Guild Wars 2

skullmount.1758:

You guys need to stop, before you get this thread locked. This is GW2 forum, not one for you to argue about a different game. I really don’t want to see this thread closed, because the OP has some really good points.

I agree. The OP has some good points, and this thread shouldn’t be closed. I’ve already stopped.

+1 to OP you hit everything that I feel is going on with this game.

Thank you OP. You posted a long opinion piece that sums up exactly how I feel.

I also didn’t mind the ascended gear drops from FOTM. I “tolerated” the ascended gear from dailies/monthlies like a bitter pill but disagreed with having them in the game.

But this past weekend I decided to try and work for an ascended weapon. I hated playing every minute.

I call BS on the players who say you don’t “need” ascended gear. My guild is very competitive in WvW. 1v1 happens. Every. Single. Day. And yes I lose, sometimes by only a couple of %. Ascended gear would have made a difference. Fact.

luckyguse.2674:

Thank you OP. You posted a long opinion piece that sums up exactly how I feel.

I also didn’t mind the ascended gear drops from FOTM. I “tolerated” the ascended gear from dailies/monthlies like a bitter pill but disagreed with having them in the game.

But this past weekend I decided to try and work for an ascended weapon. I hated playing every minute.

I call BS on the players who say you don’t “need” ascended gear. My guild is very competitive in WvW. 1v1 happens. Every. Single. Day. And yes I lose, sometimes by only a couple of %. Ascended gear would have made a difference. Fact.

Food could’ve made the difference.

/shrug

Anyway, I’m pretty sad to see that fear of a vertical progression gear chase is still considered a reasonable fear on this forum, considering the fact that you still don’t need pink gear to do 99% of what the game offers.

I’m also sad to see people trotting out the “We don’t want players to grind” line out of context and using it to back their argument that everything should come quick and easy.

The line means that Anet doesn’t want players to grind as a gate to having fun.

If you got everything these was to get in the game, would you still be playing it? For a large majority of people the answer is “No.”

^ food is always used. You must have missed the part where I said “very competitive”.

I know there are better PvPers out there than me. But when I get beat now by a small fraction is that player better than me, or did he/she grind better gear?

That question might seem absurd to some but it lingers in the back of my mind now. That takes a lot of the fun away.

luckyguse.2674:

^ food is always used. You must have missed the part where I said “very competitive”.

I know there are better PvPers out there than me. But when I get beat now by a small fraction is that player better than me, or did he/she grind better gear?

That question might seem absurd to some but it lingers in the back of my mind now. That takes a lot of the fun away.

My point was that there are so many variables, it’s probably not the gear that made you lose, even on the bleeding edge of competition.

Mackdose.6504:

If you got everything these was to get in the game, would you still be playing it? For a large majority of people the answer is “No.”

For me the answer would be “yes.” If ANet had diverted their Living Story resources and gear progression resources to creating meaningful horizontal progression, I’d still be playing. I find the Living Story to be weak and anemic, and too focused on achievement mongering for my taste. And gear progression? No thanks, been there, done that, don’t find it interesting.

However, if we had the options of new skill acquisition through game play, tweaking trait lines through game play, cosmetic additions through game play, etc., I’d be all over that.

So, yeah, items don’t interest me much. Developing my character does.

Spiral Architect.6540:

Mackdose.6504:

If you got everything these was to get in the game, would you still be playing it? For a large majority of people the answer is “No.”

For me the answer would be “yes.” If ANet had diverted their Living Story resources and gear progression resources to creating meaningful horizontal progression, I’d still be playing. I find the Living Story to be weak and anemic, and too focused on achievement mongering for my taste. And gear progression? No thanks, been there, done that, don’t find it interesting.

However, if we had the options of new skill acquisition through game play, tweaking trait lines through game play, cosmetic additions through game play, etc., I’d be all over that.

So, yeah, items don’t interest me much. Developing my character does.

Horizontal progression can still be completed, so the question still stands:

If you got everything there was to get in the game, would you still be playing it?

For a large majority of people the answer is “No.”

luckyguse.2674:

^ food is always used. You must have missed the part where I said “very competitive”.

I know there are better PvPers out there than me. But when I get beat now by a small fraction is that player better than me, or did he/she grind better gear?

That question might seem absurd to some but it lingers in the back of my mind now. That takes a lot of the fun away.

WvWvW isn’t meant for 1vs1, and will never be balanced around that idea. You’ll have plenty of fights where you are going against a level 20 in Fine Quality gear. 1vs1 fights in WvWvW is not a good justification to not have ascended gear, when just about everything in WvWvW is unbalanced anyways.

ProxyDamage.9826:

My, my. It’s been around a year now, hasn’kitten Quite a lot has changed. I remember when I bought into this game. I had been interested in it for a while when a friend, which had been here since the beta weekends, offered me the free trial that came with the first Southsun update.

wait …. what?? Southsun? Southsun wasn’t a year ago…. I’m really confused here

My point was that there are so many variables, it’s probably not the gear that made you lose, even on the bleeding edge of competition.

You are right: statistically speaking, the odds are ascended was and will not be the only reason I lose fights. But it is now a contributing factor that wasn’t there before, and that will only grow with time.

The issue [people including myself] have, is not with ascended gear itself, but with the huge grind and time gated skills required to get the gear. It’s causing a rift in the community between the “haves”, “have-not”, those with a large amount of time, and those that don’t.

luckyguse.2674:

^ food is always used. You must have missed the part where I said “very competitive”.

I know there are better PvPers out there than me. But when I get beat now by a small fraction is that player better than me, or did he/she grind better gear?

That question might seem absurd to some but it lingers in the back of my mind now. That takes a lot of the fun away.

While Ascended does offer some boost compared to Exotic, it’s not as high, compared to the Guard Killer/Guard Defense lines and the Bloodlust in the Borderlands buffs. There are far worse offenders for “unequal” fights in WvW than Ascended gear. Even with full Ascended fighting someone with full Exotics you might be at a disadvantage in stats.

luckyguse.2674:

My point was that there are so many variables, it’s probably not the gear that made you lose, even on the bleeding edge of competition.

You are right: statistically speaking, the odds are ascended was and will not be the only reason I lose fights. But it is now a contributing factor that wasn’t there before, and that will only grow with time.

The issue [people including myself] have, is not with ascended gear itself, but with the huge grind and time gated skills required to get the gear. It’s causing a rift in the community between the “haves”, “have-not”, those with a large amount of time, and those that don’t.

There’s an arena for those who don’t want to have the PvE mechanics affect their power, and that’s structured PvP.

I have very little sympathy for your justification against Ascended, which I enjoy having as a goal on the horizon.

The gear doesn’t gate game play, so the grind is for BIS. You don’t require BIS for any content the game offers, therefore there is no have and have-not dynamic at play here.

Mackdose.6504:

luckyguse.2674:

My point was that there are so many variables, it’s probably not the gear that made you lose, even on the bleeding edge of competition.

You are right: statistically speaking, the odds are ascended was and will not be the only reason I lose fights. But it is now a contributing factor that wasn’t there before, and that will only grow with time.

The issue [people including myself] have, is not with ascended gear itself, but with the huge grind and time gated skills required to get the gear. It’s causing a rift in the community between the “haves”, “have-not”, those with a large amount of time, and those that don’t.

There’s an arena for those who don’t want to have the PvE mechanics affect their power, and that’s structured PvP.

I have very little sympathy for your justification against Ascended, which I enjoy having as a goal on the horizon.

The gear doesn’t gate game play, so the grind is for BIS. You don’t require BIS for any content the game offers, therefore there is no have and have-not dynamic at play here.

I’m ok with the small stat advantage, though personally I think they should’ve left the Weapon Dmg alone, that’s too big of a change.

It says a lot when the cheer squad are so vigorous in a particular thread. I am not saying either is right or wrong BUTto me it just seems to add credence to the OP…at least its general thrust anyway…when the cheer squad turns up you know the saying “methinks he protesteth too much”.

Mackdose.6504:

Spiral Architect.6540:

Mackdose.6504:

If you got everything these was to get in the game, would you still be playing it? For a large majority of people the answer is “No.”

For me the answer would be “yes.” If ANet had diverted their Living Story resources and gear progression resources to creating meaningful horizontal progression, I’d still be playing. I find the Living Story to be weak and anemic, and too focused on achievement mongering for my taste. And gear progression? No thanks, been there, done that, don’t find it interesting.

However, if we had the options of new skill acquisition through game play, tweaking trait lines through game play, cosmetic additions through game play, etc., I’d be all over that.

So, yeah, items don’t interest me much. Developing my character does.

Horizontal progression can still be completed, so the question still stands:

If you got everything there was to get in the game, would you still be playing it?

For a large majority of people the answer is “No.”

Heh. Horizontal progression as it stands in the game right now is extremely weak, and not enough to keep me interested. Again, if ANet had put more effort and resource into that side of the game, I might still be there. Shiny new weapon tiers and stat creep, though? Not so much.

There’s an arena for those who don’t want to have the PvE mechanics affect their power, and that’s structured PvP.
I have very little sympathy for your justification against Ascended, which I enjoy having as a goal on the horizon.
The gear doesn’t gate game play, so the grind is for BIS. You don’t require BIS for any content the game offers, therefore there is no have and have-not dynamic at play here.

There really is no gated content in this game. You can finish your opening personal story with a new toon and immediately step into fractals/sPvP, WvW etc. does that mean you will be all that effective?

Some servers are very competitive. Ascended is 8% better than exotic. Having ascended doesn’t make you more skilled, but it does make you 8% more powerful. In a competitive environment BiS can mean the differance between live or die.

Mackdose.6504:

luckyguse.2674:

My point was that there are so many variables, it’s probably not the gear that made you lose, even on the bleeding edge of competition.

You are right: statistically speaking, the odds are ascended was and will not be the only reason I lose fights. But it is now a contributing factor that wasn’t there before, and that will only grow with time.

The issue [people including myself] have, is not with ascended gear itself, but with the huge grind and time gated skills required to get the gear. It’s causing a rift in the community between the “haves”, “have-not”, those with a large amount of time, and those that don’t.

There’s an arena for those who don’t want to have the PvE mechanics affect their power, and that’s structured PvP.

I have very little sympathy for your justification against Ascended, which I enjoy having as a goal on the horizon.

The gear doesn’t gate game play, so the grind is for BIS. You don’t require BIS for any content the game offers, therefore there is no have and have-not dynamic at play here.

You like it, he hates it. Neither of you need it. You both want it. He hates the way it’s been implemented, you like it. There is no greater value to what you want than there is to what he wants. The only real difference is that currently ANet believes you will spend more on gems than he will. I doubt they’re right, because people who throw time at the game will buy their gems with gold, but maybe I’m wrong.