Tracking Guild Wars 2
Terrible way to track since no one rly uses those apps, xfire is going off of 400 or so GW2 players.
The only use xfire has is connecting to more people when it’s hard to find servers these days for dead (but legendary) games like CoD4, which is why it is #1 on their list.
Raptr is cool but I don’t actively use it anymore.. nice for the rewards if you care about that. Rift is partnered with em and I get some pets and stuff here and there when I play that.
This is simply bad metrics, and in no way an accurate representation of the game.
Agreed, This is reminiscent of political polling There’s no way to really know the accuracy. This is just a targeted sampling of a people at best. The actual numbers could be way off.
Only Anet really knows the actual numbers. Does it really matter anyway? If I go on and the game is packed and busy= the game is popular and growing. If I have to server hop and can’t find players = its empty.
Do people still use those BS things?
Obviously some people do. There are over 7 million people registered with Overwolf.
Registered =/= active, or using it on a relatively regular basis.
^Inorite.
I guess both vayne and his employer (winkwink) must be testing new grounds over at the comedy show scene.Also, the whole business plan of GW2 he mentioned must indeed be quite a success overall, especially in its most recent manifestation which, having united the typically divided communty and allow it to act in unison against a largely unethical business decision, hands down successfully achieved something that no one else could even dream of so far.
In that sense it is indeed a pretty good company, a splendid one even, so I’m giving it a sound thumbs-up and a strong kiu!
Totally off topic of course, but since you lost the argument, you might as well try to obfuscate.
Oh right, those Google metrics you provided absolutely shattered my ‘doom and gloom’, kinda like Anet’s sound business decisions so far strongly improved retention and boosted them new-player figures, rite.
Nice comedy-fantasy thread, nevertheless!
But reasonable people who don’t have an agenda will see it for what it is. No one is trying to convince you of anything. Anyone can see from your post history (as they can see from mine) exactly what you’re about.
Easy enough to make up their own minds. A reasonable person will see the mass amount of evidence, circumstantial though it is, as opposed to the non-evidence provided by people who want the game to fail because they don’t like it.
Let me know when layoffs start then we’ll talk. Until then, you really have nothing to support your arguments.
The google trends does show that ff14 is searched more often than gw2. Over the last year, gw2 hasn’t surpassed ff14 a single time. We are also forgetting about runescape, which is trending much higher than gw2. We will have to see how archeage will hold up, since release it’s been higher, which is to be expected. I have a feeling it will hold up though. Gw2 one month after launch had a 38 and archeage one month after has a 37.
From those mmorpgs and WoW, that puts gw2 at #4, with a potential #5 depending on what happens with archeage.
I’m pretty sure I’ve said this exact same thing before. LolWell even if it’s #4 (keeping mind no one is near WoW at all), what’s the difference. Archeage won’t affect Guild Wars 2 numbers long term, of that I’m sure. It’s a completely different type of game. The kind of players attracted to this game, many of them anyway, would never even look at Archeage.
However, #4 or 5 is still a long long way off from being dead, or doing badly…and it’s #4 by a tiny tiny margin, not a great big huge one. It’s a very very small discrepancy any way you look at it.
Even in the other forms of polls, Guild Wars 2 isn’t far off Final Fantasy. It’s just a statement that the game is doing far better than people are giving it credit for. That’s the point.
Relatively speaking, it’s healthy…or no MMORPG is healthy except WoW. Those are really the options.
Either the entire industry is dead (and with no layoffs and profits every quarter I don’t see how this game is dead), or it’s not.
Guild Wars 2 is successful within the space of the industry…unless WoW is the only successful MMO. And I don’t think most people believe that.
That is because ArchAge is actually even worse than GW2, it’s really sad that GW2 is successful because it is the least junky mmo at the moment lol
Let’s look at some reddit numbers. There are currently almost the same number of people on the Guild Wars 2 reddit as the Archeage Reddit.
This is from just a few minutes ago, obviously numbers online will change. I polled the following games: Guild Wars 2, SWToR, Archeage, and Final fantasy. Of those games:
Guild Wars 2 Members – 97083 Members online 583
SWToR…Members 36651…. members online 130
Final Fantasy…members 50487….members online 512
Archeage…members 28430…members online 544
Guild Wars 2 has more members online than Archeage (and far more members) and you know, Archeage is relatively new. It has more online than Final Fantasy.
Or are you going to tell me Reddit doesn’t mean anything either.
Everywhere you look, Guild Wars 2 is up there with the most popular MMOs except WOW. Everywhere.
Some people just don’t want to see the truth.
(edited by Vayne.8563)
Trying to claim that there is a hard correlation between google search terms and game purchases is ludicrous. A very loose correlation surely exists, but trying to prove the health of a game by analyzing how many times that game’s title is typed into google is a fool’s errand.
Trying to provide a hard core link between the following facts, however, does mean something.
1. Anet’s quarterly report (which shows the game is still profitable).
2. The Google search trend.
3. The Overwolf best games chart
4. The Xfire top games chart.
5. The Raptr top games chart.
6. The fact that there haven’t been any major layoffs at Anet, in spite of NcSoft reorganizing and laying off people from Wildstar. Hell, Anet is still hiring.
7. The game is getting updates. You may not like them, but they’re putting an awful lot of work into a game people say is dying.It’s not one fact that paints a picture. It’s a combination of facts. One source saying the game is strong relative to other games means nothing. Three sources means only a bit more. The search trend adds to it. The lack of layoffs adds to that. The quarterly report. The hiring.
I’m not really sure what’s so hard to understand.
It’s people’s subjective my guild, my friend’s list, I don’t play the game anymore, and the fact that the game is obviously being played by someone.
Who’s playing it hardly makes a difference.
Numbers 1, 2, 6 and 7 were not mentioned in your original post. Number 2 was brought up only later.
I guess it really helps you to “win arguments” when you modify your statements after they’re criticized for being incomplete.
Furthermore this brings up to whole point of this thread. You constantly bash others for attempting to predict the state of the game without having access to Arena Net’s numbers, yet here you go doing exactly that. Quite hypocritical if I do say so myself.
I wasn’t trying to say gw2 is dead or dying. I just thought the thread was about the tracking of its popularity.
Gw2 is so very far from dying. Especially in a world where very few mmos ever actually get shut down. I would just shove the quarterly reports down peoples throats that believe the game is dying
I haven’t had many issues playing with people since the release of the megaserver. People are all over the place.
The google trends does show that ff14 is searched more often than gw2. Over the last year, gw2 hasn’t surpassed ff14 a single time. We are also forgetting about runescape, which is trending much higher than gw2. We will have to see how archeage will hold up, since release it’s been higher, which is to be expected. I have a feeling it will hold up though. Gw2 one month after launch had a 38 and archeage one month after has a 37.
From those mmorpgs and WoW, that puts gw2 at #4, with a potential #5 depending on what happens with archeage.
I’m pretty sure I’ve said this exact same thing before. LolWell even if it’s #4 (keeping mind no one is near WoW at all), what’s the difference. Archeage won’t affect Guild Wars 2 numbers long term, of that I’m sure. It’s a completely different type of game. The kind of players attracted to this game, many of them anyway, would never even look at Archeage.
However, #4 or 5 is still a long long way off from being dead, or doing badly…and it’s #4 by a tiny tiny margin, not a great big huge one. It’s a very very small discrepancy any way you look at it.
Even in the other forms of polls, Guild Wars 2 isn’t far off Final Fantasy. It’s just a statement that the game is doing far better than people are giving it credit for. That’s the point.
Relatively speaking, it’s healthy…or no MMORPG is healthy except WoW. Those are really the options.
Either the entire industry is dead (and with no layoffs and profits every quarter I don’t see how this game is dead), or it’s not.
Guild Wars 2 is successful within the space of the industry…unless WoW is the only successful MMO. And I don’t think most people believe that.
That is because ArchAge is actually even worse than GW2, it’s really sad that GW2 is successful because it is the least junky mmo at the moment lol
Guild Wars 2 certainly has it’s flaws. No question about it. But then, if ESO came out, and Wildstar came out and Archeage came out, and they’re all newer and Guild Wars 2 is less junkie than any of them, maybe that’s because it’s easy to say how to make a good MMO, but much harder to actually make one.
So many MMOs come out, and out of them, Guild Wars 2 is one of the most successful. Which doesn’t equal dying to me.
And you can’t deny people like it, because people have said on these forums they like it…even love it. There are many posts and none of them are by me. I don’t make posts like that and hardly respond to them.
But they’re out there.
I don’t know why people have so much trouble believe that other people can love a game they don’t like.
Do people still use those BS things?
Obviously some people do. There are over 7 million people registered with Overwolf.
Registered =/= active, or using it on a relatively regular basis.
^Inorite.
I guess both vayne and his employer (winkwink) must be testing new grounds over at the comedy show scene.Also, the whole business plan of GW2 he mentioned must indeed be quite a success overall, especially in its most recent manifestation which, having united the typically divided communty and allow it to act in unison against a largely unethical business decision, hands down successfully achieved something that no one else could even dream of so far.
In that sense it is indeed a pretty good company, a splendid one even, so I’m giving it a sound thumbs-up and a strong kiu!
Totally off topic of course, but since you lost the argument, you might as well try to obfuscate.
Oh right, those Google metrics you provided absolutely shattered my ‘doom and gloom’, kinda like Anet’s sound business decisions so far strongly improved retention and boosted them new-player figures, rite.
Nice comedy-fantasy thread, nevertheless!
But reasonable people who don’t have an agenda will see it for what it is. No one is trying to convince you of anything. Anyone can see from your post history (as they can see from mine) exactly what you’re about.
Easy enough to make up their own minds. A reasonable person will see the mass amount of evidence, circumstantial though it is, as opposed to the non-evidence provided by people who want the game to fail because they don’t like it.
Let me know when layoffs start then we’ll talk. Until then, you really have nothing to support your arguments.
Vayne, You saying “people wanting the game because they don’t like it is” is pretty anecdotal in itself. How do you know how posters feel? It’s conjecture on your part at best.
Frankly, I am more apt to believe that most people that feel the game is empty or unpopular are greatly displeased by that. I know, that is conjecture on my part.
To your point on people making up their own minds: I think their experience will dictate that more than your highly skewed calculation method.
I wasn’t trying to say gw2 is dead or dying. I just thought the thread was about the tracking of its popularity.
Gw2 is so very far from dying. Especially in a world where very few mmos ever actually get shut down. I would just shove the quarterly reports down peoples throats that believe the game is dying
I haven’t had many issues playing with people since the release of the megaserver. People are all over the place.
This thread is in response to stuff said in other threads..but it would have been off topic. I made it to show Guild Wars 2 is among the most popular MMORPGs right now, other than WoW.
It’s definitely a contender for #2. Look at the reddit post I made. And you know, that’s so far from what a lot of people are saying.
Maybe you don’t read or see those posts, but there are a handful of people trying to say the game will be dead in a year. There’s a post on the first page saying so is everyone else leaving. This post is the except to the rule, not the rule.
Those other posts are far more common. Someone needs to set the record straight.
Let’s look at some reddit numbers. There are currently almost the same number of people on the Guild Wars 2 reddit as the Archeage Reddit.
This is from just a few minutes ago, obviously numbers online will change. I polled the following games: Guild Wars 2, SWToR, Archeage, and Final fantasy. Of those games:
Guild Wars 2 Members – 97083 Members online 583
SWToR…Members 36651…. members online 130
Final Fantasy…members 50487….members online 512
Archeage…members 28430…members online 544Guild Wars 2 has more members online than Archeage (and far more members) and you know, Archeage is relatively new. It has more online than Final Fantasy.
Or are you going to tell me Reddit doesn’t mean anything either.
Everywhere you look, Guild Wars 2 is up there with the most popular MMOs except WOW. Everywhere.
Some people just don’t want to see the truth.
I’m not even gonna argue if GW2 is dying or not but your metrics are extremely flawed and don’t hold anything. You are basing your information on an extremely small pool of active players on applications that hardly any of the total playerbase uses.
Particle effect slider would be ‘too confusing’
The google trends does show that ff14 is searched more often than gw2. Over the last year, gw2 hasn’t surpassed ff14 a single time. We are also forgetting about runescape, which is trending much higher than gw2. We will have to see how archeage will hold up, since release it’s been higher, which is to be expected. I have a feeling it will hold up though. Gw2 one month after launch had a 38 and archeage one month after has a 37.
From those mmorpgs and WoW, that puts gw2 at #4, with a potential #5 depending on what happens with archeage.
I’m pretty sure I’ve said this exact same thing before. LolWell even if it’s #4 (keeping mind no one is near WoW at all), what’s the difference. Archeage won’t affect Guild Wars 2 numbers long term, of that I’m sure. It’s a completely different type of game. The kind of players attracted to this game, many of them anyway, would never even look at Archeage.
However, #4 or 5 is still a long long way off from being dead, or doing badly…and it’s #4 by a tiny tiny margin, not a great big huge one. It’s a very very small discrepancy any way you look at it.
Even in the other forms of polls, Guild Wars 2 isn’t far off Final Fantasy. It’s just a statement that the game is doing far better than people are giving it credit for. That’s the point.
Relatively speaking, it’s healthy…or no MMORPG is healthy except WoW. Those are really the options.
Either the entire industry is dead (and with no layoffs and profits every quarter I don’t see how this game is dead), or it’s not.
Guild Wars 2 is successful within the space of the industry…unless WoW is the only successful MMO. And I don’t think most people believe that.
That is because ArchAge is actually even worse than GW2, it’s really sad that GW2 is successful because it is the least junky mmo at the moment lol
Guild Wars 2 certainly has it’s flaws. No question about it. But then, if ESO came out, and Wildstar came out and Archeage came out, and they’re all newer and Guild Wars 2 is less junkie than any of them, maybe that’s because it’s easy to say how to make a good MMO, but much harder to actually make one.
So many MMOs come out, and out of them, Guild Wars 2 is one of the most successful. Which doesn’t equal dying to me.
And you can’t deny people like it, because people have said on these forums they like it…even love it. There are many posts and none of them are by me. I don’t make posts like that and hardly respond to them.
But they’re out there.
I don’t know why people have so much trouble believe that other people can love a game they don’t like.
Eso stinks, ArchAge has been taken over by Trion so that one is pretty much done as well.
Wildstar…. I played it and to be honest, it stunk a lot more than GW2.
None of the games came even close to what they said they would deliver. GW2 at least has the no sub going for it.
The google trends does show that ff14 is searched more often than gw2. Over the last year, gw2 hasn’t surpassed ff14 a single time. We are also forgetting about runescape, which is trending much higher than gw2. We will have to see how archeage will hold up, since release it’s been higher, which is to be expected. I have a feeling it will hold up though. Gw2 one month after launch had a 38 and archeage one month after has a 37.
From those mmorpgs and WoW, that puts gw2 at #4, with a potential #5 depending on what happens with archeage.
I’m pretty sure I’ve said this exact same thing before. LolWell even if it’s #4 (keeping mind no one is near WoW at all), what’s the difference. Archeage won’t affect Guild Wars 2 numbers long term, of that I’m sure. It’s a completely different type of game. The kind of players attracted to this game, many of them anyway, would never even look at Archeage.
However, #4 or 5 is still a long long way off from being dead, or doing badly…and it’s #4 by a tiny tiny margin, not a great big huge one. It’s a very very small discrepancy any way you look at it.
Even in the other forms of polls, Guild Wars 2 isn’t far off Final Fantasy. It’s just a statement that the game is doing far better than people are giving it credit for. That’s the point.
Relatively speaking, it’s healthy…or no MMORPG is healthy except WoW. Those are really the options.
Either the entire industry is dead (and with no layoffs and profits every quarter I don’t see how this game is dead), or it’s not.
Guild Wars 2 is successful within the space of the industry…unless WoW is the only successful MMO. And I don’t think most people believe that.
That is because ArchAge is actually even worse than GW2, it’s really sad that GW2 is successful because it is the least junky mmo at the moment lol
Guild Wars 2 certainly has it’s flaws. No question about it. But then, if ESO came out, and Wildstar came out and Archeage came out, and they’re all newer and Guild Wars 2 is less junkie than any of them, maybe that’s because it’s easy to say how to make a good MMO, but much harder to actually make one.
So many MMOs come out, and out of them, Guild Wars 2 is one of the most successful. Which doesn’t equal dying to me.
And you can’t deny people like it, because people have said on these forums they like it…even love it. There are many posts and none of them are by me. I don’t make posts like that and hardly respond to them.
But they’re out there.
I don’t know why people have so much trouble believe that other people can love a game they don’t like.
Eso stinks, ArchAge has been taken over by Trion so that one is pretty much done as well.
Wildstar…. I played it and to be honest, it stunk a lot more than GW2.
None of the games came even close to what they said they would deliver. GW2 at least has the no sub going for it.
There are plenty of people still enjoying the game. You can bury your head in the sand if you want, but even if Archeage delivered everything they said it would (and it hasn’t), I doubt many of the PvE’ers in this game could have dealt with it.
The google trends does show that ff14 is searched more often than gw2. Over the last year, gw2 hasn’t surpassed ff14 a single time. We are also forgetting about runescape, which is trending much higher than gw2. We will have to see how archeage will hold up, since release it’s been higher, which is to be expected. I have a feeling it will hold up though. Gw2 one month after launch had a 38 and archeage one month after has a 37.
From those mmorpgs and WoW, that puts gw2 at #4, with a potential #5 depending on what happens with archeage.
I’m pretty sure I’ve said this exact same thing before. LolWell even if it’s #4 (keeping mind no one is near WoW at all), what’s the difference. Archeage won’t affect Guild Wars 2 numbers long term, of that I’m sure. It’s a completely different type of game. The kind of players attracted to this game, many of them anyway, would never even look at Archeage.
However, #4 or 5 is still a long long way off from being dead, or doing badly…and it’s #4 by a tiny tiny margin, not a great big huge one. It’s a very very small discrepancy any way you look at it.
Even in the other forms of polls, Guild Wars 2 isn’t far off Final Fantasy. It’s just a statement that the game is doing far better than people are giving it credit for. That’s the point.
Relatively speaking, it’s healthy…or no MMORPG is healthy except WoW. Those are really the options.
Either the entire industry is dead (and with no layoffs and profits every quarter I don’t see how this game is dead), or it’s not.
Guild Wars 2 is successful within the space of the industry…unless WoW is the only successful MMO. And I don’t think most people believe that.
That is because ArchAge is actually even worse than GW2, it’s really sad that GW2 is successful because it is the least junky mmo at the moment lol
Guild Wars 2 certainly has it’s flaws. No question about it. But then, if ESO came out, and Wildstar came out and Archeage came out, and they’re all newer and Guild Wars 2 is less junkie than any of them, maybe that’s because it’s easy to say how to make a good MMO, but much harder to actually make one.
So many MMOs come out, and out of them, Guild Wars 2 is one of the most successful. Which doesn’t equal dying to me.
And you can’t deny people like it, because people have said on these forums they like it…even love it. There are many posts and none of them are by me. I don’t make posts like that and hardly respond to them.
But they’re out there.
I don’t know why people have so much trouble believe that other people can love a game they don’t like.
Eso stinks, ArchAge has been taken over by Trion so that one is pretty much done as well.
Wildstar…. I played it and to be honest, it stunk a lot more than GW2.
None of the games came even close to what they said they would deliver. GW2 at least has the no sub going for it.
There are plenty of people still enjoying the game. You can bury your head in the sand if you want, but even if Archeage delivered everything they said it would (and it hasn’t), I doubt many of the PvE’ers in this game could have dealt with it.
It offered bots, massive server lag+queues and a pay to win structure?
Do people still use those BS things?
Obviously some people do. There are over 7 million people registered with Overwolf.
Registered =/= active, or using it on a relatively regular basis.
^Inorite.
I guess both vayne and his employer (winkwink) must be testing new grounds over at the comedy show scene.Also, the whole business plan of GW2 he mentioned must indeed be quite a success overall, especially in its most recent manifestation which, having united the typically divided communty and allow it to act in unison against a largely unethical business decision, hands down successfully achieved something that no one else could even dream of so far.
In that sense it is indeed a pretty good company, a splendid one even, so I’m giving it a sound thumbs-up and a strong kiu!
Totally off topic of course, but since you lost the argument, you might as well try to obfuscate.
Oh right, those Google metrics you provided absolutely shattered my ‘doom and gloom’, kinda like Anet’s sound business decisions so far strongly improved retention and boosted them new-player figures, rite.
Nice comedy-fantasy thread, nevertheless!
But reasonable people who don’t have an agenda will see it for what it is. No one is trying to convince you of anything. Anyone can see from your post history (as they can see from mine) exactly what you’re about.
Easy enough to make up their own minds. A reasonable person will see the mass amount of evidence, circumstantial though it is, as opposed to the non-evidence provided by people who want the game to fail because they don’t like it.
Let me know when layoffs start then we’ll talk. Until then, you really have nothing to support your arguments.
I am firmly convinced that any reasonable person will be able to see that anecdotal evidence of yours for what it is. Ok, except perhaps this mythical breed of new players under Anet definition, which fortunately will be too confused to find this thread anyway.
Also, +1 to NewTrain. The hypocrisy is real.
RIP ‘gf left me coz of ladderboard’ Total views: 71,688 Total posts: 363
(edited by KarlaGrey.5903)
Do people still use those BS things?
Obviously some people do. There are over 7 million people registered with Overwolf.
Registered =/= active, or using it on a relatively regular basis.
^Inorite.
I guess both vayne and his employer (winkwink) must be testing new grounds over at the comedy show scene.Also, the whole business plan of GW2 he mentioned must indeed be quite a success overall, especially in its most recent manifestation which, having united the typically divided communty and allow it to act in unison against a largely unethical business decision, hands down successfully achieved something that no one else could even dream of so far.
In that sense it is indeed a pretty good company, a splendid one even, so I’m giving it a sound thumbs-up and a strong kiu!
Totally off topic of course, but since you lost the argument, you might as well try to obfuscate.
Oh right, those Google metrics you provided absolutely shattered my ‘doom and gloom’, kinda like Anet’s sound business decisions so far strongly improved retention and boosted them new-player figures, rite.
Nice comedy-fantasy thread, nevertheless!
But reasonable people who don’t have an agenda will see it for what it is. No one is trying to convince you of anything. Anyone can see from your post history (as they can see from mine) exactly what you’re about.
Easy enough to make up their own minds. A reasonable person will see the mass amount of evidence, circumstantial though it is, as opposed to the non-evidence provided by people who want the game to fail because they don’t like it.
Let me know when layoffs start then we’ll talk. Until then, you really have nothing to support your arguments.
I am firmly convinced that any reasonable person will be able to see that anecdotal evidence for what it is. Ok, except perhaps this mythical breed of new players under Anet deefinition, which fortunately will be too confused to find this thread anyway.
Yes the number of people on reddit at any time for specific games is definitely anecdotal. /sarcasm
Oh now we’re at reddit already?
Interesting.
Here I was, remembering so clearly how the forum populace is but a minuscule tiny fraction of the playerbase, and as such not representative in any kind of manner, although still trumping both xfire and and the other app’s figures, but hey!
Not only is the hypocrisy real, so is the comedy.
Man vayne I feel really bad for you. You put in so much effort into writing and coming up with all these gems of forum brilliance, yet it is all in vain because the players you seem to be adressing likely are not even able to access these forums, let alone your thread, because it is all just too confusing.
What a waste.
RIP ‘gf left me coz of ladderboard’ Total views: 71,688 Total posts: 363
(edited by KarlaGrey.5903)
Oh now we’re at reddit already?
Interesting.
Here I was, remembering so clearly how the forum populace is but a minuscule tiny fraction of the playerbase, and as such not representative in any kind of manner, although still trumping both xfire and and the other app’s figures, but hey!
Not only is the hypocrisy real, so is the comedy.
The forum population is a tiny percentage of the population. But in theory that’s true of all games. So if this game has a higher percentage of people on reddit and all games have roughly the same small number of people on the forums, then it indicates how many people are playing the game. It’s not really hard logic to follow.
Trying to make someone look bad doesn’t strengthen your argument at all. Insulting people doesn’t strengthen it.
If only 15% of people post on forums, that means 85% don’t. This is what I’ve said all along.
But it would still mean that a forum with more posters would probably indicate a game with more players.
Trying to provide a hard core link between the following facts, however, does mean something.
1. Anet’s quarterly report (which shows the game is still profitable).
2. The Google search trend.
3. The Overwolf best games chart
4. The Xfire top games chart.
5. The Raptr top games chart.
6. The fact that there haven’t been any major layoffs at Anet, in spite of NcSoft reorganizing and laying off people from Wildstar. Hell, Anet is still hiring.
7. The game is getting updates. You may not like them, but they’re putting an awful lot of work into a game people say is dying.It’s not one fact that paints a picture. It’s a combination of facts. One source saying the game is strong relative to other games means nothing. Three sources means only a bit more. The search trend adds to it. The lack of layoffs adds to that. The quarterly report. The hiring.
I’m not really sure what’s so hard to understand.
It’s people’s subjective my guild, my friend’s list, I don’t play the game anymore, and the fact that the game is obviously being played by someone.
Who’s playing it hardly makes a difference.
1, You can’t determine wether GW2 is profitable or not without knowing the expenses on the game during the five year development & after that. I’m not saying it is not , but stating it as a fact is simply not true.
2-5. Xfire and google trends shows a 90%(Xfire more than 95%) decrease in popularity and I didn’t check but most likely the other two too.
I have an opinion on 6-7 too, but that’s a different topic.
Trying to provide a hard core link between the following facts, however, does mean something.
1. Anet’s quarterly report (which shows the game is still profitable).
2. The Google search trend.
3. The Overwolf best games chart
4. The Xfire top games chart.
5. The Raptr top games chart.
6. The fact that there haven’t been any major layoffs at Anet, in spite of NcSoft reorganizing and laying off people from Wildstar. Hell, Anet is still hiring.
7. The game is getting updates. You may not like them, but they’re putting an awful lot of work into a game people say is dying.It’s not one fact that paints a picture. It’s a combination of facts. One source saying the game is strong relative to other games means nothing. Three sources means only a bit more. The search trend adds to it. The lack of layoffs adds to that. The quarterly report. The hiring.
I’m not really sure what’s so hard to understand.
It’s people’s subjective my guild, my friend’s list, I don’t play the game anymore, and the fact that the game is obviously being played by someone.
Who’s playing it hardly makes a difference.
1, You can’t determine wether GW2 is profitable or not without knowing the expenses on the game during the five year development & after that. I’m not saying it is not , but stating it as a fact is simply not true.
2-5. Xfire and google trends shows a 90%(Xfire more than 95%) decrease in popularity and I didn’t check but most likely the other two too.
I have an opinion on 6-7 too, but that’s a different topic.
You can guess a game is profitable if a company reorganizes and lays off people in two areas around you but leaves you’re company alone. One can assume if the game wasn’t profitable, reorganization and layoffs would happen.
Unless your experience is otherwise.
There’s plenty of conflicting indicators but none of them are wholly reliable. Overlays like those mentioned in the OP are worth factoring into a wider estimation but on their own they are one of the worst examples of popularity or population, or any other state of the game you’re trying to estimate.
Why? The popularity of those overlays per game is the data supplied and trying to crowbar that into a rough estimate of population trends in those games is a fallacy.
In terms of surveyed customer revenues, GW2 scores highly in those particular league tables (when compared to F2P games such as Planetside 2, DOTA 2, etc., in which GW2 brings in about as much as those) which indicates a healthy state of game and is more representative of the games population than any data supplied by overlay popularity per game.
Edit: An example http://www.superdataresearch.com/blog/mmo-arpu/
(edited by dace.8019)
There’s plenty of conflicting indicators but none of them are wholly reliable. Overlays like those mentioned in the OP are worth factoring into a wider estimation but on their own they are one of the worst examples of popularity or population, or any other state of the game you’re trying to estimate.
Why? The popularity of those overlays per game is the data supplied and trying to crowbar that into a rough estimate of population trends in those games is a fallacy.
In terms of surveyed customer revenues, GW2 scores highly in those particular league tables (when compared to F2P games such as Planetside 2, DOTA 2, etc., in which GW2 brings in about as much as those) which indicates a healthy state of game and is more representative of the games population than any data supplied by overlay popularity per game.
Edit: An example http://www.superdataresearch.com/blog/mmo-arpu/
It’s, as I’ve said many times, useful for detecting trends…and relative strengths. Nothing more. It’s unlikely a game is going to be massively popular on those three programs I listed (as well as google trends and reddit) and not be a popular/successful program.
The link you gave backs up what I’ve said.
The difference is these sites track progress monthly and over time you can actually see less popular games fall of those charts. In other words, but observations of those sites seem to be an indicator of trends over the long term.
I really don’t understand the point of this.
Seriously, so what? What does it prove? That Guild Wars 2 isn’t going to shut its doors anytime soon? Everyone here already knows that, even if they don’t want to admit it.
It’s not going to sway any opinions.
The difference is these sites track progress monthly and over time you can actually see less popular games fall of those charts. In other words, but observations of those sites seem to be an indicator of trends over the long term.
No.
You see the utilisation of these programs in these games decline. That is the data.
You could abductively infer a correlation but that premise is no more than hopeful guesswork. It also isn’t the most obvious inference. The relevance is dubious and presented alone as a indicator simply doesn’t hold water.
If you could provide data that showed overlay programs (or one of those) held a relatively stable x% representative of the player population then you might have a foot to stand on.
There’s plenty of conflicting indicators but none of them are wholly reliable. Overlays like those mentioned in the OP are worth factoring into a wider estimation but on their own they are one of the worst examples of popularity or population, or any other state of the game you’re trying to estimate.
Why? The popularity of those overlays per game is the data supplied and trying to crowbar that into a rough estimate of population trends in those games is a fallacy.
In terms of surveyed customer revenues, GW2 scores highly in those particular league tables (when compared to F2P games such as Planetside 2, DOTA 2, etc., in which GW2 brings in about as much as those) which indicates a healthy state of game and is more representative of the games population than any data supplied by overlay popularity per game.
Edit: An example http://www.superdataresearch.com/blog/mmo-arpu/
It’s, as I’ve said many times, useful for detecting trends…and relative strengths. Nothing more. It’s unlikely a game is going to be massively popular on those three programs I listed (as well as google trends and reddit) and not be a popular/successful program.
The link you gave backs up what I’ve said.
The difference is these sites track progress monthly and over time you can actually see less popular games fall of those charts. In other words, but observations of those sites seem to be an indicator of trends over the long term.
actually based on most of your info, its most likely FFXIV is doing a lot better than it seems.
FFXIV includes ps3, which is not likely to hit many of the things you are tracking. They also have a large japanese population, who likely dont use, or use different programs.
Neither JP nor PS3 users are likely to be as active in reddit as well. Just to be clear for ffxiv, JP and ps3 users are part of the same service and can interact with each other, and get the same content at the same time.
anyhow gw2 isnt dead, but it is not flourishing, and it is not living up to the potential of its game sales numbers. Retention is not high. FFXIV is competing with it, and i think their game sales are like 1/3rd of what gw2 has. Archage has no box sales, but the retention at this early stage is competing, i think their high number during opening week was 2 million accounts? (which is generally less actual people in F2p games)
point is not that gw2 is murdered, its that it isnt growing, its slowly declining, which is actually not normal for successful mmos at this stage of development.
FFXIV is expanding its audience, WoW expanded their audience at this time, and gained about 600k users in preparation for the next expansion.
Is gw2 on the chopping block? hardly. Is gw2 thriving? nope
There’s plenty of conflicting indicators but none of them are wholly reliable. Overlays like those mentioned in the OP are worth factoring into a wider estimation but on their own they are one of the worst examples of popularity or population, or any other state of the game you’re trying to estimate.
Why? The popularity of those overlays per game is the data supplied and trying to crowbar that into a rough estimate of population trends in those games is a fallacy.
In terms of surveyed customer revenues, GW2 scores highly in those particular league tables (when compared to F2P games such as Planetside 2, DOTA 2, etc., in which GW2 brings in about as much as those) which indicates a healthy state of game and is more representative of the games population than any data supplied by overlay popularity per game.
Edit: An example http://www.superdataresearch.com/blog/mmo-arpu/
It’s, as I’ve said many times, useful for detecting trends…and relative strengths. Nothing more. It’s unlikely a game is going to be massively popular on those three programs I listed (as well as google trends and reddit) and not be a popular/successful program.
The link you gave backs up what I’ve said.
The difference is these sites track progress monthly and over time you can actually see less popular games fall of those charts. In other words, but observations of those sites seem to be an indicator of trends over the long term.
actually based on most of your info, its most likely FFXIV is doing a lot better than it seems.
FFXIV includes ps3, which is not likely to hit many of the things you are tracking. They also have a large japanese population, who likely dont use, or use different programs.
Neither JP nor PS3 users are likely to be as active in reddit as well. Just to be clear for ffxiv, JP and ps3 users are part of the same service and can interact with each other, and get the same content at the same time.anyhow gw2 isnt dead, but it is not flourishing, and it is not living up to the potential of its game sales numbers. Retention is not high. FFXIV is competing with it, and i think their game sales are like 1/3rd of what gw2 has. Archage has no box sales, but the retention at this early stage is competing, i think their high number during opening week was 2 million accounts? (which is generally less actual people in F2p games)
point is not that gw2 is murdered, its that it isnt growing, its slowly declining, which is actually not normal for successful mmos at this stage of development.
FFXIV is expanding its audience, WoW expanded their audience at this time, and gained about 600k users in preparation for the next expansion.Is gw2 on the chopping block? hardly. Is gw2 thriving? nope
I don’t know if it’s not thriving or if it is. And that may well depend on your personal definition of thriving.
As for a game available on computer and console…well yes, there are more console gamers out there than computer gamers….at least that’s what developers keep telling us. It’s why they don’t care as much about the computer games if they have a console game out. We see it again and again.
So if a console/computer game sells more than just a computer game, that doesn’t prove anything. If a game is less popular on the computer, it’s less popular on the computer…no matter what the console portion is doing.
We all know having games is more formats yields more sales. But since we can’t know how GW 2 would have done if it was out on a console it’s sort of a moot point.
There’s plenty of conflicting indicators but none of them are wholly reliable. Overlays like those mentioned in the OP are worth factoring into a wider estimation but on their own they are one of the worst examples of popularity or population, or any other state of the game you’re trying to estimate.
Why? The popularity of those overlays per game is the data supplied and trying to crowbar that into a rough estimate of population trends in those games is a fallacy.
In terms of surveyed customer revenues, GW2 scores highly in those particular league tables (when compared to F2P games such as Planetside 2, DOTA 2, etc., in which GW2 brings in about as much as those) which indicates a healthy state of game and is more representative of the games population than any data supplied by overlay popularity per game.
Edit: An example http://www.superdataresearch.com/blog/mmo-arpu/
It’s, as I’ve said many times, useful for detecting trends…and relative strengths. Nothing more. It’s unlikely a game is going to be massively popular on those three programs I listed (as well as google trends and reddit) and not be a popular/successful program.
The link you gave backs up what I’ve said.
The difference is these sites track progress monthly and over time you can actually see less popular games fall of those charts. In other words, but observations of those sites seem to be an indicator of trends over the long term.
actually based on most of your info, its most likely FFXIV is doing a lot better than it seems.
FFXIV includes ps3, which is not likely to hit many of the things you are tracking. They also have a large japanese population, who likely dont use, or use different programs.
Neither JP nor PS3 users are likely to be as active in reddit as well. Just to be clear for ffxiv, JP and ps3 users are part of the same service and can interact with each other, and get the same content at the same time.anyhow gw2 isnt dead, but it is not flourishing, and it is not living up to the potential of its game sales numbers. Retention is not high. FFXIV is competing with it, and i think their game sales are like 1/3rd of what gw2 has. Archage has no box sales, but the retention at this early stage is competing, i think their high number during opening week was 2 million accounts? (which is generally less actual people in F2p games)
point is not that gw2 is murdered, its that it isnt growing, its slowly declining, which is actually not normal for successful mmos at this stage of development.
FFXIV is expanding its audience, WoW expanded their audience at this time, and gained about 600k users in preparation for the next expansion.Is gw2 on the chopping block? hardly. Is gw2 thriving? nope
I don’t know if it’s not thriving or if it is. And that may well depend on your personal definition of thriving.
As for a game available on computer and console…well yes, there are more console gamers out there than computer gamers….at least that’s what developers keep telling us. It’s why they don’t care as much about the computer games if they have a console game out. We see it again and again.
So if a console/computer game sells more than just a computer game, that doesn’t prove anything. If a game is less popular on the computer, it’s less popular on the computer…no matter what the console portion is doing.
We all know having games is more formats yields more sales. But since we can’t know how GW 2 would have done if it was out on a console it’s sort of a moot point.
point isnt really whether its on consoles or not, point is that a large % of the population of FFXIV would not be using most of your methods for determining their overall success.
reddit
overwolf
xfire
raptr
are not common for console users, or japanese pc users.
the reason i say its not thriving, is because even though it has 3.something million sales they only have the continous population, or interest, or in ffxiv case, a fraction of it, Even though they started out with much higher levels.
A game that sells to 1 million players, retains 75% of them and adds 200 thousand new players a year, is doing better
than one that sells to 3 million players retains 25% of them and adds 200 thousand new players a year.
year one, 750k versus 750k but then 75% of the 200k new players stay, and 25% of the new stay for the second.
- note this is a hypothetical, to illustrate how initial sales can show a difference even if current numbers are similar.
so while it may look like the games are doing virtually the same, one is growing, and the other is contracting.
However, it is still awhile yet, before anyone would consider gw2 to be a loser, even if its contracting, its still competing, but gw2 has to look at reversing the contracting trend if it wants a healthy future
@phys
All very logical, except no one really has the numbers to know. At this point, the game is “fine”. That is to say, it’s profitable and it’s sustainable. Going into the future, no one can say.
The bottom line is, and it’s always been the bottom line, Anet might be working on something bigger, and more expansion like. If that’s annouced or that comes out, that becomes a game changer.
I don’t think the company is resting on its laurels. I think they’re working on something. Feel free to disagree if you want, but I think they’re pushing, because they started late.
I think what Vayne is trying to say is… GW2 is still one of the most popular mmorpg on the market eventhough the game have been out for 2 years.
That being said just about every mmorpg is slowly leaking players. Very few can refill new players as fast as they lost.
I think what Vayne is trying to say is… GW2 is still one of the most popular mmorpg on the market eventhough the game have been out for 2 years.
That being said just about every mmorpg is slowly leaking players. Very few can refill new players as fast as they lost.
Maybe that’s because instead of delivering a high quality product and consistently maintaining that product’s high quality over time, thereby reaping the long term benefits of customer satisfaction and loyalty, just about every game maker today is all about farming the customers for quick and easy profits.
Or maybe not.
The table is a fable.
I think what Vayne is trying to say is… GW2 is still one of the most popular mmorpg on the market eventhough the game have been out for 2 years.
That being said just about every mmorpg is slowly leaking players. Very few can refill new players as fast as they lost.
Maybe that’s because instead of delivering a high quality product and consistently maintaining that product’s high quality over time, thereby reaping the long term benefits of customer satisfaction and loyalty, just about every game maker today is all about farming the customers for quick and easy profits.
Or maybe not.
I just think it’s very difficult for mmorpg studio to continue deliver enough content to keep people around for very long term.
I dont’ think game studio is purposely not deliver content just to kitten people.
I think what Vayne is trying to say is… GW2 is still one of the most popular mmorpg on the market eventhough the game have been out for 2 years.
That being said just about every mmorpg is slowly leaking players. Very few can refill new players as fast as they lost.
this is not really true, most of the historical successful MMOs expanded before the contracted. WoW, FFXI, FFXIV RO EQ Lineage etc.
the bleeding usually comes later in the cycle after they have peaked.
many mmos do bleed players, but those are generally not the ones that are seen as successful,
I think what Vayne is trying to say is… GW2 is still one of the most popular mmorpg on the market eventhough the game have been out for 2 years.
That being said just about every mmorpg is slowly leaking players. Very few can refill new players as fast as they lost.
this is not really true, most of the historical successful MMOs expanded before the contracted. WoW, FFXI, FFXIV RO EQ Lineage etc.
the bleeding usually comes later in the cycle after they have peaked.many mmos do bleed players, but those are generally not the ones that are seen as successful,
Besides WoW that are all asian games .. and the market in asia can’t really be
compared with the west.
Lineage 2 for example had 2 million players when i played it, but only 64.000 in
the west 2 months after release.
EVERY MMO is awesome until it is released then its unfinished. A month after release it just sucks.
Best MMOs are the ones that never make it. Therefore Stargate Online wins.
Best MMOs are the ones that never make it. Therefore Stargate Online wins.
I think what Vayne is trying to say is… GW2 is still one of the most popular mmorpg on the market eventhough the game have been out for 2 years.
That being said just about every mmorpg is slowly leaking players. Very few can refill new players as fast as they lost.
this is not really true, most of the historical successful MMOs expanded before the contracted. WoW, FFXI, FFXIV RO EQ Lineage etc.
the bleeding usually comes later in the cycle after they have peaked.many mmos do bleed players, but those are generally not the ones that are seen as successful,
Right but I think you need to look at it in several ways. Some of the game in your list is asian focus market(lineage), which is very different market. Or very old games when there are not much competition. Or have failed lunch which redo their whole games. Or can’t be criticized because they are the most profitable mmorpg for the past 10 years.
What I’m trying to say is if you just look at western games, post wow era, there isn’t any games which wasn’t leaking players. I honestly just look at it as players being too demanding, and game developers just can’t keep up.
I think what Vayne is trying to say is… GW2 is still one of the most popular mmorpg on the market eventhough the game have been out for 2 years.
That being said just about every mmorpg is slowly leaking players. Very few can refill new players as fast as they lost.
this is not really true, most of the historical successful MMOs expanded before the contracted. WoW, FFXI, FFXIV RO EQ Lineage etc.
the bleeding usually comes later in the cycle after they have peaked.many mmos do bleed players, but those are generally not the ones that are seen as successful,
Except that history in an industry that changes this fast is notoriously unreliable. For example, when WoW started it’s ascent there were NO free to play MMOs at all, and very little by way of competition. It’s not like today. If you’re a Star Trek fan there’s Star Trek. Star Wars fans have Star Wars. Horror fans have TSW. You might not love a game but might love a franchise.
There’s no way to look at the history of MMOs from even five years ago and compare it to today. It’s just not a fair comparison.
Just out of interest i looked if there is a german forum for FFXIV .. and yes there is
really one .. however if i look at the number of post and date of last posts it looks
really like a wasteland :
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/forums/14-Deutsches-Forum
Makes me also wonder if these numbers here really come from the west, or if its
in the end also more just from asia.
EVERY MMO is awesome until it is released then its unfinished. A month after release it just sucks.
Best MMOs are the ones that never make it. Therefore Stargate Online wins.
Best MMOs are the ones that never make it. Therefore Stargate Online wins.
Just out of interest i looked if there is a german forum for FFXIV .. and yes there is
really one .. however if i look at the number of post and date of last posts it looks
really like a wasteland :
http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/forums/14-Deutsches-ForumMakes me also wonder if these numbers here really come from the west, or if its
in the end also more just from asia.
its doing pretty well in NA i dont really now how EU goes, but my guess would be that it is primarily JP and NA
I do consider population when I choose a game to try…but only to try out a game. If I don’t like the game or if the player behavior is toxic inside the game then I drop it (eventually). There’s very few games I’ve stopped playing because I no longer liked the game. Usually player behavior degenerated to the point I could no longer lower my standards any further.
I bet in the industry this is a topic for consideration. There’s probably a deliberate decision made as to which group brings in more money, the toxic players or the civilized players, and where the line is going to be drawn.
I think what Vayne is trying to say is… GW2 is still one of the most popular mmorpg on the market eventhough the game have been out for 2 years.
That being said just about every mmorpg is slowly leaking players. Very few can refill new players as fast as they lost.
this is not really true, most of the historical successful MMOs expanded before the contracted. WoW, FFXI, FFXIV RO EQ Lineage etc.
the bleeding usually comes later in the cycle after they have peaked.many mmos do bleed players, but those are generally not the ones that are seen as successful,
Right but I think you need to look at it in several ways. Some of the game in your list is asian focus market(lineage), which is very different market. Or very old games when there are not much competition. Or have failed lunch which redo their whole games. Or can’t be criticized because they are the most profitable mmorpg for the past 10 years.
What I’m trying to say is if you just look at western games, post wow era, there isn’t any games which wasn’t leaking players. I honestly just look at it as players being too demanding, and game developers just can’t keep up.
to be perfectly honest, most of the MMOs in recent years have been sub par. They get numbers because people want the new thing, but they are not designed and maintained that well.
essentially i think they bleed players because they arent that good at what they are trying to do.
I think what Vayne is trying to say is… GW2 is still one of the most popular mmorpg on the market eventhough the game have been out for 2 years.
That being said just about every mmorpg is slowly leaking players. Very few can refill new players as fast as they lost.
this is not really true, most of the historical successful MMOs expanded before the contracted. WoW, FFXI, FFXIV RO EQ Lineage etc.
the bleeding usually comes later in the cycle after they have peaked.many mmos do bleed players, but those are generally not the ones that are seen as successful,
Right but I think you need to look at it in several ways. Some of the game in your list is asian focus market(lineage), which is very different market. Or very old games when there are not much competition. Or have failed lunch which redo their whole games. Or can’t be criticized because they are the most profitable mmorpg for the past 10 years.
What I’m trying to say is if you just look at western games, post wow era, there isn’t any games which wasn’t leaking players. I honestly just look at it as players being too demanding, and game developers just can’t keep up.
to be perfectly honest, most of the MMOs in recent years have been sub par. They get numbers because people want the new thing, but they are not designed and maintained that well.
essentially i think they bleed players because they arent that good at what they are trying to do.
And you’re only making an assumption that that’s the reason why they bleed players. But that’s not necessarily a warranted assumption. Rift wasn’t really a badly designed MMO even though I didn’t like what it was pushing. What it pushed was more WoWness which was playing to a saturated market.
I think Guild Wars 2’s success (at least compared to most MMOs released) is that it didn’t try to copy the WoW formula and tried to create a different kind of experience, which the core game still is.
I think there are more people tired of WoW than currently play WoW. That doesn’t mean they’re going to automatically like Guild Wars 2 though.
I think what Vayne is trying to say is… GW2 is still one of the most popular mmorpg on the market eventhough the game have been out for 2 years.
That being said just about every mmorpg is slowly leaking players. Very few can refill new players as fast as they lost.
this is not really true, most of the historical successful MMOs expanded before the contracted. WoW, FFXI, FFXIV RO EQ Lineage etc.
the bleeding usually comes later in the cycle after they have peaked.many mmos do bleed players, but those are generally not the ones that are seen as successful,
Right but I think you need to look at it in several ways. Some of the game in your list is asian focus market(lineage), which is very different market. Or very old games when there are not much competition. Or have failed lunch which redo their whole games. Or can’t be criticized because they are the most profitable mmorpg for the past 10 years.
What I’m trying to say is if you just look at western games, post wow era, there isn’t any games which wasn’t leaking players. I honestly just look at it as players being too demanding, and game developers just can’t keep up.
to be perfectly honest, most of the MMOs in recent years have been sub par. They get numbers because people want the new thing, but they are not designed and maintained that well.
essentially i think they bleed players because they arent that good at what they are trying to do.
And you’re only making an assumption that that’s the reason why they bleed players. But that’s not necessarily a warranted assumption. Rift wasn’t really a badly designed MMO even though I didn’t like what it was pushing. What it pushed was more WoWness which was playing to a saturated market.
I think Guild Wars 2’s success (at least compared to most MMOs released) is that it didn’t try to copy the WoW formula and tried to create a different kind of experience, which the core game still is.
I think there are more people tired of WoW than currently play WoW. That doesn’t mean they’re going to automatically like Guild Wars 2 though.
i hated rift within the first 30 minutes. so i cant really comment on rift.
but what im saying is good games rise to the top.
For example, when street fighter 2 blew up the scene there was years of cheap fighters that followed, most couldnt compare, because they just werent that good.
there were tons of fake mario games, most sucked.
What im saying is a lot of these mmos that dont last, thats just the nature of games, few games are good enough to rise to the top.
(edited by phys.7689)
Dude this game getting beat by Diablo III, that game sucks… Well when I played it when it launched, not sure if it got any better though maybe I should check. Diablo II will always be my fav tho.
I’m a little surprised that The Elder Scrolls Online isn’t even on any of those lists and that Star Wars The Old Republic is on them, that game sucked too from what I remember and that sucked so bad it went F2P or B2P, whatever.
Kind of wonder if TESO will go F2P or B2P, I actually want to try it out being an Elder Scrolls fan…. MORROWIND the best Elder Scrolls game that I’ve played!
But back to topic, being beat by Diablo III in 2 of those 3 links, pretty embarrassing if you ask me.
Did we really need another thread about what the GW2 population is? These threads are all the same, with the same posters saying the same kitten on both sides of the issue. Y’all should just give up posting this stuff, and come back when and if you get any real data.
I’m normally happy to support anyone’s right to express an opinion. However, none of you have any real, significant data that’s any better than the anecdote I could offer about several zone instances closing in succession after world boss pinata time. Further, “It is…” and “It isn’t…” aren’t exactly productive topics of discussion about the game.
This thread should be closed.
I think what Vayne is trying to say is… GW2 is still one of the most popular mmorpg on the market eventhough the game have been out for 2 years.
That being said just about every mmorpg is slowly leaking players. Very few can refill new players as fast as they lost.
this is not really true, most of the historical successful MMOs expanded before the contracted. WoW, FFXI, FFXIV RO EQ Lineage etc.
the bleeding usually comes later in the cycle after they have peaked.many mmos do bleed players, but those are generally not the ones that are seen as successful,
Right but I think you need to look at it in several ways. Some of the game in your list is asian focus market(lineage), which is very different market. Or very old games when there are not much competition. Or have failed lunch which redo their whole games. Or can’t be criticized because they are the most profitable mmorpg for the past 10 years.
What I’m trying to say is if you just look at western games, post wow era, there isn’t any games which wasn’t leaking players. I honestly just look at it as players being too demanding, and game developers just can’t keep up.
to be perfectly honest, most of the MMOs in recent years have been sub par. They get numbers because people want the new thing, but they are not designed and maintained that well.
essentially i think they bleed players because they arent that good at what they are trying to do.
And you’re only making an assumption that that’s the reason why they bleed players. But that’s not necessarily a warranted assumption. Rift wasn’t really a badly designed MMO even though I didn’t like what it was pushing. What it pushed was more WoWness which was playing to a saturated market.
I think Guild Wars 2’s success (at least compared to most MMOs released) is that it didn’t try to copy the WoW formula and tried to create a different kind of experience, which the core game still is.
I think there are more people tired of WoW than currently play WoW. That doesn’t mean they’re going to automatically like Guild Wars 2 though.
i hated rift within the first 30 minutes. so i cant really comment on rift.
but what im saying is good games rise to the top.
For example, when street fighter 2 blew up the scene there was years of cheap fighters that followed, most couldnt compare, because they just werent that good.there were tons of fake mario games, most sucked.
What im saying is a lot of these mmos that dont last, thats just the nature of games, few games are good enough to rise to the top.
You’re making generalizations though and trying to apply it to a specific genre of game, that is by nature different from all other games.
MMOs are more complicated and have more divided player bases than any other genre of game.
People who enjoy 3D shooters tend to like to kill stuff. People who play racing games like to drive fast. People who play single player RPGs tend to like stories.
MMOs cost more to make than those games and try to cater to a mixed audience. It’s not targeted in the same way. So you can’t really compare this genre to others.
For example, I would never play Street Fighter 2, period. Not my thing. The people who play it expect a very specific activity. Sure it’s good..but it only has to be good at a couple of things. MMOs require balance…unless they’re very niche MMOs. If you’re trying to appeal to a mass audience, you’re starting off behind the eight ball.
There are no good MMOs because people have unreasonable expectations of MMOs. I’m not sure how many people get thousands of hours out of Street Fighter, but I do know that Skyrim you could play for hundreds of hours. Which isn’t enough for an MMO. And that’s very much the exception to the rule. Tombraider might give you 20 hours (probably less). It’s just not fair to compair non-MMOs to MMOs particularly in regard to your expectation of them.
Looking at the reddit active view numbers now:
GW2: 447
FF 14: 778
Archeage: 640
Interesting enough, there’s lots of GW2 reddit subscribers, yet their traffic is impressively low compared to the traffic to number of subscribers ratio:
http://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/about/traffic/
http://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/about/traffic/
http://www.reddit.com/r/archeage/about/traffic/
Unique traffic this month (October)
GW2: 410,097
FF14: 513,682
Archeage: 961,378
Looking at the reddit active view numbers now:
GW2: 447
FF 14: 778
Archeage: 640Interesting enough, there’s lots of GW2 reddit subscribers, yet their traffic is impressively low compared to the traffic to number of subscribers ratio:
http://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/about/traffic/
http://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/about/traffic/
http://www.reddit.com/r/archeage/about/traffic/Unique traffic this month (October)
GW2: 410,097
FF14: 513,682
Archeage: 961,378
That thing fluctuates a lot though. Try going back few months to the time of living story if you can.
Looking at the reddit active view numbers now:
GW2: 447
FF 14: 778
Archeage: 640Interesting enough, there’s lots of GW2 reddit subscribers, yet their traffic is impressively low compared to the traffic to number of subscribers ratio:
http://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/about/traffic/
http://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/about/traffic/
http://www.reddit.com/r/archeage/about/traffic/Unique traffic this month (October)
GW2: 410,097
FF14: 513,682
Archeage: 961,378That thing fluctuates a lot though. Try going back few months to the time of living story if you can.
Ok, but you can see it on the page yourself, but I suppose I can post the numbers here.
Archeage skipped, obviously because it wasn’t released.
Unique traffic by month (2014):
GW2:
August 626,576 (Living Story)
July 576,472 (Living Story)
June 529,590
May 619,891
April 586,788
March 580,467 (Living Story)
February 534,457 (Living Story)
January 543,282 (Living Story)
FF14:
August 720,962
July 743,345
June 645,430
May 665,302
April 682,414
March 612,954
February 590,915
January 697,025
So FF14 has more traffic regardless of month this year.
So, according to the supposed (supposed because we have no proof that X-Fire or any of the others’ numbers are accurate) facts GW2 has a few hundred players. Everything else on either side is speculation.
Personally I think that GW2 has more than three or four hundred(ish) players, but the facts presented only support that ballpark.
Looking at the reddit active view numbers now:
GW2: 447
FF 14: 778
Archeage: 640Interesting enough, there’s lots of GW2 reddit subscribers, yet their traffic is impressively low compared to the traffic to number of subscribers ratio:
http://www.reddit.com/r/Guildwars2/about/traffic/
http://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/about/traffic/
http://www.reddit.com/r/archeage/about/traffic/Unique traffic this month (October)
GW2: 410,097
FF14: 513,682
Archeage: 961,378
Yet at any given time, all day long,. 2 years on, Guild Wars 2 hangs with the best of them. It’s like WoW. I can guarantee you more people have stopped playing WoW completely than are now playing WoW, probably several times over. So?
Guild Wars 2 is 2 years old. In 2 years will Archeage have that kind of traffic. Do you want to compare Guild Wars 2 launch month to Archeages? I didn’t think so.
As for FF…it’s usually lower in traffic than Guild Wars 2 and I’ve checked a number of times. However, whether it’s higher or lower was never really my point.
My point is that there are people on these forums, over the course of many threads, who can do nothing but say this game is dead, this game is dying, this game is on life support or whatever phrase they want to try to imply this game isn’t doing well.
And my answer is this game is doing pretty much as well as any MMORPG on the PC, with the exception of WoW. Other than that, if we’re no doing well no MMORPG is.
So, according to the supposed (supposed because we have no proof that X-Fire or any of the others’ numbers are accurate) facts GW2 has a few hundred players. Everything else on either side is speculation.
Personally I think that GW2 has more than three or four hundred(ish) players, but the facts presented only support that ballpark.
I have no proof that Xfire is accurate. But we know for a fact that Guild Wars has more than hundreds of players because there are multiple maps with hundreds of players all doing stuff at the same time. For example, even when there were queues for the top servers during the WvW tournament, there were still multiple zones doing the Fire Ele.
I have no proof that three different sites that track numbers are tracking numbers? lol
Okay you have no proof there are less players in the game now than there were six months ago.
And since this thread is in response to people who are saying the game is dead with no proof, I’d take this “proof” over their proof.
And again, Anet didn’t have anyone laid off when NcSoft was restructuring. One would think if it was dead they would have.