Guild Wars 2

soo after the mas confusion nerf, that hit condition mesmers extremely hard as it is pretty much the only true condition we can viably stack, anet comes out with a rune.

this rune is majorly changing balance as now every class gets free access to viable confusion stacking through interrupts! i mean we had to kitten spec into glams and give up so much for viable stacking.

a warrior can stack confusion in mass now, rangers, necros, thieves , simply every single class can do it easily.

a rune should not be a free ticket to massstacking a new condition, it should buff the condition and give a chance of inflicting confusion not 10 sec of confusion on interrupts.
anet this is not ok! u have weakend the mesmer already enough and now u take it’s condition where we were supposed to be specialized in and give it to everyone for free.

it’s not ok at all. this rune is way too powerful the way it is and shouldnt give every class free access to a new condition.

i mean a glam mesmer gave up everything in order to get high stacks of confusion. no dps, long cd’s limited traitline and u nerfed it all and now this?!?!

dont u realize that there are classes out there that have tons of interrupts? so what is the role of the mesmer now?
veilbot?

It’s 1 stack. I don’t see this as a mass stacks of confusion rune. This rune actually benefits mesmers more than any other class. Considering that mesmers can spec for interrupts and confusion, this rune set is perfect.

actually no it puts 5 stacks of confusion during 10sec (+30%) to anything you interrupt……

there is no cooldowns! and btw our interrupts are great for 1v1 but nowhere near what other classes can do with aoe interrupts

Yes.

EDIT: I have yet to actually test it but if it’s as good as you say it is then that could mean trouble. Either way I am going to test it out with thief s/p

Omg! What have they done?! There will be mass confusion…

Seems like a fairly bizarre gear introduction on Anet’s part. I’d love to hear their rationale.

they have to change this rune! a rune should not give every class that uses it access to a new condition. it is ok if it does inflict a few stacks, but with cooldown and definitely not through interruption. aoue interruption is way easier to access by other classes than mesmer and therefor this rune actually hurts the mesmer class a lot with this. i know it will strengthen cond. mesmers too, but like this it actually destroys a lot about our class.
mesmers should be masters of confusion not only as a condition, but also in general. making confusion accessable like this to all classes…… im sure its not intended ANET!

I wouldn’t use it on my confusion mesmer.

Do other classes really cause interrupt better than a mesmer? I can’t think of any class that’s better at interrupting than a mesmer.

A thief loses it’s dps if it focuses on interrupts.
A warrior could be good with it
A necro only has fear and can’t fear very often
An elementalist wouldn’t be good with this, don’t even think shocking aura is an interrupt bcs the hit lands
An engineer could be good with this
A guardian wouldn’t fit this rune well,
A ranger wouldn’t fit this rune well either

The only 3 professions that could potentially really utilize this rune set well are the Engi, Warrior, and Mesmer.

I’ll sell the idea that it’s OP for other profs to access to confusion, but 5 stacks for 10 seconds I might consider OP if it were PvP.

me neither as my interrupts are not that great for wvw, but other classes will be abusing this till it get fixed.

Shockwave.1230:

Do other classes really cause interrupt better than a mesmer? I can’t think of any class that’s better at interrupting than a mesmer.

A thief loses it’s dps if it focuses on interrupts.
…

7k pistol whip is good enough DPS for me.

Shockwave.1230:

Do other classes really cause interrupt better than a mesmer? I can’t think of any class that’s better at interrupting than a mesmer.

A thief loses it’s dps if it focuses on interrupts.
A warrior could be good with it
A necro only has fear and can’t fear very often
An elementalist wouldn’t be good with this, don’t even think shocking aura is an interrupt bcs the hit lands
An engineer could be good with this
A guardian wouldn’t fit this rune well,
A ranger wouldn’t fit this rune well either

The only 3 professions that could potentially really utilize this rune set well are the Engi, Warrior, and Mesmer.

I’ll sell the idea that it’s OP for other profs to access to confusion, but 5 stacks for 10 seconds I might consider OP if it were PvP.

Incorrect on necromancer. Fear does not even register as an interrupt. The only way a necro can proc the interrupt is through the daze on the warhorn and a well-timed spectral grasp.

Khal Drogo.9631:

Shockwave.1230:

Do other classes really cause interrupt better than a mesmer? I can’t think of any class that’s better at interrupting than a mesmer.

A thief loses it’s dps if it focuses on interrupts.
…

7k pistol whip is good enough DPS for me.

and we got the fist winner of easy 25 stacks! mesmer glam traits btw never lasted even close to 10 sec. most glams last 5s. this rune is an absolute slap in a mesmers face! if anet doesent nerf this, it will look like anet is trying to delete mesmers from the game! and sry i main a mesmer. mesmer gets destroyed like that=no reason for me to play again!

What in the world is happening in this thread?

Mesmers do not own confusion. Have you ever heard of engineers? These runes are not an attack on mesmers. Yes, these runes give whoever uses them a good source of confusion ( including mesmers…). I think this is a good thing because they open up a lot of new and interesting condition builds.

My main is a mesmer, but I have as alts (thief, warrior, ranger).

Mesmers have multiple AOE interrupts: diversion (can spec to hit up to 5 targets), chaos storm, focus pull, illusionary wave, ect. Other classes can use these runes, but the mesmer appears to have the most potential in terms of speccing and landing multiple AOE interrupts, which is the way it should be.

Not sure what the fuss is about, these runes take nothing away from the mesmer. And the relative “luck” factor in landing interrupts in the heat of battle (unless the enemy is using a real obvious/slow ability) means that these runes should NOT have a cooldown on the #6 ability.

Rodigee.7139:

What in the world is happening in this thread?

Mesmers do not own confusion. Have you ever heard of engineers? These runes are not an attack on mesmers. Yes, these runes give whoever uses them a good source of confusion ( including mesmers…). I think this is a good thing because they open up a lot of new and interesting condition builds.

erm confusion is the core condition for mesmer. we have very little other conditions and so far only engi and mesmers could viably stack it.our traitline and scepter for exampe have a lot to do with confusion. now every class can stack it better then mesmers with 1 rune! then anet pleast give me a permastalthrune, perma binding root rune, perma knockdown rune, permastun rune and a necrowell rune.

a glamesmer has thoughness of around 1.6k and our power was 900, and condition dmg was 1.7k. thats what we gave up for being able to stack confusion. mesmers really dont have other conditions to viably stack. now every other class that has interrupts gets free 25 stacks next to being able to deal decent dps dmg! i mean wtf!

Has anyone actually faced someone with these runes yet? I have a feeling people are really blowing things out of proportion. Just because an attack is a CC, does NOT mean it is an interrupt. By the time someone has 10 stacks of confusion from 2 interrupts, they’re likely going to stop attacking because that’s what procs confusion damage. And when they stop attacking, you cannot interrupt. Plus most CC heavy weaponsets don’t have any fodder conditions to stop one cleanse from eliminating all those confusion stacks and killing all your damage because CC heavy weaponsets tend to be power oriented.

At best for non-mesmers, I see these runes being used by hammer warriors with the trait that gives another 4 stacks on interrupt, and p/p bomb kit/toolkit engis. Every other class just doesn’t have the inherent confusion to make the runes worth taking over another just to make CCs inflict confusion.

selan.8354:

Rodigee.7139:

What in the world is happening in this thread?

Mesmers do not own confusion. Have you ever heard of engineers? These runes are not an attack on mesmers. Yes, these runes give whoever uses them a good source of confusion ( including mesmers…). I think this is a good thing because they open up a lot of new and interesting condition builds.

erm confusion is the core condition for mesmer. we have very little other conditions and so far only engi and mesmers could viably stack it.our traitline and scepter for exampe have a lot to do with confusion. now every class can stack it better then mesmers with 1 rune! then anet pleast give me a permastalthrune, perma binding root rune, perma knockdown rune, permastun rune and a necrowell rune.

a glamesmer has thoughness of around 1.6k and our power was 900, and condition dmg was 1.7k. thats what we gave up for being able to stack confusion. mesmers really dont have other conditions to viably stack. now every other class that has interrupts gets free 25 stacks next to being able to deal decent dps dmg! i mean wtf!

Bleeding is the core condition for Thieves, I don’t see any Thieves complaining that there is a sigil that grants 60% chance on crit to cause bleeding damage. I’m glad they’re bringing out runes and sigils that break the monotony. Confusions were never exclusive to Mesmers, I’ve been able to stack confusion with an Engineer since forever.

selan.8354:

a glamesmer has thoughness of around 1.6k and our power was 900, and condition dmg was 1.7k. thats what we gave up for being able to stack confusion. mesmers really dont have other conditions to viably stack. now every other class that has interrupts gets free 25 stacks next to being able to deal decent dps dmg! i mean wtf!

Using gross exaggerations will not bolster this claim that you are making.

Getting 25 stacks purely on interrupts means landing interrupts on your opponent FIVE times in a short enough time period (all occurring in say, within 10-15 seconds) so that the first confusion stacks do not dissipate in time. This is very difficult, if not impossible to pull off based on interrupts alone.

Aside from using these runes, mesmers still have shatters and other abilities where they can reliably and easily stack confusion. These runes are simply the icing on the cake. Other classes will now be able to stack confusion, but it won’t happen nearly as often or as effectively as the mesmer can do

Yukabacera.2307:

Has anyone actually faced someone with these runes yet? I have a feeling people are really blowing things out of proportion. Just because an attack is a CC, does NOT mean it is an interrupt. By the time someone has 10 stacks of confusion from 2 interrupts, they’re likely going to stop attacking because that’s what procs confusion damage. And when they stop attacking, you cannot interrupt. Plus most CC heavy weaponsets don’t have any fodder conditions to stop one cleanse from eliminating all those confusion stacks and killing all your damage because CC heavy weaponsets tend to be power oriented.

At best for non-mesmers, I see these runes being used by hammer warriors with the trait that gives another 4 stacks on interrupt, and p/p bomb kit/toolkit engis. Every other class just doesn’t have the inherent confusion to make the runes worth taking over another just to make CCs inflict confusion.

I’ve been using the runes, and I have 3 different interrupts on my mesmer (with 100% confusion duration) with the spec/weapons I use. They’re good, but landing confusion stacks with just interrupt is no where as easy as the OP is pretending it is. Between shatters (frustration) and the rune procs, I can average anywhere from 8-15 stacks throughout a fight with an enemy, and occasionally spike it up to 25 stacks (but this isn’t easy and they don’t last that long).

Elthurien.8356:

selan.8354:

Rodigee.7139:

What in the world is happening in this thread?

Mesmers do not own confusion. Have you ever heard of engineers? These runes are not an attack on mesmers. Yes, these runes give whoever uses them a good source of confusion ( including mesmers…). I think this is a good thing because they open up a lot of new and interesting condition builds.

erm confusion is the core condition for mesmer. we have very little other conditions and so far only engi and mesmers could viably stack it.our traitline and scepter for exampe have a lot to do with confusion. now every class can stack it better then mesmers with 1 rune! then anet pleast give me a permastalthrune, perma binding root rune, perma knockdown rune, permastun rune and a necrowell rune.

a glamesmer has thoughness of around 1.6k and our power was 900, and condition dmg was 1.7k. thats what we gave up for being able to stack confusion. mesmers really dont have other conditions to viably stack. now every other class that has interrupts gets free 25 stacks next to being able to deal decent dps dmg! i mean wtf!

Bleeding is the core condition for Thieves, I don’t see any Thieves complaining that there is a sigil that grants 60% chance on crit to cause bleeding damage. I’m glad they’re bringing out runes and sigils that break the monotony. Confusions were never exclusive to Mesmers, I’ve been able to stack confusion with an Engineer since forever.

i know about engis and yes they were able to stack confusion very very well before the nerf and im not saying its supposed to be a mesmer only skill, but we were specialists on it next to engis and there is not much conditions we are able to stack this high. a 60 percent on grit granting bleeding is nothing compared to 5 stacks of confusion on every interrupt for 10 seconds. even with that rune and a crit glasscannon build i wouldnt be able to stack bleeding as much as a bleeding thief can

Sunreva.8714:

selan.8354:

a glamesmer has thoughness of around 1.6k and our power was 900, and condition dmg was 1.7k. thats what we gave up for being able to stack confusion. mesmers really dont have other conditions to viably stack. now every other class that has interrupts gets free 25 stacks next to being able to deal decent dps dmg! i mean wtf!

Using gross exaggerations will not bolster this claim that you are making.

Getting 25 stacks purely on interrupts means landing interrupts on your opponent FIVE times in a short enough time period (all occurring in say, within 10-15 seconds) so that the first confusion stacks do not dissipate in time. This is very difficult, if not impossible to pull off based on interrupts alone.

Aside from using these runes, mesmers still have shatters and other abilities where they can reliably and easily stack confusion. These runes are simply the icing on the cake. Other classes will now be able to stack confusion, but it won’t happen nearly as often or as effectively as the mesmer can do

erm just go to the wvw forums and see how people talk about their massstacks of confusion with theuir warriors thieves and rangers.

so mesmer now sucks in pvp?

laokoko.7403:

so mesmer now sucks in pvp?

go to the spvp forums and see for yourself. who is top and who is bottom tier.

Saying a Mesmer is bad because Its not used in SPvP anymore is rather silly.

Since winning SPvP often isn’t determined by actually winning fights, but more about Controlling Points.

Anyway… The Rune itself probably does need a ICD put on the 6th ability…Mainly Because it can be spammy on some classes.. realistically though you actually have to interrupt someone.. and Interrupting someone isn’t always the easiest thing to do.

Xsorus.2507:

Saying a Mesmer is bad because Its not used in SPvP anymore is rather silly.

Since winning SPvP often isn’t determined by actually winning fights, but more about Controlling Points.

Anyway… The Rune itself probably does need a ICD put on the 6th ability…Mainly Because it can be spammy on some classes.. realistically though you actually have to interrupt someone.. and Interrupting someone isn’t always the easiest thing to do.

yeah it does need a icd and also be not 5 stacks at once for 10 seconds, any glamtrait lasts for 5s…soo 10 sec is too much.

gurugeorge.9857:

Seems like a fairly bizarre gear introduction on Anet’s part. I’d love to hear their rationale.

Their Rationale is “we don’t test anything properly” that’s for the players to do and then they can nerf it at their leisure.

The problem with warriors is unique to them. They can trait to do 4 stacks of confusion on interrupt, combine that with the rune and 1 interrupt puts 9 stacks of confusion on the enemy.

A warrior who lands 2 interrupts on you (if they are traited and have the runes) applies 18 stacks of confusion. Whereas, any other class that lands 2 interrupts (with the runes) will only apply 10 stacks.

The issue is with that warrior trait (distracting strikes) and not the rune set.

I’m not sure if they fixed the issue that was letting engineers get 25 permanent stacks of AoE torment, regardless of build, from the new rune sets.

Anet’s gotta learn, the internal cooldowns exist for a reason.

Blood Red Arachnid.2493:

I’m not sure if they fixed the issue that was letting engineers get 25 permanent stacks of AoE torment, regardless of build, from the new rune sets.

Anet’s gotta learn, the internal cooldowns exist for a reason.

has been hotfixed yesterday and has now a icd of 20 seconds. the new confusion rune has to to be reworked as im sure its not inteded for wrriors to get 19 stack consistently plus it need a icd like the torment one.

My warrior has always been a wacky bleeding/confusion build: 1 interrupt via trait, 2 interrupts on weapons, 3 interrupts from utilities, and 4 interrupts with the elite.

I got Perplexity installed recently, and I’m happy… extra Confusion and 100% Confusion duration. Saw some 4k numbers.

Rangers only have 3-4 ok interups. And they are all on seperate weapons with long cooldowns :\

ugh this is a nightmare!anet fix this mess already!

That rune sounds “worse” than it is. A confusion mesmer can with some alterations now stack even more confusions. That doesn’t make confusion a better condition. And while Mesme have the most abilities to stack confusion, it is not the only one. My mesmer stacks in the first secs of a fight up to 8-12 bleeds, and while the fight goes on, I can stack bleed faster than necro.

However, while it sounds theoreticly awfull to have tons of confusions stacked on you through this rune, it still has to be done doing interrupts. I actually like the idea behind that rune, so maybe more player will focus on interrupting rather focus on big dmg numbers. Also, confusion remains a very predictable condition. If you are confused, you should avoid using skills, making it harder for your opponent to stack more confusion via interrupt. Let’s please wait some time and see how this rune turns out. I bet it won’t be such a big deal in some weeks any more.

Shockwave.1230:

Do other classes really cause interrupt better than a mesmer? I can’t think of any class that’s better at interrupting than a mesmer.

A thief loses it’s dps if it focuses on interrupts.
A warrior could be good with it
A necro only has fear and can’t fear very often
An elementalist wouldn’t be good with this, don’t even think shocking aura is an interrupt bcs the hit lands
An engineer could be good with this
A guardian wouldn’t fit this rune well,
A ranger wouldn’t fit this rune well either

The only 3 professions that could potentially really utilize this rune set well are the Engi, Warrior, and Mesmer.

I’ll sell the idea that it’s OP for other profs to access to confusion, but 5 stacks for 10 seconds I might consider OP if it were PvP.

And we should consider too that warrior to focus on condition damage should focus on sword as a main weapon..you could put a shield or a mace offhand to interrupt, but it wouldn’t work so well imo…main 2h hammer and double mace would work much better…but they have no skill that gives cond at all ( at least damaging ones)…confusion is nice, but they wouldn’t be able to reliably stack it…you can land 25 interrupts, doesn’t mean you ll hit every time nor interrupt something…plus it’s easier to avoid a melee stun/daze/knock , since they generally have a very peculiar animation…but a ranged stun from a mesmer…or a clone shattering…it’s another story.
To me this rune is a big big big plus to a confusion mesmer…before it lacked the possibility to stack some proprerly (6-8 stack…in a burst…for like ? 6-7 ? meh….) and you coldn’t get a big bonus to its duration either…still i miss a confusion sigil.

Doubt I would benefit from this.

I’m a GS/Rifle Signet build War, and I have 1 int – Which is my number 5 skill on a rifle. While I do use that often, I need to be within melee range to use that skill – Which is what I am trying to avoid, by using a rifle.

I think this might be a bit of an over-reaction, since it seems you need to actually focus on the interrupt to make this even worthwhile and that could hurt a lot of classes in PvP.

EDIT Besides, as a warrior, I wouldn’t give up my current runes/sigils to boost my damage and other stats I am pushing, for confusion. It’s not worth it at all.

I think the rune is going to get nerfed (at least an ICD and probably a change to the duration), so this will all be moot in a little while.

But it does sometimes feel like GW2 is slowly homogenizing the classes.

Its DEVESTATING in WvW, far, far, far worse then Mesmer confusion ever was and that was nerfed…

Warriors are getting 25 stacks of confusion and maintaining it no problem…

Will 100% certain get nerfed…

Last time I looked a set cost 20g…I wonder if people will get enough ‘use’ out of it to be worthwhile before its nerfed?

If I mained a Mesmer I would be RAGING now after there confusion was nerfed a few months back, when it was no were near as bad as this…

Here is what I wouldn’t mind seeing.
Not only in this rune set, but future rune sets.

Major Rune of Perplexity
(1) +28 Condition Damage
(2) 15% Confusion Duration
(3) +55 Condition Damage
(4) 20% chance to inflict Confusion with hits (15 second cooldown).

Superior Rune of Perplexity
(1) +28 Condition Damage
(2) 15% Confusion Duration
(3) +55 Condition Damage
(4) 20% chance to receive Confusion when hit (5 second cooldown).
(5) +120 Condition Damage
(6) +15% confusion duration. Causes 10 seconds of Confusion on interrupt.

From my example. Major is just about what you’d expect from a rune. Superior is different. Set effects (5) and (6) are stronger than your average rune. That’s why set effect (4) is a disadvantage**.

**Unless you are a necro. Then it can be an advantage. >_>

Meglobob.8620:

Its DEVESTATING in WvW, far, far, far worse then Mesmer confusion ever was and that was nerfed…

Warriors are getting 25 stacks of confusion and maintaining it no problem…

Will 100% certain get nerfed…

Last time I looked a set cost 20g…I wonder if people will get enough ‘use’ out of it to be worthwhile before its nerfed?

If I mained a Mesmer I would be RAGING now after there confusion was nerfed a few months back, when it was no were near as bad as this…

I do main a mesmer, but my ability to rage over nerfs is long, long, gone. It’s been a never ending stream of nerfs for the mesmer (and a never ending stream of buffs to the warrior) so this is par for the course.

I’m not even sure this thread is for reals but…

…only condition builds will get anything out of them, and condition builds are kinda meh. So they all needed a boost.

I put them on my necro, and like others have said, fear isn’t an interupt, and warhorn is kinda useless. Landing a daze on someone is pretty hard to do; an offhand dagger gives condition transfer and aoe bleed/weakness, so the warhorn is pretty bad.

So for my necro, I have no interrupts.

The damage from confusion is nice, but it’s unpredictable, worthless against some classes, and comes at the cost of the 140-150 condition damage that I used to have with undead runes 6th bonus.

The bottom line is, that even with these runes, you still won’t be able to kill a thief.

Rodigee.7139:

What in the world is happening in this thread?

Mesmers do not own confusion. Have you ever heard of engineers? These runes are not an attack on mesmers. Yes, these runes give whoever uses them a good source of confusion ( including mesmers…). I think this is a good thing because they open up a lot of new and interesting condition builds.

Thank you! I don’t understand how or why some people think confusion (or any condition, for that matter) belongs to just one class. It’s like complaining about the fear from Runes of the Nightmare because “fear is a necro thing.”

This rune does not hurt mesmers in any way. We have just as much access to it as any other class. In fact, because we have lots of interrupts, a trait that increases confusion duration by 33%, and skills that inflict confusion, we gain more by using these runes than any other class.

Selan has already been very vocal about his concerns about this rune on the mesmer forum (https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/New-Rune-for-condi-mesmers/first). While there’s nothing wrong with bringing this topic to a larger audience for discussion, I would challenge him and anyone else who thinks these runes are overpowered to actually try them out on the classes you think they would be overpowered on. Provide the community with a video of the runes in action, or at least with a numerical summary of what they did and why they’re unbalanced.

I’ve been using these runes since the patch, and while they’re a nice dps increase for me, I’ve yet to see them do anything overpowered. Maybe I’m using them wrong, but it seems to me that any skilled opponent I’ve faced so far simply cleanses the confusion or stops spamming skills for a while.

I hope they don’t nerf the runes. I’m loving them on my s/p thief, and since s/p has a huge issue keeping pressure it really does a lot to close that pressure gap. I’m perfectly fine with the runes. Please don’t nerf them because of naysayers.

Palu.3405:

Rodigee.7139:

What in the world is happening in this thread?

Mesmers do not own confusion. Have you ever heard of engineers? These runes are not an attack on mesmers. Yes, these runes give whoever uses them a good source of confusion ( including mesmers…). I think this is a good thing because they open up a lot of new and interesting condition builds.

Thank you! I don’t understand how or why some people think confusion (or any condition, for that matter) belongs to just one class. It’s like complaining about the fear from Runes of the Nightmare because “fear is a necro thing.”

This rune does not hurt mesmers in any way. We have just as much access to it as any other class. In fact, because we have lots of interrupts, a trait that increases confusion duration by 33%, and skills that inflict confusion, we gain more by using these runes than any other class.

Selan has already been very vocal about his concerns about this rune on the mesmer forum (https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/New-Rune-for-condi-mesmers/first). While there’s nothing wrong with bringing this topic to a larger audience for discussion, I would challenge him and anyone else who thinks these runes are overpowered to actually try them out on the classes you think they would be overpowered on. Provide the community with a video of the runes in action, or at least with a numerical summary of what they did and why they’re unbalanced.

I’ve been using these runes since the patch, and while they’re a nice dps increase for me, I’ve yet to see them do anything overpowered. Maybe I’m using them wrong, but it seems to me that any skilled opponent I’ve faced so far simply cleanses the confusion or stops spamming skills for a while.

first of all im a girl, secondly warriors had fear since beginning of the game. i never said that confusion is an only mesmer thing, but as it is right now it does what a confusion mesmer does, but way better. they nerfed bb trait on mesmers to make it harder to stack confusion and along comes a rune. plus none of our confusions evr lasted for 10 seconds. all of them have 3-5 seconds. and if u wantproof, go to wvw forums and check the sreenshots of warriors and thieves with that rune.

a mesmer has to give up a lot if he wanted to be able to viably stack confusion. we have no dps in return,especially as glam mesmers. thats why im concerned as a confusion mesmer has been replaced by a rune!
btw no need to point me out.gotta see that as a confision mesmer since start and way befor glam mesmers, this rune makes me very upset!

selan.8354:

Palu.3405:

Rodigee.7139:

What in the world is happening in this thread?

Mesmers do not own confusion. Have you ever heard of engineers? These runes are not an attack on mesmers. Yes, these runes give whoever uses them a good source of confusion ( including mesmers…). I think this is a good thing because they open up a lot of new and interesting condition builds.

Thank you! I don’t understand how or why some people think confusion (or any condition, for that matter) belongs to just one class. It’s like complaining about the fear from Runes of the Nightmare because “fear is a necro thing.”

This rune does not hurt mesmers in any way. We have just as much access to it as any other class. In fact, because we have lots of interrupts, a trait that increases confusion duration by 33%, and skills that inflict confusion, we gain more by using these runes than any other class.

Selan has already been very vocal about his concerns about this rune on the mesmer forum (https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/New-Rune-for-condi-mesmers/first). While there’s nothing wrong with bringing this topic to a larger audience for discussion, I would challenge him and anyone else who thinks these runes are overpowered to actually try them out on the classes you think they would be overpowered on. Provide the community with a video of the runes in action, or at least with a numerical summary of what they did and why they’re unbalanced.

I’ve been using these runes since the patch, and while they’re a nice dps increase for me, I’ve yet to see them do anything overpowered. Maybe I’m using them wrong, but it seems to me that any skilled opponent I’ve faced so far simply cleanses the confusion or stops spamming skills for a while.

first of all im a girl, secondly warriors had fear since beginning of the game. i never said that confusion is an only mesmer thing, but as it is right now it does what a confusion mesmer does, but way better. they nerfed bb trait on mesmers to make it harder to stack confusion and along comes a rune. plus none of our confusions evr lasted for 10 seconds. all of them have 3-5 seconds. and if u wantproof, go to wvw forums and check the sreenshots of warriors and thieves with that rune.

a mesmer has to give up a lot if he wanted to be able to viably stack confusion. we have no dps in return,especially as glam mesmers. thats why im concerned as a confusion mesmer has been replaced by a rune!
btw no need to point me out.gotta see that as a confision mesmer since start and way befor glam mesmers, this rune makes me very upset!

So buff the mesmer, don’t nerf the rune. On another note, engineer Asura have always been able to stack confusion better than mesmers when they use p/s and pain inverter. That’s including after the PI nerf.

Meglobob.8620:

Its DEVESTATING in WvW, far, far, far worse then Mesmer confusion ever was and that was nerfed…

Warriors are getting 25 stacks of confusion and maintaining it no problem…

Will 100% certain get nerfed…

I would hope that they do not simply nerf the runes, as the runes are not the problem. As you mentioned, warriors are getting 25 stacks and maintaining it no problem, this is because of a trait they can pick which does 4 stacks of confusion on interrupt. The problem is that their trait and the runes combined, equals 9 stacks of confusion PER interrupt.

The warrior trait needs to be fixed.

Viking Jorun.5413:

selan.8354:

Palu.3405:

Rodigee.7139:

What in the world is happening in this thread?

Mesmers do not own confusion. Have you ever heard of engineers? These runes are not an attack on mesmers. Yes, these runes give whoever uses them a good source of confusion ( including mesmers…). I think this is a good thing because they open up a lot of new and interesting condition builds.

Thank you! I don’t understand how or why some people think confusion (or any condition, for that matter) belongs to just one class. It’s like complaining about the fear from Runes of the Nightmare because “fear is a necro thing.”

This rune does not hurt mesmers in any way. We have just as much access to it as any other class. In fact, because we have lots of interrupts, a trait that increases confusion duration by 33%, and skills that inflict confusion, we gain more by using these runes than any other class.

Selan has already been very vocal about his concerns about this rune on the mesmer forum (https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/New-Rune-for-condi-mesmers/first). While there’s nothing wrong with bringing this topic to a larger audience for discussion, I would challenge him and anyone else who thinks these runes are overpowered to actually try them out on the classes you think they would be overpowered on. Provide the community with a video of the runes in action, or at least with a numerical summary of what they did and why they’re unbalanced.

I’ve been using these runes since the patch, and while they’re a nice dps increase for me, I’ve yet to see them do anything overpowered. Maybe I’m using them wrong, but it seems to me that any skilled opponent I’ve faced so far simply cleanses the confusion or stops spamming skills for a while.

first of all im a girl, secondly warriors had fear since beginning of the game. i never said that confusion is an only mesmer thing, but as it is right now it does what a confusion mesmer does, but way better. they nerfed bb trait on mesmers to make it harder to stack confusion and along comes a rune. plus none of our confusions evr lasted for 10 seconds. all of them have 3-5 seconds. and if u wantproof, go to wvw forums and check the sreenshots of warriors and thieves with that rune.

a mesmer has to give up a lot if he wanted to be able to viably stack confusion. we have no dps in return,especially as glam mesmers. thats why im concerned as a confusion mesmer has been replaced by a rune!
btw no need to point me out.gotta see that as a confision mesmer since start and way befor glam mesmers, this rune makes me very upset!

So buff the mesmer, don’t nerf the rune. On another note, engineer Asura have always been able to stack confusion better than mesmers when they use p/s and pain inverter. That’s including after the PI nerf.

So what you’re saying is that you support power creep? Something that every one with their head screwed on right is completely against?

selan.8354:

first of all im a girl, secondly warriors had fear since beginning of the game. i never said that confusion is an only mesmer thing, but as it is right now it does what a confusion mesmer does, but way better. they nerfed bb trait on mesmers to make it harder to stack confusion and along comes a rune. plus none of our confusions evr lasted for 10 seconds. all of them have 3-5 seconds. and if u wantproof, go to wvw forums and check the sreenshots of warriors and thieves with that rune.

a mesmer has to give up a lot if he wanted to be able to viably stack confusion. we have no dps in return,especially as glam mesmers. thats why im concerned as a confusion mesmer has been replaced by a rune!
btw no need to point me out.gotta see that as a confision mesmer since start and way befor glam mesmers, this rune makes me very upset!

My apologies for using a male pronoun to refer to you. I assure you, I meant no offense.

Regarding Fear, I was making the comparison that it is a condition which a small number of classes get access to via skills, but which can be gained by all classes via runes. Saying confusion should belong to mesmers is akin to saying that Fear should belong only to necros.

You claim that you never stated mesmers should be the only class with access to confusion. However, you have the following statements strongly implying that you think other classes shouldn’t be able to access it via a rune.

selan.8354:

mesmers should be masters of confusion not only as a condition, but also in general. making confusion accessable like this to all classes…… im sure its not intended ANET!

selan.8354:

mesmers are not specialists in confusion anymore! i mean whats our role now? veil and portal bot?

Saying that other classes are not intended to have access to confusion like this and that these runes relegate us to “portal bots” strongly paints a picture that you believe confusion should not be easily accessible via a rune. Please explain how this doesn’t imply that mesmers should have semi-exclusivity to confusion.

You also seem to imply that glamour builds were the primary way for mesmers to stack confusion. While this was certainly true for ZergvZerg (and why Blinding Befuddlement was nerfed into the ground), mesmers can make perfectly viable condition builds which have confusion not as the primary source of damage, but as a supplement. For these builds, the runes are incredible. The increased confusion duration is a great boon for anyone using Confusing Images. And, quite frankly, any build that is focusing solely on confusion is going to be sub-par. In large groups, there will be enough condition cleansing to make it ineffective, and in smaller fights, any decent player won’t spam skills and will make an effort to cleanse such large stacks of confusion.

I play a mesmer and have come across several players using the Runes of Perplexity. I’ve seen thieves, mesmers, engies, and warriors using the runes thusfar. Of all those classes, guess which ones used the runes the best: engies and mesmers. They were able to use confusion as a supplemental damage source along with their other conditions. Thieves didn’t have enough interrupts to keep confusion on me after I cleansed the initial burst. Likewise, warrior interrupts are so easily dodge-able that they were barely able to get confusion on me.

I would be a fan of a 10-20s ICD on the 6-piece trait to prevent the rune from becoming Glamour 2.0. However, in the many hours I’ve spent in WvW since the rune was released, I’ve yet to see any situations where the rune was overpowered. If people are allowing 20+ stacks of confusion to be stacked on them and aren’t cleansing it, that is a problem with their build or their understanding of confusion mechanics, not with the rune.

Edit: Likewise, I’ve been a condition mesmer since the game’s pre-release. I have played around with many builds utilizing confusion to varying degrees. A mesmer needs to give up a lot to stack massive confusion stacks. However, as stated above, those builds aren’t going to perform well against any decent player. These runes benefit mesmers (and to a lesser degree, engies) more than any other class. If you think these runes destroy our class, you really ought to evaluate your build and how you’re using them.

Mada.5319:

Viking Jorun.5413:

selan.8354:

Palu.3405:

Rodigee.7139:

What in the world is happening in this thread?

Mesmers do not own confusion. Have you ever heard of engineers? These runes are not an attack on mesmers. Yes, these runes give whoever uses them a good source of confusion ( including mesmers…). I think this is a good thing because they open up a lot of new and interesting condition builds.

Thank you! I don’t understand how or why some people think confusion (or any condition, for that matter) belongs to just one class. It’s like complaining about the fear from Runes of the Nightmare because “fear is a necro thing.”

This rune does not hurt mesmers in any way. We have just as much access to it as any other class. In fact, because we have lots of interrupts, a trait that increases confusion duration by 33%, and skills that inflict confusion, we gain more by using these runes than any other class.

Selan has already been very vocal about his concerns about this rune on the mesmer forum (https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/mesmer/New-Rune-for-condi-mesmers/first). While there’s nothing wrong with bringing this topic to a larger audience for discussion, I would challenge him and anyone else who thinks these runes are overpowered to actually try them out on the classes you think they would be overpowered on. Provide the community with a video of the runes in action, or at least with a numerical summary of what they did and why they’re unbalanced.

I’ve been using these runes since the patch, and while they’re a nice dps increase for me, I’ve yet to see them do anything overpowered. Maybe I’m using them wrong, but it seems to me that any skilled opponent I’ve faced so far simply cleanses the confusion or stops spamming skills for a while.

first of all im a girl, secondly warriors had fear since beginning of the game. i never said that confusion is an only mesmer thing, but as it is right now it does what a confusion mesmer does, but way better. they nerfed bb trait on mesmers to make it harder to stack confusion and along comes a rune. plus none of our confusions evr lasted for 10 seconds. all of them have 3-5 seconds. and if u wantproof, go to wvw forums and check the sreenshots of warriors and thieves with that rune.

a mesmer has to give up a lot if he wanted to be able to viably stack confusion. we have no dps in return,especially as glam mesmers. thats why im concerned as a confusion mesmer has been replaced by a rune!
btw no need to point me out.gotta see that as a confision mesmer since start and way befor glam mesmers, this rune makes me very upset!

So buff the mesmer, don’t nerf the rune. On another note, engineer Asura have always been able to stack confusion better than mesmers when they use p/s and pain inverter. That’s including after the PI nerf.

So what you’re saying is that you support power creep? Something that every one with their head screwed on right is completely against?

Buffing one class due to a new item being added that nullifies the way said class stands out isn’t power creep. You’d see that if your own head was screwed on right, and this thread isn’t about it at all. We’ve seen nerf after nerf with little love. I think it’s time they buff something rather than merging everything else to solve the issue.

hi for the “apply on interrupt” what actual abilities count as this?

Thank you sorry if it was already posted above.