Guild Wars 2

Charr aligning themselves with the other civilized races is a pretty important part of the story, going from Prophecies → Eye of the North → GW2.

Ogres and ettins have only recently begun to open relations with other races, due to centaur encroachment.

Charr were very much a race in GW1 (right from the first area in the first game) and have the longest history in this game. Asurans and Norns were added much later (EoTN) and Sylvari are new to GW2.

I would doubt that Charr were ripped from WoW as GW1 and WoW came out close to the same time and GW1 was long in development, meaning the Charr were designed before the success of WoW was apparent.

Charr make sense as a playable race due to their history in the game. They are a much more intelligent race than an Ogre would be. Ogre’s are barely sentient.

All of that said, Charr is my least favourite race.

How are Charr at all like Tauren, other than being large, bestial, and possessing horns? Culturally they are completely different, and the Charr have a feline, not bovine, ancestry – the only bovine feature they really have are the horns, but mostly they are feline, a fact that has been outright stated by artists as the inspiration for Charr.

Granted, I didn’t play WoW, but aren’t the Tauren nomadic and close to nature? That is very, very far from the Charr, who are militaristic, industrialized, and have a very strong social order and have no time for faith or spirituality.

And while humans are the most popular race, a lot of people still enjoy and play Charr. Even people unfamiliar with their lore – giant horned cats with rifles and tanks? I’m pretty sure that appeals to plenty of people even without knowing their history in Guild Wars.

that’s probably the reason why we don’t see charrs in game, they are almost extinct since they are ugly tauren or whatever.

charrs where there since guild wars prophecies in 2005

Lets hijack this thread and turn it into complaint thread about lack of elves…and mounts!

legion.7518:

Charr are pretty much ripped straight from the Tauren of WoW. And I’m pretty sure they are one of the more unpopular races in that game. Not sure why a developer would choose to make that a playable race. A better alternative would have been Ogres. Again, you want more people to play your game then give them cool races that they want to be. Who wants to be a cow?

How on earth charr like Tauren? they both have horns and ears that are kinda similar I guess… that’s it. They certainly aren’t cows.

Charr actually remind me somewhat of post Star Trek: The Motion Picture Klingons, which I tend to think of as Space Orcs as I feel they fill that particular niche (I also think of the Borg as Space Zombies). Original Series Klingons, however, were more like Dark Humans (a la Dark Elves).

I personally love my Charr, partially since I find the charr very interesting as a race in itself. How they wage war, their culture, how they handle their children, their design, everything. One thing I keep wondering about, though is; What the hell are the charr as a culture going to do once the Dragons are defeated, all the big wars done? Are they going to fight against the other races again? Become a race of mercenaries?

And let’s just face it, the Asura are basically just the gnomes of other games with a different name and skin. And that skin is just a weird alien-looking creature that most people didn’t care for from the beginning.

Asura should have been Gnomes
Charr should have been Ogres
Sylvari should have been Elves

Do that and they would have had a much better shot of this game being a mainstream blockbuster like WoW.

First priority should be making playable characters that appeal to the most people out there. The lore can always be changed.

legion.7518:

Charr are pretty much ripped straight from the Tauren of WoW. And I’m pretty sure they are one of the more unpopular races in that game. Not sure why a developer would choose to make that a playable race. A better alternative would have been Ogres. Again, you want more people to play your game then give them cool races that they want to be. Who wants to be a cow?

You know, come to think of it, Humans in GW2 are kind of like a clone of Blood Elves in WoW. kitten copy cats.

JemL.3501:

sonicwylde.2906:

except that elves do not appear in any GW lore that I can remember. Why would you add a race that did not exist in any GW lore just because? Sylvari at least have the Pale tree from GW.

doesnt matter, still elves > all your lore

Sylvari are superior to mere elves.

legion.7518:

And let’s just face it, the Asura are basically just the gnomes of other games with a different name and skin. And that skin is just a weird alien-looking creature that most people didn’t care for from the beginning.

Asura should have been Gnomes
Charr should have been Ogres
Sylvari should have been Elves

Do that and they would have had a much better shot of this game being a mainstream blockbuster like WoW.

First priority should be making playable characters that appeal to the most people out there. The lore can always be changed.

wow how can you say that these races don’t appeal players are you blind or just a troll (which is a hatred race in the forum)?

Vayne.8563:

Actually, I wouldn’t even want to play a game with elves. I can’t stand them. And I’m not alone.

In fact, mmorpg.com has a column called “No Elves Allowed” about all the things that are traditionally in MMOs that the writer just can’t stand to see any more of. Ever hear the term “played out”?

Fantasy is a very very broad catagory. It’s long past time it’s expanded beyond elves and dwarves. I’m so glad they’re not in this game (and that Anet killed off the dwarven race in Guild Wars 1).

Elves are in the game. The fact is that Tyria’s sylvari closely resemble the aldryami from the world of Glorantha, so much so that they could have been lifted directly from it. The only real difference is the lore. And elves don’t seem to be the only concept that might have been borrowed from Glorantha.

Sylvari are elves, just not the ubiquitous Wal-Mart version.

legion.7518:

And let’s just face it, the Asura are basically just the gnomes of other games with a different name and skin. And that skin is just a weird alien-looking creature that most people didn’t care for from the beginning.

Asura should have been Gnomes
Charr should have been Ogres
Sylvari should have been Elves

Do that and they would have had a much better shot of this game being a mainstream blockbuster like WoW.

First priority should be making playable characters that appeal to the most people out there. The lore can always be changed.

Um, no. I love Charr and my main is a charr. I dislike Orcs and would never play one. We don’t need more boring, cliche fantasy stuff. I prefer Anet’s twist of these fantasy types. It’s far more interesting.

And I’m saying this as someone who likes elves and usually plays them. Elves are nice, but they don’t really fit GW2. Humans basically fit the role the elves would normally take with the whole “dying, once glorious race” thing. I remember the old design for sylvari was pretty much just elves. I was pretty unimpressed. When I saw the redesign I was actually excited to play a sylvari. The new look fits their story/lore so much more. Very glad they chose to redesign.

Darkstar.6178:

RebelYell.7132:

Kryta – Constantinople

Istanbul

Are you Turkish? If not it’s none of your business.

legion.7518:

And let’s just face it, the Asura are basically just the gnomes of other games with a different name and skin. And that skin is just a weird alien-looking creature that most people didn’t care for from the beginning.

Asura should have been Gnomes
Charr should have been Ogres
Sylvari should have been Elves

Do that and they would have had a much better shot of this game being a mainstream blockbuster like WoW.

First priority should be making playable characters that appeal to the most people out there. The lore can always be changed.

Everything you said is wrong. Go play WoW.

Demented Sheep.1642:

legion.7518:

Charr are pretty much ripped straight from the Tauren of WoW. And I’m pretty sure they are one of the more unpopular races in that game. Not sure why a developer would choose to make that a playable race. A better alternative would have been Ogres. Again, you want more people to play your game then give them cool races that they want to be. Who wants to be a cow?

How on earth charr like Tauren? they both have horns and ears that are kinda similar I guess… that’s it. They certainly aren’t cows.

Yeah, besides the horns they are nothing alike. Charr are a steampunk inspired feline race. Tauren are a hippy, tree hugger cow race.

legion.7518:

Charr are pretty much ripped straight from the Tauren of WoW. And I’m pretty sure they are one of the more unpopular races in that game. Not sure why a developer would choose to make that a playable race. A better alternative would have been Ogres. Again, you want more people to play your game then give them cool races that they want to be. Who wants to be a cow?

Tauren? not even close. If anything, the Charr are more like Kzinti , and they pre-date wow by nearly 40 years. GW is not wow, it is not D&D, it’s a different world. Why should it have the same races?
There are many MMORPGs and other types of games that do not have elves, so why should this one?

I think we should just get it over with.
Add mounts.
Add raids.
Add elves.
Lower the graphic settings to cartoonish.
Start charging a monthly fee.
Change the name of the game from GuildWars2 to World Of Warcraft 2

Only then, will the players be happy.

Ettins are closer to orcs than Charr are.

Jemmi.6058:

Charr were very much a race in GW1 (right from the first area in the first game) and have the longest history in this game. Asurans and Norns were added much later (EoTN) and Sylvari are new to GW2.

I would doubt that Charr were ripped from WoW as GW1 and WoW came out close to the same time and GW1 was long in development, meaning the Charr were designed before the success of WoW was apparent.

Charr make sense as a playable race due to their history in the game. They are a much more intelligent race than an Ogre would be. Ogre’s are barely sentient.

All of that said, Charr is my least favourite race.

First, Ogres are not all that dumb. In my Norn storyline I went to help the ogres and they had a leader that was quite intelligent and charming. As a hero, you can be smarter than the typical ogre grunt.

Second, even if you assume the ogres are big dummies, that can be a fun role-playing thing. I remember in EQ people that played ogres would go around and be like “me look for group, me like to smash things.” It was hilarious fun.

Also, ogre females would give a chance to have a female humanoid model that doesn’t look all cutesy or sexy.

I would play as an Ogre in a second.

legion.7518:

Jemmi.6058:

Charr were very much a race in GW1 (right from the first area in the first game) and have the longest history in this game. Asurans and Norns were added much later (EoTN) and Sylvari are new to GW2.

I would doubt that Charr were ripped from WoW as GW1 and WoW came out close to the same time and GW1 was long in development, meaning the Charr were designed before the success of WoW was apparent.

Charr make sense as a playable race due to their history in the game. They are a much more intelligent race than an Ogre would be. Ogre’s are barely sentient.

All of that said, Charr is my least favourite race.

First, Ogres are not all that dumb. In my Norn storyline I went to help the ogres and they had a leader that was quite intelligent and charming. As a hero, you can be smarter than the typical ogre grunt.

Second, even if you assume the ogres are big dummies, that can be a fun role-playing thing. I remember in EQ people that played ogres would go around and be like “me look for group, me like to smash things.” It was hilarious fun.

Also, ogre females would give a chance to have a female humanoid model that doesn’t look all cutesy or sexy.

I would play as an Ogre in a second.

But you can play a ‘hilariously dumb character’ as any current race. Personally I find Charr to be a more interesting race than ogres on every single level.

I’m glad Tyria has its own lore and is not another rip-off of Tolkien-like fantasy.

I love playing dark elves whenever they’re available, but there is no place for elves (or orcs, and other typical fantasy stereotypes) in Tyria and I like that it has its own lore.

As a lover of dark elves, I’m still waiting for the Largos to be playable (bodies are like a fussion of a Dark Elf and a stingray and they have similar armor designs to warhammer dark elves), for their aesthetics, but I like that they’re a different race with their own properties and culture.

Another great thing this game has is probably the best human race in any game. As they had the first game to develop their lore, humans are really like the elves of GW2, a race that dominated most known territories and were close to the gods and now is close to extinction and lost most of their territories.

Darkstar.6178:

RebelYell.7132:

Kryta – Constantinople

Istanbul

I see what you did there.

http://youtu.be/Gi0Rt0slfy4

legion.7518:

Charr are pretty much ripped straight from the Tauren of WoW. And I’m pretty sure they are one of the more unpopular races in that game. Not sure why a developer would choose to make that a playable race. A better alternative would have been Ogres. Again, you want more people to play your game then give them cool races that they want to be. Who wants to be a cow?

Tauren and Charr are pretty much opposite of eachother… COMPLETE opposite..
The only thing they have in common is fur -.-

Gathslan.1870:

Tauren and Charr are pretty much opposite of eachother… COMPLETE opposite..
The only thing they have in common is fur -.-

C’mon man. The models are very similar. One has a bull face, one has a cat face, both with horns. Body types are so similar that most people will instantly think of the Tauren when they see a Charr. Yeah I know the lore is different, I’m talking about the look of the character.

legion.7518:

Jemmi.6058:

Charr were very much a race in GW1 (right from the first area in the first game) and have the longest history in this game. Asurans and Norns were added much later (EoTN) and Sylvari are new to GW2.

I would doubt that Charr were ripped from WoW as GW1 and WoW came out close to the same time and GW1 was long in development, meaning the Charr were designed before the success of WoW was apparent.

Charr make sense as a playable race due to their history in the game. They are a much more intelligent race than an Ogre would be. Ogre’s are barely sentient.

All of that said, Charr is my least favourite race.

First, Ogres are not all that dumb. In my Norn storyline I went to help the ogres and they had a leader that was quite intelligent and charming. As a hero, you can be smarter than the typical ogre grunt.

Second, even if you assume the ogres are big dummies, that can be a fun role-playing thing. I remember in EQ people that played ogres would go around and be like “me look for group, me like to smash things.” It was hilarious fun.

Also, ogre females would give a chance to have a female humanoid model that doesn’t look all cutesy or sexy.

I would play as an Ogre in a second.

My bad, I have not played the Norn story line. I have had very little experience with Ogres, and the few experiences suggested they were not intelligent. Granted they do have TP’s and things in Ascalon.

Jemmi.6058:

legion.7518:

Jemmi.6058:

Charr were very much a race in GW1 (right from the first area in the first game) and have the longest history in this game. Asurans and Norns were added much later (EoTN) and Sylvari are new to GW2.

I would doubt that Charr were ripped from WoW as GW1 and WoW came out close to the same time and GW1 was long in development, meaning the Charr were designed before the success of WoW was apparent.

Charr make sense as a playable race due to their history in the game. They are a much more intelligent race than an Ogre would be. Ogre’s are barely sentient.

All of that said, Charr is my least favourite race.

First, Ogres are not all that dumb. In my Norn storyline I went to help the ogres and they had a leader that was quite intelligent and charming. As a hero, you can be smarter than the typical ogre grunt.

Second, even if you assume the ogres are big dummies, that can be a fun role-playing thing. I remember in EQ people that played ogres would go around and be like “me look for group, me like to smash things.” It was hilarious fun.

Also, ogre females would give a chance to have a female humanoid model that doesn’t look all cutesy or sexy.

I would play as an Ogre in a second.

My bad, I have not played the Norn story line. I have had very little experience with Ogres, and the few experiences suggested they were not intelligent. Granted they do have TP’s and things in Ascalon.

Well, it’s not specifically Norn, the Charr can do it too. It’s one of their choices for the Racial Sympathy step in the storyline, after the standardized Whispers/Vigil/Priory step that all races have access to.

legion.7518:

Gathslan.1870:

Tauren and Charr are pretty much opposite of eachother… COMPLETE opposite..
The only thing they have in common is fur -.-

C’mon man. The models are very similar. One has a bull face, one has a cat face, both with horns. Body types are so similar that most people will instantly think of the Tauren when they see a Charr. Yeah I know the lore is different, I’m talking about the look of the character.

Except that charr are also hunched over, with claws on their hands and feet.

legion.7518:

Gathslan.1870:

Tauren and Charr are pretty much opposite of eachother… COMPLETE opposite..
The only thing they have in common is fur -.-

C’mon man. The models are very similar. One has a bull face, one has a cat face, both with horns. Body types are so similar that most people will instantly think of the Tauren when they see a Charr. Yeah I know the lore is different, I’m talking about the look of the character.

Don’t make me post side by side pics :P

Jemmi.6058:

Charr were very much a race in GW1 (right from the first area in the first game) and have the longest history in this game. Asurans and Norns were added much later (EoTN) and Sylvari are new to GW2.

I would doubt that Charr were ripped from WoW as GW1 and WoW came out close to the same time and GW1 was long in development, meaning the Charr were designed before the success of WoW was apparent.

Charr make sense as a playable race due to their history in the game. They are a much more intelligent race than an Ogre would be. Ogre’s are barely sentient.

All of that said, Charr is my least favourite race.

Actually the Tauren made their first appearence in Warcraft 3, so it would be possible for them to be an influence on GW1.

I don’t think they are, as many people have said other than being a big, beastial race they have absolutely nothing in common, but chronologically it would be possible.

Elves? Never heard of it.

kRiza krimos.1637:

Lets hijack this thread and turn it into complaint thread about lack of elves…and mounts!

So your saying that you want to use elves as mounts!?

Any way i find sylvari far closer to Ents they are just a great deal less tree like and far smaller. More of the saplings or ground cover plants.

legion.7518:

What do the most successful fantasy MMOs have in common? They had elves! People love elves. Remember EQ? And then WoW.

We don’e need elf-pron ERPing in Lion’s Arch in this game. Take that to WoW.

The LAST thing this game needs is Tolkien’s warped interpretation of Santa’s Shoemaking crew for the XXX-texting crowd.

You want WoW or EQ? The door is —-———————————> That way.

Danikat.8537:

Jemmi.6058:

Charr were very much a race in GW1 (right from the first area in the first game) and have the longest history in this game. Asurans and Norns were added much later (EoTN) and Sylvari are new to GW2.

I would doubt that Charr were ripped from WoW as GW1 and WoW came out close to the same time and GW1 was long in development, meaning the Charr were designed before the success of WoW was apparent.

Charr make sense as a playable race due to their history in the game. They are a much more intelligent race than an Ogre would be. Ogre’s are barely sentient.

All of that said, Charr is my least favourite race.

Actually the Tauren made their first appearence in Warcraft 3, so it would be possible for them to be an influence on GW1.

I don’t think they are, as many people have said other than being a big, beastial race they have absolutely nothing in common, but chronologically it would be possible.

I know they were in Warcraft 3. I was assuming that the suggestion was, Guild Wars copied WoW, because WoW was the most popular MMO. It is possible that Guild Wars copied earlier non MMO games, and I am sure they did to some extent.

legion.7518:

Gathslan.1870:

Tauren and Charr are pretty much opposite of eachother… COMPLETE opposite..
The only thing they have in common is fur -.-

C’mon man. The models are very similar. One has a bull face, one has a cat face, both with horns. Body types are so similar that most people will instantly think of the Tauren when they see a Charr. Yeah I know the lore is different, I’m talking about the look of the character.

Is this what you’re concerned with overall, the looks of characters? If so, do you really want 10 humanoid races? I’m sure many feel differently, but that’s just mind numbingly boring. Part of the fun of playing fantasy is to get away from real life, no?

legion.7518:

You guys haven’t commented on what I said about the Charr and Asuran races. I don’t think anyone can deny that most people really don’t like to play those races. This game just doesn’t have enough cool races.

Charr are the whole reason I was drawn to GW2.

After seeing who the real heroes of GW1 were, and that humans were the evil force driving the other races back. GW1 having been a story of the Charr trying to reclaim their homeland – I’ve wanted to play one since 2005.

GW2 finally gave me that chance.

I could care less about Sylvarri. I called them out as elf-pron when they were first announced. But thankfully the hentai-looking original model got scrapped. The plant people, I don’t object to – they just bore me.

Asura are a lot of fun and very interesting.

Norn… meh. Somebody has a Viking that acts like a Native American thing over at ArenaNet. I’ve got 2 because the model is often better than the human one for certain looks – but could care less for them as a concept. They’re the “we dialed it in and just added big humans because we ran out of ideas” race.

But don’t diss my Charr.

You want epic races and then you ask for Santa’s Elves as done by Tolkien? That’s like saying “I want amazing” and then going out and buying a Hinda Civic like the other 100 people on your block…

No no no, was never the elves. It is statistically proven that every successful game in the last 127 years had dwarves. Only because of dwarves was there a need for a taller slim race to balance the average height and thus meeting the Fantasy Rulebook regulation 205.3. Same regulation works for intelligence as well ( – see orcs) and the need for multiple ear-shapes.

Norn are clearly the local dwarves. Pretty clever to get a round the height average by making them tall in the first place.

Now, someone solve the riddle of the asura … small and very intelligent. No orcs to create balance. Huh, oh well.

Amadan.9451:

sylvari lore is very similar to fairy lore in our legends, all this nightmare court and the dreaming and the leafs and the winged cultural armor, and all this genderless love, the wylde hunt etc etc. they have nothing in common with elves just as their maker (tolkjen) pictured them, they just happen to like to live in the forest (though elves have buildings while sylvari have seed like buildings provided by their own mother).

Sylvari lore is based on Celtic myths. So it’s not surprising. Sylvari are actually a lot lie the elves in Kingdoms of Amalur.

Tolkien didn’t invent Elves (or Dwarves, or Orcs), he based them on European folklore, including Celtic.

legion.7518:

Charr are pretty much ripped straight from the Tauren of WoW. And I’m pretty sure they are one of the more unpopular races in that game. Not sure why a developer would choose to make that a playable race. A better alternative would have been Ogres. Again, you want more people to play your game then give them cool races that they want to be. Who wants to be a cow?

Congratulations on making sure nobody here takes you seriously ever again.

I would have said Istanbul had the White Mantle succeeded in taking over Lion’s Arch.

You know, these issues could all be resolved if they’d allow us more freedom in editing our characters. Want your human character to look like elves? Then give us more options in character creation!

Are people so blind…

Sylvari = Guildwars 2 Elves

Pointy ears – Check
Slender Appearance – Check
Tree hugging plant lovers – Check

Sylvari = Good Elves
Nightmare Court = Drow/Dark Elves

Just because they are ugly as sin and are vegetables doesn’t hide the fact that they are still Elves…

OP

Fantasy is limitless.

Why are you so gung-ho to limit us.

And really think about it. The sylvari are elves just 25 not 25000

Elf, the other white meat. I mean, seriously, elves are so done.

Krosslite.1950:

OP

Fantasy is limitless.

Why are you so gung-ho to limit us.

And really think about it. The sylvari are elves just 25 not 25000

The difference is that the elves sylvari aren’t the ancient, wise race that’s time has past and not long for this world, that’s humans. I think this shakeup could be used better.

All of my characters are Asura. They’re the only race I’ll play.

Please, for all that is Holy… Leave the elves for Tolkien…..

The races of GW2 are actually known in other novels.

Charr – The Pride of Chanur (C. J. Cherryh)

Sylvari – Sylvan races of every fantasy ever written

Human – duh

Norn – Any Nordic fantasy, such as the Thor graphic novels

Asura – Depending on which elf story you read, some are described eerily like Asura. Even the Harry Potter house elves look like Asura more than the Sylvan races pictured in Tolkien.

If I were given the opportunity to create a playable race for GW2 that fits in the lore, I would pick either the Hecket or an Elemental of some sort… or maybe Mursaat ;-)

sinzer.4018:

Krosslite.1950:

OP

Fantasy is limitless.

Why are you so gung-ho to limit us.

And really think about it. The sylvari are elves just 25 not 25000

The difference is that the elves sylvari aren’t the ancient, wise race that’s time has past and not long for this world, that’s humans. I think this shakeup could be used better.

Look deep though.

They gain knowledge through the dream, which by the way it is described is a planetary psychic link to all that have lived and now live in Tyria. This makes this an ancient wise race, with a twist toward naive. You hear hints of this from everyone that has talked to them and even they hint at it on the way they say things. Even the Asura rank them evenly with themselves while they basically call all the other races dummies.

Ashabhi.1365:

Sylvari – Sylvan races of every fantasy ever written

Yup. It’s in the name as well (Latin: silva=forest). The sylvan is a generic term for various tree spirits, gods etc common to tons of folklore around the world.

However, the Sylvari are definitely similar to elves in the mythological sense. Let’s go back to the álfar in Norse Mythology of which Tolkein’s elves are derived from. They were supernatural beings that are distinctively connected to Yggdrasil; the World Tree. I think it’s obvious that the álfar are sylvan.

While whether or not the Sylvari are derived from Tolkein’s elves or the álfar is a matter of debate, i’d say even if the Sylvari aren’t derived from germanic folklore they would still be derived from the same source as elves

GW2 humans are actually the elves of GW2. They’re closer to the Tolkien theme of elves as a fading race that was once the pinnacle of Tyria.