Advocate of learning and being a useful party member.
http://mythdragons.enjin.com/recruitment
Nomads is basically a troll stat.
As outlined previously, it is bad for wvw. Many reasons, like you hit like a wet noodle and the enemy can completely disregard your presence. for commanders, you lose any ability to gauge how much health your zerg is at (I have a tendency to pugmand on a zerker staff ele, for the simple reason: If I’m still alive, there is no way on tyria you died). This keeps the pugs inclined to stay close. Guild groups aren’t much different tbh, but they want more zerker heavy people for the bulldozing with active defenses style play. That, and they know how to not stand in front of a melee train then wonder why they died.
PvE.. Dead mob = no threat
Kited/tanked mob = can still hit you.
I tend to die more in pug groups with zerker than guild groups simply because I end up carrying pugs. Not enough damage across the team, not enough active defenses or might stacking. Tend to burn extra active defense skills because pugs can’t dodge (too used to sitting there in their nomads gear saying “lol what damage?”).
also zerk meta, for 99% of dungeon fights means bosses dead <10s. Even 30s is slow for most fights. Let alone the 5-10 minutes that seems to be acceptable for the majority. Its hardly surprising you run out of <insert defensive ability here>.
10seconds vs 10 minutes. Yet people wonder why those who know how to play are “elitist” and expect you to learn to play your class too..
To anyone about to retort with " zerk is easy, no skill just 111 dead boss insta win!" Or similar arguments, see this thread (then feel free to learn to play):
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/game/dungeons/Carried-Players/first#post4476334
I’m all down for necro’ing a thread when it’s hating on a truly awful gear stat distribution.
Please, come in and tell us more about how you are the last man standing when all your zerker teammates are dead, and then how you solo’ed the boss with your wet noodle attacks. I need entertainment to go with my morning coffee!
Necro thread indeed…
Nomad gear has it’s uses, mostly for tanking-control combo builds. Warrior is one who benefits most of the ARMOR-healing-vitality, due to healing and control abilities tied mostly to Defense trait line.
But for PvE, 99% of all mobs are designed to die quick, which is not good for healing, control, conditions and boon/condition manipulation, or even for tanking, which are designed for mobs that don’t die in 1-3 seconds and to provide longevity to players.
Berserker is dominant stat choice, as it deals the highest possible direct dmg, if mobs die before they can do anything, it pretty much defends itself against damage and other effects…
Only the 1% of PvE mobs, which are world bosses with more complex mechanics, some dungeon mobs (Many still just use high HP as buffer without touching armor or anything else, so Direct Dmg will deal damage without much hinderance, while conditions suffer from the high HP buffer), Mordrem, Giant Beetles and Veteran Karka,
are the mobs where builds other than DPS have equal chances.
Other problem is that the Open World PvE mobs are “Super Easy Mode”, because of “High HP-High Dmg per Attack-Long action delays-Low/0 Armor-Harmless abilities” design, which was for Casuals, but means that mobs don’t do anything else, than just die. Most combat is done without dodging, strategical positioning or use of other skills.
(edited by FrostSpectre.4198)
2 zerker warriors? Come on, 4 war 1 mes is the meta. Absolute best dps in the game, especially if there’s one shout heal for that op regen and everyone is running ruby orbs ( more crit chance). Mesmer should be healing mantra, prismatic understanding staff/ scepter torch condi: 1 condi user is mandatory to boost the team dps, don’t listen to those zerker elitists. Everyone plays gs/ rifle but I feel like a melee weapon is kinda exploitive so I run longbow/ rifle.
I aprove only zerker warriors, 2 in a team is a good thing. but 4 zerkers is too much and dps lose.
Feel free to check out the link in my signature. You can see the dungeon speed run records where everyone in the group is full dps. You can also watch the replays of the last dungeon tournament where everyone in the group is full dps.
The fact that you think everyone in dps gear dies alot and is a waste says more about you and your playskill than some universal truth.
LOL for U man, I dont care if I kill a boss in 3 or 4 minutes. 1 minute don’t mean nothing to me. But if you are a full zerker and you die even with my perma protection plus my heals than its YOUR issue not mine. There are lot of good zerker groups but also there are bad ones. Zerker dont mean a thing if you dont have any skill to back up it with. Being a zerker and being a kitteny one makes you dead in no time and your party frustrated.
But.. If you’re a tank, you should be taking aggro and no squishy dps should die, because you’re here to protect them right? Would that mean… horrified stance your extra toughness is useless for your teammates? * screams, cries, lots of people dying in the background*
First off – players are allowed to play how they wish to in this game, regardless if you disagree with them. If that is a problem for you or anyone else, perhaps a single player or co-op game would be better for you.
Secondly I foresee this thread going down the negative nancy toilet extremely fast – just like the last TVH thread did. What happened to that thread? After deleting over half of the posts, they then decided to just trash the entire thread.
Playing how you want doesn’t give you the right to ruin other peoples in-game experience. Also if he wanted to use that gear he would be better off in the main zerg anyway. I don’t care for the people who force their play styles that can potentially ruin my fun. If that makes me an elitist, so be it.
Yes, that does make you an elitist.
This….. “Playing how you want doesn’t give you the right to ruin other peoples in-game experience.” And this…. “I don’t care for the people who force their play styles that can potentially ruin my fun.” ….. They make you hypocrite.
not that I consider an elitist a bad thing, but that actually just makes you a person who understands the game mechanics.
First off – players are allowed to play how they wish to in this game, regardless if you disagree with them. If that is a problem for you or anyone else, perhaps a single player or co-op game would be better for you.
Secondly I foresee this thread going down the negative nancy toilet extremely fast – just like the last TVH thread did. What happened to that thread? After deleting over half of the posts, they then decided to just trash the entire thread.
Playing how you want doesn’t give you the right to ruin other peoples in-game experience. Also if he wanted to use that gear he would be better off in the main zerg anyway. I don’t care for the people who force their play styles that can potentially ruin my fun. If that makes me an elitist, so be it.
Yes, that does make you an elitist.
This….. “Playing how you want doesn’t give you the right to ruin other peoples in-game experience.” And this…. “I don’t care for the people who force their play styles that can potentially ruin my fun.” ….. They make you hypocrite.
not that I consider an elitist a bad thing,
but that actually just makes you a person who understands the game mechanics.
Nope : brain makes you understand game mechanics, not elitism.
I do have a brain, I do understand that eventually you want to max your dps to clear content faster to get more shiny in PvE.
Yet I still walk as a valk ele with ranger runes because I can’t be bothered to time all my dodges and healing. So stop telling me what I should wear or that I’m stupid.
And yes I don’t care if my AC P1 takes 20min instead of 5. I play for fun, not for profit. #filthycasual
But.. If you’re a tank, you should be taking aggro and no squishy dps should die, because you’re here to protect them right? Would that mean… horrified stance your extra toughness is useless for your teammates? * screams, cries, lots of people dying in the background*
I am not a tank dont have any extra toughness and I am not dying so fast its just combo zerk, valky gear for same dmg and better survival.
Breaking news: Wearing valkyrie lowers your dps and makes you tankier. That’s the point of the gear. You just said: " But if you are a full zerker and you die even with my perma protection plus my heals than its YOUR issue not mine." You’re a bad tank/healer/ whatever you think you are, because your build is made for support and you can’t support them.
I aprove only zerker warriors, 2 in a team is a good thing. but 4 zerkers is too much and dps lose.
Feel free to check out the link in my signature. You can see the dungeon speed run records where everyone in the group is full dps. You can also watch the replays of the last dungeon tournament where everyone in the group is full dps.
The fact that you think everyone in dps gear dies alot and is a waste says more about you and your playskill than some universal truth.
LOL for U man, I dont care if I kill a boss in 3 or 4 minutes. 1 minute don’t mean nothing to me. But if you are a full zerker and you die even with my perma protection plus my heals than its YOUR issue not mine. There are lot of good zerker groups but also there are bad ones. Zerker dont mean a thing if you dont have any skill to back up it with. Being a zerker and being a kitteny one makes you dead in no time and your party frustrated.
Beint terrible at the game makes people frustrated too.
I aprove only zerker warriors, 2 in a team is a good thing. but 4 zerkers is too much and dps lose.
Feel free to check out the link in my signature. You can see the dungeon speed run records where everyone in the group is full dps. You can also watch the replays of the last dungeon tournament where everyone in the group is full dps.
The fact that you think everyone in dps gear dies alot and is a waste says more about you and your playskill than some universal truth.
LOL for U man, I dont care if I kill a boss in 3 or 4 minutes. 1 minute don’t mean nothing to me. But if you are a full zerker and you die even with my perma protection plus my heals than its YOUR issue not mine. There are lot of good zerker groups but also there are bad ones. Zerker dont mean a thing if you dont have any skill to back up it with. Being a zerker and being a kitteny one makes you dead in no time and your party frustrated.
Beint terrible at the game makes people frustrated too.
I’m so frustrated right now.
Especially when you read nonsense like Damage+Damage does less damage than Damage+Vitality for unknown reasons.
Maybe he was only referring to non crittable bosses?
(I wish)
The best way to end this debacle is have boss type foes (champs/legendaries) in dungeons have a one hit kill move if they are crowded by 3 or more players. This will end the stack and press 1 mentality in a heart beat and make players play better use new tactics and different gear. Add in a fix to conditions and we have a much better game.
I don’t do Tequatal or Wurm because my PC will just crash in all that mass of players and enemies. Its a tech specification problem for me more than a skill as a player one.
And yes I don’t care if my AC P1 takes 20min instead of 5. I play for fun, not for profit. #filthycasual
Dude at least you own it :P.
I can respect that.
Thankfully, dungeons are instanced content and our playstyles don’t interfere with one another. The only time they cross paths is open world pve, which is why I don’t participate in open world PVE (except map completion).
The best way to end this debacle is have boss type foes (champs/legendaries) in dungeons have a one hit kill move if they are crowded by 3 or more players. This will end the stack and press 1 mentality in a heart beat and make players play better use new tactics and different gear.
Lots of dungeon bosses already have 1 hit kill mechanics when you stack on them, the mildly skilled among us know how to use the dodge mechanic.
(edited by calyx.9086)
Breaking news: Wearing valkyrie lowers your dps and makes you tankier. That’s the point of the gear. You just said: " But if you are a full zerker and you die even with my perma protection plus my heals than its YOUR issue not mine." You’re a bad tank/healer/ whatever you think you are, because your build is made for support and you can’t support them.
My build isnt made for support, it was made to make dmg + survival. Your assumptions are just bad.
You are from those “selling p3 10g 80lv 7k AP zerkers no other” lfg type of a player?
At least people in this awful gear set will not be rewarded with champ boxes in other world events because they won’t do enough to tag it.
Honestly, the more people who wear this crap, the easier it is for me to tag stuff, so whatever.
That means gw2 design is play zerker or gtfo.
between trinity or this play zerker or gtfo, call de devil and choose the worse.
My build isnt made for support, it was made to make dmg + survival. Your assumptions are just bad.
I used to run PTV on that same theory. That needing to pull out of melee reduced my DPS.
Technically it does.
But that need just goes away when I’m with a good zerker group. (Also really helps to have a good guardian with well timed aegis and such.)
Like I said before: If I’m zerking alone, I die from time to time. If we’re all zerking, we all live.*
*There are a few unique non zerker builds that compliment zerkers well.
Breaking news: Wearing valkyrie lowers your dps and makes you tankier. That’s the point of the gear. You just said: " But if you are a full zerker and you die even with my perma protection plus my heals than its YOUR issue not mine." You’re a bad tank/healer/ whatever you think you are, because your build is made for support and you can’t support them.
My build isnt made for support, it was made to make dmg + survival. Your assumptions are just bad.
You are from those “selling p3 10g 80lv 7k AP zerkers no other” lfg type of a player?
Then read what you type again and realize your build is useless in a team setting, and since you don’t bring proper support to a dungeon, there’s no reason to play with you at all over a supportive player. I didn’t make false assumption, I wanted you to say out loud how selfish you were, and how you expect people to carry you with your non supportive build. You accused some pugs of dying, but since you did nothing to help them and work as a team you have absolutely no right to judge them, and they were probably better players than you.
:)
Nomad would be good if the plan was to kite and kill nothing until battery phase. Then everyone would have to be wearing it.
Zerkers will make quick work of those mobs assuming that no champ or creeper spawns and that the team knows to destroy the hypnoss first and no one will have time to go down unless they are reckless.
Having suboptimal gear for defense can be very problematic, because it can mean being unable to get rid of all the mobs before the next spawn, which can mean getting wiped when the other wave comes, because attrition. So that guy was wrong in using Nomad’s gear. You might as well have had just 4 members there…
(edited by Kasima.8143)
The amount of dead and downed people at the zerg group with teq is huge sometimes
If you factor in the time it takes to revive a downed player, and during this time the downed player and his rezzers dont do damage, i realy dont think it makes much difference in the end damage wise at these big events.As somebody who did tequatl quite few times and spends lots of time teaching noobs how to deal with him, I cannot but agree with you.
Lots of players are amazed when I tell them that zerker is a bad choice for tequatl/wurm. They try to lecture me pretending berserker gear is the ONLY viable gear for the ENTIRE PvE section of the game.
However I’m not surprized anymore : I just browsed dulfy’s website. Members of [rT] are posting excellent quides for Speed Clearing dungeons and fractals. What is the only HUGE downside of these guides ?
=> They advertize it as PvE quide when it’s clearly speed clear in an organized group.No wonder why elite wannabe are screwed up when they try larger event. They are truly misguided by this kind of stuff.
Back on topic : Nomad gear is made for those who want unkillable elementalist or necromancer commander. The goal of the commander is to…. command (duh!) and thus to stay alive. The zerg is supposed to dish out damage.
Of course in PvE where the goal is mostly to kill stuff quickly, going full tank does not make much sense. Power has always some use.
Did you all skip the part where the guy said he was doing defence?
Yes, yes you did.
Omg are you reading what I wrote or just judging LOL. I am not in PVT gear. MG so many ignorant ppl.
And I dont care what you think of my build or anything. I’m just saying, too many stupid zerkers around thinking they are good.
Breaking news: Wearing valkyrie lowers your dps and makes you tankier. That’s the point of the gear. You just said: " But if you are a full zerker and you die even with my perma protection plus my heals than its YOUR issue not mine." You’re a bad tank/healer/ whatever you think you are, because your build is made for support and you can’t support them.
My build isnt made for support, it was made to make dmg + survival. Your assumptions are just bad.
You are from those “selling p3 10g 80lv 7k AP zerkers no other” lfg type of a player?
Then read what you type again and realize your build is useless in a team setting, and since you don’t bring proper support to a dungeon, there’s no reason to play with you at all over a supportive player. I didn’t make false assumption, I wanted you to say out loud how selfish you were, and how you expect people to carry you with your non supportive build. You accused some pugs of dying, but since you did nothing to help them and work as a team you have absolutely no right to judge them, and they were probably better players than you.
:)
Your just trolling. move along.
I didn’t even know TVH existed, wht a joke lol doing zero damage in a DPS game
WvW commanders disagree with this statement. In competitive modes, conditions and tanking have their place.
As for tequatl, THANKS FOR NECROING THIS DISCUSSION BTW, a group can succeed with nomad gear (since a group can kill tequatl while naked just saying). So get off you high horses and stop telling players in open world what stats they should wear. Keep this kind of comment for your dungeon party.
I’d rather have a nomad noob doing very little dps than a berserk noob laying dead and doing no dps.
That would be with a guild group. With a pug group? Not sure about that.
Did you all skip the part where the guy said he was doing defence?
Yes, yes you did.
AFAIK, def is not about killing mobs, def is about keeping turrets alive and working. You can keep turrets alive by kiting away mobs from the turret (I did it, was quite fun actually). It is one of the possible ways to handle tequatl and tanky gear is better for this.
And btw, mobs in def are no stronger than open world mobs (i.e the one you kill by spamming 1), you can manage them no matter what gear you wear. As far as I can see, killing a krait in def in 30 sec instead of 45 sec won’t get tequatl killed faster. Just saying.
You’re just bothering ppl for nothing.
(edited by VodCom.6924)
AFAIK, def is not about killing mobs, def is about keeping turrets alive and working. You can keep turrets alive by kiting away mobs from the turret (I did it, was quite fun actually). It is one of the possible ways to handle tequatl and tanky gear is better for this.
It might have had some sense if the mobs at turrets went after people with high toughness. Instead, they almost always go straight at zerkers (or more precisely at people that do the most damage to them). Nomad there is not only useless (next to no damage, and mobs ignore him), but also can scale up the event to champs. If you really want to have a survival gear, go soldier or cleric (hey, even go sentinel, if you really want), but stay away from Nomad.
nah, I tried to calc around nomads, it just isn’t worth it.
Also, staff is garbage, the amount of dmg you’re not doing while casting it doesnt trade up the might stacks you hand out.
I use staff on my guardian pretty much all the time. In an out of dungeons. This weapon has the best output of HEALING and might with the right trait and gear. Skill 4 have fast CD and might is always welcome. Also the healing output is insane. The OP has issues with mobs from tequatl? Weird, he must be playing with lazy ppl slacking the dodge button.
For example, try my guardian Fractal 50 – Archdiver, fire seal in the mid. Never failed to loose a person to date.
Except Healing is not useful in PVE and the Ele in the group is already supplying longer lasting might. Using Empower would only overwrite the longer duration might. Staff auto is also pretty bad, unless you are mindlessly tagging mobs in cursed shore then its fine.
Except Healing is not useful in PVE and the Ele in the group is already supplying longer lasting might. Using Empower would only overwrite the longer duration might. Staff auto is also pretty bad, unless you are mindlessly tagging mobs in cursed shore then its fine.
Without a guardian by it’s side, an elementalist is a total failure nowadays imo. So your argument is invalid.
Without a guardian by it’s side, an elementalist is a total failure nowadays imo. So your argument is invalid.
A normal zerker DPS traited Guardian’s Aegis is just as strong as whatever crazy “tank” Guardian’s Aegis… if that is what you were referring too. Support comes from skills (and traits), not from stats (for PvE).
Without a guardian by it’s side, an elementalist is a total failure nowadays imo. So your argument is invalid.
A normal zerker DPS traited Guardian’s Aegis is just as strong as whatever crazy “tank” Guardian’s Aegis… if that is what you were referring too. Support comes from skills (and traits), not from stats.
DPS traited guard is the worst class at the moment. It always has been. There is a huge CD for the aegis to refresh in a dps build and it saves you from 1 hit and that’s it. Then 80 seconds cd? Fail imo.
Let’s say you use “Shave yourselves” and you can place x2 Aegis in a row. Not recomended. I’ve seen so many failed guardian builds, sometimes I wonder if we play the same game or not lol.
I wonder if we play the same game or not lol
It is very apparent that we do not, as you are clearly talking about a different game, or you are simply a noob/scrub if you were talking about GW2.
Without a guardian by it’s side, an elementalist is a total failure nowadays imo. So your argument is invalid.
A normal zerker DPS traited Guardian’s Aegis is just as strong as whatever crazy “tank” Guardian’s Aegis… if that is what you were referring too. Support comes from skills (and traits), not from stats.
DPS traited guard is the worst class at the moment. It always has been. There is a huge CD for the aegis to refresh in a dps build and it saves you from 1 hit and that’s it. Then 80 seconds cd? Fail imo.
Let’s say you use “Shave yourselves” and you can place x2 Aegis in a row. Not recomended. I’ve seen so many failed guardian builds, sometimes I wonder if we play the same game or not lol.
The best pve guardians in the game all play berserker guardian. I can name them if you like so you can get some pointers.
Omg are you reading what I wrote or just judging LOL. I am not in PVT gear. MG so many ignorant ppl.
And I dont care what you think of my build or anything. I’m just saying, too many stupid zerkers around thinking they are good.
Too many stupid baddies around thinking they are better
Did you all skip the part where the guy said he was doing defence?
Yes, yes you did.
AFAIK, def is not about killing mobs, def is about keeping turrets alive and working. You can keep turrets alive by kiting away mobs from the turret (I did it, was quite fun actually). It is one of the possible ways to handle tequatl and tanky gear is better for this.
And btw, mobs in def are no stronger than open world mobs (i.e the one you kill by spamming 1), you can manage them no matter what gear you wear. As far as I can see, killing a krait in def in 30 sec instead of 45 sec won’t get tequatl killed faster. Just saying.
You’re just bothering ppl for nothing.
Difference comes in when you get people trying to “help” somewhere causing vet/elite/champ spawns. Being able to put those down before the next wave is pretty much key to not wiping, regardless of gear. You wipe = turrets will get aggro. Defense failed.
In a “perfect teq” you could run any build with a modicum of dps and be fine. However that rarely happens, So often you will be carrying others with terrible builds etc.
(eg, correctly spec’d zerk ele will be doing 14k+ dps. A badly spec’d one may only get 2k dps). A defense group probably needs average dps of around 6k+ per person to have a smooth time.
DPS traited guard is the worst class at the moment. It always has been. There is a huge CD for the aegis to refresh in a dps build and it saves you from 1 hit and that’s it. Then 80 seconds cd? Fail imo.
Let’s say you use “Shave yourselves” and you can place x2 Aegis in a row. Not recomended. I’ve seen so many failed guardian builds, sometimes I wonder if we play the same game or not lol.
Nope, necro is.
60s by default after the patch tomorrow it will be 40s on Retreat but you have your F3 your elite to refresh it and shield of the avenger as well and i don’t even mentioned mace3 or focus5 …
Save yourselves doesn’t apply aegis.
You are either a troll or a scrub. Get out of my internet.
ps: At least be accurate if you try to argue.
i’d rather have “that guy” in a group
I do North boats at reset
But seriously, i do do north boats normally, and I dont really care what kind of armor a guardian in my group is wearing, if he does his GS5 pull on spawns I am happy.
On another note…..HOLY NECRO BATMAN
He did mistake if he want to ’’tank’’ he should use shield as it give him extra aggro according to the wiki
Youre honestly discussing a Nomad’s wearing Staff wielding Guardian in open world PvE? Good one!
nah, I tried to calc around nomads, it just isn’t worth it.
Also, staff is garbage, the amount of dmg you’re not doing while casting it doesnt trade up the might stacks you hand out.
I use staff on my guardian pretty much all the time. In an out of dungeons. This weapon has the best output of HEALING and might with the right trait and gear. Skill 4 have fast CD and might is always welcome. Also the healing output is insane. The OP has issues with mobs from tequatl? Weird, he must be playing with lazy ppl slacking the dodge button.
For example, try my guardian Fractal 50 – Archdiver, fire seal in the mid. Never failed to loose a person to date.
You do realize that every single hardcore PvE guild uses either GS/Sw+F or Hammer/x for Fractals on a Guardian*? Staff is among the worst you can do. Healing as a stat is about as bad as it gets. It’s been two years and yet people who are trying to discuss builds still don’t understand the meta and why it’s better than whatever crap they come up with.
*With Mace and Scepter having niche uses
(edited by Veydar.5017)
Runes alone don’t make a whole build. If your traits, other equipment stats, and skills are all strictly offensive, Nomad’s runes might be a nice counterbalance to keep you alive.
He might do a little less damage but survive longer( more armor and HP), so it is a crap shoot, depending on how good he was. Zerker isn’t everything in this game.
I see more zerker’s down in fights with world bosses than any other type of gear because they are glass cannons and the world bosses have huge HP pools compared to how much damage Zerkers put out.
Actually for a Tequatl Fight….. ideally you want to kill the mobs as fast as possible if you are on a defense team.
The only time you want anyone in survivability gear is the people in the zerg during the first Teq attack phase. (And that is power toughness and vitality, not TVH, since you still need to be doing damage to push him to a battery phase)
After the first battery defense phase, everyone should be running max dps gear (yes, i know you can’t crit teqatl) since Tequatl will not be attacking again for the rest of the fight as long as everyone is doing enough damage.
It is okay if you don’t understand all the mechanics behind a Tequatl fight, not a lot of players do…. but as someone who has lead organized tequatl kills since the boss was first updated to be stronger, I can tell you there is no place for a TVH staff guardian in a defense squad.
Those squads have an exact number of players to balance out mob strength vs party strength without upscaling the foes. If you are basically running one man short you are greatly hindering your squad’s performance, and therefore are putting turrets, and the entire fight in jeopardy.
(edited by TheBlackLeech.9360)
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