Guild Wars 2

Ninjeff.6510:

First of all, Who actually thinks of Guild Halls as content? Putting furniture in a building is boring, pointless, and seems like just a lack of the devs actually making content. Not only that it take tons of time and materials for what ?

I dont play mmo’s to play house. I play mmo’s for pve content, pvp content, and the experience’s that go along with that. Wish they would have just made new dungeons, fractals, more raids, another pvp map! , or pretty much anything other than this “lets play house” stuff.

Hehehe, from my side I expected a game called GUILD wars be more centered in Guilds, Halls might just be the beginning, for sure more in-depth is coming like guild vs guild battles…etc. I see they are increasing the importance of Guilds in WvW but dunno how is that working, probably not focused on that atm.

I’m going to attempt to put in a support ticket requesting reimbursement for all the mats we invested and the gold to start the event. I’m not wasting my time nor mats anymore just to put more in for the next level. We’ve already pulled out of WvW over this and we’re going to go about our merry way.

milo.7198:

I’m in a small family guild. We aren’t mad about not getting a hall. That’s no big deal. But all the amenities we worked so hard for, harder than a bigger guild, like banners and weaponsmith, have been taken away. We would have been happy if Anet lets us keep what we unlocked and frozen all future progress until a guild hall was obtained.. It really stings because we got our weaponsmith and was in the progress of building it when HoT launched..
For us, its not that we don’t get a hall, its about all of our progress and work being erased..
It happened once before, when the Merit was introduced. Some things we had unlocked were taken away and we had to re-earn them. I believe it’s very wrong

I agree.
If nothing was lost, I may be less upset. I still think it’s BS to hide all the skins behind a fully maxed guild hall, though. I don’t want most of them, but there are some I’d like to have, but never will. I like to be ABLE to work for the things I want… and so far have been able to without having to be in a bigger guild.

Loosmaster.8263:

I’m going to attempt to put in a support ticket requesting reimbursement for all the mats we invested and the gold to start the event. I’m not wasting my time nor mats anymore just to put more in for the next level. We’ve already pulled out of WvW over this and we’re going to go about our merry way.

Did it. I hope you get a more favorable response than I did!

Dejavu.2349:

My problem is that I was never required to deal with people before HOT… I COULD do it on my own….

How did you get dungeon skins on your own? Those have existed in the game since day one, and require interaction with other players to obtain, either via grouping to do dungeon runs or, eventually, playing with other players in PvP games to get rewards.

If you’ve been able to accept for the last three years that dungeon skins were out of your reach because you couldn’t do dungeons due to your limitations, you should be able to accept that these new guild skins are out of your reach due to your limitations. There’s still plenty of other skins to get.

Ninjeff.6510:

First of all, Who actually thinks of Guild Halls as content? Putting furniture in a building is boring, pointless, and seems like just a lack of the devs actually making content. Not only that it take tons of time and materials for what ?

I dont play mmo’s to play house. I play mmo’s for pve content, pvp content, and the experience’s that go along with that. Wish they would have just made new dungeons, fractals, more raids, another pvp map! , or pretty much anything other than this “lets play house” stuff.

I known ppl who pay 15$ a month to play mmorpg’s with housing crafting and guild hall decorations like eq2

Dejavu I agree that if these are the mats that are required it really is to high.
I would recommend about the amount needed in legendaries from what I could see you can easily fit 20 bolts in this amount…

Ninjeff.6510:

First of all, Who actually thinks of Guild Halls as content? Putting furniture in a building is boring, pointless, and seems like just a lack of the devs actually making content. Not only that it take tons of time and materials for what ?

I dont play mmo’s to play house. I play mmo’s for pve content, pvp content, and the experience’s that go along with that. Wish they would have just made new dungeons, fractals, more raids, another pvp map! , or pretty much anything other than this “lets play house” stuff.

GW2, being not a linear progression game and being previously casual-friendly, is all about skins or other fluff, which is what makes this game have such a high player retention value. They have effectively hidden a bunch of fluff in a guild hall a TON of casual players won’t be able to access.

There are a TON of skins you can and I can’t get because a MAX level restoration 2 guild is required to get the weaponsmith2.

I don’t even care about the play house stuff. I might after everything else was complete just for something else to do and I’m glad it’s there for those who need it. But this is about BASIC access to a ton of this expansion’s skins.

Psion.9432:

Dejavu.2349:

Riku.4821:

I claimed my guild hall with 5 people first try. And we got the first tavern upgrade easily. My guild is 50 people with 42 or so inactive people and 6 active people. 2 are on so and so.
The guild hall things are perfectly fine as is, and sadly not much can be done to stop large guilds abuse it.

https://goo.gl/ZXBiva
Have you seen the mats? These are finished mats, so some of them take other things to make and this list is ONLY for the first level of restoration. There are a veritable kittenton of mats for level 2 – virtually unattainable for a guild of 2 active and 2 more slackers.

You gain absolutely nothing from the guild hall with that number of people. There’s nothing of value for you to obtain.

You can’t do Guild Missions for favor, unless you only do Race and Rush. Maybe get lucky with some of the PvP ones.
You can’t do Scribe if you can’t even afford the GH mats and have no reason to progress it now that they’ve made the papers tradeable.
There’s literally no reason for you to have an Arena or WvW claiming.
Your banners automatically become accessible again once the GH is unlocked (or shortly after one of the first tiers is unlocked AFAIK).

Literally the only thing of value is the % buffs to Karma, XP, etc.. of which you can only use one at a time of. And unless you have that much of a hard-on for Guild Minis (which you could probably just join/leave another guild for) then you lose nothing.

My guild of ~10 active people has been funded to Guild Level 21, and nearly Restoration 2 on all of the points, with roughly 7 contributors. We aren’t no lifers and I could barely get 5 people for a raid last night. We just put forth the effort and don’t whine about it constantly.

I wonder what the name of your main account is, as you’re clearly posting from an alt account (post history starts 30 days ago).

How much did it cost you to get the guild to level 21 with 7 people contributing? Looking at one enhancement for a level 9 guild which is 1500 aetherium plus a pile of mats and 50 ectos on it’s own, it must have come to a huge pile of cash and mats and a lot of farming.

How much has been spent on scribing so far?

I’m interested in the total cost in time/mats/gold so far.

Dejavu.2349:

The skins. The entire purpose of this game behind a wall of friends I don’t have. If it was all just a place to run around, I wouldn’t give a rat’s kitten . It’s not about buffs (though 10% xp, karma, etc is nice when you’re leveling or farming… It’s about the skins we won’t have. It’s about the principle of the thing…

Content gating can suck my butt.

Ask around to join a guild that has access to the skins, get them, quit the guild. You win the game.

Dejavu.2349:

Ninjeff.6510:

First of all, Who actually thinks of Guild Halls as content? Putting furniture in a building is boring, pointless, and seems like just a lack of the devs actually making content. Not only that it take tons of time and materials for what ?

I dont play mmo’s to play house. I play mmo’s for pve content, pvp content, and the experience’s that go along with that. Wish they would have just made new dungeons, fractals, more raids, another pvp map! , or pretty much anything other than this “lets play house” stuff.

GW2, being not a linear progression game and being previously casual-friendly, is all about skins or other fluff, which is what makes this game have such a high player retention value. They have effectively hidden a bunch of fluff in a guild hall a TON of casual players won’t be able to access.

There are a TON of skins you can and I can’t get because a MAX level restoration 2 guild is required to get the weaponsmith2.

I don’t even care about the play house stuff. I might after everything else was complete just for something else to do and I’m glad it’s there for those who need it. But this is about BASIC access to a ton of this expansion’s skins.

I thought this was about having a refuge and a guild hall to chill with family/friends… apparently this is just another complain about not being able to get shinny stuff easily -_-

kuritsutian.2987:

I thought this was about having a refuge and a guild hall to chill with family/friends… apparently this is just another complain about not being able to get shinny stuff easily -_-

Clearly, you don’t understand. But thank you for your valuable input.
This is about this GAME being a refuge where we could get all the shiny things on our OWN… without having randoms shoved down our throats. We could play at our own pace, knowing eventually, we can achieve whatever we want. They changed the very focus of their game. I can’t help it if you don’t see that.

Now, we can get scraps and are legitimately peeved.

Sure… I can still log in and spend innumerable hours in Silverwastes to get the 600 shovels I need. or in DS to get the 21,000 flax. It’s not as fun knowing I have to grind for the rest of my life (which may actually not be an exxhageration considering my age) simply to keep up with people who actually like people. It’s really rather ridiculous how they , in one fell swoop, made small guilds obsolete. If they want to get rid of their casual players, they took a huge step in the right direction. If they want to be just like all the other MMO’s, this expansion made them competitive! Grats!

When I leave other MMO’s, I never go back. I’ve always come back to GW, but… they’ve taken away my reasons for keeping them in the top of my list. I’m not the only one and I’m determined to let them know that. I WILL be heard!

You can still get shiny things! Just not on your terms.

You’re right, Sanity. Which makes it like every other game

And again, I’ll ask.. this is different from dungeon skins how?

With dungeon skins, Legendary weapons that require dungeon tokens as a component, and the handful of other expensive weapons that require tokens via the Mystic Forge, the game launched with hundreds of skins that were unavailable to you if you chose to play solo. Why has it taken the new guild skins to get you bent out of shape over it? Why didn’t you complain about, say, the Fractal weapon skins when they launched and required a group to have a chance at?

MaximillianVonSchatten.6278:

kuritsutian.2987:

So before HoT you had no guild hall and you were happy…… now you have a chance of having a guild hall, but can’t get it …. so having no guild hall now makes you unhappy?
why do you suddenly feel the need for a GH if you don’t like people… just find a cool area to meet and call it a hideout!

Well to be fair he did pay a large amount of money for HoT, and I can see how the guild hall is all but impossible to upgrade for all but the largest guilds.

Small guilds can upgrade too it just takes a really long time. Also, while he was taking breaks he could have been farming for materials. Or buy the materials Anet hinted us about for Guild Halls when the price was incredibly low (before HoT). Lastly, just use the guild initiation headquarters for free. It’s like a mini guild hall just for your guild.

OK, while I understand this is slightly off topic;

The letter “’I” , please use it. As in, I think, I believe , I feel.

Please try to refrain from " you should, you all, you think, you suck etc.

Please present an opinion and be aware others have an opinion.

Try stating a counter argument rather than just venting spleens and spewing forth vitriol.

Good luck

IMHO, guilds should be able to use all facilities they previously had open, these options could be available through the LA Guild initiative building.

If considered necessary,they could have higher ongoing purchase costs than GUILD HALL versions as an incentive to actively rebuild the new halls.

Xiahou Mao.9701:

And again, I’ll ask.. this is different from dungeon skins how?

With dungeon skins, Legendary weapons that require dungeon tokens as a component, and the handful of other expensive weapons that require tokens via the Mystic Forge, the game launched with hundreds of skins that were unavailable to you if you chose to play solo. Why has it taken the new guild skins to get you bent out of shape over it? Why didn’t you complain about, say, the Fractal weapon skins when they launched and required a group to have a chance at?

It’s different because I can LFG any of those when I want at my whim (and I have all the dungeon skins I want except for maybe a few CoE ones because back when I was doing dungeons, NOBODY wanted to do CoE). The guild ones are behind huge mat requirements that are impossible to do whenever I want… If I start now, I’d finish… maybe a bit after my kids graduate college (My eldest is 12).

It’s totally different. I’m not talking about grouping up on occasion. I’m talking about basic requirements for guild vendors.

And I was kittened when they introduced fractals and I DID leave the game after that, but I came back because at that time, I could still get at everything I wanted even with a small guild – even fractal stuff because I DO have 4 friends in other guilds. The HOT guild content is geared for a MUCH larger guild full of people with either tons of mats, tons of gold, or no life. I DO realize the impetus for this xpac came from people who needed stuff to do with all their mats, etc…, but those people aren’t their only player base. They have a huge casual player base that they basically just told to F off. I do have a ton of mats and a good amount of gold, but all of it wouldn’t make a dent in the Restoration 2 requirements or even a big dent in Restoration 1.

Well, if you were able to LFG to find your dungeon groups, but you don’t think you’ll be able to build your guild up enough, then you can LFG (Looking For Guild) for the weapons down the road. Yes, you complained earlier that that was “using” people, but you had no problem with using people in your LFGs for your dungeons despite your apparent distaste for playing with others. We’re still early in the life cycle of the new system, there are no guilds out there at all that have access to these weapons or armour yet. Once there are and the initial uniqueness luster has worn off, there’ll surely be some guilds that will let you join temporarily to buy/make what you need out of the goodness of their heart, just like there were other players who wanted dungeon skins and paired together with you even though you had no desire to get to know them any better in the process.

I am, for the record, speaking in this as someone with a small guild of my own with a handful of active players, enough to claim the guild hall but not much more than that. I’m sinking a lot of gold worth of materials into my guild hall because I want to, because it provides me with a goal. A long term goal, in my case, but a goal no less. My guild is level 14 now, and with some more Tangled Depths play, PvP potions and Elder Wood, we’ll be able to finish our Arena Restoration 2 within a few days.

If you’re not willing to put in the time and the expensive materials (I’d be hundreds of gold richer now if I was selling my Flax/Sand/etc. rather than hoarding it for upgrades), then wait for another guild to offer to help you once they finally get there themselves. People will show mercy to you. Alternately, do what I’m doing now and build it yourself. Will it take forever? It sure will. But for some of us, that makes it mean more.

Xiahou,
Dungeoning was 2012. Before I quit guild leading and dealing with people in general. It’s 2015 and I’m tired of people and their petty drama and problems and general stupidity. Maybe I’m just getting old and can’t deal…
A lot of people who lead raiding guilds for 7 years in multiple games end up like me. I don’t expect everyone to understand.

I totally understand if it takes a while, but I’m not sure you understand just how long we’re talking. Have you looked at the mats? For each individual thing, they look pretty easy… but look at the bigger picture. Get with me after a few months when you realize just how many mats you need and how tired you are of having no money because you can’t sell anything… not carrots, not flax, not dust, not ore, not wood, not ecto, not lodestones… nothing but sigils… Sigils are the only reasonable income when you are a primary provider in a small guild. Maybe reevaluate how much it means at that point. Who knows… maybe in a few months, I’ll reevaluate and decide it was a piece of cake! The chances of that are super slim, though, as I have a very good idea of how much time it takes to farm these mats.

Unless you’re just buying them with real money conversions… and anyone who does that doesn’t deserve an opinion in this thread. I fully suspect my friend with the level 19 guild has put a kittenton of money into it to get it that far and he’s willing to do it because he has something to prove and people to please. I don’t. I’m in it for ME (and my family, of course).

Dejavu.2349:

I totally understand if it takes a while, but I’m not sure you understand just how long we’re talking. Have you looked at the mats? For each individual thing, they look pretty easy… but look at the bigger picture. Get with me after a few months when you realize just how many mats you need and how tired you are of having no money because you can’t sell anything… not carrots, not flax, not dust, not ore, not wood, not ecto, not lodestones… nothing but sigils… Sigils are the only reasonable income when you are a primary provider in a small guild. Maybe reevaluate how much it means at that point. Who knows… maybe in a few months, I’ll reevaluate and decide it was a piece of cake! The chances of that are super slim, though, as I have a very good idea of how much time it takes to farm these mats.

I’m well aware how much it costs, given that I’m farther along with it than you are. But on the flip side, as a small guild there’s benefits too. I don’t need to worry about Mining Rate, for example, because gathering Aetherium faster isn’t a concern. I just need Mining Capacity upgrades. That means that I can make money, for a while at least, by selling Ley Line Infused Tools. Of course, those gobble up some Ley Sparks I need for the Arena upgrades I do want, but that’s just a matter of balance.

I haven’t put any real-world money into my guild hall beyond what I spent for HoT itself. I’ve never done a gem to gold conversion and don’t intend to start anytime soon. If I reach a point where I need gold for something else, there’s nothing stopping me from putting the guild hall on hold for a while. If the 10 gold worth of Ectos I get most nights while playing is ever better served lining my wallet rather than being fed to the guild, then it can line my wallet. It’s not a race. If it was a race, I’d be losing because I have three or four active racers compared to other guilds who have dozens, if not hundreds. But I still intend to be playing this game a year from now, two years from now. I probably won’t be done the upgrades by then. That’s fine. Goals are nice.

And as I said for you, if you don’t want to put in the effort and the ton of materials required, if you’re patient and give other guilds time to get there, there will surely eventually be someone willing to temporarily give you access to get the items you want, likely out of the goodness of their heart. Just like there’s people to group with in Fractals, just like there’s Mesmers who advertise portals to JPs, just like there’s people who offer taxis to rarer boss events like Eye of Zhaitan.

Now, raid loot is a different story…

Vayne.8563:

OP, I’m probably never going to beat the raid. I don’t think my guild will be stalwart enough to bang their heads against it long enough to succeed. Maybe a few people will, but most won’t. There are rewards that you can only get with raids that you can’t get outside of raids.

A while back they offered a set of armor you could only get by winning a PvP tournament. I won’t ever get that armor. Ever. Not once.

You can still be a guild. You can even have a guild hall if it means that much to you.

But even if you are a guild, not everyone is going to be guaranteed every reward. You either way, I’m not going to get every reward, and deal with it,. or you don’t.

If you don’t, you leave the game. If you do, you play the game. It’s pretty simple.

As I’ve warned in other threads, if there are enough rewards casuals can’t get they’re feel disenfranchised and some of them will leave. That’s still true. Some people will leave the game over changes made to the game. That’s true for all MMOs btw.

But having a guild doesn’t necessarily entitle you to every future benefit of being in a guild.

One of the big complaints larger guilds have had since launch, particularly ones that don’t WvW is that there was really nothing for them to work towards. If everything is attainable by the smallest guilds, what is there for large guilds to do?

Up until recently, with the exception of WvW, large guilds had pretty much Triple Threat…maybe Tequatl. That’s pretty much the list.

Anet is simply filling a void. And yes, some people will feel disenfranchised by it.

Having lead a guild for over 12 years from small to medium to large throughout that time I have never ever heard of a guild complaining they had nothing to aim for and achieve because other smaller guilds can achieve the same thing… If ANET are truthfully looking to make such content exclusively for faceless 500 guilds in GW2 then that’s where a lot of small guilds will just pack up and go find an MMO that knows what they are doing – I think though your just talking a load of tosh as usual!

ProtoGunner.4953:

A guild hall is for a guild, not for 3 players. Also, the guild hall is not much content, it’s just a huge area with nothing in it (well with fluff in it if it’s filled with… fluff like a chair you can’t even sit on).

Besides the +% food the tavern guy gives me, and cheap transportation to the Magus Falls, I don’t need it.

You’re correct that a guild hall isn’t content. It is, however, the gateway to the full potential of a guild. My small guild(~20 players with 3-6 active each day) can’t build the perks we used to have, because we don’t have a guild hall. We don’t have a guild hall, because we don’t have the guild favor. We can’t earn the guild favor, because there aren’t enough of us on at the same time to complete any of the guild missions. OP is upset, like most small guild members, because we have had abilities taken away and put behind a wall we can’t scale on our own.

Fortunately, there is a workaround. There is a thread on this forum for small guilds that are banding together to help each other unlock and improve their guild halls. This is an excellent idea, and one that showcases the community spirit that I love about this game.

I do love guildhalls and all but id like to see them add some kinda player hall/housing like thing the home instances just dont cut it not everyone got time to join guilds primarly because all the big guilds are turning into elitests and dont want you because your too casual.

My suggestion to solve the problem of family oriented guilds, or small groups of 10 people for less, is improve the Home Instance which is a feature with great potential, but wasted and relatively deserted, Anet could make the Home Instance something parallel the Guild Halls. Bringing content and challenges for solo players or small groups.

I am against the idea diminish the requirements of Guild Halls, the thing is a giant castle. In real life three people could not keep a castle.

Also dont complain about content if you been here since beta you would also no gw2 doesnt throw everything into the patch its a living story therefore they have new content kitten near on a bi to monthly basis also you can leave not a big issue because its not a sub based game so no stress.

Living story has NOTHING to do with guild halls. They are not part of the story. Also… at launch, they had content updates every 2 weeks… then a month… now… not so much.

I think being here from beta gives me even more reason to be annoyed because I KNOW how good we small guilds used to have it. Many new folks don’t know, so they’re totally cool with being forced into hanging in larger circles… They just expect it. I expect to be able to be as casual as I want as still be able to progress my guild and given the past 3 and a half years, I have good reason to expect that.

Small guilds do small guild things. From the perspective of the game, I don’t really see it making much sense to have a guild hall if you have a 3 person guild in the first place. based on the requirements, I don’t think Anet does either, though I don’t believe anything stops you from trying, which is really the point. You aren’t blocked from getting the mats needed for whatever upgrades you’re after.

Dejavu.2349:

Valentinus.3412:

I’m genuinely getting more and more baffled by the complaints on this forum.

You can’t expect content to be balanced around 2-3 person guilds. That doesn’t even qualify as a full party!

The game type should clue you in… Massivley-Multiplayer-Online.

If you can’t stand the rest of the community to thebpointbyou have hamstring your enjoyment of the game… Well, that’s your issue and not Anets.

And for the love of Dhuum. Does ever single tiny tangential complaint need a new thread?! This forum is already hard enough to navigate without “I’m quitting HOT because X” thread number 9000.

You should all start an anti hot support group guild, then you will have plenty of people to get a guild hall.

/rant

I’m so tired of this argument. I’ve been playing GW2 since launch and they have inarguably made a HUGE change to the very point of their game and content and, in doing so, have completely annihilated the reasons I was playing this game. It’s completely within reason for me to be upset. I’m not speaking for YOU or for people who actually like hanging out in big guilds. I do not and have had no need to until this huge let-down of an expansion.

I think Anet underestimated the number of people who keep coming back to their game BECAUSE it was very casual-friendly. It is no longer so unless you are able to completely ignore the content you won’t ever see (like Weaponsmith 2 – skins I can never have because Anet put them behind a wall of friends I don’t have (or want). I can’t ignore that and am stating my valid argument for why this sucks. Of course people who are in big guilds won’t get this at all – I don’t expect you to.

I wouldn’t go quite as far to say it’s a huge let-down, as some things aren’t so bad, but otherwise I agree with you here and on your initial post. I’ve commented elsewhere about this as well – it’s not a great development choice to be cutting little guilds out of the game. Casual/small-guild players have been as invested in the game as most other players!

Further than that, though, an issue with the giant-guild focus is that it removes the equal footing that WvW gameplay has had. Big guilds are not always online (and some servers don’t even have them). Gating upgrades behind huge resource/gold sinks is detrimental to small guilds who would gladly support their server with some modest upgrades/boosts that they put effort into obtaining – but not as much effort as it now costs. It will take some guilds years to reach the stage they had already reached. Others simply won’t be able to.

Obtena.7952:

Small guilds do small guild things. From the perspective of the game, I don’t really see it making much sense to have a guild hall if you have a 3 person guild in the first place. based on the requirements, I don’t think Anet does either, though I don’t believe anything stops you from trying, which is really the point. You aren’t blocked from getting the mats needed for whatever upgrades you’re after.

I disagree; even a small guild likes to have some place to call theirs. It would be good if Anet added little guild halls for little guilds (and less/smaller services as upgrades). A little, say… guild of thieves could have a smuggler’s den. I’d be content with a nice little hobbit hole. Or a little old-Ascalonian keep, perhaps.

Guild Wars 1 had guild halls of various sizes. I don’t see why Guild Wars 2 shouldn’t!

In fact, here’s a quote I found from a Guild Wars 1 guild hall vendor: “I am pleased that you should ask. Truly, what guild can call itself a guild without an island of its own? Come with me. I can take you on a tour of each island, and you can choose which you like the best.”

A lot of people also don’t realize the server buffs that WvW provides. Those are going to start diminishing as that game mode is now spiraling down.

Swift.1930:

Obtena.7952:

Small guilds do small guild things. From the perspective of the game, I don’t really see it making much sense to have a guild hall if you have a 3 person guild in the first place. based on the requirements, I don’t think Anet does either, though I don’t believe anything stops you from trying, which is really the point. You aren’t blocked from getting the mats needed for whatever upgrades you’re after.

I disagree; even a small guild likes to have some place to call theirs. It would be good if Anet added little guild halls for little guilds (and less/smaller services as upgrades). A little, say… guild of thieves could have a smuggler’s den. I’d be content with a nice little hobbit hole. Or a little old-Ascalonian keep, perhaps.

Guild Wars 1 had guild halls of various sizes. I don’t see why Guild Wars 2 shouldn’t!

I’m not sure that the OP is complaining he can’t get a hall. I think he’s complaining about the price to upgrade once he does get it. Furthermore GW1 != GW2.

Obtena.7952:

Swift.1930:

Obtena.7952:

Small guilds do small guild things. From the perspective of the game, I don’t really see it making much sense to have a guild hall if you have a 3 person guild in the first place. based on the requirements, I don’t think Anet does either, though I don’t believe anything stops you from trying, which is really the point. You aren’t blocked from getting the mats needed for whatever upgrades you’re after.

I disagree; even a small guild likes to have some place to call theirs. It would be good if Anet added little guild halls for little guilds (and less/smaller services as upgrades). A little, say… guild of thieves could have a smuggler’s den. I’d be content with a nice little hobbit hole. Or a little old-Ascalonian keep, perhaps.

Guild Wars 1 had guild halls of various sizes. I don’t see why Guild Wars 2 shouldn’t!

I’m not sure that the OP is complaining he can’t get a hall. I think he’s complaining about the price to upgrade once he does get it. Furthermore GW1 != GW2.

But my reply was in regards to your comment, not the OP’s post :P

Well, true. But the gameplay mechanics of GW2 means that I can’t go back to GW1 without a little bit of wincing… unfortunately.

The thing is, this is an MMO. To expect all content the game develops as rewards to be developed for players who refuse to play with others is not being realistic.

That being said, they should have grandfathered in everything a guild had earned prior to HoT launching. Not just certain things like the bank. And covert like things to like. So if they had X banner that did Y, they should get the new Z banner that does Y since X banner went away.

Small roaming guilds in WvW have been hit especially hard. They lost a lot of benefits they had pre-HoT and the cost of materials/work to grind them out has made it difficult for guilds to get these recipes and buffs they once had back.

maddoctor.2738:

And they “fixed” that with Heart of Thorns.

It wasn’t a problem for three years until ANet suddenly decided it was a problem and made it one.

maddoctor.2738:

But aside from that, do you really “quit” because they took the guild banners away? Were they so important that it was the sole reason to enjoy the game? So you are leaving for a couple of nearly useless buffs?

If those buffs are so useless, what’s the harm in letting the smaller guilds actually make use of them, still?

Vayne.8563:

Up until recently, with the exception of WvW, large guilds had pretty much Triple Threat…maybe Tequatl. That’s pretty much the list.

So now, the answer is to leave smaller guilds in the dark. No wait, the answer is to take everything away that they had, AND THEN leave them in the dark.

Oh, and even though 3 people used to be a perfectly legitimate guild, and nobody ever had a problem with it, and ANet even recommended on several occasions that people make small personal guilds for some extra bank space, suddenly, out of nowhere, small guilds are a problem that were clearly never legitimate (even though they were), because ANet says so, and how could ANet ever be wrong?

But of course, Vayne is okay with it, so it MUST have been okay that ANet did this.

Vayne.8563:

Anet is simply filling a void. And yes, some people will feel disenfranchised by it.

They filled that void by locking away things that small guilds already had worked for and you KNOW it.

But you ignore it, because it’s all okay, because everything ANet does is okay, every time.

Seera.5916:

The thing is, this is an MMO. To expect all content the game develops as rewards to be developed for players who refuse to play with others is not being realistic.

That being said, they should have grandfathered in everything a guild had earned prior to HoT launching. Not just certain things like the bank. And covert like things to like. So if they had X banner that did Y, they should get the new Z banner that does Y since X banner went away.

It’s still a realistic expectation for people to want to be able to play with small guilds (5-15 players). Small guilds are often cosy and fun atmospheres, as opposed to larger guilds where (while it can be fun and relaxed) it’s often more about organization and rank and even responsibilities. I like both elements, and I personally enjoy that they are both part of the Guild Wars experience. It’s just cruel if Anet is just telling little guilds that they’re going to have to swap to full-time organized farming just to get some basic upgrades (especially things they had already build up) and clapping big guilds on the back and saying “well done, son/daughter/creature”.

Gene Archer.8560:

They filled that void by locking away things that small guilds already had worked for and you KNOW it.

In my opinion, it’s really never okay to take away what someone or a group has already spent time earning. It would have been possible to simply give guilds what they had before and let them work toward the new things. There still would have been plenty to do and it wouldn’t exactly have been game-breaking.

ANet: we have a problem with everyone hoarding mats and gold, what can we do?

Dev 1) well we could reduce the drops and dungeon rewards…

Dev 2) we could make the guild halls require insane amounts of mats..

Dev 3) we could make the new maps very difficult to navigate to increase WP revenues.

ANet: make it so…

I am all for having to work for rewards, but it feels like we are playing Scrooge Mcduck 2 the reality show at this point. Please ANet reduce the mat requirements for the guild halls at least, my guild leader is constantly nagging us for mats (not his fault), and that goes very much against the spirit of the community hall!

i was looking through the spreadsheet and nothing on it really stood out as difficult or unobtainable in a feasible amount of time, what in particular are you looking at as impossible?

Swift.1930:

Seera.5916:

The thing is, this is an MMO. To expect all content the game develops as rewards to be developed for players who refuse to play with others is not being realistic.

That being said, they should have grandfathered in everything a guild had earned prior to HoT launching. Not just certain things like the bank. And covert like things to like. So if they had X banner that did Y, they should get the new Z banner that does Y since X banner went away.

It’s still a realistic expectation for people to want to be able to play with small guilds (5-15 players). Small guilds are often cosy and fun atmospheres, as opposed to larger guilds where (while it can be fun and relaxed) it’s often more about organization and rank and even responsibilities. I like both elements, and I personally enjoy that they are both part of the Guild Wars experience. It’s just cruel if Anet is just telling little guilds that they’re going to have to swap to full-time organized farming just to get some basic upgrades (especially things they had already build up) and clapping big guilds on the back and saying “well done, son/daughter/creature”.

I was talking to the OP who seems to have developed a desire to not play with anyone else. Or anyone else but their spouse. ANet doesn’t need to make everything obtainable by people who do not want to ever play with others. And by play with I mean actually engage. Not sit silently and press 1 and dodge occasionally.

But yes, ANet does need to make it easier for smaller guilds to get back what they had before HoT launched. Because they shouldn’t have had to get it back in the first place. I get why they had to make it hard because 500 person guilds would make anything reasonable for a small guild something they could do in 2 seconds.

Seera.5916:

Swift.1930:

Seera.5916:

The thing is, this is an MMO. To expect all content the game develops as rewards to be developed for players who refuse to play with others is not being realistic.

That being said, they should have grandfathered in everything a guild had earned prior to HoT launching. Not just certain things like the bank. And covert like things to like. So if they had X banner that did Y, they should get the new Z banner that does Y since X banner went away.

It’s still a realistic expectation for people to want to be able to play with small guilds (5-15 players). Small guilds are often cosy and fun atmospheres, as opposed to larger guilds where (while it can be fun and relaxed) it’s often more about organization and rank and even responsibilities. I like both elements, and I personally enjoy that they are both part of the Guild Wars experience. It’s just cruel if Anet is just telling little guilds that they’re going to have to swap to full-time organized farming just to get some basic upgrades (especially things they had already build up) and clapping big guilds on the back and saying “well done, son/daughter/creature”.

I was talking to the OP who seems to have developed a desire to not play with anyone else. Or anyone else but their spouse. ANet doesn’t need to make everything obtainable by people who do not want to ever play with others. And by play with I mean actually engage. Not sit silently and press 1 and dodge occasionally.

But yes, ANet does need to make it easier for smaller guilds to get back what they had before HoT launched. Because they shouldn’t have had to get it back in the first place. I get why they had to make it hard because 500 person guilds would make anything reasonable for a small guild something they could do in 2 seconds.

Gotcha. I still hold by my idea that they should make small guild halls available for small guilds. Less/smaller services or something… more attainable for little guilds. I’m honestly spooked by the size of the current halls. I go in there and just immediately leave. It’s a giant city in there.

Celtic Lady.3729:

Gene Archer.8560:

They filled that void by locking away things that small guilds already had worked for and you KNOW it.

In my opinion, it’s really never okay to take away what someone or a group has already spent time earning. It would have been possible to simply give guilds what they had before and let them work toward the new things. There still would have been plenty to do and it wouldn’t exactly have been game-breaking.

At this point, I’m convinced it’s a symptom of a larger problem. For all that ANet has added in 3 years, look at all the things they’ve also taken away, or re-done for the millionth iteration, and in so re-doing, still take something away or re-start the unlock process that people have already worked on.

I’ve never seen this at such a scale from any other MMO. This is the kind of stuff that I expect from an EA backed game.

Celtic Lady.3729:

Gene Archer.8560:

They filled that void by locking away things that small guilds already had worked for and you KNOW it.

In my opinion, it’s really never okay to take away what someone or a group has already spent time earning. It would have been possible to simply give guilds what they had before and let them work toward the new things. There still would have been plenty to do and it wouldn’t exactly have been game-breaking.

Big +1. Seriously, rather than rework prices of current things, lock previously unlocked things, etc… Anet should just add random new content to use up our materials and gold. Buildable/craftable/researchable/etc stuff. They’ve already got templates; it couldn’t be ridiculously hard to simply add more, could it?

On top of that, people pay good money for aesthetics. Outfits. Minis. Etc. Why wouldn’t they spend more gems and gold and materials adding aesthetics to guild halls? Didn’t need to rework the whole thing as a gold/material sink in a way that cuts the little guys out xP

Gene Archer.8560:

Celtic Lady.3729:

Gene Archer.8560:

They filled that void by locking away things that small guilds already had worked for and you KNOW it.

In my opinion, it’s really never okay to take away what someone or a group has already spent time earning. It would have been possible to simply give guilds what they had before and let them work toward the new things. There still would have been plenty to do and it wouldn’t exactly have been game-breaking.

At this point, I’m convinced it’s a symptom of a larger problem. For all that ANet has added in 3 years, look at all the things they’ve also taken away, or re-done for the millionth iteration, and in so re-doing, still take something away or re-start the unlock process that people have already worked on.

I’ve never seen this at such a scale from any other MMO. This is the kind of stuff that I expect from an EA backed game.

Yeah, this is the first MMO I’ve played where they’ve employed the strategy of taking AWAY content in order to incentivize expansion purchases. Every other game I play, the promise of new content alone is enough to encourage people to buy their x-pacs.

They may not add to the previous content, but they leave it alone and allow new players and alts to enjoy it as is or they make it easier and faster to progress through. They certainly don’t take away rewards, etc. in order to entice purchases. It’s just not necessary.

Not a huge issue anet has been really good at listening to the community so long as its constructive though so if enough people tell anet what they like and dont like constructively i wouldnt be surprised if they take the step to make people happy.Keep in mind 90% of these changes are done just because of that the community asks or complains.Since its been like a week or 2 since release give it time for them to read and gather their thoughts on changes. Even so this game mmo wise is definatly worth the money.

Celtic Lady.3729:

Gene Archer.8560:

Celtic Lady.3729:

Gene Archer.8560:

They filled that void by locking away things that small guilds already had worked for and you KNOW it.

In my opinion, it’s really never okay to take away what someone or a group has already spent time earning. It would have been possible to simply give guilds what they had before and let them work toward the new things. There still would have been plenty to do and it wouldn’t exactly have been game-breaking.

At this point, I’m convinced it’s a symptom of a larger problem. For all that ANet has added in 3 years, look at all the things they’ve also taken away, or re-done for the millionth iteration, and in so re-doing, still take something away or re-start the unlock process that people have already worked on.

I’ve never seen this at such a scale from any other MMO. This is the kind of stuff that I expect from an EA backed game.

Yeah, this is the first MMO I’ve played where they’ve employed the strategy of taking AWAY content in order to incentivize expansion purchases. Every other game I play, the promise of new content alone is enough to encourage people to buy their x-pacs.

They may not add to the previous content, but they leave it alone and allow new players and alts to enjoy it as is or they make it easier and faster to progress through. They certainly don’t take away rewards, etc. in order to entice purchases. It’s just not necessary.

Exactly. And some. It’s quite absurd, not to mention it staggers my loyalty somewhat.

I descended from the remnants of old Ascalon; such scorn at the bending of my knee is astounding.

Swift.1930:

Exactly. And some. It’s quite absurd, not to mention it staggers my loyalty somewhat.

Mine, too. The Fractal reward nerf especially irritated me in this regard. I get that there’s a mastery for it, but come on. The mastery should have improved on the rewards as they were.

It’s like a car dealership “sale.” Where they jack up the price of the car and then put it “on sale” so that in the end, you’re just paying the same price you would have before the sale. Only in reverse.

Celtic Lady.3729:

Swift.1930:

Exactly. And some. It’s quite absurd, not to mention it staggers my loyalty somewhat.

Mine, too. The Fractal reward nerf especially irritated me in this regard. I get that there’s a mastery for it, but come on. The mastery should have improved on the rewards as they were.

It’s like a car dealership “sale.” Where they jack up the price of the car and then put it “on sale” so that in the end, you’re just paying the same price you would have before the sale. Only in reverse.

This is one thing I’ve noticed about HoT: it keeps being advertised as an expansion, but even people who haven’t paid for the content (which for quite a few people also means haven’t endorsed the changes) are being flooded with changes and replacements for content that they were, well… (pardon the pun) content with. They may have endorsed upgrades, but they were enjoying the gameplay they already had.

I bought the expansion myself, and to be honest I’m glad I did; I would have been hit by the changes anyways, but I’d just have been thrown up against tons of walls labeled “HoT content. You shall not pass.”

Obtena.7952:

Small guilds do small guild things. From the perspective of the game, I don’t really see it making much sense to have a guild hall if you have a 3 person guild in the first place. based on the requirements, I don’t think Anet does either, though I don’t believe anything stops you from trying, which is really the point. You aren’t blocked from getting the mats needed for whatever upgrades you’re after.

If everything in game design “made sense,” there wouldn’t be things like scantily clad characters taking 14k damage in a single hit and staying alive.

These sort of arguments invariably devolve into a level of examination that does not hold up under scrutiny.

That said, the prevailing question should always be something along the lines of, “Are players going to enjoy this?” And then if you want to get a bit more specific, you can ask things like, “What player demographic will most enjoy this?” or “How do we market this?”

I still think Guild Hall design was a marketing decision, which would fit with the direction of stuff like the NPE. Streamlining and simplifying. It allows them to put across the message of what the game is in a simpler way. Openly supporting micro guilds makes it sound like they’re cool with people playing by themselves, which goes against their cooperative design mantra.

I seriously doubt it has anything to do with it “making sense” for a few people to own and maintain a Guild Hall (as it is, it’s already possible – just not easy).

I’m pretty sure most of their recent design decisions have been market-driven more than anything. They want a game that they can spoon-feed to the masses and GW2 has never been that game. It’s a little late for them to be doing such a shift in focus, but then, look at what happened with SWG of old. First the CU and then the NGE. Why? Because they were hemorrhaging players and losing out horribly to games like WoW.

I wouldn’t be surprised if a similar mindset is at play here. Some parallels are certainly present. SWG was very sandbox, which has been proven time and time again to not have mass appeal when mixed with MMOs (which annoys the heck out of me, but whatever). GW2 is nowhere near as sandbox as SWG was, but it’s definitely on the cusp.

Honestly, I think WoW is one of the worst things that ever happened to the MMO market. Since its success, everybody wants WoW numbers and seems to consider their game an utter failure if they don’t come close. And of course there’s the fact that due to WoW’s monstrous success, it drains the market of players. Makes it so there’s less to go around, concentrates them all in one spot. Not a good thing for us players.

Anyway, I digress…