Guild Wars 2

Dress up then standing around in Lions Arch

I think it’s mostly about having fun, which is exactly what I need after a hard day’s work.

For that, I don’t need nor want ultrahard content, gear grind or other nonsensical stuff that punishes me for not keeping up.

Erasculio.2914:

HiddenNick.7206:

Developers gives you new ways to acquire more powerful items and then you can use those items to overcome certain challenges and receive even more powerful gear or other rewards like unique skins or mounts.

In other words, other MMORPGs are about rewarding time spent in gear treadmills. As flawed as GW2 is, I’m happy it’s not about that (yet). Regardless, this game has been released more than six months ago, had you done a minimum of research about it you would have learned that no, gear treadmill isn’t the focus of GW2. Buying without research = “a fool and his money…”.

So what is the focus in this game?! I’m trying to find this game goal and as far as I know there is none!

It’s not about leveling.
It’s not about any other type of character progression.
It’s not about cooperative challenging content.
It’s not about killing ancient dragon anymore – everyone already did it.
It’s not about gear grind – I get it that some people may consider gear grind as a bad thing. But give us something else to do instead! And ascended gear… Please… 5% of boosted stats without any purpose. Only agony resistance is something to work for. But it’s not even nearly as rewarding as it should be.

The only thing to do right now is to play some not always fun mini-games that would never sell on today’s indie market. Or farm gold… And this used to be something that only bots and Chinese farmers did. And it never suppose to be considered fun!

HiddenNick.7206:

Erasculio.2914:

HiddenNick.7206:

Developers gives you new ways to acquire more powerful items and then you can use those items to overcome certain challenges and receive even more powerful gear or other rewards like unique skins or mounts.

In other words, other MMORPGs are about rewarding time spent in gear treadmills. As flawed as GW2 is, I’m happy it’s not about that (yet). Regardless, this game has been released more than six months ago, had you done a minimum of research about it you would have learned that no, gear treadmill isn’t the focus of GW2. Buying without research = “a fool and his money…”.

So what is the focus in this game?! I’m trying to find this game goal and as far as I know there is none!

It’s not about leveling.
It’s not about any other type of character progression.
It’s not about cooperative challenging content.
It’s not about killing ancient dragon anymore – everyone already did it.
It’s not about gear grind – I get it that some people may consider gear grind as a bad thing. But give us something else to do instead! And ascended gear… Please… 5% of boosted stats without any purpose. Only agony resistance is something to work for. But it’s not even nearly as rewarding as it should be.

So how about a nice game of freecell instead?

Why does a game need a reward for you to play it? Can’t you just play it for what it is … a game? Can’t you just play it, because it’s fun?

I didn’t need to play chess a thousand times to unlock the queen. It’d be such a bad game if that was part of the mechanics …

whats the game about?
well to me, it was about your character rising from local hero to unrecognised world hero (thank you threahern), and the dealing with your life after that – what happens once you’ve saved the day? do you explore the world in search of adventure, work the markets and become a merchant making money or master a profession always waiting for your next call to arms against the dragons. but as you chose your path the world changes, your victory has left a vacuum in power and others will take this oppertunity to rise and opress the people you’ve fought to protect, maybe you stand up (on a monthly basis) and make things right.
You slayed the mad king and stopped trix’s mad machines at winters day , earning trophies of your victories not as challenging as killng a dragon you got a sense of peace. then a new threat appeared in a deadly alignance and the after match left you to decide where you would allow slavery or the actions of a vigelantee. in the end the choice was taken away from you, and a new friend was made in kiel.
Now a new festival arises and a once again your skills are called upon to make sure things go well. Just another hectic day in teria.

If you are looking for someone to clearly lay out your objectives and rewards then I can see why this game might be disappointing. Perhaps people who migrated from other MMOs are used to that and feel adrift in GW2. That’s what it sounds like to me anyway.

Players like myself, and there seem to be at least a few of us from what I’ve seen and read, aren’t MMO players. We don’t have preconceived MMO expectations for the game. Instead we enjoy the game for what it is, a fun video game, but one that’s larger, more dynamic, and more social than standard single-player games.

Please GW doesn’t require more skill than GW2: go to gwpvx.com, click the game mode you want, let’s say general pvp, select Meta, no be a Paragon, get the skills/gear, done you can destroy everything in the game (if you have a good hero build).

And I like in GW2 I can set my own rules and do what I want, I enjoy the events and talk to every NPC, I also started following DE people after you helped them, almost all lead to extra dialogue or a follow up DE.

HiddenNick.7206:

So what is the focus in this game?! I’m trying to find this game goal and as far as I know there is none!

The goal is the same goal as in any other good game: to have fun.

People are too used to mediocre games (aka MMORPGs) these days.

MMO players work in a really weird way to be honest.

Ive spoken to so many players who started playing GW2. But since they knew “it has no end game” they got bored relatively fast. Some even before leaving the first zone….eventhough it was probably the best starting zone in any MMO they played untill that date.

Apperantly “we” need a sense of direction/ a purpose. We refuse to look at all the little things that make this game stand out as long as that sense of direction isnt there.

marnick.4305:

Why does a game need a reward for you to play it? Can’t you just play it for what it is… a game? Can’t you just play it, because it’s fun?

I’m asking about the goal of the game… Why? Because it is a game! I have fun playing it. But without a goal… I just don’t see any reason to. It’s just like with any other game. I had fun playing Assassins Creed 2 and AC:Brotherhood. Game play was almost the same so why wouldn’t I just play AC 2 second time instead of buying and playing AC:B? Explain it to yourself and you will know why I’m asking for goal in Gw2.

Guild Wars is NOT a virtual reality where you have fun all the time. It’s a game! And as one it needs to have rules and goals.

And if you consider mini-games fun… Then play something else. You will just realize how wrong you are.

HiddenNick.7206:

Guild Wars is NOT a virtual reality where you have fun all the time. It’s a game! And as one it needs to have rules and goals.

Well there’s two kinds of rules and goals.
Rules established by the game and rules established by the player. Every game has rules established by the game. I’ll give example of both GW2 and Minecraft:
GW2 has certain established ways of leveling – you can craft, you can complete maps (when you complete maps there’s established points that you have to get – vistas to see, NPCs to kill, quests to follow), you can WvW (once again there’s established rules there – you can’t fly, you can only get exp for points taken/ players killed/ NPCs killed, you can’t kill your own teamates, etc). All of the system is based on very closed game rules. You can’t break them, because that’s how the system is made.
The same is with minecraft – there are enemies that will try to kill you, you have to mine to get materials and you have to build to protect yourself.
Now what you seem to be lacking is a sense of direction. Myself, being used to sandbox games I don’t need a direction, because after I observe the rules set by the game I can set my own goals.
So what do you want to do in Minecraft? What do you want to build? Where do you want to go? You set a goal for yourself and you follow it. There’s a variety of different goals only limited by the game world and your imagination. Maybe your goal is to build the tallest building, or have a golden castle in the desert, or recreate a world from a different game, or uncover a certain amount of a map… The game doesn’t tell you what to do, but should it?
The same way is with Guild Wars. Do you want to get all the achievements? Do you want to reach the highest rank in Spvp? Do you want to climb the fractals as far as it is possible? Do you want to join a WvW guild, follow orders, learn how to command and make sure that your server will beat the others? Do you want to try all of the professions and have one of each? Do you want to level up one of each race? Do you want to get rich and outfit multiple characters with legendaries? There’s many goals that you can set for yourself, do you really require the game telling you what to do?

HiddenNick.7206:

I’m asking about the goal of the game… Why? Because it is a game! I have fun playing it. But without a goal… I just don’t see any reason to.

This sums up quite nicely how people are molded in to a certain expectation pattern.

Would you prefer content that isnt fun but has a goal? Ever tried archeology in wow for example?

Mirta.5029:

The game [Minecraft] doesn’t tell you what to do, but should it?
The same way is with Guild Wars.

GW2 already tells you what to do. It has a strong theme park feel where you pick from several designed options rather than creating your own. The login screen directs you to goals through accomplishment icons that beg to be filled, while the UI has various and daily goals permanently glued to the upper right corner.

I could get behind this “do what you want” idea if GW2 had more sandbox options like Minecraft. Highly customizable player housing or guild housing, tied to resource collection or other PvE goals and achievements, would be a good start.

Guns and Giblets.9308:

GW2 already tells you what to do. It has a strong theme park feel where you pick from several designed options rather than creating your own. The login screen directs you to goals through accomplishment icons that beg to be filled, while the UI has various and daily goals permanently glued to the upper right corner.

I could get behind this “do what you want” idea if GW2 had more sandbox options like Minecraft. Highly customizable player housing or guild housing, tied to resource collection or other PvE goals and achievements, would be a good start.

Well like other themepark MMOs the game doesn’t tell you a lot of what you have to do. For example in WoW (like in Guild Wars) if you wanted to level in a different place than your own starter Area you could, all you had to do was fly (in GW2 case portal) there.
While GW2 is not a sandbox, the person that I gave the comparison to seems to be puzzled, because the game after you hit level 80 doesn’t force you on a direct path like some MMOs and most RPGs do. It’s your choice whether you want to fulfill those UIs achievements. It’s your choice whether you want to WvW/Spvp or PVE. Some people seem to be unable to decide to do something unless a game directly tells them “go there”.

Mirta.5029:

Do you want to join a WvW guild, follow orders, learn how to command and make sure that your server will beat the others?

Can I win the battle? Or does my guild does get any recognition or anything by participating?

Mirta.5029:

Do you want to try all of the professions and have one of each?

Grind with 8 characters?! Is this what’s the game about?!

Mirta.5029:

Do you want to level up one of each race?

More grind… So no!

Mirta.5029:

Do you want to get rich and outfit multiple characters with legendaries?

Even more grind… Definitely no!

So this is what’s the game about! Thanks…

HiddenNick.7206:

Mirta.5029:

Do you want to join a WvW guild, follow orders, learn how to command and make sure that your server will beat the others?

Can I win the battle? Or does my guild does get any recognition or anything by participating?

Mirta.5029:

Do you want to try all of the professions and have one of each?

Grind with 8 characters?! Is this what’s the game about?!

Mirta.5029:

Do you want to level up one of each race?

More grind… So no!

Mirta.5029:

Do you want to get rich and outfit multiple characters with legendaries?

Even more grind… Definitely no!

So this is what’s the game about! Thanks…

About the WvW – my guild has alliances with about 10 other guilds. If we all win WvW then it’s clear for all 10 guilds that we only did it because of the 10 guilds.
About everything else – so you don’t enjoy and don’t want to do the content, because all the content looks like for you is grind? What kind of end game goal were you expecting? What kind of end game goal do you have set for you in other games that’s so unlike the end game goals that oyu can set for yourself in this game?

Currently the game is about nothing. Guildwars 2, the Seinfeld if MMOs.

If that’s a good thing or a bad thing is up to you.

In my humble opinion, there is a severe lack of risk vs reward and a lack of sense of accomplishments in all parts of the game, be it PvE, PvP or WvW.

I would like to welcome everyone for a constructive discussion over at the suggestions forum:

Suggestions: The Seinfeld of MMOs

Thanks!

HiddenNick.7206:

Mirta.5029:

Do you want to join a WvW guild, follow orders, learn how to command and make sure that your server will beat the others?

Can I win the battle? Or does my guild does get any recognition or anything by participating?

Mirta.5029:

Do you want to try all of the professions and have one of each?

Grind with 8 characters?! Is this what’s the game about?!

Mirta.5029:

Do you want to level up one of each race?

More grind… So no!

Mirta.5029:

Do you want to get rich and outfit multiple characters with legendaries?

Even more grind… Definitely no!

So this is what’s the game about! Thanks…

You do know there are WvW ranks, passive unlockable abilities, and unique titles to be achieved strictly from playing WvW. Is that also not enough recognition?

Have you ever played an MMO in the past that allowed for 2000+ hrs that wasn’t repetitive in some way and involved some kind of grind? Please enlighten us to what game you’ve poured thousands of hours into that had absolutely no grind and that GW2 should use as an example of how to do it right.

GW2 should be given the credit for doing something different. Many seem to hate it, but I sure as kitten think its a breath of fresh air from the garbage that has been coming out in the MMO genre. Constant re-hashing of the same basic “WoW” format content, but with different lore.

Everyone wants to recapture the nostalgia of past MMOs, but when presented with something similar to what they enjoyed in the past the nostalgia disappears or is never experienced at all because everyone remembers why they quit those games in the first place.

I think that is at the heart of the problem with new MMOs. At this point, most MMO players are likely in the 10-15,000+ mark in terms of hours played across all MMOs in their lifetime. It’s why they get bored easily when a new one comes out that is even remotely similar to what they’ve played.

Draknar.5748:

You do know there are WvW ranks, passive unlockable abilities, and unique titles to be achieved strictly from playing WvW. Is that also not enough recognition?

But I can’t win in any way! I know that there is sPvP but I don’t play it. Either way it’s the only part of the game that has a goal – be the best.

Draknar.5748:

Have you ever played an MMO in the past that allowed for 2000+ hrs that wasn’t repetitive in some way and involved some kind of grind? Please enlighten us to what game you’ve poured thousands of hours into that had absolutely no grind and that GW2 should use as an example of how to do it right.

I’m not saying that Gw2 is most grindy of all games… Here it’s just pointless. And you never feel achieving something.

Draknar.5748:

GW2 should be given the credit for doing something different. Many seem to hate it, but I sure as kitten think its a breath of fresh air from the garbage that has been coming out in the MMO genre. Constant re-hashing of the same basic “WoW” format content, but with different lore.

I don’t care what format the game is. I really don’t. And will never give credit only for doing something different.

Draknar.5748:

Everyone wants to recapture the nostalgia of past MMOs, but when presented with something similar to what they enjoyed in the past the nostalgia disappears or is never experienced at all because everyone remembers why they quit those games in the first place.

I think that is at the heart of the problem with new MMOs. At this point, most MMO players are likely in the 10-15,000+ mark in terms of hours played across all MMOs in their lifetime. It’s why they get bored easily when a new one comes out that is even remotely similar to what they’ve played.

I don’t play any other MMO. I don’t know if there are any better games in this genre. But right now the game has no goal. And that’s the problem for me.

Everything in this game is more or less: do it a thousand times because it’s “fun”. When it aren’t. And a goal could change that.

I don’t know why people here are trying to tell me that the problem is on my side when at the same time you acknowledge that the game has no goal! You all sound more or less like this: “The game has no goal… But it’s a good thing! And you should be happy about it!”. That kind of arguments just makes me sad.

HiddenNick.7206:

Draknar.5748:

You do know there are WvW ranks, passive unlockable abilities, and unique titles to be achieved strictly from playing WvW. Is that also not enough recognition?

But I can’t win in any way! I know that there is sPvP but I don’t play it. Either way it’s the only part of the game that has a goal – be the best.

Draknar.5748:

Have you ever played an MMO in the past that allowed for 2000+ hrs that wasn’t repetitive in some way and involved some kind of grind? Please enlighten us to what game you’ve poured thousands of hours into that had absolutely no grind and that GW2 should use as an example of how to do it right.

I’m not saying that Gw2 is most grindy of all games… Here it’s just pointless. And you never feel achieving something.

Draknar.5748:

GW2 should be given the credit for doing something different. Many seem to hate it, but I sure as kitten think its a breath of fresh air from the garbage that has been coming out in the MMO genre. Constant re-hashing of the same basic “WoW” format content, but with different lore.

I don’t care what format the game is. I really don’t. And will never give credit only for doing something different.

Draknar.5748:

Everyone wants to recapture the nostalgia of past MMOs, but when presented with something similar to what they enjoyed in the past the nostalgia disappears or is never experienced at all because everyone remembers why they quit those games in the first place.

I think that is at the heart of the problem with new MMOs. At this point, most MMO players are likely in the 10-15,000+ mark in terms of hours played across all MMOs in their lifetime. It’s why they get bored easily when a new one comes out that is even remotely similar to what they’ve played.

I don’t play any other MMO. I don’t know if there are any better games in this genre. But right now the game has no goal. And that’s the problem for me.

Everything in this game is more or less: do it a thousand times because it’s “fun”. When it aren’t. And a goal could change that.

I don’t know why people here are trying to tell me that the problem is on my side when at the same time you acknowledge that the game has no goal! You all sound more or less like this: “The game has no goal… But it’s a good thing! And you should be happy about it!”. That kind of arguments just makes me sad.

Every other MMO I’ve played has goals. This is one of the few MMOs I’ve played that really has none. Or at least your goals are yours.

Are you saying this one game for players like me should become like other games for players who have a bevy of games to choose from.

That makes ME sad.

This game kinda reminds of Seinfeld.

HiddenNick.7206:

marnick.4305:

Why does a game need a reward for you to play it? Can’t you just play it for what it is… a game? Can’t you just play it, because it’s fun?

I’m asking about the goal of the game… Why? Because it is a game! I have fun playing it. But without a goal… I just don’t see any reason to. It’s just like with any other game.

Guild Wars is NOT a virtual reality where you have fun all the time. It’s a game! And as one it needs to have rules and goals.

So what’s the goal of other games exactly and how does this differ from GW2? The goal of chess is to checkmate the other player within a certain time limit. After that, you set up the board again in the exact same way as the first game. There is no progression, no rewards. You don’t get an extra queen for playing 100 games. If anything, you lose your queen against a weaker player.

The goal of GW2 is to get a legendary and BiS gear. Once you’re done with that, you start on the next character. Alternatively, you could start achievement hunting, you could get nice looking characters or play WvW or PVP. There’s a lot of potential goals. The only thing you need to do is open your eyes and look for them. This game doesn’t spoonfeed you like WoW used to do.

Either game should be fun. If you don’t like to play chess, don’t. If you don’t like the rules of chess, don’t. If you want ever more queens, stop playing chess. If you don’t like GW2, you can log out and never look back.

Torqueblue.1945:

This game kinda reminds of Seinfeld.

It kinda reminds me of AfterMASH.

Vayne.8563:

Every other MMO I’ve played has goals. This is one of the few MMOs I’ve played that really has none. Or at least your goals are yours.

How is that a good thing? Because it’s different? That’s your argument?

Mirta.5029:

HiddenNick.7206:

Mirta.5029:

Do you want to join a WvW guild, follow orders, learn how to command and make sure that your server will beat the others?

Can I win the battle? Or does my guild does get any recognition or anything by participating?

Mirta.5029:

Do you want to try all of the professions and have one of each?

Grind with 8 characters?! Is this what’s the game about?!

Mirta.5029:

Do you want to level up one of each race?

More grind… So no!

Mirta.5029:

Do you want to get rich and outfit multiple characters with legendaries?

Even more grind… Definitely no!

So this is what’s the game about! Thanks…

About the WvW – my guild has alliances with about 10 other guilds. If we all win WvW then it’s clear for all 10 guilds that we only did it because of the 10 guilds.
About everything else – so you don’t enjoy and don’t want to do the content, because all the content looks like for you is grind? What kind of end game goal were you expecting? What kind of end game goal do you have set for you in other games that’s so unlike the end game goals that oyu can set for yourself in this game?

^^^^Basically, he doesn’t want to grind? GW2 is one of the least (if not THE least) grindy MMO around. Why play an MMO type game at all if any grind at all is not your thing?

Some people are just to stuck in the ‘I wan’t a new gear for compleating the end game’ so it’s even pointless to get them to see the difference of Work and Enjoyment.

I play a game becouse it’s fun, grind or no grind, story or no story, 8-bit or better, horrific music or enchanting music and more. If the game is fun I play it, if it’s not fun I don’t play it. I played GW1 almost from release to EotN and then I started playing another MMO for six years and they ruined the game compleatly for me so I left and in good time GW2 was released and now this is the game for me and honestly of all these 3 games I have played, I have enjoyed GW2 the most.

What’s the point of a game? Relaxation and fun, that’s what it is for me.

It is about RNG. If you have luck, you will succeed. If you have no luck, you will be frustrated.

HiddenNick.7206:

Vayne.8563:

Every other MMO I’ve played has goals. This is one of the few MMOs I’ve played that really has none. Or at least your goals are yours.

How is that a good thing? Because it’s different? That’s your argument?

No, my argument is other MMOs, the way they stand don’t work for me, because they’re telling me you need to do this, then do this, then to this. I prefer less structure.

See, some people want a more structured experience and some people want a less structured experience. And there’s nothing wrong with either.

But since most MMOs are structured out the kitten, it’s nice to have a game for the rest of us. I don’t think this is so hard to understand.

Vayne.8563:

What’s solitaire about? It’s one of the worlds most popular games..but what’s the point? I mean I play solitaire and I get no prizes, no drops, no real reward.

This game is about buying into the reality of Tyria. Either you buy into it, or you don’t. It’s the same with soap operas, comics, Star Trek, professional wrestling. It’s entertainment.

If you need to accomplish something other than fun in your down time, if you need to be spoonfed go here and do this, go here and do that to keep you going, if you need to constantly test yourself to try to prove something, then you might be well playing the wrong game.

On the other hand, if you just want to bang around and have fun without worrying about catching up to people if you take a month or two break…you’re probably playing the right game.

I love you Vayne.

I think some people have been playing MMOs like WoW for so long that their definition of fun went from….. “fun”…. to like…. gear progression. Somewhere over the years, fun went from that intangible definition to some all-consuming tedium ad nauseum.

HiddenNick.7206:

There is not even a slight feeling of achievement here.

Im going to have to disagree here. In guild wars 2, unlike ofher mmos, its all about personal skill, timing, cooldown management etc. Wheras in other mmos you win by grindin for long enough, same with the pvp. Using an OP build while you grinded for longer than the other person will let you win.

In guild wars 2 structured pvp you start with max stats and all traits available.
“But thats borinf because eveyone will just be the same and no one will be better! Right?”
You couldnt be more wrong there. Most professions have a huge skill cap, after 1500 hours of mesmering i still havent perfected my skills. Im pretty close, but not there yet.
Believe me, theres nothijg more satisfying or “feeling like you achieved something” like killing 2 people by yourself. Yes, its more than possible. How? Practice, self improvement, but no gear grind.
In fact, my record so far is a 1vs6, it did take like 10 minutes but it was worth it.

As for pve: someone could wear full berserker and never go down in a dungeon, while someone wearing full sentinel vould spend more time on their back than on their feet. Thats kind of an exagerated example, but things like this happen.

Personal skill determines victory, not having stared at the screen for longer than the ither person.

If youre interested in seeing what fighting outnumbered in pvp is like, try the first or second video in my signature link.

Cheers,
Alissah

Vayne.8563:

What’s solitaire about? It’s one of the worlds most popular games..but what’s the point? I mean I play solitaire and I get no prizes, no drops, no real reward.

This game is about buying into the reality of Tyria. Either you buy into it, or you don’t. It’s the same with soap operas, comics, Star Trek, professional wrestling. It’s entertainment.

If you need to accomplish something other than fun in your down time, if you need to be spoonfed go here and do this, go here and do that to keep you going, if you need to constantly test yourself to try to prove something, then you might be well playing the wrong game.

On the other hand, if you just want to bang around and have fun without worrying about catching up to people if you take a month or two break…you’re probably playing the right game.

Comparing GW2 to solitaire is comparing apples to oranges.

GW2 has a reward system: drops, skill points, and a scoring system. The reward system is DESIGNED to be used: you can’t play the entire game as it was meant to be played using starter-level armor and weapons. There is a progression that the player MUST follow in order to play the game as designed. The drops are necessary to obtain that progression: either to utilize or capitalize upon. Once the armors and weapons are maximized, THEN you can argue, “Just play for fun.” Since all maximized weapons and armor are not the same (different skins and stats), then you may HAVE to continue to play on to achieve those stats and/or skins. To argue that gold and gear is irrelevent is disingenuous. That people are complaining about drops sucking IS relevent because the drops clearly determine what gear you get. If it takes forever to GET max-stat items, people are going to complain. If they’re getting crappy drops, which provides chump change from the vendor, it prolongs the grind. SO, if people are farming certain DEs because it is the most efficient use of their time, then there is a design flaw that the developers SHOULD address. If they address it by creating DR, then that clearly tells the players that the design is NOT flawed, but WANTED. So, I guess, by that line of reasoning, the answerr to the OP’s question is, “This game is about grind!”

I guess the only way you could compare the 2 GW2 and Solitaire rationally is if you had 50 different decks of playing cards for Solitaire, each with a different set of individual cards, each deck with benefits and hindrances, and THEN offered 50 different cardbacks and artwork…

Making NCSoft as much money as possible while denying players as much content as they can get away with.

Basically NCSoft’s usual agenda, courtesy the Queen of Greed herself.

Buying a bathing suit from the BLTC so that I can ERP on the shores of LA.

This game has two goals..

How much money NCsoft and Anet can make, and on the flip side, gives nothing back..

Saldonus Darkholme.5680:

Vayne.8563:

What’s solitaire about? It’s one of the worlds most popular games..but what’s the point? I mean I play solitaire and I get no prizes, no drops, no real reward.

This game is about buying into the reality of Tyria. Either you buy into it, or you don’t. It’s the same with soap operas, comics, Star Trek, professional wrestling. It’s entertainment.

If you need to accomplish something other than fun in your down time, if you need to be spoonfed go here and do this, go here and do that to keep you going, if you need to constantly test yourself to try to prove something, then you might be well playing the wrong game.

On the other hand, if you just want to bang around and have fun without worrying about catching up to people if you take a month or two break…you’re probably playing the right game.

Comparing GW2 to solitaire is comparing apples to oranges.

GW2 has a reward system: drops, skill points, and a scoring system. The reward system is DESIGNED to be used: you can’t play the entire game as it was meant to be played using starter-level armor and weapons. There is a progression that the player MUST follow in order to play the game as designed. The drops are necessary to obtain that progression: either to utilize or capitalize upon. Once the armors and weapons are maximized, THEN you can argue, “Just play for fun.” Since all maximized weapons and armor are not the same (different skins and stats), then you may HAVE to continue to play on to achieve those stats and/or skins. To argue that gold and gear is irrelevent is disingenuous. That people are complaining about drops sucking IS relevent because the drops clearly determine what gear you get. If it takes forever to GET max-stat items, people are going to complain. If they’re getting crappy drops, which provides chump change from the vendor, it prolongs the grind. SO, if people are farming certain DEs because it is the most efficient use of their time, then there is a design flaw that the developers SHOULD address. If they address it by creating DR, then that clearly tells the players that the design is NOT flawed, but WANTED. So, I guess, by that line of reasoning, the answerr to the OP’s question is, “This game is about grind!”

I guess the only way you could compare the 2 GW2 and Solitaire rationally is if you had 50 different decks of playing cards for Solitaire, each with a different set of individual cards, each deck with benefits and hindrances, and THEN offered 50 different cardbacks and artwork…

I’m not comparing Guild Wars 2 to solitaire. I’m pointing out that the same sorts of people who might enjoy solitaire will enjoy Guild Wars 1. Plenty of people who play RPGs generally do NOT play for rewards. This is a relatively recent development, made most popular by WoW and WoW clones.

Mostly, prior to that, RPGs were made to reward people experientially rather than with loot.

Anet will revisit the loot system, but even in Guild Wars 1, the loot system wasn’t like it was in most games, but lots of people played the game for years.

HiddenNick.7206:

There is not even a slight feeling of achievement
here.

Bye, have fun playing your smartphone games.

It’s about nerfs and game store… Ok, i couldn’t resist.

People find their fun in different areas and aspect of the game… Some are “achievement hunters” others like collecting skins, minis, valuable items, some like to run dungeons, WvW, PvP, farming gold, standing in lion’s arch and chatting 80% of the time….

I want to live and breath in a fantasy world when I buy an MMO. Structured goals go against that, because I’m no longer living the game but working towards another shopping list. Not fun. Leave the game open, let players decide what’s fun and what’s not.

This game is about being shuttled to a new crappy grind temporary living story arc evrey 2 weeks then farming in down time….. also WvW and SPvP.

Take out the crap temp content, or make it reoccurring so people can do it at ones own leisure and adding some more perm content would maybe make this game good.

Like any other game it is about fun and entertainment.

Nuage.5230:

Like any other game it is about fun and entertainment.

Nah games USED to be about fun and entertainment, now they are just blatant money grabs masked in a mediocre game to keep you playing . Insert RNG cash shop rant here.

Vayne.8563:

Saldonus Darkholme.5680:

Vayne.8563:

What’s solitaire about? It’s one of the worlds most popular games..but what’s the point? I mean I play solitaire and I get no prizes, no drops, no real reward.

This game is about buying into the reality of Tyria. Either you buy into it, or you don’t. It’s the same with soap operas, comics, Star Trek, professional wrestling. It’s entertainment.

If you need to accomplish something other than fun in your down time, if you need to be spoonfed go here and do this, go here and do that to keep you going, if you need to constantly test yourself to try to prove something, then you might be well playing the wrong game.

On the other hand, if you just want to bang around and have fun without worrying about catching up to people if you take a month or two break…you’re probably playing the right game.

Comparing GW2 to solitaire is comparing apples to oranges.

GW2 has a reward system: drops, skill points, and a scoring system. The reward system is DESIGNED to be used: you can’t play the entire game as it was meant to be played using starter-level armor and weapons. There is a progression that the player MUST follow in order to play the game as designed. The drops are necessary to obtain that progression: either to utilize or capitalize upon. Once the armors and weapons are maximized, THEN you can argue, “Just play for fun.” Since all maximized weapons and armor are not the same (different skins and stats), then you may HAVE to continue to play on to achieve those stats and/or skins. To argue that gold and gear is irrelevent is disingenuous. That people are complaining about drops sucking IS relevent because the drops clearly determine what gear you get. If it takes forever to GET max-stat items, people are going to complain. If they’re getting crappy drops, which provides chump change from the vendor, it prolongs the grind. SO, if people are farming certain DEs because it is the most efficient use of their time, then there is a design flaw that the developers SHOULD address. If they address it by creating DR, then that clearly tells the players that the design is NOT flawed, but WANTED. So, I guess, by that line of reasoning, the answerr to the OP’s question is, “This game is about grind!”

I guess the only way you could compare the 2 GW2 and Solitaire rationally is if you had 50 different decks of playing cards for Solitaire, each with a different set of individual cards, each deck with benefits and hindrances, and THEN offered 50 different cardbacks and artwork…

I’m not comparing Guild Wars 2 to solitaire. I’m pointing out that the same sorts of people who might enjoy solitaire will enjoy Guild Wars 1. Plenty of people who play RPGs generally do NOT play for rewards. This is a relatively recent development, made most popular by WoW and WoW clones.

Mostly, prior to that, RPGs were made to reward people experientially rather than with loot.

Anet will revisit the loot system, but even in Guild Wars 1, the loot system wasn’t like it was in most games, but lots of people played the game for years.

Sorry, Vayne, but reward systems in games have been there for centuries. In chess, you won the war. In poker, you won the pot. In Monopoly, you won the most wealth. In Pac-Man, you got your name in the winner’s list. In Mario Bros., you got the gold. The point is, GW2 is DESIGNED TO RELY ON GEAR PROGRESSION. As I stated earlier; you can’t start the game and play it all the way through with starter armor and starter weapons.

As for GW1 loot system: I gave ANet a rash of crap for the loot nerf they implemented prior to the implementation of HM. However, after they tweaked it several times, it became palatable. Frankly, looking back, I’d PREFER the loot system in GW 1 over this one. Instead of fighting to obtain the gold to obtain the gems to obtain the skin in the TP, you went and fought a boss and hoped you got his green drop. There was a greater sense of accomplishment getting the drop than there is in grinding the gold.

Saldonus Darkholme.5680:

Sorry, Vayne, but reward systems in games have been there for centuries. In chess, you won the war. In poker, you won the pot. In Monopoly, you won the most wealth. In Pac-Man, you got your name in the winner’s list. In Mario Bros., you got the gold. The point is, GW2 is DESIGNED TO RELY ON GEAR PROGRESSION. As I stated earlier; you can’t start the game and play it all the way through with starter armor and starter weapons.

As for GW1 loot system: I gave ANet a rash of crap for the loot nerf they implemented prior to the implementation of HM. However, after they tweaked it several times, it became palatable. Frankly, looking back, I’d PREFER the loot system in GW 1 over this one. Instead of fighting to obtain the gold to obtain the gems to obtain the skin in the TP, you went and fought a boss and hoped you got his green drop. There was a greater sense of accomplishment getting the drop than there is in grinding the gold.

One is a reward the other is a job, that is what MMOs are slowly becoming… jobs that you pay.

You aren’t allowed to ask this question, it makes certain people uncomfortable.

Phaedryn.3698:

You aren’t allowed to ask this question, it makes certain people uncomfortable.

Yeah the truth makes people uncomfortable too.

HiddenNick.7206:

So what is this game about?

It is about having fun.

Which I still have (1300 hours +).

Edit: Just saw that another guy answered like this. Sorry, was a spontaneous answer from me.

Saldonus Darkholme.5680:

As I stated earlier; you can’t start the game and play it all the way through with starter armor and starter weapons.

Is there anything in the game mechanics that shows that it is impossible?

Or are you just saying that no one has publicly admitted to having done it yet? Because I know that no-gear-upgrades self-challenges are pretty common in single player RPGs.

Heck, those kind of self-challenges in single player RPGs go to a point where the communities tend to take the challenges to their logical extreme. That being removing elements like leveling up, gear, skill usage, character usage until something comes around that no one has been able to beat.

And that’s not even all of it. There’s also things like leveling a character to a maximum level in a limited environment, such as doing it on the starting zone or before you get any other party members.

And why does that happen? It’s not out of hatred for those systems. It’s because of those systems. That and the higher difficulty.

Honestly, the addition of “achievements” and making content centered on loot is killing off the genre of MMORPGs. In most MMORPGs, the storyline that they’re telling is stereotypical with a unique twist, but it’s not present actively in the world. Similarly, in a lot of cases, the gear that you get is vaguely, or not at all, tied to some kind of storyline and in some ugly cases, you need to get that gear.

Olba.5376:

Saldonus Darkholme.5680:

As I stated earlier; you can’t start the game and play it all the way through with starter armor and starter weapons.

Is there anything in the game mechanics that shows that it is impossible?

Or are you just saying that no one has publicly admitted to having done it yet? Because I know that no-gear-upgrades self-challenges are pretty common in single player RPGs.

Heck, those kind of self-challenges in single player RPGs go to a point where the communities tend to take the challenges to their logical extreme. That being removing elements like leveling up, gear, skill usage, character usage until something comes around that no one has been able to beat.

And that’s not even all of it. There’s also things like leveling a character to a maximum level in a limited environment, such as doing it on the starting zone or before you get any other party members.

And why does that happen? It’s not out of hatred for those systems. It’s because of those systems. That and the higher difficulty.

Honestly, the addition of “achievements” and making content centered on loot is killing off the genre of MMORPGs. In most MMORPGs, the storyline that they’re telling is stereotypical with a unique twist, but it’s not present actively in the world. Similarly, in a lot of cases, the gear that you get is vaguely, or not at all, tied to some kind of storyline and in some ugly cases, you need to get that gear.

I didn’t say it was impossible. You are welcome to try. However, the game is DESIGNED with gear progression. While I agree with you, that people will kitten themselves for the challenge. I DON’T think they start the game and play through with the express purpose of using only the starter armor and broken stick they start with.

Saldonus Darkholme.5680:

Vayne.8563:

Saldonus Darkholme.5680:

Vayne.8563:

What’s solitaire about? It’s one of the worlds most popular games..but what’s the point? I mean I play solitaire and I get no prizes, no drops, no real reward.

This game is about buying into the reality of Tyria. Either you buy into it, or you don’t. It’s the same with soap operas, comics, Star Trek, professional wrestling. It’s entertainment.

If you need to accomplish something other than fun in your down time, if you need to be spoonfed go here and do this, go here and do that to keep you going, if you need to constantly test yourself to try to prove something, then you might be well playing the wrong game.

On the other hand, if you just want to bang around and have fun without worrying about catching up to people if you take a month or two break…you’re probably playing the right game.

Comparing GW2 to solitaire is comparing apples to oranges.

GW2 has a reward system: drops, skill points, and a scoring system. The reward system is DESIGNED to be used: you can’t play the entire game as it was meant to be played using starter-level armor and weapons. There is a progression that the player MUST follow in order to play the game as designed. The drops are necessary to obtain that progression: either to utilize or capitalize upon. Once the armors and weapons are maximized, THEN you can argue, “Just play for fun.” Since all maximized weapons and armor are not the same (different skins and stats), then you may HAVE to continue to play on to achieve those stats and/or skins. To argue that gold and gear is irrelevent is disingenuous. That people are complaining about drops sucking IS relevent because the drops clearly determine what gear you get. If it takes forever to GET max-stat items, people are going to complain. If they’re getting crappy drops, which provides chump change from the vendor, it prolongs the grind. SO, if people are farming certain DEs because it is the most efficient use of their time, then there is a design flaw that the developers SHOULD address. If they address it by creating DR, then that clearly tells the players that the design is NOT flawed, but WANTED. So, I guess, by that line of reasoning, the answerr to the OP’s question is, “This game is about grind!”

I guess the only way you could compare the 2 GW2 and Solitaire rationally is if you had 50 different decks of playing cards for Solitaire, each with a different set of individual cards, each deck with benefits and hindrances, and THEN offered 50 different cardbacks and artwork…

I’m not comparing Guild Wars 2 to solitaire. I’m pointing out that the same sorts of people who might enjoy solitaire will enjoy Guild Wars 1. Plenty of people who play RPGs generally do NOT play for rewards. This is a relatively recent development, made most popular by WoW and WoW clones.

Mostly, prior to that, RPGs were made to reward people experientially rather than with loot.

Anet will revisit the loot system, but even in Guild Wars 1, the loot system wasn’t like it was in most games, but lots of people played the game for years.

Sorry, Vayne, but reward systems in games have been there for centuries. In chess, you won the war. In poker, you won the pot. In Monopoly, you won the most wealth. In Pac-Man, you got your name in the winner’s list. In Mario Bros., you got the gold. The point is, GW2 is DESIGNED TO RELY ON GEAR PROGRESSION. As I stated earlier; you can’t start the game and play it all the way through with starter armor and starter weapons.

As for GW1 loot system: I gave ANet a rash of crap for the loot nerf they implemented prior to the implementation of HM. However, after they tweaked it several times, it became palatable. Frankly, looking back, I’d PREFER the loot system in GW 1 over this one. Instead of fighting to obtain the gold to obtain the gems to obtain the skin in the TP, you went and fought a boss and hoped you got his green drop. There was a greater sense of accomplishment getting the drop than there is in grinding the gold.

But Guild Wars 1 still wasnt’ DESIGNED around rewards. The rewards were THERE, but for the most part if you did a dungeon, you got a crappy gold that unless you were working for wisdom, you’d sell as an unid’ed gold.

There were rare drops in some dungeons like the bone dragon staff, and some people farmed them, but most never did. Maybe you got the rare black dye, white dye or lockpick, but most drops were crap.

People did farm, but they weren’t the majority. Most people just played the game and the drops were INCIDENTAL to the rest of it.

Just because YOU think in terms of drops doesn’t mean the game was designed for that to be the focus.

Danikat.8537:

For me Guild Wars 2 is about exploring Tyria and doing the different personal story quests and dungeons, and because it’s an MMO getting to do it with my friends and/or random strangers.

And, to be fair, I enjoyed all of that the first time through. Less so the second and not much the third. Fourth 80 I levelled solely through crafting and the fifth I cant even be bothered with anymore. Once you have explored everywhere and done all the dungeons…what are you gonna do then huh?

That is the point you will probably join the whining masses. Resistance is futile.