Guild Wars 2

I remember Anet, when introducing Specializations(Elite Specializations now called)
They compared this feature to Dual Class Feature from GW1..

Well with the reveal of Chronomancer (Mesmer’s Elite Spec), its clear what they mean now.
Chronomancer is a combo of Mesmer/Necromancer. Chonomancer is a Mesmer with Necromancer Wells and DS to a limited extent.

Very clever.

I didnt want to bump the old thread,

But I would be interested in a discussion to speculate how you believe other upcoming Elite Specs well be a combo of.

Something to note:
The Chronomancer’s special weapon was (SHIELD) which neither the Mesmer nor Necromancer can use.. interesting.

So far I have a few hints myself.

*Guardian- getting Bow
*Engineer- getting Hammer
*Elementalist – getting Sword
*Thief – getting Rifle
*Ranger – getting Staff
*Necromancer – getting GreatSword

What sort of combos you think could be coming between these classes?

I had a speculation thrown my way:

Guardian (Long Bow) = Guardian/Elementalist – Attunement mechanics mixed with virtues. Virtues change the effect of weapon skills and utilities.

Thoughts?

Knighthonor.4061:

I had a speculation thrown my way:

Guardian (Long Bow) = Guardian/Elementalist – Attunement mechanics mixed with virtues. Virtues change the effect of weapon skills and utilities.

Thoughts?

I definitely think Guards are getting another virtue, probably related to resistance or stun breaker. Other than that, no idea.

Hmm..

Druid = Ranger + Elementalist
Tempest = Elementalist + Thief
Saboteur = Thief + Engineer
Crusader = Guardian + Warrior
Reaper = Necromancer + Guardian
Pioneer = Engineer + Warrior
Legionnaire = Warrior + Necromancer
Chronomancer = Mesmer + Necromancer
Ritualist = Revenant + Ranger

I question what the Revenant will get for their 1st specialization.

With each Profession going to get to use each weapon eventually I’m waiting for the day when they finally release the Rifle Specialization for Revenant.

I just hope the thief will never get to see a silly rifle, so in that case Id be happy if Revenants get them.
Rifles simpyl dont fit to the quick and silent thieves and for all those sniper wannabes, theres already kill shot with the warrior.
No need to have thieves doing a stupid unneccessary copycat here.

ANet should give Guardians Shortbows and Thieves Longbows, so that they get finally their fitting silent 1200 range weapon. Thieves already can use shortbows, so whsat should stop them to use also rogue style longbows like Robin Hood, one of the most well known THIEVES that used a Longbow.

If I speculare right and we will see in the future 5 Elite Specializations per Class, basically 1 per Specialization, then this are the 5 Weapons I want to see only getting added for the Thief

• Longbow = Rogue = Deadly Arts
• Mace or Axe = Saboteur = Trickery
• Whip/Chain Sickle = Infiltrator = Shadow Arts
• Offhand Sword = Seeker = Critical Hits
• Quarterstaff = Brawler = Acrobatics

Druid = Ranger + Elementalist
Tempest = Elementalist + Thief
Shadow = Thief + Mesmer
Crusader = Guardian + Revenant
Medium = Necromancer + Ranger (Shout support minions)
Pioneer = Engineer + Warrior
Warlord = Warrior + Engineer (steampunk warriors from the pact with OH pistol)
Chronomancer = Mesmer + Necromancer
Ritualist = Revenant + Ranger

If thief got Longbow, many ranger will reroll to thief elite spec. Long range and can stealth? Too much OP

Lol, sure teddie… Thief Spec with Longbow will be too op only because of Stealth…
when theres already with a Ranger Rapid Fire from Stealth …

I would wait in your place just, what the Thief Spec with Longbow would work like exactly, before you automatically assume that its OP, only because Thieves have longer lastign Stealths, than Rangers. Cause it changes nothign on the fac,t that the lonbow Thief would get still revealed after their initial attack.

We also have no clues, what kind of weapon skills a longbow thief would get, so just instantly cryoing out Op for the sake of calling somethign instantly OP is just ridiculous.
However, ANet will anyways make a big Balancing Update first, before they add with HoT the Elite Specialization to make appropiate changes to the Game Balance for the Main Professions and their Skills and Specializations.

There is currently in this game nothing more OP, than a Gatling Gun RF Ranger, especialyl when paired up together – 2 of them are easily able to annihilate any target with a simultanous spike within seconds into downed state/death if you have at the moment when it happens no good reflexes, blocks, reflections ready at use to survive that spike or to counter it.
SO I’m pretty sure that no single Ranger player will instantly reroll a thief, when they would get longbows, just because of the better stealth..therefore is rapid Fire simply way too OP currently.

I would understand it, if Rangers would still be a super weak, like they were before ANet buffed them ad adsurdum in regard of Rapid Fire, but as long this class has this OP 1 win button skill that requires of the player no player skills and no thinking, but just pressing only 1 button every like 8 seconds which is WAY TOO QUICK for that skill to recharge with its immensive spike damage it can deal, your assumed case will never happen.
With the OP ness of Rapid Fire, its a skill that if it should stay at this power rate, should belong to Skill Slot 5 with the cool down of Barrage and barrage should rather become longbow skill 2, to make rangers better at more frequent AoE damage support instead of turning them into walking gatling guns /facepalm

Knighthonor.4061:

I had a speculation thrown my way:

Guardian (Long Bow) = Guardian/Elementalist – Attunement mechanics mixed with virtues. Virtues change the effect of weapon skills and utilities.

Thoughts?

I’d say it’s a lot more likely that if there is an attunement type thing given to guardians, it’d be a toggleable F4 ability while old virtues remain the same. Maybe something like Life Attunement? Activate it to increase outgoing healing to allies by a percentage, but decrease your own damage by a percentage. If they really are mixing up different mechanics from professions, it’d fit as well. It’d also fit with the theme behind the leaked longbow skills (ie. a duality between defensive support/healing and offensive support/damage).

Ive always seen caster characters in games described as “Tempests” to be storm mages (Water+Air/Lightning magic), so maybe its a hint that instead of singular elemental attunements, Tempest will wield combination attunements.

So instead of Fire, Water, Air and Earth, we’ll have:
Storm (Water+Air)
Lava (Fire+Earth)
Sand (Earth + Air)
Steam (Fire+Water)

Or any other elemental combinations people can think of. Smoke(Fire+Air), Mud (Water+Earth). Who knows.

Argon.1563:

Ive always seen caster characters in games described as “Tempests” to be storm mages (Water+Air/Lightning magic), so maybe its a hint that instead of singular elemental attunements, Tempest will wield combination attunements.

So instead of Fire, Water, Air and Earth, we’ll have:
Storm (Water+Air)
Lava (Fire+Earth)
Sand (Earth + Air)
Steam (Fire+Water)

Or any other elemental combinations people can think of. Smoke(Fire+Air), Mud (Water+Earth). Who knows.

If one follows the same logic used for the extra mechanics added to chronomancers, it would probably be more safe to assume that another attunement or two would be added, or maybe some sort of active ability that is influenced somehow by attunements (somewhat like the chronomancer’s new F5 skill).

Engineer- Hammer Elite Spec seem like a combo of Engineer/Guardian.
Somebody correct me if I am wrong, but did the Engineer in the video trailer have 3 bots or 4?
Looks like 3 to me. Seem like a sort of like Virtue mechanic to me. Were each is activated to gain a active effect .

I cant seem to figure out the Druid yet.
But I am assuming either Druid is Ranger/Guardian
or Ranger/Ele due to the vine line skill.
6:22 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bfas4k_J-lk

Why are people assuming Tempest is ELementalist + Thief? I wonder the range of Sword for Tempest

Tupi.2967:

Why are people assuming Tempest is ELementalist + Thief? I wonder the range of Sword for Tempest

because the skills leaked and Ele’s elite Spec is melee oriented.

I believe Warriors may be getting a new Off Hand Weapon now.
Why?

I believe it will be off hand Pistol. in the video preview we saw that Warriors is getting a dual burst skill.

I believe the Dual Burst skill will be off hand focused, similar the dual attack of thief class.

Warrior Elite Spec is Warrior/Thief combo imo.

Knighthonor.4061:

Tupi.2967:

Why are people assuming Tempest is ELementalist + Thief? I wonder the range of Sword for Tempest

because the skills leaked and Ele’s elite Spec is melee oriented.

source? I remember someone said that datamined sword had temporarily assigned dagger skills… do you have any other source of sword skills?

This “A+B” speculation is pretty much 100% baseless.

Chronomancer has essentially no relation to Necromancer, despite the wells (which work differently anyway), so assuming other classes will do makes very little sense.

We do “know” some weapons, at least, and that’s the smart point for jumping off from.

Elementalist – Sword – Tempest – I think we can expect melee-range stuff, probably some teleporting. No reason to expect Thief-style abilities. I’d expect more survival-oriented stuff if anything.

Thief – Probably Rifle (given the trailer) – Well, Sniper, obviously. Probably a spec more focused on staying still than the very movement-focused specs Thief already has.

Guardian – Longbow – Probably Paragon – Barely a guess at this point. If they aren’t shouting to help their friends and debuffing enemies with that bow I will be very surprised.

Necromancer – Greatsword – Probably something like the Dervish from GW2, because that worked pretty well and wasn’t a million miles from Necromancer anyway.

Ranger – Staff – Druid – Focuses on buffs/heals, probably still likes rooting enemies etc.

Engineer – Hammer – Hard to guess, actually – we know he’ll have drones, like disposable minion-type followers, but not much beyond that.

Warrior – I’m guessing Pistol – The only other likely one is Short Bow and that’s not very likely. Short-mid range burst and control. Maybe “duelist” or “pirate” themed or the like.

Eurhetemec.9052:

This “A+B” speculation is pretty much 100% baseless.

Chronomancer has essentially no relation to Necromancer, despite the wells (which work differently anyway), so assuming other classes will do makes very little sense.

We do “know” some weapons, at least, and that’s the smart point for jumping off from.

Elementalist – Sword – Tempest – I think we can expect melee-range stuff, probably some teleporting. No reason to expect Thief-style abilities. I’d expect more survival-oriented stuff if anything.

Thief – Probably Rifle (given the trailer) – Well, Sniper, obviously. Probably a spec more focused on staying still than the very movement-focused specs Thief already has.

Guardian – Longbow – Probably Paragon – Barely a guess at this point. If they aren’t shouting to help their friends and debuffing enemies with that bow I will be very surprised.

Necromancer – Greatsword – Probably something like the Dervish from GW2, because that worked pretty well and wasn’t a million miles from Necromancer anyway.

Ranger – Staff – Druid – Focuses on buffs/heals, probably still likes rooting enemies etc.

Engineer – Hammer – Hard to guess, actually – we know he’ll have drones, like disposable minion-type followers, but not much beyond that.

Warrior – I’m guessing Pistol – The only other likely one is Short Bow and that’s not very likely. Short-mid range burst and control. Maybe “duelist” or “pirate” themed or the like.

No from the developers own words its comparable to dual classes.
Also wells are similar to Necromancer because they “Wells”. Of course they have different effects, but they still “Wells” which was necromancer exclusive. Also the Chronomancer have their own spin on Death Shroud with a secondary health bar from their time jumping ability.

When the Guardian Elite Spec is revealed, you will see the same pattern with another class.

Knighthonor.4061:

Something to note:
The Chronomancer’s special weapon was (SHIELD) which neither the Mesmer nor Necromancer can use.. interesting.

So far I have a few hints myself.

*Guardian- getting Bow
*Engineer- getting Hammer
*Elementalist – getting Sword
*Thief – getting Rifle
*Ranger – getting Staff
*Necromancer – getting GreatSword

I think the absence of these weapons from certain armour types had a role to play in choosing the new weapons, especially for a weapon like Hammer that was restricted to Heavy Armour.

And we do know theme/flavour had an impact with Mesmer (confirmed in the article), as well as the Engineer (based on the way the word the teases).

Knighthonor.4061:

No from the developers own words its comparable to dual classes.
Also wells are similar to Necromancer because they “Wells”. Of course they have different effects, but they still “Wells” which was necromancer exclusive. Also the Chronomancer have their own spin on Death Shroud with a secondary health bar from their time jumping ability.

When the Guardian Elite Spec is revealed, you will see the same pattern with another class.

You’re taking the Dual Class comment way too literally. They mean it adds diversity comparable to that, not that it’s literally the same as mixing in another existing class in a straightforward way.

And I’m not seeing any evidence whatsoever that Chronomancer’s bar is a “secondary health bar”. That’s rank speculation on your part, and doesn’t match up with what we’ve been told. If you have something confirming that, please link it.

Wells are just a type of skill, and whilst they did happen to be Necro exclusive, they’re no more of a big deal than giving a class with no Shouts, Shouts.

As for when we see the next class, well, that’s rubbish, frankly. I mean, you will definitely be able to pretend that any Elite spec is “like they added Class X”, but that doesn’t mean it actually is, it just means you’re willing to convince yourself of it.

Seriously, whatever Elite spec that add, doesn’t matter what, you will be able to claim that, because it’s such a vague and meaningless claim.

Eurhetemec.9052:

Chronomancer has essentially no relation to Necromancer, despite the wells (which work differently anyway), so assuming other classes will do makes very little sense.

Continuum shift split/ shift is an improved ripp-off from spectral walk/recall.

A lot of speculation but not much chat regarding the point most of issue to me;

Will Non Elite traitline characters be capable, in the hands of a good player, of matching the elite traitline characters, in a decent percentage of fights.

Tim.6450:

Continuum shift split/ shift is an improved ripp-off from spectral walk/recall.

Thematically, having a rewind skill on a time mage makes more sense than on a necromancer. It’s reminds me of Chronos in Smite.

Eurhetemec.9052:

Knighthonor.4061:

No from the developers own words its comparable to dual classes.
Also wells are similar to Necromancer because they “Wells”. Of course they have different effects, but they still “Wells” which was necromancer exclusive. Also the Chronomancer have their own spin on Death Shroud with a secondary health bar from their time jumping ability.

When the Guardian Elite Spec is revealed, you will see the same pattern with another class.

You’re taking the Dual Class comment way too literally. They mean it adds diversity comparable to that, not that it’s literally the same as mixing in another existing class in a straightforward way.

And I’m not seeing any evidence whatsoever that Chronomancer’s bar is a “secondary health bar”. That’s rank speculation on your part, and doesn’t match up with what we’ve been told. If you have something confirming that, please link it.

Wells are just a type of skill, and whilst they did happen to be Necro exclusive, they’re no more of a big deal than giving a class with no Shouts, Shouts.

As for when we see the next class, well, that’s rubbish, frankly. I mean, you will definitely be able to pretend that any Elite spec is “like they added Class X”, but that doesn’t mean it actually is, it just means you’re willing to convince yourself of it.

Seriously, whatever Elite spec that add, doesn’t matter what, you will be able to claim that, because it’s such a vague and meaningless claim.

I disagree, because they get a secondary health bar from jumping back in time to reset their bar.

Also we will see with the Guardian ES.

CONTINUUM SHIFT IS NOT A FREAKING DEATH SHROUD X_@

I am so sick of seeing that. Yes, it can potentially be a bass-ackwards heal which spikes you back up to high health – but only if you were at high health before you cast CS something like six seconds ago tops. It doesn’t provide an entire set of new skills with their own independent cooldowns, and it’s also a resource-eater that requires the Chronomancer to shatter their existing illusions. If it lasts longer than six seconds (3s base +1s per illusion), I will eat this company monitor in front of me.

You know what happens if a Chronomancer Splits at low health? They go right back to being at low health six seconds later, even if a hundred-man legion of blast-heal-blasting Engineers run up to him and drop five hundred thousand points of health in his pants. Any cooldowns they used before Splitting – and they need to use cooldowns to generate illusions to Slit with, outside Scepter AA – are lengthened by whatever time the Chronomancer spends Split, since their cooldowns are reset as well.

Treating Continuum Split like a second health bar or a Massmorey Death Shroud shows a fundamental lack of understanding, of either DS or CS. Continuum Split has tremendously more potential power than Shroud, at the cost of requiring more resources to use, having a vastly longer cooldown, and also being much more difficult to use well.

Continuum Split is more like an Elite shatter than a Death Shroud analog. it’s meant to be used sparingly, deployed carefully when someone needs to get through a particularly tough fight. Shroud, on the other hand, is a short-cooldown, low-maintenance mode meant to be woven into a Necromancer’s normal fighting style.

People are flipping way too many lids over the whole EHRMAHGEHRD HEHRLTH REHRSEHRT thing. And people are taking the dual-classing comment too literally. The Chronomancer uses Wells because ArenaNet wanted giant clocks on the ground that pulse effects, and using an existing skill classification allows for more potential rune/sigil synergy in the future. The Chronomancer is only superficially an Me/N, and trying to treat it like a particularly fruity Necromancer is going to get Chronomancers killed.

Especially when they realize their’second health bar’ has a two-minute cooldown before Alacrity. That 10s cooldown on Shroud is going to start lookin’ mighty inviting, ne?

DevilLordLaser.8619:

CONTINUUM SHIFT IS NOT A FREAKING DEATH SHROUD X_@

I am so sick of seeing that. Yes, it can potentially be a bass-ackwards heal which spikes you back up to high health – but only if you were at high health before you cast CS something like six seconds ago tops. It doesn’t provide an entire set of new skills with their own independent cooldowns, and it’s also a resource-eater that requires the Chronomancer to shatter their existing illusions. If it lasts longer than six seconds (3s base +1s per illusion), I will eat this company monitor in front of me.

You know what happens if a Chronomancer Splits at low health? They go right back to being at low health six seconds later, even if a hundred-man legion of blast-heal-blasting Engineers run up to him and drop five hundred thousand points of health in his pants. Any cooldowns they used before Splitting – and they need to use cooldowns to generate illusions to Slit with, outside Scepter AA – are lengthened by whatever time the Chronomancer spends Split, since their cooldowns are reset as well.

Treating Continuum Split like a second health bar or a Massmorey Death Shroud shows a fundamental lack of understanding, of either DS or CS. Continuum Split has tremendously more potential power than Shroud, at the cost of requiring more resources to use, having a vastly longer cooldown, and also being much more difficult to use well.

Continuum Split is more like an Elite shatter than a Death Shroud analog. it’s meant to be used sparingly, deployed carefully when someone needs to get through a particularly tough fight. Shroud, on the other hand, is a short-cooldown, low-maintenance mode meant to be woven into a Necromancer’s normal fighting style.

People are flipping way too many lids over the whole EHRMAHGEHRD HEHRLTH REHRSEHRT thing. And people are taking the dual-classing comment too literally. The Chronomancer uses Wells because ArenaNet wanted giant clocks on the ground that pulse effects, and using an existing skill classification allows for more potential rune/sigil synergy in the future. The Chronomancer is only superficially an Me/N, and trying to treat it like a particularly fruity Necromancer is going to get Chronomancers killed.

Especially when they realize their’second health bar’ has a two-minute cooldown before Alacrity. That 10s cooldown on Shroud is going to start lookin’ mighty inviting, ne?

Although we disagree, keep in mind , just because the Chronomancer is Mesmer/Necro combo, its still a Mesmer. So its Necro themed mechanics wont be on par with Necro for obvious reasons.

DevilLordLaser.8619:

And people are taking the dual-classing comment too literally. The Chronomancer uses Wells because ArenaNet wanted giant clocks on the ground that pulse effects, and using an existing skill classification allows for more potential rune/sigil synergy in the future. The Chronomancer is only superficially an Me/N, and trying to treat it like a particularly fruity Necromancer is going to get Chronomancers killed.

Honestly? Give up. We still get people saying every profession is a hybrid of ritualist plus something else even when said profession is nothing like the ritualist at all (with the exception of the engineers, which are exactly what ritualists were, and the reason why we won’t have any kind of ritualist hybrid in GW2). We will have people saying that specializations are an hybrid of two professions even if it becomes (more) obvious that they are nowhere close to being such thing.

Eurhetemec.9052:

Warrior – I’m guessing Pistol – The only other likely one is Short Bow and that’s not very likely. Short-mid range burst and control. Maybe “duelist” or “pirate” themed or the like.

I’m thinking main-hand pistol and traps for a ‘bounty-hunter’ theme. If ANet want to give us a jetpack and Mandalorian helm skin with the spec., I’d totally be cool with that too ;-)

Actually, the druid getting Glyphs that change effects based on the animal companion you have sounds absolutely awesome. Its fitting too.

I’m pretty sure “dual-class” meant that the specialisation will fell like a class of its own, not that it literally combines 2 existing classes into a new one.

DevilLordLaser.8619:

CONTINUUM SHIFT IS NOT A FREAKING DEATH SHROUD X_@

Depends on how you look at it.

You can say it’s a secondary health bar that’s created equal to what your health was when you used Split.

So, you Split with 10,000 health. Your secondary health bar is 10,000. All heals and damage apply to that health bar and are, thus, temporary. When the duration ends, the secondary health bar disappears and you are back to where you started.

The only difference is that, from what we know so far, if you die during that time, you are downed, instead of switching to your primary health bar.

I could be completely wrong, but I am going to run with the idea that each elite spec will also get access to a previously exclusive skill type, much like the Chrono got wells. With that in mind here are some ideas:

Guardian = Banner or Mark skills
Thief = Kit or Gadget skills
Elementalist = Mantra or Clone skills
Warrior = Kit or Survival skills
Ranger = Deception or Stance skills
Engineer = Banner or Clone (hologram) skills
Necromancer = Spirit or Ward skills

DevilLordLaser.8619:

CONTINUUM SHIFT IS NOT A FREAKING DEATH SHROUD X_@

Well no.. it’s significantly better in every way, but it is the improved DS that won’t be used as an excuse to completely screw over the mesmer at every turn (hopefully), and won’t lock them out of their entire class, and won’t take 30+ seconds to charge up.

ZudetGambeous.9573:

DevilLordLaser.8619:

CONTINUUM SHIFT IS NOT A FREAKING DEATH SHROUD X_@

Well no.. it’s significantly better in every way, but it is the improved DS that won’t be used as an excuse to completely screw over the mesmer at every turn (hopefully), and won’t lock them out of their entire class, and won’t take 30+ seconds to charge up.

Uh, no.

Until we know how long it takes to charge, and whether it has a cooldown associated with it, and/or a casting time, and/or whether it activates automatically, you cannot say “it’s significantly better in every way”.

Period.

Eurhetemec.9052:

ZudetGambeous.9573:

DevilLordLaser.8619:

CONTINUUM SHIFT IS NOT A FREAKING DEATH SHROUD X_@

Well no.. it’s significantly better in every way, but it is the improved DS that won’t be used as an excuse to completely screw over the mesmer at every turn (hopefully), and won’t lock them out of their entire class, and won’t take 30+ seconds to charge up.

Uh, no.

Until we know how long it takes to charge, and whether it has a cooldown associated with it, and/or a casting time, and/or whether it activates automatically, you cannot say “it’s significantly better in every way”.

Period.

Yes, you can, cause DS is a glorified downstate you can enter by choice, and a badly executed one at that, plus it is one of the main reason we Necros don’t get any type of good stuff. No stab no perma vigor no block no invlun no stealth no anything to protect us from being 100-0’d at the beginning of any teamfight, because DS doesn’t scale with the amount of enemies present. Now if there was a maximum of how much dmg we could take per second in DS, or we could heal through DS, and have our utilities in DS… maybe you could argue. But that isn’t the case. You have acces to all of those things on a mesmer plus good CC (which Necros also lack), even in Continuum Shift (and then you get them TWICE), aswell as those awesomne traits that recreate your clones and phantasms when you shatter them for CS, so you do not even lose anything. Yes, it goes on a cooldown… But it is avaiable from second one of a match. And there even is a skill that immediatly resets shatters.

And keep in mind, while heals while in CS don’t do anything, the Mesmers new Heal-Well has the bulk of its heal delayed, so you can cast well→ CS → cast elite and a utility or weapon skill → leave CS → get immediatly healed by the delayed major healing of your well (alternatively use the well while in CS to be able to cast it twice).

So, yes, it definitly IS better than DS in basically every situation. Except if you play like someone that is missing 99% of his brain.

Rin.1046:

I could be completely wrong, but I am going to run with the idea that each elite spec will also get access to a previously exclusive skill type, much like the Chrono got wells. With that in mind here are some ideas:

Guardian = Banner or Mark skills
Thief = Kit or Gadget skills
Elementalist = Mantra or Clone skills
Warrior = Kit or Survival skills
Ranger = Deception or Stance skills
Engineer = Banner or Clone (hologram) skills
Necromancer = Spirit or Ward skills

I think you’re more on the mark that this is a way for ArenaNet to give current professions existing skill types that they previously didn’t have access to.

When enough elite specialisations come out, perhaps we will see more rune sets and sigils affecting skill types, such as the set we currently have for Traps.

I don’t like your idea of Elementalists or Engineers with clones. I think some skill types need to remain sacred to their original professions and clones are certainly one of those skill types.

You talk about Necros getting ward skills. Wards, if I recall correctly, are only available on 2 Guardian weapons. It would be nonetheless interesting to see skills which appear on weapons made into utilities for the new elite specialisations. Wards would fit Elementalist much more appropriately than clones would, especially since it’s a skill type they had access to in Guild Wars 1.

Yeah, just given the design choice i think the Rev is going to get Ritualist as a spec with the ability to call up stationary spirits for area denial type stuff. Sorta like turrets for engie’s, but with different affects from CC to support and some kind of consume spirit thing for the elite to make them more in line with the Riti of old. maybe with scepter as the new weapon choice for it.

Rin.1046:

Elementalist = Mantra or Clone skills

You create water field that you can travel to and resurface from it. You create bunch of clones made of earth, fire, water, air. You can swap freely between them. If you gonna get critcal hit you can make water copy of your body and escape from it while tore it apart:) Clonementalist.

Sarie.1630:

I don’t like your idea of Elementalists or Engineers with clones. I think some skill types need to remain sacred to their original professions and clones are certainly one of those skill types.

You talk about Necros getting ward skills. Wards, if I recall correctly, are only available on 2 Guardian weapons. It would be nonetheless interesting to see skills which appear on weapons made into utilities for the new elite specialisations. Wards would fit Elementalist much more appropriately than clones would, especially since it’s a skill type they had access to in Guild Wars 1.

With regards to clones, while it may seem like a sacred skill type, you have to remember that the Mesmer can still make more use of them by shattering them, plus all the traits that effect them. Much like thief makes better use of stealth than other professions due to stealth skills and traits. Many traits will only effect skill types in a couple of ways, but some skill types, such as clones and stealth, which are a specialization of that profession, will have more traits linked to them. While mesmer and ranger can make excellent use of stealth skills, no profession is as good or effective with stealth as the thief. And if other professions gained clones, or even phantasms, due to all the traits and shatters the mesmer has access to, other professions will never be as effective with clones as the mesmer can be.

However, it is a valid point, and I also agree that Ele may not quite suit clones. I could not think what else would fit Ele and tbh I had forgotten about the wards in GW1, so that may indeed be a better choice. I still think engi having hologram type clones would be pretty cool though . As to Necro getting wards I was thinking it could offer more area denial and control options to them, which I think would work really well with their wells and marks.

The list was just a quick thing I threw together, without any in-depth thought put into it. I was merely toying with the idea of exclusive skill types being given to other professions. If I’m right and that is the case, I look forward to seeing what Anet has given each profession.

Sarie.1630:

I don’t like your idea of Elementalists or Engineers with clones. I think some skill types need to remain sacred to their original professions and clones are certainly one of those skill types.

I don’t see how clones are more sacred that Wells, Gadgets, Mantras, Kits, etc.

Any skill type that was exclusive to a single class is as sacred as the other.

RabbitUp.8294:

Sarie.1630:

I don’t like your idea of Elementalists or Engineers with clones. I think some skill types need to remain sacred to their original professions and clones are certainly one of those skill types.

I don’t see how clones are more sacred that Wells, Gadgets, Mantras, Kits, etc.

Any skill type that was exclusive to a single class is as sacred as the other.

Well.. depends. I’d say “Minions” (and maybe Spectrals) is/are what was sacred about Necros, not Wells. And it’s not like Chrono-Wells are even remotely close to Necro-Wells, except for the fact they are ground targeted AoE’s that pulse their effects, and even then there are differences like the Memser-Wells getting a bonus effect on the last tick. If ele would get clones, they’d be elemental clones, not illusions, and even then phantasms would stay Mesmer Only, aswell as the shatters.

Just because they name something “clone” or “well” doesn’t mean it takes away a unique aspect of another class, it is just named that way to have syngery with existing sigills etc.

I mean, Corrosive Poison Cloud is basically a “bad” well. Things like the Eles fountain that pulses regen and heal could be considered a “well” aswell.

In other words, just because an ele could possibly create a waterclone when hit doesn’t mean that he can create a clone and leap back/forward, or create one that charges while he stays in place to confuzzle the enemy.

I think the warrior will be a RAIDER of sorts and get the torch weapon.

Chokolata.1870:

I think the warrior will be a RAIDER of sorts and get the torch weapon.

I would like to see kind of adventurer’ aptitudes like exposing around the corner to throw something/shot/observe will remain still hide behind the wall, or ability to search for traps or dodge without changing just through changing position of parts above belt.

Shiki.7148:

Well.. depends. I’d say “Minions” (and maybe Spectrals) is/are what was sacred about Necros, not Wells. And it’s not like Chrono-Wells are even remotely close to Necro-Wells, except for the fact they are ground targeted AoE’s that pulse their effects, and even then there are differences like the Memser-Wells getting a bonus effect on the last tick. If ele would get clones, they’d be elemental clones, not illusions, and even then phantasms would stay Mesmer Only, aswell as the shatters.

Just because they name something “clone” or “well” doesn’t mean it takes away a unique aspect of another class, it is just named that way to have syngery with existing sigills etc.

I mean, Corrosive Poison Cloud is basically a “bad” well. Things like the Eles fountain that pulses regen and heal could be considered a “well” aswell.

In other words, just because an ele could possibly create a waterclone when hit doesn’t mean that he can create a clone and leap back/forward, or create one that charges while he stays in place to confuzzle the enemy.

I don’t think mechanics are sacred to any particular class. The only thing that retains some exclusivity is the flavour behind the skill.

Like you said, Chrono Wells look, feel and play different than the Necro ones. Similarly, illusory Mesmer clones can look, feel and play different than a holographic projection an Engineer might utilize (I don’t think the concept of elemental clones make much sense, and it’s too similar to Glyph of Elementals/Lesser Elementals). The hologram could be immobile and use the new taunt mechanic, for example. And/or utilize a mine.

RabbitUp.8294:

And/or utilize a mine.

Yes engi have in common to mine everything to ka-boom start from bodies of dead enemies and end to their own it would be nice to see that holograms, but again there maybe a voice like : similar to ghost gw1, turrets. It is hard to came up with something that wouldn’t be similar to something else, but still I would like to see^

RabbitUp.8294:

I don’t think mechanics are sacred to any particular class. The only thing that retains some exclusivity is the flavour behind the skill.

Like you said, Chrono Wells look, feel and play different than the Necro ones. Similarly, illusory Mesmer clones can look, feel and play different than a holographic projection an Engineer might utilize (I don’t think the concept of elemental clones make much sense, and it’s too similar to Glyph of Elementals/Lesser Elementals). The hologram could be immobile and use the new taunt mechanic, for example. And/or utilize a mine.

I agree that skill types are not necessarily sacrid to one profession, however I think profession mechanics should remain sacrid. So while I have no objection to other professions getting clones, I do not think anyone but Mesmer should be able to shatter them. That said, they need to be careful not to take away that unique feeling each profession should have, and I think that might be what Shiki and Sarie are concerned about.

The Mesmer is kind of what it is because of their clones. If you gave clones to another profession you run the risk of making the Mesmer less appealing and less unique feeling. However, if it was done right I see no issue with clones ‘done differently’ being added to other profs. For example the Engi holograms may be classified as clones but behave very differently.

Btw, I really like the idea of a taunting mine hidden by a hologram .

Shiki.7148:

Eurhetemec.9052:

ZudetGambeous.9573:

DevilLordLaser.8619:

CONTINUUM SHIFT IS NOT A FREAKING DEATH SHROUD X_@

Well no.. it’s significantly better in every way, but it is the improved DS that won’t be used as an excuse to completely screw over the mesmer at every turn (hopefully), and won’t lock them out of their entire class, and won’t take 30+ seconds to charge up.

Uh, no.

Until we know how long it takes to charge, and whether it has a cooldown associated with it, and/or a casting time, and/or whether it activates automatically, you cannot say “it’s significantly better in every way”.

Period.

Yes, you can, cause DS is a glorified downstate you can enter by choice, and a badly executed one at that, plus it is one of the main reason we Necros don’t get any type of good stuff. No stab no perma vigor no block no invlun no stealth no anything to protect us from being 100-0’d at the beginning of any teamfight, because DS doesn’t scale with the amount of enemies present. Now if there was a maximum of how much dmg we could take per second in DS, or we could heal through DS, and have our utilities in DS… maybe you could argue. But that isn’t the case. You have acces to all of those things on a mesmer plus good CC (which Necros also lack), even in Continuum Shift (and then you get them TWICE), aswell as those awesomne traits that recreate your clones and phantasms when you shatter them for CS, so you do not even lose anything. Yes, it goes on a cooldown… But it is avaiable from second one of a match. And there even is a skill that immediatly resets shatters.

And keep in mind, while heals while in CS don’t do anything, the Mesmers new Heal-Well has the bulk of its heal delayed, so you can cast well-> CS -> cast elite and a utility or weapon skill -> leave CS -> get immediatly healed by the delayed major healing of your well (alternatively use the well while in CS to be able to cast it twice).

So, yes, it definitly IS better than DS in basically every situation. Except if you play like someone that is missing 99% of his brain.

Nope. You still don’t know the charge rate etc. so that’s all rubbish.

Eurhetemec.9052:

Shiki.7148:

Eurhetemec.9052:

ZudetGambeous.9573:

DevilLordLaser.8619:

CONTINUUM SHIFT IS NOT A FREAKING DEATH SHROUD X_@

Well no.. it’s significantly better in every way, but it is the improved DS that won’t be used as an excuse to completely screw over the mesmer at every turn (hopefully), and won’t lock them out of their entire class, and won’t take 30+ seconds to charge up.

Uh, no.

Until we know how long it takes to charge, and whether it has a cooldown associated with it, and/or a casting time, and/or whether it activates automatically, you cannot say “it’s significantly better in every way”.

Period.

Yes, you can, cause DS is a glorified downstate you can enter by choice, and a badly executed one at that, plus it is one of the main reason we Necros don’t get any type of good stuff. No stab no perma vigor no block no invlun no stealth no anything to protect us from being 100-0’d at the beginning of any teamfight, because DS doesn’t scale with the amount of enemies present. Now if there was a maximum of how much dmg we could take per second in DS, or we could heal through DS, and have our utilities in DS… maybe you could argue. But that isn’t the case. You have acces to all of those things on a mesmer plus good CC (which Necros also lack), even in Continuum Shift (and then you get them TWICE), aswell as those awesomne traits that recreate your clones and phantasms when you shatter them for CS, so you do not even lose anything. Yes, it goes on a cooldown… But it is avaiable from second one of a match. And there even is a skill that immediatly resets shatters.

And keep in mind, while heals while in CS don’t do anything, the Mesmers new Heal-Well has the bulk of its heal delayed, so you can cast well-> CS -> cast elite and a utility or weapon skill -> leave CS -> get immediatly healed by the delayed major healing of your well (alternatively use the well while in CS to be able to cast it twice).

So, yes, it definitly IS better than DS in basically every situation. Except if you play like someone that is missing 99% of his brain.

Nope. You still don’t know the charge rate etc. so that’s all rubbish.

Charge Rate? Do you mean cooldown? Cause that was 60 seconds, but will increased according to A-net. So yes, I actually DO know. Also i do know the cooldown on the “reset all shatters” skill, so there is that. If you mean the amount of phantasms/clones to shatter for x seconds, you can tell from the POI that 2 of them are enough for most shenanigans you wanna pull off, and thanks to the traits you even get a replacement for them. So again, I actually DO know. Your move.

Shiki.7148:

So, yes, it definitly IS better than DS in basically every situation. Except if you play like someone that is missing 99% of his brain.

I do not wish to derail this thread into a Necro vs Chrono discussion, but I thought I would just add to this. While CS is indeed powerful it does have its own downsides. Firstly, it appears to have a long cooldown (though this is still in flux) and requires illusions to trigger. I know illusions are easy to generate so that part is not a major downside. Secondly, while in CS you leave behind an attackable object where you cast it, that ends the split prematurely if destroyed. This makes CS a double edged sword. Use at the wrong time or in the wrong place and it could work against you. It will require skill to use effectively.

I don’t think CS or DS is better than the other. Each has its strengths and weaknesses. When traited DS can be very useful, and even when not traited it can still be used to good effect. You can trait to fill life force more quickly to increase uptime, deal more damage while in DS, heal while in DS, remove a condition entering DS, and many more. We will no doubt be able to trait to improve CS, but we don’t yet know to what extent and it may not be to the same extent as DS. With regards to the base DS, I personally do not think it is any stronger or weaker than CS, it is just different.