Guild Wars 2

Since most people in the MMO industry use WoW for most comparisons….

I just want you to know that I’m a WoW veteran….I’ve played since WoW’s first Beta….I played when Tauren’s didnt have mounts only plain-strider speed….I played when Will of the forsaken and underwater breathing for undead was passive…..i played when paladins abilties did more damage against undead players…I played when Alterac Valley did not end till 8 hours had passed and all the elites had been summoned….I played when the Hall of Champions was reserved for champions….i played before arena existed…..before BG’s existed….I played when the only way to Achieve Grand Marshal or Highwarlord was to drop out of school or quit your job….I could go on and on but you get the idea….

I see a lot of posts about this games end game content. I remember when WoW came out the only end game content we had was MC. Why would a game designer spend a significant amount of time on the end game content when the mass majority of it’s player base is leveling up for the first time. Doesn’t it make sense that a game would focus more time on the leveling experience since new players are being introduced into the game for the first time….and add more “end game” content as the “community” together reaches max level. If you were a game designer why would you only cater to a few hard core players that reach the max level within a couple of days? It doesn’t make any sense at all that you would spend a significant amount of time on end game content when you are trying to create an addictive leveling experience for people new to the game…at least that’s what WoW realized when it released its MMO…..and that formula worked…because numbers don’t lie.

But not only has Guild Wars focused on the core community of its game it also has a superior business strategy as well…which is to profit solely off the support of our community. You see…Blizzard has a strategy too….one that most of you will be reading about for the first time in this post so grab some popcorn. Now as we all know Blizzard charges subscription fees for World of Warcraft….and we also know that Blizzard offered us a free Diablo 3 in exchange for a year of WoW….and everyone here agrees that Blizzard did not spend a significant amount of time on Diablo 3 and I’ve yet to talk to anyone who thought that was an amazing game or who even still plays it….***So here’s their game plan….They gave most players a low quality made game (they didn’t have to sacrifice a lot of time and resources into) for free in exchange for a year of WoW so that players would feel obligated to buy the expansion when it released….BUT WAIT there’s more…..when the years subscription ends and you’ve had all the WoW you can take….they will introduce you to a new game titled “Project Titan”. The COO of Blizzard (Paul Sams) said their most talented people are working on “Project Titan” and that great people “under” them are managing WoW. So not only is WoW a sinking ship but their COO is even telling you that his best people are working on another project. Guild Wars has its best people working on their game RIGHT NOW….and they are NOT trying to to manipulate you through crafty marketing strategies to lock you into the game. The GW2 business strategy requires that the community supports the game in order for it to succeed…unlike Blizzard.

PvP? I’ve ranked gladiator many times on the unending grind to the top….where emotions run high and a demon arises within the nerd. Arena is NOT fun….it’s a grind…just like WoW PvE is. This game isn’t a grind…in WvW I actually enjoy myself if we win or lose and I never feel the tension that I felt in arena. Arena and BG’s for me at one point had turned into a job….this has never felt like that. Even in WoW when I mention GW2 most people in every chat channel no matter what they think about GW2 in general will always say the PvP is more fun than WoW.

What about MoP? I made my panda monk with his bouncing belly….and ran him around till he was level 15….then logged onto my 85 paladin and mounted on my ZG tiger mount and explored the entire new island in under 30 mins……then for the first time ever I logged out, cancelled my account, and uninstalled the game. Yes GW2 is that good.

The point of this post was to show you that every game needs time to grow and that even though criticism is important towards a games success….its equally important that you understand that the game was built for a community as a whole and also that the meaning of end game “evolves” as the “community” matures and grows.

My complaint is about DR and its affect on the community and the legit playerbase. My question to you would be, how does WoW relate to this. I read your post, and I am complaining.

The only thing that comes to mind is that WoW is supremely successful, you can not deny that, and they do not have a DR system implemented. Every other relavent MMO out there are in the same catagory as WoW on this issue.

Is innovating the industry limiting what your player base can and cant do?

All of what you said does not stop making the DR the most ridiculous and shambolic idea to ever come out of ANet does it?

Read the forums mate, specifically the bug one, and see them lighting up with people being affected for trying to play the game in a legitimate fashion. It’s not right and is a source of serious disruption to people’s playing styles.

It’s important you understand that massive mistakes and poor game policy choices will lead to the very fast demise of a title.

I’m all for the community as a whole idea, but not if that community insists on trying to kill itself. I don’t agree with that at all. It’ll try to stop that from happening.

People are already leaving as GW2 is far from being “that good”. It’s not very good at all. It’s a mess.

Bugs. Not slight launch bugs. Severe gameplay affecting bugs that are left in the game for days and there’s one I’ve noticed for over a week. Not acceptable. Skillpoints, hearts, DEs, there’s more.

A 1-80 XP curve that takes 1 week of moderate play and 2-3 days of hardcore play to achieve? What where they thinking? You’re setting yourself up for a fall there.

DR. If you can’t see it’s a problem from this forum and the bug forum, you need to visit an optician.

WvWvW has left me with 2 hour queues.

Dungeons are a novelty after this first few times and are extremely grindy, for a game that “is not about the grind.”

Bots. They’re increasing exponentially. The DR is supposed to be implemented to stop this, which is an outright lie. I’m getting around 5-10 spam messages in the chatlog to 1-2 mails a day now, a vast increase on what I had before.

DEs. Forget trying to tag a mob. Mindless zerging is now the standard format for group play is it? When did this memo go out? I want my copy so I can say ‘NO!’.

Punitive waypoint travel costs. So I have a friend who needs my help, several times in one day or someone calls out to me to raise them in a given area, and I need to port there. Charging me almost 2 silver within zone and up to 5 out of zone is fair is it? Not even slightly.

I made a really bad mistake purchasing this game in its current state. I wish I hadn’t.

I do hope it gets better, there’s lots of potential. It’s a common theme for devs not to listen to their playerbase at all.

If they had they’d have known the DR was a real no-no. They didn’t and the kittens have hit the fan now.

Oh god really. Ronin. Have you ever played any game on release? Anet are doing a way better job then most companies have done. Of course the bots and spammers are swarming this game, because its immensely popular. Blizzard hasnt fixed Gold spamming in 6 years in WoW and yet people expect Anet to fix it within 3 months of release.

God people have no brains

^ But blizzard never implemented a feature that punishes normal people from playing the game the way they want to.

They introduced DR to limit the effect of bots on the market, but the reality is the TP is useless with many items having little value and bots still prevalent. The DR has done nothing but hurt people who play with their legitimate time.

Thanks for the snapshot from 8 years ago. As of today I have nothing to do in Gw2. And hell, id even faction grind at this point.

You do make Blizz sound very devious and present a few things that if true would be.

Here is a conspiracy the other way around.

Anet says it needs to combat botting and speed runs by implementing DR. DR spills into every aspect of the game (WvW, Des, Farming,Dungeons) and this kills most of the ways players choose to make gold. All of this for the bots and “exploiters”.

Yet the same bots who have been reported hundreds of times are still there. Same names, same bots. Now are those bots still there for an excuse to keep the DR and force limited playtime people into the cash shop or? DR in WvW…do we have botting going on there?

I’m just curious as to who’s making the most money off these bots…the bot owners(whoever they may be) or Anet.

I agree with the DR comments. DR is like gun control…

Gun control only affects those that are legimate gun owners. Criminals do not play by the rules. Same with gold sellers. They could care less about DR for they have 10-15 accounts each farming different things. Thats alot of gold being made. I have noticed when DR was implimented the amount of gold sellers went up to offset the slowed farming.

All DR does is hurt the legimate players. I entered a personal story, the cave complex was like 50% grubs. I killed 1 of them and got the red lettered message to come back later. At first I thought my account was being hacked, or that I was glitched. So I went from scared to irritated. Thought I wouldn’t get credit completing the instance. Then i realized that i was not getting any XP as well as loot… 50% XP and loot from an instance…gone???? Not fair to legimate players. Not cool at all.

Now that being said… I really have not seen any bugs. Been playing for over 160-170 hours. Am only level 68. I found 1 bugged skill point in WvW. So maybe i am just lucky, but I haven’t seen any other bugs.

Evil.9061:

Thanks for the snapshot from 8 years ago. As of today I have nothing to do in Gw2. And hell, id even faction grind at this point.

You do make Blizz sound very devious and present a few things that if true would be.

Here is a conspiracy the other way around.

Anet says it needs to combat botting and speed runs by implementing DR. DR spills into every aspect of the game (WvW, Des, Farming,Dungeons) and this kills most of the ways players choose to make gold. All of this for the bots and “exploiters”.

Yet the same bots who have been reported hundreds of times are still there. Same names, same bots. Now are those bots still there for an excuse to keep the DR and force limited playtime people into the cash shop or? DR in WvW…do we have botting going on there?

I’m just curious as to who’s making the most money off these bots…the bot owners(whoever they may be) or Anet.

To be honest, I suspect the reasoning of why they are keeping the bots active at the moment is for that specialized team they formed to make the application they are designing. Rather than ban them out right, they are using the bots against the farmers themselves as test-beds for their program. I suspect once the program is done, we’re going to see a firestorm of banning.

Ironically, the gold farmers are helping them design the tools Anet will be using to find them.

Citations:

Our monitoring of ‘bot’ activity has already resulted in over 1600 account terminations world-wide in the last week alone, and we are actively tracking the most common ‘bots’ in use, so that we can continue to eliminate them from the game. As we continue to gather information on these ‘bots’, we will be increasing the rate of account termination to remove them. Please continue to report players that you suspect of ‘botting’ – your support is much appreciated.

We are actively improving our means of detecting ‘bot’ activity in the game automatically. This includes tools for our customer support team to help them verify ‘botting’ reports and efficiently issue account terminations. Recently we have also hired a team of data specialists who will be helping us create more effective tools for analyzing reports of ‘botting.’

I would call Anet devious indeed in this regard.

Sahriah.3792:

Oh god really. Ronin. Have you ever played any game on release? Anet are doing a way better job then most companies have done. Of course the bots and spammers are swarming this game, because its immensely popular. Blizzard hasnt fixed Gold spamming in 6 years in WoW and yet people expect Anet to fix it within 3 months of release.

God people have no brains

Who are these “god people” and why do they have no brains?

Can you be reasonable and not start your posts with accusing other people of being stupid. Even if you do insist on calling them “god people” for some reason.

I haven’t called anyone stupid and am just stating the flaws in the game as I see them. I’m allowed to do that. This isn’t the NO CRITICISM EVAR forum. It’s a forum. You seem to need a lesson in what a forum is. It’s a place for a discussion of opinion and ideas.

If you don’t agree with my opinion, that’s fine, but I won’t have you calling me brainless. I’d have thought the language I use and the way I try to articulately state my case would show that I do, in fact, have a brain.

Anyway, the very fact, as you say, that so much of this comes right after launch does not inspire with me confidence. It’s not a case of, sure tinker around until you’ve fixed it. It’s a case of don’t take my money, give me a F2P and I’ll pay you for the game when you’ve got something that resembles playable. There was the R&D, planning, development, alpha and beta phases. They were all pointless were they?

I think this was rushed to coincide with MoP. I shouldn’t have to suffer because of their insistence on trying to keep up with the Blizzards.

I’m not asking them to fix the bot issue and you only addressed one of my seven or so points. That of bots. I don’t care in the slightest if this game has bots, they never affected me and I’d never interact with them.

They might have an effect on the economy that drives prices up or even down for me. It’s negligible enough not to care.

Do not and I repeat do not have a war with the botters that has an immediate and negative impact on your money-paying customers who want to play the game in a legitimate fashion. It’s really bad company policy.

ANet have said officially that DR is combat botting. That’s the line. Well it’s not working at all. Botting is a serious problem. It’s endemic in all MMOs. RMT isn’t something new that’s just arrived. It’s been around for over a decade. Punishing everyone but the bots for this is a really bad idea. Prove to me that it’s not and I’ll change my mind.

Anyway bots is just one point of many and one that I’m not even that bothered about. The measures they’ve put in to try and stop it are risible and pathetic. That much is true.

There’s lots of other issues I have pointed out. Which I should be allowed to do.

Go ahead and have a culture of no feedback and make it so no one can say the game’s bad if they think it is.

It’s really unhealthy and will lead to a world of braindead/brainless people very quickly. Not god people, just ordinary people.

AndrewWaltfeld.4621:

Evil.9061:

Thanks for the snapshot from 8 years ago. As of today I have nothing to do in Gw2. And hell, id even faction grind at this point.

You do make Blizz sound very devious and present a few things that if true would be.

Here is a conspiracy the other way around.

Anet says it needs to combat botting and speed runs by implementing DR. DR spills into every aspect of the game (WvW, Des, Farming,Dungeons) and this kills most of the ways players choose to make gold. All of this for the bots and “exploiters”.

Yet the same bots who have been reported hundreds of times are still there. Same names, same bots. Now are those bots still there for an excuse to keep the DR and force limited playtime people into the cash shop or? DR in WvW…do we have botting going on there?

I’m just curious as to who’s making the most money off these bots…the bot owners(whoever they may be) or Anet.

To be honest, I suspect the reasoning of why they are keeping the bots active at the moment is for that specialized team they formed to make the application they are designing. Rather than ban them out right, they are using the bots against the farmers themselves as test-beds for their program. I suspect once the program is done, we’re going to see a firestorm of banning.

Ironically, the gold farmers are helping them design the tools Anet will be using to find them.

Citations:

Our monitoring of ‘bot’ activity has already resulted in over 1600 account terminations world-wide in the last week alone, and we are actively tracking the most common ‘bots’ in use, so that we can continue to eliminate them from the game. As we continue to gather information on these ‘bots’, we will be increasing the rate of account termination to remove them. Please continue to report players that you suspect of ‘botting’ – your support is much appreciated.

We are actively improving our means of detecting ‘bot’ activity in the game automatically. This includes tools for our customer support team to help them verify ‘botting’ reports and efficiently issue account terminations. Recently we have also hired a team of data specialists who will be helping us create more effective tools for analyzing reports of ‘botting.’

I would call Anet devious indeed in this regard.

So they are tracking them in WvW as well then? Seeing for some reason DR is there too.

AndrewWaltfeld.4621:

Evil.9061:

Thanks for the snapshot from 8 years ago. As of today I have nothing to do in Gw2. And hell, id even faction grind at this point.

You do make Blizz sound very devious and present a few things that if true would be.

Here is a conspiracy the other way around.

Anet says it needs to combat botting and speed runs by implementing DR. DR spills into every aspect of the game (WvW, Des, Farming,Dungeons) and this kills most of the ways players choose to make gold. All of this for the bots and “exploiters”.

Yet the same bots who have been reported hundreds of times are still there. Same names, same bots. Now are those bots still there for an excuse to keep the DR and force limited playtime people into the cash shop or? DR in WvW…do we have botting going on there?

I’m just curious as to who’s making the most money off these bots…the bot owners(whoever they may be) or Anet.

To be honest, I suspect the reasoning of why they are keeping the bots active at the moment is for that specialized team they formed to make the application they are designing. Rather than ban them out right, they are using the bots against the farmers themselves as test-beds for their program. I suspect once the program is done, we’re going to see a firestorm of banning.

Ironically, the gold farmers are helping them design the tools Anet will be using to find them.

Citations:

Our monitoring of ‘bot’ activity has already resulted in over 1600 account terminations world-wide in the last week alone, and we are actively tracking the most common ‘bots’ in use, so that we can continue to eliminate them from the game. As we continue to gather information on these ‘bots’, we will be increasing the rate of account termination to remove them. Please continue to report players that you suspect of ‘botting’ – your support is much appreciated.

We are actively improving our means of detecting ‘bot’ activity in the game automatically. This includes tools for our customer support team to help them verify ‘botting’ reports and efficiently issue account terminations. Recently we have also hired a team of data specialists who will be helping us create more effective tools for analyzing reports of ‘botting.’

I would call Anet devious indeed in this regard.

Maybe your right but the bots in ORR went from 5 to 10 to 15 to 20+ all of them in one event cremating the mobs faster then you can blink your eyes! If the DR was such a great system bots wouldn’t be multiplying. But the fact is the player base is dwindling and bots are multiplying. I have been playing MMO’s since June of 99 and in all my years I have never seen so many bots in one game. You can’t go anywhere worth while in this game with out running into bots. Something needs to be done NOW not latter!

P.S. if your right and there working on a mass ban I am going to go out on a limb and say 60k+ accounts get banned for botting across all servers!

AndrewWaltfeld.4621:

To be honest, I suspect the reasoning of why they are keeping the bots active at the moment is for that specialized team they formed to make the application they are designing. Rather than ban them out right, they are using the bots against the farmers themselves as test-beds for their program. I suspect once the program is done, we’re going to see a firestorm of banning.

Ironically, the gold farmers are helping them design the tools Anet will be using to find them.

Citations:

Our monitoring of ‘bot’ activity has already resulted in over 1600 account terminations world-wide in the last week alone, and we are actively tracking the most common ‘bots’ in use, so that we can continue to eliminate them from the game. As we continue to gather information on these ‘bots’, we will be increasing the rate of account termination to remove them. Please continue to report players that you suspect of ‘botting’ – your support is much appreciated.

We are actively improving our means of detecting ‘bot’ activity in the game automatically. This includes tools for our customer support team to help them verify ‘botting’ reports and efficiently issue account terminations. Recently we have also hired a team of data specialists who will be helping us create more effective tools for analyzing reports of ‘botting.’

I would call Anet devious indeed in this regard.

Because mass banning bots in waves has worked in the past amiright? 2 days later, after slightly altering the bot script, they are right back at it again. Game after game after game this has been tried and used. Has it solved the problem? No.

Active policing by actual people is the only truly effective tool against botting. But it costs more money.

Devious? I think not. More along the lines of failing to learn from the mistakes of other games.

Soulwatcher.2604:

AndrewWaltfeld.4621:

Evil.9061:

Thanks for the snapshot from 8 years ago. As of today I have nothing to do in Gw2. And hell, id even faction grind at this point.

You do make Blizz sound very devious and present a few things that if true would be.

Here is a conspiracy the other way around.

Anet says it needs to combat botting and speed runs by implementing DR. DR spills into every aspect of the game (WvW, Des, Farming,Dungeons) and this kills most of the ways players choose to make gold. All of this for the bots and “exploiters”.

Yet the same bots who have been reported hundreds of times are still there. Same names, same bots. Now are those bots still there for an excuse to keep the DR and force limited playtime people into the cash shop or? DR in WvW…do we have botting going on there?

I’m just curious as to who’s making the most money off these bots…the bot owners(whoever they may be) or Anet.

To be honest, I suspect the reasoning of why they are keeping the bots active at the moment is for that specialized team they formed to make the application they are designing. Rather than ban them out right, they are using the bots against the farmers themselves as test-beds for their program. I suspect once the program is done, we’re going to see a firestorm of banning.

Ironically, the gold farmers are helping them design the tools Anet will be using to find them.

Citations:

Our monitoring of ‘bot’ activity has already resulted in over 1600 account terminations world-wide in the last week alone, and we are actively tracking the most common ‘bots’ in use, so that we can continue to eliminate them from the game. As we continue to gather information on these ‘bots’, we will be increasing the rate of account termination to remove them. Please continue to report players that you suspect of ‘botting’ – your support is much appreciated.

We are actively improving our means of detecting ‘bot’ activity in the game automatically. This includes tools for our customer support team to help them verify ‘botting’ reports and efficiently issue account terminations. Recently we have also hired a team of data specialists who will be helping us create more effective tools for analyzing reports of ‘botting.’

I would call Anet devious indeed in this regard.

Maybe your right but the bots in ORR went from 5 to 10 to 15 to 20+ all of them in one event cremating the mobs faster then you can blink your eyes! If the DR was such a great system bots wouldn’t be multiplying. But the fact is the player base is dwindling and bots are multiplying. I have been playing MMO’s since June of 99 and in all my years I have never seen so many bots in one game. You can’t go anywhere worth while in this game with out running into bots. Something needs to be done NOW not latter!

P.S. if your right and there working on a mass ban I am going to go out on a limb and say 60k+ accounts get banned for botting across all servers!

True. It could very well be they are allowing simply tagging all the bots and keeping track of their movements then comparing them to regular players. This would allow them to develop tools to track and identify botters. As well all know, there is only so much you can do with bot programs, A frog has a bigger IQ than bots. So it could be they are using it to ensure that their program isn’t catching real players in the mix as well.

I wouldn’t be surprised at all to be honest. It’s slightly in genius plan. Either the botters lay low or contribute to the data stream to help identify their bots better. Either hurts the gold sellers profit margins.

Lysidian.4653:

Because mass banning bots in waves has worked in the past amiright? 2 days later, after slightly altering the bot script, they are right back at it again. Game after game after game this has been tried and used. Has it solved the problem? No.

Active policing by actual people is the only truly effective tool against botting. But it costs more money.

Devious? I think not. More along the lines of failing to learn from the mistakes of other games.

shrugs and your assuming they wouldn’t tackle the problem from multiple angles like having live people track them down? It seems to me that’s precisely what they are doing, but making sure the people who tracking down the bots have the tools necessary to do their jobs properly.

I wonder what would make some of the same folks hammer the issue in multiple forum topics and threads. Because they want the devs to fix the problem RIGHT NOW I SAID RIGHT NOW I PAID MY MONEY NOW NOW NOW? hmmmm .. not likely. Now if it was affecting my business, maybe losing some accounts because my bots got busted? It would tick me off so bad to see those other bots that haven’t been busted still farming gold. I would even post on more then one account to make my point(farmers would have quite a few) I think that DR is affecting the forum too! Keep saying the same thing over and over and it loses some of its potency, ya know?

Ronin.8095:

All of what you said does not stop making the DR the most ridiculous and shambolic idea to ever come out of ANet does it?

I agree DR is ineffective, and hurts the legimate players

People are already leaving as GW2 is far from being “that good”. It’s not very good at all.

This is pure speculation and conjecture. If you have the numbers please post it and your source, otherwise it is just plain assumption

Bugs. Not slight launch bugs. Severe gameplay affecting bugs that are left in the game for days and there’s one I’ve noticed for over a week. Not acceptable. Skillpoints, hearts, DEs, there’s more.

I have only ran into “1” bug in over 160 hours of play. Was a skillpoint in WvW. 2-4 hours later it was fixed. Maybe I am just lucky

A 1-80 XP curve that takes 1 week of moderate play and 2-3 days of hardcore play to achieve? What where they thinking? You’re setting yourself up for a fall there.

Like I said earlier I have over 160 hours logged. think it closer to 180, anyways… I am still Level 68. There is so much to do. The world is so big that I get lost in exploring. Just because some people rush to 80… and yes doing it in 3 days to a week is rushing, to say otherwise is an out right lie. When you rush to 80, you bypass the whole game. Not Anet fault you are not bored, that is the players fault.

WvWvW has left me with 2 hour queues.

Really? I have never waited for more than 20 minutes. Again i must be lucky

Dungeons are a novelty after this first few times and are extremely grindy, for a game that “is not about the grind.”

Will confess I have yet to try a dungeon. Am having fun doing all the other stuff. But I will get to it eventually.

DEs. Forget trying to tag a mob. Mindless zerging is now the standard format for group play is it? When did this memo go out? I want my copy so I can say ‘NO!’.

There is no tagging. You help to kill it, you get credit, plain and simple. I don’t understand your issue.

Punitive waypoint travel costs. So I have a friend who needs my help, several times in one day or someone calls out to me to raise them in a given area, and I need to port there. Charging me almost 2 silver within zone and up to 5 out of zone is fair is it? Not even slightly.

Now I do think that this a small issue. WP cost should be because of distance, NOT level. Does a taxi driver look at your paycheck and position in the company to figure out how much to charge you? Not he charges you for the distance traveled

I made a really bad mistake purchasing this game in its current state. I wish I hadn’t.

I am sorry you feel this way. I also hate it when I buy a game and dislike it. I think everyone does. Might i suggest moving on to a different game that perhaps you enjoy?

I do hope it gets better, there’s lots of potential. It’s a common theme for devs not to listen to their playerbase at all.

So far I think the DEVs in this game have listened alot and fixed alot of glitches/bugs that some people reported. What I am glad they don’t do is compromise the integrity and soul of the game, by caving into peoples demands to make the game more like (fill in the blank) other MMO’s.

If they had they’d have known the DR was a real no-no. They didn’t and the kittens have hit the fan now

I think your overreacting quite a bit with the doom and gloom.

You are entitled to your opinion, and I am entitled to mine. You asked for feedback on your points, so I gave you some. I agreed with you on 2 of your points: WP cost and DR.

I started reading until “paladins abilities did more damage against undead” that was removed in very early closed beta because it was kitten You are talking out of your kitten

Any new MMO needs end game content. Especially since the WoW era. You see there is this mindset that is hard to break: “I must get to max lvl, when there I can do the good stuff” This mindset is hard to break. Telling someone “hey you hit max level, good for you! Now go try the lvl 1-10 zones for another race it’s awesome!” is NOT the way to go. It might be if those zones consistantly rewarded you with lvl appropriate drops but they do not.

I’ve thought hard about this in the last 6 hours (small amount of time, but feels like more than Anet have spent)

New tickboxes in the options menu, set to off/no by default.
1) Scale my equipment drops to match my level.
2) Scale my fine crafting materials to match my level.

What this does: spreads people about. You no longer have 20 (I’m being generous, I know) people in Orr killing the same mob in hopes for an Uber Fang, they czn get this anywhere.

You know I’m done with this topic. ANet pay people to make their game profitable. Why should I, as someone who already gave them the up-front fee to play this game fix it for them. Anet and ALL you “it’s fine”ers will see in 30 days time.

This game is dying FAST. Not because its a bad game, but because of kitten company decisions. Fun=Play. Time=Reward. Reward=Fun.

Kailthir.6384:

Ronin.8095:

All of what you said does not stop making the DR the most ridiculous and shambolic idea to ever come out of ANet does it?

I agree DR is ineffective, and hurts the legimate players

People are already leaving as GW2 is far from being “that good”. It’s not very good at all.

This is pure speculation and conjecture. If you have the numbers please post it and your source, otherwise it is just plain assumption

Bugs. Not slight launch bugs. Severe gameplay affecting bugs that are left in the game for days and there’s one I’ve noticed for over a week. Not acceptable. Skillpoints, hearts, DEs, there’s more.

I have only ran into “1” bug in over 160 hours of play. Was a skillpoint in WvW. 2-4 hours later it was fixed. Maybe I am just lucky

A 1-80 XP curve that takes 1 week of moderate play and 2-3 days of hardcore play to achieve? What where they thinking? You’re setting yourself up for a fall there.

Like I said earlier I have over 160 hours logged. think it closer to 180, anyways… I am still Level 68. There is so much to do. The world is so big that I get lost in exploring. Just because some people rush to 80… and yes doing it in 3 days to a week is rushing, to say otherwise is an out right lie. When you rush to 80, you bypass the whole game. Not Anet fault you are not bored, that is the players fault.

WvWvW has left me with 2 hour queues.

Really? I have never waited for more than 20 minutes. Again i must be lucky

Dungeons are a novelty after this first few times and are extremely grindy, for a game that “is not about the grind.”

Will confess I have yet to try a dungeon. Am having fun doing all the other stuff. But I will get to it eventually.

DEs. Forget trying to tag a mob. Mindless zerging is now the standard format for group play is it? When did this memo go out? I want my copy so I can say ‘NO!’.

There is no tagging. You help to kill it, you get credit, plain and simple. I don’t understand your issue.

Punitive waypoint travel costs. So I have a friend who needs my help, several times in one day or someone calls out to me to raise them in a given area, and I need to port there. Charging me almost 2 silver within zone and up to 5 out of zone is fair is it? Not even slightly.

Now I do think that this a small issue. WP cost should be because of distance, NOT level. Does a taxi driver look at your paycheck and position in the company to figure out how much to charge you? Not he charges you for the distance traveled

I made a really bad mistake purchasing this game in its current state. I wish I hadn’t.

I am sorry you feel this way. I also hate it when I buy a game and dislike it. I think everyone does. Might i suggest moving on to a different game that perhaps you enjoy?

I do hope it gets better, there’s lots of potential. It’s a common theme for devs not to listen to their playerbase at all.

So far I think the DEVs in this game have listened alot and fixed alot of glitches/bugs that some people reported. What I am glad they don’t do is compromise the integrity and soul of the game, by caving into peoples demands to make the game more like (fill in the blank) other MMO’s.

If they had they’d have known the DR was a real no-no. They didn’t and the kittens have hit the fan now

I think your overreacting quite a bit with the doom and gloom.

You are entitled to your opinion, and I am entitled to mine. You asked for feedback on your points, so I gave you some. I agreed with you on 2 of your points: WP cost and DR.

I didn’t ask for feedback, but thanks for giving it.
Yes you’re entitled to your opinions. Quite right.

Always with the “game is dying” doom and gloom, because they woun’t add what you want.

Seriously… really? So many temper tantrums on the forums now a days. So the game has a few small issues, what game dosen’t. They have actually fixed quit a bit of stuff. Things you would never know in a beta test.

And this dam mentality of “give it to me now”… I am so sick and tired of the entitlist attitude. Enjoy the game for what it is not for what you demand it to be.

(when I say you… I am refering to gammers in general, especially the QQer and rage monsters on the forums)

Kailthir.6384:

Always with the “game is dying” doom and gloom, because they woun’t add what you want.

Seriously… really? So many temper tantrums on the forums now a days. So the game has a few small issues, what game dosen’t. They have actually fixed quit a bit of stuff. Things you would never know in a beta test.

And this dam mentality of “give it to me now”… I am so sick and tired of the entitlist attitude. Enjoy the game for what it is not for what you demand it to be.

(when I say you… I am refering to gammers in general, especially the QQer and rage monsters on the forums)

I haven’t seen a single “MAKE IT LIKE WOW NOW OR I AM GOING TO RAGE QUIT!” I am only seeing complaints about DR and Bots, bot of which are a simple fix. But its falling on deaf ears the least thing Anet could do is make a community post saying “Look this is how were going to fix the problem”.

But they are ignoring us hoping that people are going to go away. And when they have had enough that’s exactly what they are going to do and they are going to take their wallets with them. And if enough of them leave future development of this game is going to go to the crapper. Maybe then the fanboys will be happy!

I agree with OP about how everyone compares every MMO to WoW…but the thing is WoW isn’t quotable because it’s a good GAME. As OP said, WoW is lauded because it’s good MARKETING. It didn’t revolutionize online GAMING aspect of MMOs it just revolutionized the INDUSTRY (industry = business).

Soulwatcher.2604:

Kailthir.6384:

Always with the “game is dying” doom and gloom, because they woun’t add what you want.

Seriously… really? So many temper tantrums on the forums now a days. So the game has a few small issues, what game dosen’t. They have actually fixed quit a bit of stuff. Things you would never know in a beta test.

And this dam mentality of “give it to me now”… I am so sick and tired of the entitlist attitude. Enjoy the game for what it is not for what you demand it to be.

(when I say you… I am refering to gammers in general, especially the QQer and rage monsters on the forums)

I haven’t seen a single “MAKE IT LIKE WOW NOW OR I AM GOING TO RAGE QUIT!” I am only seeing complaints about DR and Bots, bot of which are a simple fix. But its falling on deaf ears the least thing Anet could do is make a community post saying “Look this is how were going to fix the problem”.

But they are ignoring us hoping that people are going to go away. And when they have had enough that’s exactly what they are going to do and they are going to take their wallets with them. And if enough of them leave future development of this game is going to go to the crapper. Maybe then the fanboys will be happy!

They have made a few posts on the bot issue. They just put together a group to combat the bots.

Bots are not a simple fix. You ban 1 and 2-3 pop back up. The problem is they are stealing peoples accounts or buying them at cheap rates from less than reputable countries.

Bots and gold sellers have always been a problem. Unless gammers stop buying their gold they will never be gone.

And as far as rage quitting… yes there has been a few in these forums. Either they are outright quitting or threatening to quit cause it’s not like WoW or TOR or Rift or some other such MMO. But I was more pointing out the usless mentality of these people in many forums. Not just here. Seems game forums are ripe with them.

The OP is a great post.

I’m not sure how wow players don’t realize they’re being treated as cows to milk, using all the shadiest marketing strategies to pretty much force them to continue paying, paying, and paying again.
The game’s new content beyond vanilla is just a clone of the previous, new gear treadmills and that’s about it.
And it is even outclassed in its own genre by Rift, the only reason one would play wow would be if he was too tied to his invested time and money and/or lured by blizz’s market strategies.
From an adult point of view, it’s a cartoony, simple game for kids that’s been turned into a mental chain to keep people playing.

Glad to hear some people like the OP made it out of it.

“Bots are not a simple fix” That statement is true. Although it is easier than you’re saying it is. Quite a lot easier, in fact.

You employ real people to monitor the situation. Enough flags come in, in a given period, you investigate, talk to the character, move them, things like that. Turing test them basically. If the bot controller is lucky enough to be there at the time, then they get away with it. 90% of the time they won’t be there as the whole point of a bot is that it’s autonomous (to a certain extent.)

If it’s evident they’re abusing the system at that point. Bang. Gone. Other games do do this and it’s effective.

This costs money. Not a lot of money but more money. You budget for this before you even devise the game and have a real solution to the problem.

DR was rolled out after release and no one knows what it does. That really sounds shady to me and is really like someone applying a band-aid to their jugular vein being severed.

I’ll repeat myself, the DR does nothing to alleviate the bot problem, it only seeks to encourage the rampant creation of more bots to farm the same amount (as no one’s taking them out of the game) and those bots are now crowding out DEs which is really annoying me.

A DE, as another poster said, is a bot’s paradise. It has no event starter. It just starts by itself. If you’re in the area and perform some actions you’ll get some bonus from it. Logistically, it’s a botter’s dream and incredibly poorly thought out by the dev team. An event that needs no series of button clicking or mini-Turning test to intiatie. That’s quite mad in this day of sophisticated automation and macros. It’s a really really badly thought out system, when you look at it from a botter’s perspective.

Anyway, the way they’re going about fixing the problem of bots is really backward. It’s only exacerbating the problem. Can’t you see this? It’ll end up costing them vastly more than an active task force will in the long run.

Why? It’s totally unecessary they’ve way they’ve approached botting in this game and makes no sense whatsoever, any way I try to approach it.

It’s like they’ve never made a game before in this regard. Let alone tried to prepare correctly for the scourge that is bots.

DR? That’s really your solution is it? Puh-lease.

Red Falcon.8257:

The OP is a great post.

I’m not sure how wow players don’t realize they’re being treated as cows to milk, using all the shadiest marketing strategies to pretty much force them to continue paying, paying, and paying again.
The game’s new content beyond vanilla is just a clone of the previous, new gear treadmills and that’s about it.
And it is even outclassed in its own genre by Rift, the only reason one would play wow would be if he was too tied to his invested time and money and/or lured by blizz’s market strategies.
From an adult point of view, it’s a cartoony, simple game for kids that’s been turned into a mental chain to keep people playing.

Glad to hear some people like the OP made it out of it.

You’re exactly being treated like a cow with GW2. It’s no different at all. How is it different? Except you’re just a cow that’s being treated with much shoddier hay over here, from what I can see.

They’ll fill up the store with pretty crap eventually and employ all the same underhand strategies. The want for them to make money out of you is only ever going to make you a teat for them to pull on.

Kailthir.6384:

Soulwatcher.2604:

Kailthir.6384:

Always with the “game is dying” doom and gloom, because they woun’t add what you want.

Seriously… really? So many temper tantrums on the forums now a days. So the game has a few small issues, what game dosen’t. They have actually fixed quit a bit of stuff. Things you would never know in a beta test.

And this dam mentality of “give it to me now”… I am so sick and tired of the entitlist attitude. Enjoy the game for what it is not for what you demand it to be.

(when I say you… I am refering to gammers in general, especially the QQer and rage monsters on the forums)

I haven’t seen a single “MAKE IT LIKE WOW NOW OR I AM GOING TO RAGE QUIT!” I am only seeing complaints about DR and Bots, bot of which are a simple fix. But its falling on deaf ears the least thing Anet could do is make a community post saying “Look this is how were going to fix the problem”.

But they are ignoring us hoping that people are going to go away. And when they have had enough that’s exactly what they are going to do and they are going to take their wallets with them. And if enough of them leave future development of this game is going to go to the crapper. Maybe then the fanboys will be happy!

They have made a few posts on the bot issue. They just put together a group to combat the bots.

Bots are not a simple fix. You ban 1 and 2-3 pop back up. The problem is they are stealing peoples accounts or buying them at cheap rates from less than reputable countries.

Bots and gold sellers have always been a problem. Unless gammers stop buying their gold they will never be gone.

And as far as rage quitting… yes there has been a few in these forums. Either they are outright quitting or threatening to quit cause it’s not like WoW or TOR or Rift or some other such MMO. But I was more pointing out the usless mentality of these people in many forums. Not just here. Seems game forums are ripe with them.

Then they need to hire as many people as it takes to combat the bots and gold sellers;. A happy player base means lots of gem sales and happy share holders and then the price of your stock goes up. Its a win win for Anet if they put together the resources!

Ronin i am dead set against DR. It’s poorly implimented for one. Two i don’t believe it does anything to the gold spammers at all. They have 10-20 bots all over per person and just collect all the coins each one makes. Pretty efficient.

So they lose 2-5 in a week. They get plenty more to replace them. I’ve said it before DR is hurting the game not helping it.

Soulwatcher the only thing I am worried about is the cost to keep the people combating bots. Since there is no sub, I wonder if there is enough money over the long term to keep it up. Either they will eventually shut it down (cost too much money) or they will have to start charging a sub. I imagine if sales don’t continue to happen or MT in the store dosen’t make enough money… they will either have to shut down or charge.

It’s worriesone

Kailthir.6384:

Ronin i am dead set against DR. It’s poorly implimented for one. Two i don’t believe it does anything to the gold spammers at all. They have 10-20 bots all over per person and just collect all the coins each one makes. Pretty efficient.

So they lose 2-5 in a week. They get plenty more to replace them. I’ve said it before DR is hurting the game not helping it.

Soulwatcher the only thing I am worried about is the cost to keep the people combating bots. Since there is no sub, I wonder if there is enough money over the long term to keep it up. Either they will eventually shut it down (cost too much money) or they will have to start charging a sub. I imagine if sales don’t continue to happen or MT in the store dosen’t make enough money… they will either have to shut down or charge.

It’s worriesone

I personally have spent $90 on gems so far and I have no problem buying more. But if they want me to keep buying more gems. Then they better do something quick with the bots. There are certain events in orr that I can not even do (well its a waste of time) because there are so many bot rangers that the mobs are dead a second after they pop.

That is effecting my game play, I reported them 4 days ago. Guess what there still there and they multiplied. Also I want to help my friend buy exotic gear but I cant because of DR. I would have to play a insane amount of hours to be of any help.

Bottom line if people are not having fun there not going play or buy gems and your right they will be forced to ask for subs or shut the game down!

I don’t see how a small task force of say max. 5 people to monitor all servers is ever going to make a dent in…

Hold on. 2,000,000 x ~$60 = One-Hundred and Twenty Million Dollars!

Yes, I can’t imagine where they’ll get the cash from. The mind boggles.

Sorry, poor excuse.

Glad we can agree on DR although I did notice you’d been saying this the whole time anyway.

I appreciate your analogy to the Grecian Lernaean Hydra, with the 5 bots popping up for every bot you cut off. Except the Hydra had infinite head regeneration properties. It’s weakness was that it could be overcome when it had only one head and you cauterized the others, so it’s a really odd analogy.

I’ll flip your own analogy back on you. Accounts are a finite resource and RMT companies are never going to pay $60 for them. They’ll eventually only have one head (account) left. If you’re pro-active in dealing with the problem and do it in real time.

IF you employ someone to start cutting the heads off now. You’ll make some (excuse the pun) headway.

Wait too long and it’s going to be come an inextricable problem.

Please don’t talk about finances with ANet, when I know over 2 million people have paid for a box in the last several months or year (including pre-orders.) That is outlandish talk there.

$120,000,000 before in-game store sales and paying people (and it wouldn’t be a lot) say circa $20,000 a year, maybe $25k.

If this is a problem then there’s some priorities seriously misaligned here.

Soulwatcher:
I have seen bots ruin communities in other games. Don’t want that to happen here. I mentioned it in another thread that I haven’t personaly seen a bot, least that I can’t recall. Was mentioned that they are in the 70-80 zones. I got a level 70 ranger but haven’t been to those zones yet.

Like I said it is becomming worriesome. I was in a personal story instance… full of grubs. Had to fight my way thru. Got nothing…

Wait, thats a lie. I did get something for them… a red text message that told me to come back at a later time to do the content… I was like WTF? At first I thought I got glitched. Then I realized it only happened when I killed the grubs… The instance was 50% grubs in some cave… Half my XP and loot down the drain. It sux.

I agree with the OP, as a Vanilla WoW player myself. This game is great and has been well worth the money.

Sure it has bugs, and other content issues that need to be resolved, but give it time and it will happen.

Good post OP.

The only MMO I’ve played that was smoother than GW2 at launch was Rift. I got bored of Rift but the point is it was really polished. Honestly, GW2 is already very successful, it’s gonna take awhile to iron out the bugs and I can wait. It’s not like I’m paying a sub or something.

Soulwatcher.2604:

…I haven’t seen a single “MAKE IT LIKE WOW NOW OR I AM GOING TO RAGE QUIT!”…

that’s what they’re saying when they say, “i’m bored,” or, “endgame sucks,” or, “there’s nothing to do.”
there’s a lot of those and they are asking for something to grind because that’s what they learned to do from other games. if you tell them that they can wvw, get completion, achievement hunt, farm crafting mats, run dynamic events, spvp, keg brawl, etc. they will tell you, “i don’t wanna.”
ok…
i think those are the same people that are complaining about the lack of “proggression” or “carrot-on-a-stick,” as i’ve thought of it since vanilla wow. so yeah. that’s the conditioning people have been under since eq.

ANet doesn’t charge a sub. They need to keep costs low. That means they would rather do something lame like DR and not deal with bots than to actually hire people to deal with bots. Employees cost more money than a few code changes. Read their bit on bots, they’re looking at ways to automate dealing with them – because they don’t want to pay CSRs to deal with player reports.

Bots suck, and ANet has a plan. That’s all well and good.

But oh lawdy, this DR thing needs a good tweaking. I’m a pretty casual player, although I haven’t always been. But, for me to log in… play for 20-30 minutes (if I’m lucky) and get hit with DR is ludicrous.

I’ve spent some real $$s on gems, but that ain’t happening again until this DR thing removed. I’m not going to support the decision to hit someone with an anti-farm code, purportedly designed to stop bots, who plays for only a half an hour to an hour a day. That’s just insanity. Especially since the bot population is on the rise. Mind = Blown.

I really don’t understand why people find it necessary to spill venom all over the forums.

Yes we know there is a very vocal group shouting:

I hate DR! , My game is ruined, Anet just want my money!

There are hundreds of threads about it and people who scream and moan and threaten to leave the game and claiming the game is dead… etc ad nauseam.

If someone has the audacity to disagree they are shouted down, called a white knight or a fanboy.

The reality is that this is a very well designed and successful game.
It breaks the mold of a stagnant MMO genre very nicely and Anet is very responsive to their player base, they keep the players updated and they are proactive in fixing real issues and protecting their players.
Also to the person who suggested that because this game is B2P that Arena Net needs to keep their costs down- are you serious? Have you got any idea how profitable this game is?

Morrigan.2809:

I really don’t understand why people find it necessary to spill venom all over the forums.

Mostly seeking attention. One or two posts (in Suggestions forum) is sufficient to tell Arenanet “I don’t like this and here’s what I think you should do.” One or two threads is sufficient to create a dialog and brainstorm with other players.

The handful of players who flood the General forum with complaints don’t want to do either. They’re acting like children throwing a tantrum – for several it has gone beyond trying to sound reasonable and just repeating the same stuff over and over because they like the attention it brings from other people repeating the same answers over and over. No one is getting anywhere with the subject because there is no dialog, just shouting.

Break the cycle. If no one is feeding into their tantrum they will get tired and go away. Like a small child, constantly giving in just to make them shut up will only encourage the behavior.

There is no point to drama without an audience.

Morrigan.2809:

I really don’t understand why people find it necessary to spill venom all over the forums.

Yes we know there is a very vocal group shouting:

I hate DR! , My game is ruined, Anet just want my money!

There are hundreds of threads about it and people who scream and moan and threaten to leave the game and claiming the game is dead… etc ad nauseam.

If someone has the audacity to disagree they are shouted down, called a white knight or a fanboy.

The reality is that this is a very well designed and successful game.
It breaks the mold of a stagnant MMO genre very nicely and Anet is very responsive to their player base, they keep the players updated and they are proactive in fixing real issues and protecting their players.
Also to the person who suggested that because this game is B2P that Arena Net needs to keep their costs down- are you serious? Have you got any idea how profitable this game is?

And everytime we come to the forums with a viable complaint we are shut down with taunts of ‘go back to playing WoW’ and claims that GW2 is the most perfect, awesome game out there. We are given the, ’ I THINK THE GAME IS FINE SO YOU SHOULD TOO’ arguement. And if not that, we are asked to move on – which is always a favourite of players whose games slowly died.

Its a double edged sword here, you believe the game is well designed and I cant disagree? I am a paying customer and I am only allowed to post messages of love on the main boards because you believe negativity is non-existant?

And for an issue this large, why should it be negelcted to the suggestions forums where ANET rarely frequent. After all, the only thing they have changed after player complaints are dungeon rewards. Any other suggestion has not been considered at all.

You believe the forums should only praise ANET because YOU believe the game is perfect. I respect your oppinion, as you are a paying customer and you should respect mine when I bring up a legitamate complaint that many others are agreeing on. I dont go into all the ‘praise-anet-as-much-as-possible-just-because’ and flame the individuals who agree with the thread JUST BECAUSE I DISAGREE. It is thier oppinion and that is fine.

And my question to you: Why can I not be negative on the forums if I believe a feature is not fixing anything? Why can I not post about how bots ARE NOT BEING AFFECTED BY DR? Why can I not complain about how I play and spend my LEGIT time only to be punished the longer I play? Why can I not complain about how the market is already out of hand, even though Anet hired an economist? WHY CAN I NOT COMPLAIN ABOUT HOW THE DR-SYSTEM WAS IMPLENTED 2 WEEKS OUT OF NOWHERE WITHOUT ANY WARNING?

Have you guys considered that Anet is actually reading it and fixing it as we speak? They don’t like to expose details about exploits and stuff so I wouldn’t be to hasty as to these hateful comment. Just wait a week or two. Stuff will get fixed.

To Ronin, Soulwatcher and Kimhyuna.

You have complained about it. I do not know if you put anything in the suggestion forum or contacted CS directly to complain about but we all know now that you don’t like DR.

So, do you actually think that complaining about it more on the general forum will improve this? All you will get here is the same group of people agreeing with you and the other group of people disagreeing with you.

You are entitled to complain about it, but there is no positive outcome that I can think of from reiterating your complaint. Anet will not listen more, other players on the forum have already formed their opinion about the issue.

So let me ask you the question: what do you think to gain from this continued complaint campaign on the forum? And once you’ve answered that, if you can, do you really believe it will get you anywhere?

“Have you guys considered that Anet is actually reading it and fixing it as we speak? They don’t like to expose details about exploits and stuff so I wouldn’t be to hasty as to these hateful comment. Just wait a week or two. Stuff will get fixed.”

I know that fixing bugs, tracking down bot software, and developing new systems to improve the game take time to create, test, and install. I also know that no system is perfect and after installation there will still be a period of adjustment where they collect data, analyze it, and decide what to adjust.

When I see someone post over and over “I reported those bots three days ago and they’re still there! What the kitten!?!” I know that this person does not have realistic expectations. He seems immature and unable to comprehend basic concepts like giving people the time they need to do good work. As such, I dismiss his rants as irrelevant and I suspect others in more important positions than me do as well. Throwing a tantrum about bugs/class balance/whatever is not going to make things happen any faster.

Experience in life has taught me that when I do things in a rush I miss important details, do sloppy work, and generally cause more problems for myself and others than I solve. I try to find the sweet spot where my work is both efficient and effective, with minimal errors and if that means it takes a little longer to do something, it’s still a lot faster than doing it quickly, then doing it again slowly to fix the things I broke doing it quickly.

“Anti-fanboy” addendum: Sometimes in the rush to meet demands from outside sources, mistakes ARE made, and take a lot longer to clean up than doing it right the first time. It appears that Arenanet may have acted too hastily in their efforts to delay the activities of botters and create a better game environment for everyone.

Having implemented hastily conceived solutions that, yes, broke some things they were supposed to fix, it is absolutely necessary to take more time to do it right and to make sure they don’t break things further. So if the original fix took two weeks, expect the correction to take at least another month.

^ A genuine answer from ANET.
An answer about what they plan to do going forward because, clearly, the reason it was implemented was to combat the damage of botting. A reality check is needed as botting is an incredibly common sight.

And once we get an answer as to why they introduced this feature two weeks into launch and never mentioned it leading up to release, we can perhaps get a better insight into why ANET proposed this flawed system in the first place.

I am a paying customer, I have a right to post on the forums too. If these topics are not to your interest, you have the ability to ignore them. I do not go around on the ‘praise anet’ and flame individuals who think the game is perfect for them.

Also, since when has the suggestion forums been taken seriously? The only change anet has done on behalf of its players, that I know off, is to the dungeon rewards system and that was as a result of a multitude of threads in the DUNGEON forum.

Kimhyuna.1035:

Morrigan.2809:

I really don’t understand why people find it necessary to spill venom all over the forums.

Yes we know there is a very vocal group shouting:

I hate DR! , My game is ruined, Anet just want my money!

There are hundreds of threads about it and people who scream and moan and threaten to leave the game and claiming the game is dead… etc ad nauseam.

If someone has the audacity to disagree they are shouted down, called a white knight or a fanboy.

The reality is that this is a very well designed and successful game.
It breaks the mold of a stagnant MMO genre very nicely and Anet is very responsive to their player base, they keep the players updated and they are proactive in fixing real issues and protecting their players.
Also to the person who suggested that because this game is B2P that Arena Net needs to keep their costs down- are you serious? Have you got any idea how profitable this game is?

And everytime we come to the forums with a viable complaint we are shut down with taunts of ‘go back to playing WoW’ and claims that GW2 is the most perfect, awesome game out there. We are given the, ’ I THINK THE GAME IS FINE SO YOU SHOULD TOO’ arguement. And if not that, we are asked to move on – which is always a favourite of players whose games slowly died.

I have never told someone to go back to Wow, I also never said GW2 was perfect- I said it was a well designed game. Since there are multiple threads on this issue you are clearly not being shut down. You have a complaint sure- lot of people don’t you are being melodramatic

Its a double edged sword here, you believe the game is well designed and I cant disagree? I am a paying customer and I am only allowed to post messages of love on the main boards because you believe negativity is non-existant?

Again, where did I say this at all?
I have as much right as you to an opinion.
Why are you telling me you are a paying customer? Do you think I didn’t pay for the game? I pre- purchased it in full and have been playing since the beta’s

And for an issue this large, why should it be negelcted to the suggestions forums where ANET rarely frequent. After all, the only thing they have changed after player complaints are dungeon rewards. Any other suggestion has not been considered at all.

It is not a large issue, you feel it is a large issue and the fact that there are a gazillion threads about it makes it seems large. I happen to not agree with you since it has never affected me in the slightest.

You believe the forums should only praise ANET because YOU believe the game is perfect. I respect your oppinion, as you are a paying customer and you should respect mine when I bring up a legitamate complaint that many others are agreeing on. I dont go into all the ‘praise-anet-as-much-as-possible-just-because’ and flame the individuals who agree with the thread JUST BECAUSE I DISAGREE. It is thier oppinion and that is fine.

There you go again telling me what I believe.
I have never flamed anyone in my life

_And my question to you: Why can I not be negative on the forums if I believe a feature is not fixing anything? Why can I not post about how bots ARE NOT BEING AFFECTED BY DR? Why can I not complain about how I play and spend my LEGIT time only to be punished the longer I play? Why can I not complain about how the market is already out of hand, even though Anet hired an economist? WHY CAN I NOT COMPLAIN ABOUT HOW THE DR-SYSTEM WAS IMPLENTED 2 WEEKS OUT OF NOWHERE WITHOUT ANY WARNING?-

I never said you can’t state your opinoin, I questioned the need for multiple similar threads that achieve nothing but spread negativity.

Also please note that not once in all my posts do I feel the need to write sentences in caps. That kind of emphasizes the point i was trying to make about people screaming

Gehenna.3625:

To Ronin, Soulwatcher and Kimhyuna.

You have complained about it. I do not know if you put anything in the suggestion forum or contacted CS directly to complain about but we all know now that you don’t like DR.

So, do you actually think that complaining about it more on the general forum will improve this? All you will get here is the same group of people agreeing with you and the other group of people disagreeing with you.

You are entitled to complain about it, but there is no positive outcome that I can think of from reiterating your complaint. Anet will not listen more, other players on the forum have already formed their opinion about the issue.

So let me ask you the question: what do you think to gain from this continued complaint campaign on the forum? And once you’ve answered that, if you can, do you really believe it will get you anywhere?

You didn’t address me, but I’ll answer your question. They want thier complaint heard.

It’s really very simple.

They have a complaint about the way something in game is handled, and are voicing thier complaint. (A valid one, in my opinion.) And they are very passionate about this issue they have. Thus they’re being vocal.

let me ask you a question. What do you hope to gain by calling them out for being vocal? After you’ve answered that, do you think it will get you anywhere?

Kimhyuna.1035:

I am a paying customer, I have a right to post on the forums too. If these topics are not to your interest, you have the ability to ignore them. I do not go around on the ‘praise anet’ and flame individuals who think the game is perfect for them.

Yes, you have the right to complain. I do not dispute that. But what I actually asked is what you think it you will achieve by repeating your same complaint over and over again. Do you really think it will make any positive difference?

Ravnodaus.5130:

let me ask you a question. What do you hope to gain by calling them out for being vocal? After you’ve answered that, do you think it will get you anywhere?

My reasoning is simple.

If indeed you believe there is a point in bringing this up again and again, then what is that point? ….because if there isn’t…well then there’s no point, so get over it and move on.

Just saying.

Gehenna.3625:

Kimhyuna.1035:

I am a paying customer, I have a right to post on the forums too. If these topics are not to your interest, you have the ability to ignore them. I do not go around on the ‘praise anet’ and flame individuals who think the game is perfect for them.

Yes, you have the right to complain. I do not dispute that. But what I actually asked is what you think it you will achieve by repeating your same complaint over and over again. Do you really think it will make any positive difference?

I hope to actually gain an audience to what I percieve as problems. If you look at this thread: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/support/account/Gold-missing-from-Inventory-merged/page/6
you can see the disdain I have when it comes to an issue being addressed at all. In that thread, players are being addressed in a light where they dont do the most basic of things.

I might also like to repeat my complaint over and over again, but the dual side this is that people are also praising the game for the same things over and over again too. I am not going out of my way and telling them to stick to one thread. Also note that I did not make any of these threads, and am in here just to argue with individuals who believe we are ‘seeing things’ in lieu of a better description of this situation.

In the long run, I hope we do see change because, as it stands, no reply will result in people constanly creating a topic about that one subject. I will also not give up the complaint, as I dont want to seem like I have accepted the situation for what it is.

This has gone far beyond simply wanting to be heard. Arenanet has already stated they will not release details about what they are doing. The numerous messages from moderators closing their rant threads indicates that they have been heard. There is nothing to be gained from continuing to create these threads other than to cause trouble for its own sake.

tolunart.2095:

Mature individuals, upon stating their case, step back and give people time to consider things. Children throwing tantrums yell until their parents give in just to make them shut up.

My son used to do that before he finally realized my patience was far greater than his.

Problem is though, you seem to expect people to be mature. I don’t mean to insult here…but what world do you live in where everyone is mature? O_o

Yknow this forum display bug is getting kind of annoying…

The real problem here is that the community of ANet supporters here are so touchy and precious, that you cannot have a debate about the serious game failings (as we perceive them.) reasonably, as I’ve found out.

It’s the ultimate exercise in futility.

Why do people post on forums? Do we really have to answer that question for you?

Ok, I will.

If you’re in a community and you think something is wrong with that community or in our case the product that community is connected by, you’d like to know other people are having the same frustrations and concerns.

With a community or a group of other people that are reasonable and like-minded you have a much louder voice and you can start to effect big change on an official forum.

It takes people. Like-minded people.

Talking one one one, or phoning, email, tweeting ANet is another massive exercise in futility.

Making it a hot debated topic that’s being discussed by everyone on a forum is a way to get the problems noticed and dealth with in a much more efficient way.

Power in numbers.

Don’t think ANet won’t listen if enough people start talking about certain issues with the game, they will and for anyone to say otherwise is folly.

I want them to listen as I genuinely want to play the game. I really like it, but the game is trying to do everything in its power to push me away.

That grates. It really does. If I could pay a sub and ensure it would go someway to alleviate the problems, I would.

These problems aren’t minor “launch bugs” that can be waved away with a hand, they’re serious flaws in the game.

Take the DE as being the perfect environment for a bot for example. When you think what a DE is and how it works, it’s almost that it was considered with bots in mind. It 100% caters to their needs. It does not require any human intervention to start, it just starts. If you’re in the DE cachement area and perform some action in a given timeframe, it’s a Karma river. A karma torrent and eventually a karma flood if you have enough bots. Which they do. No RMT company only ever had one bot. You need as many as possible to maximize profit.

That’s just another massive oversight and design flaw which means that bots infest DEs right now and as the other ones (like Arah and Grenth) are bugged on an off constantly. Yeah it really starts to annoy people. It’s really no surprise.

Add to this the fact that the DR system is a direct cause of pushing the bots into the DEs it’s blood-boiling.

DR and DEs are not meant for us, it seems. As they are in their current state, the bots are very welcome to them. It’s just horrible as a player.

People like tolunart will always be there to dismiss anything you say as rant. Even if it is well constructed thought out, calm, collected and is making a valid point.

Infact, defense of such serious flaws to such a degree ends up having a negative impact on the game. It’s damaging to not be able to admit there’s some serious questions that need to be asked about lots of areas of the game.

Certain things are so poorly designed and thought out, I find it believe is comes from a development studio with pedigree, who have worked on the title for x amount of years.

The game really doesn’t reflect that.

When you want, and ANet want to accept these problems and see how damaging they are for the game, then maybe some headway can be made and things wouldn’t look so bleak right now.

If you take a spare 10 mins reading around the forum (and that’s just a tiny fraction of the game’s populace) you’d see the posts that are concerned about the game’s future far out-weight those to the contrary.

Why are we trying to have something done about it?

We like the game. We invested time and money in it and as paying customers we deserve some quality control.

If you can’t get your head around any of these very salient points are just here to attack everything we say, then we’re not going to get very far are we.

Simply brushing-off everything you read as a rant, or immature when it clearly isn’t and is just constructive criticism in blind defense of your game is a really damaging thing to do.

It allows for no quality control and feedback and Dev teams can be very ego-centric and think only they know what’s best for a game and its community.

The problems I have cited show to me, at least, that they don’t know and have actually devised/programmed systems that are going to end up causing lasting damage.

I’m not saying the ship is sinking, I’m saying watch that iceberg over there. There IS a difference.

The main one being – I care about the game as much as you do.