Guild Wars 2

Rylock looks pretty cool with his blindfold and flaming sword and whatnot. As a long time necromancer player though, it was just one collosal face palm after the next as I found out further details about the Revenants. Why? Everything that necromancers do seems to be done better and in a more lore cohesive manner by revenants.

Necromancers channel the power of undeath. What this means is never explained very vividly in game. What we do know is that the mists are the reality’s underworld and so Necromancers must pull some hocus pocus from the mists.

First point about the revenants: They channel the power of the mists -.-

Necromancers also summon undead minions. Or at least I think they are. Trahearne comments at some point that undead minions were never alive (and so cannot be corrupted by Zhaitan). This seems to suggest that flesh golems are merely that – golems. Not alive, not undead, just dubious constructs held together by unspecified “mist” energy. And quite frankly, I get the impression that asuran progeny are taught to make golems out of bone before being allowed to move onto the more reliable metal, steam and finally holo constructs.

And what do revenants do while necromancers are busy tinkering around with fleshy constructs. It seems that Revenants are busy channeling the power of ancient heroes in the mist. In other words, THEY ARE USING THE POWERS OF ACTUAL DEAD PEOPLE.

Plus revenants get to use heavy armor, cause no one actually knows why a necromancer confine themselves to cloth – and because heavy ascended equipment is just oh so much cheaper to craft -.-

They look cool but to me revenants just seem to be more epic necromancers, there to loom over any existing necromancers and skitten at their backwards cultural tendencies.

spirits =/= walking lumps of smelly rotting flesh

I’m assuming you haven’t played GW1? A lot of what you’re saying could be said about the Necromancer and Ritualist there (http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Ritualist).

The difference between necromancers and ritualists (and by extension probably between necromancers and revenants) is that necromancers focus on the physical aspects of undeath, such as undead-ish minions, blood, decay, rot, disease, shivers, weakness, pain, fear and so on (oh and shadows). Ritualists on the other hand focus on souls, ghosts, spirits, ancestors and the mists.

Now obviously there is some overlap there which might be one reason why there was some rivalry between necromancers and ritualists.

Diovid pretty much has it. I think the necromancer HAS picked up some ritualism in the time between GW1 and GW2 (shadow fiends, some of the various ‘ghostly claws’ skills) but the fundamental distinction is that the necromancer has always focused on death magic that is sourced from and has most of its effects confined within the world of Tyria. The ritualist – and now the revenent – draws its power from the Mists, bypassing Tyrian magic altogether.

This means that the revenent (and ritualist) have much more power regarding the spirits of the dead that have moved on, but they have little or no power over the “earthly” aspects of death, such as blood magic, corporeal minions, and so on.

Yeah, the Guild Wars necromancer doesn’t quite fit the typical fantasy theme. It sucks if you really wanted it literally, but the bright side is you get a choice of different interpretations once Revenant comes out. Just save up some Tomes of Knowledge or something, most things are cross account in this game so an alt isn’t so bad. ;P

As soon as I read the name of the profession I was somehoe picturing reverend lovejoy smiting enemies with the power of god.

Using the powers of the mists sounds cool. Seeing how it executed not so.
The mists are depicted as basicaly everything . We are not but stardust, we are mist.
The WvW is in the mists. The PvP areas are in the mists. Fractals are in the mists.

So basicly he, who controls the mists, controls reality? So someone who can use the mist should be able to shape reality.

However he is depicted as someone who is able to wield the mist and summon past legends. Makes sense, because since the fractals we know the mists are wibbly-wobbley-timey-wimey so to speak.

So if fractals and WvW are correct, there is a multi-dimensional theory at work here.
So if anything Revenants taking a created “legend” from somwhere in the mists and channel their power through himself.
It doesn`t have to be bound to this realm, time and space (which is, why want to see him channel a future hero. Commando be my guest )

A necro however is still bound to this realm. He can open portals (as seen in the PS) to the realm of death (grenth`s refugium), but that still needs a connection to the Tyria they stand upon.
You need something of the ghost you are bout to conjur to make it happen. Like Majory had Belindas blade.
Though her ghost was still wandering the earth at this point, since no one came and send her to the realm of death (We all know how busy Grenth is these days and we still have no answer how death in general works anyway. Just that we can enter his realm)

So yeah. Revenants could theoretical be gods, if they hone their skills. At least in my opinion.

btw. However I hope they rethink the name for germany: Widergänger is such a silly name.

Jaken.6801:

btw. However I hope they rethink the name for germany: Widergänger is such a silly name.

Step 1: Press F11
Step 2: Change language to english
Step 3: Enjoy

#PlayInEnglish

MrTJpwnz.4710:

Jaken.6801:

btw. However I hope they rethink the name for germany: Widergänger is such a silly name.

Step 1: Press F11
Step 2: Change language to english
Step 3: Enjoy

#PlayInEnglish

Oh, I do…
Doesn`t change how others will call it in the german community or on TS, or so

Gerrand.3085:

First point about the revenants: They channel the power of the mists -.-

But necromancers don’t. No other profession does – not even ritualists that many people compare Revenants to. Though ritualists did call upon the spirits of the dead that resided in the Mists, they did not channel power of the Mists itself. Revenant is basically ritualist and then some.

Gerrand.3085:

Necromancers also summon undead minions. Or at least I think they are. Trahearne comments at some point that undead minions were never alive (and so cannot be corrupted by Zhaitan). This seems to suggest that flesh golems are merely that – golems. Not alive, not undead, just dubious constructs held together by unspecified “mist” energy. And quite frankly, I get the impression that asuran progeny are taught to make golems out of bone before being allowed to move onto the more reliable metal, steam and finally holo constructs.

Now you’re making up presumptions. While yes, those are undead constructs made of flesh, they’re not held together by Mists energy – no more than elementals summoned by an elementalist is, or a phantasm summoned by a mesmer is.

And again, your impression on asura progeny is false. Most races disdain from necromancy in the majority – asura amongst them. Bone constructs is not a common for teaching. The only noteable golemancers (what asura call those who work with golems) that dabbled in necromancy was Oola and her former assistant Blimm.

Gerrand.3085:

And what do revenants do while necromancers are busy tinkering around with fleshy constructs. It seems that Revenants are busy channeling the power of ancient heroes in the mist. In other words, THEY ARE USING THE POWERS OF ACTUAL DEAD PEOPLE.

Technically false. They’re using the power of the Mists to either call upon or mimic (it’s not clear yet but Colin’s wording implies the latter – we’re summoning hte legends but not the souls; the Mists is more than the afterlife, it is also the creation of all things and the memories of past, present, and future – it loves to copy existing things, often with alterations, be those things existed in the past, present, or future – so theoretically we may be able to call upon the legends that have not yet been made). Necromancers don’t summon spirits, however. They put them to rest and, sometimes under extreme difficulty, can summon them. Ritualists summoned them casually – their role in society was drastically different in Cantha than even Tyrian and Elonian necromancy.

There is a lot of overlap but that’s little different than mesmer and thief, really, who both use the same field of magic.

Gerrand.3085:

Plus revenants get to use heavy armor, cause no one actually knows why a necromancer confine themselves to cloth – and because heavy ascended equipment is just oh so much cheaper to craft -.-

Armor class is purely mechanical.

Jaken.6801:

btw. However I hope they rethink the name for germany: Widergänger is such a silly name.

Why? Revenant and “Widergänger” (or in my opinion better “Wiedergänger”) are essentially the same (See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revenant and https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wiederg%C3%A4nger).

But i guess you find it silly because the word isnt used that often in the german language anymore.

Though “Revenant” in german should also work considering the origin of the word comes from latin and means literally someone, who returns. So it makes my wonder why the didnt name the new profession “Revenant” in german considering they also called the necromancer “Nekromant” and not “Totenbeschwörer” (which i would consider the “more german” translation).

I had the impression that some of the direct-damage and direct-healing ritualist skills could have been calling on the Mists directly – opening a portal to a section of the Mists with certain properties, and letting the energy within flow out to have a certain effect. They were never really clear about the lore behind specific skills, though.

I don’t think it’s entirely correct to say that armour class is purely mechanical. It’s probably more accurate to say that it’s what members of a given profession typically prefer when they can get it.

It’s worth noting, in that regard, that GW1 mechanics actually suggest a reason for this – wearing lighter armour grants better energy maximums and regeneration. While this doesn’t directly translate into GW2 mechanics, it’s possible that wearing heavier armour would hinder the scholar and adventurer professions in a manner that they don’t consider to be a good deal.

Jaken.6801:

MrTJpwnz.4710:

Jaken.6801:

btw. However I hope they rethink the name for germany: Widergänger is such a silly name.

Step 1: Press F11
Step 2: Change language to english
Step 3: Enjoy

#PlayInEnglish

Oh, I do…
Doesn`t change how others will call it in the german community or on TS, or so

Touché, but still you can play with non-german people or a mix

Muchacho.2390:

Jaken.6801:

btw. However I hope they rethink the name for germany: Widergänger is such a silly name.

Why? Revenant and “Widergänger” (or in my opinion better “Wiedergänger”) are essentially the same (See http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revenant and https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wiederg%C3%A4nger).

But i guess you find it silly because the word isnt used that often in the german language anymore.

Though “Revenant” in german should also work considering the origin of the word comes from latin and means literally someone, who returns. So it makes my wonder why the didnt name the new profession “Revenant” in german considering they also called the necromancer “Nekromant” and not “Totenbeschwörer” (which i would consider the “more german” translation).

For once it isn`t really used that much in german language like you said.
For seconds there is the matter of shortening classes in normal conversation.

Widergänger or Wiedergänger (wieder and wider are two different words, though. One means “again” the other means “against” (more or less) ) would be shortened to “Ich bin ein Wieder” or “Ich bin ein Gänger” (the latter would somehow work, though how quickly would someone say: “Ganger” , a gang member, etc. )

It has nothing to do with the naming in general, mostly the possibilities of it, though.

Nekromant is the name they used for GW1 as well and in german games it was often used as another, more sophisticated description for “Totenbeschwörer”, who by all means would be a “Summoner of the dead”.

I mean. People are allready getting kittened if people call a Thief a Rouge, because they come from another game.
So naming things is quite the difficult process, i know.
Hope they would think about the name.

Speaking of naming. Does Revenant sound like a class to you? “Someone who came back”, it is for me more a description for a status. For a state someone is in.
It doesn`t sound like something someone could learn.

“What class are you?”
“Oh, I am a Revenant.”
“So, you died? Aren`t you a Zombie then? A ghost”
“No, I traveled into the Mists and survived.”
“Doesn`t sound that special. People in the borderlands do that all the time. Are they all Revenants as well?”
etc…

It sounds more like someone who reached another level of understanding. Something akin to ascension. Something they could have put on top of every other being.

The more I think about it, as a class it sounds very different from what we allready have.

Is it like the grey wardens in Dragon Age? Only few who survive the rituals are able to wield this power?

Jaken.6801:

Widergänger or Wiedergänger (wieder and wider are two different words, though. One means “again” the other means “against” (more or less) ) would be shortened to “Ich bin ein Wieder” or “Ich bin ein Gänger” (the latter would somehow work, though how quickly would someone say: “Ganger” , a gang member, etc. )

Yes it is true that wider and wieder have different meanings, which is the reason why i prefer Wiedergänger since wieder is more in line with the returning part then wider.

But if you look at the wiki page, which i posted, you see that in this case it actually means the same (Widergänger=Wiedergänger).

But maybe it would be better to discuss this in the german forums…

I see the Revenant as a combination of Ritualist from GW1 (lore connection with Spirits and Heroes from the Mists) and Engineer (channeling mechanics may possibly work similar to Engineer weapon kits).

Folks, the Lore is Anets to “mold” any way that makes the class “make sense”. Your complaint that it is not “lore friendly” is like me complaining at every space shot in movies & TV that has sound effects. The fact that it bothers me does not mean me ranting about is going to stop the Tie Fighters from making sounds in an airless medium…

I read this title and my first thought was, “No way… Revenants are going to be able to summon an army of minions!?”

Seems my hopes were dashed. It’d be awesome to see Revenants having a small army of demons or something. Maybe that would be their specialization.

From what I’ve been able to discern, while Necromancers are concerned primarily with summoning the dead or, more directly debuffing foes with dark powers, the emphasis of the Revenant is not on summoning ancestral heroes as minions, but rather as a form of self-empowerment or as a powerful attack. This would make them more similar to the Dervish or Guardian in function, despite their similarities to Ritualists.

Duke Blackrose.4981:

From what I’ve been able to discern, while Necromancers are concerned primarily with summoning the dead or, more directly debuffing foes with dark powers, the emphasis of the Revenant is not on summoning ancestral heroes as minions, but rather as a form of self-empowerment or as a powerful attack. This would make them more similar to the Dervish or Guardian in function, despite their similarities to Ritualists.

I hope they maintain a similarity to Ritualists to be honest. I’d love to have a minion master class and build where the character can actually lead his minions into battle. As a necro I usually just stand back and let the minions do the fighting for me.

Part 1

Jaken, you truly spoke out of my heart, why I dislike this new Class and find that it is conceptual junk so far, that doesn’t fit into the game the slightest bit

• Its no profession at all compared to all other playable Classes
• It feels rather like some kind of supernatural being than something, that would be on par with all other playable classes
• Its uses a crap mechanic, that is full of lore gaps considerign all the playable races, which have excepot of the humans zero relationship to those channeled spirits and demons (Mallyx, he is NO HERO so dont compare him, as if he would be one, he was clearly a demon overloard, that ruled the domain of anguish)
• Its a concept, that clearly exists only to make the permanent Dervish and Ritualist Whiners just shut up, since they whine day for day everyday since game release, that those silly GW1 junk classes aren’t in GW2, where Anet mostly already absorbed everything possible and implented it into the other existign Classes, except of a very few things like Ash Urns and Boon Sacrifices for offensive Side Effects as also those childish Scythes (oooh look at me, I’m the Grim Reaper muhahahah), which could be implemted simpyl through Specilizations, rather through such silly lore retconned unfitting Classes, like the Revenant, which in my opinion should be only if it really must exist in GW2 just a special lore based profession for Rytlock only!!
  I would prefer any day just a classical very well designed Dark Knight Profession over these supernatural half god like looking and acting Wannabe Dervish-Ritualist-Necromancer Hybrids which get popped into the game with the lamest of lamest explanations of why out of a sudden millions of them exist … because ..wait, you guess it:

“Rytlock teached us”….

Sure, Rytlock just teached in a blink of an eye millions of othercharacters across from all playable races how to become out of a sudden Revenants and use also supernatural pwoers from the mists channeling some heroic spirits and even demons from which they have absolutely no clue, who or what these heroic spirits were, why they were heroes in their time and so on and why these spirits should even care for the problems of the living instead of just resting in their well deserved peace instead of lettign them command by some living revenants like their slaves granting them their powers.

Part 2:

The Revenant absolutely offers nothing to the table, which wouldn’t have fitted alot better as improvements to the already existingn classes.
Spiritual Empowerments that change the Weapon Skills in the form of using Ash Urns would have fitted far better to Guardians or Necromancers

Using some kind of Mist Powers would be a much better improvement for specializing or enhancing the Death Shroud Skills of the Necromancer would would fit lore based also alot better as the Underworld is already a large part of the Mists and only accessible through the Mists.
There is no other playable Profession in Tyria NOW, which is lore based connected to the Mist in the time of Tyria(so don’t come to me with Ritualists now..Ritualists were in the past anyways nothing else than necrotic occultists like Necromancers which had just a different specialization of death magic compared to necromancers and Necromancers already show signs, that they kind of learned that other specialization of Ritualists over the course of 250 years too by using Spectral Skills communing with souls and ghosts to gain that way spiritual powers)
It would have been better for GW1, if ANet would have never implemented the Ritualist in GW1 and woudl just have improved the Necromancer with their skills and gameplay and instead would have brought with Factions a Class in like the Bard or the Chronomancer or Summoner which could have been completely different and could have added something, that would have feeld also really 100% new and not like a half copy of the necromancer

• The german name for the profession is really disgusting and by its meaning again shows, that this is absolutely no profession, because alone its meaning just stands already for no profession, but rather more like jaken say for some kind of "status and reminds me personally also more of “zombies” with divine powers, than a normal medieval kind of fantasy profession, like all other playable profession,s that give you the feelinng, that they just could be some normal JOB, that one has to learn how to master it to know how to become one of them, where you need to train skills and various talents and gather lots of required expertises about that profession to become a true master in what you do as that profession.

Jumping into a mist hole and suddenly returning back as something supernatural is just lame and is very unoriginal.

So I really hope, that this profession will get some reiterations, before it gets either implemente,d or that when Anet starts to brign out all the infos about the new class and shows more gameplay footage, that these things will hopefully bring me to like the class more to the poin,t that I actually would want to play one.

If not, this junk concept will mostly likely always stay as a black sheep outside from me, never gettign played, while I continue to play all other into the game good fitting white sheep-professions, which actually feel also like professions and not like supernatural half gods >.>

The ritualist is far from a “junk class” considering its the only class that does NOT draw magic from the four primary schools. So in theory, we may be looking at a magic that is older than the dragons themselves, or at least before the bloodstones, and possibly inedible to them. It was explained a VERY long time ago that we as players are >1% of the total populations of our respective races (explanation for why there are no race/class restrictions). In addition, the Charr are masters of military training. It’ll most likely be that Rytlock “trains” our character through proxy or lesser officers. The revenant seems like a really suped up version of the rit being able to channel not just through ashes but through weapons making them less fragile. In addition to that seeing able to channel legendary foes as well means that they are bending the reality of the mists to their will. Remember that GW has the mists(think the twisting nether from wow) AND an underworld. Necromancers rely on the destruction school. (This magic is yummy to dragons). Ritualist do NOT rely on magic (or dragon energy)

Check out GW wiki for more details.

I am…confused as to why we would be upset over a new class. Apparently it’s true that it is impossible to please everyone. They’re giving us some pretty awesome stuff that the community has largely been wanting for a long time. Playing the revenant doesn’t somehow make necromancers useless and certainly they are not the same thing, there will continue to be plenty of people playing ALL of the classes. And with the new specializations coming, there will more than likely be a lot more people playing their old classes than the new one.

The ritualist and the necromancer definitely have different functions and have expertise in different kinds of magic (and in the ritualist’s case, not even magic as they have existed since long before the Exodus of the gods, and before magic was given to the races of Tyria). If the revenant is doing the same kind of things as a ritualist, tapping into those same powers, than it isn’t using magic either. Would a ritualist and necromancer overlap a bit? Maybe. Depends on your perspective. When I think of a necromancer, I think of fleshy constructs, curses, disease. The role of a ritualist doesn’t really fit there. Let’s say they do overlap. Then it just means that they use two different kinds of power, to in some cases do very loosely similar things, but in general very different.

Dervish and ritualist are junk classes because…what, exactly? Those were two very popular classes in GW. Junk classes don’t become popular. They both brought a lot of unique skills and playstyle, and honestly just looked cool and had a lot of interesting lore behind them (and yes, that does matter). So ya, players wanted something like that back. Those roles really have not been filled in GW2. Some things might be similar, but overall there is not much that is like them. And by the way, people playing with a scythe to look like the grim reaper is far from childish. There’s nothing wrong with that at all (and there are plenty, myself included, who loved the scythe and had no desire to look at all like the grim reaper). However, calling people childish because they like to use the scythe…how about we try and keep the insults to ourselves if we are all adults here. That’s the kind of stuff that will fan flames and ultimately get threads closed, if this one hasn’t already earned that.

Rytlock did not just jump in a mist-hole and pop out as a revenant the next day…heh, mist-hole. He’s been down there awhile. We don’t know what happened to him, what he encountered, what he’s learned. We will most likely learn more. And it’s entirely possible we might have to go and speak to him to get the class, and not just get it automatically because we own the expansion. And if not? Who cares. It’s no different than any other game getting a new class and “suddenly millions know.”

And to say that the revenants are half-gods just…I don’t get where that’s coming from. I wouldn’t call any class half-gods. And I don’t see how a revenant is anymore supernatural than a lot of the classes (though being more or less supernatural shouldn’t be somehow considered a bad thing…this is a fantasy world where magic and spirits and so on are a regular occurrence). He’s channeling the mists, and can take on properties of fallen legends (and maybe even current ones, and lore-wise you could possibly say future ones though I doubt that’ll be the case simply because as a player character, that wouldn’t work well). I don’t think any of the classes in GW1 or GW2 have ever come close to being a half-god. But let’s say some are… Necromancers in GW2 can gain death shroud (practically a second life). They can turn into a plague, and into a giant powerful lich. They can create their own personal army out of nothing more than bones and flesh (and apparently from literally anywhere in the world, there is a limitless supply of both bone and flesh for every necromancer to use). They can steal the life force and health of their enemies and though not as much as a ritualist, they do mess around with spirits. They wield curses, diseases, fear itself, and their own blood as weapons. And goodness knows what they’ll gain for their specialization. I could probably say even more about GW1 necromancers.

They didn’t do death knight. death knight is a very distinctive thing, that has correlation with WoW, and if they made a death knight then there would be a lot of people crying out with the words “ripped off.” So, they did something else. Something kinda new. The revenant. In the end this seems to come down to either “we’re not happy, we wanted the death knight” or “we’re not happy, necromancers should get all the cool spirit skills just cause.” Lighten up. Either try the new class and have fun with it, or stick with your own. The fact that it exists won’t hurt you, or the game.

Hocus pocus. Lol.

Necromancers are getting a GS specialization and I think that the Marjory and Belinda affair was foreshadowing of this. Marjory’s GS is imbued with the ghost of her sister (which apparently didn’t go to the mists). It seems likely that the new necro specialization would also feature GS with ghostly powers this may blur the lines between the two further. They still are very unique though.

KngGilgamesh.3481:

Necromancers are getting a GS specialization and I think that the Marjory and Belinda affair was foreshadowing of this. Marjory’s GS is imbued with the ghost of her sister (which apparently didn’t go to the mists). It seems likely that the new necro specialization would also feature GS with ghostly powers this may blur the lines between the two further. They still are very unique though.

I highly doubt that the Necro GS specialization has anything related to what happened to Belinda and her sister. I’m still very curious to know what the new class mechanics will be since Death Shroud will be replaced with something else maybe.

I didn’t read most of this thread, so im sure there is a similar answer in here, but Necromancers summon the physicality of death, disease, and suffering. They summon basically every thing that is dark in the world. Not evil, but dark. Therefore, they are not good nor evil, just dark.
As you stated, the mists is the thearetical afterlife in this game. This is true, but the afterlife is dominated by the spiritual part of death. Regen ants channel and are aided by the strength of spirits to do their work.
So Necros very from revenants in aspect of the afterlife they deal with. Additionally, necromancer a have complete dominion over what they summon, where as revenants CHANNEL spirits. They do not have control of the spirits, they are simply aided by them.

In response to those skeptical about the lore behind the revenant, I feel it is important to know that it is not rytlock teaching however many players there are. The game story is designed so you are the hero. So, lore wise, he would only be teaching one person. Look at it as you are his student. The open world does not have any effect on your personal story, which generates most of the lore.

Revenant’s concept is very interesting, appealing, and it certainly brings some ritualist/ dervish flavor to GW2. I didn’t care much about ritualists and their weird-ish designs, but a heavy armored equivalent, that is not restricted to cantha culture only, and that is focused on legends, sounds so awesome.

I do hope that it’s also a fun-to-play profession, and that it is distinct enough from engineer’s kits and elementalist’s conjures.

Orpheal.8263:

Part 1

Jaken, you truly spoke out of my heart, why I dislike this new Class and find that it is conceptual junk so far, that doesn’t fit into the game the slightest bit

• Its no profession at all compared to all other playable Classes
• It feels rather like some kind of supernatural being than something, that would be on par with all other playable classes
• Its uses a crap mechanic, that is full of lore gaps considerign all the playable races, which have excepot of the humans zero relationship to those channeled spirits and demons (Mallyx, he is NO HERO so dont compare him, as if he would be one, he was clearly a demon overloard, that ruled the domain of anguish)
• Its a concept, that clearly exists only to make the permanent Dervish and Ritualist Whiners just shut up, since they whine day for day everyday since game release, that those silly GW1 junk classes aren’t in GW2, where Anet mostly already absorbed everything possible and implented it into the other existign Classes, except of a very few things like Ash Urns and Boon Sacrifices for offensive Side Effects as also those childish Scythes (oooh look at me, I’m the Grim Reaper muhahahah), which could be implemted simpyl through Specilizations, rather through such silly lore retconned unfitting Classes, like the Revenant, which in my opinion should be only if it really must exist in GW2 just a special lore based profession for Rytlock only!!
  I would prefer any day just a classical very well designed Dark Knight Profession over these supernatural half god like looking and acting Wannabe Dervish-Ritualist-Necromancer Hybrids which get popped into the game with the lamest of lamest explanations of why out of a sudden millions of them exist … because ..wait, you guess it:

“Rytlock teached us”….

Sure, Rytlock just teached in a blink of an eye millions of othercharacters across from all playable races how to become out of a sudden Revenants and use also supernatural pwoers from the mists channeling some heroic spirits and even demons from which they have absolutely no clue, who or what these heroic spirits were, why they were heroes in their time and so on and why these spirits should even care for the problems of the living instead of just resting in their well deserved peace instead of lettign them command by some living revenants like their slaves granting them their powers.

Understand that everything you’ve said (in both parts of your post) are entirely assumptions. With the very limited information that is currently available about the profession, how exactly can you talk about what it does and how it works and then say it’s “conceptual junk?” We haven’t seen how this profession ACTUALLY works AT ALL. We don’t know what Arenanet really means when they say that Revenants will channel the powers of the mists, we’re just throwing guesses out there. I don’t know how you can write a dedicated review about something that doesn’t even exist yet. Conceptually sure, it has its similarities to classes from GW1 like the Ritualist and Dervish, but you’re talking about the profession as if you already know everything that it’s going to be able to do, and I consider that bogus.

Also, just to point this out, nowhere does it say that Revenants channel the power of past “heroes.” Arenanet made a point out of saying that they channel the power of LEGENDS of the past. Legends are not restricted to being good or evil, so being able to channel the power of Mallyx the Unyielding isn’t a lore gap if you actually pay attention to what the game developers tell you.

Its really just a description of how they get their powers, at this point they could truly manifest in just about any conceivable way.

I kind of thought revenant sounded like it should have been the necro specialization class (back from the dead and ready to kick *) but they made it some kind of channeller. <- that would be a better name for it imo

You have to remember there are four schools of magic that each profession generally ties itself to.

Elementalists use Destruction.

Guardians and Rangers (possibly though never confirmed) use Preservation.

Mesmers and Thieves use Denial.

Necromancers and Warriors use Aggression.

And Engineers I feel use Aggression as well but nothing is ever really clear as to what school of magic they might more utilize over others.

Revenant is going to fall into it’s own category as they draw their magic directly from The Mists.

While yes Necromancers are described as drawing on life force, their power comes more from -The Underworld- which is Grenth’s domain within The Mists. Grenth was the one that stopped Dhuum, with the help of the Seven Reapers, and thus allowed Necromancy to be a practicable magic.

The Mists itself isn’t the domain of the dead, The Underworld within the Mists is and that is where the souls of the dead end up being brought. Generally by the Envoys.

Revenant =/= Necromancers. Two distinct sources of power for two distinct professions.

Also I repeated myself because otherwise I don’t think it’d get the point across. If you just poke your head in on the GW2 and even the GW1 wiki you’d understand.

Rangers, I’m pretty sure use Destruction rather than Preservation, since most of their magic is elemental in nature.

Engineers don’t use magic directly. They exploit the natural magic in the materials and substances they work with.

Well sure it might be “elemental” in some kind of sense but so isn’t Guardian magic with the flames they can conjure. Same goes for Warriors. But in a sense I feel like Preservation fits more with Rangers seeing as their orientation toward nature rather than just “elemental” damage.

@ DarkLord: Part1 :

The Revenants are no profession, but actually a status.
This is no assumption, this is pretty much FACT. Maybe you should get your facts first straight, before you assume, that things that others say are assumptions.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revenant

But like zombies, revenants were undead and typically malevolent creatures

In regard of medieval western europe mythology, a revenant is nothing else, than an (evil) UNDEAD, which returned from death.
So you can basically say, Anet lets us play undeads, which mystically have the ability to channel the powers of other dead “legends”, regardless of what they were or if you are at all anyhow connected to them lorewise, be it spirits of fallen heroes, be it demons like Mallyx… how come that the game tells us then lorewise absolutely no “legends” about all these things that the Revenant will be able to channel powers from??
Whatever they will channel in the future, nothing of what thery will be able to use will be anyhow “legendary” to me.

Its also one of the reasons, why people here see a strong connection to the Necromancer in the Revenant, not just only because of the strong Ritualist references and similarities, but rather also because this supernatual “status”, that anet wants to sell us for dumb for as a “profession”, that is none at all is nothign but an undead, if you stay to the facts of mythology from which ANet takes this name for the profession, because the meanign behind “Revenant” comes just only from the european/norse medieval mythologies, where Revenant has its origin from.

In the norse mythology for example, Revenants were called “Draugr” So in fact we talk basically about nothing else here, than about zombies and if ANet would hold to the mythologic facts, tan this would theoretically mean, than Rytlock woudl be an undead not, that returned from the realm of death, so the underworld, that is the realm of the death in the mists and its the realm, to which only necromancers are connected too by their lore.

Thats why I say, due to all those gaps and missing infos thatI think that the Revenant is “conceptual junk” and this it needs more finetuning and some conceptual changes to make just sense and to give us all not just the impression, that this “profession” has conceptual no hands and no feett and basically gets only retconned into the game to make the whining Dervish/Ritualist cryers finally shut up to please them by lettign them get something that should remind on the old Dervish/Ritualist gamplay in a merged way like a surprise egg that gives them 3 things in 1 and I just god darn hate such retconned hybrid “professions”, that make no sense and provide nothing new, that all the other real professions, that feel also like being really a medieval kind of fantasy profession and aren’t a status rather, which get only implemented to make some nostalgic players happy, rather than to add something to the game, what would be best for the game and not just for some nostalgic whiny players, that can’t let go of the past and comprehend that Anet has already done their best to include as many old mechanics from GW1 into GW2 as possible with a few exceptions, which would have also just fitted as specialization improvements to the already existing classes better.

ANet has made this mistake already in the past with the Dervish and the Paragon, two absolute obsolete classes, which added nothing really new to the game, what other classes like the Warrior or Monk wouldn’t have been able to do so too, which got just retconned into the game just to please some players and to have with them a reason so that players might buy Nightfall to get those new playable classes, but in fact these two classes just ruined far more the overall Game Balance, than they did anything good for GW1 and my fear is it simply, that Anet exactly repeats this big mistake here again with the way to supernatural coming over Revenant.

@ DarkLord Closing Part 2:

I think simply, the class concept needs some minor changes to get more into line with all other playable professions:

1. Rename the Class from Revenant to if it must be Ritualist, then at least the class name is already again in line and lore fitting, plus sounds like a profession and not like a reference so something UNDEAD, that just returned from the underworld…

2) Replace the Channel Legends Mechanic with an Ash Urn-Mechanic that works rather like an environmental item that replaces when used (channeled) the half backline of your skill bar (healing, utility, elite skills) and which arend based on some lore characters fro mthe past, which most likely are only connected to the hitory of the humans only and no other playable race, which makes the Revenant look only more retconned, if you play it not with a human…., because thats the reason, why the Dervish Avatars became human racial skills and not some skills, that are useable by all playable races, that aren’t connected to the lore of the humans.

So Instead of having a Mechanic Skill (most likel F-Skills) that let you channel up to maximum 3 different “legends” from which we know so far 2 (my guess for number 3 is Glint (Support) due to that dragon animation in the trailer as jalis is clearly DPS and Mallyx is clearly conditions for control, instead of that, the reiterated Ritualist could have 4 different Ash Urns that consist the ashes of some iconic complete new demons or ancient old mighty races, that lived way before of any other playable race so that lore from GW1 can’t interfere here with the playable races, plus it would be something, that would be different from the necromancer, as demons aren’t undeads, lettign the Ritualist become able over the past 250 years to make Pact Rituals with demons from the mists to channel their powers from the Ash Urns in which their powers are sealed away.

I would have rather heavy armored Ritualists as 9th playable profession, that feels connected to the GW1 lore, without allinatign players that don#t play them as humans with lore, that isn#t connected to their race that also doesn’t come over like some kind o supernatural half god like, thats even able to return from death, which is in fact by mythology an undead that returned from the underworld.

HoT is far away from being released, we will see a Beta Test first, which will decide over it, when HoT will get its Release Date, so I think we still have enough time to make on this concept of the Revenant just some finetunings in the game mechanics and its name/lore, so that the profession will feel in the end also like a medieval fantasy profession like all others do and doesn’t come over like the black sheep among many white sheeps that must be completely different in all things just to be the special overpowered snowflake, which does nothing, what a Necromancer/Guardian Specialization wouldn’t be able to do so too – maybe just only under a different design theme, but thats all.

I think many of you have some interesting points about the “new profession”.

Sure it seems more like a status/description than a profession. But I am not sure how the other classes work. Is everyone able to be an elementalist? Or do you have to be “born” with certain magic abilities? Sure everyone can be a warrior or thief or engineer…

Well maybe we could try to focus on the fact that anet tried to give us what the majority wanted.
As all charakters are adults it could be possible that the revenant requires a kind of death experience as a child or something. A specific relation to death so that people called them revenant becuase they (nearly died) but returned…so we are not talking about zombies but about people who survived something really bad.

After Rytlock returned the fact that there’s a new power available spreaded all over tyria. So the people with this kind of relation to death/the mists are able to reach these power like Rytlock did – through hard training of course.

I am looking forward to the new profession. And I think it is like everything in Thema world: if you WANT you could accept the new profession and think Hof a way they fit Info tyria. But if you are searching for negativ points , you’ll find them

PS: maybe the new spec. Of the necro is kind of a dark nicht i man GS and the power of death ?!;)
But I would like a ranged attack like the memer GS even cooler

See you ingame

Orpheal.8263:

The Revenants are no profession, but actually a status.
This is no assumption, this is pretty much FACT. Maybe you should get your facts first straight, before you assume, that things that others say are assumptions.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Revenant

Or maybe the Profession is named so because of other reasons.

For example, where the word Revenant derived from (reveniens, “returning”). This could have a dual meaning: Rytlock ‘returning’ from the Mists with this power and knowledge, and the legends ‘returning’ to the battlefield.

Or maybe because Revenants had a personal story, unlike most of the constructs or spirits Ritualists and Necromancers summon up.

I also find it funny where you say that people shouldn’t assume things, and yet you’re assuming that this profession is ‘conceptual junk’ without even knowing the full lore or mechanics of the profession, and assuming that they bring nothing new.

Orpheal.8263:

In the norse mythology for example, Revenants were called “Draugr” So in fact we talk basically about nothing else here, than about zombies and if ANet would hold to the mythologic facts, tan this would theoretically mean, than Rytlock woudl be an undead not, that returned from the realm of death, so the underworld, that is the realm of the death in the mists and its the realm, to which only necromancers are connected too by their lore.

This is your big mistake here: you’re assuming that mythology in Tyria is an exact copy of real-life mythology, and not just drawn inspiration from it.

Lets look at the Norn.

Norn in Germanic mythology were only women who ‘ruled the destiny of Gods and men’, and yet Norn in game can be either male or female.

Orpheal.8263:

ANet has made this mistake already in the past with the Dervish and the Paragon, two absolute obsolete classes, which added nothing really new to the game.

I can’t say for sure with the Paragon, but the Dervishes did bring something that the Warriors and Monks couldn’t do.

Firstly, they were a ‘holy warrior’, so to speak, that relied on enchantments based around earth and wind mysticism and removing said enchantments to boost their skills, and these mechanics made sense because of their backstory of mysticism.

Conceptually, the Warrior was a profession that relied on physical training and adrenaline and mastery of arms above all else, while the Monk was, conceptually, a support character based around the divine.

KryTiKaL.3125:

You have to remember there are four schools of magic that each profession generally ties itself to.

Elementalists use Destruction.

Guardians and Rangers (possibly though never confirmed) use Preservation.

Mesmers and Thieves use Denial.

Necromancers and Warriors use Aggression.

And Engineers I feel use Aggression as well but nothing is ever really clear as to what school of magic they might more utilize over others.

Warriors, Thieves, Rangers, and Engineers actually don’t use any of the four schools of magic. Three bypass any form of magic entirely (Engineers replacing it with technology, Warriors and Thieves with skills), and Rangers don’t directly use any magic themselves, instead performing rituals to summon nature spirits that have the magical effects (and bypass the bloodstones entirely). Revenants, drawing power from the Mists instead of Tyria, also bypass the Bloodstones.

I see revenent as either an ultimate buffer, a quick killer or an evasive pest. I thinks it’s mechanics would be a mixture between attunements and virtues. By this I mean you have a single, ultra buff, that can be switched like attunements. This in my opinion is the Revenant

Orpheal I think you took things just a tad bit too literally with how they are referring to it as a Revenant.

TheDaiBish makes a good point of the origins of the actual word and not just its mythological connotations in norse or medieval western european mythology.

So much hate on this for practically no reason. People are funny, aren’t they?

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Warriors, Thieves, Rangers, and Engineers actually don’t use any of the four schools of magic. Three bypass any form of magic entirely (Engineers replacing it with technology, Warriors and Thieves with skills), and Rangers don’t directly use any magic themselves, instead performing rituals to summon nature spirits that have the magical effects (and bypass the bloodstones entirely). Revenants, drawing power from the Mists instead of Tyria, also bypass the Bloodstones.

Actually it’s said that every person in Tyria has some affinity with magic, what matters is if they actually act upon it or how strong their affinity to it is. Sure you can RP a warrior not using magic, or an Engineer not using it, or a Ranger or a Thief not using it but the idea remains that they -can- and -will-. Unlike in WoW the abilities presented on GW2 professions are actually -canon-, Anet has a good track record going all the way back to GW1 with how they actually make nearly all content in their game actually -canon-. If Thieves didn’t use some kind of magic then they wouldn’t use some kind of magic, especially considering they were derived from the Assassin from GW1 which very obviously used magic and so does the Thief.

Also mind you a ranger performing a ritual to summon spirits…that -is- magic, that isn’t a natural physical feat of a typical mortal being. Also you can’t bypass the Bloodstones…it’s the Bloodstones, unless somehow all Rangers are of King Doric’s descent. And as for Revenants yeah, they use the power form the Mists but they are the only case in which they do not draw upon -typical- magic. Ritualists did the same thing.

who cares if in our mithology a revenant is an evil undead… i don’t think tyria mithology needs to be mixed with our. it’s just a name for something it didn’t existed before inspired by a caracters who actually returns from the mists…
i think we can’t really judge an entire class just because we know what their name means in our mithology. just see what they can do when info will be released than we can talk

after almost 10 years of playing GW, i have always seen the mist and the underworld as 2 different things.
the mist is more like a valhalla while the underworld is like helheim, one is for heroes and the other is for the common folk.
so with that, necro’s use the power from the underworld, manipulating the flesh body with dark magic.
the revenant uses the power of heroes, that’s why they say it uses the power of the mist.

that’s at least how i have always seen it…..

I can’t speak here for anyone else, rather than but for myself, but knowing, that Revenants are evil undeads that return from the realm of the dead and Anet uses this term for a new playable class, which is in its whole design no real profession, but more some kind of unnatural status, that comes the real mythology meaning very near, is kind of extremely immersion breaking for me.
The other half that makes it far more immersion breaking for me, are the big lore gaps currently in this new class. Alot of things need to be explained with this class, (I stay with class from now on, as the Revenant is no profession like all others are.) to make this retconned class that clearly should please only the Dervish/Ritualist people mainly more plausible.

I can’t take the thought any serious, that Rytlock should teach everyone how to become suddenly a complete different “thing”, because it opens up naturalyl the silyl question, of what those characters were then, before Rytlock made Revenants out of them? The whole discussion around the Personal Story wouldn’t exist, if anet would make out of the Revenant something, that integrates itself easier and wouldn’t be bonded to Rytlock and would work like all the other playable professions as a trustworthy real profession too, that will start from one of the racial hometowns, like all others do.
If ANet changes something on that, it clearly shows again ,how retconned the whole class is, if they don’t change for them the personal story, then its even worser, because then its completely immersion breaking, because there simply can’t exist any Revenant before of Rytlock. (unless, and thats just now my guessing, Anet retcons now Razah in and declares him as official first Revenant that made Rytlock his pupil in the Mist, because currently nobody knows, exactly who or what Razah from GW1 was/is, just so much, that he gets described as a human manifestation from the mists, in GW1 he had skills as a Ritualist mainly, but was the only npc, with a variable class mechanic so that you could make out of him, what you want – reminds me now on Rytlock changing his class while being in the mists)

Thats why I say, Anet would have done better with it, if they would have made out of Rytlock the only Revenant and kept it that ways as having him this new design uniquely, what would have made more sense and wouldn’t put Anet under the stress to retcon the whole thing into the game somehow that it makes sense.
If they would make rytlock the unique Revenant in Tyria, that would have been alot bett,er because then would have been Rytlock truly unique and special.

Anet should better use the Specialization System among the already existing Professions to implement old GW1 mechanics, like the Dervish’s Boon Sacrifice for the offense. thats perfectly something that I’d rather like to see for a Guardian’s Specialization as Crusader, because that would be true “holy warriors” to describe it with DaiBish’s words.

KryTiKaL.3125:

Orpheal I think you took things just a tad bit too literally with how they are referring to it as a Revenant.

TheDaiBish makes a good point of the origins of the actual word and not just its mythological connotations in norse or medieval western european mythology.

So much hate on this for practically no reason. People are funny, aren’t they?

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Warriors, Thieves, Rangers, and Engineers actually don’t use any of the four schools of magic. Three bypass any form of magic entirely (Engineers replacing it with technology, Warriors and Thieves with skills), and Rangers don’t directly use any magic themselves, instead performing rituals to summon nature spirits that have the magical effects (and bypass the bloodstones entirely). Revenants, drawing power from the Mists instead of Tyria, also bypass the Bloodstones.

Actually it’s said that every person in Tyria has some affinity with magic, what matters is if they actually act upon it or how strong their affinity to it is. Sure you can RP a warrior not using magic, or an Engineer not using it, or a Ranger or a Thief not using it but the idea remains that they -can- and -will-. Unlike in WoW the abilities presented on GW2 professions are actually -canon-, Anet has a good track record going all the way back to GW1 with how they actually make nearly all content in their game actually -canon-. If Thieves didn’t use some kind of magic then they wouldn’t use some kind of magic, especially considering they were derived from the Assassin from GW1 which very obviously used magic and so does the Thief.

Also mind you a ranger performing a ritual to summon spirits…that -is- magic, that isn’t a natural physical feat of a typical mortal being. Also you can’t bypass the Bloodstones…it’s the Bloodstones, unless somehow all Rangers are of King Doric’s descent. And as for Revenants yeah, they use the power form the Mists but they are the only case in which they do not draw upon -typical- magic. Ritualists did the same thing.

Keep in mind that Warriors and Rangers had no Spells in GW1. These would be the people who do not act upon their magical capabilities. Ranger spirits were rather explicitly not the same kind of magic that is tied to the Bloodstones, but is actually far older, as it was around even before the gods gifted Magic to mortal races. These two and Engineers currently do ignore the Bloodstones because what they draw from for power is not what gets filtered.

Thieves are a little funky. Not easy to tie them down as being “magic” or just ridiculous skill. Aggression would be the school that best fits them, though.

Well we still don’t know how the Revenant is going to be introduced story wise aside from us knowing that Rytlock is the first one and it was said that he will be training new ones.

Revenants may get their own starting point, outside of the typical racial ones, so as to make more sense within the lore but we don’t know that yet and it’s at least something I hope they will do because I agree it’d be extremely off for a charr Revenant to be going to see Rytlock in the beginnings of the Personal Story if you pick Blood Legion.

Now also understand that okay this looks like something to please the “ritualist/dervish crowd” but also remember that both of those classes were also called Professions, even the Ritualist which got its magical powers the same way a Revenant is. From The Mists.

Also I wouldn’t call this ‘retconning’, that would imply a deliberate, immense and drastic change to already established lore foundations to accommodate for something that was previously impossible to implement with the standard lore. Which…is not true in this case seeing as Ritualists already had an established lore foundation, as did the Dervish. I mean I can understand some people having an issue with Rytlock teaching others this class seeing as he can be kind of a prick, but that all falls under preference.

The Revenant was built out of things that were already established in the lore as plausible. If you don’t like these parts of it, okay sure that’s fine, but that doesn’t invalidate the idea of a Revenant because you don’t like the segment of lore that is the Dervish and Paragon (as you stated in a previous post).

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Keep in mind that Warriors and Rangers had no Spells in GW1. These would be the people who do not act upon their magical capabilities. Ranger spirits were rather explicitly not the same kind of magic that is tied to the Bloodstones, but is actually far older, as it was around even before the gods gifted Magic to mortal races. These two and Engineers currently do ignore the Bloodstones because what they draw from for power is not what gets filtered.

Thieves are a little funky. Not easy to tie them down as being “magic” or just ridiculous skill. Aggression would be the school that best fits them, though.

No they did not, but you could multiclass in GW1 with Professions that used magic and Anet said very early on before GW2 came out that some of their classes are kind of meshed together with ones from GW1. So while Warrior as a base did not use magic, you generally multiclassed with something that did. Or you could and that’s kind of the point. Each person has an affinity to magic on Tyria, it just varies by the degree of their affinity or the effort put forth to expand upon that affinity.

You also have to remember that magic in GW is not rigid, it’s actually invariably flexible despite the limitations of, basically, 1 magic school per person. So I think their nature magic can very well fall under Preservation. I also don’t recall Rangers ever being described as using a completely different kind of magic to everyone else, just that they utilized nature rituals and that it was unique to them…just like elemental magic tends to be unique to Elementalists or death magic to Necromancers.

KryTiKaL.3125:

Well sure it might be “elemental” in some kind of sense but so isn’t Guardian magic with the flames they can conjure. Same goes for Warriors. But in a sense I feel like Preservation fits more with Rangers seeing as their orientation toward nature rather than just “elemental” damage.

The names of the schools are simply names.

Sure, there’s a little bit of fire in Preservation, and even touches of other elements, but those have never been Preservation’s focus (and when a guardian does use fire, it’s in a distinctive form that’s different to elementalist or ranger fire). Preservation is also associated with light and force fields and a whole bunch of other effects that Rangers don’t show the slightest signs of having.

Furthermore, only users of Destruction have access to all of the elements. Rangers, particularly in GW2, have their skills themed around having access to all the elements. Thy have offensive skills based around fire and frost, they can use lightning to defend themselves (Lightning Reflexes and downed skill #2), make themselves and their pets temporarily invulnerable with Signet of Stone, mire their enemies in mud by softening stone, conjure elemental spirits of all four elements, and here’s the kicker:

They have a healing skill that operates by conjuring healing water. Just like elementalists heal by conjuring healing water. In fact, if you look to Guild Wars 1, rangers did it first.

I can understand why you might think that “Preservation” is a more appropriate label – but keep in mind that those labels were probably applied right after the bloodstones were split, where magic was more primitive than it is now and people probably had only figured out how to do the most basic things with the schools. When you look at the actual effects of what rangers do, though, the only things they have in common with Preservation are basically the things that Preservation has in common with “Destruction” anyway. While basically all of their overtly or potentially supernatural effects have an elemental nature.

There were other things I wanted to comment on here, but I’m running short on time and they will have to wait.

KryTiKaL.3125:

Drarnor Kunoram.5180:

Keep in mind that Warriors and Rangers had no Spells in GW1. These would be the people who do not act upon their magical capabilities. Ranger spirits were rather explicitly not the same kind of magic that is tied to the Bloodstones, but is actually far older, as it was around even before the gods gifted Magic to mortal races. These two and Engineers currently do ignore the Bloodstones because what they draw from for power is not what gets filtered.

Thieves are a little funky. Not easy to tie them down as being “magic” or just ridiculous skill. Aggression would be the school that best fits them, though.

No they did not, but you could multiclass in GW1 with Professions that used magic and Anet said very early on before GW2 came out that some of their classes are kind of meshed together with ones from GW1. So while Warrior as a base did not use magic, you generally multiclassed with something that did. Or you could and that’s kind of the point. Each person has an affinity to magic on Tyria, it just varies by the degree of their affinity or the effort put forth to expand upon that affinity.

You also have to remember that magic in GW is not rigid, it’s actually invariably flexible despite the limitations of, basically, 1 magic school per person. So I think their nature magic can very well fall under Preservation. I also don’t recall Rangers ever being described as using a completely different kind of magic to everyone else, just that they utilized nature rituals and that it was unique to them…just like elemental magic tends to be unique to Elementalists or death magic to Necromancers.

And the dual-classing system also broke lore by having Necromancer/Monks or Elementalist/Mesmers exist, both combinations double-dipping on schools of Magic, even though mortals are only able to access a single school. Using that as an excuse for shoehorning the explicitly non-magical classes into a school of magic is not a good argument.

Sadly, the wiki is rather worthless right now for this argument.

Right, now that I’ve got a bit more time to comment on some of the other issues:

First, on the bloodstone thing: The lore on the bloodstones never actually specified that anyone was limited to a single bloodstone, just that the bloodstones meant that nobody could draw from all four.

When it comes to magic distributed among the professions, the less overtly magical professions do indeed use magic. Rangers manipulate elemental magic (albeit at a much lower level than elementalists) and thieves have shadow magic for teleportation and stealth (generally considered to be a specialised branch of Denial). Warriors simply use magic to empower themselves rather than cast any formal spells (which is how they can perform superhuman physical feats, while engineers manipulate magical energy in the substances and materials they use.

If you look at GW1… rangers had no “spells” according to the mechanics, but they certainly had supernatural abilities – calling spirits if nothing else. They’ve also got a lot of stuff that you can choose to interpret either as magic or as being miraculously good at fieldcraft – traps, preparations, and some attack skills fit into this category. Warriors have less that can be pointed at and called ‘magic’, but I’d love to know how you can make someone fall over simply by accusing them of cowardice without mixing some magic in.

@ The name: I’d have to agree that “revenant” as a name seems a bit… lame. Something like a placeholder that never actually got pushed aside for something better. On the other hand, I’m not sure what WOULD be better under the circumstances – “medium” is probably the best fit meaning-wise, but… errrm. Ritualist has the issue that even though they appear to be drawing from the same sources, they do appear to be substantially different – the revenant may be a kind of ‘spiritual successor’, but a revenant isn’t a ritualist any more than a guardian is a monk.

Something like “herald” or “harbinger” might fit.

I’m inclined to shrug it off just like I shrugged off ‘guardian’ as an uninspiring name (even though I love the profession ingame!), although it probably is higher on the ‘meh’ quotient than even guardian. It’s probably another one with the problem that different cultures ingame might call it by different things, but what do you call it on the whole.

@ Balance concerns and GW1: The balance issues with GW1 largely came about due to the GW1 philosophy of each profession having its own role. This means that every new profession had to have a new role that it could fit into – and when you keep adding additional roles into a game that wasn’t initially designed with those roles in mind, those roles will tend to fall into one of two balance states: either they’re worth taking in the place of a character that would have performed another role (in which case, they appear overpowered, particularly to people who were used to how the game was before they were introduced) or they’re not (and they never get seen in competitive play).

GW2 has a different philosophy that is probably more robust – you don’t see professions slotted into roles so much, instead the professions largely do similar things in different ways. The distinction is not in that every profession has its own role to play – it’s that the professions have different mixes of roles that they can perform at once, and require different behaviours to perform those roles.

@ The concept: At this stage, I’m going to invoke “different people have different opinions”. ArenaNet have taken the option they felt would please the most people and which fits the playstyle they have in mind – and some of the people they’re looking to please may well be themselves.

When it comes to the legends appearing human-centric – I think that’s a case of “depends on how it’s implemented”. If they draw just from GW1 for the nostalgia… then yes, it likely will feel that way, even if none of the legends are actually humans (they’ll all be coming out of human lore). Mind you, that’s probably not too inaccurate as to what might realistically happen – the two races most inclined to respect individual heroics seem to be norn and humans, and even the norn respect human heroics from GW1’s time. However, just playing the nostalgia card would, I think, be sloppy, when they’ve got a good opportunity to introduce new legends from periods in history and places that we as players haven’t seen before.

Certainly, though, I think I like the idea of invocations more than the urns. GW1 had fairly limited graphical fidelity, and urns were a suitable solution there – in GW2, they have the option to grant more eye candy, and such eye candy could in itself be a PvP balance mechanism. If the legends are not subtle, then PvPers will quickly learn what at least the popular legends do and how to counter them.

Let`s just calm down and face it.
Revenant is not a good name to discribe a class. We can argue that it is not our call how to name things, but if we go by simple definition it is something someone aquires in life (or afterlife).
So aside from sounding cool and describing the events that happened to Rytlock, it is weird to look at it for a new class.

It is more akin to: “I am Rytlock the Reventant, because I came back from the Mists and have seen things, none of you will understand”

It is something new. It is something unique that happened to this one character in the lore.

We don`t even have to go further from here on. What kind of magic he is drawing from is irrelevant, simply because he is described as something entirely new to the world of Tyria.
He is the first of his kind.

The big questions is: How will they justify others running around with these new powers?

Possible solutions
- All Revenants have their own introduction which is set around HoT with Rytlocks return. This means all of them have their own special instance (think Deathknight in WoW, or what he is called)

- They don`t care about the timeline and just let you build one under the old narrative.

- You have to unlock him by playing the story (which still doesn`t work out the timeline issue)

- Rytlock, through the power of mists is able to timetravel and subsequently bestow the power of the mists upon chosen ones.

- Rytlock coming back awakened the powers in Tyria, allowing others to wield these powers.

Bottom Line
- The name is questionable in regards of definition and being part of the lore.
- The class while mechanicly interesting looses relevance in terms of the lore, due to the unique status it brings to the world.

These are things that don`t neccessary have to work together, but for the sake of immersion should.
We are missing too many informations about anything regarding this class, so if anything we are speculating anyway. Nevetheless, right now I have to raise an eyebrow on this class and hope for some propper explanations in the next months.

I want to say that Revenants channeling the powers of known legends is the most interesting thing about legends themselves. It leaves me very curious on how those legends will be re-imagined in GW2. If some legends were entirely new guys, without any lore or narrative that stood out behind them, it would leave me cold. They would just be randomly-named new guys I don’t care about. The concept of legends PLAYS on nostalgia. It just does.