Guild Wars 2

There’s nothing shady going on. The standard MMO Expansion costs between $40 and $50, and that is what Heart of Thorns costs.

They don’t have to give you a discount, and they are giving you a free character slot ($10 value) if you prepurchase.

Furthermore, this is not a subscription… that metaphor is completely ridiculous. Not buying the expansion doesn’t prevent you from playing the core game—it just locks you out of the new content. Try that kitten with WoW. Drop your subscription, and they won’t let you log in.

Stop QQing. If it’s too expensive, wait until it goes on sale.

So, to clarify slightly: The 50$ fee is for you to continue receiving updates for your game. Nothing more or less. It happens to coincide with a huge update, but is also charging you for the other updates you will receive.

I doubt that the expansion will be as much as the base game in scale of content, and even if the quality is improved, it still won’t quite equal out. However, LS season 2 has given me confidence that ANet has their ducks in a row this time around, and we will get a nice chunk of content over the next couple years; substantially more than we got with LS 1+2. Make sure you factor that in as well. We got 3 new PvE maps, 1 new WvW map, 1 reworked WvW map, 2 revamped PvE maps, and an extra chapter’s worth of story, in addition to 3 world bosses 2 new dungeons and innumerable Quality of Life improvements. I expect at minimum that amount again before the next subscription fee is up.

As stated, it’s not bundling anything any more than bundling a free month’s play with the initial purchase. You’re buying an all-access subscription; those of us who bought the game before simply have to renew our membership if we want to continue receiving updates.

I’d suggest contacting support and asking them to clarify how to do it. Better safe than sorry.

MattyP.6954:

There’s nothing shady going on. The standard MMO Expansion costs between $40 and $50, and that is what Heart of Thorns costs.

They don’t have to give you a discount, and they are giving you a free character slot ($10 value) if you prepurchase.

Furthermore, this is not a subscription… that metaphor is completely ridiculous. Not buying the expansion doesn’t prevent you from playing the core game—it just locks you out of the new content. Try that kitten with WoW. Drop your subscription, and they won’t let you log in.

Stop QQing. If it’s too expensive, wait until it goes on sale.

Says who? SWTOR was 20, other games have been less. 50 USD for a tiny amount of content is only possible because of people who have invested significant time into the game and they feel compelled to pay it. It’s like a drug dealer increasing his price after the first charge, lol.

Stochastic.1398:

MattyP.6954:

There’s nothing shady going on. The standard MMO Expansion costs between $40 and $50, and that is what Heart of Thorns costs.

They don’t have to give you a discount, and they are giving you a free character slot ($10 value) if you prepurchase.

Furthermore, this is not a subscription… that metaphor is completely ridiculous. Not buying the expansion doesn’t prevent you from playing the core game—it just locks you out of the new content. Try that kitten with WoW. Drop your subscription, and they won’t let you log in.

Stop QQing. If it’s too expensive, wait until it goes on sale.

Says who? SWTOR was 20, other games have been less. 50 USD for a tiny amount of content is only possible because of people who have invested significant time into the game and they feel compelled to pay it. It’s like a drug dealer increasing his price after the first charge, lol.

SWToR started as a sub game, and you can barely play it without paying the “optional” monthly fee. Hardly an example of good business practices if you ask me. Tell me do you still have to pay to unlock your second skill bar?

Talon Silverhawk.3574:

Gaile Gray.6029:

vikkival.2459:

ricky markham.8173:

yes thank you gaile for bringing that to our attention. this is what i felt was right

See nothing to panic over. They’re always listening even if it doesn’t seem like it

It’s true. We are. We do. We always will.

Are you still? : p

Only if you praise them and give them compliments.

Vayne.8563:

SWToR started as a sub game, and you can barely play it without paying the “optional” monthly fee. Hardly an example of good business practices if you ask me. Tell me do you still have to pay to unlock your second skill bar?

Have you tried playing GW2 without paying anything? With the incredibly small bank and the few inventory bag slots, only 5 character slots despite having 8 professions? With ArenaNet’s strong focus in adding far, FAR more skins to the Gem Store than to the game? With the scam-like lottery system ArenaNet uses for people who want to get the weapon skins from the Gem Store?

It’s hardly an example of good business practices if you ask me.

Test.8734:

Vayne.8563:

SWToR started as a sub game, and you can barely play it without paying the “optional” monthly fee. Hardly an example of good business practices if you ask me. Tell me do you still have to pay to unlock your second skill bar?

Have you tried playing GW2 without paying anything? With the incredibly small bank and the few inventory bag slots, only 5 character slots despite having 8 professions? With ArenaNet’s strong focus in adding far, FAR more skins to the Gem Store than to the game? With the scam-like lottery system ArenaNet uses for people who want to get the weapon skins from the Gem Store?

It’s hardly an example of good business practices if you ask me.

Many people still do and many people have used gold to purchase gem store QoL items.

Ayrilana.1396:

Macs.6814:

Once upon a time expansions used to cost 40 dollars (Eye Of the North) and came with 2 character slots.

People complained about the price of that just like they do for every expansion that is ever released.

So you’re saying an expansion costs $40 that long ago and now it’s $50 and you think the price has gone up. Do you pay the same price for bread, or milk, or petrol or rent or electricity in that time?

This industry changes very fast. A ten dollar increase in the price of an expansion isn’t even anything to comment on.

Staff used to be 50 people and now it’s 300. It costs much more to make this game. It costs more to make most games.

Test.8734:

Vayne.8563:

SWToR started as a sub game, and you can barely play it without paying the “optional” monthly fee. Hardly an example of good business practices if you ask me. Tell me do you still have to pay to unlock your second skill bar?

Have you tried playing GW2 without paying anything? With the incredibly small bank and the few inventory bag slots, only 5 character slots despite having 8 professions? With ArenaNet’s strong focus in adding far, FAR more skins to the Gem Store than to the game? With the scam-like lottery system ArenaNet uses for people who want to get the weapon skins from the Gem Store?

It’s hardly an example of good business practices if you ask me.

Even if I stopped and bought two or three bank tabs, it’s still a lot cheaper than I paid playing Lotro or DDO, and it would be a lot cheaper, because I’d have to sub to SWToR to make it playable.

Once you get the “essentials” in Guild Wars 2, it’s done. And yes, there are people who farmed gold and upgraded their bank without spending cash.

Xawen.2658:

Just to be sure.
A vet player that bought the game 40$ (yes some had, even know one that paid 60$ when the game just got out.) and buy the expension at 49.99$ will have pay a total of 89.99$.
But a brand new player will pay only the 49.99$ (add a 10$ if you want to count the extra character slot for the equivalence, so 59.99$ in that case).
So a vet player would have paid at least 30$ more then the new player in that case…
Sorry, but I don’t see the fairness for loyal players.

I pre-ordered the game at full price (I think it was $60). That was 3 years ago. I’ve been playing the game on and off for 3 years. If they had told me in 2012 that I had the option of paying $60 now + $50 for expansion later, OR I can wait, not play the game for 3 years, but just pay $50, I still would have bought the game 3 years ago at the $60 premium.

As a vet you are entitled. Yes, you are entitled to 3 years of gw2 that a newbie did not get. I want gw2 to grow and I want them to bring in new players because I want to play a game with an active playerbase that isn’t dying out.

I also want them to make $$ to keep their game going and because they have a good product and rightfully should be making their $$. And they can’t just be running on the revenue from selling the base game 3 years ago… they have costs, and people have salaries and kitten. They didn’t just hoard their initial game sales revenue to pay all of that every year, every month etc… they make $ from their cash shop (which i’ve chosen not to use until today and still have enjoyed my game); i’m guessing that’s their primary source of revenue over the past 1-2 years, and the way you keep that constant or growing is with new players.

This is an interesting view, I wouldn’t call it a subscription though. Subscription is an arrangement to receive something, typically a publication or in the more modern sense of the word a benefit or access to a service, regularly or continuously by paying in advance.

In order for ANet’s business model, expansions or no expansions, to be considered a subscription model they would have to remove your access to their service (ie. the game) if you do not pay an agreed upon sum at set intervals. In subscription based MMO’s you are technically paying for continued access, and in some cases upkeep, not content because in most cases any future content you may receive, be it for a fee or not, is not stipulated in the terms of said subscription when you set one up.

In GW2, regardless of whether you pay for expansions or not, your access to their service remains unchanged. When you purchase HoT you pay for content (in this context this can cover features and other types content including in-game areas). Those who pay for this content get additional benefits but those who do not don’t have their existing access level changed.

The defining feature of a subscription is that if you don’t keep renewing your payment when it’s due you lose access to the service you have previously paid for. It doesn’t matter if that happens after 1 day, 1 month or 10 years and it doesn’t matter how much you have to pay or how much you’ve paid previously.

If a player in a subscription game chooses not to renew their sub they cannot play any part of the game until they do. They could have been subbed for 10 years before then and bought every single thing available, but if they don’t pay after their (pre-agreed) subscription period ends they lose access to it.

So for GW2’s business model to be a sub they would have to lock everyone who doesn’t buy HoT out of the game.

Which isn’t how it’s going to work. If you don’t buy HoT you can still keep logging in and keep playing everything that’s in the game now, you just can’t keep playing the new stuff.

It’s a purchase, not a subscription.

Vayne.8563:

Ayrilana.1396:

Macs.6814:

Once upon a time expansions used to cost 40 dollars (Eye Of the North) and came with 2 character slots.

People complained about the price of that just like they do for every expansion that is ever released.

So you’re saying an expansion costs $40 that long ago and now it’s $50 and you think the price has gone up. Do you pay the same price for bread, or milk, or petrol or rent or electricity in that time?

This industry changes very fast. A ten dollar increase in the price of an expansion isn’t even anything to comment on.

Staff used to be 50 people and now it’s 300. It costs much more to make this game. It costs more to make most games.

to add to that. $40 ten years ago adjusted for inflation is just about $50. don’t know when that game came out but just to give you an idea. Around $44-45 five years ago.

The OP’s comparison is flawed because WoW charges for its expansions in addition to their monthly fee.

So, WoW:

• Buy base game, play base game as long as you pay the sub.
• Need to buy an expansion to play that expansion for as long as you pay the sub.
• Don’t pay sub fee, cannot play anything in WoW.

GW2:

• Buy core game, play core game for life of servers.
• Buy an expansion, play that expansion for the life of servers.
• No monthly sub pay wall.

Stochastic.1398:

What is shady is bundling the games and not giving a price discount for people who currently own the core game. I don’t understand how anyone can view that as not shady.

That’s because you don’t understand the economics of the situation. WoW sells Battle Chests with the core game and all expansions other than the newest. GW2 will now sell expansions for an expansion price, and will bundle the core game and any prior expansions to the current Xpac.

You seem to think that vets are paying some cost for the core game. What’s really happening is that core GW2 is now F2P. Tying free core access to HoT is a way for ANet to reap the benefits of F2P while preserving the value of account bans on RMTers (i.e, no infinite supply of accounts).

ANet is being upfront about tying core GW2 to HoT. So, no dishonesty. It’s perfectly legal for sellers to bundle products. So, no illegality. Therefore, not shady. All that’s going on is that some posters believe HoT would cost less if GW2 core was not attached. As there are zero costs associated with “giving” away core accounts in this way, I see no reason to disbelieve that the price of HoT, were core not attached, is $50.

Benson.9063:

Xawen.2658:

Just to be sure.
A vet player that bought the game 40$ (yes some had, even know one that paid 60$ when the game just got out.) and buy the expension at 49.99$ will have pay a total of 89.99$.
But a brand new player will pay only the 49.99$ (add a 10$ if you want to count the extra character slot for the equivalence, so 59.99$ in that case).
So a vet player would have paid at least 30$ more then the new player in that case…
Sorry, but I don’t see the fairness for loyal players.

I pre-ordered the game at full price (I think it was $60). That was 3 years ago. I’ve been playing the game on and off for 3 years. If they had told me in 2012 that I had the option of paying $60 now + $50 for expansion later, OR I can wait, not play the game for 3 years, but just pay $50, I still would have bought the game 3 years ago at the $60 premium.

As a vet you are entitled. Yes, you are entitled to 3 years of gw2 that a newbie did not get. I want gw2 to grow and I want them to bring in new players because I want to play a game with an active playerbase that isn’t dying out.

I also want them to make $$ to keep their game going and because they have a good product and rightfully should be making their $$. And they can’t just be running on the revenue from selling the base game 3 years ago… they have costs, and people have salaries and kitten. They didn’t just hoard their initial game sales revenue to pay all of that every year, every month etc… they make $ from their cash shop (which i’ve chosen not to use until today and still have enjoyed my game); i’m guessing that’s their primary source of revenue over the past 1-2 years, and the way you keep that constant or growing is with new players.

Thank for your reply, explained that way is a bit more understandable. Just that like I said in a comment after the one you quoted, me and my guild-mates were more expecting an upgrade of currently owned game by elder players, like 10$-20$ to upgrade to the expansion pack, a bit like getting to Digital Deluxe.

I agree with your point, the game worth more than you pay for seeing that way. And we don’t pay normally for the evolution of the story.

Once again, it’s the updates to which you subscribe, not access per-se. You gain access the first time you subscribe to updates (including all past updates). Each time there is a new expansion, your subscription runs out. Because 90%+ of the new updates will be behind the new content, lack of the HoT subscription means you are also hedged out of the Living World ‘free’ updates.

This isn’t a bad thing, it’s just a different marketing model. My post is not so much to jab ANet for not calling their model a subscription as it is to try and keep the model clear in people’s minds. I see a lot of people complaining that they are short-changed by buying the original now, or will be next expansion by buying this one now. This is simply not true; you can wait till next subscription period to get better value, or buy HoT now and get the content before 2018+. Their call. The price will be the same then though in all likelyhood.

@IndigoSundown: WoW as a comparison is medeocre at best, I will admit, but it’s often either ignored or misrepresented as a comparison.

dreadicon.5840:

Once again, it’s the updates to which you subscribe, not access per-se. You gain access the first time you subscribe to updates (including all past updates). Each time there is a new expansion, your subscription runs out. Because 90%+ of the new updates will be behind the new content, lack of the HoT subscription means you are also hedged out of the Living World ‘free’ updates.

This isn’t a bad thing, it’s just a different marketing model. My post is not so much to jab ANet for not calling their model a subscription as it is to try and keep the model clear in people’s minds. I see a lot of people complaining that they are short-changed by buying the original now, or will be next expansion by buying this one now. This is simply not true; you can wait till next subscription period to get better value, or buy HoT now and get the content before 2018+. Their call. The price will be the same then though in all likelyhood.

@IndigoSundown: WoW as a comparison is medeocre at best, I will admit, but it’s often either ignored or misrepresented as a comparison.

You’re also ignoring the addiction factor, which is the only reason anyone would pay 50 USD for something with a fraction of the content the original GW had.

For new players it makes some sense, for current players if you base your purchase decision on content per dollar, HOT is a terrible purchase and you’re better off buying a different game.

So veteran players who pre-order get 2 character slots now?

The one that came with the HoT pre-order originally, plus the additional “veteran appreciation” slot?

I already got one slot the day after I pre-ordered. Does the second slot come when HoT launches? They said it would take a while. Should I be concerned that I haven’t gotten the 2nd slot yet? Or am I interpreting the 2 slots wrong?

Depends on which edition you pre-purchased. If it was Standard, you only get one..total.

If it was Deluxe or Ultimate, you should end up with two. If you don’t have two by the time the release date is announced (unless other information becomes available), you might consider contacting the CS Team.

Good luck.

Xawen.2658:

Benson.9063:

Xawen.2658:

Just to be sure.
A vet player that bought the game 40$ (yes some had, even know one that paid 60$ when the game just got out.) and buy the expension at 49.99$ will have pay a total of 89.99$.
But a brand new player will pay only the 49.99$ (add a 10$ if you want to count the extra character slot for the equivalence, so 59.99$ in that case).
So a vet player would have paid at least 30$ more then the new player in that case…
Sorry, but I don’t see the fairness for loyal players.

I pre-ordered the game at full price (I think it was $60). That was 3 years ago. I’ve been playing the game on and off for 3 years. If they had told me in 2012 that I had the option of paying $60 now + $50 for expansion later, OR I can wait, not play the game for 3 years, but just pay $50, I still would have bought the game 3 years ago at the $60 premium.

As a vet you are entitled. Yes, you are entitled to 3 years of gw2 that a newbie did not get. I want gw2 to grow and I want them to bring in new players because I want to play a game with an active playerbase that isn’t dying out.

I also want them to make $$ to keep their game going and because they have a good product and rightfully should be making their $$. And they can’t just be running on the revenue from selling the base game 3 years ago… they have costs, and people have salaries and kitten. They didn’t just hoard their initial game sales revenue to pay all of that every year, every month etc… they make $ from their cash shop (which i’ve chosen not to use until today and still have enjoyed my game); i’m guessing that’s their primary source of revenue over the past 1-2 years, and the way you keep that constant or growing is with new players.

Thank for your reply, explained that way is a bit more understandable. Just that like I said in a comment after the one you quoted, me and my guild-mates were more expecting an upgrade of currently owned game by elder players, like 10$-20$ to upgrade to the expansion pack, a bit like getting to Digital Deluxe.

I agree with your point, the game worth more than you pay for seeing that way. And we don’t pay normally for the evolution of the story.

I was a little shocked at the price too because I was thinking $30. I rationalized it like that user and for other reasons.

What people on the fence should do is sit down and decide for themselves as to whether the expansion has enough content to keep them entertained to be worth the $50 price. How it compares to the core game or other expansions doesn’t matter.

We, as players, are paying to be entertained so we have to determine if that price is worth it. Many have, many haven’t. If I read correctly, the pre-purchase bonuses will still be available until launch. Players still have until then to determine if they’ll purchase the expansion or wait until a later date to purchase it when it’s on sale.

I suppose it depends on what you mean by ‘new’ players. If someone has not purchased Guild War2 core game, and pre-purchases HoT, they will not get any ‘refund’. The refund only applies to existing customers (those who purchased GW2 core game prior to June 16th, I believe the cut-off date is).

See, guys? There was no need for all this backlash. They’ve addressed the issue and even did what other major developers probably wouldn’t do; which is offering refunds.

It’s understandable to be mad, but not this mad. Especially when it becomes a total lack of respect and appreciation for one of the best companies in gaming.

Thank you, Arena Net.

Skater.9281:

scerevisiae.1972:

They haven’t addressed our concerns:

• new players get so much beter value for money than existing players for the same amount of money, ie: existing players are being made to subsidise new players.
• not including a character slot in an expac that adds a class unless they pre-purchase is just screwing your playerbase.

https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/pre-purchase-community-address/

Plisa, read…..

Char slot is only if you pre-purchase.

Inculpatus cedo.9234:

I suppose it depends on what you mean by ‘new’ players. If someone has not purchased Guild War2 core game, and pre-purchases HoT, they will not get any ‘refund’. The refund only applies to existing customers (those who purchased GW2 core game prior to June 16th, I believe the cut-off date is).

Yea its hard to get a refund for a game you havent bought.

New players certainly ARE getting a much better deal & existing players ARE effectively subsidising new players – it’s “new player welfare”.

What IS unfair though, is for an expac that adds a class to not come with a character slot FOR ALL.

Existing players are subsidising new players through the rather huge disparity in the different value offerings to existing and new players ie: for the same price, new players get the entire core game.

OK, no problem, this makes business sense, though it remains to be seen whether these new “welfare players” are subconscious or openly resented by long-term players.

However, what troubles me most as a player, of any game, is the notion that an expansion that adds a new class doesn’t automatically come with an included character slot FOR ALL.

This is just plain common sense for a 3 year-old game where virtually every veteran player will have used all of their character slots a long time ago. It’s not a pre-purchase bonus either – pre-purchasers already get beta/early access, and it’s not like having to buy an extra character slot is optional in most cases either – most veteran players already have all slots filled with characters that have had 100s/1000s of hours invested.

It’s akin to buying a new car and having to pay extra for the wheels. It’s a cheap, cynical way of gouging a few more $$, and contrary to the recent blog post, demonstrates close to zero respect for existing customers. It’s worse than the new car without wheels example because for Anet, character slots cost them almost nothing, just a few extra rows in a bunch of existing database tables.

I think it’s appalling behaviour to be honest, especially when the business model is already based on having veteran players subsidise new players, who get a much better deal for the same amount of money. An expac should come with ALL the facilities for EVERYONE to enjoy all aspects of the expansion out of the box.

Veteran players have just as much right to enjoy all aspects of the expac as others who are paying the same amount of money, and this means being able to create and play a revenant out of the box, just like everybody else, with no hidden extra charges.

Why are vet players who don’t pre-purchase expected to delete one of their characters, with potentially 100s/1000s of hours invested, in order to enjoy the new class that’s part of the expac?

Any which way you spin it, we’re just getting screwed. For being loyal customers.

Why not just wait to see what they release? Better yet, wait for a review, or some gameplay footage.

Relevant: http://i.imgur.com/hz2PYe4.gifv

dreadicon.5840:

Once again, it’s the updates to which you subscribe, not access per-se.

Except that I am not subscribing to anything, there is no commitments associated with HoT or future expansion purchases nor is there something to cancel when I no-longer wish to be bound by commitments related to GW2.

I am definitely not subscribing to “updates after HoT” by buying the expansion because that would imply ArenaNet would be obligated to provide such updates and if they fail to do so I would have a means of recourse, since they would be in breach of the terms of my “subscription”. This is exactly why in subscription MMO’s you subscribe for access not for content, because if you subscribed for content or updates it would mean if the company responsible fails to deliver the customer could pursue compensation for this.

No matter how you spin it, there is no angle at which the term subscription can be applied to this business model. The content I am purchasing with HoT is exactly the content that ships with it the content that comes after the expansion and before the next one, if any, is unrelated to that purchase whether people who don’t purchase the expansion have access to it or not. Same applies to content associated with the original purchase of the core game as well as any content in the interim.

It is funny how I don’t see people complaining about the parts of HoT that are free for everyone (ie. Stronghold, Desert Borderlands) being free for everyone. Players may not perceive these two features as part of HoT but the simple fact that ArenaNet announced them as such is enough to make that true, because one or both of those pieces of content might not have been developed at all where it not for HoT. There will always be aspects of expansions that trickle through to the base game for technical reasons in order to retain compatibility, so it is not like people who won’t purchase the expansion will suddenly stop getting updates or be segregated to their own servers, you may not get all the benefits of all updates but updates will continue all the same. So even there your argument falls through.

Tere.4759:

Wow, complain when they don’t give you what you want and complain when they do give you what you want. Those who don’t pre-order should NOT get a character slot.

How do you figure that? In order to enjoy all aspects of the expac (ie: create a revenant), you need a character slot. The game’s been out for 3 years, most vet players used all 5 of their slots ages ago. Why should the most loyal customers get the worst deal?

Prepurchasers already get beta/early access, so it’s not like they aren’t already rewarded.

MattyP.6954:

There’s nothing shady going on. The standard MMO Expansion costs between $40 and $50, and that is what Heart of Thorns costs.

That’s not true at all, other games charge as low as $20 for expansions.

Also, other game’s expansions for $50 come with a LOT more content.

Also, the effective price of the expansion is $60, because the included character slot is not included for all.

And I’m sorry, but not including a character slot in a 3 year-old game for an expac that adds a class IS shady. It basically means veteran players (who used up their 5 slots long ago) get the worst deal, on top of that, are expected to subsidise the purchases of new players (who get the core game included).

Ashen.2907:

I agree that losing progress as part of the fix would be a poor solution.

Yet that is what is expected of vet players who don’t pre-purchase. We’re expected to delete a character in order to enjoy the new class in the expac.

If you know you’re just going to get it anyway, why not pre-order/pre-purchase?

And some people have seen and heard enough to know they’ll get their money’s worth out of it. And that point where you buy vs where you wait vs where you don’t buy at all are different for everybody. Some people are more easily satisfied than others.

Easy prepurchase or wait for a sale were you feel its low enough you can afford game and a char slot

Or buy it for gold if you are a veteran you should have enough

Duke Blackrose.4981:

This community can never be pleased.

On the contrary, it looks a bit shady that they are pushing the preorder this hard (especially in the way they are pushing it, not really the fact that they are pushing it).

Where is the content? What exactly am I paying for? They say they have more stuff than what they are currently showing, so what is it (they don’t actually have to spoil story elements to give us a rough idea of what we can expect)? Because currently the amount of content they have shown really doesn’t justify kitten pricetag (in my personal opinion) This doesn’t mean that there isn’t 50$ worth of content there, it simply means they aren’t currently showing it (and that is where the problem lies).

If people saw that they were going to be getting a lot of content with this update then they would be buying it in droves, but everything that Anet has said and has done is actually pointing to there being a significantly less amount of content than what we would expect for such a price, and that is why people are showing anger.

thomdane.3670:

So, if they gave the people that bought the game after release all the same stuff that people who pre-ordered received, why then would people pre-order? FYI: All games do this, or do you not have a Gamestop where you live? Even if you do not have a Gamestop, have you seen a commercial for any major game advertised that didn’t have pre-order only items attached? Dragon Age, God of War, Halo, Mass Effect, Call of Duty, etc, etc, etc. All games do this to entice players to “buy now”. Anet is not a pioneer in this regard, even among MMO’s. (please see SW:ToR, WoW, Rift, etc).

Perhaps they should offer a better reason to preorder then. Because the amount of content that they are offering for a preorder is actually quite small in comparison (at least for those that already own the game and are loyal to the game) other games that offer preoder, and most games that offer preorder (the ones that haven’t flopped miserably after their release anyway) are very open about the content that is going to be in the game.

Aren’t expansions a little different than an entirely new game? I do agree with the sentiment, Acharyn, but we have the gameplay, graphics, and performance already. What we don’t have fully revealed is the extent of the content.

Also, I knew I was going to get HoT anyway. I intend to play this game for many years to come. That said, I was going to wait with my pre-order under the first pricing structure, but since they changed it to what I considered fair, I have gone through with it.

I just want to say thank you for referencing one of the greatest player events in the history of mmos in that glorious game, Eve Online. I was playing Eve when that happened and it was HILARIOUS watching the entire economy of the whole game fail like a real life depression in the economy. It was phenomenal watch Goonswarm cause so much havoc (as they often do in mmos) lol.

You guys can pre-purchase even the day before HoT launches…by that point all the information will have already been revealed.

We already know how the game plays (you play it right now)
We already know the graphical quality (See Lion’s Arch if questioning)

What we don’t know is the extent of the content. That much will be revealed before the game launches. If you like what you see by then, and you want the character slot, then pre-purchase it at that time. If you don’t like what you see, don’t pre-purchase it.

Gaile Gray.6029:

As we mentioned in several posts on the forums and in various other media, we have been reading and gathering your feedback about the Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns pre-purchase.

Please see this blog post for new information on the Guild Wars 2: Heart of Thorns pre-purchase.

Thank you again for sharing your thoughts!

Sorry Gaile but this really doesn’t do any justice.

Have you forgotten the different core games offered? with the higher costing you got miniature rytlock etc and the mystfire wolf thingy elite skill? what of this?

Now if by core game you mean the original standard version and NOT the deluxe version once offered then this might be a bit more clarity. What I would not want as a veteran player is to find that the core game consists of ALL the bonus content extras that were with the original deluxe version as this is just bad practice. The core game MUST be clarified as just basic core game and NO extras where the HoT comes with core game and extras. This would just be a kick in the teeth. Personally, since you have offered the core game in the past at 75% off then this could still be done with the HoT expansion and still leave veterans buying just the expansion at a lower price for ALL including new players but new players could get one of the original core games + any extras for that particular version like miniature rytlock etc when checking a check box as part of the purchasing system. This leaves any veteran players not needing the core game and those needing it getting it at the reduced price which you have offered in the past and this could go for any new expansion in the future and seems the most logical.

You take the price of the core game off from the HoT value (the deluxe core game) and that gives the new prices for the various purchase prices of the HoT expansion. so for say £99.99 you take away £12.25 say or whatever it was and that leaves the remainder for HoT ultimate expansion pack. then if the new player requires the core you leave what was the two options for standard AND the deluxe core to be added which was either around £8.75 or £12.25 or whatever they were. Let’s say £10 standard and £15 deluxe core versions. This means one of 3 HoT packs can be ordered with one of 2 core game packs where necessary.

This would make alot more sense overall to be fair for those pre-january 2015 and those after this date.

However, as it stands this core game should be basic minimum ONLY NOT the deluxe version you had which is up for clarification. This has been missed. Please clarify and look into this model for pre-purchase and any future purchasing

Fundoshi.3092:

Random.4691:

You purchase HoT, it has a core copy that comes with your purchase. If you have previously purchased the GW2 core game (not HoT) within the time frame given and you would like a refund you can contact support to get a refund.

Because HoT comes with the core game they are compensating all those who bought the Core game under the impression that you needed it to get the expansion, before Pre-purchase was announced.

Yeah but that makes no sense, why would they go through all that trouble just to give you the effin HoT expansion? Why not just give the new players a 10$ discount and remove the pre-purchase bonuses? (since the core game was 40$ and the expansion is 50$)…

There were some people that paid either $10 or $40 for the game between January 23rd and June 16th. They couldn’t just give people $10 because some people would still be paying $80 for the expansion. They want all “new” players to pay $50 for the core game and expansion (base packages).

Also, the refund is automatic for accounts that bought the core game between 1/23-6/16 AND pre-purchase the expansion before July 31st. If you are one of those players, like I am, pre-purchase HoT before 7/31 and you will be refunded. They are going to put out a post at some point soon outlining this more clearly.

Pre-“purchased” HoT Ultimate. No regrats. Not a single letter.

Is $50-$100 THAT detrimental to your life where you must spend all your time and effort raging on the forums because of a company’s so-called “ill” business practices? Have you seen where thousands of your tax dollars have gone? Does that not bother you? You may have your priorities jumbled.

See you in game! If you buy HoT and keep complaining in game… I swear to god…

dreadicon.5840:

Once again, it’s the updates to which you subscribe, not access per-se. You gain access the first time you subscribe to updates (including all past updates). Each time there is a new expansion, your subscription runs out. Because 90%+ of the new updates will be behind the new content, lack of the HoT subscription means you are also hedged out of the Living World ‘free’ updates.

This isn’t a bad thing, it’s just a different marketing model. My post is not so much to jab ANet for not calling their model a subscription as it is to try and keep the model clear in people’s minds. I see a lot of people complaining that they are short-changed by buying the original now, or will be next expansion by buying this one now. This is simply not true; you can wait till next subscription period to get better value, or buy HoT now and get the content before 2018+. Their call. The price will be the same then though in all likelyhood.

@IndigoSundown: WoW as a comparison is medeocre at best, I will admit, but it’s often either ignored or misrepresented as a comparison.

Nope, you still lose. You still have access to all of the base game and all of the QoL improvements that come through the pipe, even if you don’t buy the expansion

ZeftheWicked.3076:

There, couldn’t lay it out simpler if I tried, and you’re welcome btw.

Hah, as if they haven’t already considered these things. Announcements will be made when things are ready and at a pace that continues to keep people interested until release.

To announce everything you are asking for now, with the xpac still who knows how far away, would just leave us with months of silence and no announcements to look forward to.

Khristophoros.7194:

The core game doesn’t even have enough slots for all core professions.

That’s one of the reasons you can get it as a buy-to-play game instead of a subscription model. If they gave you everything you needed automatically (bigger bank, more inventory, more character slots, etc.) they would get less money to support the game.

Convenience items need to be in the cash shop, and having enough character slots to make everything you want is absolutely a convenience.

scerevisiae.1972:

Also, the effective price of the expansion is $60

This is a nonsensical argument, gems can be acquired without cash. You also don’t need to make a Revenant immediately and deleting a character is always an option if you do, whether you want to do so or not is up to you. but it is also incorrect to assume everyone has used up all of their character slots (played since headstart and I still have excess character slots granted I did get one slot for free due to bug in migrating some accounts from pre-release to final release).

You have options, the effective price for the expansion might be seen as 60$ if you absolutely did not have any other option (as in the game didn’t give you a choice) to access the Revenant, but everyone has at least the option of farming gold for a character slot if nothing else (and this can be done any time before or after HoT launches). Is it a raw deal, yes maybe so but it doesn’t change the price of the expansion effective or otherwise.

Won’t comment on amount of content, because no-one, that can talk about it at least, knows the exact quantity of content in HoT right now. They have not announced all of it… what they have announced are broad strokes out of which deducing the volume of content is literally impossible because the entire in-game progression is completely changing.

I’m quite sure that many of the nay-sayers will purchase despite saying they will not. When they see all the perks that come from the xpac (elite specs, new legendaries, who knows how many weapon/armor skins, mastery rewards, etc.) they’ll break down. I’m not really worried about these kinds of posts.

Instead they’ll watch many ppl hold on to their money, until “they’re ready”

ZeftheWicked.3076:

Asides addressing the main complaints about shady pre-purchase tactics here are 4 easy steps for you to make those pre-purchase copies moving:

1. determine and announce release date. It can be an estimation like spring 2016, but give your prospective buyers something to hang on to.

2. Announce the size and number of PvE zones in HoT.

3. Announce plans regarding LS3 – if it will happen and what sort of stuff will you throw in it (new maps? new skills? just story and achies?).

4. Announce beta schedules and open betas – no better way to get ppl who are on the fence to pre-purchase then giving them a taste of the actual thing. Unless it sucks and you know it, that is.

There, couldn’t lay it out simpler if I tried, and you’re welcome btw.

It’s very possible they don’t want to announce some of these because they might cause fewer pre-orders. For example:

1. if the release date is too far away (e.g. 2016), people are going to hesitate to buy and those who have already bought will be angry.

2. If there are as few PvE zones as people are projecting, why would they say that? Though I can imagine there being 2 zones with 3 layers each and having them call it “Six new zones!”

3. If there isn’t going to be LS anymore, they’re not going to say anything about when season 3 comes. LS was their failed content delivery model and expansions are the new one. I wouldn’t be surprised if their new plan was to have an expansion every year with no content in between.

(Incidentally, LS failed because the “a new episode every 2 weeks” turned out to be closer to “a small episode every 2 weeks for 8 weeks, then a 4 months break.” In other words, not enough content. From the looks of it the expansion will have the same problem — not surprising: if they had trouble creating enough content before, who’s to say they can do it now just because the delivery model is different.)

Am i able to pre purchase the expansion for a friend? If so, how does it work?