Guild Wars 2

MiniEquine.6014:

At no point did they say not to complain about it, just that, in their opinion, the complaints are somewhat out of hand. Speak out if you feel like it, but it really has gotten to some ridiculous levels (like trying to file a class-action lawsuit? really?). Anet owes us more communication, clarification, and possibly apologies too, but this forum has been almost literally nothing but repeat threads about the expansion price.

For customers that purchased GW2 in the recent months when Anet had been marketing (deceptively) the base game as being required before buying HoT, there is valid reasoning for legal action. That deceptive marketing very likely false under the definitions of US false advertising laws.

abc.5790:

Eurhetemec.9052:

abc.5790:

Eurhetemec.9052:

abc.5790:

$50 expansion may seem expensive to some but it’s still very reasonable.

Very reasonable by what standard? It’s expensive for an expansion, period. It’s very expensive for an expansion that does not let you play all the content without deleting a character or buying a new slot for another $10.

I think it’s just your opinion that it’s “very reasonable”, not a fact so you may want to chew on that.

abc.5790:

Why does it bother “veterans” that new customers get the base for free? If you’re a so called veteran, you had a 3 year head start. You experienced content that’s now retired, content that will never be enjoyed by the new buyer.

Simple fairness when we’re paying money for something. It’s not complicated.

My bad, I didn’t know people on here were ignorant on the price ranges of gaming expansions. Is this your first game?

$50 is reasonable because it is within the range of a typical expansion.
$5000000000000000 is unreasonable though.

Oh dear lol.

So you’re the arbiter on this, with all your what, 14 years of wisdom?

14 years more than yours

No doubt, son, no doubt. You’ll teach us grown-ups a thing or three.

abc.5790:

Eurhetemec.9052:

abc.5790:

$50 expansion may seem expensive to some but it’s still very reasonable.

Very reasonable by what standard? It’s expensive for an expansion, period. It’s very expensive for an expansion that does not let you play all the content without deleting a character or buying a new slot for another $10.

I think it’s just your opinion that it’s “very reasonable”, not a fact so you may want to chew on that.

abc.5790:

Why does it bother “veterans” that new customers get the base for free? If you’re a so called veteran, you had a 3 year head start. You experienced content that’s now retired, content that will never be enjoyed by the new buyer.

Simple fairness when we’re paying money for something. It’s not complicated.

My bad, I didn’t know people on here were ignorant on the price ranges of gaming expansions. Is this your first game?

$50 is reasonable because it is within the range of a typical expansion.
$5000000000000000 is unreasonable though.

why do u even argue if u do not want to understand why veterans and others are upset? u like the deal ok thats fine and im glad u like it, but me and others arent.
i get that u are happy, but u cant change how we who are upset feel:

to ALL u white knights out there:

1. u cannot change how i feel about this deal
2. yes i have played the game for 3 years and so has my husband. and we invested way more than the initial price on this game and have always supported this game. so the argument about: well u had the game for free, now new players get it for free whats your issue? well u obviously dont want to understand the issue!

3 u can not force me to be quiet

4 u cant expect everyone to shut up and just accept things

5. as i have an opinion about the pricing, so do u. difference: im not trying to force my opinion on u. u wanna buy it at 50$ thats fine, enjoy! but i personally wont shut up, because i am unhappy and u cannot change this at all.

6. u are not anet and honestly, the only one who can change the way we who are upset feel is ANET and only ANET. white knights that call us names just make us even more upset.

matrix seishin.5312:

Let’ review.

When Arena Net announced the pre-purchase of HoT the community was divided. Those who accepted and those who didn’t. Here are the problems:

1. The price – The expansion costs 45 euro. If you don’t have the core game you get it for free (or so they say). When the game came out it also cost about the same. So why does the expansion cost so much if it is only an expansion?

2. The amount of content – HoT < GW2. There is simply no way that an expansion has the same amount of content as the core game (without updates). We know of a few new features and nothing else. That brings us to…

3. Lack of information – Most of us can’t just buy the expansion for such a high price without any information on what we are buying. At least this can be solved by simply waiting.

4. False advertising – Before announcing HoT Arena Net told new players that they have to have the core game in order to play the expansion. The made people buy the game in order to get into the world of GW2 so they can be prepared when the expansion comes out. They put the game on sales throughout the past year to make the game more appealing. Now people who bought the game more than 30 days ago (or didn’t use the site) can’t get their money back in order to buy the expansion and get the game for free.

5. What current players get – We don’t know exactly what the expansion will include. All we get are sneak previews. But we do know that there will be a new profession. But we don’t get an extra character slot with the standard pack. We have to either: already have a free slot; buy and additional slot; delete a character; in order to play the new profession. That is a slap in the face for people who spent time developing all their characters and can’t afford to spend even more money for a new slot.

6. Poor communication – This has been going on for days (almost a week) and there has been no response what so ever on the issues that people have.

(feel free to add if I’ve missed something)

So what do we want? Well I can’t speak for everyone on this but what I want for my 45 euro of unknown content is: a character slot, some gems. That’s it.

1., 2., & 3. It costs that much because that’s what ANet values HoT at. They do have an issue of not communicating enough details about HoT for everyone to see it worth that much.

4. It’s not false advertising. You still need the base game to play HoT. They’ve just bundled the two together in one key. Not having something in place to quickly copy & paste onto the forums for those who did purchase withing the past 30-60 days was the mistake here. To me, they also still haven’t officially announced that because it’s not on the official forum. ANet needs to learn to post things on more than just every site but the official forums. We shouldn’t have to post a link to a post on Reddit from a dev about what they are doing for those who purchased recently. It is however shady given they’ve done sales of the game recently.

5. While not all MMO’s give free character slots when they add new professions, ANet did give free character slots in GW1 when they released content that added new professions. And to those saying it’s because it’s a standalone, they could have coded it such that “If own Prophecies, add 0 character slots”. They should have realized not having a character slot in the standard edition was not likely to go over well, especially considering points 2 & 3 that you brought up.

6. The longer it goes without an official statement, the more damage will be done. If they go too long, even if it is the perfect solution, people will be at a point where it’s just too late to change their opinion.

selan.8354:

why do u even argue if u do not want to understand why veterans and others are upset? u like the deal ok thats fine and im glad u like it, but me and others arent.
i get that u are happy, but u cant change how we who are upset feel:

to ALL u white knights out there:

1. u cannot change how i feel about this deal
2. yes i have played the game for 3 years and so has my husband. and we invested way more than the initial price on this game and have always supported this game. so the argument about: well u had the game for free, now new players get it for free whats your issue? well u obviously dont want to understand the issue!

3 u can not force me to be quiet

4 u cant expect everyone to shut up and just accept things

5. as i have an opinion about the pricing, so do u. difference: im not trying to force my opinion on u. u wanna buy it at 50$ thats fine, enjoy! but i personally wont shut up, because i am unhappy and u cannot change this at all.

6. u are not anet and honestly, the only one who can change the way we who are upset feel is ANET and only ANET. white knights that call us names just make us even more upset.

THIS! So very much this!

selan.8354:

abc.5790:

Eurhetemec.9052:

abc.5790:

$50 expansion may seem expensive to some but it’s still very reasonable.

Very reasonable by what standard? It’s expensive for an expansion, period. It’s very expensive for an expansion that does not let you play all the content without deleting a character or buying a new slot for another $10.

I think it’s just your opinion that it’s “very reasonable”, not a fact so you may want to chew on that.

abc.5790:

Why does it bother “veterans” that new customers get the base for free? If you’re a so called veteran, you had a 3 year head start. You experienced content that’s now retired, content that will never be enjoyed by the new buyer.

Simple fairness when we’re paying money for something. It’s not complicated.

My bad, I didn’t know people on here were ignorant on the price ranges of gaming expansions. Is this your first game?

$50 is reasonable because it is within the range of a typical expansion.
$5000000000000000 is unreasonable though.

why do u even argue if u do not want to understand why veterans and others are upset? u like the deal ok thats fine and im glad u like it, but me and others arent.
i get that u are happy, but u cant change how we who are upset feel:

to ALL u white knights out there:

1. u cannot change how i feel about this deal
2. yes i have played the game for 3 years and so has my husband. and we invested way more than the initial price on this game and have always supported this game. so the argument about: well u had the game for free, now new players get it for free whats your issue? well u obviously dont want to understand the issue!

3 u can not force me to be quiet

4 u cant expect everyone to shut up and just accept things

5. as i have an opinion about the pricing, so do u. difference: im not trying to force my opinion on u. u wanna buy it at 50$ thats fine, enjoy! but i personally wont shut up, because i am unhappy and u cannot change this at all.

6. u are not anet and honestly, the only one who can change the way we who are upset feel is ANET and only ANET. white knights that call us names just make us even more upset.

Well no one is asking you to buy it and if you cant afford it that’s your problem.

Play fair and don’t tell people to shut up.

You exercise your right to state your opinion. So I exercise my right to have an opinion about your opinion.

I have a feeling they won’t adress this until full release and then they will throw Vets a bone. Tho they could just completetly ignore us and hope it goes away xD witch they seem to be doing.

matrix seishin.5312:

abc.5790:

My bad, I didn’t know people on here were ignorant on the price ranges of gaming expansions. Is this your first game?

$50 is reasonable because it is within the range of a typical expansion.
$5000000000000000 is unreasonable though.

Which other game costs 50$ and then has an expansion or dlc that also costs 50$? Even if there is 1, why should GW2 be the same? GW2 is vast and HoT will be a small part of that. So no… 50$ for an expansion is not reasonable.

It doesn’t matter if others are charging $5, $50, or $500. Any expansion to any game needs to give customers the perception that they are getting a reasonable amount of content for their money. Expansions usually cost more, because that term is almost always reserved for additions of significant amounts of content. Any DLC is still an “expansion”, but we don’t see companies charging $50 for DLC or even applying that label to them.

All the term “expansion” really represents is a marketing term for “really big DLC”. So, if a company wants to use the term, they need to be sure they are giving and marketing a “really big” DLC. This is something Anet has yet to do with HoT. The content they’ve shown off or even hinted it, is very limited.

At the point of HoT being put up for sale, I’d expect Anet to be showing off new content if it actually exists. This is why people are doubting the value of the expansion. Anet has given us no reason to believe that it’s worth the cost, and no reason to believe we will actually get a significant amount of content.

dope boy fresh.7203:

I have a feeling they won’t adress this until full release and then they will throw Vets a bone. Tho they could just completetly ignore us and hope it goes away xD witch they seem to be doing.

A lot of vets aren’t going to wait that long. They could be doing irreparable harm to their company with their silence.

abc.5790:

selan.8354:

abc.5790:

Eurhetemec.9052:

abc.5790:

$50 expansion may seem expensive to some but it’s still very reasonable.

Very reasonable by what standard? It’s expensive for an expansion, period. It’s very expensive for an expansion that does not let you play all the content without deleting a character or buying a new slot for another $10.

I think it’s just your opinion that it’s “very reasonable”, not a fact so you may want to chew on that.

abc.5790:

Why does it bother “veterans” that new customers get the base for free? If you’re a so called veteran, you had a 3 year head start. You experienced content that’s now retired, content that will never be enjoyed by the new buyer.

Simple fairness when we’re paying money for something. It’s not complicated.

My bad, I didn’t know people on here were ignorant on the price ranges of gaming expansions. Is this your first game?

$50 is reasonable because it is within the range of a typical expansion.
$5000000000000000 is unreasonable though.

why do u even argue if u do not want to understand why veterans and others are upset? u like the deal ok thats fine and im glad u like it, but me and others arent.
i get that u are happy, but u cant change how we who are upset feel:

to ALL u white knights out there:

1. u cannot change how i feel about this deal
2. yes i have played the game for 3 years and so has my husband. and we invested way more than the initial price on this game and have always supported this game. so the argument about: well u had the game for free, now new players get it for free whats your issue? well u obviously dont want to understand the issue!

3 u can not force me to be quiet

4 u cant expect everyone to shut up and just accept things

5. as i have an opinion about the pricing, so do u. difference: im not trying to force my opinion on u. u wanna buy it at 50$ thats fine, enjoy! but i personally wont shut up, because i am unhappy and u cannot change this at all.

6. u are not anet and honestly, the only one who can change the way we who are upset feel is ANET and only ANET. white knights that call us names just make us even more upset.

Well no one is asking you to buy it and if you cant afford it that’s your problem.

Play fair and don’t tell people to shut up.

You exercise your right to state your opinion. So I exercise my right to have an opinion about your opinion.

erm did i state that i cannot afford it? i didnt say to shut up. but u are still attacking me for being a different opinion. u think its a good deal…fine thats your opinion. i think its a terrible deal!

Seera.5916:

1., 2., & 3. It costs that much because that’s what ANet values HoT at. They do have an issue of not communicating enough details about HoT for everyone to see it worth that much.

4. It’s not false advertising. You still need the base game to play HoT. They’ve just bundled the two together in one key. Not having something in place to quickly copy & paste onto the forums for those who did purchase withing the past 30-60 days was the mistake here. To me, they also still haven’t officially announced that because it’s not on the official forum. ANet needs to learn to post things on more than just every site but the official forums. We shouldn’t have to post a link to a post on Reddit from a dev about what they are doing for those who purchased recently. It is however shady given they’ve done sales of the game recently.

…

Yes, they valued it at 50$. It does not mean that it is worth that much to the player. We just don’t know yet. That’s why I suggest waiting.

Yes it is false advertising (in a way). They said “You need to have the core game to play HoT”. They put it on sale so people can get it and eventually get HoT as well. But now they say “You didn’t have to buy GW2 before because now we are giving it for free if you pre-purchase HoT”.

We don’t know what they valued it at, we only know that they priced it at $50.

Value and price are different concepts.

Pifil.5193:

Straylight.7529:

You did NOT pay Arenanet in advance so they owe you three years of updates. You paid for Guild Wars 2 in it’s vanilla state. Nothing more, nothing less.

No we didn’t. It’s an MMO so frequent updates are expected and included as part of the base product. They sold the game on the basis of their post-launch plans. No-one would buy an MMO that wasn’t planning on adding new content just like no-one would release an MMO that wasn’t planning on adding new content. That’s not how the market works.

http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2012-04-23-guild-wars-2-developer-has-plans-for-literally-years-to-come

“Look,” concluded Price, "even from our standpoint we’ve got years of work, of great work, that players are going to be able to enjoy.

“We’re launching a service – you don’t launch a box and be done with it. We have years of awesome, fun work ahead of us.”

Articles like that are the reason people bought into GW2.

This is way too rational for some people, but very well-said. And, truly, not said often enough. I don’t understand this mentality that Living Story updates are “gravy” on top of the base game. They’re not. They’re meant to entice players into picking up the game (which it did, for me) and buying from the gemshop (also did for me) which is increasing their revenue.

They’re changing their business model, and nobody but ANET is sure of why that is, but one thing I will say is that this expansion’s value should not take into account previous updates to the game. I would not have bought an MMO without a clearly stated plan for regular updates to the game. Living Story is what brought me in the door. It’s why they have my money for 2 accounts.

This is the worst kind of straw man, and it needs to stop. The game was advertised as being buy to play with content updates. Stop acting like it should factor in to how we value Heart of Thorns, except to provide context for what the expansion might look like. That’s it. It wasn’t “free” it was the selling point.

I wouldn’t pre-purchase anything from this company, and certainly not without a clear release schedule, after the Infinite Continue Coin debacle remains unresolved, but I was starting to have some good will again. Enough that I was contemplating upgrading both of my accounts, and almost certainly planning to buy (perhaps post-release) the expansion for my main account.

At $25 for the base price, both accounts would have been a sure thing from me, once a date was announced. I’d probably even have considered $35 a fair enough price for my main account to get it. But given what last year was like, and what this year has been like thus far (content-wise and “communication”), I’m simply going to wait and see what reviewers have to say, and for the price to fall.

matrix seishin.5312:

abc.5790:

My bad, I didn’t know people on here were ignorant on the price ranges of gaming expansions. Is this your first game?

$50 is reasonable because it is within the range of a typical expansion.
$5000000000000000 is unreasonable though.

Which other game costs 50$ and then has an expansion or dlc that also costs 50$? Even if there is 1, why should GW2 be the same? GW2 is vast and HoT will be a small part of that. So no… 50$ for an expansion is not reasonable.

How can you say that hot will not be vast? Are you the only one who got secret info on the game? Did you know that maguuma jungle is 3 level for each map? This meens that you tripple the area by scalling up, it may not be as vaste has the core game but it can be a decent area for an expansion.

mrstealth.6701:

MiniEquine.6014:

At no point did they say not to complain about it, just that, in their opinion, the complaints are somewhat out of hand. Speak out if you feel like it, but it really has gotten to some ridiculous levels (like trying to file a class-action lawsuit? really?). Anet owes us more communication, clarification, and possibly apologies too, but this forum has been almost literally nothing but repeat threads about the expansion price.

For customers that purchased GW2 in the recent months when Anet had been marketing (deceptively) the base game as being required before buying HoT, there is valid reasoning for legal action. That deceptive marketing very likely false under the definitions of US false advertising laws.

You can just ask for a refund / discount in the support area of gw2, they may accord you a way to be discounted for the price of HOT if you pay for the core game now that they give it for free (if you got it in less than a month ago I think)

Guhracie.3419:

At $25 for the base price, both accounts would have been a sure thing from me, once a date was announced. I’d probably even have considered $35 a fair enough price for my main account to get it. But given what last year was like, and what this year has been like thus far (content-wise and “communication”), I’m simply going to wait and see what reviewers have to say, and for the price to fall.

I agree except for one thing. I’m going to wait for a while to see what ANet says/does. If it’s “nothing” long enough, I’ll just decide that they don’t really value their existing customer base and move on to another game.

If they do start saying something, then I’ll consider what they say before making a final decision.

DeadReaper.6527:

mrstealth.6701:

MiniEquine.6014:

At no point did they say not to complain about it, just that, in their opinion, the complaints are somewhat out of hand. Speak out if you feel like it, but it really has gotten to some ridiculous levels (like trying to file a class-action lawsuit? really?). Anet owes us more communication, clarification, and possibly apologies too, but this forum has been almost literally nothing but repeat threads about the expansion price.

For customers that purchased GW2 in the recent months when Anet had been marketing (deceptively) the base game as being required before buying HoT, there is valid reasoning for legal action. That deceptive marketing very likely false under the definitions of US false advertising laws.

You can just ask for a refund / discount in the support area of gw2, they may accord you a way to be discounted for the price of HOT if you pay for the core game now that they give it for free (if you got it in less than a month ago I think)

I’ll believe that when there’s official ANET word on it, and not a moment sooner. However, I’d like to point out that this FAQ was up for five months, and likely misled a lot of people in that time period. I guess the rest of the people are just out of luck.

DeadReaper.6527:

How can you say that hot will not be vast? Are you the only one who got secret info on the game? Did you know that maguuma jungle is 3 level for each map? This meens that you tripple the area by scalling up, it may not be as vaste has the core game but it can be a decent area for an expansion.

Maybe, maybe… But I’m not talking just about map size. I’m talking about content as a whole. And if you compare GW2 to HoT I doubt they will have even close to the same amount of content. As you said – it will be a decent area, but not worth the same price as the core game.

DeadReaper.6527:

mrstealth.6701:

MiniEquine.6014:

At no point did they say not to complain about it, just that, in their opinion, the complaints are somewhat out of hand. Speak out if you feel like it, but it really has gotten to some ridiculous levels (like trying to file a class-action lawsuit? really?). Anet owes us more communication, clarification, and possibly apologies too, but this forum has been almost literally nothing but repeat threads about the expansion price.

For customers that purchased GW2 in the recent months when Anet had been marketing (deceptively) the base game as being required before buying HoT, there is valid reasoning for legal action. That deceptive marketing very likely false under the definitions of US false advertising laws.

You can just ask for a refund / discount in the support area of gw2, they may accord you a way to be discounted for the price of HOT if you pay for the core game now that they give it for free (if you got it in less than a month ago I think)

The only refund offer I’m aware of deletes the existing account, and does not refund any gems/gemstore purchases. So they have to start over, and lose any money spent on gems. That’s a pretty terrible “offer”.

If they were to give these players a voucher/discount code of some sort, I think that would be pretty good.

matrix seishin.5312:

DeadReaper.6527:

How can you say that hot will not be vast? Are you the only one who got secret info on the game? Did you know that maguuma jungle is 3 level for each map? This meens that you tripple the area by scalling up, it may not be as vaste has the core game but it can be a decent area for an expansion.

Maybe, maybe… But I’m not talking just about map size. I’m talking about content as a whole. And if you compare GW2 to HoT I doubt they will have even close to the same amount of content. As you said – it will be a decent area, but not worth the same price as the core game.

I can’t say for sure, but I will wait and see for myself, we can only decide if the content in hot value 50$ when we will have more details about it.

mrstealth.6701:

DeadReaper.6527:

mrstealth.6701:

MiniEquine.6014:

At no point did they say not to complain about it, just that, in their opinion, the complaints are somewhat out of hand. Speak out if you feel like it, but it really has gotten to some ridiculous levels (like trying to file a class-action lawsuit? really?). Anet owes us more communication, clarification, and possibly apologies too, but this forum has been almost literally nothing but repeat threads about the expansion price.

For customers that purchased GW2 in the recent months when Anet had been marketing (deceptively) the base game as being required before buying HoT, there is valid reasoning for legal action. That deceptive marketing very likely false under the definitions of US false advertising laws.

You can just ask for a refund / discount in the support area of gw2, they may accord you a way to be discounted for the price of HOT if you pay for the core game now that they give it for free (if you got it in less than a month ago I think)

The only refund offer I’m aware of deletes the existing account, and does not refund any gems/gemstore purchases. So they have to start over, and lose any money spent on gems. That’s a pretty terrible “offer”.

If they were to give these players a voucher/discount code of some sort, I think that would be pretty good.

In that way, I think it is sad, in ANet place I would at least offer a discount on the upgrade if you purchase it less than a month ago. I’m rooting for you to obtain an upgrade for the current price of hot – the price you paid for the core game.

In hope an admin can authorize that kind of thing with is just basic compromise for an advertisement that was misleading in the FAQ.

DeadReaper.6527:

matrix seishin.5312:

DeadReaper.6527:

How can you say that hot will not be vast? Are you the only one who got secret info on the game? Did you know that maguuma jungle is 3 level for each map? This meens that you tripple the area by scalling up, it may not be as vaste has the core game but it can be a decent area for an expansion.

Maybe, maybe… But I’m not talking just about map size. I’m talking about content as a whole. And if you compare GW2 to HoT I doubt they will have even close to the same amount of content. As you said – it will be a decent area, but not worth the same price as the core game.

I can’t say for sure, but I will wait and see for myself, we can only decide if the content in hot value 50$ when we will have more details about it.

All we have to go buy right now is the available map space in that region, and what Anet has shown/told of so far. Neither of these things are very promising.

The remaining Maguuma territory on the map is pretty small, and even with the verticality of HoT, isn’t enough space to be more than a small fraction of the core game. And in the parts of Verdant Brink we’ve seen (in betas), there wasn’t a lot of overlap in the verticality. Meaning that if you’re on the jungle canopy, there is no jungle floor area below you. Having 3 different layers of a map is only going to increase the area/content if those layers overlap each other.

As for what Anet is showing off. Verdant Brink and a single short story instance is it. I would have expected at last some information about other maps before they started asking for money.

101 pages of people discussing the multiple issues surrounding the pre-order deal.
Multiple other threads, and yet Anet silence remains.

If a company can’t come up with an official statement after a week, I guess it’s time to pack and move to another game. Sad, I really loved this one.

Wolfeng.3784:

101 pages of people discussing the multiple issues surrounding the pre-order deal.
Multiple other threads, and yet Anet silence remains.

If a company can’t come up with an official statement after a week, I guess it’s time to pack and move to another game. Sad, I really loved this one.

You do realize that the Anet official statement is already in the thread, posted 5 days ago? Expansion is $50, period. Its the answer to the thread. Just because people dont like it or choose to ignore it doesnt make it any less of an official statement. What came after is as you said, 101 pages of people discussing stuff.

I thought the Blizzard pricing and lack of content was crazy but HoT tops this by a huge margin. I have no respect for Anet now, just another MMO consumed by pure greed.

I didn’t read the whole thread so, sorry if someone alredy posted/answer this:

1. Since the cost we see is for a pre-order, which include an exclusive title and be able to play some events before HoT launch. Taking in account those things (or some of those things) won’t be available after launch: the cost of the game will be different after launch? It will cost less? If the answer is yes (which I doubt), then maybe the current cost isn’t that bad, if it is not (most likely) then the cost may be too high.

2. With the current cost, I think is fine to give players the base game for free if they buy the expansion. If the cost is reduced (which I doubt) it could be ok to leave the current cost for the ones that don’t have the basic game.

3. I think that if the current cost isn’t changed they could, at least, give something else:

For the standard edition, add a free character slot. And to the other 2 add another slot or free bag slots (1 or 2) to be used in the character they want, or something like that.

Dawdler.8521:

Wolfeng.3784:

101 pages of people discussing the multiple issues surrounding the pre-order deal.
Multiple other threads, and yet Anet silence remains.

If a company can’t come up with an official statement after a week, I guess it’s time to pack and move to another game. Sad, I really loved this one.

You do realize that the Anet official statement is already in the thread, posted 5 days ago? Expansion is $50, period. Its the answer to the thread. Just because people dont like it or choose to ignore it doesnt make it any less of an official statement. What came after is as you said, 101 pages of people discussing stuff.

So, you’re saying the official statement is, “we’re not changing anything, kitten off everyone who doesn’t like it”?

matrix seishin.5312:

Maybe, maybe… But I’m not talking just about map size. I’m talking about content as a whole. And if you compare GW2 to HoT I doubt they will have even close to the same amount of content. As you said – it will be a decent area, but not worth the same price as the core game.

Yeah, they haven’t addressed people’s questions or concerns over the amount of content in the expansion.

Direct questions go unanswered; for example, people have been asking about whether or not there are new dungeons or fractals, a simple yes no answer would do there but ArenaNet ignore the question. Surely something like the existence of new dungeons or fractals is not a secret, they’re either adding them or they’re not. So why not tell people? Because a “no” could mean that some of those people may just leave the game now, not answering means they will hang around and may see something else that will get them to buy.

We’re assured that HoT will lay the framework for future expansions but if HoT doesn’t deliver on the content then will there still be players around to justify future expansions? (Not to mention that ArenaNet have put frameworks in place in the past that they then abandon; Fractals were going to be this great system that was easy to add to and yet we have had very little in terms of actual additions to the Fractal system).

At this stage I beginning to feel like they’re stringing us along, trickling out information about systems being added but little to no information on the actual content that goes alongside it. That’s what will sell (or kill) this expansion.

Dawdler.8521:

Wolfeng.3784:

101 pages of people discussing the multiple issues surrounding the pre-order deal.
Multiple other threads, and yet Anet silence remains.

If a company can’t come up with an official statement after a week, I guess it’s time to pack and move to another game. Sad, I really loved this one.

You do realize that the Anet official statement is already in the thread, posted 5 days ago? Expansion is $50, period. Its the answer to the thread. Just because people dont like it or choose to ignore it doesnt make it any less of an official statement. What came after is as you said, 101 pages of people discussing stuff.

Ahh brave knight, lets clear some topics for you, since you haven’t been paying attention. I understand, being a knight and all must take a lot of your time.

*Problem number 1: *

They had a campaign that stated we need the core game to play HoT, that later changed to notify that HoT already has the core game included.

They had sales over a period of months on top of that initial statement.

The only “official” response for that was a forum post somewhere on this mess. That hasn’t even been made a stick, saying that they would refund. So far some people managed to get a refund from purchases made more than 30 days, while others didnt. Its incosistent.

And there’s no clear answer as to what happens to those accounts, since again, some said they would lose their accounts, while others kept. Again, incosistency.

*Problem number 2: *

Client 1 pays 50$ for a product and gets item X and Y. Item Y is free, so they say.
Client 2 pays 50$ for a product and gets item X. He can’t get item Y because he already owns. Where’s the freebie for client 2?

That lowers the value of any purchase, and make the deal look more appealing for only one of the clients.

*Problem number 3: *

There hasn’t been a great deal of features that made HoT look like its worth 50$. Guild halls? A new region? Elite specs that haven’t even been revealed yet? A new class that is still being worked on?
Not enough for some people, and for those, they can just wait and see. Easy.

Now brave knight, I hope that has cleared some stuff for you. And I hope you enjoy your next adventures in this land so full of trolls.

GeekDavid.2786:

Dawdler.8521:

Wolfeng.3784:

101 pages of people discussing the multiple issues surrounding the pre-order deal.
Multiple other threads, and yet Anet silence remains.

If a company can’t come up with an official statement after a week, I guess it’s time to pack and move to another game. Sad, I really loved this one.

You do realize that the Anet official statement is already in the thread, posted 5 days ago? Expansion is $50, period. Its the answer to the thread. Just because people dont like it or choose to ignore it doesnt make it any less of an official statement. What came after is as you said, 101 pages of people discussing stuff.

So, you’re saying the official statement is, “we’re not changing anything, kitten off everyone who doesn’t like it”?

pretty much yes… and let’s be honest here, that’s what’s hapenning right now. that’s the reason there’s no other response to this thread. they might reconsinder their position in time if they don’t reach their financial goals or the game starts to suffer due to bad press. otherwise it’s safe to say that they’re pretty much done. that’s why they lump here every semi negative thread and they flat out delete others. they don’t want our “negative” vibes or something affecting the forums and such…

They could have sold the base game for $10 and the expansion for $50. That would have made things seem more equitable for everyone. $10 wouldn’t be such a burden for a new player. And if they’d added a char slot to all packages, in addition, there probably never would have been much outrage.

ReiCH.6273:

GeekDavid.2786:

Dawdler.8521:

Wolfeng.3784:

101 pages of people discussing the multiple issues surrounding the pre-order deal.
Multiple other threads, and yet Anet silence remains.

If a company can’t come up with an official statement after a week, I guess it’s time to pack and move to another game. Sad, I really loved this one.

You do realize that the Anet official statement is already in the thread, posted 5 days ago? Expansion is $50, period. Its the answer to the thread. Just because people dont like it or choose to ignore it doesnt make it any less of an official statement. What came after is as you said, 101 pages of people discussing stuff.

So, you’re saying the official statement is, “we’re not changing anything, kitten off everyone who doesn’t like it”?

pretty much yes… and let’s be honest here, that’s what’s hapenning right now. that’s the reason there’s no other response to this thread. they might reconsinder their position in time if they don’t reach their financial goals or the game starts to suffer due to bad press. otherwise it’s safe to say that they’re pretty much done. that’s why they lump here every semi negative thread and they flat out delete others. they don’t want our “negative” vibes or something affecting the forums and such…

That sure seems to be the case. As I said on another thread (that’ll probably be merged here), ANet just doesn’t care about their existing customers.

Dawdler.8521:

Wolfeng.3784:

101 pages of people discussing the multiple issues surrounding the pre-order deal.
Multiple other threads, and yet Anet silence remains.

If a company can’t come up with an official statement after a week, I guess it’s time to pack and move to another game. Sad, I really loved this one.

You do realize that the Anet official statement is already in the thread, posted 5 days ago? Expansion is $50, period. Its the answer to the thread. Just because people dont like it or choose to ignore it doesnt make it any less of an official statement. What came after is as you said, 101 pages of people discussing stuff.

That’s not a response to the issues being brought up here. That’s a clarification of the ambiguous information on the HoT pre-purchase page.

Yes they did answer. They said that the expansion is 45 euro. Something we can already see but simply don’t agree with. Maybe we can’t do anything about it. But around page 60 they said they will keep out opinions and suggestions in mind. We’ll see. All we can do is wait.

mrstealth.6701:

DeadReaper.6527:

mrstealth.6701:

MiniEquine.6014:

At no point did they say not to complain about it, just that, in their opinion, the complaints are somewhat out of hand. Speak out if you feel like it, but it really has gotten to some ridiculous levels (like trying to file a class-action lawsuit? really?). Anet owes us more communication, clarification, and possibly apologies too, but this forum has been almost literally nothing but repeat threads about the expansion price.

For customers that purchased GW2 in the recent months when Anet had been marketing (deceptively) the base game as being required before buying HoT, there is valid reasoning for legal action. That deceptive marketing very likely false under the definitions of US false advertising laws.

You can just ask for a refund / discount in the support area of gw2, they may accord you a way to be discounted for the price of HOT if you pay for the core game now that they give it for free (if you got it in less than a month ago I think)

The only refund offer I’m aware of deletes the existing account, and does not refund any gems/gemstore purchases. So they have to start over, and lose any money spent on gems. That’s a pretty terrible “offer”.

If they were to give these players a voucher/discount code of some sort, I think that would be pretty good.

It’s been confirmed that refunds are being processed for within 30 days purchases, if made on buy.guildwars2.com
At least one as far back as April.
At least two lost no current progress, gems, etc.

Between the many many threads about this, I can’t remember specifically which thread(s) / posts I’ve seen these things stated, but they did have copies of official support responses.

I trust that people who purchased within 30 days have a viable option to get necessary refunds/service; if they contact support.

Doesn’t alleviate my main concern (why is my $50 worth less than a new players?) BUT at least Anet is correcting those who have been hands down deceived by the FAQ. This restores some faith I lost in this debacle.

I was fine in paying the 50$ for the exp. But what changed my mind was the “free” core game.

I’ve been supporting Anet since 2006 and have been disappointed more than once but never enough to not buy an expansion.

This timr they totally blew it for me. New players are treated better.

I refuse to buy anything else from Anet. I refuse to pay for something others are getting better and for the same price.

No thanks. I’ll gladly give my money to a more honest company. I work hard for my money and should at least deserve the same amount of content as the new player over there.

Seera.5916:

4. It’s not false advertising. You still need the base game to play HoT. They’ve just bundled the two together in one key. Not having something in place to quickly copy & paste onto the forums for those who did purchase withing the past 30-60 days was the mistake here. To me, they also still haven’t officially announced that because it’s not on the official forum. ANet needs to learn to post things on more than just every site but the official forums. We shouldn’t have to post a link to a post on Reddit from a dev about what they are doing for those who purchased recently. It is however shady given they’ve done sales of the game recently.

.

Actually it is false advertising.
They are not only delivering on the deal they promised, they also led people on to believe they needed to purchase the core game before HoT, and had sales 3+ months before they announced this bundle.

matrix seishin.5312:

But around page 60 they said they will keep out opinions and suggestions in mind. We’ll see. All we can do is wait.

Yeah, I agree. That’s all we can do.

However, as ArenaNet have repeatedly proven themselves to be terrible at communicating real information, I won’t wait long.

Pifil.5193:

matrix seishin.5312:

But around page 60 they said they will keep out opinions and suggestions in mind. We’ll see. All we can do is wait.

Yeah, I agree. That’s all we can do.

However, as ArenaNet have repeatedly proven themselves to be terrible at communicating real information, I won’t wait long.

Yeah, this is my issue. ANet honestly seems to try to “get away with” a lot of stuff and only backtrack once HUGE outrage is expressed, and then only sometimes. No trust here. None at all. You’ll be waiting a long time, my friend. I’ve seen them spew out platitudes like “we’re looking into it” over and over with not much resulting action.

ozmaniandevil.6805:

Pifil.5193:

matrix seishin.5312:

But around page 60 they said they will keep out opinions and suggestions in mind. We’ll see. All we can do is wait.

Yeah, I agree. That’s all we can do.

However, as ArenaNet have repeatedly proven themselves to be terrible at communicating real information, I won’t wait long.

Yeah, this is my issue. ANet honestly seems to try to “get away with” a lot of stuff and only backtrack once HUGE outrage is expressed, and then only sometimes. No trust here. None at all. You’ll be waiting a long time, my friend. I’ve seen them spew out platitudes like “we’re looking into it” over and over with not much resulting action.

Speaking only for myself, my patience with ANet is rapidly evaporating.

And our various white knights here aren’t slowing said evaporation at all.

“100 pages of ignorance”
Hell with it – they won’t do anything about this.

Solori.6025:

Seera.5916:

4. It’s not false advertising. You still need the base game to play HoT. They’ve just bundled the two together in one key. Not having something in place to quickly copy & paste onto the forums for those who did purchase withing the past 30-60 days was the mistake here. To me, they also still haven’t officially announced that because it’s not on the official forum. ANet needs to learn to post things on more than just every site but the official forums. We shouldn’t have to post a link to a post on Reddit from a dev about what they are doing for those who purchased recently. It is however shady given they’ve done sales of the game recently.

.

Actually it is false advertising.
They are not only delivering on the deal they promised, they also led people on to believe they needed to purchase the core game before HoT, and had sales 3+ months before they announced this bundle.

Think it’s more of misrepresenting the product

synfullydevine.3642:

Think it’s more of misrepresenting the product

They actually had to change their FAO because of this, used to said you’d need to buy the core game, now it says you get it for free.

Shinzan.2908:

synfullydevine.3642:

Think it’s more of misrepresenting the product

They actually had to change their FAO because of this, used to said you’d need to buy the core game, now it says you get it for free.

Misrepresentation of a product in a manner that could effect purchasing decisions is the legal definition of false advertisement.

Telling people (via the original FAQ), that the core game was required before purchasing HoT would certainly effect their decision to buy the core game.

Title 15 U.S. Code Chapter 2 Subchapter 1 Section 55 Additional definitions

(a) False advertisement
(1) The term “false advertisement” means an advertisement, other than labeling, which is misleading in a material respect; and in determining whether any advertisement is misleading, there shall be taken into account (among other things) not only representations made or suggested by statement, word, design, device, sound, or any combination thereof, but also the extent to which the advertisement fails to reveal facts material in the light of such representations or material with respect to consequences which may result from the use of the commodity to which the advertisement relates under the conditions prescribed in said advertisement, or under such conditions as are customary or usual. No advertisement of a drug shall be deemed to be false if it is disseminated only to members of the medical profession, contains no false representation of a material fact, and includes, or is accompanied in each instance by truthful disclosure of, the formula showing quantitatively each ingredient of such drug.

if the core game has become free, does that mean we can make a new account without HoT for free?
oh and if that’s not the case, it’s not really free now is it.

sorudo.9054:

if the core game has become free, does that mean we can make a new account without HoT for free?
oh and if that’s not the case, it’s not really free now is it.

Yeah, it’s free for new players only.

mrstealth.6701:

Shinzan.2908:

synfullydevine.3642:

Think it’s more of misrepresenting the product

I
They actually had to change their FAO because of this, used to said you’d need to buy the core game, now it says you get it for free.

Misrepresentation of a product in a manner that could effect purchasing decisions is the legal definition of false advertisement.

Telling people (via the original FAQ), that the core game was required before purchasing HoT would certainly effect their decision to buy the core game.

Title 15 U.S. Code Chapter 2 Subchapter 1 Section 55 Additional definitions

(a) False advertisement
(1) The term “false advertisement” means an advertisement, other than labeling, which is misleading in a material respect; and in determining whether any advertisement is misleading, there shall be taken into account (among other things) not only representations made or suggested by statement, word, design, device, sound, or any combination thereof, but also the extent to which the advertisement fails to reveal facts material in the light of such representations or material with respect to consequences which may result from the use of the commodity to which the advertisement relates under the conditions prescribed in said advertisement, or under such conditions as are customary or usual. No advertisement of a drug shall be deemed to be false if it is disseminated only to members of the medical profession, contains no false representation of a material fact, and includes, or is accompanied in each instance by truthful disclosure of, the formula showing quantitatively each ingredient of such drug.

Ty for opening up that business law book. It’s not false advertising though if they accept refund s sold to the customers who actually were affected by it. In which is handled individually

synfullydevine.3642:

mrstealth.6701:

Shinzan.2908:

synfullydevine.3642:

Think it’s more of misrepresenting the product

I
They actually had to change their FAO because of this, used to said you’d need to buy the core game, now it says you get it for free.

Misrepresentation of a product in a manner that could effect purchasing decisions is the legal definition of false advertisement.

Telling people (via the original FAQ), that the core game was required before purchasing HoT would certainly effect their decision to buy the core game.

Title 15 U.S. Code Chapter 2 Subchapter 1 Section 55 Additional definitions

(a) False advertisement
(1) The term “false advertisement” means an advertisement, other than labeling, which is misleading in a material respect; and in determining whether any advertisement is misleading, there shall be taken into account (among other things) not only representations made or suggested by statement, word, design, device, sound, or any combination thereof, but also the extent to which the advertisement fails to reveal facts material in the light of such representations or material with respect to consequences which may result from the use of the commodity to which the advertisement relates under the conditions prescribed in said advertisement, or under such conditions as are customary or usual. No advertisement of a drug shall be deemed to be false if it is disseminated only to members of the medical profession, contains no false representation of a material fact, and includes, or is accompanied in each instance by truthful disclosure of, the formula showing quantitatively each ingredient of such drug.

Ty for opening up that business law book. It’s not false advertising though if they accept refund s sold to the customers who actually were affected by it. In which is handled individually

Does it count as a refund when you have to forfeit all gems on the account?

RoyHarmon.5398:

synfullydevine.3642:

mrstealth.6701:

Shinzan.2908:

synfullydevine.3642:

Think it’s more of misrepresenting the product

I
They actually had to change their FAO because of this, used to said you’d need to buy the core game, now it says you get it for free.

Misrepresentation of a product in a manner that could effect purchasing decisions is the legal definition of false advertisement.

Telling people (via the original FAQ), that the core game was required before purchasing HoT would certainly effect their decision to buy the core game.

Title 15 U.S. Code Chapter 2 Subchapter 1 Section 55 Additional definitions

(a) False advertisement
(1) The term “false advertisement” means an advertisement, other than labeling, which is misleading in a material respect; and in determining whether any advertisement is misleading, there shall be taken into account (among other things) not only representations made or suggested by statement, word, design, device, sound, or any combination thereof, but also the extent to which the advertisement fails to reveal facts material in the light of such representations or material with respect to consequences which may result from the use of the commodity to which the advertisement relates under the conditions prescribed in said advertisement, or under such conditions as are customary or usual. No advertisement of a drug shall be deemed to be false if it is disseminated only to members of the medical profession, contains no false representation of a material fact, and includes, or is accompanied in each instance by truthful disclosure of, the formula showing quantitatively each ingredient of such drug.

Ty for opening up that business law book. It’s not false advertising though if they accept refund s sold to the customers who actually were affected by it. In which is handled individually

Does it count as a refund when you have to forfeit all gems on the account?

Does the refund actually negate the violation? I can see it causing some leniency to be granted, but does it specifically remove legal responsibility?

And the fact that there were customers not offered full refunds should also be taken into account.

Also, no business law book is necessary. The actual text of US Code is available online. https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/15/chapter-2/subchapter-I

RoyHarmon.5398:

synfullydevine.3642:

mrstealth.6701:

Shinzan.2908:

synfullydevine.3642:

Think it’s more of misrepresenting the product

I
They actually had to change their FAO because of this, used to said you’d need to buy the core game, now it says you get it for free.

Misrepresentation of a product in a manner that could effect purchasing decisions is the legal definition of false advertisement.

Telling people (via the original FAQ), that the core game was required before purchasing HoT would certainly effect their decision to buy the core game.

Title 15 U.S. Code Chapter 2 Subchapter 1 Section 55 Additional definitions

(a) False advertisement
(1) The term “false advertisement” means an advertisement, other than labeling, which is misleading in a material respect; and in determining whether any advertisement is misleading, there shall be taken into account (among other things) not only representations made or suggested by statement, word, design, device, sound, or any combination thereof, but also the extent to which the advertisement fails to reveal facts material in the light of such representations or material with respect to consequences which may result from the use of the commodity to which the advertisement relates under the conditions prescribed in said advertisement, or under such conditions as are customary or usual. No advertisement of a drug shall be deemed to be false if it is disseminated only to members of the medical profession, contains no false representation of a material fact, and includes, or is accompanied in each instance by truthful disclosure of, the formula showing quantitatively each ingredient of such drug.

Ty for opening up that business law book. It’s not false advertising though if they accept refund s sold to the customers who actually were affected by it. In which is handled individually

Does it count as a refund when you have to forfeit all gems on the account?

All I can say is only ppl who bought and can deal with refunding are entitled for that claim. Otherwise no one else has been mislead. If anet shows legit fair trade over the faq that was advertised then there should be no claim of false advertising. Myself that is a strong word and can’t point my finger at anet. Maybe some can but I don’t know. True or not I did see a post on reddit someone stating they kept there progress which led me they kept there gem purchases too. But don’t know how true that is. This is the internet
edit: don’t get me wrong if a refund is all you did and didn’t pay the 50 then I would think your entitled but I just hate to see certain words used loosely when it didn’t happen to everyone. Would help if anet came clear on this though