Guild Wars 2

I have to say I think making the WvW maps part of the world map completion was a mistake. I love the game but I have no interest in the WvW part but attempting to complete the world map is incredibly irritating whilst continually being attacked by other players. Surely there could be something introduced to highlight a players is simply in the region for map completion purposes and not to join in the general battling.

I think there should be a mandatory poi or vista at the end of the eternal battlegrounds jp…

I completely agree about this objection…… I have no problem that map complete would include every bit of the PvE world, but to include the WvW – thereby forcing you to play that aspect of the game for at least a time – seems contrived. PvP has it’s own reward system, WvW should be the same and stay separate from PvE rewards and map completes.

Just camp out in WvW and wait for locations to unlock for you. Don’t participate, just wait. It takes patience (more than I’ve had so far), but it’s really the only thing you can do to get that achievement without being forced to screw around in PvP. Don’t worry about the slot you’re hogging either. It’s not as if you were given any options.

Too bad server transfers cost money now. You can’t move around to get locations that other worlds already hold. Just have to wait for yours to do it. Hope you picked the right server…

I am currently at 94% completion and the WvW is killing me. It’s going to take a long time for me to get 100%.

I just run around naked or in town clothes, because giving the other teams free kills is how Anet planned it.

Made a post about this a while back saying the same thing. Having to capture Keeps/Towers in order to complete exploration points is a mistake.

I have been stuck at 99% (Need one vista point to complete) due to the fact that Commanders in WvWvW wont attack a place. The commanders will capture a few keeps/towers and then sit back or run around harassing supply camps.

All rather frustrating.

Quick Mouse.7635:

Congratulations! This is the 10000000th thread on this topic!
Here, have a cookie.

Wow thanks, I was kind of hungry.

Sorry Quick Mouse but meet me, I’m slow and old Keyboard, age is creeping up on me and I haven’t the time or inclination to read through all the other posts to see if this had been brought up. Many thanks for the Cookie mind, I shall have it with my Horlicks before bed. Much love, Andy.

1. WvW is PvE with PvP thrown in, or the other way, both work.
2. World completion is optional, if you have issues with the way it’s set up, then don’t do it.

Hahaha sorry for the sarcastic response. I’m on the forums quite a bit, and I see new threads on this topic several times a week.
Here’s the thing: you will get map completion (regardless of how long it takes your server to switch between red/green/blue) waaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyyy before you’re even close to getting your legendary.
So don’t worry about it

I think it’s unfair that i have to pve world complete for my legendary.

I think it’s unfair how this game is set up. It makes no sense! [/sarcasm]

WvW is PvE and PvP mixed. Separating it from World Discovery would make it lean more towards PvP, though it was clear from the start that it would contain a mixture of both worlds. World Completion is optional. Achievements are optional.

If you feel like discovering the entire world isn’t your cup of tea, then don’t do it. It’s as simple as that.

MrKnieves.4162:

2. World completion is optional, if you have issues with the way it’s set up, then don’t do it.

and

AprilRain.7649:

Achievements are optional.

If you feel like discovering the entire world isn’t your cup of tea, then don’t do it. It’s as simple as that.

Playing the game at all is optional so I’m unclear what the point of this statement is. The topic at hand is evaluating the Map Complete achievement and whether the requirements for getting that achievement consistent and make sense. Many posit that the WvW requirement for what is primarily a PvE achievement makes little to no sense and in some cases, depending on the server you’re on, creates an inflated level of difficulty that shouldn’t exist.

No, we don’t “have” to do this (or much else in life but die), but if they are going to present us with an achievement like this, especially one that’s tied to certain end game rewards, then have it make sense. Right now, it really doesn’t.

MrKnieves.4162:

1. WvW is PvE with PvP thrown in, or the other way, both work.
2. World completion is optional, if you have issues with the way it’s set up, then don’t do it.

Don’t get me wrong, I don’t mind them being in WvWvW, hell I enjoy WvWvW. However having to rely on others to help you complete something is where the problem for me lies.

Sure leave the points in. Place them in dangerous places close to keeps/enemy spawn zones etc….. That I don’t mind. Just don’t make me rely on others to get something.

I think some people are missing the point that me being in WvW is only helping the opposing servers and hindering my own.

As a matter of fact, did start one thread with that also….totally agree with OP especially since it’s costly to change server. And by the way, it’s not only waiting for our world to get to a specific place, things is that unless one of the world really bad, there is some place that will never be on our side…Yes I know Map Completion is optional, as anything in a game…but Map Completion is pure PvE, nothing to do with PvP…..

WvW has to be removed from Map Completion since guesting is impossible in that area.

my gripe with this is, open the world map and try and point out where the www area is…. that’s right its NOT THERE!!!!!! …

The WWW maps are not part of the world at all. It would make more sense to add waypoints in Dungeons at least they are on the map…..

While WvW may technically still have aspects of PvE, being able to reach POIs and vistas is completely reliant on the PvP aspect of the game. If one realm controls a POI, you’re unable to reach it unless it’s recaptured. Which can potentially require fighting through an enemy PvP zerg.

“World Completion is optional” is a terrible argument. Everything in the game is optional. You don’t have to do hearts, or unlock skill points, or earn karma, or even gold. But you want to. And it makes the game more enriching to be able to do so.

I think the WvW points are cool, and a nice incentive for those that WvW. But they should not count toward World Completion. The PvP battleground maps don’t count, why should the WvW maps? They aren’t technically part of the explorable world imo.

The basic issue with WvW mapping is making an individual accomplishment (world mapping) dependent on something no individual has any control over (ownership of certain WvW PoIs/Vistas etc.). I love WvW personally. Thankfully I have been able to map all WvW maps with two characters already. But ironically enough my current WvW main character lacks 3 points in Eternal Battleground and my server has been unable to conquer the corresponding strongholds in around 10 weeks. I dare saying that this situation is common for a lot of servers, not just mine. In many tiers one server is so overwhelmingly dominant that conquering their home castles is unthinkable. This means that essentially nobody is able to compete their maps at this time. And THAT is silly.

I took an lvl 8 into wvwvw and got all the POI/vistas/SPs (did get help on the Skritt SP in fairness, from a rival server player!) and came out lvl 11.

Yes, its a challenge. Games are intended to be a challenge.

GuzziHero.2467:

I took an lvl 8 into wvwvw and got all the POI/vistas/SPs (did get help on the Skritt SP in fairness, from a rival server player!) and came out lvl 11.

Yes, its a challenge. Games are intended to be a challenge.

You weren’t level 8.

Yeah, I kind of agree with you. I’d prefer it if the WvW map completion were a separate achievement from the general PvE world map completion. It was a royal pain and it took me a long while to do, but I did finally get my 100% world completion star. lol

So glad that’s over, though.

GuzziHero.2467:

I took an lvl 8 into wvwvw and got all the POI/vistas/SPs (did get help on the Skritt SP in fairness, from a rival server player!) and came out lvl 11.

Yes, its a challenge. Games are intended to be a challenge.

Oh, actually I did the same with a level 5 back then. Am I not awesome!!!!

Thing is – that was when my server was in a tier when we were steamrolling the opposition and owned entire maps at a time. In Tier 2 we’re the punching ball, though. Like I said, TC hasn’t been able to breach Green’s home castle in WEEKS. And yes, we tried. Getting into green castle in our tier isn’t called “challenging”, it’s called “infeasible”.

Slowburn.5319:

So you don’t like the ’it’s optional, dont do it’ statement eh?

The problem lies in that you ‘do’ want to do it… you just want it to be easier and or more catered to ‘you’. Cry babies cry.

Read it again. Never said I didn’t like the argument. I said it’s an invalid argument. ’It’s optional" refers to every aspect of GW2. Never said I wanted it to be easier. Said that World Completion (a PvE achievement) should logically be limited to PvE play. Pull up the world map, and you see the world. Except apparently the WvW maps (which don’t appear on the world map) are a part of the world, required for 100% completion. But they’re not there. And, unlike the non-WvW maps, to complete them you have to rely on the efforts of others (PvP), not yourself.

It’s not an “I want it, make it easy for me” argument. It’s a “this doesn’t make any kitten sense” argument.

Seras.5702:

It’s not an “I want it, make it easy for me” argument.

This is a common accusation that is trotted out in online forums when nothing intelligent can be thought to be said. lol

Seras.5702:

Slowburn.5319:

So you don’t like the ’it’s optional, dont do it’ statement eh?

The problem lies in that you ‘do’ want to do it… you just want it to be easier and or more catered to ‘you’. Cry babies cry.

Read it again.

You’re feeding the trolls, stop that!

Said that World Completion (a PvE achievement) should logically be limited to PvE play. …..And, unlike the non-WvW maps, to complete them you have to rely on the efforts of others (PvP), not yourself.

It’s not an “I want it, make it easy for me” argument. It’s a “this doesn’t make any kitten sense” argument.

Exactly this. There’s no rhyme or reason. Difficult (or near impossible on some servers) or not, there’s not a lick of sense to be found in the pairing the WvW maps and PvE maps and calling the two disparate worlds “Map Completion”.

Missywink.7162:

MrKnieves.4162:

1. WvW is PvE with PvP thrown in, or the other way, both work.
2. World completion is optional, if you have issues with the way it’s set up, then don’t do it.

Don’t get me wrong, I don’t mind them being in WvWvW, hell I enjoy WvWvW. However having to rely on others to help you complete something is where the problem for me lies.

Sure leave the points in. Place them in dangerous places close to keeps/enemy spawn zones etc….. That I don’t mind. Just don’t make me rely on others to get something.

GUILD Wars

MrKnieves.4162:

Missywink.7162:

MrKnieves.4162:

1. WvW is PvE with PvP thrown in, or the other way, both work.
2. World completion is optional, if you have issues with the way it’s set up, then don’t do it.

Don’t get me wrong, I don’t mind them being in WvWvW, hell I enjoy WvWvW. However having to rely on others to help you complete something is where the problem for me lies.

Sure leave the points in. Place them in dangerous places close to keeps/enemy spawn zones etc….. That I don’t mind. Just don’t make me rely on others to get something.

GUILD Wars

250 years ago. The GUILD Wars are over, you need to brush up on your lore.

MrKnieves.4162:

Missywink.7162:

MrKnieves.4162:

1. WvW is PvE with PvP thrown in, or the other way, both work.
2. World completion is optional, if you have issues with the way it’s set up, then don’t do it.

Don’t get me wrong, I don’t mind them being in WvWvW, hell I enjoy WvWvW. However having to rely on others to help you complete something is where the problem for me lies.

Sure leave the points in. Place them in dangerous places close to keeps/enemy spawn zones etc….. That I don’t mind. Just don’t make me rely on others to get something.

GUILD Wars

From wiki : "The name of the series comes from the Guild Wars, a series of conflicts between Tyrian guilds which led to decline of humanity and allowing the charr to invade and eventually retake Ascalon, and other events of the first series of the games. "

Sorry your arguments is invalid :-)

I am in complete agreement that something needs to be done to make mapping WvWvW more feasible for those who aren’t fortunate enough to be on a dominant WvWvW server. Why? Basically due to the same reason others have stated above that it’s basically impossible to breach all green keeps/towers on some servers (e.g. I’m on Devona’s Rest and I’ve yet to see us get into the main Ehmry Bay keep).

Fyi – I already have WvWvW completely mapped on 3 characters, but I was able to do so while still being able to transfer servers. Now as others have said, it’s very difficult to map green keeps/towers if your server just doesn’t have the manpower to overtake them. Sure you can pay to transfer, but why should you be penalized while someone else who is lucky enough to already be on a dominant WvWwW server is not?

Slowburn.5319:

I think it’s unfair that i have to pve world complete for my legendary.

Probably shouldn’t have bought a game that consists of 90% pure PvE content then, huh? It might even be higher than that since three WvW maps are basically carbon copies of one another.

Fiddlestyx.9714:

You weren’t level 8.

Yes, Sir. I was.

All my ranger had done to that point was all the Lion’s Arch POI/Vistas, all the home zones and all of the Ebonhawke ones other than the SP where you battle a lvl 40 Ebon Vanguard. Got one shotted by Lvl40 separatists a couple of times.

Then I went to WvWvW and finished that (with a few deaths and lots of narrow squeaks!).

Kimyrielle.3826:

Oh, actually I did the same with a level 5 back then. Am I not awesome!!!!

I’m jelly

Fiddlestyx.9714:

I think some people are missing the point that me being in WvW is only helping the opposing servers and hindering my own.

Been trying to tell these induhviduals that for months but it never sinks in. Guess that’s fine for everyone but your own server, which is why they have kitten all to say about it.

Camp those server spots and be as useless as you can be. That’s what map completion is all about. Glad it’s optional so I can pretend that I’m actually there of my own volition and not just wasting my time, in addition to that of my “team”.

Blacklight.2871:

Fiddlestyx.9714:

I think some people are missing the point that me being in WvW is only helping the opposing servers and hindering my own.

Been trying to tell these induhviduals that for months but it never sinks in. Guess that’s fine for everyone but your own server, which is why they have kitten all to say about it.

Camp those server spots and be as useless as you can be. That’s what map completion is all about. Glad it’s optional so I can pretend that I’m actually there of my own volition and not just wasting my time, in addition to that of my “team”.

Yeah and if a lot of us went into WvW and stood around and did nothing we would get in trouble for griefing, as long as it’s just a few now and then it’s working as intended. So Anet is basically saying griefing is ok as long as just a few do it. I’ll have to remember that the next time I find an exploit nobody knows of.

Folks, notice something. Few people (if any) are complaining about the 500 badge of honor requirement for getting a legendary.

And as someone else noticed, this is the 10,000th thread on WvW mapping.

This is only tangentially about legendaries, folks.

What this is really about is people who see a bar that says 98% and they want the last 2%.

For people who complain about getting killed, yeah, it’s frustrating and I feel for you, but I don’t feel too bad for you. If it was just about randomly getting ganked, I think I could understand Anet not changing things.

But what a lot of people have to realize is that for some maps, it is really, truly, impossible to take some of the green keeps on Eternal Battlegrounds. I’ve been waiting about a month and checking the map at least once a day.

Completing an achievement should be fun and it should be challenging. It shouldn’t be nigh-impossible.

I shouldn’t be hoping that my server sucks this week and drops a tier. I really shouldn’t.

Kaiwen.1520:

But what a lot of people have to realize is that for some maps, it is really, truly, impossible to take some of the green keeps on Eternal Battlegrounds. I’ve been waiting about a month and checking the map at least once a day.

Completing an achievement should be fun and it should be challenging. It shouldn’t be nigh-impossible.

Exactly this. I would love to hear a rational response from either Anet or anyone for that matter on how it makes any sense whatsoever to include WvW maps into the PvE map completion achievement.

Either Map completion should be ALL maps (PvP, WvW and PvE) or it should just be PvE.

Getting this in the first few weeks while it was 24hr matches… feels good brah.

Andy Rymz.7518:

I have to say I think making the WvW maps part of the world map completion was a mistake. I love the game but I have no interest in the WvW part but attempting to complete the world map is incredibly irritating whilst continually being attacked by other players. Surely there could be something introduced to highlight a players is simply in the region for map completion purposes and not to join in the general battling.

Oh yes, I agree 100 percent. I just hate WvW, I’ve spent the last two weeks working on getting the map completion and its been a real pain….I have one poi left and have not been able to get it to it the last two days…

Your idea won’t work with the highlighted players for map completion as most of the poi’s/vistas you need are in contested or captured areas by other servers. So unless you join in to try and capture that area you pretty much out of luck…

Blacklight.2871:

Fiddlestyx.9714:

I think some people are missing the point that me being in WvW is only helping the opposing servers and hindering my own.

Been trying to tell these induhviduals that for months but it never sinks in. Guess that’s fine for everyone but your own server, which is why they have kitten all to say about it.

Camp those server spots and be as useless as you can be. That’s what map completion is all about. Glad it’s optional so I can pretend that I’m actually there of my own volition and not just wasting my time, in addition to that of my “team”.

Guess you should have bought a game that was %100 pve then.

This sounds more like"I can’t finish the WvW completion in one sitting so it is unfair". I got the WvW completion, yes it took time. I got most of the points as the server cycled through the different colors. Each time we had a different colored map I could go grab the points I did not yet have. No, nobody controls what color you currently have, had the same color for like 5 weeks for me.

kratan.4619:

This sounds more like"I can’t finish the WvW completion in one sitting so it is unfair".

I really don’t see this attitude here at all. Many players in this thread have expressed their frustration after waiting weeks for their chance to finish their maps. I know a couple of players that have been waiting months to finish theirs. No one is saying they want to finish their WvW maps from start to finish in an afternoon, so I’m not sure where you’re getting this.

Celtic Lady.3729:

No one is saying they want to finish their WvW maps from start to finish in an afternoon, so I’m not sure where you’re getting this.

There are a few trolls in this thread that aren’t “getting” anything or trying to make salient points, they’re just throwing pointless “crybaby”, “it’s optional” comments or any number of pointless little snipes that don’t add anything constructive to either side of the debate. It’s usually best to give them a response that is of commensurate value to their own contributions which usually means no response is warranted at all.

Ah, okay. Gotcha. Thanks for clarifying.

Slowburn.5319:

Blacklight.2871:

Fiddlestyx.9714:

I think some people are missing the point that me being in WvW is only helping the opposing servers and hindering my own.

Been trying to tell these induhviduals that for months but it never sinks in. Guess that’s fine for everyone but your own server, which is why they have kitten all to say about it.

Camp those server spots and be as useless as you can be. That’s what map completion is all about. Glad it’s optional so I can pretend that I’m actually there of my own volition and not just wasting my time, in addition to that of my “team”.

Guess you should have bought a game that was %100 pve then.

Thought I had. Remember that ol’ “play the game how you want to play it” garbage? Sounded accurate until the PvP shoehorning started occurring.

Hope you’re not on a busy WvW server. I’d hate to think someone who thought as I did, was squatting on a spot you’re waiting for.

Given that the only thing world completions gets you is 2 ingredients for a legendary weapon which also requires you to get 500 Badges of Honor from WvWvW I fail to see what the problem is.

Protoavis.9107:

Given that the only thing world completions gets you is 2 ingredients for a legendary weapon which also requires you to get 500 Badges of Honor from WvWvW I fail to see what the problem is.

It also gets you a completed symbol on your login page, a star beside your name, and 100% for your character in general.

Seriously, there is more than one way to look at most things.

Agree including WvW was a bad design decision. I hope they’ll think it through and exclude WvW from map completion.

Celtic Lady.3729:

Protoavis.9107:

Given that the only thing world completions gets you is 2 ingredients for a legendary weapon which also requires you to get 500 Badges of Honor from WvWvW I fail to see what the problem is.

It also gets you a completed symbol on your login page, a star beside your name, and 100% for your character in general.

Seriously, there is more than one way to look at most things.

Yeah, some people like having goals they want to complete. Split the achievement into one for Tyria and one for the WvW Mists, then make the legendary requirement drop when you complete both. Design separate symbols for all three. This would please both those who do not want to WvW and those who don’t want to leave WvW.

I agree OP. I think its really dumb that Anet forces people into pvp in order to complete a pve achievement. Add in the fact that some servers are bad enough to never control certain spots and youve got something that not only sucks to do but is impossible for some people. Thats not fun for anyone.

Just the other night, I needed one more PoI in an opposing BL and even though we had the superior numbers, supply, and siege to easily take it, our kitten commanders ran right by it and ignored it. And this was after several people requested we take it because they needed it as well. Its because of this stupidity and dependecy on others that make map completion impossible at times.

Ive also ran into the problem of my server NEVER controlling certain areas of the BLs, even though we are always the winning team (green). Of course an easy fix to this would be to make every realm alternate colors instead of always being the same one, but it seems even Anet cant be bothered to implement this simple solution to help people out.

Zeph.5927:

Of course an easy fix to this would be to make every realm alternate colors instead of always being the same one, but it seems even Anet cant be bothered to implement this simple solution to help people out.

As a fairy regular WvW player, I have wondered why they didn’t do -exactly- that anyway, and not just for making mapping more accessible. Change is a good thing and getting red castle week after week after week just because we’re the weakest server in our tier is booooring.