Guild Wars 2

Haha smooth, good luck with that! In the meantime, let’s crunch some numbers.

Saulius.8430:

not as ridiculous as pulling numbers out of thin air

Hardly thin air. I personally opened about 5k bags. But if you don’t want to take my word for it, take Wanze’s word for it: while an opponent of change, he did provide info that after opening roughly 100.000 loot bags in 4 months, the success rate of obtaining silver doubloons is much smaller than I calculated:

Wanze.8410:

From those 100k lootbags, nearly half of them were Light Bags of Booty because for me, they have been the most profitable at certain times, when their supply was high, so those are the ones i bought the most.

I wont give you the exact percentage of the Silver Doubloon droprate but you can expect between 0.6-0.9 Silver Doubloons per stack.

One of the bags with Silver Doubloons on the loot table has an average droprate of over 1.0 per stack but usually the value of the other items on the loot table were abysmal, so not really worth it.

So my 60 thousand bags was a generous estimate, believe it or not, which in practice is closer to 75 thousand bags (0,8 doubloon per stack, which is still generous in light of Wanze’s data).

I hope you won’t contest my figures for receiving one bag per three mobs. That was a generous estimate as well. Even if the figure is lower (1 bag per 2,5 mobs), you’d still come close to having to kill 190 thousand mobs to obtain the necessary 75k bags.

Oh, and forging gemstones doesn’t make this any better btw. At a 4% success rate (I’m personally consistently much lower, but I’ll use a more generous estimate), you need about 100 gemstones per doubloon, which means you’ll need 25k gemstones and roughly 6250 forges. So that’s 25.000 gemstones currently hovering at around 2s each…. again, that’s 500g in gemstones and a broken wrist/permanent carpel tunnel syndrome. The only “upside” here is that you also end up with roughly 60g worth of gemstones that you can’t use but can sell at 51g. Making the silver doubloon “only” 1,8g instead of 2g.

Please don’t defend the blatantly unreasonable. And don’t defend a fundemental design flaw and call me, of all people (as I said, I can buy this legendary straight off the TP had it been available) “wanting it easy” in the process. It’s not worth defending that position. You profited from the botter silver doubloon price? Good for you. But don’t obstruct others in trying to obtain a very, very necessary fix to a bug/oversight/design flaw.

Buttercup.5871:

Really? Let’s assume 1 in 3 of the “right” mobs, let’s say centaurs, drops the “right” bag that might contain a doubloon. As I stated above, you need over 60 thousand bags of those bags for 250 doubloons. You are, therefore, proposing that people stick around in level 20 to 35 zones for a year and slay 180.000 centaurs just to get the doubloons. Do you even know how ridiculous that sounds?

((Holds Infinite Light aloft))

Probably better than you do. It’s not theory-craft for me. I’ve DONE IT.

I’m sorry your tastes happen to run in the same direction as people with more gold coin than you, and that you’re getting trampled at the Trading Post. I’m sorry you’re spending your time launching a multi-forum posting crusade instead of going out and being a centaur mass murder. I’m sorry you are constitutionally incapable of placing alts at the end of a jump puzzle for whatever reason. I’m sorry you’re so afraid of Zomorros you won’t even try to get them that way. I’ve even taken it upon myself to do the harvesting and mystic forge combines you won’t to inject more silver doubloons into the system. Without much thanks, I see.

I’ve tried to help you by explaining alternative methods to accelerate your progress. But if all you want is for them to COST LESS, what you really need to do is go over and cheer the Devs on in the “Champ-loot bags have been nerfed” thread, because that one action has done more for your cause than the many, many threads you listed in the OP.

Nike.2631:

Buttercup.5871:

Really? Let’s assume 1 in 3 of the “right” mobs, let’s say centaurs, drops the “right” bag that might contain a doubloon. As I stated above, you need over 60 thousand bags of those bags for 250 doubloons. You are, therefore, proposing that people stick around in level 20 to 35 zones for a year and slay 180.000 centaurs just to get the doubloons. Do you even know how ridiculous that sounds?

((Holds Infinite Light aloft))

Probably better than you do. It’s not theory-craft for me. I’ve DONE IT.

I’m sorry your tastes happen to run in the same direction as people with more gold coin than you, and that you’re getting trampled at the Trading Post. I’m sorry you’re spending your time launching a multi-forum posting crusade instead of going out and being a centaur mass murder. I’m sorry you are constitutionally incapable of placing alts at the end of a jump puzzle for whatever reason. I’m sorry you’re so afraid of Zomorros you won’t even try to get them that way. I’ve even taken it upon myself to do the harvesting and mystic forge combines you won’t to inject more silver doubloons into the system. Without much thanks, I see.

I’ve tried to help you by explaining alternative methods to accelerate your progress. But if all you want is for them to COST LESS, what you really need to do is go over and cheer the Devs on in the “Champ-loot bags have been nerfed” thread, because that one action has done more for your cause than the many, many threads you listed in the OP.

Two things.

1. You clearly have not read my posts. You play this ad hominem, which is already a mistake, but you did so without even bothering to read that I can buy this legendary without even bothering with the doubloons. This is not about me. This is – as you undoubtedly have read from my original post – about hundreds of people raising a valid concern over the last year.

2. You clearly have not read my posts. Yea, it’s number 2 as well. This time, you didn’t bother to read that this wasn’t about the cost – the cost is merely a nasty side-effect of the cause. The cause being that the item cannot be obtained by a level 80 character through normal, intended gameplay. I don’t care how many shady methods you tell me to acquire this item by. They remain that, shady, and it shouldn’t be that way. It encourages clearly unintended gameplay.

Then take it as directed at the generic ‘you’ you are so bravely championing.

Simple truth is if I can stack up 25 silver doubloons in two weeks and a total play time of under an hour without being even interested in the result, I DON’T BELIEVE YOUR PREMISE that they are too hard to get.

60 minutes over 14 days is 4.2 minutes a day… thats some efficiebt farming

Nike.2631:

Then take it as directed at the generic ‘you’ you are so bravely championing.

Simple truth is if I can stack up 25 silver doubloons in two weeks and a total play time of under an hour without being even interested in the result, I DON’T BELIEVE YOUR PREMISE that they are too hard to get.

You’re essentially telling me to to delete three of my nine characters just so that they can do nothing but be a level 21 piggy bank and open chests at jumping puzzles they never really did. Or buy three additional character slots solely for this purpose instead.

I will not accept this kind of unintended gameplay. I’d rather bleed and buy the legendary straight from the TP than do that. It’s wrong.

Warcry.1596:

60 minutes over 14 days is 4.2 minutes a day… thats some efficiebt farming

Yes it is.

It takes seconds to log in an alt and click a chest. Multiply by 5 and it’s still under a minute. I counted my time messing with the Mystic forge in there too.

I DON’T expect everyone to do this, I just would like people to understand that when I do it I then sell them and I’m not raising the prices (I’m selling instantly to the highest standing offer). You ‘enemy’ in this process is all the other players who want the same legendary as you do and who like you, are turning to the TP to get there.

When they finally unveil a new wave of Legendaries, I think this problem will self-correct in a big way – people’s focus on the current set of Legendaries will be divided up over a much larger field. It’s possible one of the new ones will also require the gift of Quicksilver, but if not, your relief is already inbound. Stand by.

Buttercup.5871:

Nike.2631:

Then take it as directed at the generic ‘you’ you are so bravely championing.

Simple truth is if I can stack up 25 silver doubloons in two weeks and a total play time of under an hour without being even interested in the result, I DON’T BELIEVE YOUR PREMISE that they are too hard to get.

You’re essentially telling me to to delete three of my nine characters just so that they can do nothing but be a level 21 piggy bank and open chests at jumping puzzles they never really did. Or buy three additional character slots solely for this purpose instead.

I will not accept this kind of unintended gameplay. I’d rather bleed and buy the legendary straight from the TP than do that. It’s wrong.

Well, I’m certainly hinting that for a fraction of what you’d spend buying the 250 silver doubloons you could buy more character slots – and after you’ve built juggernaut they’ll continue to net you a substantial profit for trivial effort. Some economic solutions are lateral.

Option A: Farm Silver Doubloons from JP chests using low level characters
Pros – SDs for free if they drop from chest
Cons – Time consuming

Option B: Buy Silver Doubloons from TP
Pros – Get SDs instantly
Cons – Costly

Option C: Complain about availability and price.
Pros – Helps to release frustrations by venting, and let’s Devs know how you feel
Cons – Does not add SDs to your inventory

People have different options available to them in this game. Each of us makes the choice to go with the option we’re comfortable with. But remember, just because you pick an option you like, it doesn’t mean it’s the best choice.

Nike that isnt farming! That’s opening what you already farmed :p

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Option A: Farm Silver Doubloons from JP chests using low level characters
Pros – SDs for free if they drop from chest
Cons – Time consuming

Option B: Buy Silver Doubloons from TP
Pros – Get SDs instantly
Cons – Costly

Option C: Complain about availability and price.
Pros – Helps to release frustrations by venting, and let’s Devs know how you feel
Cons – Does not add SDs to your inventory

---

People have different options available to them in this game. Each of us makes the choice to go with the option we’re comfortable with. But remember, just because you pick an option you like, it doesn’t mean it’s the best choice.

Option C clearly isn’t the easiest option. But I’ll go with that I think is right. And unintended gameplay – or the promotion thereof – isn’t right. Neither is saying nothing about it when you know it’s wrong. In fact, it’s even worse if you defend it and you know it’s wrong. But we’ll leave that discussion for another time.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

(…)
Option C: Complain about availability and price.
Pros – Helps to release frustrations by venting, and let’s Devs know how you feel
Cons – Does not add SDs to your inventory

(…)

You forgot the entertainment value.

But seriously, while I don’t particularly care about the item in question, or the fact that the game design seems to encourage this type of “farming” (perhaps the jumping puzzles should be nerfed? honestly the chests should only be lootable if you did the puzzle from start to finish) as long as Anet does not come out and say that it’s intended I look at it as a mistake, simply because (on top of my head) nothing else follows this pattern.

I made the Gift of the Juggernaut a long while ago when SDs were 10% as expensive as they are now. I quit the game for the early part of 2013 and when I returned and saw that the price of the Silver Doubloons was hitting almost 2 gold each, the only thing I felt was a mix of disgust and shame. It’s long overdue for a Mystic Forge recipe, and until then it will remain the same absurdly scarce and therefore atrociously abused market commodity it is now.

I seem to recall that sharing and discussing game exploits over the forum are against the terms of service. Repeatedly and systematically bypassing content for the reward is clearly an exploit.

~The More You Know~

Clockwork Bard.3105:

I seem to recall that sharing and discussing game exploits over the forum is against the game’s terms of service. Repeatedly and systematically bypassing content for the reward is clearly an exploit.

~The More You Know~

I would love for you to point out where in this thread has discussions of exploits.

I am still wondering why this is an issue? They aren’t even that expensive when compared with some of the other legendary components.

A lot of things in this game are RNG, we all know most players don’t like that and in many cases you can simply buy them from the TP. That is not my preferred way and I understand it isn’t what most want, but that is how this game has and continues to operate.

Smooth Penguin.5294:

I would love for you to point out where in this thread has discussions of exploits.

Means of repeatedly farming rewards without doing the content. It’s not the main topic of discussion, but has come up repeatedly. I like my account staying active, so that’s as deep as I’m going on the matter. I just thought I’d mention it for people’s benefit. Folks used to get banned for less.

Clockwork Bard.3105:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

I would love for you to point out where in this thread has discussions of exploits.

Means of repeatedly farming rewards without doing the content. It’s not the main topic of discussion, but has come up repeatedly. I like my account staying active, so that’s as deep as I’m going on the matter. I just thought I’d mention it for people’s benefit. Folks used to get banned for less.

Camping a character at the end of a Jumping Puzzle isn’t an exploit. Due to the fact that nearly all world jumping puzzles are not instanced, if you log out while your character is there, he’ll always log in at the same spot.

In this sense, do you consider leaving a character next to a Trading Post rep an exploit? By logging into the game with that specific character, I’m able to gain access to the Trading Post without using one of those portable TP consumables from the Gem Store.

KOPPER.1458:

I am still wondering why this is an issue? They aren’t even that expensive when compared with some of the other legendary components.

Huh? Other than the precursor, what legendary component – or in this case, sub component – is more expensive? I’d really like to know.

When it comes to gift recipes, even legendaries that require charged lodestones are twice as cheap.

Buttercup.5871:

Smooth Penguin.5294:

Option A: Farm Silver Doubloons from JP chests using low level characters
Pros – SDs for free if they drop from chest
Cons – Time consuming

Option B: Buy Silver Doubloons from TP
Pros – Get SDs instantly
Cons – Costly

Option C: Complain about availability and price.
Pros – Helps to release frustrations by venting, and let’s Devs know how you feel
Cons – Does not add SDs to your inventory

---

People have different options available to them in this game. Each of us makes the choice to go with the option we’re comfortable with. But remember, just because you pick an option you like, it doesn’t mean it’s the best choice.

Option C clearly isn’t the easiest option. But I’ll go with that I think is right. And unintended gameplay – or the promotion thereof – isn’t right. Neither is saying nothing about it when you know it’s wrong. In fact, it’s even worse if you defend it and you know it’s wrong. But we’ll leave that discussion for another time.

Option D’: Get a lv 80 to WvW and farm the Skritt on the upper left area of each borderland. The bags go for 16 silver each on TP and have low chances for silver doubloons.

Pro: A level 80 option exists guys.
con: You need to be able to farm in WvW unimpeded.

Yumiko Ishida.3769:

Option D’: Get a lv 80 to WvW and farm the Skritt on the upper left area of each borderland. The bags go for 16 silver each on TP and have low chances for silver doubloons.

Pro: A level 80 option exists guys.
con: You need to be able to farm in WvW unimpeded.

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!! Why are you sharing this?!?!?!?

I shared it once before in my own thread and another twice already it was ignored as most of my intelligent constructive posts are.

Barely anyone does in it TC since the bots were removed form WvW. Infact, I believe every level of “skritt bag of shinies” has a chance of all douboon types in it (except t1).

Yumiko Ishida.3769:

I shared it once before in my own thread and another twice already it was ignored as most of my intelligent constructive posts are.

Barely anyone does in it TC since the bots were removed form WvW. Infact, I believe every level of “skritt bag of shinies” has a chance of all douboon types in it (except t1).

You’re not supposed to share trade secrets of farmers

I commend you for being so forthcoming by sharing your knowledge with the masses.

Time to move to other money making areas when competition drops bag profits

I’m the opposite actually, I favor smaller bag prices, meaning I do not sell my bags directly. Changes to Orr and lack of people in Orr ruined the Heavy Moldy Bag prices for me. They are near 5 s a bag and I can’t afford that price (in bulk of 1000) based on how I make money and my methods.

Its why I shared it three times. I sell the contents keep what I need (lodestones).

Killing 190,000 skritt won’t solve the inherent design problem, but it may help depending on how many people pick this up.

I doubt though that zergs will kill skritt rather than defend their keep or attack that of their opponent during a WvW season that rewards winners. So, more likely, it will attract farmers that take up a valuable spot on full WvW servers. Personally speaking, when I WvW, I want to help my server (gold league, currently 2nd place) win.

I was mistake on the number of charged lodestones for the legendary weapons. Still Mjolnir and Infinite Light require more and aren’t even legendary weapons. They aren’t even ascended at this point.

You can farm chests for these, combine pebbles in the forge, and open bags just to name a few ways of getting them. I don’t see them as any worse than charged lodestones and in some ways are far easier for me to get. I see 3-6 a week without trying. (these are from chests)

what players seem to really want is an easy recipe for copper to silver. This wasn’t left out on accident and obtaining them wasn’t a mistake either. Perhaps the low level requirement was unintentional but these mats are meant to be a pain to get. Design flaw or not there isn’t an easy fix that won’t hurt the market currently. I also see tons of the hammers all over the place, so it can’t be too hard to make.

KOPPER.1458:

I was mistake on the number of charged lodestones for the legendary weapons. Still Mjolnir and Infinite Light require more and aren’t even legendary weapons. They aren’t even ascended at this point.

You can farm chests for these, combine pebbles in the forge, and open bags just to name a few ways of getting them. I don’t see them as any worse than charged lodestones and in some ways are far easier for me to get. I see 3-6 a week without trying. (these are from chests).

Did you read the part in this thread that opening 75 thousand bags, or forging 25 thousand pebbles isn’t a solution? Or forcing people to make alts to reap rewards for puzzles they didn’t do? Before you skip reading them too and respond anyway: these are generous estimates, the real numbers are likely higher (and not cheaper either, although that is merely a nasty side effect of the core design problem).

coglin.1867:

Design flaw? That’s a bit of a hyperbole don’t you think? Why in the world would you need alts? You farm them just they way you farm lodestones, or upper tier mats.

No, you don’t. Lodestones and upper tier mats drop from endgame mobs and champ boxes. And they have far better drop rates.
The only way to “farm” silver doubloons with drop rates is by using an army of lowlevel alts camped in jumping puzzles – a single alt can get you one-two doubloons per week.
You can also farm certain loot bags, but even the best ones contain doubloons at a rate of less than one doubloon per whole bag stack.
No, reliable farming of doubloons does not get even close to reliable farmings of lodestones. Which has the visible effect on the price.

I was wrong. The Heavy Bags of Skritt Shinies are now 29.01 s each now!
Yet no one bothers with the toxic offshoot there in wvw obviously.

look at that margin!

Yes, let’s all fill up 2-hour-queue WvW servers with people that only want to farm skritt for silver doubloons! Brilliant idea, I’m sure you’ll get a lot of support for that.

The recipe is obviously missing.

I don’t know why it’s taking so long to put it in the game.

It could not possibly be intended.

Buttercup.5871:

Yes, let’s all fill up 2-hour-queue WvW servers with people that only want to farm skritt for silver doubloons! Brilliant idea, I’m sure you’ll get a lot of support for that.

No! We can’t have that! It would be bet to farm it when we have 100% of land in control and we are a comfortable lead say, Fridays?

It is not comparative to other legendary ingredients. If it was 100g or even 200g it wouldn’t be so bad, but it is gonna cost more to get these doubloons than the precursor. The method of obtaining these is bad. Having 4 or 5 character slots tied up in farming these is ridiculous although probably the easiest most reliable way of doing so outside of straight up farming the gold for them. This is the only part of the legendary I have made 0 progress on from regular game play.

They need to drop more and be craftable.

I believe it used to be much cheaper and cost effective to go Zommoros-way with these. I have only 38 BECAUSE I have been putting it off, but last week tried combining low level gems about 10 times+ and none would turn up. Does anyone know if ANet banned Silver Doubloons from the Mystic forge (I used to get several in a row, and I am not the “lucky” type.)

If they were removed from the MF, then I would totally agree it’s silly and more alternate ways to get them should be available. “Parking” characters on JP’s chests and whatnot can’t be intended gameplay to obtain these Doubloons, and not all players have free character slots to be used in such fashion (not saying it’s “wrong” for people to do this, but rather that it is totally weird it may be the “best” way to get them.)

If one could get a Precursor from the Forge by luck, hopefully the Doubloons are still available, since all that removing that method would do is make the prices even higher-which is why I am asking if anyone knows if anything changed while I wasn’t looking.

Star Ace.5207:

I believe it used to be much cheaper and cost effective to go Zommoros-way with these. I have only 38 BECAUSE I have been putting it off, but last week tried combining low level gems about 10 times+ and none would turn up. Does anyone know if ANet banned Silver Doubloons from the Mystic forge (I used to get several in a row, and I am not the “lucky” type.)

If they were removed from the MF, then I would totally agree it’s silly and more alternate ways to get them should be available. “Parking” characters on JP’s chests and whatnot can’t be intended gameplay to obtain these Doubloons, and not all players have free character slots to be used in such fashion (not saying it’s “wrong” for people to do this, but rather that it is totally weird it may be the “best” way to get them.)

If one could get a Precursor from the Forge by luck, hopefully the Doubloons are still available, since all that removing that method would do is make the prices even higher-which is why I am asking if anyone knows if anything changed while I wasn’t looking.

They still drop from MF. Got a few the other day. Still ridiculous the amount of time waste simple from doubloons compared to other sub mats takes though.

Banzie.5248:

Star Ace.5207:

I believe it used to be much cheaper and cost effective to go Zommoros-way with these. I have only 38 BECAUSE I have been putting it off, but last week tried combining low level gems about 10 times+ and none would turn up. Does anyone know if ANet banned Silver Doubloons from the Mystic forge (I used to get several in a row, and I am not the “lucky” type.)

If they were removed from the MF, then I would totally agree it’s silly and more alternate ways to get them should be available. “Parking” characters on JP’s chests and whatnot can’t be intended gameplay to obtain these Doubloons, and not all players have free character slots to be used in such fashion (not saying it’s “wrong” for people to do this, but rather that it is totally weird it may be the “best” way to get them.)

If one could get a Precursor from the Forge by luck, hopefully the Doubloons are still available, since all that removing that method would do is make the prices even higher-which is why I am asking if anyone knows if anything changed while I wasn’t looking.

They still drop from MF. Got a few the other day. Still ridiculous the amount of time waste simple from doubloons compared to other sub mats takes though.

Well, if they do, you gotta admit this is actually the easiest, though not necessarily cheapest method? At least the more affordable way after the character “parking” method. I am going to do combine a few right now and see if they still “drop” in the Forge for me (thanks for the answer.)

Star Ace.5207:

Banzie.5248:

Star Ace.5207:

I believe it used to be much cheaper and cost effective to go Zommoros-way with these. I have only 38 BECAUSE I have been putting it off, but last week tried combining low level gems about 10 times+ and none would turn up. Does anyone know if ANet banned Silver Doubloons from the Mystic forge (I used to get several in a row, and I am not the “lucky” type.)

If they were removed from the MF, then I would totally agree it’s silly and more alternate ways to get them should be available. “Parking” characters on JP’s chests and whatnot can’t be intended gameplay to obtain these Doubloons, and not all players have free character slots to be used in such fashion (not saying it’s “wrong” for people to do this, but rather that it is totally weird it may be the “best” way to get them.)

If one could get a Precursor from the Forge by luck, hopefully the Doubloons are still available, since all that removing that method would do is make the prices even higher-which is why I am asking if anyone knows if anything changed while I wasn’t looking.

They still drop from MF. Got a few the other day. Still ridiculous the amount of time waste simple from doubloons compared to other sub mats takes though.

Well, if they do, you gotta admit this is actually the easiest, though not necessarily cheapest method? At least the more affordable way after the character “parking” method. I am going to do combine a few right now and see if they still “drop” in the Forge for me (thanks for the answer.)

Update: Only 3 Silver Doubloons with just about 6 gold spent on gems/marks. BUT I may have been unlucky. I think percentages were better in the past (like MUCH better) but who knows. If I was able to get them with 50% more frequency, it wouldn’t be that bad (with 41 Doubloons, I need 420+ gold to get the remainder, which I won’t do-this is the reason why I honestly don’t grind for the Legendary, but it’s hard to see how casual play can achieve the Doubloons component on its own, even over 3 years… and I have been playing since headstart.)

I also blame the “meta fever” of the Warrior Hammer build. I hate that it’s going to be nerfed due to FotM builds I DO NOT use (I used Hammer long before it was the popular choice), but hopefully it will help prices as demand lowers.

Buttercup.5871:

Malediktus.9250:

Wrong forum, this is definatly not even close to a bug.

Mal, you have already explained you take this position because you don’t want your juggernaut to become “less valuable”. Stop being so selfish and obstruct everyone’s efforts for a bug fix at every step of the way.

Which is funny because i bet Malediktus.9250 got his when they were really cheap, early on

Also the dredge near the end of dredgehaunt cliffs and the beginning of Timberline falls drop bags that give silver doubloons.. I agree with the OP these things need fixing, (try making a legendary with these things haha) the economy obsession is mostly to blame though.

If you can’t get them through ‘regular’ gameplay, then clearly there is an issue that needs to be fixed.

Alt-parking isn’t regular gameplay, nor is opening 100k bags.

“Did you read the part in this thread that opening 75 thousand bags, or forging 25 thousand pebbles isn’t a solution? Or forcing people to make alts to reap rewards for puzzles they didn’t do? Before you skip reading them too and respond anyway: these are generous estimates, the real numbers are likely higher (and not cheaper either, although that is merely a nasty side effect of the core design problem).”

Why is it not a solution? It certainly isn’t a solution you like, that I understand.

If it is such a problem then why are their hammers everywhere? It’s not a rare legendary to see at all. 2 Guild members are nearly ready to complete theirs and doubloons were not the road block at all.

It’s possible I am simply too ignorant on the subject at hand but I don’t see it to be the glaring problem that some in this thread do.

edit: They haven’t really made getting a precursor easier, I don’t see them making these easier to obtain either or changing the recipe. Would love to be wrong on this but if it’s been ignored this long then I find there is very little hope of change.

Cactus Brawler.7415:

If you can’t get them through ‘regular’ gameplay, then clearly there is an issue that needs to be fixed.

Alt-parking isn’t regular gameplay, nor is opening 100k bags.

You clearly didn’t play the Halloween content.

It’s funny how the traders that make a fortune off of this think it’s ok.