Guild Wars 2

Asmodeus.5782:

Vayne, large chunks of content from the hearts and early events have been removed and replaced with spamming F or just blown to hell altogether, right? So, seemingly permanent content has been deemed not as permanent as we thought it to be, yes? Mistakes have been made, yes?

Changing how a heart works is VERY VERY different from removing content. As an example, every single AC path was changed to have different bosses and not one single person ever claimed they removed content. But those old bosses were not in the game anymore.

This is making an argument to try to prove a point. Content changes all the time. Battles get nerfed. Things get buffed. When they added elites to the world, no one came and said, look we have new foes..but they were new foes.

The changed some hearts in the early area, they didn’t remove them. And in some cases, they added ways to get those hearts that didn’t exist before.

Vayne.8563:

Tachenon.5270:

Vayne.8563:

There isn’t any more temporary content. The closest we’ve had since the end of the last living story is seasonable or recurring content, which isn’t temporary.

With the September patch, content that had been here from launch turned out to be more ‘temporary content’. As in, poof! Gone.

Give me a break. The heart changes aren’t what people were referring to as temporary content. They were changed, but they’re still in the game as hearts.

It’s funny how people ignore a new zone when they want to say Anet added nothing, but they’re happy to try to point to a change in early hearts as temporary content. This is about as disingenuous as it gets.

Nope, no breaks. Well. Except for the things anet keeps breaking. I mean, revamping. Also, not just talking about the heart changes.

Vayne.8563:

Asmodeus.5782:

Vayne, large chunks of content from the hearts and early events have been removed and replaced with spamming F or just blown to hell altogether, right? So, seemingly permanent content has been deemed not as permanent as we thought it to be, yes? Mistakes have been made, yes?

Changing how a heart works is VERY VERY different from removing content. As an example, every single AC path was changed to have different bosses and not one single person ever claimed they removed content. But those old bosses were not in the game anymore.

This is making an argument to try to prove a point. Content changes all the time. Battles get nerfed. Things get buffed. When they added elites to the world, no one came and said, look we have new foes..but they were new foes.

The changed some hearts in the early area, they didn’t remove them. And in some cases, they added ways to get those hearts that didn’t exist before.

Removing golem in the early Metrica heart was not removing content? Removing underwater events in the same zone because it was too close to entrance was also very different from removing content?

Yeah, the lake in Metrica is the most blatant example. It was removed in its entirety. All mobs, all events, the whole heart. It’s dead, Jim.

Essence Snow.3194:

Yes those numbers account for the launch and the China release and include subs (which most likely are not there anymore).

If you look at glassdoor and several recent ex-employees that have made comments on the matter, the actual base is nowhere near the size of those numbers (300-350).

I’m actually stunned that people think 300-350 people would be able to keep their jobs if their jobs resulted in what we’ve seen in terms of this game. That many people are capable of so much more.

Those glassdoor reviews are fascinating reading, a real eye-opener!

Reading a few of the reviews I was pleased and worried (but not surprised) to see just how closely they are to my own suspicions about ArenaNet.

I wholeheartedly recommend that everyone read them, just google “glassdoor arenanet”.

Pifil.5193:

Essence Snow.3194:

Yes those numbers account for the launch and the China release and include subs (which most likely are not there anymore).

If you look at glassdoor and several recent ex-employees that have made comments on the matter, the actual base is nowhere near the size of those numbers (300-350).

I’m actually stunned that people think 300-350 people would be able to keep their jobs if their jobs resulted in what we’ve seen in terms of this game. That many people are capable of so much more.

Those glassdoor reviews are fascinating reading, a real eye-opener!

Reading a few of the reviews I was pleased and worried (but not surprised) to see just how closely they are to my own suspicions about ArenaNet.

I wholeheartedly recommend that everyone read them, just google “glassdoor arenanet”.

Yes but read them all, not just the ones that agree with your personal pet theories.

Astral Projections.7320:

Essence Snow.3194:

Astral Projections.7320:

Essence Snow.3194:

Astral Projections.7320:

Essence Snow.3194:

Vayne.8563:

No difference in hosting, major difference in bandwidth. It’s not as simple as what he was talking about. Not to mention, a lot of stuff is a lot more expensive today then back then. A staff of 350 in a bigger office is a lot more to maintain than a staff of 50.

But there’s a lot more complexity in getting 150 people playing together on a the same screen at the same time with better graphics. It’s just a different product. It can’t be compared.

There’s not a chance in heck that they have 350 ppl working for Anet on gw2 atm. That might have been the case during development or prior to the china release (although I think KZ took much of that burden), but atm, there’s simply no way.

I was also under the impression that Anet was fond of sub-contractors…….ie many of those that used to work on the game were only there when needed. Thus now since they are not needed, they are not there. This explains why we have minimal reflection from what once was a much larger group.

I’d wager that there’s maybe 35 employees tops at Anet actively working on the game itself atm.

From February 2014: http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2014-01-14-you-thought-that-was-it-for-guild-wars-2

“As for dwindling investment, it appears to be a myth: ArenaNet had a whopping 300 people when Guild Wars 2 launched, and now… now there are 350 and counting – ArenaNet is hiring.”

1/19/2013 size of live teams
http://dulfy.net/2013/01/19/gw2-colin-johanson-mmorpg-livestream-transcript-jan-18/
“In GW1 we had a really small live team because the game wasn’t big enough to generate a consistent revenue. The gems/micro-transaction based model allow us to have a much larger live team in GW2, allowing players to see much more content on a monthly basis.
Our live team in GW2 is 15-20 times larger than the live team in GW1.”

Yes those numbers account for the launch and the China release and include subs (which most likely are not there anymore).

If you look at glassdoor and several recent ex-employees that have made comments on the matter, the actual base is nowhere near the size of those numbers (300-350).

I’m actually stunned that people think 300-350 people would be able to keep their jobs if their jobs resulted in what we’ve seen in terms of this game. That many people are capable of so much more.

Are you saying that from 350 people or so in February 2014, they lost substantial numbers and no one has noticed or commented about it? That’s very interesting. I would have thought that would come out in some sort of business review or note of some kind if they lost that many people in about half a year.

I am saying they included contract employees in that 300-350. They are no longer employed by Anet once their contracts end unless either renewed or a new contract is agreed upon.

Think of it like a builder. They might contract out all the plumbing, electrical, framing, masonry, hvac, roofing, architects, etc….At a time they might actively employ lots of people, but once each contract work is finished they are no longer employed by the builder. The builder really only has a few employees like secretary, superintendent, project manager, etc…

You said, “I’d wager that there’s maybe 35 employees tops at Anet actively working on the game itself atm.”

If there were ~350 people working there in February and now 35 at the most, that would mean over 300 of those employees were contract workers who were let go in the last 6 months. I find it hard to believe that a company of this size and type would have had 85% or more contact/temporary workers. That sounds very unusual.

I would love to see the source where you are getting the information about staffing size and type.

When I said “working on the game itself”, I wasn’t saying that they only had 35 employees total. I meant that of their employees only 35 were actively working on the the actual game. That does not include things such as customer support, liasons, accounting, kitchen staff (yeah they count too in that 350), receptionist….etc etc…

I’ll make this very simple.

I am only basing my “wager” on the amount of game progress we currently are seeing and common sense.

I love how you completely avoid answering posts presenting you with indisputable evidence that content has been removed, Vayne. Discussion with you is a one-of-the-kind experience, truly.

Asmodeus.5782:

I love how you completely avoid answering posts presenting you with indisputable evidence that content has been removed, Vayne. Discussion with you is a one-of-the-kind experience, truly.

When people talked about temporary content, they were talking about content put in for a short time and removed. They weren’t talking about altered content that’s been sitting around for two years. What you’re doing is moving the bar. Including things in a category that isn’t what people were talking about all this time.

It’s disingenuous, and it means nothing.

It’s what most reasonable people would call a red herring.

DeathMetal.8264:

NinjaEd.3946:

Somehow they never fail to release more item mall skins heaven forbid they add aesthetics that can be obtained from playing the game :/
…snip…

You do realize Anet could have altogether removed Gold to Gem conversion right?
By that same idea, all items in the gemstore can be bought, in your own words, “from playing the game”.

Sure, the inflation has gone up, but players who save up and play the game, always have the option to get the items they “want” (thank goodness, it’s NOT about the items we NEED) by playing the game.

You do realize that with the INSANE gold sink that they’ve turned Traits into, that they are also leeching so much out of the game with it that it further forces new players to BUY gems to turn into gold, or BUY gems to get things from the gem store. Its just sad that their gemstore devs are so much more efficient at what they do. Glad I’ve not bought a gem card since April.

Vayne.8563:

Asmodeus.5782:

I love how you completely avoid answering posts presenting you with indisputable evidence that content has been removed, Vayne. Discussion with you is a one-of-the-kind experience, truly.

When people talked about temporary content, they were talking about content put in for a short time and removed. They weren’t talking about altered content that’s been sitting around for two years. What you’re doing is moving the bar. Including things in a category that isn’t what people were talking about all this time.

It’s disingenuous, and it means nothing.

It’s what most reasonable people would call a red herring.

Talking about problems with content being temporary and about other, permanent content, disappearing completely, does not fit into one discussion for you? Whoo-eee, you’re far out.

Q: So what is this company’s focus?

A: Tooltips! No matter how old the content gets, it’s never to late to correct and dedicate half an updates notes to them.

Gambit.8425:

Q: So what is this company’s focus?

A: Tooltips! No matter how old the content gets, it’s never to late to correct and dedicate half an updates notes to them.

lol…It’s funny cause it’s sad

Also include changing item icons which give players a split second of “ooohhhh what did I get” followed prompted by “crap porous bone with new icon”.

Vayne: “Changing how a heart works is VERY VERY different from removing content”
We: There ARE parts of the hearts and in fact whole events connected to hearts that were removed.
Vayne: Thats not a part of this conversation.
Thats right, you’re far out.

Vayne.8563:

Pifil.5193:

Those glassdoor reviews are fascinating reading, a real eye-opener!

Reading a few of the reviews I was pleased and worried (but not surprised) to see just how closely they are to my own suspicions about ArenaNet.

I wholeheartedly recommend that everyone read them, just google “glassdoor arenanet”.

Yes but read them all, not just the ones that agree with your personal pet theories.

Yes, I have read them all, I was reading them during the last half hour or so since my first post and I stand by it.

Asmodeus.5782:

Vayne.8563:

Asmodeus.5782:

I love how you completely avoid answering posts presenting you with indisputable evidence that content has been removed, Vayne. Discussion with you is a one-of-the-kind experience, truly.

When people talked about temporary content, they were talking about content put in for a short time and removed. They weren’t talking about altered content that’s been sitting around for two years. What you’re doing is moving the bar. Including things in a category that isn’t what people were talking about all this time.

It’s disingenuous, and it means nothing.

It’s what most reasonable people would call a red herring.

Talking about problems with content being temporary and about other, permanent content, disappearing completely, does not fit into one discussion for you? Whoo-eee, you’re far out.

I don’t. By the way, I blocked you in game. No clue why you’d add me to your friend’s list. It’s clear we don’t see eye to eye on anything.

For months and months we’ve been talking about temporary content, stuff added to the game with the express purpose of being removed. That WAS the conversation.

Taking out a couple of options from a heart, or even adding in options was never something we talked about. If I talked about all the minor niggling changes to what was added and put in, we could be here for a long time. I could itemize every single item put in and it would be a hell of a lot longer than what they took out.

Retention of old players, induction of new players, and box sales. Along with probably a million other things.

Asmodeus.5782:

laokoko.7403:

Asmodeus.5782:

Once again, confronted with truth, Vayne throws a smoke bomb and vanishes from sight to await a more comfortable post to comment upon!

Is it about feeding cows. I think it’s something really small to worth arguing about.

Granted many people may felt really deeply about feeding the cow with all the black lion key farming run…

A short list of some of the removed content, from the top of my head. It’s very basic, because I strive to avoid starting zones now. They make me sad.

A whole lake in Metrica. Along with the shark, released by the evil scientists. An awesome event, one of the best I remembered from my noobship.

The golem chess and golem assistants with their faulty staves in Metrica.

Taking cannonballs in Plains of Ashford from the skritt, now we only can kill them.

The leopards in the Wayfarer’s heart have 1 skill left of 4, making hunting a boring chore.

We can’t feed the bear cubs in Wayfarer’s.

A whole personal story arc.

We can’t throw mines we pick up on Plains of Ashford to kill the Flame Legion anymore.

Eda no longer sells famous Eda’s apple pie.

The gathering nodes evaporated, to even further the monotony of the early zones.

Vayne, got no problem you blocked me, you’re not a person I’d like to have any closer contact with, just wanted to check your general gamestyle, you being a creature I learned to rather despise due to your way of conducting conversations and effectively opposing any kind of betterment that could’ve come from criticising the Anet’s faulty decisions.

Not being able to feed the bears in Wayfarer Foothills is removing content? So noted. I think everyone can take what they want from that list.

Roybe.5896:

Retention of old players, induction of new players, and box sales. Along with probably a million other things.

You can’t focus on a million things.

Mireles Lore.5942:

This game is about a year away from being free to play. Why? its because “credit card” gamers have become easy and lazy. To these gamers, to compare how long it takes them to earn a in game reward compared to how long it takes them to earn the real money required to buy that reward, and to choose the obviously quicker path, has become a actual rational thought process. This should scare the hale out of people that actually enjoy quality challenges inside games.

It is really the fault of the majority gamer community, because alot of us found it acceptable to translate game progress to the effort of real life currency, this is not a job, you are supposed to play the game to enjoy it, not to earn shiny stuff that give you in game social status. The practice of extracting real world money will not stop until gamers stop the practice.

It’s not solely the gamer’s fault. It’s a feedback loop that both players and developers perpetuate.

When a developer’s idea of adding new content is creating new checklists of things to be repeated in game often enough for new rewards, without actually adding new stuff to do, they are participating in making the game equivalent to a job just like players who compare what it takes to earn in game to a real life job.

When the gameplay becomes an ridiculously long repetition of the same event to get the shiny, it’s natural that people start comparing it to other ridiculously long repetitions like their RL jobs to see the most efficient path to the reward.

But it’s not just the developers fault. The reason they put in “do this a hundred times” to get the reward is because players want to be able to log in for 40 hours a week. No game company, no matter how large, can keep producing that quantity of engaging content. The only way to keep those people busy is to require them to repeat the old stuff over and over for the carrot they want.

So both sides continue to enable each other, and are dissatisfied with the result. Players start to feel the grind, developers are strained trying to keep players satisfied.

It’s not as simple as “lazy gamers” and the “credit card generation”. This same generation made Dark Souls popular. Most of the time people aren’t comparing their RL jobs to the game because the game is difficult, but because rewards are placed behind dull grinds in order to keep people playing longer than the content actually warrants.

Pifil.5193:

Roybe.5896:

Retention of old players, induction of new players, and box sales. Along with probably a million other things.

You can’t focus on a million things.

Well these three things are what the devs discuss in public.

Vayne.8563:

Not being able to feed the bears in Wayfarer Foothills is removing content? So noted. I think everyone can take what they want from that list.

I’d say more than the removal of “content”, the great shame of some of those early area NPE changes is the removal of “character”. A lot of what is now missing is some of the uniqueness that this game used to present to new players as soon as they left the starter instance.

It boggles the mind, when I think about the other MMORPGs I’ve played in beta recently. One of the most common refrains in both of them was that questing was bland and too “kill ten rats”. People expect more variety in a contemporary MMORPG. GW2 had a lot of that variety in it’s starter areas, but a portion was removed because it was just too confusing to new players.

Maybe it has significantly increased player retention. It’s still sad.

Gibson.4036:

Vayne.8563:

Not being able to feed the bears in Wayfarer Foothills is removing content? So noted. I think everyone can take what they want from that list.

I’d say more than the removal of “content”, the great shame of some of those early area NPE changes is the removal of “character”. A lot of what is now missing is some of the uniqueness that this game used to present to new players as soon as they left the starter instance.

It boggles the mind, when I think about the other MMORPGs I’ve played in beta recently. One of the most common refrains in both of them was that questing was bland and too “kill ten rats”. People expect more variety in a contemporary MMORPG. GW2 had a lot of that variety in it’s starter areas, but a portion was removed because it was just too confusing to new players.

Maybe it has significantly increased player retention. It’s still sad.

It’s also relegated to the first hour of play, during which new players are getting their feet under them. I can see why you think it’s sad. I can agree that it’s removal of character…but the character isn’t greatly affected unless you knew it was there in the first place. It’s removal of character to you. The game still has plenty of character left for new players.

When my friend was playing he kept stopping to listen to ambient dialogue. At one point he was listening to two conversations at once and he marveled how one got louder and the other dimmer as he moved between them. This is stuff we take for granted, but a lot of games don’t have.

It’s the attention to detail that always made this game great. Does it matter if you have five skills or one as a snow leapard for a guy playing the game for fifteen minutes….probably no so much.

Vayne – just watch this. Just watch it.

Harper.4173:

Vayne – just watch this. Just watch it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-On3Ya0_4Y

What’s it when it came out. I’m very impressed by it. It almost went viral. Yes the arrow was bugged and this guy got a lot of play from that, among other things. He’s a guy trying to make money by promoting a youtube channel. Not exactly a big deal. He registered an opinon. I’m sure he’s made hundreds of games and really knows his stuff.

Of course I know my stuff too. Anyone can ridicule almost anything if they want to. Some people even make a living at it. Was this supposed to prove something to me?

Vayne.8563:

It’s also relegated to the first hour of play, during which new players are getting their feet under them.

That depends on how one plays. I spent a lot of time thoroughly completing starter zones at launch before moving on, even though that meant I was way over levelled for later zones. A year later, when my wife started playing, she also spent a lot of time in those early zones before moving on. It’s one of the things I like about GW2. You aren’t quickly ushered on to new zones like in other games.

But yes, it’s a small part of the game, relatively speaking.

I can see why you think it’s sad. I can agree that it’s removal of character…but the character isn’t greatly affected unless you knew it was there in the first place. It’s removal of character to you. The game still has plenty of character left for new players.

In a sense, yes. Those players can’t tell me something’s missing that used to be there, because they don’t know. They still, however, are getting something with a little bit less variety.

I work as a professional artist, and I learned long ago that there is a level of detail people will have no idea is missing. I often get people telling me they thought my work was done before I added the final layers. If I didn’t go that extra step, they’d never say it was missing, but going that extra step is what makes people respond so well to my work.

I’m not sure I’m articulating that well. Hopefully you understand what I’m trying to say.

When my friend was playing he kept stopping to listen to ambient dialogue. At one point he was listening to two conversations at once and he marveled how one got louder and the other dimmer as he moved between them. This is stuff we take for granted, but a lot of games don’t have.

This reminds me of shortly after launch when I was looking around inside a tent and some NPCs approached, talking to each other. I was wearing headphones and realized I was hearing their voices pan between the headphones matching where they were with respect to my character. I was stunned, and spent some time just running around listening to sounds while turning my character. It is, indeed, that kind of detail that made me initially love this game.

It’s the attention to detail that always made this game great. Does it matter if you have five skills or one as a snow leapard for a guy playing the game for fifteen minutes….probably no so much.

Yes, you can pretty easily dismiss them as minor things that don’t make a great difference. Still, they add up. It’s the fact that there are hundreds of little details that give the game that polish. If you lose a handful, it’s still a loss.

Over my time with GW2, it got to feel like the original GW2 I loved was dying by the proverbial death of a thousand paper cuts. That’s why I stuck with it as long as I did. There wasn’t one change that made me rage-quit. Even the introduction of Ascended gear, which felt like a betrayal, was easily defended with comments like “But you don’t need ascended because the stat increase is so small”.

The problem is, add enough grains of sand together, and you eventually do end up with a lot of weight.

Vayne.8563:

Alex.9567:

your assertion to brooks law is no more substantial then me drawing a conclusion about anets business practices based on 2 years of gws2, in fact me drawing conclusions from their business practices after 2 years is far more convicting than quoting brooks law, then you say I have something against the direction of the company as if I haven’t made it plainly clearly what and why, you speak of evidence when we’re both obviously speculating conclusions on possibility’s, that’s why I believe youre irrational because you count what you’ve said as evidence when its in fact at the very most just as speculative as the conclusions I’ve made, so yes I do see a pattern, one in which your have a strong subjective bias towards your own opinion.

You obviously can’t tell the difference between refuting a statement to show it’s not necessarily 100% accurate, or making a statement.

I didn’t instigate anything. I didn’t make a statement. I RESPONDED to a statement. That changes the entire dynamic.

If I came into these forums and said, straight out, that adding more people won’t slow down the production of a program, you’d have every right to be saying what you’re saying….but I didn’t do that at all.

I was replying to someone who was making a claim. That is it say, I was showing the POSSIBILITY that what that person was saying, and stating with great certainty, was possibly not as certain as they were claiming. The same about Kekai. I never EVER claimed to know why he left Anet.

I’m simply pointing out possibilities, because someone else claimed to know why.

If you have no evidence, don’t make claims. If you do make claims with no evidence, don’t expect people to just accept what you say. I’m within my right to RESPOND with alternate reasons why this might happen.

If you have evidence, by all means present it. I don’t think you do.

I don’t have evidence either. It’s why I RESPOND to statements like yours rather than MAKING them.

I never made any claims I was also merely pointing out possibility’s, in fact we’re BOTH pointing out possibility’s, the only difference is im challenging anets status quo on the game and youre challenging my arguments in that respect, youre happy to accept brooks law as a basis to why there isn’t any substantial further developments, while I see the reason as anet wishing to continue milking the cash shop, at the end of the day all we have is circumstantial evidence on both sides of the argument, and ill admit there probably is a fair amount of brooks law happening at anet, my whole enquiry into those 2 head ppl that left was to determine to what extent and why, I do however think you are fooling yourself to not give my argument some credence, after all what we have proven through our posts is that it cant be ruled out as a possibility.

Vayne.8563:

Harper.4173:

Vayne – just watch this. Just watch it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D-On3Ya0_4Y

What’s it when it came out. I’m very impressed by it. It almost went viral. Yes the arrow was bugged and this guy got a lot of play from that, among other things. He’s a guy trying to make money by promoting a youtube channel. Not exactly a big deal. He registered an opinon. I’m sure he’s made hundreds of games and really knows his stuff.

Of course I know my stuff too. Anyone can ridicule almost anything if they want to. Some people even make a living at it. Was this supposed to prove something to me?

It’s supposed to prove just how great the original NPE changes were. Just how the company sees new players and just what passes for a good idea.

The fact that he hasn’t made a game doesn’t discredit his opinion. Your logic is flawed to the extreme here.

Real life example : Film critics are rarely know for making films yet make a living off reviewing and knowing what’s what about films.

You don’t need to be a game developer or designer to see poor design.

It’s not the arrow bug – it’s the “can’t die at all” and complexity reduced to an abysmally low level that’s supposed to catch people’s eye.

I know – you see nothing wrong with it but this is what’s giving us all those “clueless” level 80 players down the road.

It’s also what’s making more and more people entitled. In a game where they can’t even die at the very beginning how can you not foster and promote that attitude?

This back and fourth between you guys doesn’t seem to be getting anywhere :/

Glad to see I’m not the only one disappointed with Anet’s direction with this game. Not really glad, but at the very least it would add to the list of complaints of poor customer interaction and satisfaction that is going to hack away at the limbs which built this game. I’d really hate to see this game crumble after 15k AP’s and almost 3k hours rank 42 pvp rank 296 wvw… I’ve played enough of what the game has to offer to feel deprived of my time ><

Alex.9567:

Vayne.8563:

Alex.9567:

your assertion to brooks law is no more substantial then me drawing a conclusion about anets business practices based on 2 years of gws2, in fact me drawing conclusions from their business practices after 2 years is far more convicting than quoting brooks law, then you say I have something against the direction of the company as if I haven’t made it plainly clearly what and why, you speak of evidence when we’re both obviously speculating conclusions on possibility’s, that’s why I believe youre irrational because you count what you’ve said as evidence when its in fact at the very most just as speculative as the conclusions I’ve made, so yes I do see a pattern, one in which your have a strong subjective bias towards your own opinion.

You obviously can’t tell the difference between refuting a statement to show it’s not necessarily 100% accurate, or making a statement.

I didn’t instigate anything. I didn’t make a statement. I RESPONDED to a statement. That changes the entire dynamic.

If I came into these forums and said, straight out, that adding more people won’t slow down the production of a program, you’d have every right to be saying what you’re saying….but I didn’t do that at all.

I was replying to someone who was making a claim. That is it say, I was showing the POSSIBILITY that what that person was saying, and stating with great certainty, was possibly not as certain as they were claiming. The same about Kekai. I never EVER claimed to know why he left Anet.

I’m simply pointing out possibilities, because someone else claimed to know why.

If you have no evidence, don’t make claims. If you do make claims with no evidence, don’t expect people to just accept what you say. I’m within my right to RESPOND with alternate reasons why this might happen.

If you have evidence, by all means present it. I don’t think you do.

I don’t have evidence either. It’s why I RESPOND to statements like yours rather than MAKING them.

I never made any claims I was also merely pointing out possibility’s, in fact we’re BOTH pointing out possibility’s, the only difference is im challenging anets status quo on the game and youre challenging my arguments in that respect, youre happy to accept brooks law as a basis to why there isn’t any substantial further developments, while I see the reason as anet wishing to continue milking the cash shop, at the end of the day all we have is circumstantial evidence on both sides of the argument, and ill admit there probably is a fair amount of brooks law happening at anet, my whole enquiry into those 2 head ppl that left was to determine to what extent and why, I do however think you are fooling yourself to not give my argument some credence, after all what we have proven through our posts is that it cant be ruled out as a possibility.

If you can’t tell the difference between making a statement to start a conversation or responding to a statement that may or may not be true, I really don’t know what to tell you.

I didn’t come to these forums and start a conversation stating something was true when it may or may not be true. I responded to something which was stated as a truth which may or may not be true. I don’t initiate posts with stuff I can’t back up. I do respond to posts made by other people however, because I wouldn’t make such posts myself.

ipan.4356:

And, above all, put out more content. Lots of it.

Build it, and they will come.

People are becoming disillusioned with GW2.

I’m having more fun right now playing Skyrim and Star Citizen (Arena Commander alpha).

Your game is stale, fix it.

Great points. I had more fun in Guild Wars 1 the other night than I did in GW2 going back to launch. The original world was robust, engaging, and the rewards kept you coming back for more. I achieved GWAMM and still have 30 some odd quests to complete and there’s a lot more I never picked up.

An expansion done right would solve a lot problems and give disillusioned players (including myself) a reason to be active again.

The Living Story in its current form will not stop the hemorrhaging of players.

Is it really that hard to understand these changes weren’t meant for veteran players, or even veteran MMO players but players who have little to no experience with the game.

Man I am really surprised how many alts veteran players start even after 2 years. The way people are calling this a major issue you’d think veteran Gw2 players start a character play for a couple of hours, delete him/her and start a new one.

For veteran players its a step back no doubt, I agree and I am with you. For players who haven’t played an MMO or even many of the MMOs other there this is a good thing. I feel a lot of you underestimate how much stuff Gw2 does and how quickly it dumps everything on players.

Lets take the famous feeding the cows or watering the plants. Both changes are a loss and you know why they’re a loss? cause very few if any MMOs did something like that. Pick something up and gain new skills? nearly unheard off. The closest you get in most MMO is a question on the feed which when you interact with you’re told you picked up the feed. A question mark on the cow which then you go to and you’re told you fed the cow.

Is any of this nuclear science that requires a Phd in MMOs to figure out? Obviously No but keep in mind this is 2 minutes in after you finish the tutorial you’ve just unlocked 5 different skills, each skills does more then a single thing you’re trying to memorize and then there is the dodging thing and armors of different types and different colours you’re getting skill points that you’re not sure where you should be using them and if you figure it out you’re probably left scratching your head why your non healing class has not one but a list of healing skills you can choose from, + which one is better? what boons, what is a boon? or conditions? And then there is gathering, but what I am missing tools how do I get those? also shouldn’t I need to learn a gathering profession. Ohh is that a bug? how come the tree is still there after I’ve seen that player gathering it? wait is that an npc running towards me waving trying to get my attention? ohh where did this giant worm come from, I didnt start any quests I was just watering this plant! What I leveled up and nothing happened? where are my attributes to distribute? Whats this circular bar over my health indicator? whats this green bar to the left? Ohh I pressed F1 and I got 5 new skills? what I got killed but instead I can still play and have 5 news skills yet, What I changed weapon and now I have 4 more skills to unlock… its been 2 minutes and I already have to deal with 15-30 different skills to play with?
etc….

Most of us played tons of MMOs, most of us played Gw1 which had a lot of complexity and thus thought us to love being overwhelmed but again its crucial to understand none of these changes were made for us. They’re intended for the players who have little to no MMO experiance. Playing most other MMOs casually will not prepair you for this game. Consider in some have you reach level 5 before they even give you a new skill and after that you get maybe 3 skills to choose from not to mention you probably will need to spend some 10 points in those 3 skills before you have access for more and unlike Gw2 it will not take just 1 – 2hrs to reach level 15 but considerably more.

Just like sometimes as a PvE player I look at a release and think hmm I’ll have to wait another 2 weeks as this release is for PvP players not for me… no problem. This is a case where these NPE changes arent for us veteran players they’re for players still building their MMO experiance. There is no need to cry the sky is falling just cause a change isnt geared specifically at you. For crying out loud, how many new alts do you all create in a month and if its so bad you cant even stand it with all those alts how is it possible you dont have enough instant 20 scrolls from all the birthday presents you all must be getting?

Vayne.8563:

Alex.9567:

I never made any claims I was also merely pointing out possibility’s, in fact we’re BOTH pointing out possibility’s, the only difference is im challenging anets status quo on the game and youre challenging my arguments in that respect, youre happy to accept brooks law as a basis to why there isn’t any substantial further developments, while I see the reason as anet wishing to continue milking the cash shop, at the end of the day all we have is circumstantial evidence on both sides of the argument, and ill admit there probably is a fair amount of brooks law happening at anet, my whole enquiry into those 2 head ppl that left was to determine to what extent and why, I do however think you are fooling yourself to not give my argument some credence, after all what we have proven through our posts is that it cant be ruled out as a possibility.

If you can’t tell the difference between making a statement to start a conversation or responding to a statement that may or may not be true, I really don’t know what to tell you.

I didn’t come to these forums and start a conversation stating something was true when it may or may not be true. I responded to something which was stated as a truth which may or may not be true. I don’t initiate posts with stuff I can’t back up. I do respond to posts made by other people however, because I wouldn’t make such posts myself.

you missed it again, oh well, not really that surprised, w/e, ignorance is bliss.

Alex.9567:

Vayne.8563:

Alex.9567:

I never made any claims I was also merely pointing out possibility’s, in fact we’re BOTH pointing out possibility’s, the only difference is im challenging anets status quo on the game and youre challenging my arguments in that respect, youre happy to accept brooks law as a basis to why there isn’t any substantial further developments, while I see the reason as anet wishing to continue milking the cash shop, at the end of the day all we have is circumstantial evidence on both sides of the argument, and ill admit there probably is a fair amount of brooks law happening at anet, my whole enquiry into those 2 head ppl that left was to determine to what extent and why, I do however think you are fooling yourself to not give my argument some credence, after all what we have proven through our posts is that it cant be ruled out as a possibility.

If you can’t tell the difference between making a statement to start a conversation or responding to a statement that may or may not be true, I really don’t know what to tell you.

I didn’t come to these forums and start a conversation stating something was true when it may or may not be true. I responded to something which was stated as a truth which may or may not be true. I don’t initiate posts with stuff I can’t back up. I do respond to posts made by other people however, because I wouldn’t make such posts myself.

you missed it again, oh well, not really that surprised, w/e, ignorance is bliss.

Well, I guess when you run out of valid argument, all that’s left is insults. I won’t be responding to any more of your posts.

Vayne.8563:

Alex.9567:

Vayne.8563:

Alex.9567:

I never made any claims I was also merely pointing out possibility’s, in fact we’re BOTH pointing out possibility’s, the only difference is im challenging anets status quo on the game and youre challenging my arguments in that respect, youre happy to accept brooks law as a basis to why there isn’t any substantial further developments, while I see the reason as anet wishing to continue milking the cash shop, at the end of the day all we have is circumstantial evidence on both sides of the argument, and ill admit there probably is a fair amount of brooks law happening at anet, my whole enquiry into those 2 head ppl that left was to determine to what extent and why, I do however think you are fooling yourself to not give my argument some credence, after all what we have proven through our posts is that it cant be ruled out as a possibility.

If you can’t tell the difference between making a statement to start a conversation or responding to a statement that may or may not be true, I really don’t know what to tell you.

I didn’t come to these forums and start a conversation stating something was true when it may or may not be true. I responded to something which was stated as a truth which may or may not be true. I don’t initiate posts with stuff I can’t back up. I do respond to posts made by other people however, because I wouldn’t make such posts myself.

you missed it again, oh well, not really that surprised, w/e, ignorance is bliss.

Well, I guess when you run out of valid argument, all that’s left is insults. I won’t be responding to any more of your posts.

that’s literally the best news I’ve heard today, and listen when your ready to come down from your ivory tower and actually follow the argument as opposed to saying what you want, ill be here.

Vix: "Great points. I had more fun in Guild Wars 1 the other night than I did in GW2 going back to launch. The original world was robust, engaging, and the rewards kept you coming back for more. I achieved GWAMM and still have 30 some odd quests to complete and there’s a lot more I never picked up.

An expansion done right would solve a lot problems and give disillusioned players (including myself) a reason to be active again.

The Living Story in its current form will not stop the hemorrhaging of players.
"

I agree 100%. I’ve actually “owned” a copy of gw1 back in the day but didn’t have the incentive to purchase any expansions towards it since I never really got involved in the game. Couple months back I actually purchased all but eotn (including proph again since I lost my old login info and pw retrieval wasn’t working :/) and made an assassin.

Still havn’t quite beaten my entire expansion of cantha but wow, talk about difficult and content. So far I’ve completed both prophecies and factions and even after the lass boss there is a ton to do, not to mention I fell in love with assassin because it doesn’t look like they’ve ever been nerfed into the ground (did some pvp too, pretty easy to spike people ^^)

I’d be glad if I had a way to link account age/creation date to not sound like I’m talking out of my kitten, but if I can purchase an older game from the same company and be so frustrated with their new material then something is clearly not working right. It doesn’t matter if its a different number of dev’s or different dev’s entirely, you have a reputation to maintain as a company and have strayed from it with gw2. The looks, the controls, the storyline, the encounters of course can’t just be gw1 2.0 but the experience and fulfilling content shouldn’t be lost. I had a great experience with gw1 back then and most definitely after I got rid of my henchmen and got new classes to play with. Why can’t the LS do the same?

errrr duhhh

to simply kill the game within 1 or 2 years?

Their goals seem to be the following:
1. Sell gems for real currency.
2. Dumb down the game.
3. Sell gems for real currency.
4. Remove random content from the game and ignore that it’s broken or missing.
5. Sell gems for real currency.
6. Make seasonal events with rewards that require unrealistic amounts of effort (Promotes Gems → Gold)
7. Sell gems for real currency.
8. Ignore the community.
9. Sell gems for real currency.
10. Be evasive about upcoming content // “Company policy prevents us from discussing what’s in development”
11. Sell gems for real currency.