Guild Wars 2

Lishtenbird.2814:

I also agree that there is an overwhelmingly surprising amount of people who just can’t handle the simplest things without being spoonfed -

I will point out that nowhere on the skills tab of the Hero panel is there a listing for the character’s Downed state skills.

Just like there is no listing for Death Shroud skills, the possible Steal skills, Toolbelt skills, Ranger pet skills, Conjured weapon skills, etc.

GW2’s UI is and has always been extremely underwhelming. I know that the design philosophy is to get players to look at the environment, which is a nice sentiment, but it doesn’t really bear out in a fast paced MMO. Every skill a player has access to should have its statistics listed in the Hero panel. Saying “just mouse over the skill” doesn’t work when you only have access to it for limited amounts of time (i.e. Steal, Shroud, environmental, etc.). The skills tab in the Hero panel should be the reference for players, one should not have to do research OUTSIDE the game to figure out how a skill works or what it does, that is what the UI is for in the first place!

Selene.9415:

They should have at least tried a full tutorial (similar to GW Factions/Nightfall) that can be skipped if you’re an experienced player…

This was my general thought as well.

They could have packed all of it into the initial instance before releasing players into the regular world.

Selene.9415:

They should have at least tried a full tutorial (similar to GW Factions/Nightfall) that can be skipped if you’re an experienced player…

That wouldn’t be innovative.

What they really need to do is make it so if you already have level 80s that you can get an option to jump your toon to level 30 or 40 if you don’t want to replay that initial content, or a toggle for you to have it not be so dumbed down.

I’m actually going to go back to Diablo 3 for a while, until something more interesting comes out.

I wish they would at least give veterans the option to get these abilities and such faster. I don’t blame them for making it easier for newbies, but I can already imagine it’s going to be insulting to level an alt and feel like the game is patronizing me every other minute.

Aenaos.8160:

Selene.9415:

They should have at least tried a full tutorial (similar to GW Factions/Nightfall) that can be skipped if you’re an experienced player…

That wouldn’t be innovative.

Not only that, but new players, especially nowadays, will rarely do tutorial content anyway, because they think they already know everything there is to know about everything. Then two levels in, they realize they don’t, and so they bombard the chat channels with inane questions because Google is too hard and/or time-consuming.

PookieDaWombat.6209:

What they really need to do is make it so if you already have level 80s that you can get an option to jump your toon to level 30 or 40 if you don’t want to replay that initial content, or a toggle for you to have it not be so dumbed down.

Weren’t those types of scrolls datamined? I can see these becoming available for purchase in the store eventually, for exactly your reasoning – vets that want to skip the tutorial hassle.

So, instead of making a video tutorial to watch before playing or a starter area like the mist, they smack down every existing player in game???? GG, this just keeps getting worse…..

I believe most new accounts (players) are just existing players anyway.

This game already is insultingly easy and there’s barely any skill to be expressed in any aspect of the game. It’s obvious that their target demographic is EXTREMELY casual players to the point where calling them players is almost not applicable. People who log in every two weeks to buy the newest additions to the gem store and click F to get through the latest iteration of living story, following the green dot around the map.

Anyone who actually wants to be challenged by their video games has likely left the game or hates Anet for turning the sequel of Guild Wars into a glorified cash-shop simulator with low-quality writing and 0 gameplay updates since launch. And who can say that these people are wrong? Anet clearly doesn’t care about their wants and needs because they bring in less revenue or are just small percentage in the margins, not worth investing resources into, not worth the investment, not worth their valuable time – time that could be spent on making more items added to the gemstore.

Ergolicious.1507:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

And I love making alts, I got 20 already. It’s really the only way to keep the game fun for me.

/facepalm

Yea I’m having fun with it, fudge me right?

PookieDaWombat.6209:

Crovax.7854:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

Logos.1306:

guys new info

some Renown Hearts will change after patch.

Taking food to feed cows were too complex, so now you only have to F-click the cows.
Taking water buckets were too complex, now you only F-click the plants.
and so on..

so yeah no more fun thinks like running with water and other like that. Now we just F-click everything because this game want to be PEGI 3

I would really laugh my kitten off if they actually did this.

Newsflash: “That’s actually what they did – for real.”

Nope. No. Just no. That has to be a joke. Not, please let this be a joke, but more it HAS to be a joke. I cannot accept that someone thought that it was too hard to learn that you had to pick up a bundle and use it so they just did away with that.

Agree…….. on the plus side apparently I can now let the pre-schoolers do my mapping for me. Who needs to grind when a 4 year old can do it for you?

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

I’m on close to the same page as Bird. For those of us that have played through since launch, this does seem insulting, because we obviously did figure the stuff out. We populated the wiki so that other people would have an easier time. People have written all sorts of guides for the various components of the game. Etc. However, there are a lot of people that really don’t have a clue.

Look at the questions being asked in game, on here, in the player helping player forum, etc. They don’t understand down state, they don’t know what wvw is, they don’t get how pvp works, they don’t know what a combo field is, what blasting is, what might stacking is, etc. The game needs a better tutorial for those types of people. People have posted that they don’t understand, that they feel just thrown into the game with no direction, that they are overwhelmed, and many vets have stated that they understand that feeling.

So anet built a tutorial…of sorts. I don’t agree with the implementation of all the various things, but I agree with the general concept. Considering there are people playing this game and it is their first MMO, they need something to help them along. Something to help educate beginners, which might help the player base in general when they get to trying things like dungeons. Sadly, I don’t think that even with our feedback that this implementation will change because it apparently does seem to be working (at least in China).

To be quite honest, I have to admit that I didn’t know how combos really work until 8th or so month after release .

Yes, tutorials are needed.

I’m just finding it hard to swallow that 2 years worth of research and these changes are the best they can come up with for new players when it essentially dumbs down the experience/

Abe Kleine.3568:

Next thing you know Anet is going to say that stacking might is too complex, so were just going to give you all stacks of might for huddling near each other in a ball.

Every 3 levels until lvl 75 you get 1 additional stack of might so that you can get used to the effect this has to your damage output and not be suddenly socked,and then you have a full 5 levels to adjust your brain till lvl 80.

The thing is, all they’re really doing is making the starter zone into a tutorial zone, the way it really should have been in the first place. It’s actually the way most games do it.

No one has tried the experience, but so many are quick to judge it.

You have to look at the whole fabric of a change, not individual changes. Then make a decision on how they affect the game.

At least one person who played it said in his preview that the leveling from 1-15 is faster now.

Leo Paul.1659:

I’m just finding it hard to swallow that 2 years worth of research and these changes are the best they can come up with for new players when it essentially dumbs down the experience/

Research probably done with corporate focus groups…..always a bad idea, and always gives you metrics that never reflects the actual population.

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

Logos.1306:

guys new info

some Renown Hearts will change after patch.

Taking food to feed cows were too complex, so now you only have to F-click the cows.
Taking water buckets were too complex, now you only F-click the plants.
and so on..

so yeah no more fun thinks like running with water and other like that. Now we just F-click everything because this game want to be PEGI 3

I would really laugh my kitten off if they actually did this.

Actually, based on WP’s preview… they are doing exactly this. No more feeding cows, no more watering plants. Just hit F. No more low level gathering. No more low level dodge roll or conditions from foes.

It makes me want to smack anet, but if leveling through 15 is distinctly faster, then perhaps the tutorial might not be quite so bad. I’m going to reserve judgement until I can try it myself tonight. I’m going to make a new ele (which was my first class) and take her out to QD and ‘relive’ my first days of play, so to speak, and see how I feel about the new process.

They removed dodging on low levels too!?

That’s just ridiculous, dodging is probably THE most important system in this game.

Maybe mobs in the early levels should have really long tells, and tooltips come up saying “this attack is going to hurt, use (keybind) or double tap a direction to dodge!” I mean.. going 15 levels without having to dodge is going to make players WORSE at the game

What next?
“Many of our players have said that so-called ‘armor’ is too confusing, so we made some changes to help clarify their use! Until you reach 2500 AP, characters can now only fight in their undergarments!”
“Our testing has found that the idea of ‘skills’ is difficult for many players. As such, we now only unlock skills after reaching level 80! All prior combat will be done automatically! Just click and the computer will do it for you so you don’t feel overwhelmed!”
“Use of the waypoint system was confusing, so now we unlock it at level 40 when you get to Lions Arch the first time! But first, you must visit with Evon Gnashblade in-game and give him a tribute of your own blood, your first born child, and 1000 gems to unlock!”

Seriously, who do they think is playing this game?

Devildoc.6721:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

Windu The Forbidden One.6045:

Logos.1306:

guys new info

some Renown Hearts will change after patch.

Taking food to feed cows were too complex, so now you only have to F-click the cows.
Taking water buckets were too complex, now you only F-click the plants.
and so on..

so yeah no more fun thinks like running with water and other like that. Now we just F-click everything because this game want to be PEGI 3

I would really laugh my kitten off if they actually did this.

Actually, based on WP’s preview… they are doing exactly this. No more feeding cows, no more watering plants. Just hit F. No more low level gathering. No more low level dodge roll or conditions from foes.

It makes me want to smack anet, but if leveling through 15 is distinctly faster, then perhaps the tutorial might not be quite so bad. I’m going to reserve judgement until I can try it myself tonight. I’m going to make a new ele (which was my first class) and take her out to QD and ‘relive’ my first days of play, so to speak, and see how I feel about the new process.

They removed dodging on low levels too!?

That’s just ridiculous, dodging is probably THE most important system in this game.

Maybe mobs in the early levels should have really long tells, and tooltips come up saying “this attack is going to hurt, use (keybind) or double tap a direction to dodge!” I mean.. going 15 levels without having to dodge is going to make players WORSE at the game

They added in a specific dodge tutorial. Not sure at what level.

This is the problem with Anet.

They want to hinder progress because it might be too overwhelming, but instead of delaying the progress, they could just actually teach players with an in-game tutorial.

This is just beyond stupid for leveling alts now. Veterans keep getting screwed over with every patch. First traits, and now this.

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

PookieDaWombat.6209:

What they really need to do is make it so if you already have level 80s that you can get an option to jump your toon to level 30 or 40 if you don’t want to replay that initial content, or a toggle for you to have it not be so dumbed down.

Weren’t those types of scrolls datamined? I can see these becoming available for purchase in the store eventually, for exactly your reasoning – vets that want to skip the tutorial hassle.

Yeah, see thats the other problem. you just KNOW they are going to put them in the gem store and coyly say “you can just buy them for XXX gems or XXXX gems for 5” which would go further to putting me off from this game. Sad part is i already told someone that I had been trying to come over to the game to just pass it by. Now i have good reason to tell them to keep moving.

Rym.1469:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

I’m on close to the same page as Bird. For those of us that have played through since launch, this does seem insulting, because we obviously did figure the stuff out. We populated the wiki so that other people would have an easier time. People have written all sorts of guides for the various components of the game. Etc. However, there are a lot of people that really don’t have a clue.

Look at the questions being asked in game, on here, in the player helping player forum, etc. They don’t understand down state, they don’t know what wvw is, they don’t get how pvp works, they don’t know what a combo field is, what blasting is, what might stacking is, etc. The game needs a better tutorial for those types of people. People have posted that they don’t understand, that they feel just thrown into the game with no direction, that they are overwhelmed, and many vets have stated that they understand that feeling.

So anet built a tutorial…of sorts. I don’t agree with the implementation of all the various things, but I agree with the general concept. Considering there are people playing this game and it is their first MMO, they need something to help them along. Something to help educate beginners, which might help the player base in general when they get to trying things like dungeons. Sadly, I don’t think that even with our feedback that this implementation will change because it apparently does seem to be working (at least in China).

To be quite honest, I have to admit that I didn’t know how combos really work until 8th or so month after release .

Yes, tutorials are needed.

That is because these are not clearly documented and explained in the skills section of the Hero panel as they should be.
Same goes for conditions,boons,and additional skills gained from Elites and Utilities.
These are also not documented in the skills panel.
On the other hand I hope they don’t add a learning period for conditions/boons in game because then they would have to increase the lvl cap to 200.

I just started leveling a ranger and I’m bored. Why? because 1111111. I have yet to use greatsword so I don’t know how it is. Also didn’t look at guides but from my observation, the rotation of most ranger weapons do seem to be 11111.

I don’t know if I will be able to level other character if they levelgate weapon skills.

PookieDaWombat.6209:

LanfearShadowflame.3189:

PookieDaWombat.6209:

What they really need to do is make it so if you already have level 80s that you can get an option to jump your toon to level 30 or 40 if you don’t want to replay that initial content, or a toggle for you to have it not be so dumbed down.

Weren’t those types of scrolls datamined? I can see these becoming available for purchase in the store eventually, for exactly your reasoning – vets that want to skip the tutorial hassle.

Yeah, see thats the other problem. you just KNOW they are going to put them in the gem store and coyly say “you can just buy them for XXX gems or XXXX gems for 5” which would go further to putting me off from this game. Sad part is i already told someone that I had been trying to come over to the game to just pass it by. Now i have good reason to tell them to keep moving.

Well, to be fair, people have said that they would be willing to buy such items… Have asked for them to be available via such means.

Personally, I don’t think they should be available at all.

Afya.5842:

I just started leveling a ranger and I’m bored. Why? because 1111111.

That’s actually not different from lv 80.

Just wait. Watch the predicable unfold.

Anet: “We’ve made leveling easier for new players!”
Forums: “You mean more tedious…”
Anet: “Well if you think that way we are sorry, but you are welcome to buy the instant leveling scrolls that grant you 40 or 60 levels in the gem store.”

This is what cash shop games do. Create artificial roadblocks / barriers for the ‘good of the game’, wait a bit, and then sell the bypass to said roadblock / barrier. It is a pattern that has often repeated itself since the creation of the micro transaction model. Quite frankly, a buy 2 play game should be above this.

People were excited by the datamined 40/60 scrolls because leveling was already tedious past the first few alts….

Afya.5842:

I just started leveling a ranger and I’m bored. Why? because 1111111. I have yet to use greatsword so I don’t know how it is. Also didn’t look at guides but from my observation, the rotation of most ranger weapons do seem to be 11111.

I don’t know if I will be able to level other character if they levelgate weapon skills.

Just put it on auto attack and enjoy your first levels as a bot really.
Now that’s some pretty bad @s#s gaming.
You still have to use WASD.And Q.And E.
Can you handle it?

Xar.6185:

Just wait. Watch the predicable unfold.

Anet: “We’ve made leveling easier for new players!”
Forums: “You mean more tedious…”
Anet: “Well if you think that way we are sorry, but you are welcome to buy the instant leveling scrolls that grant you 40 or 60 levels in the gem store.”

*Anet: “Well if you think that way we are sorry, but you can all write about the issues you have with it in excruciating detail for 50+ pages for the next 5 months and barely acknowledge the thread exists until the the next feature pack rolls around.”

Fixed that for ya.

Thanks Stephane. I do not questions your research, and maybe everything is justified. I might even be a better experience for new players.
But for the love of all of us, come up with a solution for veteran players. Please address that in the next meeting of yours.

Maybe, upon reaching level 80, give us a scroll to instantly level up an alt to level 80 (or 40) who also gets that scroll. After a few alts you have seen it all and just dont want to grind again.

Stephane Lo Presti.7258:

Snip

The decision to implement the New Player Experiment system came from tens of thousands of usability testers

Snip

Tens of thousands…..Oh….My….Goodness….I feel so bad for those usability testers ;/ Guild Wars 2 is already one of the easier games to pick up regarding skills. Sure the Fields and Finishers are a bit of a hassle to learn but that’s probably the hardest thing in the game to learn.

Skills? Hah, hell no.
Traits? They were a bit confusing but if you took more than 5 minutes of brain activity you could figure out how stuff worked.

Stephane Lo Presti.7258:

Snip

The decision to implement the New Player Experiment system came from tens of thousands of usability testers

Snip

Tens of thousands…..Oh….My….Goodness….I feel so bad for those usability testers ;/ Guild Wars 2 is already one of the easier games to pick up regarding skills. Sure the Fields and Finishers are a bit of a hassle to learn but that’s probably the hardest thing in the game to learn.

Skills? Hah, hell no.
Traits? They were a bit confusing but if you took more than 5 minutes of brain activity you could figure out how stuff worked.

Stephane Lo Presti.7258:

Hi everyone,

I’m going to paraphrase Colin on this topic. The decision to implement the New Player Experiment system came from tens of thousands of usability testers and interviews with players who tried Gw2 and left leading up to China launch both in NA/EU and in China. It came as a surprise to us but it was an important for us to acknowledge that a number of systems, downed included, were difficult to understand for many players.

For the downed, system we tried a downed tutorial, building downed into the level 1 tutorial and other ideas. After usability testing with numerous different groups, we found that the best rate of people learning and understanding it came from having it be layered complexity and the solution we went with above. Intuitively that wouldn’t have been my guess either initially, but we found people understood it better this way than all other options we tried.

This same level of testing led to the other changes as well. At the end of the day the biggest take away is that all of us (including a lot of people on the forums) probably know games (and Guild Wars 2) really really well. We have millions of users, and a tiny percentage of them frequent game forums. Just because all of us learned those systems well and thought it was all really easy doesn’t mean we are the norm.

I hope this helps everyone here understand that this was a decision to improve the game for many people. Thanks for your understanding

What i took away from this is that you are catering towards the lowest common denominator. We are talking about basic principles, the simplest of logic, common sense for crying out loud. At this point I’m really glad I didn’t give Anet any money in the past couple of months. I haven’t played for some time now because of that very reason: Anet thinks of their players as stupid and this just proves it further.

My whole guild of 50+ people left over the last 2 months and migrated to other games.
People that played GW1 for many years quit before the second birthday which is just so incredibly disheartening to see.

Like many others I’m happy to come back and give you my money but please, for once just prove that you see me as more than a sucker you use to generate revenue.

Isn’t it obvious by now, this is just another step to drag out the leveling experience with existing content until they have time to build new stuff. I’ve said it on reddit and I’ve said it here, I don’t believe they have an expansion near ready to go because if they did they would announce it to stop the bleeding. I think they poured a good chunk of their development into the China launch which did not net the numbers they expected and now they’re scrambling in the background.
Do you really think they would stick to their policy knowing just the announcement of an expansion would placate the vast majority of the player base? Announcing is by far the lesser of the two evils at this stage of the game, they aren’t announcing because they have nothing to announce.

Stephane Lo Presti.7258:

Hi everyone,

I’m going to paraphrase Colin on this topic. The decision to implement the New Player Experiment system came from tens of thousands of usability testers and interviews with players who tried Gw2 and left leading up to China launch both in NA/EU and in China. It came as a surprise to us but it was an important for us to acknowledge that a number of systems, downed included, were difficult to understand for many players.

For the downed, system we tried a downed tutorial, building downed into the level 1 tutorial and other ideas. After usability testing with numerous different groups, we found that the best rate of people learning and understanding it came from having it be layered complexity and the solution we went with above. Intuitively that wouldn’t have been my guess either initially, but we found people understood it better this way than all other options we tried.

This same level of testing led to the other changes as well. At the end of the day the biggest take away is that all of us (including a lot of people on the forums) probably know games (and Guild Wars 2) really really well. We have millions of users, and a tiny percentage of them frequent game forums. Just because all of us learned those systems well and thought it was all really easy doesn’t mean we are the norm.

I hope this helps everyone here understand that this was a decision to improve the game for many people. Thanks for your understanding

But can’t you at least make this optional? For the more experienced players this makes levelling alts a lot more tedious… Does our opinion not count anymore?

Stephane Lo Presti.7258:

Hi everyone,

I’m going to paraphrase Colin on this topic. The decision to implement the New Player Experiment system came from tens of thousands of usability testers and interviews with players who tried Gw2 and left leading up to China launch both in NA/EU and in China. It came as a surprise to us but it was an important for us to acknowledge that a number of systems, downed included, were difficult to understand for many players.

For the downed, system we tried a downed tutorial, building downed into the level 1 tutorial and other ideas. After usability testing with numerous different groups, we found that the best rate of people learning and understanding it came from having it be layered complexity and the solution we went with above. Intuitively that wouldn’t have been my guess either initially, but we found people understood it better this way than all other options we tried.

This same level of testing led to the other changes as well. At the end of the day the biggest take away is that all of us (including a lot of people on the forums) probably know games (and Guild Wars 2) really really well. We have millions of users, and a tiny percentage of them frequent game forums. Just because all of us learned those systems well and thought it was all really easy doesn’t mean we are the norm.

I hope this helps everyone here understand that this was a decision to improve the game for many people. Thanks for your understanding

I take it passing an IQ test wasn’t required to become a tester? I can’t imagine anyone with an IQ above that of a monkey would need it dumbed down any further.

Please re-evaluate your testing procedures to actually incorporate intelligence. Thank You for your umderstanding.

They do it to make it more grindy, look at what happened with the traits.
Think of someone who got lots of alts, and really want all of the traits to be available on his alts, do you think he will go farm all of the events to unlock them? no, i don’t think so.
But you can buy them off with gold and if you short on gold and don’t feel like grinding (grinding again) you can buy gems.

I have alts running around with almost no traits because i just don’t bother, i can imagine how many people are doing the same.

Stephane Lo Presti.7258:

Hi everyone,

I’m going to paraphrase Colin on this topic. The decision to implement the New Player Experiment system came from tens of thousands of usability testers and interviews with players who tried Gw2 and left leading up to China launch both in NA/EU and in China. It came as a surprise to us but it was an important for us to acknowledge that a number of systems, downed included, were difficult to understand for many players.

For the downed, system we tried a downed tutorial, building downed into the level 1 tutorial and other ideas. After usability testing with numerous different groups, we found that the best rate of people learning and understanding it came from having it be layered complexity and the solution we went with above. Intuitively that wouldn’t have been my guess either initially, but we found people understood it better this way than all other options we tried.

This same level of testing led to the other changes as well. At the end of the day the biggest take away is that all of us (including a lot of people on the forums) probably know games (and Guild Wars 2) really really well. We have millions of users, and a tiny percentage of them frequent game forums. Just because all of us learned those systems well and thought it was all really easy doesn’t mean we are the norm.

I hope this helps everyone here understand that this was a decision to improve the game for many people. Thanks for your understanding

I really want to know where those interviews are from. Is it the ingame report thing from beta? Or where? Because the report thingy from BWE is the only “interview” I’ve come across.

Yes the forum represents only a portion of the playerbase but it doesn’t automatically mean it’s only representing the most skilled part. There is a player help player subforum and I’ve never seen anyone mentioning the difficulties of using the weapon skills.

I was already intruded when I move from GW1 to GW2, that I have to unlock skills by killing mobs. Some weapon sets just ain’t as good to killing and it requires quite a long and boring time to grind those skills. And it counters some class mechanics like ele. To unlock skills, players have to camp one element. Despite that some elements are more for support. Now it’s further gated, I really have no word.

Crovax.7854:

What i took away from this is that you are catering towards the lowest common denominator.

They have to. Sadly. Nor is this actually new. Games, websites, electronics… all cater to the lowest common denominator. Don’t believe me? Example: Electric blow dryers didn’t have those handy “Do Not Use this item while in the shower” warned labels 2 decades ago when I was kid. Now, they are mandatory… so someone doesn’t “accidentally hurt them self.”

Common sense… not so common anymore.

I guess the longer a new player spends time [finding out the basics/core of the game], the harder it will be for him/her to quit, which is better than experiencing all of its features/mechanics asap and knowing that the game just isn’t for him from a business standpoint.

There is a difference between real MMO players and the “others” please make up your mind as to who you want to cater to…….And just who were these testers x.×.........Skirrits??

Stephane Lo Presti.7258:

Hi everyone,

I’m going to paraphrase Colin on this topic. The decision to implement the New Player Experiment system came from tens of thousands of usability testers and interviews with players who tried Gw2 and left leading up to China launch both in NA/EU and in China. It came as a surprise to us but it was an important for us to acknowledge that a number of systems, downed included, were difficult to understand for many players.

For the downed, system we tried a downed tutorial, building downed into the level 1 tutorial and other ideas. After usability testing with numerous different groups, we found that the best rate of people learning and understanding it came from having it be layered complexity and the solution we went with above. Intuitively that wouldn’t have been my guess either initially, but we found people understood it better this way than all other options we tried.

This same level of testing led to the other changes as well. At the end of the day the biggest take away is that all of us (including a lot of people on the forums) probably know games (and Guild Wars 2) really really well. We have millions of users, and a tiny percentage of them frequent game forums. Just because all of us learned those systems well and thought it was all really easy doesn’t mean we are the norm.

I hope this helps everyone here understand that this was a decision to improve the game for many people. Thanks for your understanding

I don’t believe that you would not take into account how this would worsen the game for your already playing people.
And it’s not that you added those tutorials,or that even after the “new player experience” there are still important aspects of the game not being communicated to new players.
No.It is the way you implemented all these and spread them over unneeded expanses of levels.For all intents and purposes this will not be a good experience for new players
especially ones coming form other games,and it surely is a bad experience for the old forum going minority as you describe it.

nexxe.7081:

Veterans keep getting screwed over with every patch. First traits, and now this.

Just like players get Veteran Slayer as daily/monthly, I think the devs might get a Veteran Slayer achievement too. =P

omg, This change won’t really affect us vet MMO gamers who have been playing MMOS for 10+ years. Most of us will fly through the levels so fast these changes won’t mater anyways. Those who are super new to MMOs or totally confused as to how GW2 works compared to a game like (sigh) WoW will have a more accessible game. This is no complaint I’m reading in the OP, this is pure elitism at it’s finest.

Vanive.3804:

omg, This change won’t really affect us vet MMO gamers who have been playing MMOS for 10+ years. Most of us will fly through the levels so fast these changes won’t mater anyways. Those who are super new to MMOs or totally confused as to how GW2 works compared to a game like (sigh) WoW will have a more accessible game. This is no complaint I’m reading in the OP, this is pure elitism at it’s finest.

So a player coming from WoW where you have to manage in excess of 30 skills will
have a problem adjusting to a 10 skill bar and a dodge…yeah

I can’t stand level restrictions and unlocks… I loved GW2 so much for not having them.

I’m not sure if my hatred for all the structural changes made (feature packs and magic find as an example) is more or less than that.

It’s painful.

Stephane Lo Presti.7258:

Hi everyone,

I’m going to paraphrase Colin on this topic. The decision to implement the New Player Experiment system came from tens of thousands of usability testers and interviews with players who tried Gw2 and left leading up to China launch both in NA/EU and in China. It came as a surprise to us but it was an important for us to acknowledge that a number of systems, downed included, were difficult to understand for many players.

For the downed, system we tried a downed tutorial, building downed into the level 1 tutorial and other ideas. After usability testing with numerous different groups, we found that the best rate of people learning and understanding it came from having it be layered complexity and the solution we went with above. Intuitively that wouldn’t have been my guess either initially, but we found people understood it better this way than all other options we tried.

This same level of testing led to the other changes as well. At the end of the day the biggest take away is that all of us (including a lot of people on the forums) probably know games (and Guild Wars 2) really really well. We have millions of users, and a tiny percentage of them frequent game forums. Just because all of us learned those systems well and thought it was all really easy doesn’t mean we are the norm.

I hope this helps everyone here understand that this was a decision to improve the game for many people. Thanks for your understanding

I know you are reiterating what colin said, Tell them these points.

1)Making it easier for some, by making it in general slower to reach basic game mechanics may net you some players, but it will probably lose you just as many, you went too far to one side.
2)the 1-40 leveling experience is packaged for new players 1 time. For every character after that its no longer new. Look at how many people have alts at various levels, how much do you lose by forcing everyone to play at the pace of a brand new player who has played no MMOs? What you have done is akin to making it so you can only drive a new car at 20 miles per hour for the first 3 weeks.

I understand what you guys goal was, but i think it was short sighted and will overall harm the game instead of improving it.

I suggest you create a experienced player mode option that is unlocked after your account has one level 80, with a lot of these things reworked. Currently playing a new class is the main veteran activity, and you have made that a lot less enjoyable. Go back to the lab.

Vanive.3804:

omg, This change won’t really affect us vet MMO gamers who have been playing MMOS for 10+ years. Most of us will fly through the levels so fast these changes won’t mater anyways. Those who are super new to MMOs or totally confused as to how GW2 works compared to a game like (sigh) WoW will have a more accessible game. This is no complaint I’m reading in the OP, this is pure elitism at it’s finest.

flying through levels because they suck is bad design, and it will still require almost the same time as it did before.

Stephane Lo Presti.7258:

Hi everyone,

I’m going to paraphrase Colin on this topic. The decision to implement the New Player Experiment system came from tens of thousands of usability testers and interviews with players who tried Gw2 and left leading up to China launch both in NA/EU and in China. It came as a surprise to us but it was an important for us to acknowledge that a number of systems, downed included, were difficult to understand for many players.

For the downed, system we tried a downed tutorial, building downed into the level 1 tutorial and other ideas. After usability testing with numerous different groups, we found that the best rate of people learning and understanding it came from having it be layered complexity and the solution we went with above. Intuitively that wouldn’t have been my guess either initially, but we found people understood it better this way than all other options we tried.

This same level of testing led to the other changes as well. At the end of the day the biggest take away is that all of us (including a lot of people on the forums) probably know games (and Guild Wars 2) really really well. We have millions of users, and a tiny percentage of them frequent game forums. Just because all of us learned those systems well and thought it was all really easy doesn’t mean we are the norm.

I hope this helps everyone here understand that this was a decision to improve the game for many people. Thanks for your understanding

New players need direction and actual instruction regarding advanced features such as WvW, dungeons, crafting, traits and so on, not to be introduced to basic features at an absolute snail’s pace.

As of right now. there’s bare minimum actual direction in game regarding these features, to the point where (for the ADVANCED FEATURES) it is easy to get lost.

This can be easily remedied by using tutorials, like, say, 99% of MMORPG’s out there.

GW2 lacks direction and guidance, not pacing