been the longest, and I could argue, the most loyal players. And maybe a cap that affects your most loyal players isn’t what is good for the game.

People like me collected achievements before achievement reward chests were introduced. They were only added some time AFTER release because a lot of people complained that AP were pointless for them. New chests were added step by step as people reached certain milestones. If I remember correctly I had about 9k AP before the chests were introduced.
So I see no reason why Anet should start catering to people who view AP merely as a reward track. Start seeing them as a tiny bonus for the thousands of hours of dedication to get to the higher AP levels instead of it being a reward track. If you think you run out of achievements ask Anet to add more achievements instead of changing the daily AP nonsense which never should have existed to begin with.

I agree with the idea of having no AP linked to dailies, just look at the replies here. ‘Only do it for the AP’.. and you think that’s a healthy sign? You should play the game because it’s fun, not do a daily checklist to get your 1-up. In my opinion that’s a fail from a design perspective. Ofcourse it’s an MMO so keeping players in the game is a priority for Anet, but a game imo should be about fun. I will never reach the cap exactly because I don’t bother with a daily checklist, I rather play what I want than waste time on such a thing. If they didn’t link AP to dailies I bet HoT achievements wouldn’t reward such a pathetic amount of AP to make up for the loss. Either way, my vote is keep the cap.. heck, remove the AP from them if you ask me but that’s something I know won’t happen so yea, keep as it is.

On another note, instead they could add achievements to make up for it that people can work on but don’t require daily progress.

DoctorDing.5890:

You can’t just poll people who are already capped about abolishing the cap. That’s like polling prisoners about abolishing prisons…

I’m at the cap and don’t want to see it removed. I like that I’m not “having to keep up” any more. The 2-Gold daily is enough motivation to keep me going for now, however, but I’m less bothered if I miss out on it.

Malediktus.3740:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

I don’t care at all about the leaderboard or anyone else’s place on it. I don’t respect (or disrespect) any player because of their AP (what a silly concept). What I want is to be making steady, reasonable daily progess towards each next chest. Because after all, that’s the point of getting AP. It’s reaching the next chest or the next title. If ANet doesn’t give the AP points that allow this, (and they don’t. They’ve been miserly on event AP) then after you reach cap the chests are extremely far between. 10 points a day plus the content points was very reasonable progress, but then ANet decided to favor the completionists who begged for ANet to control them since they couldn’t control themselves. In doing so they affected all the players who can control themselves.

But after the 15k cap was put in the game the dailies were changed to 10 points max. And this max means that the 15k cap is pointless as the dailies themselves are now capped so that completionists have the cap there to keep them from needing to do all dailies.

I think ANet needs to reconsider the 15k cap. The reason it was put in has been removed with the 10 AP daily max and they should also consider that it’s affecting most strongly those who have been the longest, and I could argue, the most loyal players. And maybe a cap that affects your most loyal players isn’t what is good for the game.

People like me collected achievements before achievement reward chests were introduced. They were only added some time AFTER release because a lot of people complained that AP were pointless for them. New chests were added step by step as people reached certain milestones. If I remember correctly I had about 9k AP before the chests were introduced.
So I see no reason why Anet should start catering to people who view AP merely as a reward track. Start seeing them as a tiny bonus for the thousands of hours of dedication to get to the higher AP levels instead of it being a reward track. If you think you run out of achievements ask Anet to add more achievements instead of changing the daily AP nonsense which never should have existed to begin with.

Let’s take off the daily cap and see how “dedicated” a good portion of the leaderboard is. Can’t be bothered to grind the daily AP, then you don’t deserve it. You’re not dedicated enough to the game. Miss a day? Too bad, so sad.

And if one follows the blame chain on long enough, it’s people who kew for “achievement” recognition in the first place that had to be catered to, not the people who saw meaningless internet points as worthless. The game never needed AP, and it certainly doesn’t need a leaderboard for them.

Tiger Ashante.1792:

OP, I feel you. I’ve been dedicated to this game since the release, I’ve spent tons of money on it and one thing I always wanted (once I discovered the Hellfire armor set was earned through daily achievements) was to get that armor. I just recently hit the daily cap and my heart sunk. I was already playing less and less of this game, but now another incentive has been removed for me to log in.

TBH, I’m fed up of us veterans being penalised for sticking around and supporting the game. I know lot of people think that we Vets don’t spend money on the game, but I do, I regularly buy gems to support the development of this game and I’m sick and tired of constant gatings and barriers being thrown into the game just to stifle our progress.

At this point, with the daily cap in place, I see no way of getting my hellfire set, ever and that has basically given me even less reason to log in. Just b/c some 1 complained they could not control themselves in the past, why should I be penalised for it? Especially some 1 who has been dedicated to the game and supported it since its launch.

So my view on this is, remove the cap, no more caps, gating etc. enough is enough.

I don’t understand why so many people insist that uncapped dailies are the only solution to the currently unobtainable AP skins. This is simply not true. A, much healthier, option would be for ANet to add way more permanent achievements, that give AP more reflective of the effort put into obtaining them. I mean, with LWS2 and HoT the new AP available was extremely limited, almost a pitiful amount really. We need more of those general achievements, that you can work on as you play the game, where you can earn far more than 10AP a day if you work towards it.

Simply increasing the daily AP cap doesn’t solve the problem. It exclusively helps veteran players (which is not healthy),and it could be used as an excuse by ANet to continue giving very little new AP with every release. So far LWS3 has been better than HoT and LWS2 were imo, hopefully they pick up the pace even more.

OriOri.8724:

A, much healthier, option would be for ANet to add way more permanent achievements, that give AP more reflective of the effort put into obtaining them. I mean, with LWS2 and HoT the new AP available was extremely limited, almost a pitiful amount really. We need more of those general achievements, that you can work on as you play the game, where you can earn far more than 10AP a day if you work towards it.

Simply increasing the daily AP cap doesn’t solve the problem. It exclusively helps veteran players (which is not healthy),and it could be used as an excuse by ANet to continue giving very little new AP with every release. So far LWS3 has been better than HoT and LWS2 were imo, hopefully they pick up the pace even more.

As much as I agree with this, there’s a certain reality to be faced by understanding that there’s just no room for ANet to really work on this in a meaningful way. They can’t currently scrape together legendary journeys, which means the more practical solution is in something sustainable with few man-hours invested. In this case, it means deleting the cap.

For the feel of the game, I’d rather see more permanent achievements and suitable rewards for the effort invested. (Let’s not forget how terrible Hungry Hal was…) As it looks right now, the AP values of tasks are just lobbed about at random without much consideration of how much time or resources it takes to do them. :\

OriOri.8724:

Tiger Ashante.1792:

OP, I feel you. I’ve been dedicated to this game since the release, I’ve spent tons of money on it and one thing I always wanted (once I discovered the Hellfire armor set was earned through daily achievements) was to get that armor. I just recently hit the daily cap and my heart sunk. I was already playing less and less of this game, but now another incentive has been removed for me to log in.

TBH, I’m fed up of us veterans being penalised for sticking around and supporting the game. I know lot of people think that we Vets don’t spend money on the game, but I do, I regularly buy gems to support the development of this game and I’m sick and tired of constant gatings and barriers being thrown into the game just to stifle our progress.

At this point, with the daily cap in place, I see no way of getting my hellfire set, ever and that has basically given me even less reason to log in. Just b/c some 1 complained they could not control themselves in the past, why should I be penalised for it? Especially some 1 who has been dedicated to the game and supported it since its launch.

So my view on this is, remove the cap, no more caps, gating etc. enough is enough.

I don’t understand why so many people insist that uncapped dailies are the only solution to the currently unobtainable AP skins. This is simply not true. A, much healthier, option would be for ANet to add way more permanent achievements, that give AP more reflective of the effort put into obtaining them. I mean, with LWS2 and HoT the new AP available was extremely limited, almost a pitiful amount really. We need more of those general achievements, that you can work on as you play the game, where you can earn far more than 10AP a day if you work towards it.

Simply increasing the daily AP cap doesn’t solve the problem. It exclusively helps veteran players (which is not healthy),and it could be used as an excuse by ANet to continue giving very little new AP with every release. So far LWS3 has been better than HoT and LWS2 were imo, hopefully they pick up the pace even more.

Yes, OriOri, that would be a more healthy solution. The problem with though is that they must create new achievements which takes programming time, whereas simply lifting the daily cap would be the simplest. Though I do like the idea you have more. I think there would be less complaining if the AP quests were more numerous.

Yeah, increase the cap to 30k, and call it “Veteran Daily Achievements” that gives 3 AP and only consists of stupidly hard activities such as:

PVE:
Cleanse all OrrTemples
Kill all the 3 Worms in Triple Trouble
Ember Bay Jumping Puzzle
Silverwastes Jumping Puzzle
Sorrow’s Embrace All Paths
Honor of the Waves All Paths
Arah All Paths
Verdant Brink – Kill All Night Champions/Do a Camp meta from Start to Finish
Auric Basin – 50 Veteran Bristleback/Smokescale Kills
Tangled Depths – Chak Gerent 3 Lanes Kills
Dragon’s Stand – Kill All 3 End Champions

PVP:
Rank 1st with 9 Classes
Win 5 games consecutively in Ranked
Score at least 500 points and Win 5 times
Stomp 25 Players
Capture 30 nodes
Deliver 20 Finishing Blows with <Insert> Class

WvW:
Capture 2 Enemy Home Garrisons
Defend 20 Camps
Escort 20 Yaks
Defend SMkittenil Fortified
Fortify Enemy EB Keep
Kill 100 Players

Now the veteran players would be busy and have reasons to play for long times.

They are constantly working on the game and adding more content with AP included. I dont know how people come to the ludicrous conclusion that adding more AP to new tasks is some unsurmountable task.

Though it’s very debatable whether that is really necessary. AP are more a completionist meter than a endless reward track. Though bad management between game modes and the huge difference in achievements and effort make it nearly seem like an endless reward track.

Removing the cap would just mean it would not be that completionist points anymore and instead a way to yet again grind more stuff for players to get. I would nearly suggest to lower the cap instead.

I’d be glad if they dont focus on adding AP rewards too much. And instead focus on getting rewards in actual content.

I’d want even a lower cap, but steadily increasing the cap over time isn’t a terrible idea. I personally think that having such a disproportionate amount of it devoted to a few activities just trivializes any sense of accomplishment that is left. So you have a lot of AP? You did a lot of dailies. Whatever. That’s nothing special, and stop considering yourself as such.

Nonsense about catching up to other people doesn’t matter to me. To me, it’s about good game design. And having more than half of a certain metric to be heavily weighted to a class of achievements that really isn’t that hard doesn’t make much sense to me.

I think either the permanent achievements should be more valuable or if they really want to give out more progression, to actually add more permanent achievements. But right now, I do dailies for their rewards, and probably will continue to do them after the cap anyways.

Wheter or not AP is a competition is subjective. If you want to have more than everyone else and be at the top of the leader board then for you it’s a competition. If you only care about your own AP count and don’t care at all about anyone else’s count or the leader board then for you it’s not a comptetition. Basically it’s an optional competition, if you want it to be.

New players will never catch up on AP. There are too many AP points that can no longer be acquired. I’ve been playing since the beginning and I’ll never catch up. If you didn’t play in 2012 then you can’t get the AP for Wintersday 2012 or Halloween 2012, etc, etc… If someone starting the game today did the daily every day without fail they’d hit the cap around Dec 12, 2020.

I don’t care how much AP anyone else has. I only care about my AP and being able to progress it for the AP rewards. I don’t have strong feelings either way on the cap. I’d be happier if they’d remove the cap but hitting the cap won’t affect how much I play at all. Once I hit the cap (and I’m still long way from it) the only thing it may affect is specifically what I do. If I’m not going to get AP from dailies then it will depend on how much I value the remaining rewards vs doing someting else.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

ANet’s always explained that they wanted a way to reward players for doing stuff that they’d normally do and dailies are among the mechanics.

If the AP rewards are supposed to reward people for doing what they’d normally do then for me it’s a massive fail in PvE. PvPers and WvWers will get dailies easily doing what they’d normally do. None of the PvE dailies are every anything I’d normally do. I usually get my daily by doing PvP which I normally would not do. I get a very quick daily for AP + 2G + 3 Spirit Shards + PvP reward track progress + PvP rank progress. Getting it quick in PvP lets me get my daily (mainly just for the AP) and leaves me some time to do the things I would normally do. (This is not a complaint, just an observation on how I choose to balance my time/productivity in the game)

How about this idea for daily cap:

• The AP cap for daily AP is equal to the highest amount of Daily+Monthly AP anyone has
• On odd months everyone can earn daily AP
• On even months only people who have not reached the cap can earn daily AP
• People who have hit the cap can still earn AP from Dailies during odd months and can do something else during even months without missing anything
• People who have not hit the cap can always earn AP if they want to