Shatterer Break Bar - A bit too much

Shatterer Break Bar - A bit too much

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Posted by: Rhyav.4812

Rhyav.4812

Hey, first of all, I love the new Shatterer! Really fun fight and the Branded Backpiece looks cool.
However, I do have one complain, that hopefully is just a bug – The Shatterer’s breakbar is INSANE. I’ve done it like 6 times already and I never saw that bar drop under 70%.

I do understand that some people either don’t care or don’t know what CC is or how/when to use it, but I doubt that’s the majority. At first I thought it was because too many people were gliding, but then I noticed #1 Skill has hard CC.

So how’s the deal? I really want those achievements but right now, that break bar looks untouchable, or at least on the time given to break it. Hopefully is just a bug, like Gerent’s HP scaling used to be.

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Posted by: Swagger.1459

Swagger.1459

The break bar mechanics are not good.

Kill credit for branded is bugged and not counting properly.

Zero credit for the healing crystal things.

I’ve not been able to loot the trophy all 4 times I’ve done it.

It’s a mess right now.

New Main- 80 Thief – P/P- Vault Spam Pro

221 hours over 1,581 days of bank space/hot pve/lion’s arch afk and some wvw.

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Posted by: Rhyav.4812

Rhyav.4812

The break bar mechanics are not good.

Kill credit for branded is bugged and not counting properly.

Zero credit for the healing crystal things.

I’ve not been able to loot the trophy all 4 times I’ve done it.

It’s a mess right now.

Weird… I’ve been getting full credit for the Healing crystals, I did get credit for some of the Branded kills and I did get a trophy :/ But yeah, I’ve seen other people complain, specially about the crystals. I hope they fix it soon. Its a really fun fight but these bugs disencourage people

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Posted by: Manasa Devi.7958

Manasa Devi.7958

I agree, the break bar seems much too steep. I know I’m not helping with my single CC option on my character of choice, but I’ll be kittened if I’m going to change my build for a 5 minute world boss that I’m not even enjoying much. The game needs to account for people running weapons with little CC on them. They can’t possibly balance this for a full map of people fully optimized for CC. That’s not viable for an open world encounter.

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Posted by: Cyninja.2954

Cyninja.2954

Remembers wyvern in VB the first few days after HoT launched → breakbar never got below 60-70%.

Most wyvern fights now → breakbar completed or at least down to 10-20%.

I’d say, give it a week or 2 and see if people addapt or if it is an actual problem.

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Posted by: Konig Des Todes.2086

Konig Des Todes.2086

I’d say, give it a week or 2 and see if people addapt or if it is an actual problem.

This. People just need to learn the mechanics. Instead, folks look on ways to bug things out or just complain it is too difficult because they cannot faceroll the content.

Rather sad.

Dear ANet writers,
Stop treating GW2 as a single story. Each Season and expansion should be their own story.

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Posted by: Khisanth.2948

Khisanth.2948

Remembers wyvern in VB the first few days after HoT launched -> breakbar never got below 60-70%.

Most wyvern fights now -> breakbar completed or at least down to 10-20%.

I’d say, give it a week or 2 and see if people addapt or if it is an actual problem.

… and the bars scale with the number of people

Also each success seems to count as 3 so the achievement just needs 7 successful breaks.

A venom share thief is also nice for providing more CC.

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Posted by: Rhyav.4812

Rhyav.4812

I just saw this video from WoodenPotatoes in a non-full map.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZ9XRXAU5KE

Minute 8:03, see how easy the crystal break bar breaks. I could solo that with my Rev or my Reaper. My guessing is that the Shatterer’s Break Bar scaled too much, because in my experience the crystals also were really hard to break. My 5 hard CC skills in Revenant barely touched the crystal’s bar (about 5% or less).

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Posted by: Draknar.5748

Draknar.5748

I would dare say that 75% of GW2 players do not understand break bars or know how they are supposed to break it. I discovered this when raiding. We call out for people to break the bar and it’s like 2 of us even moving it. Then afterwards we ask the players what skills they are using to break the bar and it’s like “uhhhh, huh?”.

I’m not even kidding, most people don’t even understand which CC effects damage the break-bar or even know their class has skills that can do CC.

Most people will auto attack or go through their standard rotation like they are doing a heart or something.

PSA: in-game type /wiki break bar in your chat bar and hit enter. Read all about how break bar works and how YOU can reduce it. It may require changing one of your weapons so you can do it more efficiently. Adapt.

EDIT: And I’m not saying that the break bar doesn’t have a ton of HP, all I’m really saying is that it won’t be broken by 5-10% of the players using their hard CC, it will require everyone using hard CC at the same time, which will require educating people on break bars.

I won’t stop because I can’t stop.

It’s a medical condition, they say its terminal….

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Posted by: Illconceived Was Na.9781

Illconceived Was Na.9781

I’d say, give it a week or 2 and see if people addapt or if it is an actual problem.

This. People just need to learn the mechanics. Instead, folks look on ways to bug things out or just complain it is too difficult because they cannot faceroll the content.

Rather sad.

I don’t think it’s “sad” as much as it’s a typical human reaction. People forget that lot of content that we decry today as “faceroll easy” wasn’t when we first encountered it. That’s not specific to GW2 or even MMOs — in general, public opinion doesn’t have a long-term perspective and is quick to react (and overreact) without waiting for all the facts to come in.

(Other than that, I agree with Konig’s post: give it a couple of weeks; we’ll be cracking defiance like ice on a warming lake.)

John Smith: “you should kill monsters, because killing monsters is awesome.”

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Posted by: Rhyav.4812

Rhyav.4812

I would dare say that 75% of GW2 players do not understand break bars or know how they are supposed to break it.

Agree… That’s why I always call out in Map Chat what CC means and what effects are CC. But yes, a lot of people don’t understand. Can’t deny is not very well explained if you just got into the game and see that bar, I bet most new players assume its like a energy or mana bar Lol

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Posted by: Nitron.6405

Nitron.6405

Couldn’t agree more.

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Posted by: Kiza.5630

Kiza.5630

It’s the same problem as with vinetooth prime. The break bar mechanics are somewhat badly explained. Mostly not at all and players just keep hitting the thing. All you can do is explain what the blue bar is before the fight, how to deplete it and when to go wild. I’ve seen the shatterer bar go down almost to 30% yesterday and it was a last-minute map.

I think it’s fine for now. If it’s still not working in roughly in half of the fights after a month, it could be looked at again. But fights like these are good at teaching players the game mechanics. Many will look at the achievement panels, think “I want that” and ask themselves “hm, how can I do that”. And learn about break bars. Hopefully.

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Posted by: maddoctor.2738

maddoctor.2738

I’d say, give it a week or 2 and see if people addapt or if it is an actual problem.

This. People just need to learn the mechanics. Instead, folks look on ways to bug things out or just complain it is too difficult because they cannot faceroll the content.

Rather sad.

The problem with many encounters in this game is that many people do NOT want to learn the mechanics. Instead they want the mechanics to be about them and their build of choice, instead of them adapting to the mechanics. Which of course doesn’t make any sense. The player adapts to the content, not the content to the player…

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Posted by: Manasa Devi.7958

Manasa Devi.7958

Learning the mechanics to a trivial and rather boring open world event that lasts a few minutes is a bit of a waste of time in my book. I’m perfectly content to let other people figure it out and do the heavy lifting while I drop by a few times to finish some achievements, and then never again.

The whole “take out the breakbar when it appears” mechanic that’s so prevalent on bosses since HoT is rather stupid. It adds nothing but artificial difficulty. “How long does it take before enough people learn to press the right button at the right time”, that’s the whole of the challenge . It reminds me more of the experiments they do with monkeys to have them operate simple machinery for food rewards, than of interesting game play.

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Posted by: OGDeadHead.8326

OGDeadHead.8326

I would dare say that 75% of GW2 players do not understand break bars or know how they are supposed to break it.

Agree… That’s why I always call out in Map Chat what CC means and what effects are CC. But yes, a lot of people don’t understand. Can’t deny is not very well explained if you just got into the game and see that bar, I bet most new players assume its like a energy or mana bar Lol

Pretty much. There are lots of players out there that doesn’t know and frankly doesn’t even care about mechanics like this. And, as you said, it’s not very well explained ingame. I would also argue that players using the wiki (or any other source) to get information are very, very few compared to the population as a whole.

Win10 pro | Xeon 5650 @ 4 GHz | R9 280x toxic | 24 Gig Ram | Process Lasso user

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Posted by: Berelious.3290

Berelious.3290

The devs are aware of the break-bar issue and are currently working on a fix.

Source: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/bugs/Shatterer-issues-Merged/first#post5958310

Corwin Grimjaw: Guardian (80)
Yak’s Bend Server
Crimethink [ct]

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Posted by: maddoctor.2738

maddoctor.2738

I’m perfectly content to let other people figure it out and do the heavy lifting while I drop by a few times to finish some achievements, and then never again.

Nice, so you just want to be carried by others. And they call elitists bad.

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Posted by: Manasa Devi.7958

Manasa Devi.7958

No… I go there to do what I want to do and what everyone else is doing doesn’t interest me at all. The last 2 times (out of a total of 3) I went there, the event failed, and I was perfectly fine with that. I got 4 achievements out of it and that was for the “work” I did. No one else contributed to that or carried me.

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Posted by: DoctorDing.5890

DoctorDing.5890

I’m perfectly content to let other people figure it out and do the heavy lifting while I drop by a few times to finish some achievements, and then never again.

Nice, so you just want to be carried by others. And they call elitists bad.

I think this is going to be quite common in the next few weeks. I’m now in the position of having got the “kill the boss 10 times” achievement but I am only about 100/500 of the “kill the mobs” one. So my focus is bound to be on killing those mobs rather than the boss. There are going to be loads of people in the same boat. This morning there were so many people doing the “other” achievements that the timer ran out and the boss still had 90% health (yeah, chat was a bit salty….). But you can’t really blame folk for focussing on those achievements. That’s what they are there for.

Incidentally, I think the whole break bar CC thing is confusing a huge number of players. Remember this is open world PUG stuff. Some don’t know what a break bar is. Others don’t know to use CC. And even if they do know, it’s not amazingly obvious which skills count as CC. When you wiki it you find several different flavours of break bar and soft and hard CC’s. I got confused between condition and control and the fight is quite frantic so you can’t easily tell whether your skills are affecting the break bar. It’s hardly surprising we’re seeing the frustration and blame in chat.

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Posted by: maddoctor.2738

maddoctor.2738

No… I go there to do what I want to do and what everyone else is doing doesn’t interest me at all. The last 2 times (out of a total of 3) I went there, the event failed, and I was perfectly fine with that. I got 4 achievements out of it and that was for the “work” I did. No one else contributed to that or carried me.

Nice so you go to do such events to get achievements and not to participate in the events themselves. Selfish much?

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Posted by: maddoctor.2738

maddoctor.2738

But you can’t really blame folk for focussing on those achievements. That’s what they are there for.

All the achievements except for the one to stand there and let the Shatterer crash you contribute to the event itself.

Remember this is open world PUG stuff.

That’s why we have map chat and in nearly all the times I did the new Shatterer at least one person (usually more) explained what CC is. Just because it’s open world PUG stuff doesn’t mean you are not supposed to read and learn how to play your own character.

Just like they have a place that teaches you dodging, they should add one that teaches you the breakbars. So even those who can’t read can actually contribute in fights that require breaking breakbars.

(edited by maddoctor.2738)

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Posted by: Kraggy.4169

Kraggy.4169

Hey, first of all, I love the new Shatterer! Really fun fight and the Branded Backpiece looks cool.
However, I do have one complain, that hopefully is just a bug – The Shatterer’s breakbar is INSANE. I’ve done it like 6 times already and I never saw that bar drop under 70%.

I do understand that some people either don’t care or don’t know what CC is or how/when to use it, but I doubt that’s the majority. At first I thought it was because too many people were gliding, but then I noticed #1 Skill has hard CC.

So how’s the deal? I really want those achievements but right now, that break bar looks untouchable, or at least on the time given to break it. Hopefully is just a bug, like Gerent’s HP scaling used to be.

Already acknowledged …

I am also looking into the scaling of the break bar in general. I believe high population groups (IE most of them right now) have an unfairly harder time breaking him than small population groups. That’s one of the reasons why we need more time to group test this fix before we push it live; we need to test it at a variety of scales.

Hey guys! FYI I’ve identified an issue with the defiance bar that causes the Shatterer to still take off if you “break” him in the last 2.8 seconds of the break phase. I have a fix for that that will need to be group tested before it can go live, so I don’t have an exact ETA for when we will be able to push that live, but we are aware of the issue and will get it fixed in an upcoming build.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Shatterer-Discussion-merged/first

Helps if you read Dev Tracker, you don’t miss this sort of thing then, it’s still on the first page:

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/devtracker

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Posted by: Manasa Devi.7958

Manasa Devi.7958

No… I go there to do what I want to do and what everyone else is doing doesn’t interest me at all. The last 2 times (out of a total of 3) I went there, the event failed, and I was perfectly fine with that. I got 4 achievements out of it and that was for the “work” I did. No one else contributed to that or carried me.

All the achievements except for the one to stand there and let the Shatterer crash you contribute to the event itself.

No, not really.

Nice so you go to do such events to get achievements and not to participate in the events themselves. Selfish much?

Get over it. The achievements were added to be achieved. That’s what I’ve been doing. And I’m not the only one, not even the only one announcing that intent in this thread. The event is flooded with people lining up for their turn at a turret or mortar, and there are dozens of people just gliding and running back to the launch pad regardless of what needs to be done.

I wouldn’t be there if there were no achievements after doing it once. Blame ANet for adding those kinds of achievements. It’s not as if this is the first time they’re messing up their own events with stupid achievements. Tequatl used to have a dozen or so people trying to dodge its tail with every run of the event the first few weeks after the redesign.

(edited by Manasa Devi.7958)

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Posted by: DoctorDing.5890

DoctorDing.5890

I was thinking precisely of the Teq tail thing. I have spent most of a Teq fight jumping around randomly to get that achievement, not contributing to the fight at all. I’ve also spent a good chunk of a Shatterer fight trying to work out the glider dodge thing, not really contributing anything to the greater good. There were plenty of others doing the same – lots of gliding and dying, not much bombing and, yes, taking turns on the mortars is a thing atm.

As for trying to educate an open world map in chat regarding the basics of break bars and CC, it just ain’t gonna happen. Most of those players never change their skill bars or weapons, because they don’t have to. Maybe a few will listen but most will ignore the preaching stranger in the chat. Most of the maps I’ve been on just had someone yelling at everyone to use CC rather than making any attempt to explain it, and they were getting lost in the rest of the chat anyway.

Having said all that, I am really enjoying the event. More gliding and bombing events please!

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Posted by: Illconceived Was Na.9781

Illconceived Was Na.9781

No… I go there to do what I want to do and what everyone else is doing doesn’t interest me at all. The last 2 times (out of a total of 3) I went there, the event failed, and I was perfectly fine with that. I got 4 achievements out of it and that was for the “work” I did. No one else contributed to that or carried me.

All the achievements except for the one to stand there and let the Shatterer crash you contribute to the event itself.

No, not really.

Nice so you go to do such events to get achievements and not to participate in the events themselves. Selfish much?

Get over it. The achievements were added to be achieved. That’s what I’ve been doing. And I’m not the only one, not even the only one announcing that intent in this thread. The event is flooded with people lining up for their turn at a turret or mortar, and there are dozens of people just gliding and running back to the launch pad regardless of what needs to be done.

I wouldn’t be there if there were no achievements after doing it once. Blame ANet for adding those kinds of achievements. It’s not as if this is the first time they’re messing up their own events with stupid achievements. Tequatl used to have a dozen or so people trying to dodge its tail with every run of the event the first few weeks after the redesign.

The game is vast. There’s plenty of room for folks like Manasa who are content doing their own thing and plenty for folks like myself, who like figuring out how to coordinate with massive numbers of random (well, if by “massive” we mean 50+).

And like Manasa says, when there are new chieves out, some people will be super focused on those (regardless of what else is going on) and others who care mostly about loot and others who are just there to kill a dragon (or whatever for the heck of it).

Besides, this has nothing to do with whether the Shatterererererererer’s defiance bar is tuned too difficult or if it will turn out to be too easy in a few weeks.

John Smith: “you should kill monsters, because killing monsters is awesome.”

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Posted by: Manasa Devi.7958

Manasa Devi.7958

The game is vast. There’s plenty of room for folks like Manasa who are content doing their own thing and plenty for folks like myself, who like figuring out how to coordinate with massive numbers of random (well, if by “massive” we mean 50+).

And like Manasa says, when there are new chieves out, some people will be super focused on those (regardless of what else is going on) and others who care mostly about loot and others who are just there to kill a dragon (or whatever for the heck of it).

Besides, this has nothing to do with whether the Shatterererererererer’s defiance bar is tuned too difficult or if it will turn out to be too easy in a few weeks.

Well, it does relate to the defiance bar tangentially. When the initial dust settles and more people are there to actually do the event because the achievement hunters are done, that bar will break somewhat easier at the very least.

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Posted by: maddoctor.2738

maddoctor.2738

The game is vast. There’s plenty of room for folks like Manasa who are content doing their own thing and plenty for folks like myself, who like figuring out how to coordinate with massive numbers of random (well, if by “massive” we mean 50+).

If many people were doing that the event would be failing. But Shatterer isn’t failing at all so most players are indeed following the mechanics and playing the actual event, even while earning those achievements since those two can be done at the same time.

But it’s more than that and beyond this single thread. Folks like Manasa are those who complain about Raiding and/or other not-so-casual events of HoT, so we now see exactly why. They can’t be carried there and complete the content while others are doing all the work and they just stand still and tag along for the achievements.

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Posted by: Manasa Devi.7958

Manasa Devi.7958

But it’s more than that and beyond this single thread. Folks like Manasa are those who complain about Raiding and/or other not-so-casual events of HoT, so we now see exactly why. They can’t be carried there and complete the content while others are doing all the work and they just stand still and tag along for the achievements.

I would urge you not to spread lies about me.

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Posted by: maddoctor.2738

maddoctor.2738

No, they don’t come naturally, and it amazes me that you think they would.

But they do come naturally. You can both get the dodge while gliding AND drop bombs on him. You can kill Branded foes while also damaging him, and indeed killing branded foes helps the entire map complete the event. Getting people out of crystals is self-explanatory why it helps and comes naturally.

The funniest part is that there achievements that require you to break the healing crystals AND one to kill him without him ever flying. If those players ruining the event were actually achievement hunters as you say, wouldn’t it make sense to try for those too? Or those are too hard?

What’s wrong with being selfish?

What’s wrong with being selfish In a cooperative environment? I wonder really. Let’s add open world PVP then so everyone can be selfish while ruining the fun of others.

But it’s more than that and beyond this single thread. Folks like Manasa are those who complain about Raiding and/or other not-so-casual events of HoT, so we now see exactly why. They can’t be carried there and complete the content while others are doing all the work and they just stand still and tag along for the achievements.

I would urge you not to spread lies about me.

I never post lies.

And I thought the “zerker wannabies” and “meta followers” were toxic and working against the community. It appears that you can be toxic, unfriendly, selfish, ruin the experience for others, without following any meta nor being an elitist.

(edited by maddoctor.2738)

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Posted by: Manasa Devi.7958

Manasa Devi.7958

But they do come naturally. You can both get the dodge while gliding AND drop bombs on him. You can kill Branded foes while also damaging him, and indeed killing branded foes helps the entire map complete the event. Getting people out of crystals is self-explanatory why it helps and comes naturally.

I wish to minimize the number of times I play the event. None of the achievements come naturally within that constraint. Throwing around healing would be something I’d never do at all, so definitely not a “natural” achievement. Neither would be the turret or mortar achievement. You wouldn’t see me man one of those if there wasn’t a reward for it.

Breaking the bar? If anything isn’t a natural thing, it’s that. It’s an achievement that requires everyone to care about it specifically. People have to stop doing all those other “natural” achievements to press one or two keys at exactly the right time to achieve something that’s not required at all to win the event. This morning, I was rezzing someone when the breakbar appeared. Should I abort and try to use my knockback that I’m terribly out of position for because of the rezzing? I didn’t. It’s the most unnatural achievement there is, and I don’t expect many people to learn to do it, because it’s pointless to break that bar, it has no bearing on a group’s ability to complete the event.

The funniest part is that there achievements that require you to break the healing crystals AND one to kill him without him ever flying. If those players ruining the event were actually achievement hunters as you say, wouldn’t it make sense to try for those too? Or those are too hard?

Achievements that require 50 people to act simultaneous like well-trained monkeys hold no interest to me. Yeah, it’s hard. I’ve thrown some CC at the dragon once and the bar didn’t break. It was out of my hands and so it isn’t worth my time.

What’s wrong with being selfish?

What’s wrong with being selfish In a cooperative environment? I wonder really.

I chose not to be part of that cooperative environment. It’s terribly presumptuous of you and terribly selfish too, to expect everyone to cooperate to achieve the things you want to achieve. I do my own thing and ask nothing of anyone.

Let’s add open world PVP then so everyone can be selfish while ruining the fun of others.

Let’s not resort to nonsense to defend an indefensible position.

But it’s more than that and beyond this single thread. Folks like Manasa are those who complain about Raiding and/or other not-so-casual events of HoT, so we now see exactly why. They can’t be carried there and complete the content while others are doing all the work and they just stand still and tag along for the achievements.

I would urge you not to spread lies about me.

I never post lies.

And I thought the “zerker wannabies” and “meta followers” were toxic and working against the community. It appears that you can be toxic, unfriendly, selfish, ruin the experience for others, without following any meta nor being an elitist.

I earned every achievement I have except the ones awarded to me because of bugs. There have been those. If I ever ruined anyone’s experience, I hope it was yours. I never even chat in the game except in guild chat, and to whisper people advice if they ask for it a second time and no one answers. So I don’t know why you’d think I’m toxic and unfriendly. People don’t even notice me when I’m walking around doing my thing. I’ve never, ever, had someone tell me off for anything, except some kitten who whispered thrash about my mother in game because of some thing I posted on these forums. I reported him and blocked him without engaging him in conversation. I’ve never seen him or her online since.

So, please reign it in. And stop telling lies about me.

(edited by Manasa Devi.7958)

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Posted by: maddoctor.2738

maddoctor.2738

Throwing around healing would be something I’d never do at all, so definitely not a “natural” achievement. Neither would be the turret or mortar achievement. You wouldn’t see me man one of those if there wasn’t a reward for it.

The mortars can be used to break the bar too. Much like how the Teq turrets work, they are essential for the fight. The healing achievement is very easy to achieve just takes a bit of spamming the healing skill but that will hardly take any time at all. It also teaches players that use the mortars to heal their team mates on the field and not go afk spamming their skill. In a sense even those achievements are teaching players how to play the event.

It’s the most unnatural achievement there is, and I don’t expect many people to learn to do it, because it’s pointless to break that bar, it has no bearing on a group’s ability to complete the event.

Yet it doesn’t take time, nor any kind of skill to participate in it does it?

Achievements that require 50 people to act simultaneous like well-trained monkeys hold no interest to me. Yeah, it’s hard. I’ve thrown some CC at the dragon once and the bar didn’t break. It was out of my hands and so it isn’t worth my time.

Yet they are actual achievements for the achievement hunter you claim are all over the event. And really using a couple of CC skills to break the bars of the Healing Crystals isn’t hard at all, just a couple of players are needed for each crystal and it is enough. The Shatterer breakbar is being looked at and they will reduce it, are you going to try breaking the bar if it needs 20 people to break it instead of 50? Or still too much?

I chose not to be part of that cooperative environment.

And they said the Guild Wars 2 community is a nice one. I guess they weren’t telling the truth if players do not want to be part of a cooperative environment and help their fellow players. Or maybe you are just a tiny minority and not all “achievement hunters” are like this, which is the most probable thing.

So I don’t know why you’d think I’m toxic and unfriendly.

I hope this is enough of an answer:

I chose not to be part of that cooperative environment.

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Posted by: DoctorDing.5890

DoctorDing.5890

<snip>… a troll post by a selfish jerk.

No need to be rude, m8.

Shatterer Break Bar - A bit too much

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Posted by: Manasa Devi.7958

Manasa Devi.7958

The mortars can be used to break the bar too. Much like how the Teq turrets work, they are essential for the fight.

Why do you keep talking about the break bar? Breaking the bar is completely inconsequential to the fight, so using the turret to break the bar is not a natural thing to do to progress the event. It’s only good for two achievements.

I never get on turrets/mortars or any such contraptions because I don’t like to stand still. Standing still in an action combat system does not come naturaly to me.

It’s the most unnatural achievement there is, and I don’t expect many people to learn to do it, because it’s pointless to break that bar, it has no bearing on a group’s ability to complete the event.

Yet it doesn’t take time, nor any kind of skill to participate in it does it?

It takes motivation, unity of purpose, and proper awareness of the mechanics. None of those are things you can take for granted.

Achievements that require 50 people to act simultaneous like well-trained monkeys hold no interest to me. Yeah, it’s hard. I’ve thrown some CC at the dragon once and the bar didn’t break. It was out of my hands and so it isn’t worth my time.

Yet they are actual achievements for the achievement hunter you claim are all over the event. And really using a couple of CC skills to break the bars of the Healing Crystals isn’t hard at all, just a couple of players are needed for each crystal and it is enough. The Shatterer breakbar is being looked at and they will reduce it, are you going to try breaking the bar if it needs 20 people to break it instead of 50? Or still too much?

I don’t care about the breakbar. I don’t care about those achievements. I never said I care about all achievements. In fact, I explicitly state that I don’t care about those achievements in the text you quoted. Why do you appear to tell me that I should care? Are you projecting? Are you jumping down my throat because you can’t find 50 monkeys to break your bar? Again, so you get it this time: the bar is none of my concern and neither are the achievements related to it.

I chose not to be part of that cooperative environment.

And they said the Guild Wars 2 community is a nice one. I guess they weren’t telling the truth if players do not want to be part of a cooperative environment and help their fellow players. Or maybe you are just a tiny minority and not all “achievement hunters” are like this, which is the most probable thing.

Why do you keep calling me an achievement hunter? Because there’s a few I want to do at the Shatterer? There are plenty of achievements that don’t interest me. I have several completely blank tabs in the achievment overview. I want to score some AP because I’m closing in on the next multiple of 5,000 and some of those Shatterer ones seemed easy. And they were. And when I’m done I won’t be visiting the Shatterer anymore. I’ll be out of your hair even though I’m sure we never met. World bosses don’t interest me. Have fun breaking your bar from your turret.

So I don’t know why you’d think I’m toxic and unfriendly.

I hope this is enough of an answer:

I chose not to be part of that cooperative environment.

You called me toxic and unfriendly before I posted that so that can’t be the answer, unless you have a time machine.

So not interacting with people is toxic? Doing your own thing in a game that’s supposed to be single-player friendly is unfriendly? There must be a lot of toxic and unfriendly people in your game. Everyone who never talked to you or refused to do something that interested you while they were near you regardless of whether or not it interested them. All those people are toxic and unfriendly. You have high standards.

(edited by Manasa Devi.7958)

Shatterer Break Bar - A bit too much

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Posted by: maddoctor.2738

maddoctor.2738

Breaking the bar is completely inconsequential to the fight, so using the turret to break the bar is not a natural thing to do to progress the event.

If you break the bar you prevent him from using one of his attacks that might well down or kill people. Sure it lacks the power of other powerful boss attacks and maybe they should’ve made that particular attack way more powerful to make the achievement (and breaking the bar) more important. For example, like the Wyvern bars.

It takes motivation, unity of purpose, and proper awareness of the mechanics. None of those are things you can take for granted.

At the start maybe. Later on as the community learns the mechanics then it’s different.

I don’t care about the breakbar.

And as I said that’s a problem with the event. The after attack should be a lot more powerful (not causing wipe of course)

So not interacting with people is toxic? Doing your own thing in a game that’s supposed to be single-player friendly is unfriendly?

When your “own thing” can potentially hurt other players then I do find these people toxic hence my comment on adding open PVP in the game. Remember when people were doing their own thing intentionally failing events in order to farm them and preventing others from finishing the event? Remember when people break the Gerent’s breakbar when asked not to? Remember when people use turrets when they have no knowledge on how to (and don’t ask for such knowledge). It’s the same kitten thing with what you are doing.

When you know you can help but you choose not to for “reasons” then you are being at the very least selfish. Yes the bar has problems that they are addressing (namely taking too much CC to break) they will make it easier to break because now it’s punishing larger groups, that’s been said very early in the thread. But that doesn’t change your entire attitude over it.

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Posted by: Manasa Devi.7958

Manasa Devi.7958

Breaking the bar is completely inconsequential to the fight, so using the turret to break the bar is not a natural thing to do to progress the event.

If you break the bar you prevent him from using one of his attacks that might well down or kill people. Sure it lacks the power of other powerful boss attacks and maybe they should’ve made that particular attack way more powerful to make the achievement (and breaking the bar) more important. For example, like the Wyvern bars.

So we’re agreed then, breaking the bar is not particularly important.

It takes motivation, unity of purpose, and proper awareness of the mechanics. None of those are things you can take for granted.

At the start maybe. Later on as the community learns the mechanics then it’s different.

It will be harder than with any other boss to convince people of the importance of breaking that bar when nothing particularly bad happens if you don’t break it, and the event is won regardless. Reviving a few extra people is no big deal.

So not interacting with people is toxic? Doing your own thing in a game that’s supposed to be single-player friendly is unfriendly?

When your “own thing” can potentially hurt other players then I do find these people toxic hence my comment on adding open PVP in the game. Remember when people were doing their own thing intentionally failing events in order to farm them and preventing others from finishing the event?

I vaguely remember reading about it on the forum.

Remember when people break the Gerent’s breakbar when asked not to?

Actually, I’ve seen people ask that once. I have no idea why. The request came without explanation and I couldn’t be bothered to stand still to ask why. The bar was in fact broken every time it appeared and the battle was won regardless. I have no idea what that was about and I don’t particularly care. If there is an actual reason not to break the bar, that’s stupid. How can you expect people to properly deal with defiance bars if it’s not even clear if you should break it or not?

Remember when people use turrets when they have no knowledge on how to (and don’t ask for such knowledge). It’s the same kitten thing with what you are doing.

If players can mess up an event by being present and pursuing that event’s achievements, something is terribly wrong with the event or the achievements, not with what those players are doing. I would encourage those players to keep doing what they are doing so the event keeps failing, every single time. That way the event or the achievements might be fixed instead of being left to rot, like so many things are in this game.

When you know you can help but you choose not to for “reasons” then you are being at the very least selfish.

Not helping is not selfish, it’s being apathetic at worst. And I will admit to being apathetic. If we have to help people every time we’re around people, how are we going to get things done for ourselves. Especially when we go to the place we’re going for the express purpose of doing the thing we’re doing. Other people are not more important than I am on an objective scale, and they certainly aren’t more important than I am, on own my subjective scale.

Yes the bar has problems that they are addressing (namely taking too much CC to break) they will make it easier to break because now it’s punishing larger groups, that’s been said very early in the thread. But that doesn’t change your entire attitude over it.

I don’t really see what my attitude has to do with that bar. Or the bar with my attitude. I had the Shatterer sit on me. I dodged some lightning while throwing some healing kits at people. I fired a mortar and a turret too. I freed some people from crystals, which came as a surprise because I’ve never even seen those crystals. Probably a serendipitous side effect from using barrage. I’m happy. I might be back when some of the other achievements actually register. But the bar, none of my concern, because I have no control over whether or not it will break at any given time.

(edited by Manasa Devi.7958)

Shatterer Break Bar - A bit too much

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Posted by: maddoctor.2738

maddoctor.2738

So we’re agreed then, breaking the bar is not particularly important.

I never said it was in fact they should update his attack after he flies up so it gets much more important.

It will be harder than with any other boss to convince people of the importance of breaking that bar when nothing particularly bad happens if you don’t break it, and the event is won regardless. Reviving a few extra people is no big deal.

Well the question then becomes: why not break it?

If players can mess up an event by being present and pursuing that event’s achievements, something is terribly wrong with the event or the achievements, not with what those players are doing. I would encourage those players to keep doing what they are doing so the event keeps failing, every single time. That way the event or the achievements might be fixed instead of being left to rot, like so many things are in this game.

But you can get the achievements while doing the events properly that’s the whole point. Sure you might be able to dodge one less laser if you drop bombs before going back to glide again is that such a big deal? Or you might kill a few less branded if you focus on the crystals (or Shatterer) why is that such a big deal for you? In the end you miss 1 progress and get other achievements in the process what’s your problem?

Nice logic btw to encourage players to fail events on purpose. You are using the same logic as all the above examples I mentioned.

Not helping is not selfish, it’s being apathetic at worst.

When you encourage players to ruin events then yes you are indeed being selfish and that’s what you said above.

But the bar, none of my concern, because I have no control over whether or not it will break at any given time.

But you do have control over it just like you have control over all the other achievements.

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Posted by: Manasa Devi.7958

Manasa Devi.7958

But you can get the achievements while doing the events properly that’s the whole point. Sure you might be able to dodge one less laser if you drop bombs before going back to glide again is that such a big deal? Or you might kill a few less branded if you focus on the crystals (or Shatterer) why is that such a big deal for you? In the end you miss 1 progress and get other achievements in the process what’s your problem?

My problem is that I want to stop doing Shatterer as soon as I can. If I can limit myself to 3 or 4 runs, that’s good. If I need many more to get those achievements, that’s not good because that’s not going to happen. I don’t do world bosses as a rule because they don’t interest me after a few runs. And I certainly don’t want to play content that I have to keep checking the time for, even if it did interest me.

Nice logic btw to encourage players to fail events on purpose. You are using the same logic as all the above examples I mentioned.

If people are doing exactly what they need to be doing to complete achievements, they’re playing the game how it’s meant to be played. If an achievement tells you to dodge lightning 20 times, and you’re doding lightning, are you telling me that’s wrong? If that conflicts with other people’s priorities, the game is at fault, not the players. And if the game is at fault, it’s in everybody’s best interest that the fault be made apparent, or it will never be fixed. Where’s the fault in that logic? Your point of view requires us to see some people’s priorities as more important than other people’s priorities. And of course you pick the side that coincides with your interests. That’s selfish.

Not helping is not selfish, it’s being apathetic at worst.

When you encourage players to ruin events then yes you are indeed being selfish and that’s what you said above.

No, you are being selfish for denying people their achievements in the timeframe that they want them. Terribly selfish.

But the bar, none of my concern, because I have no control over whether or not it will break at any given time.

But you do have control over it just like you have control over all the other achievements.

No, I don’t. I can contribute and hope enough people do so it works. That’s not control. That’s being at the mercy of other people. If you think differently, tell me, how can I break the bar? In event runs where the players don’t even have what it takes to defeat the dragon. Because that’s the kind of events I’ve been faced with in my early morning runs. If you tell me, I’ll break that kitten bar tomorrow morning at my next failed run.

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Posted by: Zoltar MacRoth.7146

Zoltar MacRoth.7146

No… I go there to do what I want to do and what everyone else is doing doesn’t interest me at all. The last 2 times (out of a total of 3) I went there, the event failed, and I was perfectly fine with that. I got 4 achievements out of it and that was for the “work” I did. No one else contributed to that or carried me.

Nice so you go to do such events to get achievements and not to participate in the events themselves. Selfish much?

Your conceit bugged me so much I’ve decided that for the next month I’m going to attend every shatterer and only do the achievements. If I see you, I’ll wave.

(edited by Zoltar MacRoth.7146)

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Posted by: Beldin.5498

Beldin.5498

I’d say, give it a week or 2 and see if people addapt or if it is an actual problem.

This. People just need to learn the mechanics. Instead, folks look on ways to bug things out or just complain it is too difficult because they cannot faceroll the content.

Rather sad.

The problem with many encounters in this game is that many people do NOT want to learn the mechanics. Instead they want the mechanics to be about them and their build of choice, instead of them adapting to the mechanics. Which of course doesn’t make any sense. The player adapts to the content, not the content to the player…

Thats maybe what happens if people only hearsince 3 years :
go zerker, use metabattle build, DPS is king, nothing else matters ^^

And if he is beatable without breaking the bar, i have my doubts that people will learn, since most still don’t even know the double damage spot at Clawmag .. even after years and i posted it in chat hundred times. So far in all those years i have only
twice seen it that we got to phase 2 after 1 icewall.

EVERY MMO is awesome until it is released then its unfinished. A month after release it just sucks.
Best MMOs are the ones that never make it. Therefore Stargate Online wins.

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Posted by: Khisanth.2948

Khisanth.2948

I’d say, give it a week or 2 and see if people addapt or if it is an actual problem.

This. People just need to learn the mechanics. Instead, folks look on ways to bug things out or just complain it is too difficult because they cannot faceroll the content.

Rather sad.

The problem with many encounters in this game is that many people do NOT want to learn the mechanics. Instead they want the mechanics to be about them and their build of choice, instead of them adapting to the mechanics. Which of course doesn’t make any sense. The player adapts to the content, not the content to the player…

Thats maybe what happens if people only hearsince 3 years :
go zerker, use metabattle build, DPS is king, nothing else matters ^^

And if he is beatable without breaking the bar, i have my doubts that people will learn, since most still don’t even know the double damage spot at Clawmag .. even after years and i posted it in chat hundred times. So far in all those years i have only
twice seen it that we got to phase 2 after 1 icewall.

The double damage spots probably shouldn’t exist. At least not in the form they are now where you can deal damage to the enemy before the enemy is there or after they flew off.