Guild Wars 2

And they have always been, since the original Guild Wars. This was for a very good reason back then – warriors were useful in PvE, sure, but they were the best PvP profession, combining a lot of power with the need to be skilled in order to use them properly:

• They had the highest sustained DPS in the game

• They had Frenzy, a stance that increased attack speed by 33% but increased damage received by 50%; using it at the right moment and cancelling at the right moment was a key skill in PvP

• They had Bull’s Strike, an attack that knocks down a foe, but only if said foe is moving

• They had ample access to Deep Wound, a condition that reduces a character’s maximum health by 20%, and reduces any incoming health by 20%

• More importantly, warriors were all about positioning. A warrior had to attack a target in order to build adrenaline to use the really powerful skills; those were all in melee range, so in order to go for a kill the warrior had to move close to the real target. In other hand, a lone warrior who went deep within enemy lines to hit a foe would risk overextending, going beyond the reach of the support characters (usually a Monk) and thus not only dying, but also exposing the support character to enemy attack.

With all those traits, warriors were the profession that required the most skill in GW1, and which gave the biggest rewards. Many of the best PvPers in GW1 used warriors, yet a team of 8 warriors would never win anything serious since they lacked other necessary team roles. It’s easy to understand why warriors were ArenaNet’s favourite profession.

In Guild Wars 2, the idea was likely to introduce the same concept – make warriors the most skill-demanding yet one of the most powerful professions in PvP. One of the main ArenaNet PvP designers has always made public appearances in game with his warrior, for example. I’m sure they put a lot of work in the warrior…

…And they failed miserably. Warriors are the “easy mode” profession in PvE, but they are seen as rather weak in PvP.

Now, I know the reading comprehension isn’t the brighest one in the world around these parts, so I don’t expect most people who reply to this topic to think it’s anything more than a “OMG warriors are imba! Nerf plz!” post. But the real issue behind ArenaNet’s failure to make warriors what they were in GW1 is how the combat system in GW2 is extremely flawed.

All those aspects in GW1 that required a lot of skill, like stance cancelling and the precision required to effectively use Bull’s Strike? Gone from GW2. The importance of positioning? Gone. Overextending, in the meaning of moving too far away from the backline, doesn’t really exist in GW2 since support is so weak that there is no use for support-focused characters. Conditions as important as DeepWound? Gone, due to how the entire buff and debuff system isn’t as relevant now.

All those important party roles that had to surround a warrior in order to allow him to succeed? Gone.

Now, I’m strongly against a trinity based system. I don’t want healers back in GW2, and we never really had tanks in GW1, so I definitely don’t want them now.

But the real issue with the game is how everything other than DPS is borderline useless. Control and Support are so weak that ArenaNet itself cannot find any way to make warriors useful in PvP other than increasing their damage patch after patch. That’s not going to work. While in the original Guild Wars a profession could be made more powerful by giving it more utility, in GW2 said utility is so weak that it’s irrelevant.

Yet ArenaNet has not noticed any of this. Even when creating the game with the intention to make warriors as brilliant as they were in the original Guild Wars, they have failed to acknowledge how there needs to be a full spectrum of team roles – which doesn’t need to be DPS and healing, it could very well be control and damage and support – in order for the game to work. No wonder sPvP is the failure it is in the game right now.

Nope. Thief. It’s that simple.

TL;DR version: Warriors are powerful when using HB on mobs that don’t move.

But in all seriousness, I really missed how Wars were in GW1. They should’ve had stances as the mechanic rather than burst. Something like; F1; You deal x% more damage, but take x% more damage while in this stance. F2; You deal x% less damage, but take x% less damage while in this stance. Only one stance can be active at a time.

Of course Warriors deal the most DPS, that’s what they’re supposed to do.
Of course, the problem is, everyone’s a generic DPS in this game.

Tru Reptile.6058:

TL;DR version: Warriors are powerful when using HB on mobs that don’t move.

This, and when conditions only stack to 25, and control has little effect on the toughest bosses. Nothing is rewarded in PVE except direct damage – not the fault of the warrior class, just bad mob design.

Erasculio.2914:

and we never really had tanks in GW1, so I definitely don’t want them now.

Wat?

We had plenty of tanks in GW1… Pretty much every Elite area in the game revolved around them… Before the Shadow Form buff, it were mainly Ele/Warrior tanks that were bonded that did the tanking. After the buff, we had Terra tanks in UW, FoW and pretty much every EotN dungeon. Normal tank and spank tanks in DoA, FoW, Urgoz, Deep (although Deep never really had Shadow Form tanks). Eventually even Rangers got to tank due to Whirling Defense being insanely OP.

Did you play the same game I did?

And, I’d like to point out to everyone that keeps whining about how OP warriors are that it’s not the warriors that are OP. They just happen to do decent DPS, but lack decent defensive utility. This is why they suck in PvP.

The problem with Warriors is the fact that PvE is built in such a way that it favors pure DPS over everything else, which is why warriors shine.

Nerf warrior DPS and the next best DPS build will just take their place. And then people will be whining about how OP the new DPS class is. Rince and repeat until everything does terrible damage and every dungeon path takes an hour to complete.

rfdarko.4639:

Nothing is rewarded in PVE except direct damage – not the fault of the warrior class, just bad mob design.

I’m not sure if it’s just bad mob design, or if it’s an issue in the entire combat system.

Bright.9160:

Erasculio.2914:

and we never really had tanks in GW1, so I definitely don’t want them now.

Wat?

Tanks as in the classic “Taunt” MMO mechanic, in which a character could use skills to control who monsters would attack. We actually had that for a very short while in GW1 (the “gear trick” in Sorrow’s Furnace).

Erasculio.2914:

Tanks as in the classic “Taunt” MMO mechanic, in which a character could use skills to control who monsters would attack. We actually had that for a very short while in GW1 (the “gear trick” in Sorrow’s Furnace).

Why would you use a taunt mechanic on a tank when you can just send in the tank to aggro everything, ball them up and have the rest of the team spike from a distance? Hence tank and spank.

Actually, we did have the taunt mechanic, it just wasn’t used much. Depending on which mob you would be tanking, you had to swap to melee weapons or caster weapons in order to draw their aggro for example. Or, like they did in UW or DoA sometimes, have the E/Mo who was tanking Dhuum or Veil take of all their clothes. That way foes would never break/Dhuum wouldn’t go for the team in the back and stay on the E/Mo for example.

Wasn’t as much Taunt as abusing AI though.

Could the OP have possibly thought of a worse title for this thread? Seriously, that title followed by a ton of writing that few will actually read; the thread is destined to be derailed.

On topic, I agree that this game is pretty much failed to create a variety of roles. We all just do dps and more dps.

Warriors in GW1 were probably the easiest class to play and had the lowest skill cap. They aren’t weak in sPvP, I wreck people all day. What makes them a liability is that they are too easy to kill when focus fired by an enemy team and can easily have their attacking efficiency negated by conditions in which the Warrior has no way to remove.

Only in PvE…

Overall Guardians & Mesmers must be Anets golden children because both have been well balanced and perfectly playable in every aspect of GW2 for sometime now.

All the other classes at some point or another feel the nerf/buff/move everything around bats on a fairly regular basis…

Theplayboy.6417:

Warriors in GW1 were probably the easiest class to play and had the lowest skill cap. They aren’t weak in sPvP, I wreck people all day. What makes them a liability is that they are too easy to kill when focus fired by an enemy team and can easily have their attacking efficiency negated by conditions in which the Warrior has no way to remove.

Warriors in GW1 PvP were easy to learn, hard to master…

You had some of the best PvP’ers that could land a Bull’s Strike every time for spikes etc.

Not to mention quad stepping…

Warriors being Masters’ of dps’ in mmo’s isn’t nothing new.

Look at this; any class can easily kill a warrior; in fact yesterday, i killed a fully-geared berserk warrior 1v1 in wvw with a ranger.

Warrior had received a lot of nerfs since release; even their food consumption was nerfed.

I don’t play Warrior but i always Respected and Honored this class for being the front runner in battles; they Deserved to be highly geared with outputting high damage.

Now

Compare that to a thief

who can easily do what a warrior do, 2x-4xx times with equipping stealth; Cheater

whose the only class been favored with nerf-rewarding; nerf>buffs patches; Favoritism

whose the only class in the game that isn’t easily killed by any high-powerful class ; Imbalance class mechanic

Finally

The only class who has the single highest dps in the game >puts Warrior to Shame.

whose the only class that can reset a fight at will ; Unfair class balance.

The only class the Majority of Arenanet Adores and will silence and Punish anyone who complains about them/

Seriously ask yourself this;

Who is the only class among the classes that gets players the most Infractions in the forums for complaining against them? (see closed/deleted posts/threads)

Who is the only class/profession that that can Enter and Exit 12-30+ zerg without a scratch or dying?

Warrior? Nope
Mesmer? Nope
Ranger? Nope
Elementalist? Nope
Guardian? Nope
Engineer? Nope
Thief? of course!! Yes.

Now who is Arena net Favorite Profession/class?

The Only One

Thief

Warriors problem is nothing more than lack of condition removal. One chill, snare, root, and they are done. Until they get something that can remove conditions that keep them at bay consistently, they will continue to be cannon fodder to other classes.

warrior, yes. and thief too. and they obviously hate ranger…..

rfdarko.4639:

Tru Reptile.6058:

TL;DR version: Warriors are powerful when using HB on mobs that don’t move.

This, and when conditions only stack to 25, and control has little effect on the toughest bosses. Nothing is rewarded in PVE except direct damage – not the fault of the warrior class, just bad mob design.

Pretty sure Torment will buff up the damage by a nice notch for necromancers, thieves and mesmers that want to go condition spec.

As for mob farming if you manage to hit 3-4 times with whatever instant ability you have you’ll get credit for it no matter how much dps it does. (considerably lower when there’s alot of damage being done by multiple classes)

If they keep this up as it is, im pretty sure they can balance it out

The rule is every class that you do not play often is the makers of the games favorite class in any game hehe.

i think its the mesmer.. The problem is the majority dont play them. Look at their skills set and how well they can be played with. The new balance patch has buffed them instead of nerfing them like other classes.

Burnfall.9573:

Who is the only class/profession that that can Enter and Exit 12-30+ zerg without a scratch or dying?

Warrior? Nope
Mesmer? Nope
Ranger? Nope
Elementalist? Nope
Guardian? Nope
Engineer? Nope
Thief? of course!! Yes.

Go roll a thief, level it to 80 and do just that. Good luck!

price

15-20+ zerg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2W4CoZEeI0

I won’t roll a thief

I Believe in fair play.

I Don’t Cheat

than

why is the thief the only class who can?

know what? damage nerf next patch! and stunbreak for everyone to make sure warriors stay at the bottom!

havoc.6814:

On topic, I agree that this game is pretty much failed to create a variety of roles. We all just do dps and more dps.

The variety of roles exist, it’s the reason to use them that’s absent. Why bother with a support, crowd control, or condition build when direct damage gets the job done so much quicker?

Burnfall.9573:

price

15-20+ zerg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2W4CoZEeI0

I won’t roll a thief

I Believe in fair play.

I Don’t Cheat

than

why is the thief the only class who can?

Ok, I watched the video and don’t understand your point about the thief. What I saw was a fragile class, often on the verge of death, doing mediocre damage with a shortbow.

The OP thief most people talk about is the roamer/duelist. Before the reveal nerf this was always a glass cannon d/d thief, a walking opener, that without cooldowns up was usually going to be noted for their great acumen in the ways of exiting battle. Occasionally, a skilled thief would hang around and be annoying…on cooldown. Thieves have their niche but are certainly not a favored profession, especially in general PvE.

And, according to the leaked patch notes (if legit), warriors shouldn’t be secure in any presumed favored class. I do agree with the OP on the lack of meaningful combat roles being an overall problem. Meaningful roles are the first thing humans address in any group activity be it a scavenger hunt or brain surgery. We shouldn’t expect games to be any different.

The GW1 Warrior design philosophy seemed to be that it would have the highest DPS of any class, out of the gate. But that every other class would have stacks of abilities designed to shut down warriors. Played well, you could reduce a warrior to a guy standing there with a lolipop…

So every class also had abilities designed to remove the conditions stacked on their team’s warriors.

And even in PvE many runs were reduced to a battle of adjusting the buffs and conditions on each side’s warriors… who stood there trying to hit each other with sticks that were either nerf bats or portable nukes, and they had no ability to control which other than to hope their mates were fast enough in propping them up…

I was not so fond of that model, though it did teach me how to “tank” in a game without tanks… which is a surprisingly useful edge to have when you get to a game with tanks, as it lets you know some tricks about aggro and pull control that people who just spam taunt buttons and mitigation cooldowns never learn.

(and is also why I can almost tank in GW2, and find the warrior is actually better at this than the guardian.).

The design for the warrior in GW2 seems inspired by the notion of fixing the flaws in the GW1 design model. But its not fully hit the mark.

Its ended up being easy enough to play competently, hard to master (note the number of people who will claim it cannot be tanky – which shows a lack of expertise). Its also still the mega-DPS choice, but because players in this game have not considered the CC/condition game enough – the stripping down of this does not come into play enough. And in PvE, the warrior is good enough at self-removing these shutdowns without even using cooldowns that players often miss that it is even going on.

(If you take your warrior down the tanky path, you will start to notice it, as being tanky requires a LOT of focus on both you and your targets boons, conditions, and interrupts while still maintaining very high DPS).

Its hard to say where the class needs adjustment though.

If you go back to GW1, you might find that Warrior is still the most popular class. You could ‘run anything’ with one – it was the easiest class to be competent in, but it was also the hardest class to be good at.

I personally think the same is true here. I don’t think the warrior is actually the best class – but that class mastery in the player base is low enough that people have yet to find where the other classes shine. Just like in GW1… But that game was around long enough that people did finally figure out how to master the remaining choices…

I agree with you OP, by trying to remove the trinity they also removed any kind of party based tactics. Imagine trying to play chess with only pawns or only kings. This meta then now supports DPS only, I want to gouge my eyes out when I see a guardian/mesmer with a staff in my party or any condition speced player.

Is so simple, https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/gw2/A-sadly-but-true-joke/first#post2263811

Zepidel.5349:

I agree with you OP, by trying to remove the trinity they also removed any kind of party based tactics. Imagine trying to play chess with only pawns or only kings. This meta then now supports DPS only, I want to gouge my eyes out when I see a guardian/mesmer with a staff in my party or any condition speced player.

The reason so many people spec Zerker for PvE and get away with it isn’t because of the lack of trinity, it’s that boss fights are simply too easy and don’t do anything to counter these tactics.

ANet should seriously consider calling SNK for tips. because none of the bosses in this game keep me on my toes. We NEED harder content once in a while.

Of course, if we make dungeons harder, people will just whine about it being too difficult…

Back on topic, as a warrior myself, anyone who says that ANet favors warriors over anyone else has clearly never played one. Go make a warrior and play them in Spvp or WvW for a day, then come back and tell me they’re OP with a straight face.

If leaks are real:

Worst Profession in PvP:
Warrior.

Worst Profession in PvE:
Warrior.

Nope! Mesmers are.

Didn’t read all but warriors are OP because is the most played profession in all games. Most noobs/newbs are unable to learn anything beyond 1-key-smashing and warriors are the perfect example of that and therefore, they are perfect to attract that kind of players (if games were designed to attract skilled players, that game will go offline very soon due lack of profits). Also, being able of kill anything with 1 single hit give those players the illusion of being good players, A.K.A, the so-called pros (very bad players who think the contrary).
And since those kind of players are the more willing to spend money in a game, well, you can see why warrios are OP.

Daecollo.9578:

If leaks are real:

Worst Profession in PvP:
Warrior.

Worst Profession in PvE:
Ranger.

Fix’d

Nick.6972:

Of course Warriors deal the most DPS, that’s what they’re supposed to do.
Of course, the problem is, everyone’s a generic DPS in this game.

This is true but lets face it, all professions should be equally viable in all situations without the trinity. I’m not suggesting we have boring duplicates but more having the limitations of other professions removed and for the love of Christ, PvP separate from PvE.

It took 8 months to get right click targetting optional. Maybe if we moan more we can get ignored louder?

These threads…Warriors were definitely good in GW1 but idk if they were the best. We had tanks and “favorite classes” for times and there wasn’t balance in GW1. The assassin was the chosen class for a long time with shadow form(you literally couldn’t die). Doing underworld? perma shadow form. Fissure of woe? shadow form…Shards of orr…shadow form. Caster parties became broken as they just ran over everything (minions tank, throw conditions on mobs, spike spike spike with discord necros). It’s never balanced.

OP wants warriors to be buffed, made more skillful and balance? There will never be balance in pve or pvp. You want DPS? Go warrior. You want spike damage? Go thief. You want to sit on a point? Go bunker. If they nerf warrior in pve and buff them in pvp then the meta dynamic will change and something will take it’s place in dungeons.

Quarktastic.1027:

Daecollo.9578:

If leaks are real:

Worst Profession in PvP:
Warrior.

Worst Profession in PvE:
Ranger.

Fix’d

Are you joking? Rangers even after the nerf can now get easy 25 stacks of might on there pets, the pets may have suffered a damage nerf but there other pets actually got buffed.

Erasculio.2914:

Now, I know the reading comprehension isn’t the brighest one in the world around these parts,

I dont understand wat u mean, can u rephrase that?

Khal Drogo.9631:

Erasculio.2914:

Now, I know the reading comprehension isn’t the brighest one in the world around these parts,

I dont understand wat u mean, can u rephrase that?

Probably people who read a few words then post a reply

A lot of people is not even reading the thread, they read the title and then quickly rush to put “yes warriors are OP” …

You should change the topic title for the sake of the thread.

Theplayboy.6417:

Warriors in GW1 were probably the easiest class to play and had the lowest skill cap.

LMFAO

data.4093:

then the meta dynamic will change and something will take it’s place in dungeons.

And this is what the “OMG, nurf worrs pl0x, worors OP lol” crowd seems to fail to realize. If they nerf warriors, the next best DPS class will just take their place.

Unless Anet fixes PvE, there will always be a strongest PvE class, and people will always have something to whine about.

I think what made warrior balanced in gw1, while still having massive damage was the hex system. pve mobs used them, requiring support from your backline in order to pull out that dps.

In pvp, warriors were a threat and HAD to be shut down or controlled. Also, wars had to think VERY carefully about their positioning. You wanted to put pressure on the casters of course, but in order to do that you had to overextend in the enemy lines, leaving you alone, far from the monks and vulnerable to being shut down or spiked.

All positioning is gone now. Need for support and class interaction is gone, because anet didn’t want to force group compositions, to keep it more casual. All the variety with cross class builds is also gone, so no more w/n with plague touch (transfer conditions to melee enemy) w/e with chain knockdowns, w/r with pets and so on.

Stances and adrenaline skills are also gone, and with them a big part of the skill ceiling.

All we have left is the “core” of the profession. Huge dps, low ability to remove conditions. Turns out, thats not enough in pvp where everyone plays for himself, and more than enough in pve, where control and support are dead.

I’d happily suggest changes, but imho we’re beyond the point of nerf/buff… only a GOOD expansion (new skills, traits, mechanics, pve enemies with control skills) could give back some of the depth wars had in gw1 :\

People saying the easiest class in GW1 was the warrior clearly never played a Spirit ritualist, drop the spirits, run away, watch the spirits kill everything.

People saying we had no tanks in GW1? We even had builds that were built around having so low health that a single enchantment would outheal everything.. the 55hp builds were definitly tanks.

Daecollo.9578:

Quarktastic.1027:

Daecollo.9578:

If leaks are real:

Worst Profession in PvP:
Warrior.

Worst Profession in PvE:
Ranger.

Fix’d

Are you joking? Rangers even after the nerf can now get easy 25 stacks of might on there pets, the pets may have suffered a damage nerf but there other pets actually got buffed.

That won’t change the fact that we have sustained DPS and still won’t be easily accepted in dungeon groups. The lack of Trinity results in a game where Dps/Burst Damage is god. Hence player with sustained DPS are kind of … useless for most people.

Enewia.1356:

That won’t change the fact that we have sustained DPS and still won’t be easily accepted in dungeon groups. The lack of Trinity results in a game where Dps/Burst Damage is god. Hence player with sustained DPS are kind of … useless for most people.

No, the reason some groups avoid rangers are more than your DPS being ‘sustained’.

It’s because your DPS is trash in comparison to almost every other class in the game. Your spirits are situational and die too fast to be useful. Your pets are a liability in most dungeons due to terrible AI and aggro issues.

And, mainly: most Rangers you encounter are longbow camping cowards who stay in the backline and effectively leech off the rest of the team and bring almost nothing to show for it. Their only decent melee options are clunky as hell, their cleave damage sucks, their sword autoattack feels about as smooth as trying to dial your phone using oven mitts and they rely on their stupid pets for damage as well.

That’s why people don’t want you in dungeons. Not because your damage is ‘sustained’ instead of burst. Skills in GW2 have such a short cooldown in general that there isn’t something like sustained vs Burst and most high damage builds rely on rotations. In a sustained fight you’ll still be outdone by Warriors, Eles, Thieves, Guardians, Mesmers, Necro’s and Engineers anyway.

If you rolled a ranger for dungeon PvE, you wasted your time and the best option is to just reroll something that is actually useful.

Until the day they give the option to stow away your pet completely, and give the ranger DPS a boost for doing so and fix the sword autoattack, I’m not taking a ranger on my runs ever.

Bright.9160:

Enewia.1356:

That won’t change the fact that we have sustained DPS and still won’t be easily accepted in dungeon groups. The lack of Trinity results in a game where Dps/Burst Damage is god. Hence player with sustained DPS are kind of … useless for most people.

No, the reason some groups avoid rangers are more than your DPS being ‘sustained’.

It’s because your DPS is trash in comparison to almost every other class in the game. Your spirits are situational and die too fast to be useful. Your pets are a liability in most dungeons due to terrible AI and aggro issues.

And, mainly: most Rangers you encounter are longbow camping cowards who stay in the backline and effectively leech off the rest of the team and bring almost nothing to show for it. Their only decent melee options are clunky as hell, their cleave damage sucks, their sword autoattack feels about as smooth as trying to dial your phone using oven mitts and they rely on their stupid pets for damage as well.

That’s why people don’t want you in dungeons. Not because your damage is ‘sustained’ instead of burst. Skills in GW2 have such a short cooldown in general that there isn’t something like sustained vs Burst and most high damage builds rely on rotations. In a sustained fight you’ll still be outdone by Warriors, Eles, Thieves, Guardians, Mesmers, Necro’s and Engineers anyway.

If you rolled a ranger for dungeon PvE, you wasted your time and the best option is to just reroll something that is actually useful.

Until the day they give the option to stow away your pet completely, and give the ranger DPS a boost for doing so and fix the sword autoattack, I’m not taking a ranger on my runs ever.

Bright nailed it in his post. Well done!

BTW, I am NOT one of those tantrum throwing, “Rangers are broken and worthless” screaming noobs that you see on the forums. Actually, in many aspects of the game, Rangers are pretty solid (overland PvE, WvW ) and contribute nicely. But as far as dungeons go, Bright’s post nailed it.

Burnfall.9573:

price

15-20+ zerg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o2W4CoZEeI0

I won’t roll a thief

I Believe in fair play.

I Don’t Cheat

than

why is the thief the only class who can?

Then you will never understand the thief…. or really get a good win for that matter.

Bright.9160:

Enewia.1356:

That won’t change the fact that we have sustained DPS and still won’t be easily accepted in dungeon groups. The lack of Trinity results in a game where Dps/Burst Damage is god. Hence player with sustained DPS are kind of … useless for most people.

No, the reason some groups avoid rangers are more than your DPS being ‘sustained’.

It’s because your DPS is trash in comparison to almost every other class in the game. Your spirits are situational and die too fast to be useful. Your pets are a liability in most dungeons due to terrible AI and aggro issues.

And, mainly: most Rangers you encounter are longbow camping cowards who stay in the backline and effectively leech off the rest of the team and bring almost nothing to show for it. Their only decent melee options are clunky as hell, their cleave damage sucks, their sword autoattack feels about as smooth as trying to dial your phone using oven mitts and they rely on their stupid pets for damage as well.

That’s why people don’t want you in dungeons. Not because your damage is ‘sustained’ instead of burst. Skills in GW2 have such a short cooldown in general that there isn’t something like sustained vs Burst and most high damage builds rely on rotations. In a sustained fight you’ll still be outdone by Warriors, Eles, Thieves, Guardians, Mesmers, Necro’s and Engineers anyway.

If you rolled a ranger for dungeon PvE, you wasted your time and the best option is to just reroll something that is actually useful.

Until the day they give the option to stow away your pet completely, and give the ranger DPS a boost for doing so and fix the sword autoattack, I’m not taking a ranger on my runs ever.

I agree with all you said. I just used sustained because that is what rangers trying to defend our class and pretending it isn’t kittened up in Dungeon.
I didn’t chose Ranger to dungeon. It’s my main and well I use it in dungeon because that is the only class I don’t mind playing hours without feeling bored. But apart from elitist there is a lot of groups that allow rangers.
If I need to farm CoF 1 I will use my war because, even though I hate its dumb gameplay it is one of the best class to dungeon, sadly.
Though Guardian seems like a lot of fun

Bright.9160:

Until the day they give the option to stow away your pet completely, and give the ranger DPS a boost for doing so and fix the sword autoattack, I’m not taking a ranger on my runs ever.

It’s funny, in the context of this topic, that the so-called “fix” to rangers is basically to turn them into warriors.

Erasculio.2914:

Bright.9160:

Until the day they give the option to stow away your pet completely, and give the ranger DPS a boost for doing so and fix the sword autoattack, I’m not taking a ranger on my runs ever.

It’s funny, in the context of this topic, that the so-called “fix” to rangers is basically to turn them into warriors.

Well, if you think about it… Rangers are just bad warriors that have to carry around a pants-on-head-retrded pet with them.

They have similar buffs (Might, Fury), but can’t supply it as effectively. They do less damage both in melee and ranged, their melee weapons suck, their cleave is terrible etc.

The only thing they have over warriors is better survivability, condi removal and they have traps and spirits which, in dungeons, are about as useful as aids.

Don’t get me wrong though, Rangers are amazing in sPvP and can be semi-useful in WvW. It’s just that I don’t do sPvP much, and I never WvW, so I don’t care about their usefulness in those areas. And the fact that they’re so strong in PvP is the big reason why they suck in PvE. Anet balances around PvP, and often forget the impact it might have in PvE, or they underestimate it.

Bright.9160:

And the fact that they’re so strong in PvP is the big reason why they suck in PvE. Anet balances around PvP, and often forget the impact it might have in PvE, or they underestimate it.

^This

Pet damage got nerfed because BM Bunker build did “too much damage” in Pvp. As if they weren’t already useless in PvE, now they tickle and are only 10 second meat shield. Though Anet tried to compensate with might, will see what how it will end but they force us to take a trait in order to have semi-useful pet.

I hate when people say that warriors are the worst profession in sPvP and WvW. That’s exactly why I develope my own builds and prove people wrong. Warriors are great, but only behind the hands of a skilled player. Most every warrior I see has the same zerk-or-nothing PvE build and they think it’ll be the same in PvP/WvW. We have excellent conditions and with the right setup, even better condition removal. BM rangers are still the only class I have issues with simply because their pets do everything for them, including tons of damage, and their shortbows have 1200 range and let them stand back and stack bleeds by mashing 1. That isn’t skill in my book. That’s a cookie-cutter build that’s overused because it’s OP, and I’ll be glad to see it nerfed in the next patch.

It is a problem to have on profession do significantly more DPS than all the others when DPS is the only genre of profession (class) in an MMO.

Every profession should be capable of similar DPS output in at least 1 or 2 various builds. Right now many professions are nothing more than an anchor in PVE. Hey want challenging PVE in GW2? Take multiple rangers/necros in your group.