Guild Wars 2

This gear is kind of bad isn’t it?

I mean..you have to sacrifice offensive stats for some defensive stats if your a beserker and you have to sacrifice defensive stats for some offensive stats if your the tanky prefix.

Not really worth it is it?

unless of course the inscription boosts it up high enough to be legit

magic find wvw gear.

its not bad, its optional. some builds excel on this stat combination.

Think about ele and engineers.

And guardians, to some extent.

The helm is very worth it if u are using knights gear regardless of build. its -12 to Power and Precision and the toughness minus is balanced out with vit plus and you gain 3% crit damage.

Zil.3071:

its not bad, its optional. some builds excel on this stat combination.

Name one

It’ll replace MF gear for players secondary armor sets. That way it will provide less of a performance hit when you breeze through PVE. No biggie.

I think that it’ll be popular among Elementalists.

Attunements make Eles so versatile that Celestial helps them in many ways.
Fire and Earth attunement both benefit from Power and Condition damage quite a bit and Water Attunement has Healing skills.
Vitality and Toughness are useful to them for obvious reasons…
Low health, low armor value.

Of course if they are just farming CoF then Zerker is most likely the way to go.

The conversion rate is ridiculously long though. Do the math – a full set takes 5×6= 30 days approx 1 month. Sneaky way to get people just to log in even if they are not going to do their daily.

Khal Drogo.9631:

The conversion rate is ridiculously long though. Do the math – a full set takes 5×6= 30 days approx 1 month. Sneaky way to get people just to log in even if they are not going to do their daily.

Is it sneaky? I thought it was quite obvious. lol

Ryuujin.8236:

Zil.3071:

its not bad, its optional. some builds excel on this stat combination.

Name one

1) D/D eles.
2) R/nodefighter engineers.
3) some more.

Esplen.3940:

And guardians, to some extent.

No, and not to any extent.
There is not one viable guardian build where this kit could be considered better, or even useful, compared to what is currently in game.

What do you think of celestial on Ranger, Bri?

Chopps, rangers are in such a state that it makes little difference what kit one uses …

Having said that, I won’t be crafting medium celestial anytime soon …

Yet somehow I own wvw with my ranger. Guys—listen up! Didn’t you know your profession is better than ranger? WHY YOU LET ME WIN??

What is celestial gear?

I only logged in for 5 minutes total this week to check out changes and logged out.

All stats my man. Like the old triforge pendant or now the trinkets (syzrgy, solaria, lunaria, ancient mursaaat token, rune of divinity etc)

Stats specifically for WvW? Meaning, if you want to be competitive, get celestial?

Not at all! It’s just the new thing to do. Plus, I’m on a mission to get every stat combo for ranger and then make a build for every combo that gets me kills. It’s a proof of concept approach to gaming.

You are free to do as you please, however, note that aquisition of the inscriptions needed to craft a full set (armorsmithing 400) takes about 1 month due to time gating.

By no means is celestial required. A good player could win fights using masterwork gear because skill and build matter more than overall stats.

Chopps.5047:

Not at all! It’s just the new thing to do. Plus, I’m on a mission to get every stat combo for ranger and then make a build for every combo that gets me kills. It’s a proof of concept approach to gaming.

You are free to do as you please, however, note that aquisition of the inscriptions needed to craft a full set (armorsmithing 400) takes about 1 month due to time gating.

By no means is celestial required. A good player could win fights using masterwork gear because skill and build matter more than overall stats.

Lag aka latency matters the most. Even in a dungeon, I press a skill and wait for the skill to pop and nothing.

I was blessed with a good internet connection. Afaik I only lag skills like a 3 way garri fight or world boss. Then all you can really do is autoattack. In fact, it’s hard just to drop a healing sprin in that lag. I wonder if anet is trying to work on that

Celestial sucks.

Sure “stat combos”, but even then it should only ever be a mix of Berserker/Rampagers, which can be fixed by taking Berserker stats on ascended items and Rampagers on exotics. Taking Celestial just makes the player lose the useful stats in exchange for some crap like healing power or vitality which are NEVER useful.

Disclaimer: I talk in a PvE environment only.

Flissy.4093:

Celestial sucks.

Sure “stat combos”, but even then it should only ever be a mix of Berserker/Rampagers, which can be fixed by taking Berserker stats on ascended items and Rampagers on exotics. Taking Celestial just makes the player lose the useful stats in exchange for some crap like healing power or vitality which are NEVER useful.

Disclaimer: I talk in a PvE environment only.

Not if u are running on low HP classes. Its ok to admit that despite your best efforts, u get multi-aggroed and stun locked and out of breakers and have to rely on your health or that little bit of health helps u survive a one shot. If you do the simple math, crit damage trade-off on helm, chest and leggings are the worst ratios for crit damage.

Zil.3071:

its not bad, its optional. some builds excel on this stat combination.

Some builds can use this combination. i don’t think there’s even one that excels on it.

Astralporing.1957:

Zil.3071:

its not bad, its optional. some builds excel on this stat combination.

Some builds can use this combination. i don’t think there’s even one that excels on it.

Again: get a D/D ele in pvp and take celestial. It’s strong. It excels. Some high rank pvp players favour celestial on them. Same for Engineer: any pvp rifle build apart from SD (which has no use in tpvp) excels with celestial.

Both are not underdogs. They are on top of pvp builds.

There’s a number of builds that I can see using it. I’ve personally seen ele, ranger, engineer, guardian, and necro builds that can make very effective use of celestial gear, mostly in WvW or other similar scenarios. Since the total stat allocation via celestial gear is much higher (and note, that’s ignoring the magic find), it frees up points from traits/runes/sigils to be used for specific effects, rather than stats, while maintaining effectiveness in other areas.

So, allow me to provide an example I’ve been tinkering with: http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/elementalist/?1.0|b.0.h1i.8.0.h5|0.0.0.0.0.0|0.7g.0.7g.0.71.0.71.0.7i.0.7i|0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2s.0|k57.a3.0.f5.p56|30.d|1m.20.1u.24.29|e

Since this builder doesn’t have celestial armor yet, I left off armor/trinkets. For a full set of celestial, put in 436 for power, precision, condi damage, toughness, vitality, and healing power, 58 for critical damage, and 44 for magic find. Taking into account the sigil of Corruption, add another 250 condi damage (686 total). You can also assume the presence of around 12 stacks of might and around 50% fury uptime. Two stunbreaks (editor is missing the stunbreaks added to the glyph and signet in the recent balance patch). You apply conditions with massive duration constantly, no matter what you’re doing. Attunement swapping poisons on next attack. 30% chance to burn on crit, with roughly 33% crit chance (not including fury). High bleed applications in earth (3 stacks for a very substantial duration on autoattack, Churning Earth applies 8 stacks). 30% chance to apply either more huge-duration burning (or a long-duration debilitating condition on hit) thanks to Glyph of Elemental Power. It looks almost like a condi build…

And yet, it deals unignorable direct damage: 73% crit damage is reminiscent of a berserker build, the 33% crit chance (boosted to 53% much of the time) is significant enough to apply the high crit damage consistently, and power, while not high by berserker standards, is at least significant (and is further boosted by might, as is condition damage).

Defensively, healing power helps out all of our various heals: Glyph of Elemental Harmony alone gives us over 50% regeneration uptime (if used consistently in water) and scales with a .75 ratio on the direct heal; Cleansing Wave, Water Trident, and Healing Ripple all get a nice 1.0 scaling ratio. Even Soothing Mist gets a tiny ratio (.05 per second, for an extra 29 health/second). While not exactly bunkerish, we also get enough health and armor to soak up a few hits, with over 19% damage reduction via toughness, and over 16,500 health.

You cannot replicate these stats to this extent without celestial gear. You can debate the build’s effectiveness all you want (I’ve found it remarkably effective in small-group combat in WvW), but you cannot ignore the fact that if an opponent has a weakness, this build can find and exploit it. Vulnerable to kiting? Meet perma-cripple. Burst damage? Say hello to constant weakness, significant self-healing, kiting, and significant return burst damage. Forget your condi removal? You’ll get beaten down by conditions. Left your toughness weak? Burst damage via crits will make you wish you hadn’t.

Is it as good for PvE, where direct damage reigns supreme and ‘zerker is often considered the only way to be effective? No, not necessarily, though it’ll still have a blast (pun completely intended). The build isn’t minmaxed for any one thing, and Celestial fits that ethos perfectly.

This is going to be an awesome replacement for my MF gear…..for other stuff, meh. Either way, I like it & will be working on a set for myself.

Kharel Arhew.1437:

[…] The build isn’t minmaxed for any one thing, and Celestial fits that ethos perfectly.

This.

Yeah, I’d like a set for PvE stuff too. I think it would be a lot of fun and let me use some interesting options in my trait trees etc that I would otherwise have to sacrifice for the sake of a more specific build.

Kharel Arhew.1437:

There’s a number of builds that I can see using it. I’ve personally seen ele, ranger, engineer, guardian, and necro builds that can make very effective use of celestial gear, mostly in WvW or other similar scenarios. Since the total stat allocation via celestial gear is much higher (and note, that’s ignoring the magic find), it frees up points from traits/runes/sigils to be used for specific effects, rather than stats, while maintaining effectiveness in other areas.

So, allow me to provide an example I’ve been tinkering with: http://gw2buildcraft.com/calculator/elementalist/?1.0|b.0.h1i.8.0.h5|0.0.0.0.0.0|0.7g.0.7g.0.71.0.71.0.7i.0.7i|0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.0.2s.0|k57.a3.0.f5.p56|30.d|1m.20.1u.24.29|e

Since this builder doesn’t have celestial armor yet, I left off armor/trinkets. For a full set of celestial, put in 436 for power, precision, condi damage, toughness, vitality, and healing power, 58 for critical damage, and 44 for magic find. Taking into account the sigil of Corruption, add another 250 condi damage (686 total). You can also assume the presence of around 12 stacks of might and around 50% fury uptime. Two stunbreaks (editor is missing the stunbreaks added to the glyph and signet in the recent balance patch). You apply conditions with massive duration constantly, no matter what you’re doing. Attunement swapping poisons on next attack. 30% chance to burn on crit, with roughly 33% crit chance (not including fury). High bleed applications in earth (3 stacks for a very substantial duration on autoattack, Churning Earth applies 8 stacks). 30% chance to apply either more huge-duration burning (or a long-duration debilitating condition on hit) thanks to Glyph of Elemental Power. It looks almost like a condi build…

And yet, it deals unignorable direct damage: 73% crit damage is reminiscent of a berserker build, the 33% crit chance (boosted to 53% much of the time) is significant enough to apply the high crit damage consistently, and power, while not high by berserker standards, is at least significant (and is further boosted by might, as is condition damage).

Defensively, healing power helps out all of our various heals: Glyph of Elemental Harmony alone gives us over 50% regeneration uptime (if used consistently in water) and scales with a .75 ratio on the direct heal; Cleansing Wave, Water Trident, and Healing Ripple all get a nice 1.0 scaling ratio. Even Soothing Mist gets a tiny ratio (.05 per second, for an extra 29 health/second). While not exactly bunkerish, we also get enough health and armor to soak up a few hits, with over 19% damage reduction via toughness, and over 16,500 health.

You cannot replicate these stats to this extent without celestial gear. You can debate the build’s effectiveness all you want (I’ve found it remarkably effective in small-group combat in WvW), but you cannot ignore the fact that if an opponent has a weakness, this build can find and exploit it. Vulnerable to kiting? Meet perma-cripple. Burst damage? Say hello to constant weakness, significant self-healing, kiting, and significant return burst damage. Forget your condi removal? You’ll get beaten down by conditions. Left your toughness weak? Burst damage via crits will make you wish you hadn’t.

Is it as good for PvE, where direct damage reigns supreme and ‘zerker is often considered the only way to be effective? No, not necessarily, though it’ll still have a blast (pun completely intended). The build isn’t minmaxed for any one thing, and Celestial fits that ethos perfectly.

Positively orgasmic. My ele is in heaven just thinking about it, and it works wonders for how I play, as I don’t specialize. I tend to be healing my teammates as much as I’m throwing out offensive/defensive boons, and doing damage.

Forestnator.6298:

Astralporing.1957:

Zil.3071:

its not bad, its optional. some builds excel on this stat combination.

Some builds can use this combination. i don’t think there’s even one that excels on it.

Again: get a D/D ele in pvp and take celestial. It’s strong. It excels. Some high rank pvp players favour celestial on them. Same for Engineer: any pvp rifle build apart from SD (which has no use in tpvp) excels with celestial.

Both are not underdogs. They are on top of pvp builds.

The reason We D/D take celestial in PvP is because we cannot fine-tune our gear like we can in PvE with 30% this set 50% that set and 20% another. That is why we don’t wear celestial trinkets in PvE even though we could already fully wear ~50%(I think its actually 48.2%) of our stats as ascended celestial even before before this patch. Celestial only got major use because of the gearing limitations in sPvP not because it’s actually good.

You can get more of everything, without Celestial gear. The advantage of Celestial is simply the ability to get high amounts of magic find without sacrificing another stat too much. If a player is interested in only in stats and not magic find, he is far better off mixing and matching other gear. That is not to say a piece or two isn’t helpful in filling out a build, but full Celestial? At the end of a build with that, add up all the stats and the total points are simply not there. Magic Find eats up too much.

Personally, I think it’s better to mix armor stats than to be an “All in one” gear.

Take for example, I wear berserker’s set gear, but I wear different trinkets according to best survivability. Such as Valkyrie for damage + Vit. Clerics for tough + Healing. Or even PVT trinkets.

Baladir.2736:

You can get more of everything, without Celestial gear. The advantage of Celestial is simply the ability to get high amounts of magic find without sacrificing another stat too much. If a player is interested in only in stats and not magic find, he is far better off mixing and matching other gear. That is not to say a piece or two isn’t helpful in filling out a build, but full Celestial? At the end of a build with that, add up all the stats and the total points are simply not there. Magic Find eats up too much.

No you can’t. Pls do math before talking kitten.

I think it’s amusing that people say that PvE is faceroll easy and then decry something that is totally balanced as terrible. How can anything be terrible in a faceroll easy game?
I’m seriously considering this set for my Engie, Guard, and Ele. I just wnat to mix things up. It will also be nice to have a jack of all trades set once they implement the ability to save builds. If you want to sacrifice a fun way to play because your friends demand zerker in pve, what’s the point of playing?

Forestnator.6298:

Kharel Arhew.1437:

[…] The build isn’t minmaxed for any one thing, and Celestial fits that ethos perfectly.

This.

Technically it’s maxed on MF and Critdamage.

Forestnator.6298:

Baladir.2736:

You can get more of everything, without Celestial gear. The advantage of Celestial is simply the ability to get high amounts of magic find without sacrificing another stat too much. If a player is interested in only in stats and not magic find, he is far better off mixing and matching other gear. That is not to say a piece or two isn’t helpful in filling out a build, but full Celestial? At the end of a build with that, add up all the stats and the total points are simply not there. Magic Find eats up too much.

No you can’t. Pls do math before talking kitten.

Yes I can. I did it long ago. I have every classification of gear on my ele and some of every stat. He is not min maxed. He fits my playstyle having just the balance of toughness and vitality I need to survive. I depend on vigor trait a great deal for defense and built enough crit chance to proc that reliably and in fact also give a proper balance of crit chance and crit damage which provides the majority of my dps. See chart:

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Critical_hit

My condition damage and healing power is just where I want it. In parties with condition damage maxed on a target, I still see my condition damage tick.

I was able, with difficulty, to incorporate the ascended gear which does not give nearly the customization options of exotic gear plus jewels.

Balance does not mean every stat is the same lol. That is not balance because every stat does not have the same weight. That is why celestial does not represent balance. I do not want similar numbers for power and vitality and toughness. That does not give my character balance. Critical damage without proper amounts of critical chance is wasted. The few previous posts that claim such cool stats do so only after adding in all kinds of stats from “other” stuff to get to where a decent built starts. Add the “other” stuff into a decent build and the results are much better.

I Have done the math. I know on my elementalist the trade off on condition vs. direct damage vs. critical damage for the skills and weapons I use. I know the dimishing returns and when to stop putting points into those stats. Power, vitality, toughness, condition damage, healing power, precision, and critical chance are not equal stat point to stat point to one another.

Flissy.4093:

Celestial sucks.

Sure “stat combos”, but even then it should only ever be a mix of Berserker/Rampagers, which can be fixed by taking Berserker stats on ascended items and Rampagers on exotics. Taking Celestial just makes the player lose the useful stats in exchange for some crap like healing power or vitality which are NEVER useful.

Disclaimer: I talk in a PvE environment only.

And this proves you’re a bad player.

If this is “PvE only” then there’s only one right answer: Berserker.

Flissy.4093:

Celestial sucks.

Sure “stat combos”, but even then it should only ever be a mix of Berserker/Rampagers, which can be fixed by taking Berserker stats on ascended items and Rampagers on exotics. Taking Celestial just makes the player lose the useful stats in exchange for some crap like healing power or vitality which are NEVER useful.

Disclaimer: I talk in a PvE environment only.

I would like to see a full berserker team do FotM 48+ effectively, efficiently, and with 0 deaths.

IllegalChocolate.6938:

Flissy.4093:

Celestial sucks.

Sure “stat combos”, but even then it should only ever be a mix of Berserker/Rampagers, which can be fixed by taking Berserker stats on ascended items and Rampagers on exotics. Taking Celestial just makes the player lose the useful stats in exchange for some crap like healing power or vitality which are NEVER useful.

Disclaimer: I talk in a PvE environment only.

I would like to see a full berserker team do FotM 48+ effectively, efficiently, and with 0 deaths.

They do, it’s called take 2 guardians and call me in the morning.

Player Character.9467:

IllegalChocolate.6938:

Flissy.4093:

Celestial sucks.

Sure “stat combos”, but even then it should only ever be a mix of Berserker/Rampagers, which can be fixed by taking Berserker stats on ascended items and Rampagers on exotics. Taking Celestial just makes the player lose the useful stats in exchange for some crap like healing power or vitality which are NEVER useful.

Disclaimer: I talk in a PvE environment only.

I would like to see a full berserker team do FotM 48+ effectively, efficiently, and with 0 deaths.

They do, it’s called take 2 guardians and call me in the morning.

> getting carried by 2 guardians in FOTM48

come talk to me when you can do it without them and I’ll take you seriously

IllegalChocolate.6938:

Flissy.4093:

Celestial sucks.

Sure “stat combos”, but even then it should only ever be a mix of Berserker/Rampagers, which can be fixed by taking Berserker stats on ascended items and Rampagers on exotics. Taking Celestial just makes the player lose the useful stats in exchange for some crap like healing power or vitality which are NEVER useful.

Disclaimer: I talk in a PvE environment only.

I would like to see a full berserker team do FotM 48+ effectively, efficiently, and with 0 deaths.

I have friends who do lvl70+, full berserker. What you have to realize, is that eventually, everything will 1-2 shot you, regardless of gear. Your best choice is to attempt to kill enemies before they can hit you with their big attacks. The reality in PvE, is that defensive stats are worthless ONCE you have good understanding about the games, and your classes mechanics. Berserker is the best at this. Celestial gives you stats which in high-end PvE, aren’t effective.

IllegalChocolate.6938:

Player Character.9467:

IllegalChocolate.6938:

Flissy.4093:

Celestial sucks.

Sure “stat combos”, but even then it should only ever be a mix of Berserker/Rampagers, which can be fixed by taking Berserker stats on ascended items and Rampagers on exotics. Taking Celestial just makes the player lose the useful stats in exchange for some crap like healing power or vitality which are NEVER useful.

Disclaimer: I talk in a PvE environment only.

I would like to see a full berserker team do FotM 48+ effectively, efficiently, and with 0 deaths.

They do, it’s called take 2 guardians and call me in the morning.

> getting carried by 2 guardians in FOTM48

come talk to me when you can do it without them and I’ll take you seriously

can you do high fotm without guards? how do you make up for not having really long projectile reflection/nullification? reroll to swamp, water + 3rd? a guard just makes it 5638105x easier.

cant take you seriously.

Ryuujin.8236:

Zil.3071:

its not bad, its optional. some builds excel on this stat combination.

Name one

If you were a d/d elementalist who kept up with the profession and the better players you would find players using all-stat trinkets.

I don’t remember seeing a lot of celestial amulet users in PvP. Maybe that’s just a lack of experience in the mists though.
Anyway, I(1400+ hours on my ele, full ascended and mainly do WvW) personally don’t see the point in using celestial on an ele. The crit damage and magic find are nice but overall it feels like it lacks a lot. The lack of defensive stats makes it hard to use with 10k base HP and light armor and it isn’t burst enough to make up for it. The condition damage is useless unless you can keep yourself up. The only place I can imagine it being used in WvW is with staff.
I think we closed the case on PvE and celestial :P

IllegalChocolate.6938:

Player Character.9467:

IllegalChocolate.6938:

Flissy.4093:

Celestial sucks.

Sure “stat combos”, but even then it should only ever be a mix of Berserker/Rampagers, which can be fixed by taking Berserker stats on ascended items and Rampagers on exotics. Taking Celestial just makes the player lose the useful stats in exchange for some crap like healing power or vitality which are NEVER useful.

Disclaimer: I talk in a PvE environment only.

I would like to see a full berserker team do FotM 48+ effectively, efficiently, and with 0 deaths.

They do, it’s called take 2 guardians and call me in the morning.

> getting carried by 2 guardians in FOTM48

come talk to me when you can do it without them and I’ll take you seriously

2 Guardians in full berzerker as well? They will get downed easily by the numerous normal mobs unless you are in a guild team that plays together all the time and coordinate your attacks.

Yeah I want to see 5 warriors take on the Fire Shaman. Should be a piece of cake right?

As a staff ele, I looked into celestial and as I can craft a full set, I totalled up the numbers and compared to my current gear.

I found celestial to be overall worse than the items I actually had and that the gain in the new stats really didn’t make up for that which was lost overall.

Celestial really needs to offer a lot more in terms of stat points. The numbers are just too low to make it all round effective.