Did you present this as false because you know for a fact that all (I’ll even take most) raiding groups in GW2 will group with raid noobs? Or is this just your opinion based on your limited experience?
Sure, there are engineered parties of 10 people that only raid with each other, but yes, there are raid groups that aren’t like that. In fact it had to be because every person that raids was a noob at some point. That’s not based on data, that’s just a logical conclusion.
Yes, every GW2 raider once had never played a GW2 raid. However it is my opinion that most raid groups are formed of guildies. I believe that its very rare for a PUG to become a regular raiding group. And since a raid group is normally a “full” group, why would they leave out one member in favor of a non-raider? And how would a non-raider find such a group willing to replace one of their regular members with a new raider?
Most .. but not all. That’s an important distinction here. I see Razor gave an exceptional reply to your questions. Frankly, you’re just one of the people that have convinced themselves it’s not possible, just because they don’t want to believe it can be done or don’t want to do it. Either way, that’s wrong.
So I’ve noticed that once people reach the max mastery level in magumma track maps, they’re xp goes towards earning spirit shards… I do not want to do raids and I have levelled all of the other mastery tracks up but all of my XP goes to waste because I haven’t started the raid mastery track.
Would we be able to get spirit shards for levelling just like the fully levelled raiders please? I hate seeing XP go to waste.
Spirit shards drop from pretty much every loot box and tomes in reward tracks. I dont even know what to do with them, drowning in thousands upon thousands of shards. I havent even done a single raid
Spirit shards drop from pretty much every loot box and tomes in reward tracks. I dont even know what to do with them, drowning in thousands upon thousands of shards. I havent even done a single raid
It’s still something to work towards though and the XP isn’t being wasted. Maybe the reward should be changed to something else? But that’s a different discussion entirely.
I got told it’s working as intended.. so I went ahead and killed Vale Guardian. Took ages to find a group but at least it went pretty smooth. I do wish locked mastery tracks would not count towards ‘you aren’t at maximum so no exp for you’.
Spirit shards drop from pretty much every loot box and tomes in reward tracks. I dont even know what to do with them, drowning in thousands upon thousands of shards. I havent even done a single raid
It’s still something to work towards though and the XP isn’t being wasted. Maybe the reward should be changed to something else? But that’s a different discussion entirely.
It’s only being wasted by a player choice. Sorry, not much sympathy. Everyone in this game is capable of raiding.
I’m 100+ LI raider, not getting shard, missing mastery because i hate things like adventure on open world. So yeah its way worse for raiders then for you, you just need to kill VG or do scort one time in your life and you are done. I need to do a lot of open world things to get it.
Spirit shards drop from pretty much every loot box and tomes in reward tracks. I dont even know what to do with them, drowning in thousands upon thousands of shards. I havent even done a single raid
It’s still something to work towards though and the XP isn’t being wasted. Maybe the reward should be changed to something else? But that’s a different discussion entirely.
It’s only being wasted by a player choice. Sorry, not much sympathy. Everyone in this game is capable of raiding.
But not everyone wants to.
This is a situation where “player choice” doesn’t seem like quite the right term. Anyway, this has already been talked to death in other threads and isn’t likely to change, so I would suggest to the OP to find a raid tutorial group or some friendly guildies and just get it over with, as I’m also trying to do. Good luck.
It’s only being wasted by a player choice. Sorry, not much sympathy. Everyone in this game is capable of raiding.
Are you saying that, since doing raids is just a choice, there shouldn’t be any prestige (and special, unique rewards like, say, Legendary armor) attached to them? Because somehow i really doubt that’s what you intended.
Actions, not words.
Remember, remember, 15th of November
It’s only being wasted by a player choice. Sorry, not much sympathy. Everyone in this game is capable of raiding.
Are you saying that, since doing raids is just a choice, there shouldn’t be any prestige (and special, unique rewards like, say, Legendary armor) attached to them? Because somehow i really doubt that’s what you intended.
Nope, what im saying is if you want something…instead of complaining you’re being restricted from it (by choice) then you clearly don’t want the something bad enough.
It’s worth the hassle of doing one raid encounter to continue getting spirit shards.
On gw2efficiency I see that a realistic conversion from SSs to gold comes from promoting bronze ingots to iron ingots. This is easy to do and it nets about 1.69 gold per SS. I don’t see if that includes TP fees but if it does you could consider promoting to deldrimor ingots.
It’s only being wasted by a player choice. Sorry, not much sympathy. Everyone in this game is capable of raiding.
Are you saying that, since doing raids is just a choice, there shouldn’t be any prestige (and special, unique rewards like, say, Legendary armor) attached to them? Because somehow i really doubt that’s what you intended.
Nope, what im saying is if you want something…instead of complaining you’re being restricted from it (by choice) then you clearly don’t want the something bad enough.
And sometimes it’s worth pointing out if something is unreasonably restricted. Players have made reasonable (and yes, unreasonable) requests for change since the game started and anet have adapted the game where appropriate. In this case, the raiding requirement is unreasonable, and after reading some of your other posts it seems like you would agree.
You’re always making the argument that raids are hard, challenging content with prestigious rewards and have an intended target audience; i.e. not the entire player base. If that’s the case, how can you argue that everyone can and should do it? Where’s the challenge and prestige if every man and his dog is a raider?
I think this deserves some attention from Anet as there is enough that those of us who don’t raid miss out on…
People have been complaining about this for months. It is clear from this and other gated content that Anet wants to force players to do content whether they want to or not – or you simply can’t gain whatever is gated.
When I become sick of seeing XP rewards that I’m not really getting, I’ll just quit the game.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
It’s only being wasted by a player choice. Sorry, not much sympathy. Everyone in this game is capable of raiding.
Are you saying that, since doing raids is just a choice, there shouldn’t be any prestige (and special, unique rewards like, say, Legendary armor) attached to them? Because somehow i really doubt that’s what you intended.
Nope, what im saying is if you want something…instead of complaining you’re being restricted from it (by choice) then you clearly don’t want the something bad enough.
This is a game that I play for entertainment, not to “hold my nose” and get through it. I have enough things I’m forced to do IRL without dealing with it in my fun time.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
It’s only being wasted by a player choice. Sorry, not much sympathy. Everyone in this game is capable of raiding.
Are you saying that, since doing raids is just a choice, there shouldn’t be any prestige (and special, unique rewards like, say, Legendary armor) attached to them? Because somehow i really doubt that’s what you intended.
Nope, what im saying is if you want something…instead of complaining you’re being restricted from it (by choice) then you clearly don’t want the something bad enough.
This is a game that I play for entertainment, not to “hold my nose” and get through it. I have enough things I’m forced to do IRL without dealing with it in my fun time.
Again, disingenuous … you aren’t ‘forced’ to do this content, even if you want shards.
It’s only being wasted by a player choice. Sorry, not much sympathy. Everyone in this game is capable of raiding.
Are you saying that, since doing raids is just a choice, there shouldn’t be any prestige (and special, unique rewards like, say, Legendary armor) attached to them? Because somehow i really doubt that’s what you intended.
Nope, what im saying is if you want something…instead of complaining you’re being restricted from it (by choice) then you clearly don’t want the something bad enough.
And sometimes it’s worth pointing out if something is unreasonably restricted. Players have made reasonable (and yes, unreasonable) requests for change since the game started and anet have adapted the game where appropriate. In this case, the raiding requirement is unreasonable, and after reading some of your other posts it seems like you would agree.
You’re always making the argument that raids are hard, challenging content with prestigious rewards and have an intended target audience; i.e. not the entire player base. If that’s the case, how can you argue that everyone can and should do it? Where’s the challenge and prestige if every man and his dog is a raider?
That’s just it, raiding is hard and challenging and yet Anet has done a great job at having multiple degrees of difficulty encased within them. This means that literally everyone who plays this game is capable of raiding should they actually put forward the bare minimum asked of them by the game. Unfortunately people still want to do less than that and be rewarded (see SW, AB, Daily Log-in). It’s a pretty poor showing that people would rather not play the content than actually do it and be rewarded aptly for their time.
It’s only being wasted by a player choice. Sorry, not much sympathy. Everyone in this game is capable of raiding.
Are you saying that, since doing raids is just a choice, there shouldn’t be any prestige (and special, unique rewards like, say, Legendary armor) attached to them? Because somehow i really doubt that’s what you intended.
Nope, what im saying is if you want something…instead of complaining you’re being restricted from it (by choice) then you clearly don’t want the something bad enough.
And sometimes it’s worth pointing out if something is unreasonably restricted. Players have made reasonable (and yes, unreasonable) requests for change since the game started and anet have adapted the game where appropriate. In this case, the raiding requirement is unreasonable, and after reading some of your other posts it seems like you would agree.
You’re always making the argument that raids are hard, challenging content with prestigious rewards and have an intended target audience; i.e. not the entire player base. If that’s the case, how can you argue that everyone can and should do it? Where’s the challenge and prestige if every man and his dog is a raider?
That’s just it, raiding is hard and challenging and yet Anet has done a great job at having multiple degrees of difficulty encased within them. This means that literally everyone who plays this game is capable of raiding should they actually put forward the bare minimum asked of them by the game. Unfortunately people still want to do less than that and be rewarded (see SW, AB, Daily Log-in). It’s a pretty poor showing that people would rather not play the content than actually do it and be rewarded aptly for their time.
A minor level-up reward is not an apt reward for raiding. It ought to be what it was before Hero Points, shards and the mastery system were invented, a minor use for the XP that the game throws around as part of the reward for playing any aspect of the game. Raiding already provides rewards that ought to be sufficient for what it entails. If raiding requires a Spirit Shard for XP reward to entice players to engage with it, then raiding is in serious trouble.
Honestly, the real issue isn’t raiding. Raiding only applies in HoT zones. Shards are gated in core, also, just not behind raids. The real issue is removing an XP reward that used to be generally available and then restoring it, but only for the completionist. Sending the message that XP is worthless unless you do a laundry list of tasks is not, imo, a good message for the health of the game.
It’s only being wasted by a player choice. Sorry, not much sympathy. Everyone in this game is capable of raiding.
Are you saying that, since doing raids is just a choice, there shouldn’t be any prestige (and special, unique rewards like, say, Legendary armor) attached to them? Because somehow i really doubt that’s what you intended.
Nope, what im saying is if you want something…instead of complaining you’re being restricted from it (by choice) then you clearly don’t want the something bad enough.
And sometimes it’s worth pointing out if something is unreasonably restricted. Players have made reasonable (and yes, unreasonable) requests for change since the game started and anet have adapted the game where appropriate. In this case, the raiding requirement is unreasonable, and after reading some of your other posts it seems like you would agree.
You’re always making the argument that raids are hard, challenging content with prestigious rewards and have an intended target audience; i.e. not the entire player base. If that’s the case, how can you argue that everyone can and should do it? Where’s the challenge and prestige if every man and his dog is a raider?
That’s just it, raiding is hard and challenging and yet Anet has done a great job at having multiple degrees of difficulty encased within them. This means that literally everyone who plays this game is capable of raiding should they actually put forward the bare minimum asked of them by the game. Unfortunately people still want to do less than that and be rewarded (see SW, AB, Daily Log-in). It’s a pretty poor showing that people would rather not play the content than actually do it and be rewarded aptly for their time.
A minor level-up reward is not an apt reward for raiding. It ought to be what it was before Hero Points, shards and the mastery system were invented, a minor use for the XP that the game throws around as part of the reward for playing any aspect of the game. Raiding already provides rewards that ought to be sufficient for what it entails. If raiding requires a Spirit Shard for XP reward to entice players to engage with it, then raiding is in serious trouble.
Honestly, the real issue isn’t raiding. Raiding only applies in HoT zones. Shards are gated in core, also, just not behind raids. The real issue is removing an XP reward that used to be generally available and then restoring it, but only for the completionist. Sending the message that XP is worthless unless you do a laundry list of tasks is not, imo, a good message for the health of the game.
Normally i’d agree with this, if it wasn’t for the fact that literally everything tosses out spirit shards now. Almost every bag has a shard, dalies have them etc…. Shards have become inflated currency almost in a worse state than gold was pre-hot.
I’d also like to point out that you can still get shards from doing task you want to do, just play core tyria stuff you enjoy and get more shards. Or just don’t give a flying penguin about “XP” as its useless to begin with outside of masteries.
It’s a fair point, I don’t see why if the only mysteries you have left are blocked by content you have yet to complete, then your bar should fill infintitely to gain spirit shards.
I think the people against this just want to feel like a special snowflake. There is no reason for that.
“He shall make whole that which was torn asunder.
Restore that which was lost. And all shall be as one.”
A minor level-up reward is not an apt reward for raiding. It ought to be what it was before Hero Points, shards and the mastery system were invented, a minor use for the XP that the game throws around as part of the reward for playing any aspect of the game. Raiding already provides rewards that ought to be sufficient for what it entails. If raiding requires a Spirit Shard for XP reward to entice players to engage with it, then raiding is in serious trouble.
Honestly, the real issue isn’t raiding. Raiding only applies in HoT zones. Shards are gated in core, also, just not behind raids. The real issue is removing an XP reward that used to be generally available and then restoring it, but only for the completionist. Sending the message that XP is worthless unless you do a laundry list of tasks is not, imo, a good message for the health of the game.
Normally i’d agree with this, if it wasn’t for the fact that literally everything tosses out spirit shards now. Almost every bag has a shard, dalies have them etc…. Shards have become inflated currency almost in a worse state than gold was pre-hot.
I’d also like to point out that you can still get shards from doing task you want to do, just play core tyria stuff you enjoy and get more shards. Or just don’t give a flying penguin about “XP” as its useless to begin with outside of masteries.
XP is the base method of character progression for every RPG I can think of. Whether or not you “need” XP or “need” shards, if you aren’t getting them then that has a very negative connotation. It is very unsatisfying to see an XP reward flash on my screen for a mob I just killed but to know that I didn’t actually get that XP reward. And I will never get that XP reward – its not going into any bank or whatever. Since all my Mastery bars are full but I have no MP to spend, it is simply wasted.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
A minor level-up reward is not an apt reward for raiding. It ought to be what it was before Hero Points, shards and the mastery system were invented, a minor use for the XP that the game throws around as part of the reward for playing any aspect of the game. Raiding already provides rewards that ought to be sufficient for what it entails. If raiding requires a Spirit Shard for XP reward to entice players to engage with it, then raiding is in serious trouble.
Honestly, the real issue isn’t raiding. Raiding only applies in HoT zones. Shards are gated in core, also, just not behind raids. The real issue is removing an XP reward that used to be generally available and then restoring it, but only for the completionist. Sending the message that XP is worthless unless you do a laundry list of tasks is not, imo, a good message for the health of the game.
Normally i’d agree with this, if it wasn’t for the fact that literally everything tosses out spirit shards now. Almost every bag has a shard, dalies have them etc…. Shards have become inflated currency almost in a worse state than gold was pre-hot.
I’d also like to point out that you can still get shards from doing task you want to do, just play core tyria stuff you enjoy and get more shards. Or just don’t give a flying penguin about “XP” as its useless to begin with outside of masteries.
XP is the base method of character progression for every RPG I can think of. Whether or not you “need” XP or “need” shards, if you aren’t getting them then that has a very negative connotation. It is very unsatisfying to see an XP reward flash on my screen for a mob I just killed but to know that I didn’t actually get that XP reward. And I will never get that XP reward – its not going into any bank or whatever. Since all my Mastery bars are full but I have no MP to spend, it is simply wasted.
And in most RPG’s there is a level cap where that progression stops. Character progression has never been infinite although there may be some games that are an exception but I can’t think of any.
A minor level-up reward is not an apt reward for raiding. It ought to be what it was before Hero Points, shards and the mastery system were invented, a minor use for the XP that the game throws around as part of the reward for playing any aspect of the game. Raiding already provides rewards that ought to be sufficient for what it entails. If raiding requires a Spirit Shard for XP reward to entice players to engage with it, then raiding is in serious trouble.
Honestly, the real issue isn’t raiding. Raiding only applies in HoT zones. Shards are gated in core, also, just not behind raids. The real issue is removing an XP reward that used to be generally available and then restoring it, but only for the completionist. Sending the message that XP is worthless unless you do a laundry list of tasks is not, imo, a good message for the health of the game.
Normally i’d agree with this, if it wasn’t for the fact that literally everything tosses out spirit shards now. Almost every bag has a shard, dalies have them etc…. Shards have become inflated currency almost in a worse state than gold was pre-hot.
I’d also like to point out that you can still get shards from doing task you want to do, just play core tyria stuff you enjoy and get more shards. Or just don’t give a flying penguin about “XP” as its useless to begin with outside of masteries.
XP is the base method of character progression for every RPG I can think of. Whether or not you “need” XP or “need” shards, if you aren’t getting them then that has a very negative connotation. It is very unsatisfying to see an XP reward flash on my screen for a mob I just killed but to know that I didn’t actually get that XP reward. And I will never get that XP reward – its not going into any bank or whatever. Since all my Mastery bars are full but I have no MP to spend, it is simply wasted.
And in most RPG’s there is a level cap where that progression stops. Character progression has never been infinite although there may be some games that are an exception but I can’t think of any.
Yes, when your character reaches the cap at which NO CHARACTER gains more XP. My character hasn’t reached that cap.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
A minor level-up reward is not an apt reward for raiding. It ought to be what it was before Hero Points, shards and the mastery system were invented, a minor use for the XP that the game throws around as part of the reward for playing any aspect of the game. Raiding already provides rewards that ought to be sufficient for what it entails. If raiding requires a Spirit Shard for XP reward to entice players to engage with it, then raiding is in serious trouble.
Honestly, the real issue isn’t raiding. Raiding only applies in HoT zones. Shards are gated in core, also, just not behind raids. The real issue is removing an XP reward that used to be generally available and then restoring it, but only for the completionist. Sending the message that XP is worthless unless you do a laundry list of tasks is not, imo, a good message for the health of the game.
Normally i’d agree with this, if it wasn’t for the fact that literally everything tosses out spirit shards now. Almost every bag has a shard, dalies have them etc…. Shards have become inflated currency almost in a worse state than gold was pre-hot.
I’d also like to point out that you can still get shards from doing task you want to do, just play core tyria stuff you enjoy and get more shards. Or just don’t give a flying penguin about “XP” as its useless to begin with outside of masteries.
XP is the base method of character progression for every RPG I can think of. Whether or not you “need” XP or “need” shards, if you aren’t getting them then that has a very negative connotation. It is very unsatisfying to see an XP reward flash on my screen for a mob I just killed but to know that I didn’t actually get that XP reward. And I will never get that XP reward – its not going into any bank or whatever. Since all my Mastery bars are full but I have no MP to spend, it is simply wasted.
And in most RPG’s there is a level cap where that progression stops. Character progression has never been infinite although there may be some games that are an exception but I can’t think of any.
Yes, when your character reaches the cap at which NO CHARACTER gains more XP. My character hasn’t reached that cap.
You’re not level 80? Or not maxed your masteries? Mystic Forge currency being awarded upon earning a levels worth of XP isn’t progression; it’s rewards.
We can always make the request to Anet that players do not earn XP if it cannot by applied to leveling a character, advancing masteries, and/or earning spirit shard reward once all masteries are maxed. This way you won’t have wasted the XP.
Normally i’d agree with this, if it wasn’t for the fact that literally everything tosses out spirit shards now. Almost every bag has a shard, dalies have them etc…. Shards have become inflated currency almost in a worse state than gold was pre-hot.
I’d also like to point out that you can still get shards from doing task you want to do, just play core tyria stuff you enjoy and get more shards. Or just don’t give a flying penguin about “XP” as its useless to begin with outside of masteries.
For me (at least), the issue is not shards, it’s the change from a system where post-80 XP gave something to one in which it gives something only if. It’s not the first time ANet has changed things up to the detriment of some players’ play experience. “Wasted post-80 XP” may not be a huge deal, but it was enough of a deal that shards for level tick was programmed back in. Why only for some?
And in most RPG’s there is a level cap where that progression stops. Character progression has never been infinite although there may be some games that are an exception but I can’t think of any.
I can think of 2. Guild Wars, and Guild Wars 2 before the L80 tick changes that preceded the Mastery system.
A minor level-up reward is not an apt reward for raiding. It ought to be what it was before Hero Points, shards and the mastery system were invented, a minor use for the XP that the game throws around as part of the reward for playing any aspect of the game. Raiding already provides rewards that ought to be sufficient for what it entails. If raiding requires a Spirit Shard for XP reward to entice players to engage with it, then raiding is in serious trouble.
Honestly, the real issue isn’t raiding. Raiding only applies in HoT zones. Shards are gated in core, also, just not behind raids. The real issue is removing an XP reward that used to be generally available and then restoring it, but only for the completionist. Sending the message that XP is worthless unless you do a laundry list of tasks is not, imo, a good message for the health of the game.
Normally i’d agree with this, if it wasn’t for the fact that literally everything tosses out spirit shards now. Almost every bag has a shard, dalies have them etc…. Shards have become inflated currency almost in a worse state than gold was pre-hot.
I’d also like to point out that you can still get shards from doing task you want to do, just play core tyria stuff you enjoy and get more shards. Or just don’t give a flying penguin about “XP” as its useless to begin with outside of masteries.
XP is the base method of character progression for every RPG I can think of. Whether or not you “need” XP or “need” shards, if you aren’t getting them then that has a very negative connotation. It is very unsatisfying to see an XP reward flash on my screen for a mob I just killed but to know that I didn’t actually get that XP reward. And I will never get that XP reward – its not going into any bank or whatever. Since all my Mastery bars are full but I have no MP to spend, it is simply wasted.
And in most RPG’s there is a level cap where that progression stops. Character progression has never been infinite although there may be some games that are an exception but I can’t think of any.
Yes, when your character reaches the cap at which NO CHARACTER gains more XP. My character hasn’t reached that cap.
You’re not level 80? Or not maxed your masteries? Mystic Forge currency being awarded upon earning a levels worth of XP isn’t progression; it’s rewards.
We can always make the request to Anet that players do not earn XP if it cannot by applied to leveling a character, advancing masteries, and/or earning spirit shard reward once all masteries are maxed. This way you won’t have wasted the XP.
It is not reaching level 80 that stops XP gain, it is capping Masteries. My character has not capped Masteries and yet has stopped gaining XP.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
I think that in the end, Anet don’t consider that enough of a problem to be worth investing time to change it. Because they could remove the need to kill a raid boss to unlock the Forsaken Thicket mastery, that would be the easiest way to do that. But then people that raid, but don’t want to hunt down mastery point in either Magguma or Tyria will continue to complain about it.
Anet might just want to touch that, because a portion of the player base will always complain when they don’t like a portion of the content, but they need to do it for some type of reward.
Normally i’d agree with this, if it wasn’t for the fact that literally everything tosses out spirit shards now. Almost every bag has a shard, dalies have them etc…. Shards have become inflated currency almost in a worse state than gold was pre-hot.
I’d also like to point out that you can still get shards from doing task you want to do, just play core tyria stuff you enjoy and get more shards. Or just don’t give a flying penguin about “XP” as its useless to begin with outside of masteries.
For me (at least), the issue is not shards, it’s the change from a system where post-80 XP gave something to one in which it gives something only if. It’s not the first time ANet has changed things up to the detriment of some players’ play experience. “Wasted post-80 XP” may not be a huge deal, but it was enough of a deal that shards for level tick was programmed back in. Why only for some?
And in most RPG’s there is a level cap where that progression stops. Character progression has never been infinite although there may be some games that are an exception but I can’t think of any.
I can think of 2. Guild Wars, and Guild Wars 2 before the L80 tick changes that preceded the Mastery system.
In GW1 you could indirectly consider the skill points as progression as you could use them to acquire skills. This only lasts until you have them all though so it’s not infinite.
In GW2, spirit shards are a currency so earning them by repeatedly getting a level’s worth of experience doesn’t progress your character. They are not used for anything that progresses your character either.
A minor level-up reward is not an apt reward for raiding. It ought to be what it was before Hero Points, shards and the mastery system were invented, a minor use for the XP that the game throws around as part of the reward for playing any aspect of the game. Raiding already provides rewards that ought to be sufficient for what it entails. If raiding requires a Spirit Shard for XP reward to entice players to engage with it, then raiding is in serious trouble.
Honestly, the real issue isn’t raiding. Raiding only applies in HoT zones. Shards are gated in core, also, just not behind raids. The real issue is removing an XP reward that used to be generally available and then restoring it, but only for the completionist. Sending the message that XP is worthless unless you do a laundry list of tasks is not, imo, a good message for the health of the game.
Normally i’d agree with this, if it wasn’t for the fact that literally everything tosses out spirit shards now. Almost every bag has a shard, dalies have them etc…. Shards have become inflated currency almost in a worse state than gold was pre-hot.
I’d also like to point out that you can still get shards from doing task you want to do, just play core tyria stuff you enjoy and get more shards. Or just don’t give a flying penguin about “XP” as its useless to begin with outside of masteries.
XP is the base method of character progression for every RPG I can think of. Whether or not you “need” XP or “need” shards, if you aren’t getting them then that has a very negative connotation. It is very unsatisfying to see an XP reward flash on my screen for a mob I just killed but to know that I didn’t actually get that XP reward. And I will never get that XP reward – its not going into any bank or whatever. Since all my Mastery bars are full but I have no MP to spend, it is simply wasted.
And in most RPG’s there is a level cap where that progression stops. Character progression has never been infinite although there may be some games that are an exception but I can’t think of any.
Yes, when your character reaches the cap at which NO CHARACTER gains more XP. My character hasn’t reached that cap.
You’re not level 80? Or not maxed your masteries? Mystic Forge currency being awarded upon earning a levels worth of XP isn’t progression; it’s rewards.
We can always make the request to Anet that players do not earn XP if it cannot by applied to leveling a character, advancing masteries, and/or earning spirit shard reward once all masteries are maxed. This way you won’t have wasted the XP.
It is not reaching level 80 that stops XP gain, it is capping Masteries. My character has not capped Masteries and yet has stopped gaining XP.
Well spirit shards don’t progress the character as they’re a currency used for the Mystic Forge. Your lack of character progression is instead due to not having enough mastery points and/or not having the raid line unlocked.
The raid line is debatable though as I don’t think it is required for legendaries and the masteries themselves are only useful for raids. After you maxed those ones, your character would stop progressing altogether anyway until they added more.
A minor level-up reward is not an apt reward for raiding. It ought to be what it was before Hero Points, shards and the mastery system were invented, a minor use for the XP that the game throws around as part of the reward for playing any aspect of the game. Raiding already provides rewards that ought to be sufficient for what it entails. If raiding requires a Spirit Shard for XP reward to entice players to engage with it, then raiding is in serious trouble.
Honestly, the real issue isn’t raiding. Raiding only applies in HoT zones. Shards are gated in core, also, just not behind raids. The real issue is removing an XP reward that used to be generally available and then restoring it, but only for the completionist. Sending the message that XP is worthless unless you do a laundry list of tasks is not, imo, a good message for the health of the game.
Normally i’d agree with this, if it wasn’t for the fact that literally everything tosses out spirit shards now. Almost every bag has a shard, dalies have them etc…. Shards have become inflated currency almost in a worse state than gold was pre-hot.
I’d also like to point out that you can still get shards from doing task you want to do, just play core tyria stuff you enjoy and get more shards. Or just don’t give a flying penguin about “XP” as its useless to begin with outside of masteries.
XP is the base method of character progression for every RPG I can think of. Whether or not you “need” XP or “need” shards, if you aren’t getting them then that has a very negative connotation. It is very unsatisfying to see an XP reward flash on my screen for a mob I just killed but to know that I didn’t actually get that XP reward. And I will never get that XP reward – its not going into any bank or whatever. Since all my Mastery bars are full but I have no MP to spend, it is simply wasted.
And in most RPG’s there is a level cap where that progression stops. Character progression has never been infinite although there may be some games that are an exception but I can’t think of any.
Yes, when your character reaches the cap at which NO CHARACTER gains more XP. My character hasn’t reached that cap.
You’re not level 80? Or not maxed your masteries? Mystic Forge currency being awarded upon earning a levels worth of XP isn’t progression; it’s rewards.
We can always make the request to Anet that players do not earn XP if it cannot by applied to leveling a character, advancing masteries, and/or earning spirit shard reward once all masteries are maxed. This way you won’t have wasted the XP.
It is not reaching level 80 that stops XP gain, it is capping Masteries. My character has not capped Masteries and yet has stopped gaining XP.
Well spirit shards don’t progress the character as they’re a currency used for the Mystic Forge. Your lack of character progression is instead due to not having enough mastery points and/or not having the raid line unlocked.
The raid line is debatable though as I don’t think it is required for legendaries and the masteries themselves are only useful for raids. After you maxed those ones, your character would stop progressing altogether anyway until they added more.
Exactly … the real disappointment is that this argument has already been had with this individual in this thread the last time. He’s unwilling to detach the fact that spirit shards earned as material rewards is in no way related to his character progressing in masteries; just because both are based on XP bar does not mean spirit shards are related to progression, no more than masteries are related to material rewards. I’m not sure how anyone even makes that connection unless they are purposefully being insincere.
Their are any number of reasons why this is not an accurate statement.
Agreed. Personally I’d like to see the restriction removed so unlocking the raid mastery track isn’t required to fill the XP bar. I’m not opposed to giving raiding a try, but honestly finding a group open to people new to raiding is difficult. I totally get it that raid groups want experienced people, and that is their prerogative. But everyone needs to learn the ropes at some point, and finding a newbie-friendly raid group has not been easy.
They should just add some sort of spirit shard track that you can swap to at any time. This solves the problem of not having all mastery tracks unlocked and allows people to earn shards at will.
It’s unsatisfying that my XP bar doesn’t move. That’s all. It bothers me. And I do not want to raid. If I wanted to participate in a macho team sport I would play football or something. Or WoW. Haha.
What really bothers me are the signs that Anet is funneling endgame towards raids. Fractals are now a ‘stepping-stone’?! Really?!! ‘Healer’ and ‘tank’ are phrases that just should not exist in my perception of what this game is.
The entitlement and arrogance in this thread is sickening and worries me. Everyone that has put the effort to reach to a state that they only need one raid to get full masteries, are capable of getting it.
Wing 3 first raid wing is the Escort, this is a glorified event rather than an actual raid and most likely everyone that is whining in this thread is capable of doing it. Ever done any of the dungeons? Then you can do it. Done any of the meta events in the HoT maps? Then you can do it. Have at least 100 Maguuma mastery points? Then you can do it.
The truth is not that you’re “not capable of raiding”, that “you’re not good enough for raiding” or “that it shouldn’t be part of its completion process”.
The truth is, that you’re lazy and not willing to put the effort to learn an event. The spoiled kid mentality in this thread that if you want something, it should just be given to you makes my dog cry.
So stop making my dog cry you heartless kittens!
The entitlement and arrogance in this thread is sickening and worries me. Everyone that has put the effort to reach to a state that they only need one raid to get full masteries, are capable of getting it.
Wing 3 first raid wing is the Escort, this is a glorified event rather than an actual raid and most likely everyone that is whining in this thread is capable of doing it. Ever done any of the dungeons? Then you can do it. Done any of the meta events in the HoT maps? Then you can do it. Have at least 100 Maguuma mastery points? Then you can do it.
The truth is not that you’re “not capable of raiding”, that “you’re not good enough for raiding” or “that it shouldn’t be part of its completion process”.
The truth is, that you’re lazy and not willing to put the effort to learn an event. The spoiled kid mentality in this thread that if you want something, it should just be given to you makes my dog cry.
So stop making my dog cry you heartless kittens!
Going to have to concur. I don’t get why people are treating raids like they are in this thread. They’re a challenge, but it’s nothing overtly difficult.
Some of the more challenging ones do need practice to understand, but if you’ve done Arah explorable, you can do raids.
I’m sure most of you have done fractals. Most raids aren’t much harder.
If you’re just looking for a cheese way to get spirit shards in HoT to unlock the raid mastery’s, doing the wing 3 escort event will unlock everything for you and it’s a very simple raid event.
If any of you want to get started on raiding, one of my guilds, Raid Clear [RAID] is always doing a raid.
We have sign ups and sometimes someone just decides to get one going. Because why not? We have many members and we usually fill out a raid party pretty quickly.
If it’s a practice run, anyone is allowed to come and learn. They’re done fairly often.
We do use discord. We’re pretty chill. PM me if you want more info and I’ll get you in touch with our leader. We’re always looking for more.
More people = more raid groups = less QQ on the forums about how haaaaard and excluuuuusive raids are.
Be part of the solution and enjoy the game (and copious amounts of loot) with us.
I’m a former raiding group leader and latter join a couple of different raiding guild. The fact is that all raiding group i have been with always look for more players to join them. People take break, some leave, all have different schedule, etc So most if not all raiding group always look to get more players so they can raid on a more regular basis.
A minor level-up reward is not an apt reward for raiding. It ought to be what it was before Hero Points, shards and the mastery system were invented, a minor use for the XP that the game throws around as part of the reward for playing any aspect of the game. Raiding already provides rewards that ought to be sufficient for what it entails. If raiding requires a Spirit Shard for XP reward to entice players to engage with it, then raiding is in serious trouble.
Honestly, the real issue isn’t raiding. Raiding only applies in HoT zones. Shards are gated in core, also, just not behind raids. The real issue is removing an XP reward that used to be generally available and then restoring it, but only for the completionist. Sending the message that XP is worthless unless you do a laundry list of tasks is not, imo, a good message for the health of the game.
Normally i’d agree with this, if it wasn’t for the fact that literally everything tosses out spirit shards now. Almost every bag has a shard, dalies have them etc…. Shards have become inflated currency almost in a worse state than gold was pre-hot.
I’d also like to point out that you can still get shards from doing task you want to do, just play core tyria stuff you enjoy and get more shards. Or just don’t give a flying penguin about “XP” as its useless to begin with outside of masteries.
XP is the base method of character progression for every RPG I can think of. Whether or not you “need” XP or “need” shards, if you aren’t getting them then that has a very negative connotation. It is very unsatisfying to see an XP reward flash on my screen for a mob I just killed but to know that I didn’t actually get that XP reward. And I will never get that XP reward – its not going into any bank or whatever. Since all my Mastery bars are full but I have no MP to spend, it is simply wasted.
And in most RPG’s there is a level cap where that progression stops. Character progression has never been infinite although there may be some games that are an exception but I can’t think of any.
Yes, when your character reaches the cap at which NO CHARACTER gains more XP. My character hasn’t reached that cap.
You’re not level 80? Or not maxed your masteries? Mystic Forge currency being awarded upon earning a levels worth of XP isn’t progression; it’s rewards.
We can always make the request to Anet that players do not earn XP if it cannot by applied to leveling a character, advancing masteries, and/or earning spirit shard reward once all masteries are maxed. This way you won’t have wasted the XP.
It is not reaching level 80 that stops XP gain, it is capping Masteries. My character has not capped Masteries and yet has stopped gaining XP.
Well spirit shards don’t progress the character as they’re a currency used for the Mystic Forge. Your lack of character progression is instead due to not having enough mastery points and/or not having the raid line unlocked.
The raid line is debatable though as I don’t think it is required for legendaries and the masteries themselves are only useful for raids. After you maxed those ones, your character would stop progressing altogether anyway until they added more.
Exactly … the real disappointment is that this argument has already been had with this individual in this thread the last time. He’s unwilling to detach the fact that spirit shards earned as material rewards is in no way related to his character progressing in masteries; just because both are based on XP bar does not mean spirit shards are related to progression, no more than masteries are related to material rewards. I’m not sure how anyone even makes that connection unless they are purposefully being insincere.
Your statement is false – I completely understand that Spirit Shards are not the same as XP. That is very easy to see. What many people in this thread DON’T understand is the basic idea of why there is XP in the first place. RPGs have XP in order to allow players to witness their character progressing. It is fundamental to game design (read an article on game design to understand why). That said, the fact that I am not receiving ANYTHING at the base level for playing my character is simply bad design.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
A minor level-up reward is not an apt reward for raiding. It ought to be what it was before Hero Points, shards and the mastery system were invented, a minor use for the XP that the game throws around as part of the reward for playing any aspect of the game. Raiding already provides rewards that ought to be sufficient for what it entails. If raiding requires a Spirit Shard for XP reward to entice players to engage with it, then raiding is in serious trouble.
Honestly, the real issue isn’t raiding. Raiding only applies in HoT zones. Shards are gated in core, also, just not behind raids. The real issue is removing an XP reward that used to be generally available and then restoring it, but only for the completionist. Sending the message that XP is worthless unless you do a laundry list of tasks is not, imo, a good message for the health of the game.
Normally i’d agree with this, if it wasn’t for the fact that literally everything tosses out spirit shards now. Almost every bag has a shard, dalies have them etc…. Shards have become inflated currency almost in a worse state than gold was pre-hot.
I’d also like to point out that you can still get shards from doing task you want to do, just play core tyria stuff you enjoy and get more shards. Or just don’t give a flying penguin about “XP” as its useless to begin with outside of masteries.
XP is the base method of character progression for every RPG I can think of. Whether or not you “need” XP or “need” shards, if you aren’t getting them then that has a very negative connotation. It is very unsatisfying to see an XP reward flash on my screen for a mob I just killed but to know that I didn’t actually get that XP reward. And I will never get that XP reward – its not going into any bank or whatever. Since all my Mastery bars are full but I have no MP to spend, it is simply wasted.
And in most RPG’s there is a level cap where that progression stops. Character progression has never been infinite although there may be some games that are an exception but I can’t think of any.
Yes, when your character reaches the cap at which NO CHARACTER gains more XP. My character hasn’t reached that cap.
You’re not level 80? Or not maxed your masteries? Mystic Forge currency being awarded upon earning a levels worth of XP isn’t progression; it’s rewards.
We can always make the request to Anet that players do not earn XP if it cannot by applied to leveling a character, advancing masteries, and/or earning spirit shard reward once all masteries are maxed. This way you won’t have wasted the XP.
It is not reaching level 80 that stops XP gain, it is capping Masteries. My character has not capped Masteries and yet has stopped gaining XP.
Well spirit shards don’t progress the character as they’re a currency used for the Mystic Forge. Your lack of character progression is instead due to not having enough mastery points and/or not having the raid line unlocked.
The raid line is debatable though as I don’t think it is required for legendaries and the masteries themselves are only useful for raids. After you maxed those ones, your character would stop progressing altogether anyway until they added more.
Exactly … the real disappointment is that this argument has already been had with this individual in this thread the last time. He’s unwilling to detach the fact that spirit shards earned as material rewards is in no way related to his character progressing in masteries; just because both are based on XP bar does not mean spirit shards are related to progression, no more than masteries are related to material rewards. I’m not sure how anyone even makes that connection unless they are purposefully being insincere.
Your statement is false – I completely understand that Spirit Shards are not the same as XP. That is very easy to see. What many people in this thread DON’T understand is the basic idea of why there is XP in the first place. RPGs have XP in order to allow players to witness their character progressing. It is fundamental to game design (read an article on game design to understand why). That said, the fact that I am not receiving ANYTHING at the base level for playing my character is simply bad design.
Yet another disingenuous statement from you … You are not receiving ANYTHING at the base level for playing your character by personal choice; all players have access to the game elements that allows them to unlock additional shards. Whether the design is bad or not is irrelevant and a matter of personal taste anyways.
I’m wondering where the outcry was for the 4 or 5 months prior to the release of HoT when XP gain gave L80 characters absolutely nothing? No Hero Points, no Skill Points, nothing.
Why is it such a big deal now that some players can attain Spirit Shards, of all things? Something that drops from sooo many sources.
Your statement is false – I completely understand that Spirit Shards are not the same as XP. That is very easy to see. What many people in this thread DON’T understand is the basic idea of why there is XP in the first place. RPGs have XP in order to allow players to witness their character progressing. It is fundamental to game design (read an article on game design to understand why). That said, the fact that I am not receiving ANYTHING at the base level for playing my character is simply bad design.
Once players reach the level cap, they stop progressing. XP no longer contributes to character progression as they cannot gain levels above the cap. As far as I know, there are no level 81+ characters in the game controlled by players.
Once players max their masteries, or get to a point where XP can no longer train a particular mastery, XP no longer contributes to character progression. This was how the mastery system was designed. If you’ve maxed all masteries then XP can’t train anything obviously. If you haven’t unlocked the next tier of a mastery, and no other tiers of other masteries are available for training, XP cannot train any masteries.
Your issue is that you are under the belief that earning spirit shards, a currency, is somehow progressing your character. It isn’t.
I’m wondering where the outcry was for the 4 or 5 months prior to the release of HoT when XP gain gave L80 characters absolutely nothing? No Hero Points, no Skill Points, nothing.
Why is it such a big deal now that some players can attain Spirit Shards, of all things? Something that drops from sooo many sources.
Odd.
I can only speak for myself: I was playing alts – I wasn’t playing my 80s until HoT arrived.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
Your statement is false – I completely understand that Spirit Shards are not the same as XP. That is very easy to see. What many people in this thread DON’T understand is the basic idea of why there is XP in the first place. RPGs have XP in order to allow players to witness their character progressing. It is fundamental to game design (read an article on game design to understand why). That said, the fact that I am not receiving ANYTHING at the base level for playing my character is simply bad design.
Once players reach the level cap, they stop progressing. XP no longer contributes to character progression as they cannot gain levels above the cap. As far as I know, there are no level 81+ characters in the game controlled by players.
Once players max their masteries, or get to a point where XP can no longer train a particular mastery, XP no longer contributes to character progression. This was how the mastery system was designed. If you’ve maxed all masteries then XP can’t train anything obviously. If you haven’t unlocked the next tier of a mastery, and no other tiers of other masteries are available for training, XP cannot train any masteries.
Your issue is that you are under the belief that earning spirit shards, a currency, is somehow progressing your character. It isn’t.
I said nothing about gaining levels – not sure why you are bringing it up. The fact is that each time my level 80 characters kill a mob, text flashes on the screen telling me that I got XP. Why does it do that if I’m not supposed to be getting XP?
And no, I’m not “under the belief” (?) you mention. Don’t put words in my mouth please.
it’s this luck based mystic toilet that we’re all so sick of flushing our money down. -Salamol
I’m wondering where the outcry was for the 4 or 5 months prior to the release of HoT when XP gain gave L80 characters absolutely nothing? No Hero Points, no Skill Points, nothing.
Why is it such a big deal now that some players can attain Spirit Shards, of all things? Something that drops from sooo many sources.
Odd.
Iteration 1: Everybody got skill points on the post-80 tick.
Iteration 2: No one got anything on the post 80 tick.
Interlude: Masteries appear; XP gets used again. People start complaining they are wasting XP, both when they have completed Masteries and when they are blocked by unlocks/unappealing MP tasks.
Iteration3: ANet decides to cater to those complaints, but only for completionists.
Iterations 1 and 2 were egalitarian. Iteration 3 is not. Meanwhile, 3 is seen as a replacement for 1.
Not odd. It ain’t the shards, per se. It’ the non-egalitarian implementation of a reward that used to be for everyone.
Your statement is false – I completely understand that Spirit Shards are not the same as XP. That is very easy to see. What many people in this thread DON’T understand is the basic idea of why there is XP in the first place. RPGs have XP in order to allow players to witness their character progressing. It is fundamental to game design (read an article on game design to understand why). That said, the fact that I am not receiving ANYTHING at the base level for playing my character is simply bad design.
Once players reach the level cap, they stop progressing. XP no longer contributes to character progression as they cannot gain levels above the cap. As far as I know, there are no level 81+ characters in the game controlled by players.
Once players max their masteries, or get to a point where XP can no longer train a particular mastery, XP no longer contributes to character progression. This was how the mastery system was designed. If you’ve maxed all masteries then XP can’t train anything obviously. If you haven’t unlocked the next tier of a mastery, and no other tiers of other masteries are available for training, XP cannot train any masteries.
Your issue is that you are under the belief that earning spirit shards, a currency, is somehow progressing your character. It isn’t.
I said nothing about gaining levels – not sure why you are bringing it up. The fact is that each time my level 80 characters kill a mob, text flashes on the screen telling me that I got XP. Why does it do that if I’m not supposed to be getting XP?
And no, I’m not “under the belief” (?) you mention. Don’t put words in my mouth please.
Well XP usually goes towards levels in most RPG’s which is a topic you brought up.
Anyway… how about Anet just hide the XP numbers? Easy solution. Now you don’t have to worry about the text on your screen.
So, why no problem with Iteration 2? It seems the complaint is XP ‘going to waste’. Or, not getting ’rewarded with Spirit Shards.
It didn’t really seem to be a problem for those 4/5 months. In fact, not only the 4/5 months, but only since the advent of said Spirit Shard reward.
Still seems odd to me.
Haves vs have nots. Those that maxed all of their masteries are getting something that those who have not maxed yet are not.
I do wonder though how many of those upset about the spirit shards actually need them and would use them. I’m also curious how many times the average players leveled each day before the change with the hero points (skill points).
