Guild Wars 2

Just curious, what everyone here thinks endgame content entails.

For me, it’s playable content that, when you finished, makes you feel like you’ve really accomplished something. For example, earning the Tequatl and Evolved Jungle Wurm titles when they first came out or getting my Mini Clockheart.

I loved questing/farming Arah for all my tokens for a full set of Arah armor before the PvP-reward tracks cheapened dungeon armor, then again the stacking/speed meta was already doing that, so I can’t really say it was all the PvP-reward track.

I love epic quests that when you completed, you get something that you can show off. Something that other players could respect or admire.

Too much of GW2 is rng or too easy to get. Legendaries are rng or gold base, it doesn’t really show others how amazing you are, except that you have a lot of gold or a lot of free time. Fractal weapons are all rng, I farmed L50 fractals every day for nearly a year and only got 1 skin. Dungeon armors used to be the thing, like a full set of Arah, CoE or even HotW was epic, but alas the speed-meta and especially the PvP-reward track made dungeon armors cheap.

Is there anything in this game that I could do and show off? Is my view of endgame in a MMO not right?

I’m really curious to know what you guys think endgame is.

These days, I avoid PvE and stick strictly to PvP and WvW.

EDIT: I’m seeing a lot of posts, which is always nice, for me EndGame starts when the personal story ends, does it not?

TP flipping, got it I my head that I want to have 100k gold.

MMOs focus on whatever their featured end-game is. In most cases, it’s raiding. That’s where they hide the biggest challenges and the best, shiniest gear. Those games often have little else, and if you’re more of a loner, then that endgame (which is only done by 2-10% of the population anyway) gets ignored.

A good MMO will at least give you more to do with your time: minigames, treasure hunts, solo/small team challenges, different races and classes to level, maybe even interesting crafting (which almost never happens). But in the end, an MMO is there as a huge time sink.

GW2 isn’t much different, except for the lack of large group content, and not so much on the minigame front.

Right now, a lot of the busywork has been shifted to Ascended crafting, lucking out on Legendary creation (which will soon change with HoT), achievement farming, and revisiting Living Story season 2.

So, yeah, it doesn’t sound like much. :\

It does feel like you might be confounding “endgame,” “challenge,” and “unique rewards.” It’s not a bad thing, really. GW2 could use some content that feels more challenging, and also some rewards that feel special.

You’ve done a lot, and you might be feeling burnout. Might be time to ease up, check in once in a while (daily login rewards, etc), and otherwise explore a new game or two in the meantime. Or commit to preparing for HoT in some fashion by finishing some world exploration on your alts or some other long term goal.

Whichever you choose, good luck.

If you want something to show off to people, the only thing to get right now imo would be full radiant/hellfire armor because you’ll need a crap ton of achievement points.

Teoman.3016:

If you want something to show off to people, the only thing to get right now imo would be full radiant/hellfire armor because you’ll need a crap ton of achievement points.

full set of hellfire already… AP isn’t really a bragging right anymore so I don’t put it on at all, I do have 6k permanent AP that I’m proud of and wish I could show off.

For me it’s content that when completed makes you feel like you’ve advanced that you’re moving up in the world or progressing. Like there was 50000 people ahead of you, but now that you’re capable of completing x there’s only 25000 ahead of you and so on,
Usually that entails ever increasing difficulty so that it’s a constant uphill battle (which is far more fun to the usual semiafk watching a movie at the same time play that makes up the majority of MMO play.).

It also provides rewards that allow you to stand out over people who farm or convert gold but may not be objectively good at the game where otherwise they might beat you due to sheer amounts of gold.

ChoChoBo.6503:

Teoman.3016:

If you want something to show off to people, the only thing to get right now imo would be full radiant/hellfire armor because you’ll need a crap ton of achievement points.

full set of hellfire already… AP isn’t really a bragging right anymore so I don’t put it on at all, I do have 6k permanent AP that I’m proud of and wish I could show off.

Agree that AP isn’t too much to brag about, but I was under the impression no one has full hellfire set yet. I thought it took at least 30K AP to get full set and highest seems to be only 28K so far.

If looking for something that will impress… that will depend on the players you’re trying to impress. Personally, I’ve never seen any gear in any MMO that would cause me to be impressed by another player.

As far as endgame, there really is none in GW2… or alternatively, everything is endgame in GW2. With the exception of spvp, nothing requires skill, and is accessible to practically everyone by design. There is hope that pve may get some “challenging” content in HoT, but we’ll just have to wait and see.

To me, endgame is going to each map saying, “LF a girlfriend, message me with details+hobbies!”. Best. Endgame. Ever.

Not really much end game in GW2 besides the glamor of your outfit. Silver Wastes is just to farm mats, Dry Top for a few trinkets or if you’re overly bored. The expansion is very much needed to give level 80 players more to do.

Endgame is when I turn the game off.

•Raids
•New story instances
•New Gear
•New race/Class
•New Dungeons
•Hard/ Extra Hard difficulty to existing content
•Raids
•New Pvp game modes/ maps

Sadly I only think 3 of these points will be added.

endgame is the end of the game, if an MMO is done right that will never be reached.

for me, it’s collecting. I love collecting stuff. And tbh, the only problem I have with collecting stuff in gw2 is that a lot of junk is unnattainable now, and a lot of it is simply buy it off the tp or buy it off the gemstore.

A good example of collecting to me would be the daedric artifacts from skyrim. each has a unique flavor quest to it and such that makes it enjoyable and not repetitive to collect. I would rather have that than “do silverwastes for a few hours” “buy item off TP”

Getting my characters to 80, getting them all in the appearances that I want them in with at least Elite gear, then doing whatever until the end of time. Probably work toward all the achievements.

Alts have always been ‘endgame’ for me. That’s why I feel new content should be distributed across all levels, from lowest to highest, not just tacked on at the ‘end’ for those with characters at the level cap.

Endgame.. would be to finish my current GW2 Goals: 20m karma, 100k Fractal relics. Then after that, 50k of each dungeon token. For now, I just AFK in lions arch, the true endgame.

Currently my end game is doing my daily then logging out.

Endgame is exactly what it says and therefore is when the game ends.
With regards to GW2 the game ends when one of these occurs:
1) The servers are permanently switched off.
2) You have done everything possible in the game and there are never going to be any more updates or expansions produced.
3) They introduce victory conditions and someone “wins”

Anything else isn’t actually “endgame” even if you call it by that title.

The concept of end game still seems weird to me because I think the game doesn’t end until you’ve done everything in it, so end game content is an oxymoron.

But given that most people say it’s anything you do after getting to the maximum level I suppose most of the game is end-game.

When I got to 80 on my first character I only had about 50% of the map completed, hadn’t finished my personal story, had never done WvW or PvP, hadn’t maxed any of the crafting professions, the living story was just getting going….I feel like getting to the maximum level in this game is more like finishing an extended tutorial, it’s not like the game ends and you start doing something else, more like you carry on as before but with much more freedom to do things in whatever order you want.

ChoChoBo.6503:

Just curious, what everyone here thinks endgame content entails.

For me, it’s playable content that, when you finished, makes you feel like you’ve really accomplished something. For example, earning the Tequatl and Evolved Jungle Wurm titles when they first came out or getting my Mini Clockheart.

I loved questing/farming Arah for all my tokens for a full set of Arah armor before the PvP-reward tracks cheapened dungeon armor, then again the stacking/speed meta was already doing that, so I can’t really say it was all the PvP-reward track.

I love epic quests that when you completed, you get something that you can show off. Something that other players could respect or admire.

Too much of GW2 is rng or too easy to get. Legendaries are rng or gold base, it doesn’t really show others how amazing you are, except that you have a lot of gold or a lot of free time. Fractal weapons are all rng, I farmed L50 fractals every day for nearly a year and only got 1 skin. Dungeon armors used to be the thing, like a full set of Arah, CoE or even HotW was epic, but alas the speed-meta and especially the PvP-reward track made dungeon armors cheap.

Is there anything in this game that I could do and show off? Is my view of endgame in a MMO not right?

I’m really curious to know what you guys think endgame is.

These days, I avoid PvE and stick strictly to PvP and WvW.

It is unfortunate, but to me, engame is made out of the things, practices, concepts implimentations, which many other MMOs have but GW2 lacks, as well as the ones which A-Net completely blew.

Seriously, just look at the combat system in this game and WvWvW, and think of the potential and how much they have hurt themselves since game launch on that front alone due to a wide plethora of reasons, but mostly due to their own ignorance and lack of longterm business vision.

Then also raids, skill based instead of RNG based PvE content, etc.

End game to me is…

Challenging and repeatable content that rewards players non-rng-based loot according to how well they performed.

(Something Guild Wars 2 has none of.)

TheBlackLeech.9360:

End game to me is…

Challenging and repeatable content that rewards players non-rng-based loot according to how well they performed.

(Something Guild Wars 2 has none of.)

Like badges of honor for World vs World, that’s a pretty straight forward system you’re describing.

If end game is defined as having the best gear, weapons, seen everything, completed all of the content, then not many people have reached end game, simply because the highest level fractals aren’t completed by the majority of the player base. However if you define end game as the majority of the player base has the game on farm, then GW2 has been at end game status for a long time. Without high level fractals where you need the ascended gear and weapons, you can simply complete everything in exotics, which are at the TP.

Log in, play to 80, save your gold and karma, get temple and exotic gear, rune/sigil it up farm Orr and SW and you’ve hit end game.

kash.9213:

TheBlackLeech.9360:

End game to me is…

Challenging and repeatable content that rewards players non-rng-based loot according to how well they performed.

(Something Guild Wars 2 has none of.)

Like badges of honor for World vs World, that’s a pretty straight forward system you’re describing.

no. It really isn’t.

“Endgame” usually refers to content, for players that reach maximum level.

These are usually dungeons, raids, or pvp, where gear acquisition is the primary motivation to do them.

Anything that requires level 80 in GW2, could be considered “endgame”.

Anything that is exciting and has a meaning besides “let’s kill more bad guys to get more gold”.

A progression system that actually makes you feel proud for defeating a certain boss or finishing a certain event, but doesn’t end there, opening more doors for more challenging content.

We need more boss encounters that besides looking epic, should feel epic. I would like to see more stuff similar to Aetherpath or the last boss of Season 2 LS. More interesting boss encounters that aren’t just “stack and press 1” like the Molten Boss Fractal and Thaumanova Anomaly.

Can anyone honestly say they feel proud for defeating Vinewrath?

long spaces of boring repetitive content. that’s not even being mean that’s just what it is, I have 7 level 80’s and fractels and dailys with the odd auto attack world event is all it has to offer right now.

replaying every aspect of the game thousands of times and then redownloading skyrim

I have no endgame goals. My end game is to log in, do a fractals 50 every day (sometimes another, lower level too if need be), a couple of dungeons, and some pvp matches.

My daily goal is to become better at the classes i play in wvw – thief + mesmer, and that is really the “endgame” for me at the moment – and what i find most fun.

Naked world boss runs are fun too, as it brings back the chaos and challenge that was fun with e.g. teq & tt wurm before they were more or less faceroll.

My endgame is waiting for content. My whole guild stopped playing in last 2 months. This is depressing.

Endgame is a term used for many wrong things. To understand the meaning of the term you have to look at the reason why it exist. As I never played WoW seriously (although I understand it is simular there) I’ll use lord of the rings online as an example.

In that game, you got a levelling game. That is the content you play when you are trying to get max level. This is different content then the content you play when you reached the levelcap. The reason is that when you you level, you outgrow maps and tasks. They are still there, but you one-shot everything. it gives no xp, progress or loot.

Cause it happened that the game at max level was very different then the game while levelling, it became an important question for buyers: “how is the endgame”.
This means they ask how is the content you play at max level.

Why this introduction. The first is cause GW2 is different. There is no content vanishing for you when you level up. You only unlock more things to do, but besides the tutorial-instance, there is no content that get’s locked for you when you progress. This means that the answer to the question bout the content you play at max level is that it is the enitre game that is playable at max level.

Now there are two issues here. The first is that people have wrong idea’s bout endgame and start claiming that GW2 has no endgame. That is simply not true if you follow the correct meaning of the word.

The second issue is that players of those old type of MMO’s are so used to outgrowing area’s they rush to max level, look at the content for max level, and decide that there isn’t anything. They do however forget to look back at all the stuff they skipped.

So the true question is..What do you do to have fun at max level.
The answer is that a lot of people are bored. The game didn’t had any refreshing content in months and we are really waiting for the expansion so have new things to do.

On top of that, some people find the game not challenging enough. For me it is just fine and I like the approach of Arenanet that all content should be doable for all players. I think there are plenty of games around that are more challenging and I wish there where more like GW2

So please use the correct terms. But to answer the question.
I’m currently doing my daily. then I log off and into another game (ESO) and have fun there. When the expansion pack hits I’ll likely be playing more GW2 again. The game is clearly on a break when it comes to content, so I am too.

ChoChoBo.6503:

Teoman.3016:

If you want something to show off to people, the only thing to get right now imo would be full radiant/hellfire armor because you’ll need a crap ton of achievement points.

full set of hellfire already… AP isn’t really a bragging right anymore so I don’t put it on at all, I do have 6k permanent AP that I’m proud of and wish I could show off.

Are you saying that you actually have a full set of Hellfire?

You need 30,000AP for that I believe.

Top player has just nudged over 28,000AP.

As for showing off AP, isn’t that what the titles every 5,000AP are for? Or the specific titles for, say, completing the meta achievement under certain categories.

Notwithstanding the comments above, because MMOs tend to become larger and larger I’ve treated the endgame as myself getting ready for the next installment.

TheBlackLeech.9360:

kash.9213:

Like badges of honor for World vs World, that’s a pretty straight forward system you’re describing.

no. It really isn’t.

It kinda is.

How does a developer keep you playing? One of the cheapest ways would be to keep you striving for something, such as a specific skin or gear tier. If you got “non-rng based loot”, as you seem to want, you would no doubt run the content a few times, claim you have everything, and that there is no longer any endgame content. I’m going to be controversial here and suggest that RNG isn’t always the demon people make it out to be. Yes, it’s very easy for developers to abuse, and the chances of an item dropping could seem too low for the input they require (cough Black Lion Tickets), which by the way, is partially subjective anyway. In terms of challenging content, however, would you really continue to run it even though you’d “got your loot already”? I’m sure that a lot of players would not.

I like this game but the non existent endgame in this game is what bothers me the most. I like to have a raid or hard instance with unique drops to make the ultimate gear (in the GW2-context skin-wise). We don’t have this in this game. Of course the scavenger hunt for the luminescence armor was fun and motivated me, but that’s just not it.

Even GW1 had hard mode and hard instanced group content for up to 12 people (FoW, UW, DoA, Urgoz, Deep…).

Replayable engaging content with good rewards.

So fractals with fixed rewards. And better dungeon and raids. :P

ProtoGunner.4953:

I like this game but the non existent endgame in this game is what bothers me the most. I like to have a raid or hard instance with unique drops to make the ultimate gear (in the GW2-context skin-wise).

Thing is, skins are very subjective. What is one person’s absolute favourite over-the-top bells-and-whistles completely oversized pauldrons is another person’s worst nightmare.

If I, for example, didn’t like the skins that the “raid or hard instance” had as a reward, would I be justified in claiming that there was in fact “no endgame” as there was nothing of interest to me?

To me end-game is doing difficult content ( whether it be solo, small or large group) content in order to obtain unique and exclusive skins and cosmetic upgrades.

Sarie.1630:

ProtoGunner.4953:

I like this game but the non existent endgame in this game is what bothers me the most. I like to have a raid or hard instance with unique drops to make the ultimate gear (in the GW2-context skin-wise).

Thing is, skins are very subjective. What is one person’s absolute favourite over-the-top bells-and-whistles completely oversized pauldrons is another person’s worst nightmare.

If I, for example, didn’t like the skins that the “raid or hard instance” had as a reward, would I be justified in claiming that there was in fact “no endgame” as there was nothing of interest to me?

I second your thoughts. My point was not the rewards thoug, this may something that can be individual, maybe certain tokens to buy items from a pool of gear/skins. My point was rather what end game means to me.

ChoChoBo.6503:

Teoman.3016:

If you want something to show off to people, the only thing to get right now imo would be full radiant/hellfire armor because you’ll need a crap ton of achievement points.

full set of hellfire already… AP isn’t really a bragging right anymore so I don’t put it on at all, I do have 6k permanent AP that I’m proud of and wish I could show off.

I think you’re thinking of the 3 standard pieces as the full set. You actually start to unlock the rest of the pieces when you get around 24k AP or something, which I don’t think anyone has actually hit. Unless you are saying you are #1 on the AP charts.

Things you do at max level once leveling is no longer the main progression.

sorudo.9054:

endgame is the end of the game, if an MMO is done right that will never be reached.

That has never been what endgame meant. What mmo game has ever said that is whats endgame?

ChoChoBo.6503:

I love epic quests that when you completed, you get something that you can show off. Something that other players could respect or admire.

If you’re playing any game with the expectation that the other players will be your fan-club, then you really need to rethink your priorities.

Here’s a hint – no one cares about your stuff.

Play the game to have fun. When it’s no longer fun, play something else.

End-game:

Thief no UI first person mode vs someone. Let’s do it.

Jokes aside lately I’ve just been theorycrafting my own builds and testing them out in eotm/wvw. I play PvP when I feel like it.. other than that… not much else. Heh.

Endgame as a concept to me is a separate style of gameplay in a RPG-influenced game which is intended to be used at max-level only, frequently replacing the previous gameplay.

As in: WoW has very distinct endgame.
As in: GW2 has basically no endgame.

Mind you, it’s a downside to have an endgame, though often a necessary one. In theory your game should not be dependent on the player’s level and hence not fall apart once max level is reached.

PvP/WvW would be endgame for me.

PvE is kind of hard to be endgame content imo because it’s all scripted AI. Yeah you can make it challenging but it’s always predictable and eventually will get boring/mundane for me.

One word : Grind

Doing whatever you want in the game with no pressure to level to 80.

My own castle.

~~~~~

I took a break for 2 years. Some of that time was on purpose ( got away from gaming altogether) to not having a pc that could run games that I wanted to play when I started to get that itch.
I have 5 80’s but really haven’t seen “end game” yet. I’m having fun doing events and leveling alts as well as map completion.
I really love the atmosphere of the game. I don’t mind visiting places, farming mats etc. It’s fresh all over again.

To me endgame is what I currently feel like doing when I log in on a max level/skill capped character. Some days I want to work on map completion with my alt 80 ranger, others I’ll want to work on an achievement or title on my guardian, etc. Then there’s the few days that I don’t want to do anything but run around and act goofy in LA or something.