I’ll be simple and to the point.
The major/minor runes and sigils are an enormous pain in the kitten and really, I never used them when leveling and have ZERO use for them on my 80’s, and they sell for almost nothing.
Either find a way to make them useful to use again (like say, mystic forge x4 of the same on into exotic versions or whatever, SOMETHING) or give us a quick disposal method that can work in zergs/raids/dungeons.
I mean, a quick sell button exclusively for them would be cool. Better would be a way to avoid the MASSIVE bag space they instantly take up from the smallest amount of loot.
Get on this guys, this is a year 1 problem for the game, and I bet most of the community agrees.
Well I do not want Anet to use more important dev-time to fix something that isn’t very gamebreaking, there are some stuff that is worse than this.
I have leveled up 12 characters from 1-80 and when I have I have always got them Major sigilis and runes just becouse what you said, they are so cheap. They are not the best but they are good enough for leveling.
They are indeed taking up alot of bagspace but GW2 has for me rarely been a game where I have problems with bagspace. I mean since release of HoT you do have your GH that you can jump to and sell your stuff and then just go back to where you where. If on an instance or a meta event, if you prepared I don’t think you will fill your bags that fast. Do not salvage stuff if you don’t have to, wait until you are at a merchant.
Member of Alpha Swedish Gaming Community – http://www.alphas.se/
Guild Leader of Alpha Sgc [ASGC]
Tis was caused at least for the worst part by the Salvage Kit rework..
Changing the basic salvage kits (either teh 15 or 25 uses) and copper-fed from no chance to get upgrades to 10% causes junk sigils… Even though the reason why these specific salvage options were used in the first place was to avoid inventory clutter in the first place…
For everything we wanted to keep we used masters or better….
-Either they should give some doubloons and other usefull salvages from armor and weapons (jewels?) on gear, this will offset the tremendous load and following price spike. on jewels and doubloons lately…
or
-They should just return the salvage kits back to original form.-
Generally if it isn’t boken, don’t try to fix it…
Oh do not make titles in CAPS as devs either change them to normal characters or just delete the thread.
23 lvl 80’s, 9 times map, 4ele, 4ncr, 3war, 3grd, 3rgr, 2thf, 2msm, 1eng, 1 rev.
Been There, Done That & Will do it again…except maybe world completion.
You can mystic forge the major runes and sigils with a 20 or so percent chance to upgrade to a random exotic version. So I don’t know what you’re taking about.
Same for minor to major btw.
“It isn’t working!” CL4P-TP
Ingame Name: Guardian Erik
Yes, I throw my major ones into the mystic forge when it is a daily quest. Sometimes I get something different out but it doesn’t matter if I don’t. I have a personal bank and I share it with a friend and we both use them.
I guess the green ones were more important once. Older players might remember once when we had to confirm before salvaging green items. Perhaps the green runes and sigils were more useful back when green items were not something you automatically salvaged.
Well when there was no ascended and most people could run dungeons in rares, due to ppl not having acces to exotics either by not having the crafting level or by just not having enough dungeon tokens the reason for “end-game level runes” was lower I remember running dungeons with 6 ruby orbs or 4 major sigil from 1 set and 2 jewels.
Then again this was in the 1st 3-6 months after the game launched… after 1 year I had most of my characters in exotics and was working to get rings If I recall correctly, and not the exotics but the newly launched ascendeds….
Still waiting for Ascneded upgrade components, and legendary tbh… then all major and minor runes and sigils could nbe vendor trash immediatley and I wouldn’t mind having them sold with the sell junk option either.
23 lvl 80’s, 9 times map, 4ele, 4ncr, 3war, 3grd, 3rgr, 2thf, 2msm, 1eng, 1 rev.
Been There, Done That & Will do it again…except maybe world completion.
Like i already said in my suggestion thread that got ignored -
I would like to suggest to let us salvage the sigils and runes. I dont like how there are items in the game that are worth nothing , that its easier to throw them away,
Why?
it bothers me that there are items that are worth nothing
right now its cheaper to sell the minor , major runes/sigil to ingame npc , than to TP
no purpose of crafting them
minor runes are thrown away cause they take away to much space
Salvage them into what?
Minor Runes/Sigil – into low mats tier 1-2 (random common crafting material 1-2 pieces, lower chance of getting fine crafting material 1-2 piece , lowest chance of geting rare crafting material 1 piece)
Superior Rune/Siggil – Tier 3-4 mats ( -=-=- )
Major Rune/Sigil – Tier 5-6 mats ( -=-=- )
So that the market doesnt gets overflown with mats , I would recommend to make the salvage chance of dropping a sigil or rune lower.
Tldr : let us salvage runes, sigils so that they get a purpose in the game, and so they will be worth smth.
Please post your opinion. If you would like to see such changes. And if yes into what would you like to see it getting salvaged.
I would quite happily pay 800 gems for an extra ability to sell trash in 1 click anywhere along with the ability to auto mark types of items as trash. win win.
“Trying to please everyone would not only be challenging
but would also result in a product that might not satisfy anyone”- Roman Pichler, Strategize
Funny, just the other day I was wondering that it would be nice to teach the game what I regard as junk items so that when I press the “sell junk items” it would sell all those runes and sigils as well.
Well I do not want Anet to use more important dev-time to fix something that isn’t very gamebreaking, there are some stuff that is worse than this.
No offense to you, but I hate this argument with a vengeance. I’ve said so on several threads. Of course there’s stuff worse than this. Whatever somebody considers worth doing, there’s somebody else who thinks there’s something more important. Can we just stop with this argument already? It’s completely useless… just like minor/major sigils when you’ve reached 80.
I have leveled up 12 characters from 1-80 and when I have I have always got them Major sigilis and runes just becouse what you said, they are so cheap. They are not the best but they are good enough for leveling.
And what then? What do you do with the dozens and dozens of sigils and runes you get after you’ve levelled to 80? That’s the point of the thread.
If on an instance or a meta event, if you prepared I don’t think you will fill your bags that fast. Do not salvage stuff if you don’t have to, wait until you are at a merchant.
That’s generally good advise – salvage after. But that’s not the point of the post. Whenever you salvage, the point is there’s a kitten-ton of useless sigils and runes produced. I’d also like to be able to sell these with the click of a button. To add my suggestion to the pile, how about a combo box where you choose a quality level (e.g. “superior”) and all rules/sigils below that quality level get sold when you click Sell Junk. If you want some specific ones back, you’ve always got the merchant’s rollback screen.
Tbh, I think this is a non-issue. Because:
1. they do go in the MF
2. As much as they seem useless to us, they do sell on TP. I never get encumbered even if I’m in a meta, just open my inv, salvage then at the first chance of 20-30 seconds of calm I sell the majors on TP. They DO sell within a few hours.
Tbh I am more bothered by the endless junk like dandelions and grubby packages.
Did you ever consider the possibility that anet wants to fill our bags with crap. Then we can buy more bags slots for gems and they can make more money. Now if you maxed your bag slots already, then this is not an issue any more.
Change Copper Fed Salvage-O-Matic from 10% chance to recover upgrades to 0% chance to recover upgrades and then we have solved one of the biggest problems in the game.
Change Copper Fed Salvage-O-Matic from 10% chance to recover upgrades to 0% chance to recover upgrades and then we have solved one of the biggest problems in the game.
Yes, let’s nerf a gemstore item for no apparent reason.
brilliant.
“It isn’t working!” CL4P-TP
Ingame Name: Guardian Erik
Change Copper Fed Salvage-O-Matic from 10% chance to recover upgrades to 0% chance to recover upgrades and then we have solved one of the biggest problems in the game.
I like getting the sigils and runes though. So I don’t want this to happen. If they want to do it to the paid 15/25 salavage kits you buy, sure, but not my Salvage-o-matic. They are great in the MF, especially when I get a random rare. I just keep a bunch on my pvp engie since she has empty bag space for nothing.
Please don’t change the salvage kits. When people have spent gems on something, nerfing it later would be a problem.
I like the idea mentioned above by vesica and Blue about being able to flag items as “junk” so they could be easily sold to a merchant by clicking the sell junk items button. Having an interface to view your “junk” list and add/remove items from it would be great.
I’ll be simple and to the point.
The major/minor runes and sigils are an enormous pain in the kitten and really, I never used them when leveling and have ZERO use for them on my 80’s, and they sell for almost nothing.
Either find a way to make them useful to use again (like say, mystic forge x4 of the same on into exotic versions or whatever, SOMETHING) or give us a quick disposal method that can work in zergs/raids/dungeons.
I mean, a quick sell button exclusively for them would be cool. Better would be a way to avoid the MASSIVE bag space they instantly take up from the smallest amount of loot.
Get on this guys, this is a year 1 problem for the game, and I bet most of the community agrees.
Problem? Sure. Biggest problem in the game? Hardly. They can all be quickly vendored and merchants exist all over the place. I salvage 100s of items at a time & I’ve never had a problem disposing of them.
Do I support changing the system so that there are other uses for runes & sigils? Absolutely. I even think it would be good for the economy.
I just don’t think it’s even in the top 10 issues, at least not for me or anyone with whom I’ve been discussing the game.
John Smith: “you should kill monsters, because killing monsters is awesome.”
Well I do not want Anet to use more important dev-time to fix something that isn’t very gamebreaking, there are some stuff that is worse than this.
No offense to you, but I hate this argument with a vengeance. I’ve said so on several threads. Of course there’s stuff worse than this. Whatever somebody considers worth doing, there’s somebody else who thinks there’s something more important. Can we just stop with this argument already? It’s completely useless… just like minor/major sigils when you’ve reached 80.
I have leveled up 12 characters from 1-80 and when I have I have always got them Major sigilis and runes just becouse what you said, they are so cheap. They are not the best but they are good enough for leveling.
And what then? What do you do with the dozens and dozens of sigils and runes you get after you’ve levelled to 80? That’s the point of the thread.
If on an instance or a meta event, if you prepared I don’t think you will fill your bags that fast. Do not salvage stuff if you don’t have to, wait until you are at a merchant.
That’s generally good advise – salvage after. But that’s not the point of the post. Whenever you salvage, the point is there’s a kitten-ton of useless sigils and runes produced. I’d also like to be able to sell these with the click of a button. To add my suggestion to the pile, how about a combo box where you choose a quality level (e.g. “superior”) and all rules/sigils below that quality level get sold when you click Sell Junk. If you want some specific ones back, you’ve always got the merchant’s rollback screen.
1. I don’t feel that that argument is useless, just as people are saying that this is the most important fix in the game I wanna be able to say that yes it is a thing that needs a fix but I rather have Anet Devs putting their devtime on something else as it is not that of an big issue to me. If I where to be silent about this and everyone who wants this fix are vocal, I dunno how it works but maby then Anet thinks that this may be a top priority and fix it while I sit silent in my corner and wish that they did something else.
2. When (now rather) I mostly sell the runes and sigils but a while back I did toss them in the MF. It has never been a big problem for me, if they happen to take up some bagspace I needed they are the first stuff I throw away (If I dont have stuff that have a lower selling value).
3. The point of the post was that the ammount of min and maj runes and sigils are stupid and that they are worthless and takes up alot bag space and more so that there should be a fix to this. I think that my point works very well with this post as this is a suggestion to what OP (and others) can do while waiting for a fix to this. Anyhow I like your idéa.
Member of Alpha Swedish Gaming Community – http://www.alphas.se/
Guild Leader of Alpha Sgc [ASGC]
Change Copper Fed Salvage-O-Matic from 10% chance to recover upgrades to 0% chance to recover upgrades and then we have solved one of the biggest problems in the game.
Yes, let’s nerf a gemstore item for no apparent reason.
brilliant.
Well it used to be 0% in the past the 10% is a recentr “buff” and it’s a pain cause you bought the CFSoM to salvage whites, blues and greens in the 1st place anyways….
And it would be an upgrade IMHO not a nerf. you just think about it
23 lvl 80’s, 9 times map, 4ele, 4ncr, 3war, 3grd, 3rgr, 2thf, 2msm, 1eng, 1 rev.
Been There, Done That & Will do it again…except maybe world completion.
Pressing button keybound to Look Behind. I would suggest rearview mirror in mid of right side, so I will be calmy aware of what is behind me. QoL change definitely.
Secondly more than one minimap, so I would have my waypoints pretty close at hand instead M.
If this is the “biggest issue in the game” then the game is in a pretty good place.
Those things are minor irritation at worst and it’s no different to most other games. In a gaming session your inventory fills up with stuff that needs salvaging, selling, discarding, whatever. I merch the minors and MF the majors, keeping aside at least 4 to use when the MF is included in the dailies.
Change Copper Fed Salvage-O-Matic from 10% chance to recover upgrades to 0% chance to recover upgrades and then we have solved one of the biggest problems in the game.
I like getting the sigils and runes though. So I don’t want this to happen. If they want to do it to the paid 15/25 salavage kits you buy, sure, but not my Salvage-o-matic. They are great in the MF, especially when I get a random rare. I just keep a bunch on my pvp engie since she has empty bag space for nothing.
If you want the sigils and runes back, you use your Mystic Salvage Kit, not the Copper Salvage-o-Mat. Filling up my inventory with 15-use salvage kits is no better than filling it up with useless runes.
Mystic for Rune Recall, Salvage-o-Mat for No Clutter.
Tossing runes into the MF requires wasting time porting back to Lion’s Arch and losing your place in the world – which is absolutely terrible if you’re running Dungeons, Silverwastes, or… pretty much anything open-world.
Really? You never use em? Kinda wasteful. I use bloodlust and speed sigils on both wep sets the whole time. Makes for quicker kills and perma speed while map comping along with leveling and lets me not waste space on perma speed with a utility skill or trait.
Really? You never use em? Kinda wasteful. I use bloodlust and speed sigils on both wep sets the whole time. Makes for quicker kills and perma speed while map comping along with leveling and lets me not waste space on perma speed with a utility skill or trait.
That’s not what we’re talking about. We’re talking about the useless green and yellow sigils.
I haven’t seen it as a problem. It seems I can hardly turn around on most maps and not hit an NPC vendor of some sort who will take them off my hands. The most vendor scarce map I can think of off hand is a map like the Verdant Brinks and that map has a merchant by the first waypoint as well as mastery vendors. By the time my inventory is full of reward containers it isn’t that big a deal to take a few minutes to rest and waypoint to a vendor to salvage then sell.
Be careful what you ask for
ANet may give it to you.
You can mystic forge the major runes and sigils with a 20 or so percent chance to upgrade to a random exotic version. So I don’t know what you’re taking about.
Same for minor to major btw.
This.
Fwiw, the major runes/sigils sell for anything from 1.5 to 2.5 silver. This leads me to think there are people doing the major-superior MF rather frequently.
You can mystic forge the major runes and sigils with a 20 or so percent chance to upgrade to a random exotic version. So I don’t know what you’re taking about.
Same for minor to major btw.
This.
Fwiw, the major runes/sigils sell for anything from 1.5 to 2.5 silver. This leads me to think there are people doing the major-superior MF rather frequently.
Except only a few superior are worth the 16 major on average to get a superior. That’s 24 to 40 silver in opportunity cost hoping you will get the one of the 30 or so out of 80 or so that’s worth more than that. It’s still a crap shoot in the MF, you don’t get a superior X by tossing in 4 major Xs. You have to be dedicated to get past the number of times you burn though 10 gold of majors to only get 1 gold or less of superiors.
You can mystic forge the major runes and sigils with a 20 or so percent chance to upgrade to a random exotic version. So I don’t know what you’re taking about.
Same for minor to major btw.
This.
Fwiw, the major runes/sigils sell for anything from 1.5 to 2.5 silver. This leads me to think there are people doing the major-superior MF rather frequently.
Except only a few superior are worth the 16 major on average to get a superior. That’s 24 to 40 silver in opportunity cost hoping you will get the one of the 30 or so out of 80 or so that’s worth more than that. It’s still a crap shoot in the MF, you don’t get a superior X by tossing in 4 major Xs. You have to be dedicated to get past the number of times you burn though 10 gold of majors to only get 1 gold or less of superiors.
Actually, it’s almost always profitable in the long run, partly because there are fewer than 60 exotic sigils that might pop out of the forge, because they don’t have a uniform drop rate, and because some major are worth above the opportunity cost. At the moment, there’s a roughly 5s profit per attempt over the long run for sigils and about kitten for runes.
That’s a pretty good fractional return-on-investment, although it’s a lot of clicking for silvers. (Or in other words, it’s a bad use of time for most veterans, while still a decent use of time & resources for newer players.)
Still, that’s moot for the vast majority of players, who don’t forge much in the first place. For those players, it’s still quick to vendor the cheaps and TP the more valuable ones — in other words, it’s the least of most people’s inventory management issues.
John Smith: “you should kill monsters, because killing monsters is awesome.”
Well the times I’ve tried it I never got one that was worth more than the ones I’ve tossed in, not to mention the few that are auto account bound. I’ll say that either the odds are in your favor or wasn’t in mine. The cost to perform a large enough scale test to get a firm grip on the odds and distribution of superior upgrades from the MF is prohibited, for me. Unless you have a ready free source of majors, I’m figuring you’ll need to do roughly 10000 promotions to get enough data to start to converge on the approximate output distribution to start to overcome RNGesus’s runs of bad and good luck.
I’ve done over 2600 mat conversions in the last 90 days to validate the conversion number I use to determine if it’s worth doing on a type of mat. And that number is very different from the numbers often given by various TP sites (for instance GW2Shinies conversion ratio is 7% higher than what I’m seeing).
So before I would even suggest others to do this, I’m going to need hard data to show me it’s actually worth doing from an ROI/time standpoint because right now my small sample isn’t showing “enough color in the pan” to be worthwhile.
I throw runes and sigils into the forge. Sometimes I get something nice. The change I want would be to be able to throw superior runes and sigils into the forge, to get a random superior back.
This would stabilize the value of the most valuable runes and sigils (Bloodlust, Scholar, etc) and would give some value to the minor and major runes and sigils.
Actually, it’s almost always profitable in the long run…
How long is the “long run” exactly?
Combining a few stacks.
The most expensive scenario is you never sell any majors and throw away cheap exotics, so that your only income was from higher-priced versions. For sigils, 9 of 55 are worth more than the cost of the rares and 3 are worth a lot more. For runes, 19 are worth more than the costs and half those are high value.
Taking that distribution into account, I wouldn’t expect ‘average’ results with fewer than ~100 attempts, which means 400 majors.
Put more simply, the average player salvaging rares gear and forging leftover runes & sigils won’t see “average” results; for most of us, it’s simpler, faster, and (did I mention) easier to just sell them on the TP.
However, I was responding to a previous poster who said that forging upgrades was a loss — my point remains, it’s a net profit for the community to forge (but maybe not for any one of us individually).
edit: grammar
John Smith: “you should kill monsters, because killing monsters is awesome.”
Actually, it’s almost always profitable in the long run…
How long is the “long run” exactly?
Combining a few stacks.
The most expensive scenario is you never sold majors and through away cheap exotics, so that your only income was from higher-priced versions. For sigils, 9 of 55 are worth more than the cost of the rares and 3 are worth a lot more. For runes, 19 are worth more than the costs and half those are high value.
Taking that distribution into account, I wouldn’t expect ‘average’ results with fewer than ~100 attempts, which means 400 majors.
Put more simply, the average player salvaging rares gear and forging leftover runes & sigils won’t see “average” results; for most of us, it’s simpler, faster, and (did I mention) easier to just sell them on the TP.
However, I was responding to a previous poster who said that forging upgrades was a loss — my point remains, it’s a net profit for the community to forge (but maybe not for any one of us individually).
I understand.
Thanks for taking the time to answer my question. Maybe I’ll rethink my own sigil strategy.
Well I do not want Anet to use more important dev-time to fix something that isn’t very gamebreaking, there are some stuff that is worse than this.
No offense to you, but I hate this argument with a vengeance. I’ve said so on several threads. Of course there’s stuff worse than this. Whatever somebody considers worth doing, there’s somebody else who thinks there’s something more important. Can we just stop with this argument already? It’s completely useless… just like minor/major sigils when you’ve reached 80.
I have leveled up 12 characters from 1-80 and when I have I have always got them Major sigilis and runes just becouse what you said, they are so cheap. They are not the best but they are good enough for leveling.
And what then? What do you do with the dozens and dozens of sigils and runes you get after you’ve levelled to 80? That’s the point of the thread.
If on an instance or a meta event, if you prepared I don’t think you will fill your bags that fast. Do not salvage stuff if you don’t have to, wait until you are at a merchant.
That’s generally good advise – salvage after. But that’s not the point of the post. Whenever you salvage, the point is there’s a kitten-ton of useless sigils and runes produced. I’d also like to be able to sell these with the click of a button. To add my suggestion to the pile, how about a combo box where you choose a quality level (e.g. “superior”) and all rules/sigils below that quality level get sold when you click Sell Junk. If you want some specific ones back, you’ve always got the merchant’s rollback screen.
1. I don’t feel that that argument is useless, just as people are saying that this is the most important fix in the game I wanna be able to say that yes it is a thing that needs a fix but I rather have Anet Devs putting their devtime on something else as it is not that of an big issue to me. If I where to be silent about this and everyone who wants this fix are vocal, I dunno how it works but maby then Anet thinks that this may be a top priority and fix it while I sit silent in my corner and wish that they did something else.
2. When (now rather) I mostly sell the runes and sigils but a while back I did toss them in the MF. It has never been a big problem for me, if they happen to take up some bagspace I needed they are the first stuff I throw away (If I dont have stuff that have a lower selling value).
3. The point of the post was that the ammount of min and maj runes and sigils are stupid and that they are worthless and takes up alot bag space and more so that there should be a fix to this. I think that my point works very well with this post as this is a suggestion to what OP (and others) can do while waiting for a fix to this. Anyhow I like your idéa.
It’s not so much the bag space (and they’re not worthless – they’re a source of income, however slight) as the number of clicks to get rid of them all, I think. Whether you sell them at a merchant, throw them in the MF or sell them on the TP, it’s a lot of clicks – especially if you’re selling each one on the TP! People have complained about the number of clicks in the game and anet have recognised it’s an issue since they put in the Consume All options on luck. And if they consider those worthy of implementation, it might be time to address this. Actually, I think this is more annoying than the issue with luck. At least with luck, you could hold your mouse in one place and quickly click through the luck, and people even had double-clicker macros for it. With the sigils/runes, you have to keep moving your mouse to each one and double-clicking (when selling to a merchant for example). It would be nice to get this particular issue sorted out in between expansions.
Pressing button keybound to Look Behind. I would suggest rearview mirror in mid of right side, so I will be calmy aware of what is behind me. QoL change definitely.
OMG. I love a rearview mirror. And.. don’t hate me for this.. but it opens the field for all kinds of mirror-dangling minis. Instead of dice, imagine a pair of quaggans swinging from your rear-view.
Secondly more than one minimap, so I would have my waypoints pretty close at hand instead M.
Agree this needs something. I’d personally like a favourites list for waypoints I visit frequently, for things like events (Swamplost for SB for example) or jumping puzzles. It doesn’t add any enjoyment (at least for me) to keep zooming in and out of the map to find the same waypoints, and takes up time that could be spent playing.
-