Guild Wars 2

I would sign up for this even a subscription based plan would work for me

Corvindi.5734:

Raziel.1853:

And why do you think they introduced this? Because before the forums explode because wasn’t enough stuff to do in PvE.
You don’t want that gear, then don’t go for it, its not like you need it. I understand your frustration, but its players that made Anet take this decision, if people didn’t want this Anet would not introduce it to the game.

Then I propose the following:

Those who want this grind, go for it. Those of us who don’t should get a five minute quest involving bopping bunny rabbits on the head with a giant mallet. At the end, we get all the gear you guys get for your months of repetitive grind and hundreds and hundreds of gold.

Sound good? I bet we got a deal, right? You happy, we happy, only the bunnies, they not happy, but who cares about bunnies?

There’s actually an achievement for killing them.

Mackdose.6504:

Guys, come on. Really?

Why is this such a big deal, what exactly changed that the game is significantly worse this week than last? Better dungeon drops, better champion drops, better chest loot, more content, DA KARKA, and you guys want a “legacy” server?

NO ONE is forcing you to play a so called “numbers game.” You choose your play-style, not Anet, not “elitists,” but you.

The problem is that players who have families, jobs and children (the casual players that this game was so focused on targeting) will no longer be able to compete with the people who have more time to spend grinding away dungeons. This gear actually gives a somewhat significant increase in stats from exotics. Not only that but I read that they plan on increasing stats on legendary items to make them stronger than ascended, along with making the ascended armor and weapons. The exotics that I spent a considerable time obtaining will be rendered inferior and all forms of PvP will become a mass of hardcore players all in the same gear, tearing up the standard casual player. Hope that helps.

If there is a programing difficulty, then ANET can always go the simplest route:
– Add a vendor that sells all the stats for Ascended items for reasonable amounts of gold. Naturally they would have ugly skins.
– Add another who does the same with infusions.

Now you can make progress however you like, as progress is just gathering gold.

So, just to look at another game, which many of the “then just don’t do it”, “you whiners” people seem to come from.

When this game introduced a new item level with an expansion, would you just don’t do it? It would exclude you completely from the content of the expansion you bought. But you would still just don’t do it? Right.

This is about a major change in the mechanic and base principle that GW2 has been based on and has been advertised with.

I got my refund an hour ago and I quit not because I wanted to leave the game, I quit to make my voice as a player heard.

kKagari.6804:

Corvindi.5734:

Raziel.1853:

And why do you think they introduced this? Because before the forums explode because wasn’t enough stuff to do in PvE.
You don’t want that gear, then don’t go for it, its not like you need it. I understand your frustration, but its players that made Anet take this decision, if people didn’t want this Anet would not introduce it to the game.

Then I propose the following:

Those who want this grind, go for it. Those of us who don’t should get a five minute quest involving bopping bunny rabbits on the head with a giant mallet. At the end, we get all the gear you guys get for your months of repetitive grind and hundreds and hundreds of gold.

Sound good? I bet we got a deal, right? You happy, we happy, only the bunnies, they not happy, but who cares about bunnies?

There’s actually an achievement for killing them.

Oh well in that case they can just connect it to the achievement. Wouldn’t want the devs doing any extra work on our account. And then the dungeon grinders could just avoid killing too many bunnies.

don ring.2793:

Mackdose.6504:

Guys, come on. Really?

Why is this such a big deal, what exactly changed that the game is significantly worse this week than last? Better dungeon drops, better champion drops, better chest loot, more content, DA KARKA, and you guys want a “legacy” server?

NO ONE is forcing you to play a so called “numbers game.” You choose your play-style, not Anet, not “elitists,” but you.

The problem is that players who have families, jobs and children (the casual players that this game was so focused on targeting) will no longer be able to compete with the people who have more time to spend grinding away dungeons. This gear actually gives a somewhat significant increase in stats from exotics. Not only that but I read that they plan on increasing stats on legendary items to make them stronger than ascended, along with making the ascended armor and weapons. The exotics that I spent a considerable time obtaining will be rendered inferior and all forms of PvP will become a mass of hardcore players all in the same gear, tearing up the standard casual player. Hope that helps.

Compete for what exactly? I hear a lot of talk about competition, but I was unaware that PvE had a competitive scene.

Even if it did, it’s like me getting mad at the PGA for offering a green jacket because I can’t compete with professional golfers.

I’ve been peaking at this thread and there is something I just don’t get.

All of this strange negativity. What is the source of this? It simply escapes me, I can’t experience it myself even if I tried.

They are adding new content, slowly and progressively even, we’re easing into it, and we can start getting it relatively easy in the same means we have been getting everything else. It may have a slight boost in stats, but why does that make it necessary and why does it make it a monstrosity by virtue of that necessity? It’s something to do, plain and simple.

I’m not on either side of the vertical progression debate, there is no real way to please them both. What side I AM on is this game that I enjoy playing. Thank you Arenanet for your new additions to the game!

And a tip: it is important to express yourself, particularly in a case where you are in a position to give advice and opinion to a group of people that are working on a project. It is all the more important then to not get carried away and let emotions run wild and sharpen the oh-so-common cynical internet perception of isolated text. Not only for your sake,and Arenanet’s project, but also for others, because like breeds like, and this has become a large hive of absurdly negative judgments.

It’s like you getting mad because you’re as skilled as any professional golfer, but before they let you compete, they’re requiring you to take five years unpaid leave from your job and sit in a warehouse, to simulate the extra time that professionals have spent training and practicing.

It’s simple. I don’t want to do any dungeons without a dungeon finder and even if there was one, I’d never want to do any dungeon enough times to get a full set of this new gear. So yeah, I’m angry. Because without that gear I will never, ever be on par while doing the things I want to do, like WvW.

Crater.1625:

It’s like you getting mad because you’re as skilled as any professional golfer, but before they let you compete, they’re requiring you to take five years unpaid leave from your job and sit in a warehouse, to simulate the extra time that professionals have spent training and practicing.

What are you competing for?

Ok, look…some of us want stat progression and some of us don’t. That doesn’t make anyone a bad person. What’s dividing the community is that the ones that don’t want it are being left behind or locked out of content if we don’t do it. It can be said, “well just don’t get ascended gear,” all day long. But the fact is, there is content locked out if we don’t.

Ascended stat gear is usuable in WvW. That gives some WvW players a gear advantage. Add to this that many WvW players already had their exotic stat set(s), and thought they were good to go, and it just adds insult to injury. Even if eventually the ascended stat gear makes it way to being obtainable outside of FoTM, some folks have to regear. This is something that those of us who have been playing since beginning were told we would not have to do.

It may also very well affect the older dungeon content, as groups may look for only players in ascended gear to run those. It won’t be necessary, but it could very well happen.

And there is the new island. Will be more new content. How hard will it be to do without ascended stat gear?

The folks that wanted stat progression, got it. Those of us that didn’t want it, and were in fact counting on it not being in GW2 got…what? The loss of WvW eventually. The loss of new content. And I didn’t even get a “sparkly pony” (to quote another poster), as compensation! Even if I did get a Sparkly Pony, I expect the ascended gear folks would want that too.

It’s not a fun place for non-progression players to be in. Not saying we can’t play at all anymore. It’s just not as fun a place for me anymore. And it was supposed to be about fun.

Denouement.3268:

I’ve been peaking at this thread and there is something I just don’t get.

All of this strange negativity. What is the source of this? It simply escapes me, I can’t experience it myself even if I tried.

The source is ANet had a vision for this game which they sold to a good many of their user base, an MMO without the grind and gear treadmill. 3 months in and they do a 180, introducing both necessary grind and gear treadmill. It may start of small but it will not end with just this patch.

I’m not on either side of the vertical progression debate, there is no real way to please them both.

And that’s a problem. They are trying to please both but the two play styles are in direct conflict that they cannot possibly make either happy.

Denouement.3268:

I’ve been peaking at this thread and there is something I just don’t get.

All of this strange negativity. What is the source of this? It simply escapes me, I can’t experience it myself even if I tried.

They are adding new content, slowly and progressively even, we’re easing into it, and we can start getting it relatively easy in the same means we have been getting everything else. It may have a slight boost in stats, but why does that make it necessary and why does it make it a monstrosity by virtue of that necessity? It’s something to do, plain and simple.

I’m not on either side of the vertical progression debate, there is no real way to please them both. What side I AM on is this game that I enjoy playing. Thank you Arenanet for your new additions to the game!

And a tip: it is important to express yourself, particularly in a case where you are in a position to give advice and opinion to a group of people that are working on a project. It is all the more important then to not get carried away and let emotions run wild and sharpen the oh-so-common cynical internet perception of isolated text. Not only for your sake,and Arenanet’s project, but also for others, because like breeds like, and this has become a large hive of absurdly negative judgments.

They have stated that future content will use the Agony mechanic and thereby require Infusions (and by extension Ascended gear.) That is what makes it a necessity, not the stat boost (the boost is just a bit of extra salt for the wound for folks who like WvW.)

Look at it this way: Right now, my level 80 warrior in mostly exotic armor and green jewelry can clear all the existing content (even Fractals up to level 10 or so when Agony kicks in.) But future content will make more use of Agony, and so I won’t be able to clear that content without grinding out Ascended gear (and it is a grind, at least at low Fractal levels. 2 full level 1 runs, a full level 2 run, and some aborted attempts that did not finish due to bugs, and I have a measly 85 shards. given that the basic Ascended back and infusion takes around 2000 shards, it will be literally months before I can get even a hint of Agony resist.)

Honestly, if Anet were to even say something like “all future content will be like Fractals, in that you can clear it at the most basic difficulty in partial exotic gear” then I wouldn’t care even a fraction as much, since the grind truly would be optional, rather than required to see certain content.

Mackdose.6504:

don ring.2793:

Mackdose.6504:

Guys, come on. Really?

Why is this such a big deal, what exactly changed that the game is significantly worse this week than last? Better dungeon drops, better champion drops, better chest loot, more content, DA KARKA, and you guys want a “legacy” server?

NO ONE is forcing you to play a so called “numbers game.” You choose your play-style, not Anet, not “elitists,” but you.

The problem is that players who have families, jobs and children (the casual players that this game was so focused on targeting) will no longer be able to compete with the people who have more time to spend grinding away dungeons. This gear actually gives a somewhat significant increase in stats from exotics. Not only that but I read that they plan on increasing stats on legendary items to make them stronger than ascended, along with making the ascended armor and weapons. The exotics that I spent a considerable time obtaining will be rendered inferior and all forms of PvP will become a mass of hardcore players all in the same gear, tearing up the standard casual player. Hope that helps.

Compete for what exactly? I hear a lot of talk about competition, but I was unaware that PvE had a competitive scene.

Even if it did, it’s like me getting mad at the PGA for offering a green jacket because I can’t compete with professional golfers.

Your comparisons are way off. The concern here is the gap it will have on PvP. If it was ONLY about PvE we wouldnt care this much, because there is no competition in PvE. But when PvE gear takes a step into PvP with no way for PvPers to obtain it besides PvEing people have a right to be upset.

All the current ascendant items force you to do atleast 1 dungeon even if you dont want to, you MUST have a drop from fractals to make even the cloak. This is also RNG gear and not something you can obtain through badges. So you cant calculate the time you need to spend before being able to skip this thing that should have really been optional at most.

You are also forced to do atleast difficulty 10 to have a chance to obtain the ring i.e you must complete level 10 and get to 11 for a chance that the chest drops the right ring.

Also, the current way it works is that its all saved to your toon, not to your account. So if you enjoy alts and WvW you will need to get to difficulty 11 on ALL toons, IMO unacceptable. It should be a accountwide save, its an indication of your knowledge about the fractals, since 1-10 gives you squat that you need really.

Also comparing gold to this is just uhm… I dont know what to call it. The jacket doesnt make you better at golf, it all comes down to player vs player skill. The golf example is more like a sPvP player being mad at someone in more shiny sPvP gear because hes more skilled, its just looks.

You arent forced to play to get the jacket to be competative, but WvW players are forced to do dungeons (not PvP) to stay competative in WvW. It doesnt make sense.

WvW should be about player vs player combat, PvE should not have any impact on WvW gameplay.

I like it. GW2 classic!

Erulogos.2591:

Denouement.3268:

I’ve been peaking at this thread and there is something I just don’t get.

All of this strange negativity. What is the source of this? It simply escapes me, I can’t experience it myself even if I tried.

They are adding new content, slowly and progressively even, we’re easing into it, and we can start getting it relatively easy in the same means we have been getting everything else. It may have a slight boost in stats, but why does that make it necessary and why does it make it a monstrosity by virtue of that necessity? It’s something to do, plain and simple.

I’m not on either side of the vertical progression debate, there is no real way to please them both. What side I AM on is this game that I enjoy playing. Thank you Arenanet for your new additions to the game!

And a tip: it is important to express yourself, particularly in a case where you are in a position to give advice and opinion to a group of people that are working on a project. It is all the more important then to not get carried away and let emotions run wild and sharpen the oh-so-common cynical internet perception of isolated text. Not only for your sake,and Arenanet’s project, but also for others, because like breeds like, and this has become a large hive of absurdly negative judgments.

They have stated that future content will use the Agony mechanic and thereby require Infusions (and by extension Ascended gear.) That is what makes it a necessity, not the stat boost (the boost is just a bit of extra salt for the wound for folks who like WvW.)

Look at it this way: Right now, my level 80 warrior in mostly exotic armor and green jewelry can clear all the existing content (even Fractals up to level 10 or so when Agony kicks in.) But future content will make more use of Agony, and so I won’t be able to clear that content without grinding out Ascended gear (and it is a grind, at least at low Fractal levels. 2 full level 1 runs, a full level 2 run, and some aborted attempts that did not finish due to bugs, and I have a measly 85 shards. given that the basic Ascended back and infusion takes around 2000 shards, it will be literally months before I can get even a hint of Agony resist.)

Honestly, if Anet were to even say something like “all future content will be like Fractals, in that you can clear it at the most basic difficulty in partial exotic gear” then I wouldn’t care even a fraction as much, since the grind truly would be optional, rather than required to see certain content.

Agony resist is not necessary, I’ve done some Fractals of the Mist scale runs above level 10 without it and I’ve been able to manage just fine, in fact it was fun trying to avoid it, and when I did get hit with it I’ve rarely actually been defeated from it. I have also been with someone who already had Agony resist +10 on a ring, so no it doesn’t take that long.

I can’t make myself be dissatisfied with this, particularly to the point of butthurt that I’ve seen from a lot of these individuals. Just can’t do it.

So I guess people are peeved of more that that there will be too much grinding, rather than grinding itself.

Didn’t players complain that the prerequisites for legendaries were a grind?

You cannot satisfy everyone.

Death Reincarnated.3570:

So I guess people are peeved of more that that there will be too much grinding, rather than grinding itself.

Didn’t players complain that the prerequisites for legendaries were a grind?

You cannot satisfy everyone.

Yeah I think there was another 10k reply post about it. /sarcasm

Denouement.3268:

I’ve been peaking at this thread and there is something I just don’t get.

All of this strange negativity. What is the source of this? It simply escapes me, I can’t experience it myself even if I tried.

Then you are likely NOT one of the many people that absolutely detest gear grind. One of the reasons why i hate this feature is because it forms the basis of a gameplay style that i find abhorrent. The Elitist Game.

The better gear is here not to make things easier for you (it doesn’t, the new content always is made with the best eq tier in mind and mob stats are adjusted accordingly). It is here so some people can feel better than the others. The only value of this gear is that the masses don’t have it. Once too many people manage to get it, a new tier is needed to separate “elitist nobility” from “common noob rabble”. There is absolutely no other reason for existence of new tier items. It just separates “the better” from “the losers” – and “the betters” will keep reminding you about it at every possibility, because that was their goal in the first place.

When a game caters to that gameplay style, it tells me that developers agree with it. Why would i want to play a game which considers me to be worse somehow, just for playing differently, even if i do spend likely more money that the achievers?

Remember, this elitist playstyle is actively hostile to the one i prefer. The two simply cannot coexist in the same game space.

(I also support Corvindi’s idea about bunnies. Even if i’ll feel sorry for them)

The fact that Mcloed has just posted in a thread that is basically asking the same questions and worries as this one is proof enough that Anet will never answer us.

His answer was also super vague and NOT what we have heard from Anet all through development.

I would like to always keep this thread pushed to top though, just so new players can see what they are getting into.

Death Reincarnated.3570:

So I guess people are peeved of more that that there will be too much grinding, rather than grinding itself.

Didn’t players complain that the prerequisites for legendaries were a grind?

You cannot satisfy everyone.

Legendary grind is optional, as in I would not have to do it at all and still remain competitive in WPvP as well as being able to do any future content update without the content being tuned for higher power gear.

With the vertical progression, you will pretty much HAVE to grind in order to be on par.

“Manifesto servers” have a better ring to it. Just need 3 for WvW, though I’d wager that only 3 would be crazy crowded.

Death Reincarnated.3570:

So I guess people are peeved of more that that there will be too much grinding, rather than grinding itself.

Didn’t players complain that the prerequisites for legendaries were a grind?

You cannot satisfy everyone.

Of course, players complained that the prerequisites for legendaries were a grind. But most folks didn’t see legendaries as a must have or need to have. The stats were no different that Exoctics. It was totally for the looks. Having a legendary didn’t get you into content. It just gives bragging rights and coolness.

There are other cool/rare skins that can be make in the MF with fewer mats too.

And Anet said that they now too believe it might be a tad hard, so they are going to tone it down on legendaries.
*Note: Legendaries are going to get their stats boosted to ascended level, but they were no better than exotic level.

WvW, it doesn’t matter at all unless the other server somehow has the vast majority of their players kitted out in Ascended gear, and if that was they case, they were probably going to roll over you without it anyways. WvW isn’t at all about one person, or even a dozen people, it’s about the server as a whole. Getting your face stomped on? Go man a treb or an arrow cart. Run supplies. Whatever.

Most complaints stem from Ascended equipment being the strongest, which isnt true.

They can only be upgraded via infusion, which only gives you Agony resistance, meaning no runes and sigils.

The main problem would be if they made it mandatory for future content, but for

now it is mostly fine, other then being needed for really high Fotm difficulties.

Death Reincarnated.3570:

So I guess people are peeved of more that that there will be too much grinding, rather than grinding itself.

Didn’t players complain that the prerequisites for legendaries were a grind?

You cannot satisfy everyone.

Legendary grind is optional, as in I would not have to do it at all and still remain competitive in WPvP as well as being able to do any future content update without the content being tuned for higher power gear.

With the vertical progression, you will pretty much HAVE to grind in order to be on par.

Kolache.3964:

“Manifesto servers” have a better ring to it. Just need 3 for WvW, though I’d wager that only 3 would be crazy crowded.

Manifesto Servers, yes, yes, yes. I like you.

Denouement.3268:

Agony resist is not necessary, I’ve done some Fractals of the Mist scale runs above level 10 without it and I’ve been able to manage just fine, in fact it was fun trying to avoid it, and when I did get hit with it I’ve rarely actually been defeated from it. I have also been with someone who already had Agony resist +10 on a ring, so no it doesn’t take that long.

I can’t make myself be dissatisfied with this, particularly to the point of butthurt that I’ve seen from a lot of these individuals. Just can’t do it.

It has been stated, in the announcement for the Ascended gear, that eventually, at some difficulty level, the Agony resist would become necessary. I only mentioned Fractal 10 because that is when it first appears, it is not yet clear when it becomes a true gear check mechanic, but we have blunt words from Anet staff that the question is when, not if.

The fellow with the ring got some love from the RNG, as I believe at Fractal 10+ you have a chance to get Ascended ring drops (and if he got one with the stats he likes, he -really- got some RNG loving.) Grats to him on his good fortune, but counting on luck to see you through is not a very viable strategy.

Too bad WvW isn’t meant to be balanced on the player level. Ascended items won’t save you from a trebuchet, ballista, or cata. Saying "WvWers have to PvE to stay “competitive” (false) by playing the game doesn’t make me upset in the least.

You want gear balance? sPvP and tPvP say Hi.

I really want the question answered, what exactly are PvE players competing for? Each other? Sorry that I spend more time playing the game than you, then. I guess we should make legendaries look terrible because you don’t have the time to look that awesome.

Denouement.3268:

I’ve been peaking at this thread and there is something I just don’t get.

All of this strange negativity. What is the source of this? It simply escapes me, I can’t experience it myself even if I tried.

They are adding new content, slowly and progressively even, we’re easing into it, and we can start getting it relatively easy in the same means we have been getting everything else. It may have a slight boost in stats, but why does that make it necessary and why does it make it a monstrosity by virtue of that necessity? It’s something to do, plain and simple.

I’m not on either side of the vertical progression debate, there is no real way to please them both. What side I AM on is this game that I enjoy playing. Thank you Arenanet for your new additions to the game!

And a tip: it is important to express yourself, particularly in a case where you are in a position to give advice and opinion to a group of people that are working on a project. It is all the more important then to not get carried away and let emotions run wild and sharpen the oh-so-common cynical internet perception of isolated text. Not only for your sake,and Arenanet’s project, but also for others, because like breeds like, and this has become a large hive of absurdly negative judgments.

Its a problem cause we bought the game on the concept that there were will be no gear grind and that this will be a casual friendly game.This game was supposed to be a long term investment for us not a 3 month only.
Now it just feels like my money and time invested in this game was stolen.I would never have bought the game if i knew it will be a gear grind.
I dont mind adding new content, heck im happy for it.But where are 1vs1 arenas that weve been so eagerly awaiting?where are the guild vs guild spvp arenas?Everyone was screaming for these things and thats what should ve been priority to put out.
If they wanted to appeal to wow fans they should added raiding content that drops exotics or maybe even legendary armor that has the same stats as the exotics.Im sure noone would be complaining if they did that.I always loved raiding and hated dungeons ,after all doing same thing over and over again to keep up with other players is not something i can call fun.Even if the gear difference is only 0.0001% it still is a difference.And i am done with games where someone has advantage cause he has more time to play the game or invested more money than me.I want a skill based game and they said this will be it and with those lies they tricked me into buying the game and that is why im upset.

Mackdose.6504:

Crater.1625:

It’s like you getting mad because you’re as skilled as any professional golfer, but before they let you compete, they’re requiring you to take five years unpaid leave from your job and sit in a warehouse, to simulate the extra time that professionals have spent training and practicing.

What are you competing for?

What the hell do you think WvW is? A hug circle?

I would also continue playing the game on a vanilla server.

Tricsun.9682:

WvW, it doesn’t matter at all unless the other server somehow has the vast majority of their players kitted out in Ascended gear, and if that was they case, they were probably going to roll over you without it anyways. WvW isn’t at all about one person, or even a dozen people, it’s about the server as a whole. Getting your face stomped on? Go man a treb or an arrow cart. Run supplies. Whatever.

Why does it not suffice when someone says they want the best gear to WvW in? Do you really need to make that decision for anyone else with your reasons?

phanmc.6759:

Raziel.1853:

So basically what you people are saying in over 200 pages is that ur not happy cause is not enough PvE stuff to make you play and enjoy more this side of the game, but ur not happy that they add new PvE stuff including gear. Ok that makes perfect sense!

Apparently English isn’t your strong point. I’ll break it down for you.

1. A selling point for GW2 was the lack of vertical “gear” progression and grind.
2. Lots of people bought into the idea of no grind.
3. Other people wanted the grind and many threatened to leave.
4. ANet does a 180 and introduced the gear grind.
5. Forum explodes with those who bought into the no grind idea feeling lied to.

No grind? Really? Pretty much everything in this game is a grind. Grind map completion. Done? Grind crafting mats. Done? Grind dungeons for armor/weapon skins. Done? Grind a legendary. Done? Grind karma. Done? Grind more legendaries. I could go on, but really not necessary. The only thing that isn’t a grind is getting to level 80.

namethatimade.6108:

They can only be upgraded via infusion, which only gives you Agony resistance, meaning no runes and sigils.

Incorrect, infusions will grant stat bonuses in addition to agony resistance. Considering there are defensive, offensive, and omni infusions; it’s not out of the question that they may offer bonuses similar to runes and sigils.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/Infusions-affect-normal-stats/first

Denouement.3268:

They are adding new content, slowly and progressively even, we’re easing into it, and we can start getting it relatively easy in the same means we have been getting everything else. It may have a slight boost in stats, but why does that make it necessary and why does it make it a monstrosity by virtue of that necessity? It’s something to do, plain and simple.

It’s not “something to do”. It’s “something you have to do”, because to choose not to participate is to choose to become progressively weaker and weaker relative to players who do participate.

The ultimate effects of it are a meaningless insult to the intelligence of the game’s players. The most difficult content will always, always be balanced with the most powerful characters in mind. The difficulty level will always be identical, in the end. If this equipment offers a 15% increase in damage, then new enemies will receive a 15% increase in health.

The amount of time it takes to get this new equipment is completely unreasonable. On reaching level 80, the time it takes to max out your equipment with Exotics – with the cheapest, most boring, least cool looking Exotics – represents a minimum investment of 10-20 hours, per build, and per character. For those of us who play multiple characters, and/or multiple builds per character, the grind to max out in this game is already absurdly long, easily reaching the hundreds of hours, at a minimum, assuming all of that time is spent doing ruthlessly efficient grinding. And getting equipment that looks nice is extra, on top of all that.
Pieces of Infused Ascended gear so far represent at least 5 to 20 times the time/grind investment of an Exotic piece. Unless you can afford to play Guild Wars 2 like a full-time job with overtime every week, it is effectively impossible to play more than one build, on one character.

This only scratches the surface of what is wrong with this gear. There is literally nothing positive about the addition of Ascended gear, except that it will bring some fleeting, ephemeral satisfaction to people who derive pleasure not from progress, and not from playing the game, but from seeing numbers increase, and only the subsection of those players who refuse to learn and gear for multiple builds, and who refuse to play more than one character.

And the kicker – the really insulting bit – is that this can’t even be seen as a cash grab on the part of ArenaNet, because nothing about it actually leads directly to revenue. All that sacrifice, all that compromise, and a thumb in the eye to every single player who doesn’t fall into the “really really loves grinding” camp or the “doesn’t actually care about the design of the game, as long as they personally have some vague sense of fun” camp… And it doesn’t even effectively lead to ensuring that Guild Wars 2 has a stable financial future.

If anything, the negativity in this thread is understated.

Aaron.4807:

Mackdose.6504:

Crater.1625:

It’s like you getting mad because you’re as skilled as any professional golfer, but before they let you compete, they’re requiring you to take five years unpaid leave from your job and sit in a warehouse, to simulate the extra time that professionals have spent training and practicing.

What are you competing for?

What the hell do you think WvW is? A hug circle?

I would also continue playing the game on a vanilla server.

What do you think hardcore PvEers are, hardcore WvWers? Makes perfect sense.

kKagari.6804:

Which moderator do you think will come in here and tell us this topic has run its course, and that it will be closed, and that they thank you for understanding?

My money is on Ivonne.

Well, the topic would be posted again almost immediately.

why are there a good number of posts that go like this?

“People complain about wanting A but not B
And now people complain about wanting B but not A
Whats wrong with you people?”

The people who complain about the 1st line arent the same as the ones in the 2nd line.

The reason Why i side with one of them is because the people who are angry that there is vertical progression are here BECAUSE THEY WERE ADVERTISED BY ANET THAT THE GAME WOULD NOT HAVE IT

While the others are people who bought the game without research or without knowing that this game was SUPPOSED TO NOT HAVE VERTICAL PROGRESSION

Mackdose.6504:

Too bad WvW isn’t meant to be balanced on the player level. Ascended items won’t save you from a trebuchet, ballista, or cata. Saying "WvWers have to PvE to stay “competitive” (false) by playing the game doesn’t make me upset in the least.

You want gear balance? sPvP and tPvP say Hi.

This is the worst post on this subject I have seen so far.

I would like to know if you are in a serious WvW server or guild. Because right now, you have no idea what is going on. People saying WvW is about zergs… you have no freaking idea.

namethatimade.6108:

Most complaints stem from Ascended equipment being the strongest, which isnt true.

They can only be upgraded via infusion, which only gives you Agony resistance, meaning no runes and sigils.

The main problem would be if they made it mandatory for future content, but for

now it is mostly fine, other then being needed for really high Fotm difficulties.

This is totally not true. Ascended gear is much stronger than Exotic. Look it up in the Wiki, or other player posts. It is a much higher level of stats than Exotic. It WILL be usuable in WvW, and any other place outside of FoTM.

The agony infusion itself is for FoTM, but the gear comes with higher stats naturally.

phanmc.6759:

Legendary grind is optional

Correction: Legendary grind was optional. Now, it’s the only way to gear up weapons without having to fear them becoming sup par.

People keep asking why people are upset about ascendant gear. Here is a short asnwer.

It has to much impact on PvP and it forces PvPers into PvE. Something that should not happen when a game is so centered around a special PvP area.

Why is the ascendant gear not designed for dungeons and open world PvE only?

I really, really love this game, but introducing stronger tiers of armor is definitely worrying. At first I didn’t think much of it, but as I’m approaching my first lv 80, the arguments against this apparent power creep are definitely sinking in and making sense.

I love to play WvW. My plan was to slowly get a full set of exotics and be ready for anything. But if we have a new tier that is not only stronger, but one that also sounds incredibly grindy, it makes me a little sad. I play every day, but at a slow pace. I don’t like to grind excessively. And because of this, I don’t want to be outclassed so quickly when I’m only just reaching the original “plateau” of gear and stats.

Corvindi.5734:

Raziel.1853:

And why do you think they introduced this? Because before the forums explode because wasn’t enough stuff to do in PvE.
You don’t want that gear, then don’t go for it, its not like you need it. I understand your frustration, but its players that made Anet take this decision, if people didn’t want this Anet would not introduce it to the game.

Then I propose the following:

Those who want this grind, go for it. Those of us who don’t should get a five minute quest involving bopping bunny rabbits on the head with a giant mallet. At the end, we get all the gear you guys get for your months of repetitive grind and hundreds and hundreds of gold.

Sound good? I bet we got a deal, right? You happy, we happy, only the bunnies, they not happy, but who cares about bunnies?

I Sir, care about the bunnies.

Aaron.4807:

The fact that Mcloed has just posted in a thread that is basically asking the same questions and worries as this one is proof enough that Anet will never answer us.

His answer was also super vague and NOT what we have heard from Anet all through development.

I would like to always keep this thread pushed to top though, just so new players can see what they are getting into.

Well, he did implicitly confirm the vertical gear progression, which is important. He also ignores that the developer imposing a gear check is not the same as players imposing a gear check on one another.

ASB.4295:

Correction: Legendary grind was optional. Now, it’s the only way to gear up weapons without having to fear them becoming sup par.

If I was a gambling man, I’d bet that even if you grind for the legendaries, they will eventually become obsolete later. To have a tier completely removed from the treadmill seem counter to the new philosophy. I’d bet they introduce higher level legendaries later and not upgrade the existing ones.

Kolache.3964:

Tricsun.9682:

WvW, it doesn’t matter at all unless the other server somehow has the vast majority of their players kitted out in Ascended gear, and if that was they case, they were probably going to roll over you without it anyways. WvW isn’t at all about one person, or even a dozen people, it’s about the server as a whole. Getting your face stomped on? Go man a treb or an arrow cart. Run supplies. Whatever.

Why does it not suffice when someone says they want the best gear to WvW in? Do you really need to make that decision for anyone else with your reasons?

Usually when you want to get the best of something, you need to put some effort into it. You don’t NEED it for WvW, you WANT it. This whole debate is like a little child stomping their feet because they have to do chores to get some ice cream for dessert.

namethatimade.6108:

Most complaints stem from Ascended equipment being the strongest, which isnt true.

They can only be upgraded via infusion, which only gives you Agony resistance, meaning no runes and sigils.

The main problem would be if they made it mandatory for future content, but for

now it is mostly fine, other then being needed for really high Fotm difficulties.

Infusions have stats. The higher rarieties most certainly. It’s not just Agony.