Guild Wars 2

Forum bug begone

If you don’t have money for voice talent, use free talent,

This strikes me as the most out of touch, unlikely comment I’ve seen so far.

Just round up 10 people (2 sexes and 5 languages) who are willing to come in and work for all the hours it would take to record the dialog and not see a penny of payment? And round up 10 people not once but every time they need new dialog? Are there no laws against having people put in hours of work for a company for free and they intentionally profit from this unpaid work? Are there no unions that would have an opinion about a company getting around voice actors wages in this matter? I’m betting this isn’t even legal as it had people put in a full time hours for a company while they are not getting paid.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

If you don’t have money for voice talent, use free talent,

This strikes me as the most out of touch, unlikely comment I’ve seen so far.

Just round up 10 people (2 sexes and 5 languages) who are willing to come in and work for all the hours it would take to record the dialog and not see a penny of payment? And round up 10 people not once but every time they need new dialog? Are there no laws against having people put in hours of work for a company for free and they intentionally profit from this unpaid work? Are there no unions that would have an opinion about a company getting around voice actors wages in this matter? I’m betting this isn’t even legal as it had people put in a full time hours for a company while they are not getting paid.

It depends. I don’t think it’s uncommon for companies truly strapped for cash to use their own workers who are willing to offer their voice to further the group’s projects. Regardless, I think if there is a great audio master available on the books that can take and alter a voice to make it more easily duplicatable. That is to say, it’s not about rounding up the same individuals to voice future content but just use available imitations that can then be altered to sound close enough to the original (or better!).

I’m not going to lie, I don’t have much knowledge on the realm of voice acting beyond the strike that occurred last year (don’t even know what it was for) but if there’s one thing I’ve learned in all my years of working various jobs is there’s a way to get around people being lazy and cheap. It depends on how lazy and cheap people are being, how dumb or anal the customers/client are/is, how much effort you want to put in and if you’re willing to put in similar effort in the future. Asking for a bigger budget may be suicidal without result and asking for more time could receive similar results without something to show for the request. People may see cutting corners as lazy but if you NEED results to get more time or money, consider any options available. And I’m sure Anet knows players want their cosmetic options and they’re willing to cut corners, so…

Leo G.4501:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

If you don’t have money for voice talent, use free talent,

This strikes me as the most out of touch, unlikely comment I’ve seen so far.

Just round up 10 people (2 sexes and 5 languages) who are willing to come in and work for all the hours it would take to record the dialog and not see a penny of payment? And round up 10 people not once but every time they need new dialog? Are there no laws against having people put in hours of work for a company for free and they intentionally profit from this unpaid work? Are there no unions that would have an opinion about a company getting around voice actors wages in this matter? I’m betting this isn’t even legal as it had people put in a full time hours for a company while they are not getting paid.

It depends. I don’t think it’s uncommon for companies truly strapped for cash to use their own workers who are willing to offer their voice to further the group’s projects. Regardless, I think if there is a great audio master available on the books that can take and alter a voice to make it more easily duplicatable. That is to say, it’s not about rounding up the same individuals to voice future content but just use available imitations that can then be altered to sound close enough to the original (or better!).

I’m not going to lie, I don’t have much knowledge on the realm of voice acting beyond the strike that occurred last year (don’t even know what it was for) but if there’s one thing I’ve learned in all my years of working various jobs is there’s a way to get around people being lazy and cheap. It depends on how lazy and cheap people are being, how dumb the customers/client are/is, how much effort you want to put in and if you’re willing to put in similar effort in the future. Asking for a bigger budget may be suicidal without result and asking for more time could receive similar results without something to show for the request. People may see cutting corners as lazy but if you NEED results to get more time or money, consider any options available. And I’m sure Anet knows players want their cosmetic options and they’re willing to cut corners, so…

It depends. I don’t think it’s uncommon for companies truly strapped for cash to use their own workers who are willing to offer their voice to further the group’s projects.

This isn’t what you suggested then. This isn’t free talent. It’s using their own workers and paying for their hours. Of course, while the employees are putting in the hours to do voice acting, all the other projects that they are working on is sitting there not being worked on.If the person is someone who was working on brand new content or QoL feature or anything else people want, (because they can speak one of the 5 languages fluently and also not sound terrible) well, that isn’t getting worked on. The more outside work you put on them the less of their main job will get done. Not a good suggestion.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Leo G.4501:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

If you don’t have money for voice talent, use free talent,

This strikes me as the most out of touch, unlikely comment I’ve seen so far.

Just round up 10 people (2 sexes and 5 languages) who are willing to come in and work for all the hours it would take to record the dialog and not see a penny of payment? And round up 10 people not once but every time they need new dialog? Are there no laws against having people put in hours of work for a company for free and they intentionally profit from this unpaid work? Are there no unions that would have an opinion about a company getting around voice actors wages in this matter? I’m betting this isn’t even legal as it had people put in a full time hours for a company while they are not getting paid.

It depends. I don’t think it’s uncommon for companies truly strapped for cash to use their own workers who are willing to offer their voice to further the group’s projects. Regardless, I think if there is a great audio master available on the books that can take and alter a voice to make it more easily duplicatable. That is to say, it’s not about rounding up the same individuals to voice future content but just use available imitations that can then be altered to sound close enough to the original (or better!).

I’m not going to lie, I don’t have much knowledge on the realm of voice acting beyond the strike that occurred last year (don’t even know what it was for) but if there’s one thing I’ve learned in all my years of working various jobs is there’s a way to get around people being lazy and cheap. It depends on how lazy and cheap people are being, how dumb the customers/client are/is, how much effort you want to put in and if you’re willing to put in similar effort in the future. Asking for a bigger budget may be suicidal without result and asking for more time could receive similar results without something to show for the request. People may see cutting corners as lazy but if you NEED results to get more time or money, consider any options available. And I’m sure Anet knows players want their cosmetic options and they’re willing to cut corners, so…

It depends. I don’t think it’s uncommon for companies truly strapped for cash to use their own workers who are willing to offer their voice to further the group’s projects.

This isn’t what you suggested then. This isn’t free talent. It’s using their own workers and paying for their hours. Of course, while the employees are putting in the hours to do voice acting, all the other projects that they are working on is sitting there not being worked on.If the person is someone who was working on brand new content or QoL feature or anything else people want, (because they can speak one of the 5 languages fluently and also not sound terrible) well, that isn’t getting worked on. The more outside work you put on them the less of their main job will get done. Not a good suggestion.

This insinuates that all workers work the same. Just because you’re part of the same company doesn’t mean your work is equal. Some is more demanding and some is less. If the person who agrees to provide voice work has too much on their plate, look over them to someone who has less. Passion and altruism can also play a role.

I think you’d have to be looking for potential flaws to magnify to make an argument here. Again, I’m not suggesting ONLY free talent, just utilize what work-arounds you can to cut costs. Pay for what you can’t. My suggestion may not be good but it seems better than yours.

Leo G.4501:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Leo G.4501:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

If you don’t have money for voice talent, use free talent,

This strikes me as the most out of touch, unlikely comment I’ve seen so far.

Just round up 10 people (2 sexes and 5 languages) who are willing to come in and work for all the hours it would take to record the dialog and not see a penny of payment? And round up 10 people not once but every time they need new dialog? Are there no laws against having people put in hours of work for a company for free and they intentionally profit from this unpaid work? Are there no unions that would have an opinion about a company getting around voice actors wages in this matter? I’m betting this isn’t even legal as it had people put in a full time hours for a company while they are not getting paid.

It depends. I don’t think it’s uncommon for companies truly strapped for cash to use their own workers who are willing to offer their voice to further the group’s projects. Regardless, I think if there is a great audio master available on the books that can take and alter a voice to make it more easily duplicatable. That is to say, it’s not about rounding up the same individuals to voice future content but just use available imitations that can then be altered to sound close enough to the original (or better!).

I’m not going to lie, I don’t have much knowledge on the realm of voice acting beyond the strike that occurred last year (don’t even know what it was for) but if there’s one thing I’ve learned in all my years of working various jobs is there’s a way to get around people being lazy and cheap. It depends on how lazy and cheap people are being, how dumb the customers/client are/is, how much effort you want to put in and if you’re willing to put in similar effort in the future. Asking for a bigger budget may be suicidal without result and asking for more time could receive similar results without something to show for the request. People may see cutting corners as lazy but if you NEED results to get more time or money, consider any options available. And I’m sure Anet knows players want their cosmetic options and they’re willing to cut corners, so…

It depends. I don’t think it’s uncommon for companies truly strapped for cash to use their own workers who are willing to offer their voice to further the group’s projects.

This isn’t what you suggested then. This isn’t free talent. It’s using their own workers and paying for their hours. Of course, while the employees are putting in the hours to do voice acting, all the other projects that they are working on is sitting there not being worked on.If the person is someone who was working on brand new content or QoL feature or anything else people want, (because they can speak one of the 5 languages fluently and also not sound terrible) well, that isn’t getting worked on. The more outside work you put on them the less of their main job will get done. Not a good suggestion.

This insinuates that all workers work the same. Just because you’re part of the same company doesn’t mean your work is equal. Some is more demanding and some is less. If the person who agrees to provide voice work has too much on their plate, look over them to someone who has less. Passion and altruism can also play a role.

I think you’d have to be looking for potential flaws to magnify to make an argument here. Again, I’m not suggesting ONLY free talent, just utilize what work-arounds you can to cut costs. Pay for what you can’t. My suggestion may not be good but it seems better than yours.

So tell me, what jobs at Anet are less demanding than the others?

What I’m seeing in this thread is, anytime anyone points out a problem with adding new races someone else says they can get around it by removing something.

Personal story?
Removed. Too expensive.

Home city?
Removed.

Leveling area?
Removed. Start at level 80

Voice acting too expensive?
Get whoever you can who works for the company, can speak the language and doesn’t sound awful.

Cultural armor?
Removed.

Specific racial features such as wings are a problem?
Removed or optional.

So, what do you have at the end of all this? You have a race with no personal story, no leveling, no cultural armor, specific racial features are optional, no home city and voiced by Bob in accounting, until he gets a better job elsewhere and then James in janitorial services will start voicing it. He doesn’t sound anything like Bob, but hey, he’s cheap and he’s not awful so that’s a plus.

This thread started out with a new race with all the background and trimmings that the original 5 have and has cut back and cut back due to addressing problems until it has ended up with a race that has nothing going for it but the body. It’s a cut rate, bargain basement version of a new race that no one outside the people advocating it in this thread would be happy with.

When or if the game adds new races it’s a reasonable expectation that they’ll be on the same level of complexity as the others. Anything less will be seen as a sign that ANet is so hard up for cash that they can’t do a proper job. Don’t expect that ANet putting a bare bones version of a race out there to be happily accepted by the players. They are going to want to know why the new race is so stripped down that it’s only the body and not the whole package, and I don’t think telling them they got so little because doing the job right costs more will make them happy.

So. If this is the best y’all can come up with then I’ll be just as happy for ANet to hand out transformation tonics. Does exactly the same thing as what this thread is proposing for a fraction of the cost.

DarcShriek.5829:

Leo G.4501:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Leo G.4501:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

If you don’t have money for voice talent, use free talent,

This strikes me as the most out of touch, unlikely comment I’ve seen so far.

Just round up 10 people (2 sexes and 5 languages) who are willing to come in and work for all the hours it would take to record the dialog and not see a penny of payment? And round up 10 people not once but every time they need new dialog? Are there no laws against having people put in hours of work for a company for free and they intentionally profit from this unpaid work? Are there no unions that would have an opinion about a company getting around voice actors wages in this matter? I’m betting this isn’t even legal as it had people put in a full time hours for a company while they are not getting paid.

It depends. I don’t think it’s uncommon for companies truly strapped for cash to use their own workers who are willing to offer their voice to further the group’s projects. Regardless, I think if there is a great audio master available on the books that can take and alter a voice to make it more easily duplicatable. That is to say, it’s not about rounding up the same individuals to voice future content but just use available imitations that can then be altered to sound close enough to the original (or better!).

I’m not going to lie, I don’t have much knowledge on the realm of voice acting beyond the strike that occurred last year (don’t even know what it was for) but if there’s one thing I’ve learned in all my years of working various jobs is there’s a way to get around people being lazy and cheap. It depends on how lazy and cheap people are being, how dumb the customers/client are/is, how much effort you want to put in and if you’re willing to put in similar effort in the future. Asking for a bigger budget may be suicidal without result and asking for more time could receive similar results without something to show for the request. People may see cutting corners as lazy but if you NEED results to get more time or money, consider any options available. And I’m sure Anet knows players want their cosmetic options and they’re willing to cut corners, so…

It depends. I don’t think it’s uncommon for companies truly strapped for cash to use their own workers who are willing to offer their voice to further the group’s projects.

This isn’t what you suggested then. This isn’t free talent. It’s using their own workers and paying for their hours. Of course, while the employees are putting in the hours to do voice acting, all the other projects that they are working on is sitting there not being worked on.If the person is someone who was working on brand new content or QoL feature or anything else people want, (because they can speak one of the 5 languages fluently and also not sound terrible) well, that isn’t getting worked on. The more outside work you put on them the less of their main job will get done. Not a good suggestion.

This insinuates that all workers work the same. Just because you’re part of the same company doesn’t mean your work is equal. Some is more demanding and some is less. If the person who agrees to provide voice work has too much on their plate, look over them to someone who has less. Passion and altruism can also play a role.

I think you’d have to be looking for potential flaws to magnify to make an argument here. Again, I’m not suggesting ONLY free talent, just utilize what work-arounds you can to cut costs. Pay for what you can’t. My suggestion may not be good but it seems better than yours.

So tell me, what jobs at Anet are less demanding than the others?

Give me a list of all the positions of the company and I might be able to make said assumption on a basic title and description of the position. But if you think every position is just as demanding as all others is an even more deluded assumption than men and women being totally equal.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

What I’m seeing in this thread is, anytime anyone points out a problem with adding new races someone else says they can get around it by removing something.

Personal story?
Removed. Too expensive.

Home city?
Removed.

Leveling area?
Removed. Start at level 80

Voice acting too expensive?
Get whoever you can who works for the company, can speak the language and doesn’t sound awful.

Cultural armor?
Removed.

Specific racial features such as wings are a problem?
Removed or optional.

So, what do you have at the end of all this? You have a race with no personal story, no leveling, no cultural armor, specific racial features are optional, no home city and voiced by Bob in accounting, until he gets a better job elsewhere and then James in janitorial services will start voicing it. He doesn’t sound anything like Bob, but hey, he’s cheap and he’s not awful so that’s a plus.

This thread started out with a new race with all the background and trimmings that the original 5 have and has cut back and cut back due to addressing problems until it has ended up with a race that has nothing going for it but the body. It’s a cut rate, bargain basement version of a new race that no one outside the people advocating it in this thread would be happy with.

When or if the game adds new races it’s a reasonable expectation that they’ll be on the same level of complexity as the others. Anything less will be seen as a sign that ANet is so hard up for cash that they can’t do a proper job. Don’t expect that ANet putting a bare bones version of a race out there to be happily accepted by the players. They are going to want to know why the new race is so stripped down that it’s only the body and not the whole package, and I don’t think telling them they got so little because doing the job right costs more will make them happy.

So. If this is the best y’all can come up with then I’ll be just as happy for ANet to hand out transformation tonics. Does exactly the same thing as what this thread is proposing for a fraction of the cost.

But, what about Bob?
XD

Just a flesh wound.3589:

What I’m seeing in this thread is, anytime anyone points out a problem with adding new races someone else says they can get around it by removing something.

Just my opinion and suggestion: I never said remove PS, just it wouldn’t start at the beginning of the Zhaitan arc and wouldn’t consist of cutscenes as the original PS or even as many instances. Separate established expectations from the goal of the story.

Home city? Never said remove it, just it doesn’t have to be a full blown nation city. It hinges on the story being told. If the race has a story that begins with banishing the player, it could start in an instanced version of a city and then revolve around a different player hub (likely a hub introduced in an expansion).

Leveling area? Why make one when no one wants one?

Voice acting? While I do respect the many famous voice actors that bless our many forms of entertainment with their performances, it is not the end-all be-all bottleneck here. From how I hear Tengu in the game in the past, they have an odd artificial sound to their speech and likely it’s due to altering the voice in some way. Voice alteration is a thing. Not to mention, reading lines off of a script isn’t hard and having a good voice is simply a blessing not limited to professionals.

Cultural armor? Is another topic. Armor in this game is already in a dire situation in need of refining outside of races. But even then, I still think a new race should be offered a racial armor option, it’s just not necessary to make 3 of them.

Largos wings? I never said remove them, I just may limit their cosmetic choices from applying back pieces to their appearance. But this is coming from a poster who doesn’t like all the gaudy back piece items like wings and crap cluttering up players’ avatars. Largos wings should have interesting custom looks and colors.

At the end of the day, you’d have a race done in GW2 fashion = unique, integrated and attractive. It’s not going to be easy and the parts that are going to be difficult, it’s only common sense to look for ways to make them easier.

Just a flesh wound.3589:

What I’m seeing in this thread is, anytime anyone points out a problem with adding new races someone else says they can get around it by removing something.

Personal story?
Removed. Too expensive.

Home city?
Removed.

Leveling area?
Removed. Start at level 80

Voice acting too expensive?
Get whoever you can who works for the company, can speak the language and doesn’t sound awful.

Cultural armor?
Removed.

Specific racial features such as wings are a problem?
Removed or optional.

So, what do you have at the end of all this? You have a race with no personal story, no leveling, no cultural armor, specific racial features are optional, no home city and voiced by Bob in accounting, until he gets a better job elsewhere and then James in janitorial services will start voicing it. He doesn’t sound anything like Bob, but hey, he’s cheap and he’s not awful so that’s a plus.

This thread started out with a new race with all the background and trimmings that the original 5 have and has cut back and cut back due to addressing problems until it has ended up with a race that has nothing going for it but the body. It’s a cut rate, bargain basement version of a new race that no one outside the people advocating it in this thread would be happy with.

When or if the game adds new races it’s a reasonable expectation that they’ll be on the same level of complexity as the others. Anything less will be seen as a sign that ANet is so hard up for cash that they can’t do a proper job. Don’t expect that ANet putting a bare bones version of a race out there to be happily accepted by the players. They are going to want to know why the new race is so stripped down that it’s only the body and not the whole package, and I don’t think telling them they got so little because doing the job right costs more will make them happy.

So. If this is the best y’all can come up with then I’ll be just as happy for ANet to hand out transformation tonics. Does exactly the same thing as what this thread is proposing for a fraction of the cost.

I’m afraid you were reading wrong, because that’s not what people said.

• Personal story? Yes, but not the way it was done in the vanilla version. The race starts at 80 and follows living-story development in multiple instances.

• Home city? No one said it should get removed, it’d be there.

• Leveling area? No need for leveling area, since they start at 80. Instead other 80 zones that fit the theme of the race and the expansion that other races can also explore.

• Voice acting? Few workarounds have been suggested (in case there are any problems), but first of all, we don’t know for sure if it is indeed TOO EXPENSIVE. That’s smth people just came up with, without any concrete facts.

• Cultural armor? Once again, no one said it should get removed. People just suggested that since the race starts at 80, no need for 3 sets, just 1 (in 3 weights). But once again, that’s assuming there are financial difficulties with that, that no one from anet confirmed yet.

• Specific wings/whatever. Indeed, the ability to switch them so they would not clash with existing wings/backpacks. There is 0 lore on largos wings. Nowhere does it state they are natural (and not artificial) or that every largo has them. Maybe this kind of fins is just fashionable among largos. You don’t know that. And honestly, largos are not even prominent in the vanilla story enough, they pop up for 1-2 instances and events, so what’s this strong attachment to the wings, how are they gonna ruin your whole perception of the race?

Basically, you just made up 80% of what you said here. And as I’ve said multiple times, if they appear in expansion, they can combine the resources of creating said race zones with new expansion zones. So all your ‘budget is too low for that!" arguments (when you don’t even know how much it costs and whether they can afford it) are pretty much empty.

Leo G.4501:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

What I’m seeing in this thread is, anytime anyone points out a problem with adding new races someone else says they can get around it by removing something.

Just my opinion and suggestion: I never said remove PS, just it wouldn’t start at the beginning of the Zhaitan arc and wouldn’t consist of cutscenes as the original PS or even as many instances. Separate established expectations from the goal of the story.

Home city? Never said remove it, just it doesn’t have to be a full blown nation city. It hinges on the story being told. If the race has a story that begins with banishing the player, it could start in an instanced version of a city and then revolve around a different player hub (likely a hub introduced in an expansion).

Leveling area? Why make one when no one wants one?

Voice acting? While I do respect the many famous voice actors that bless our many forms of entertainment with their performances, it is not the end-all be-all bottleneck here. From how I hear Tengu in the game in the past, they have an odd artificial sound to their speech and likely it’s due to altering the voice in some way. Voice alteration is a thing. Not to mention, reading lines off of a script isn’t hard and having a good voice is simply a blessing not limited to professionals.

Cultural armor? Is another topic. Armor in this game is already in a dire situation in need of refining outside of races. But even then, I still think a new race should be offered a racial armor option, it’s just not necessary to make 3 of them.

Largos wings? I never said remove them, I just may limit their cosmetic choices from applying back pieces to their appearance. But this is coming from a poster who doesn’t like all the gaudy back piece items like wings and crap cluttering up players’ avatars. Largos wings should have interesting custom looks and colors.

At the end of the day, you’d have a race done in GW2 fashion = unique, integrated and attractive. It’s not going to be easy and the parts that are going to be difficult, it’s only common sense to look for ways to make them easier.

I never said YOU did. I said if a problem is brought up SOMEONE says remove.

electricwater.1572:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

What I’m seeing in this thread is, anytime anyone points out a problem with adding new races someone else says they can get around it by removing something.

Personal story?
Removed. Too expensive.

Home city?
Removed.

Leveling area?
Removed. Start at level 80

Voice acting too expensive?
Get whoever you can who works for the company, can speak the language and doesn’t sound awful.

Cultural armor?
Removed.

Specific racial features such as wings are a problem?
Removed or optional.

So, what do you have at the end of all this? You have a race with no personal story, no leveling, no cultural armor, specific racial features are optional, no home city and voiced by Bob in accounting, until he gets a better job elsewhere and then James in janitorial services will start voicing it. He doesn’t sound anything like Bob, but hey, he’s cheap and he’s not awful so that’s a plus.

This thread started out with a new race with all the background and trimmings that the original 5 have and has cut back and cut back due to addressing problems until it has ended up with a race that has nothing going for it but the body. It’s a cut rate, bargain basement version of a new race that no one outside the people advocating it in this thread would be happy with.

When or if the game adds new races it’s a reasonable expectation that they’ll be on the same level of complexity as the others. Anything less will be seen as a sign that ANet is so hard up for cash that they can’t do a proper job. Don’t expect that ANet putting a bare bones version of a race out there to be happily accepted by the players. They are going to want to know why the new race is so stripped down that it’s only the body and not the whole package, and I don’t think telling them they got so little because doing the job right costs more will make them happy.

So. If this is the best y’all can come up with then I’ll be just as happy for ANet to hand out transformation tonics. Does exactly the same thing as what this thread is proposing for a fraction of the cost.

I’m afraid you were reading wrong, because that’s not what people said.

• Personal story? Yes, but not the way it was done in the vanilla version. The race starts at 80 and follows living-story development in multiple instances.

Personal story removed and only LS available: check

• Home city? No one said it should get removed, it’d be there.

Remember I said someone would say remove
Amaimon.7823:
1) it’d need a home city with a home zone. And thats why tengu is unlikely, there’s no space for both.

Home city (and leveling area) suggested to be removed (for Tengu): check

• Leveling area? No need for leveling area, since they start at 80. Instead other 80 zones that fit the theme of the race and the expansion that other races can also explore.

Leveling area removed: check

• Voice acting? Few workarounds have been suggested (in case there are any problems), but first of all, we don’t know for sure if it is indeed TOO EXPENSIVE. That’s smth people just came up with, without any concrete facts.

Professional voice acting removed and voice acting by ANet staff: by Leo G

• Cultural armor? Once again, no one said it should get removed. People just suggested that since the race starts at 80, no need for 3 sets, just 1 (in 3 weights). But once again, that’s assuming there are financial difficulties with that, that no one from anet confirmed yet.

Cultural armor removed, now only one set instead of 3: check

• Specific wings/whatever. Indeed, the ability to switch them so they would not clash with existing wings/backpacks. There is 0 lore on largos wings. Nowhere does it state they are natural (and not artificial) or that every largo has them. Maybe this kind of fins is just fashionable among largos. You don’t know that. And honestly, largos are not even prominent in the vanilla story enough, they pop up for 1-2 instances and events, so what’s this strong attachment to the wings, how are they gonna ruin your whole perception of the race?

I don’t have a strong attachment to either the wings or the Largos but you can bet that the people who want to play Largos want those wings. The average player isn’t going to care if they are a natural part of that race or not. The wings are emblematic and expected. Just read the threads about them.

Basically, you just made up 80% of what you said here.

I don’t think so.

And as I’ve said multiple times, if they appear in expansion, they can combine the resources of creating said race zones with new expansion zones. So all your ‘budget is too low for that!" arguments (when you don’t even know how much it costs and whether they can afford it) are pretty much empty.

Wasn’t my argument.

What you want just isn’t profitable and adds to the work load of everything new that will be put in the game if it’s there.

I feel as if there are completely different conversations going on. There’s a group that wants to talk about how fun it would be to have a new race and why they prefer one over another. An overlapping group wants ANet to prioritize a new race over other new content. Yet another group is trying to explain why ANet has said a new race isn’t likely to happen anytime soon.

Each of those discussions has merit. The problem is that people are trying to mix the ideas up in a single conversation.

A new race would be fun for a lot of people, especially with the right details… which vary across the community. A portion of that community would prefer a new race over everything else that ANet might offer.

All the same, the costs for adding a new race with the level of quality GW2 fans expect is huge and (as MoarChaos has noted) also increases future costs of any other content.
People can talk all they want about how it shouldn’t be that hard or that ANet could compromise on some aspects about what fans would want from a new race. But it won’t change the actual costs or the benefits.

With limited resources, ANet still has to choose: this content with its costs, that content with greater costs. They’ll never have enough to do all the things that they want to do, let alone all that we want.

maybe the Tengu?

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Personal story removed and only LS available: check

• Home city? No one said it should get removed, it’d be there.

Remember I said someone would say remove
Amaimon.7823:
1) it’d need a home city with a home zone. And thats why tengu is unlikely, there’s no space for both.

Home city (and leveling area) suggested to be removed (for Tengu): check

Leveling area removed: check

Professional voice acting removed and voice acting by ANet staff: by Leo G

Cultural armor removed, now only one set instead of 3: check

• Specific wings/whatever.
  I don’t have a strong attachment to either the wings or the Largos but you can bet that the people who want to play Largos want those wings. The average player isn’t going to care if they are a natural part of that race or not. The wings are emblematic and expected. Just read the threads about them.

Basically, you just made up 80% of what you said here.

I don’t think so.

And as I’ve said multiple times, if they appear in expansion, they can combine the resources of creating said race zones with new expansion zones. So all your ‘budget is too low for that!" arguments (when you don’t even know how much it costs and whether they can afford it) are pretty much empty.

Wasn’t my argument.

• LS-like personal story, not an actual living story. So instead of 3 instances every 10 levels with breaks you would just get x amount of instances all together. Considering PS from lvl 40 to lvl 80 is the same for everyone (with minor variations), I don’t see losing much. And it certainly doesn’t classify as scrapping personal story all together.

• Home area. Even then what you say is not true. The person said there’s no space for BOTH home city AND leveling area for TENGU. He doesn’t suggest scrapping both, in his opinion tengu are unlikely because for some reason he thinks there’s not enough space for BOTH. There’s plenty of space on the world map that is still uncovered, so they could put it anywhere they like. And Tengu is not the only race suggested. So again, not true.

• Leveling area. If there’s no need for leveling then yeah, why have a random leveling area in the middle of nowhere? If it gets replaced by a few quality 80 maps instead, what’s the problem? Can’t live without lvl 1-20 maps that give bad loot?

• Voice acting. Probably the only thing where you have somewhat of a point. Leo G indeed suggested that anet employees start pitching in, but where’s any statement from anet that they are struggling with hiring new VA? That’s entirely made up by players.

• Cultural armor. Lol, limiting it to 1-2 sets is hardly scrapping it all together, as you say. Again, made up point. 1 =/= 0.

• Wings. Let me tell you, most casual average players don’t even know who largos are, because they are that irrelevant in personal story. And people who DO want to play a largo (I’m one of them) will certainly not care about their wings/fins much. What people DO like about them is their mystique, cool look (not counting wings), and the fact that they come from deep underwater, an area we know nothing about. Also they’re honorable cold-blooded assassins, that adds to their appeal. Nowhere did I see people going crazy about their fins and saying OMG I LOVE LARGOS CAUSE OF THEIR WINGS. Besides, I said AN OPTION to replace largos wings with whatever from gemstore IF THE PLAYER WANTS aka keep the fins if you like them, change them if you want. An option, not removing all together, like you claim.

Most people here claim it’s too expensive to create a new race. Where’s any information to support that? Of course it would cost some resources, but can anyone show me any proof it is TOO expensive?

Hyper Cutter.9376:

They actually don’t, though. The largos share most of their assets with the other humanoids and the tengu share theirs with the charr (pre-HoT tengu even share the same posture and idle animations).

No they share the same animation sets

Applying the same animations to different meshes is easy, the only requirement is that both meshies have the same number of joints in the same hierarchy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skeletal_animation

Armor however has to fit the mesh itself not just the animation rig. Tengu have a massively different mesh than charr do.

electricwater.1572:

Most people here claim it’s too expensive to create a new race. Where’s any information to support that? Of course it would cost some resources, but can anyone show me any proof it is TOO expensive?

What sort of ‘proof’ do you need? People have outlined the things that would require ANet resources and compared them to other things that ANet has done in the past. For the amount of replayable content offered to fans, a new race requires more resources both to get the new race started and each time there’s any other type of new content. A new race affects dialogue+translations, gear design, story telling, skills and skill animation, as well as any content that is particular to the new race.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

electricwater.1572:

Most people here claim it’s too expensive to create a new race. Where’s any information to support that? Of course it would cost some resources, but can anyone show me any proof it is TOO expensive?

What sort of ‘proof’ do you need? People have outlined the things that would require ANet resources and compared them to other things that ANet has done in the past. For the amount of replayable content offered to fans, a new race requires more resources both to get the new race started and each time there’s any other type of new content. A new race affects dialogue+translations, gear design, story telling, skills and skill animation, as well as any content that is particular to the new race.

They did dialogues for minor races in HoT, was that a problem? Itzel, Nuhoch, they all have voices. And they are minor races that don’t have any relevance outside of HoT. Even Mouth of Mordremoth has a voice, while they could easily skip that.

Gear design was already covered. And story telling? They would need some story for the expansion anyway.
They did skills/skills animations for revenant in HoT. Since I don’t see any new profession coming in near future, what prevents them from doing skill animations for new race? Not to mention, if the new race can utilize existing classes, all skills are already there.

electricwater.1572:

They did dialogues for minor races in HoT, was that a problem?…..

You and many others list off work to be done. Fine, dandy, and we all agree work can be done.

I’m still waiting for someone to propose how they can make a profit off that large amount of work.
Saying “expansion” really is a cop out as that is always the point of an expansion. But if you really want to go that route, put the work in terms that management will understand = greater profit because of the additional work that has to go into an expansion besides just a new race.

“Players want a new race.” gives no measurable metric what so ever.

why cant they make new race using old starting zone and personal story?

OneYenShort.3189:

“Players want a new race.” gives no measurable metric what so ever.

New race = new story, new lore, new locations, new achievements, new customization options. All this is exciting to new/old players. Most people will create a new character (sell more character slots) of the said race to try it out and go through it’s story = more participation. They can design new things for them and put them in the gemstore (for example if it’s largos – new aquabreather/fins skins for everyone). It also adds diversity to the world.

Not to mention ‘new race’ sounds like a good selling point for an expansion.

You don’t understand so I’ll break it down into generic management. Do note that I would love to see another race added. (skritt and tengu top my personal list.)

electricwater.1572:

OneYenShort.3189:

“Players want a new race.” gives no measurable metric what so ever.

New race = new story,

Yes. How many man hours will that take? (aka cost)

new lore,

No new lore here most likely. The new playable race will most likely be a race already in existence. So this “lore” most likely falls into “story.”

new locations,

Agreed. How many man hours to create it? (aka cost)

new achievements,

Agreed. How many man hours to create it? (aka cost)

new customization options.

I am assuming you mean skin applicability? Or are you talking racial skining looks during creation? Because actual customization (at least how I’m thinkign in my head with skills and such.) is the same across the game. The counter is still the same. How many man hours to create it? (aka cost)

Well… so far you have spent a lot of money, but shown nothing for recouping or making profit.

electricwater.1572:

All this is exciting to new/old players.

Opinion and not a usable metric. How many players are you estimating? How many players do you think you can get to come back to the game?

electricwater.1572:

Most people will create a new character (sell more character slots) of the said race to try it out

Agreed on the idea of selling character slots. But how many of those do you estimate will convert gold to gems to gain the slot? On average how many players still have slots open that are active? What is the actual forcast of gem sales? Honestly, probably not that high. Maybe a spike in the first month then what? This sounds more like a bonus, not a true means of profit.

electricwater.1572:

and go through it’s story = more participation.

This is an opinion and feel good statement even if logical. Do you have any data that other players seeing more players will increase sales? Megaserver was profitable because it allowed contractual changes to account for spikes and dips of players so that only what is needed is ideally being paid for. (that is at least one theory of it. There are of course many more.)

electricwater.1572:

They can design new things for them and put them in the gemstore (for example if it’s largos – new aquabreather/fins skins for everyone). It also adds diversity to the world.

Can design = more man hours, more cost. as of such, those sorts of items are external of this discussion. While it can play a factor, gem store creation items are stand alone because the effort that goes into their creation must pay for their cost and gain a profit. This idea adds little in the argument of profits gained with/for a new race to be created.

electricwater.1572:

Not to mention ‘new race’ sounds like a good selling point for an expansion.

Agreed 100% on this one. But again, there is no metric data to support how much it could increase sales of an expansion.

You see, nearly each point got questioned, and all in the realm of cost or profit of which you did not answer any of them with actual metrics. And in most cases none of us really can answer it because it requires data that only ANET is privy to. This is why these sorts of threads really only server to keep players hopes and disappointments livid. We don’t have the information necessary to make a really compelling presentation for profit.
Heck… where I work, management was so scared of an improvement I wanted to put into the product that would save 6 man hours on average per product released even though I built it up on my own time and proved it worked so it cost them nothing extra other than roughly 1 man hour to add it into the production base and have it reviewed. I can only imagine how hard it would be to make a case for a new race at ANET.

Also consider the likely hood of a new race with the next expansion, in my opinion, is highly unlikely. So maybe in the one after that? I put forth earlier that it may be about 3 years before that could be released. Great…. The player base will not be the same as it is now. Profit margins will be harder an tighter. It will be even more difficult to convince management that a new race would “keep the game alive” for the cost of the work.

So no, what I expect is that more potions will come about such that we could fight “normally” while looking like another race via potions. I believe this is what they did with Koda in the last update wasn’kitten

OneYenShort.3189:

You see, nearly each point got questioned, and all in the realm of cost or profit of which you did not answer any of them with actual metrics.

How could I have? I don’t work at anet and I have no idea how many hours/men it will take them to make it, so I can only talk about approximate pros/cons.

People say it will cost too much resources to create a new race, but there was never any official statement about that. I pointed that out. There is also no official statement that it fits perfectly in their budget either. But until either of such statements comes, it is up for discussion (yet some people are already saying it will never happen).

electricwater.1572:

OneYenShort.3189:

You see, nearly each point got questioned, and all in the realm of cost or profit of which you did not answer any of them with actual metrics.

How could I have? I don’t work at anet and I have no idea how many hours/men it will take them to make it, so I can only talk about approximate pros/cons.

People say it will cost too much resources to create a new race, but there was never any official statement about that. I pointed that out. There is also no official statement that it fits perfectly in their budget either. But until either of such statements comes, it is up for discussion (yet some people are already saying it will never happen).

No, but Anet have stated on multiple occasions that cost and resources is usually the biggest barrier to adding certain features to the game. Even changing UI elements, menus, certain changes to texts, Voice Acting, all have had “costs” attributed as barriers from the dev team, either on the forums or on Reddit. We’ll never what those “costs” equate to, but they are obviously non-trivial or they wouldn’t mention them.

The only thing we can say on this side of the fence is that we know VA is a relatable obstacle. Actors need paying, dialogue needs scheduling for the actors, scheduling for the studios around other recording needs, time found to transfer all those lines into game and this needs to keep pace every release, unlike with NPCs who record once and done. Each race has a very distinct way of speaking and accent, so it couldn’t be a case of re-using existing VA options and if Anet were to implement a new race, they’d want to do it properly anyway.

The issue isn’t that they def wont ever do a new race, since we have zero idea what their plans are or their official stance is beyond what they stated last year. The issue is that it is not an easy implementation, it does not have a quick fix to add in, has a great deal of obstacles and the pay-off appears to be relatively low – it really is just the skin of the race since all the story, lore and maps can be handled in other ways.

Personally I think 5 races is fine – that’s already 5x more than GW1 had, which I personally believe benefited more from having a single race option. I prefer races to keep their unique flavour by being non-playable.

Leo G.4501:

DarcShriek.5829:

Leo G.4501:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Leo G.4501:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

If you don’t have money for voice talent, use free talent,

This strikes me as the most out of touch, unlikely comment I’ve seen so far.

Just round up 10 people (2 sexes and 5 languages) who are willing to come in and work for all the hours it would take to record the dialog and not see a penny of payment? And round up 10 people not once but every time they need new dialog? Are there no laws against having people put in hours of work for a company for free and they intentionally profit from this unpaid work? Are there no unions that would have an opinion about a company getting around voice actors wages in this matter? I’m betting this isn’t even legal as it had people put in a full time hours for a company while they are not getting paid.

It depends. I don’t think it’s uncommon for companies truly strapped for cash to use their own workers who are willing to offer their voice to further the group’s projects. Regardless, I think if there is a great audio master available on the books that can take and alter a voice to make it more easily duplicatable. That is to say, it’s not about rounding up the same individuals to voice future content but just use available imitations that can then be altered to sound close enough to the original (or better!).

I’m not going to lie, I don’t have much knowledge on the realm of voice acting beyond the strike that occurred last year (don’t even know what it was for) but if there’s one thing I’ve learned in all my years of working various jobs is there’s a way to get around people being lazy and cheap. It depends on how lazy and cheap people are being, how dumb the customers/client are/is, how much effort you want to put in and if you’re willing to put in similar effort in the future. Asking for a bigger budget may be suicidal without result and asking for more time could receive similar results without something to show for the request. People may see cutting corners as lazy but if you NEED results to get more time or money, consider any options available. And I’m sure Anet knows players want their cosmetic options and they’re willing to cut corners, so…

It depends. I don’t think it’s uncommon for companies truly strapped for cash to use their own workers who are willing to offer their voice to further the group’s projects.

This isn’t what you suggested then. This isn’t free talent. It’s using their own workers and paying for their hours. Of course, while the employees are putting in the hours to do voice acting, all the other projects that they are working on is sitting there not being worked on.If the person is someone who was working on brand new content or QoL feature or anything else people want, (because they can speak one of the 5 languages fluently and also not sound terrible) well, that isn’t getting worked on. The more outside work you put on them the less of their main job will get done. Not a good suggestion.

This insinuates that all workers work the same. Just because you’re part of the same company doesn’t mean your work is equal. Some is more demanding and some is less. If the person who agrees to provide voice work has too much on their plate, look over them to someone who has less. Passion and altruism can also play a role.

I think you’d have to be looking for potential flaws to magnify to make an argument here. Again, I’m not suggesting ONLY free talent, just utilize what work-arounds you can to cut costs. Pay for what you can’t. My suggestion may not be good but it seems better than yours.

So tell me, what jobs at Anet are less demanding than the others?

Give me a list of all the positions of the company and I might be able to make said assumption on a basic title and description of the position. But if you think every position is just as demanding as all others is an even more deluded assumption than men and women being totally equal.

Your posts just keep getting more and more offensive. If the sexes aren’t equal, which one is superior?

Anet forgot when they entered the mmo business that it means supporting the game long term.

Couldn’t we skip the need for a level 1-15 area by just making the race require the expansion it comes out in and at least a level 80 character on your account? Then you could make the new race a level 80 in a level 80 area. Kind of like how each race’s story is dependent on their race and how some things are hidden to specific professions we could have the race develop the new maps that appear in an expansion.

Then we can see it through the eyes of someone who lives there and someone who is going there for the first time.

A native could see tracks and have a “These tracks belong to [animal name]. I need to be mindful of its [special feature]” while someone else would have the insight of “What could have made these tracks?”

Just a thought.

New personal story start w/o new race could be done – Ash Legion and Blood Legion starters, humans from other continets/kingdoms, asura that fleed underground after rata novans was flooded by chak, sylvari from other trees, norns with majority of shamans somewhere.

Rest resources for new elite spec. 10.

electricwater.1572:

People say it will cost too much resources to create a new race, but there was never any official statement about that. I pointed that out. There is also no official statement that it fits perfectly in their budget either. But until either of such statements comes, it is up for discussion (yet some people are already saying it will never happen).

If you want to believe that a new race is likely, there’s nothing that anyone can say to temper your optimism. If you want to understand why we haven’t seen a new race or hype from ANet about one, you can read above: there are huge costs associated with adding a new race to this game.

No one is saying it will never happen; we are saying it’s extremely unlikely because a new race involves both startup and ongoing costs while other features only include some of the same costs.

For what it’s worth, here are some other conversations on the same topic:

• Wooden Potatoes reviews the details of what it means to add a new race
• Reddit discussion about that vid
• Year-old reddit discussion
• Six-month-old discussion

Tengu!!!
Tengu have been since Gw1 and would be the most logical.

Illconceived Was Na.9781:

electricwater.1572:

People say it will cost too much resources to create a new race, but there was never any official statement about that. I pointed that out. There is also no official statement that it fits perfectly in their budget either. But until either of such statements comes, it is up for discussion (yet some people are already saying it will never happen).

If you want to believe that a new race is likely, there’s nothing that anyone can say to temper your optimism. If you want to understand why we haven’t seen a new race or hype from ANet about one, you can read above: there are huge costs associated with adding a new race to this game.

No one is saying it will never happen; we are saying it’s extremely unlikely because a new race involves both startup and ongoing costs while other features only include some of the same costs.

For what it’s worth, here are some other conversations on the same topic:

• Wooden Potatoes reviews the details of what it means to add a new race
• Reddit discussion about that vid
• Year-old reddit discussion
• Six-month-old discussion

First of all, WP is not a dev, so his opinion is just an opinion of another player, who doesn’t know the full situation of how things are going at anet.

*He makes a point that cities are not visited regularly, but a lot of people farm them for transmutation charges, so that’s one of the reasons to go there lol. And as he said, they can add extra activities/vendors/unique stuff like mystic forge in such cities to attract more people.

*Then he talks about problems placing leveling areas for tengu, and we already talked about how there’s no need for that if they start at 80.

*Then about how there’s some problem with heart quests…yet up to this day we see them in Ember Bay and in Bitterfrost. If they keep doing it then they probably think it’s worth it.

*New race’s personal story – has been suggested. Make the race unlockable once you have lvl 80 character of any other race first and completed HoT. This way they can enjoy the original Zhaitan/Mordy stories all they want and it won’t feel weird.

*Revoice all the previous content – again, no need for that, see previous point. As for dungeons/raids/whatever dialogues, replace them with text instead (IF there is a problem with hiring new VA). It’s just a few phrases, I don’t think anyone would mind much.

*He’s also talking about dwarves (completely new body model) and tengu (again, hard body to model for). Yeah, I can understand why it’s hard to adjust old armor to them, that’s why I suggested largos instead who have humanoid bodies (with interchangeable wings, before someone smart jumps in with ‘BUT WHAT ABOUT WINGS????’ again). Problem = gone.

Anyway, Imma stop arguing in this thread now. I’ve already listed all my views on so-called ‘problems’. People who want results look for solutions, people who don’t – look for excuses. As I’ve said like million times already, it’s up to anet. I would love a new race, but if it never comes I’m not gonna cry and uninstall.

I do agree with WP on the following though, people have this ‘list of requirements’ they made up themselves and keep referring to it. You can also think outside of the box, you know.

Anyway, I’m done here

SnowHawk.3615:

Tengu!!!
Tengu have been since Gw1 and would be the most logical.

So have the dwarfs so no its not most logical with tengu

Mem no Fushia.7604:

New personal story start w/o new race could be done – Ash Legion and Blood Legion starters, humans from other continets/kingdoms, asura that fleed underground after rata novans was flooded by chak, sylvari from other trees, norns with majority of shamans somewhere.

Rest resources for new elite spec. 10.

So a “new” race just for the sake of having a new race? I’m not a fan. A new race isn’t filling anything the game needs. We already had a new race, and they were the slyvari. The player base who wants a new race ultimately just wants all the races.

All the zones these new races would be in are lvl 80 currently. I don’t think these deadly areas should be anything but lvl 80. Which means you’d have to convince Anet to give anyone who wants to play as one the option to insta 80 or put in a wonky system where you play as a different race to unlock the new one, or turning in 80 tomes of knowledge. There may be a system that could work much better here, but I don’t see it working.

“But we already have those races and they wear things” you say. They wear one outfit! For the races we don’t have as playable they don’t wear anything the player character does. Largos are an exception for your cause, but then backpack skins and gliders interfere with them being put into the game easily so they’re back to square one. Dwarves are nearly all dead in lore, and if they’re not then they’re stone. Which means no children, which means no racial city, which means no playable race.

The other humans, asura, and slyvari could maybe be done with little money to be spent by Arena net, since they won’t have to make sure all the current skins work on things they already have. But why would you want that as a different playable race? How is that going to make people want to play as them, and make any of that money back by buying character slots? How is a new race going to make people by character slots at all? If you still want that then Zephyrites are right there. We can have Zephyrites…

I don’t think a new race in an expansion would sell any character slots. The same hullabaloo that happened with the new Profession included in the last expansion would ensue. The playerbase would insist a character slot was included in the expansion to allow one to create said new race.

Races are a launch feature, not an expansion feature.

Gwaihir.1745:

Races are a launch feature, not an expansion feature.

Not for WoW apparently.

Personally, i’d rather have a new race than Legendary weapons and armour.
And a new race is more fitting for an expansion pack.

DarcShriek.5829:

Leo G.4501:

DarcShriek.5829:

Leo G.4501:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

Leo G.4501:

Just a flesh wound.3589:

If you don’t have money for voice talent, use free talent,

This strikes me as the most out of touch, unlikely comment I’ve seen so far.

Just round up 10 people (2 sexes and 5 languages) who are willing to come in and work for all the hours it would take to record the dialog and not see a penny of payment? And round up 10 people not once but every time they need new dialog? Are there no laws against having people put in hours of work for a company for free and they intentionally profit from this unpaid work? Are there no unions that would have an opinion about a company getting around voice actors wages in this matter? I’m betting this isn’t even legal as it had people put in a full time hours for a company while they are not getting paid.

It depends. I don’t think it’s uncommon for companies truly strapped for cash to use their own workers who are willing to offer their voice to further the group’s projects. Regardless, I think if there is a great audio master available on the books that can take and alter a voice to make it more easily duplicatable. That is to say, it’s not about rounding up the same individuals to voice future content but just use available imitations that can then be altered to sound close enough to the original (or better!).

I’m not going to lie, I don’t have much knowledge on the realm of voice acting beyond the strike that occurred last year (don’t even know what it was for) but if there’s one thing I’ve learned in all my years of working various jobs is there’s a way to get around people being lazy and cheap. It depends on how lazy and cheap people are being, how dumb the customers/client are/is, how much effort you want to put in and if you’re willing to put in similar effort in the future. Asking for a bigger budget may be suicidal without result and asking for more time could receive similar results without something to show for the request. People may see cutting corners as lazy but if you NEED results to get more time or money, consider any options available. And I’m sure Anet knows players want their cosmetic options and they’re willing to cut corners, so…

It depends. I don’t think it’s uncommon for companies truly strapped for cash to use their own workers who are willing to offer their voice to further the group’s projects.

This isn’t what you suggested then. This isn’t free talent. It’s using their own workers and paying for their hours. Of course, while the employees are putting in the hours to do voice acting, all the other projects that they are working on is sitting there not being worked on.If the person is someone who was working on brand new content or QoL feature or anything else people want, (because they can speak one of the 5 languages fluently and also not sound terrible) well, that isn’t getting worked on. The more outside work you put on them the less of their main job will get done. Not a good suggestion.

This insinuates that all workers work the same. Just because you’re part of the same company doesn’t mean your work is equal. Some is more demanding and some is less. If the person who agrees to provide voice work has too much on their plate, look over them to someone who has less. Passion and altruism can also play a role.

I think you’d have to be looking for potential flaws to magnify to make an argument here. Again, I’m not suggesting ONLY free talent, just utilize what work-arounds you can to cut costs. Pay for what you can’t. My suggestion may not be good but it seems better than yours.

So tell me, what jobs at Anet are less demanding than the others?

Give me a list of all the positions of the company and I might be able to make said assumption on a basic title and description of the position. But if you think every position is just as demanding as all others is an even more deluded assumption than men and women being totally equal.

Your posts just keep getting more and more offensive. If the sexes aren’t equal, which one is superior?

The sexes are equal before the law. The sexes are not equal in outcome. People who argue for equality usually are talking about equal outcome which is only possible if you take away freedom. If you’re offended by truth, you have worse problems than equality.

dagrdagaz.4913:

Gwaihir.1745:

Races are a launch feature, not an expansion feature.

Not for WoW apparently.

Personally, i’d rather have a new race than Legendary weapons and armour.
And a new race is more fitting for an expansion pack.

And SWtOR.

Considering the armor is likely going to get complained about for buttcapes or something, i’d agree.

Leo G.4501:

dagrdagaz.4913:

Gwaihir.1745:

Races are a launch feature, not an expansion feature.

Not for WoW apparently.

Personally, i’d rather have a new race than Legendary weapons and armour.
And a new race is more fitting for an expansion pack.

And SWtOR.

Considering the armor is likely going to get complained about for buttcapes or something, i’d agree.

SW:TOR’s races have no relation to story or lore. They also all have identical body shapes.

If ANet adds in a new race I would not be happy if they did not have areas in which to level them up and their own personal story that’s related to their race and what they were doing up to the point where their race and the races we already play intersect story wise.

And not because I want to level up a character the old fashion way. But others do prefer to level their character up to max level the way we did when the game first launched.

And I’d be wary of any race being added that would give players multiple level 80’s straight out of character creation. Especially new players. Ones that don’t have the gold to gear out their level 80 new character to what the meta is for whatever class they chose or even to random exotics so they have a shot of being able to get credit for events. That was my only concern with the level 80 boost, but it at least was 1 character only and they were given some level 80 exotic gear.

I want them treated the same way the other 5 races are.

There won’t be a new race.

Crinn.7864:

Leo G.4501:

dagrdagaz.4913:

Gwaihir.1745:

Races are a launch feature, not an expansion feature.

Not for WoW apparently.

Personally, i’d rather have a new race than Legendary weapons and armour.
And a new race is more fitting for an expansion pack.

And SWtOR.

Considering the armor is likely going to get complained about for buttcapes or something, i’d agree.

SW:TOR’s races have no relation to story or lore. They also all have identical body shapes.

But they have different voice actors. Different diffs for different games.

I can see the cost for somethings stopping them but not others. Like the voice actors, you have soo many players out there, i’m sure they would freely lend their voices to do characters. I know i would. If i knew how to code i’d volunteer my free time into the design of the race aswell to help cut down on costs.

As for the home city part, that would depend on the race. I mean like tengu techincally have a corner of LA ( i remember them killing me when i got too close to their door). And if you use tengu for example and wanted to give them a starting map, they could just use Caledon Forest, afterall there are some tengu there. . Also you could always take a shortcut for them too and just make the new races home city be instanced, thus not needing to actually add it to the map.

Personal story wise, could do the level breakdown every 10 like they are now, or if the new race started at 80, can just add them then too. I Know lots of ppl who got their toons to 80, did the dungeon stories THEN did their personal stories (granted when they did that, they whined about the wp costs lol)

As for this armor refitting stuff, they already took short cut’s on that with some races, like asura some female/male armors are exact same. Norn’s just use bigger size human clothes. So they can take some short cuts here too and wouldnt need to revamp all the armor just some. I can see Kodan’s using norn size human clothes for example. Grawl using smaller Charr clothes. Still take awhile but not aslong without short cuts.

But im also fine without a new race. Afterall, it’ll be boring after the first time, that’s just gonna get rushed through and forgotten about.

A new race? Hell no! Fix Norn first!

Stop saying it would be so easy for the play base to just provide the voices for free. They’re not strapped for cash for voices. The problem is that the voice actor whether it’s free or not has to be available. So getting a free voice is risky for a game company plus no company can really get anything for free without being sued or talked to by the government. So this isn’t really a work around.

I don’t think either armor modeling OR voice work is the biggest problem with new races. I think the biggest issue, which IMO is something they need to tackle, is that they have to somehow be made to fit into the existing story framework -

a.) a small handle of specific races could probably be “pigeonholed” into the existing PS without too much trouble, and these would be the lowest effort options. This includes the Kodan, and perhaps the Tengu or Skritt.

b.) Alternatively, a new PS could be crafted around a different world region (such as Elona or Cantha) opening up new options for all kinds of races.

Honestly, I’m hoping we get a little of both, but b. would be better than a. in the long run. As they add new continents, such as Cantha or Elona, they should have new PS accompanied by two-three new races native to that continent. The PS doesn’t have to have the same scope as the original one – it can be scaled down with reduced branch points, etc, to make it easier to implement and scale.

It honestly might be worth doing that for the original PS for the sake of scalability, especially considering it wasn’t particularly well received. I know they kind of attempted and failed with this a while back, but I think it was just because it wasn’t a great execution.

I hope they actually do follow through on making Tengu playable. I’ve seen a few complaints of a “Lack of Space” for them – Nonsense. There are two gaping “Insert Tengu Here” holes in the map already – one roughly city-sized between Kessex Hills, Gendarran Fields, and Lion’s Arch, and a conspicuously Starter-zone shaped hole between Caledon Forest, Kessex Hills, and Claw Island.

Sartharina.3542:

I hope they actually do follow through on making Tengu playable. I’ve seen a few complaints of a “Lack of Space” for them – Nonsense. There are two gaping “Insert Tengu Here” holes in the map already – one roughly city-sized between Kessex Hills, Gendarran Fields, and Lion’s Arch, and a conspicuously Starter-zone shaped hole between Caledon Forest, Kessex Hills, and Claw Island.

Just to add to this, I think the Tengu were planned to be a 6th race at launch and that the starter area was originally planned to be below Kessex Hills. There is an area on the south east border called the Dominion Killing zone. There is a Tengu there and a Tengu wall along the border. However I think that starter area was removed. The map south of Kessex is mostly water and a few islands.