Guild Wars 2

AESOkami.1072:

1. It felt too easy and too fast.

Keep in mind that the “Zhaitan campaign” consists of Battle of Claw Island until Victory or Death in the personal story. The Mordremoth campaign, however, consists of all of Season 2 and Heart of Thorns – easily double the size of the Zhaitan campaign.

Heart of Thorns isn’t the full Mordremoth campaign. It’s the second half of it. Arguably, it’s just the last quarter, with the first half being Season 1 (if one were to count the entire personal story as the Zhaitan campaign in comparison).

AESOkami.1072:

2.So many unanswered questions.

TBH, I feel that this is just shoddy writing.

AESOkami.1072:

Mordremoth loves surprises.
It’s obvious that he’s planning something big.

And he had plenty.

• When we tried to free Eir and Faolain, instead of the cage disappearing like the rest its destruction caused it to be flung way over yonder.
• Faolain was used not as a typical mordrem guard but more close to home.
• Trahearne was pulled away rather than be taken until it was too late. And then Mordremoth hid within Trahearne, whom in the story is a close friend of the PC.

AESOkami.1072:

4. No changes happened with the jungle.
Mordremoth is said to be the whole jungle. Yet when we finished attacking his mind, the jungle doesn’t decay into some swamp-like land or whatever. It remains exactly the same and full of life.

Orr remained full of risen, full of decay and decrepidness too, despite Zhaitan’s death.

Does this mean Zhaitan will return?

AESOkami.1072:

Not to mention the Mordrem still walk around the jungle and attack Verdant Brink at night like they usually do on a daily basis.

That’s a map stuck before Mordremoth’s death. Just like Orr maps are stuck in time before Zhaitan’s death – all core maps are.

If you expected to be ported into a second version of each map, you just set yourself up for disappoint.

However, unlike with mordrem, we were told that risen remain after Zhaitan’s death. It’s only likely that mordrem will remain after Mordremoths’ death too (which I believe is said to be true in the raid which takes palce post-HoT).

AESOkami.1072:

“Oh, but we fought Mordremoth’s physical form in Dragon’s Stand!”
No, we didn’t. The Mouth of Mordremoth is supposed to be an EXTENSION of the jungle dragon rather than the dragon himself. And Laranthir even yells “Commander!” during the fight. So it’s said to be that the PC participated in the fight along with dozens of other players. (Which brings up another question: Does the Pact have multiple commanders?)

The Mouth of Mordremoth is supposed to be the main body of Mordremoth, however, Mordremoth can regrow his body from his corruption is what Trahearne was saying. You have to either destroy all of his corruption – or as the dues ex machina revelation the PC had, kill his brain.

And yes, the Pact has dozens of Commanders. We hear Trahearne asking for three when we first meet him in Season 2.

AESOkami.1072:

And here’s something interesting: the devs pointed out that minions of Mordremoth can be cloned. We even saw what looked like Trahearne getting multiplied in the City of Hope cinematic. What if maybe, just maybe….the Trahearne we brought down wasn’t the actual Trahearne but rather a clone of him? …..Let’s save that theory for another time.

The idea is supposed to be that was what Mordremoth had planned. But as we saw with Logan and Zojja he didn’t have time to make those clones just yet.

Mordremoth was intending to create an army of Trahearnes, Logans, and Zojjas to attack the world. Probably Eirs and Faolains too but we put a stop to that too fast.

AESOkami.1072:

“Mordremoth just underestimated us!”
Wrong. Mordremoth knows that we were strong enough to kill Zhaitan. If he had underestimated us, then he wouldn’t have brought down the Pact fleet.

Did he really? He was asleep the entire time we killed Zhaitan, and do the other dragons take note of the other Elder Dragons’ actions and state of beings?

Further, it wasn’t the PC but the Pact that destroyed Zhaitan to all external knowledge (even if the PC played a major role, would this be so epitomized by an Elder Dragon?), and Mordremoth decimated the Pact. That would probably give a “hah, and Zhaitan had trouble with these flies?” mentality to an Elder Dragon. Especially since he took over all those sylvari, who were rather crucial to fighting Zhaitan (leaving no risen if killed).

TBH, I’d be rather disappointed if they brought back Mordremoth after the blatant catering to minor-but-super-vocal QQers about Trahearne.

Xehanort.7034:

you’re putting WAY too much thought into this. I’m willing to bet that anet just rushed the story because of some stupid reason, and added too many fragmented plot points and lore inconsistencies.

What about how every dragon has a weakness? we starved zhaitan to the ground, destroyed his army production site, and cooked him alive by firing LAVA at him after CUTTING HIS TAIL OFF.

And then there’s kralky: snaff forcibly grounded him via mind control, which let plenty of people wail on him. At least until logan happened.

Now, i’m no expert. But being the victim of such a severe guerrilla-tactic attack and then was shot at by lava, or being attacked by a group of people while being rendered completely immobile isn’t exactly a specific weakness unique to a single dragon.

Well, Kralk didn’t die, so there’s that, also Glint was there. It’s entirely possible that nothing would have gone differently even if Logan had been there. So none of that could be taken as a legitimate weakness since it ultimately didn’t work.

It’s reasonable to say that Zaitan’s weakness was the way he had to collect and consume food. Once weakened, giant laser beams based on the energy of a Krait artifact that repels dragon energy was enough to finish the job.

Keep in mind that all the Dream nonsense we do doesn’t actually kill Mordremoth, it just hurts him badly. Once weakened the combined effort of the Pact forces that systematically destroyed his cloning facilities and killed his mouth, and stabbing Trehearne finish the job.

The expansion is called “Heart” of Thorns. We didn’t kill his heart, so even if neutered I believe that it’s still beating somewhere.

After watching the Dragon’s Stand event (I haven’t played in a successful one yet) I would have to agree that Mordremoth is dead (or mostly dead at least); his physical “head” is the DS main boss, thus the statement about being distracted when the PC enters his mind in the story.

The story is obviously not over, however with the ley energy moving to Glint’s egg. Is it Mordy transferring himself? Or is it something new? Too many cliffhangers for this to be the end-end.

I’ve gotta agree with redux, I hope we haven’t encountered the “Heart of Thorns” yet.

Maybe now that Mordy’s mind has been shattered his physical form will become even more of a threat.
If not then I’ve gotta say I’m quite unimpressed with the story, not only in length but detail and script/writing.
I expected the initial content to take us to some kind of minor victory and figured raids and the LS season 3 would continue the fight, really hoping this wasn’t the climax to the expansion.

It’s not the end of HoT though, his mind could have been shattered and be inside his most powerful minions just like when Tequatl gathered Zhaitan energy, and when these will be dead, the energy will be absorbed by another elder dragon which will be this one:

Can you really kill the elder dragons? Looks to me they can only be defeated and seem to come back thousands of years later. Other races defeated them, but yet they always came back. I’m sure these races thought they killed them as well. So him planting a seed seems very plausible. Perhaps mordy will come back to restore another dragon. I would be angry being defeated so easily. And the perfect payback would be to imbue whatever power I had left to heal krakatorik. Since destiny’s edge failed in defeating that dragon.

Killing Mordremoth would never have resulted in all the Jungle wilting away. If all Elder Dragons were so connected to their minions existence then all Sylvari would have vanished with his death.

I think the egg and Mordremoth’s energy entering it going to have a big part in the future, what with the Pale Tree fading. Will the elder dragon be reborn? Or will Glint’s offspring carry the energy of the fallen dragon and take its place as the new hope for Sylvari?

To OP: I’m afraid the fact is HoT story was so badly developed and disappointing that it is hard to believe it has already ended – after all the hopes we had. You prefer to continue fooling youself? Don’t. YEARS has past and we got THIS shallow story. You want to wait another 2-3 years? After HoT I’m rather convinced ArenaNet is unable to deliver decent personal story anymore, that real story awaits in single player games. I just went to Hoelbrak and met Eir carving some stone. Hahahaha…

Interesting thoughts, I had similar thoughts on it. After beating ‘him’ I was quite sure that can’t be the end.

Also, if you read the last story section after finishing it, it says something along the lines of : we have to see what happens in the near future with those energy balls scattered across the jungle.

So what you’re saying is the safest bet is to put all Sylvari to the torch?

All I have to ask is… when do we start?

Vorpp did nothing wrong.

We need more Mordremoth #Modremothteam #Mordremothiseverywhere #Mordremothiseverything #Mordremothislife

Or maybe and just maybe, its lazy storytelling from below than average “video game” writers and you are reading too much into it.

But hey gotta justify those 50 bucks, right? It reminds me of the people waiting for the super secret epic ruse chapter 3 update for MGSV.

You will probably get some closure in future living world expansions. But dont expect too much. The game is not known for its great writing. Just have fun with the actual game, level up your masteries, explore the jungle (there is a ton of stuff to explore) and ignore the plot.

I think that those raids that are about to come, have something we might need to uncover the truth. Like every raid we do gives us hints about something bigger that is about to happen, and there will be one final mega event that will make us all participate to down Mordremoth in physical world instead of his chubby lizard form that we fought on a bad trip.

It’s over unless Thakery has a seed planted in him and which point WOOHOO!!! we get to kill Thakery!!!

Sylvari can’t be turned into Branded, Undead, or Corrupted which are all beings infused with the dragons will or whatnot. Primordious has his own deal the Destroyers that said there are no Mordrem controlled Chak and plenty of salt water under Tangled Depths(or fresh who knows it has Piranhas but also has Jellyfish and Tuna) and off the coast of Dragons Basin. So next Dragon might be Bubbles if the Chak are indeed his/her minions.

Mord’s fight was better than Zhatian but Zhatian’s had the theme and setting you actually felt like you had to fight to reach him. Also if Zhatian was parked next to Rata Sum he wouldn’t just leave it be like Mord Zhatian corrupted all the maps around him.

Doam.8305:

It’s over unless Thakery has a seed planted in him and which point WOOHOO!!! we get to kill Thakery!!!

Sylvari can’t be turned into Branded, Undead, or Corrupted which are all beings infused with the dragons will or whatnot. Primordious has his own deal the Destroyers that said there are no Mordrem controlled Chak and plenty of salt water under Tangled Depths(or fresh who knows it has Piranhas but also has Jellyfish and Tuna) and off the coast of Dragons Basin. So next Dragon might be Bubbles if the Chak are indeed his/her minions.

Mord’s fight was better than Zhatian but Zhatian’s had the theme and setting you actually felt like you had to fight to reach him. Also if Zhatian was parked next to Rata Sum he wouldn’t just leave it be like Mord Zhatian corrupted all the maps around him.

Maybe there’s a “seed” planted in Kasmeer.

AESOkami.1072:

1. It felt too easy and too fast.
At multiple times, the game says that Mordremoth is easily more powerful than Zhaitan.Yet with Zhaitan, it took a huge army along with foiling Risen spies, gaining artifacts that repelled dragon corruption, destroying it’s food and minion supply and lots of planning that felt like months to finally finish him off. With Mordremoth, we just had to leave our destroyed army behind, saw two people die, brought Glint’s egg to Tarir, discovered that apparently all the elder dragons have a weakness and took a small group of adventurers across the jungle to somehow waltz into the dream and poke Mordremoth’s mind AKA a big tubby lizard to death with our weapons. That’s just it. And it felt like just 3 days that this all happened with no effort.

Quite interesting, but this point stood out to me. Yes, it was “easy”, but for two reasons. First of all, Mordi overestimated his grip on the Sylvari, especially Trahearne and the potential Sylvari pact commander. “You shouldn’t have come here”, when you enter his domain. As far as I know, mind was Mordiboys domain? And yet, it was his weakness as well. By corrupting Trahearne he also gave him a little bit of control over this, a back door right to the dragon’s mind. And that was his first mistake.

The second reason for our success was the entire DS map meta event. See, this is essentially a Tolkien-esque Battle of the Black Gate. You know, when the rest of Gondor’s and Rohan’s armies and most of the Fellowship all pull up before the Black Gate to force Saurons hand, focus his gaze on them, bait all of his standing armies in Mordor, all while two Hobbit save the day. We – the player characters and Destiny’s Edge 2.0 – are pretty much the Tyrian equivalent to the two brave Hobbit in this case. He said something along the lines of “Armies cannot stop me!”. Yeah, they couldn’t. But they could distract him and all his main forces (i.e. his generals, the axe/blade/stave masters) long enough to destroy him from within.

So yes. It was easy because countless people suffered through DCs one the Dragon’s Stand map

Magnus Godrik.5841:

Can you really kill the elder dragons? Looks to me they can only be defeated and seem to come back thousands of years later. Other races defeated them, but yet they always came back. I’m sure these races thought they killed them as well. So him planting a seed seems very plausible. Perhaps mordy will come back to restore another dragon. I would be angry being defeated so easily. And the perfect payback would be to imbue whatever power I had left to heal krakatorik. Since destiny’s edge failed in defeating that dragon.

as far as current lore stays – previous “cycle” didn’t prevail agains elder dragons – the alliance of races was broken and said races barely managed to survive long enought until ED got back too sleep from lack of food

so yeah basically we are the very first that actually managed to kill off not only one but two of elder dragons.

btw. someone mentioned Glint’s Egg
have you noticed that energy from the mordy just blasted into the heart of heavilly protected Tarir and no one of its protector even seem to noticed?
isn;t it actually seem weird that the location for egg was meant so close to Mordy at all?

and what if it was actually meant to happen?
what if Glint predicted mordys fall and pointed that point for Tarir [and if the city itself was constructed in the way allowing] for the Egg to absorb Jungle dragon energy?

as far as we know for now Glints plan was to save sentient races from Elder dragon – wouldn’t creating own friendly dragon on power levels of ED suit it good enought for that purpose?

and then which domain would suit this task better than jungle dragon?
[undead dragon? crystal dragon? lava dragon? ice dragon? water dragon? right there is not better domain suited to PROTECT LIFE]

also such a development wouldn’t be anything new for AN – remember Abaddon and his replacement Kormir?

[that reminds me a book – I forgot the title – where the “goddess” of nature wants to wipe out humans because of harm to the nature they were doing but for doing so she needed to devour child who had incredible power – after all it ended out that said child devoured her taking over her domain and instead of trying to wipe out life focused on preserve and regrow of nature]

I wanted to make out whole new thred for this theory but then somhow I just can;t make it :P – so posted here

Have anyone noticed how similar this whole thing is to Diablo 3?

Glint’s egg reminds me of soulstones. It absorbs power of dead dragons, just like soulstones absorbed demons.

Kruczek.3865:

Have anyone noticed how similar this whole thing is to Diablo 3?

Glint’s egg reminds me of soulstones. It absorbs power of dead dragons, just like soulstones absorbed demons.

Nah, dragons eat magic. Baby gotta feed.

I would love to see a twist, because while it was a decent telling i felt like it was very straightfowards, like the tactics and path employed by the pact commander and her team was way too predictable for a being like Mordremoth. I feel like it was a little too much so to lead to instant success.

Although I admit I was often lamenting the fact that the very environment (if it was part of Mordremoth like suggested) could easily kill the team if it actually did something. But i tend to forgive stuff like that.

What’s stuck in my mind is, this is Heart of Thorns. The vision from the egg showed a Heart made of vines. We killed Mordremoth’s Mind and his Mouth but what about his heart? Was the heart automatically destroyed when we killed the mind? Does the heart even matter with the mind gone…wait, with the mind gone Mordremoth was still in Trahearne so....×.×. Does killing Trahearne means Mordremoth is truly gone, how many seeds can Mordremoth truly plant? He could have just made another copy of Faolin.

One thing that that has been bothering me is, we never saw what happen with Scarlet’s body. Is it still in the breachmaker or was it destroyed? I’m guessing, it was destroyed.

OP feedback time!

{I think he’s dead. Honestly, I thin ArenaNet is realizing that creating a story around 6 magical all powerful elder dragons and only having enough resources and manpower to release one expansion (and two LS seasons) in a 3 year timespan is gonna mean we won’t be rid of all of them for at least another ten years. This means they cannot take the story anywhere else because people will wonder, okay what about the dragons? Are we just going to do x story and pretend the elder dragons are taking a break? I excpect more rushed kills in the future because I’m sure they understand that releasing another 4 expansions in which we kill a dragon isn’t going to get really old really fast.}

Providing players with enough content is the point of running an MMO. If you don’t, then people will get bored and stop playing, and the company will go broke. That’s why having Mordy not truly gone would be a prefect opportunity for Arenanet. It would give us more interesting content along with a non-sucky story.

Also, it’s not just the EDs that we’ll be dealing with in the future. There’s dealing with the aftermath of the dragons, taking care of Glint’s kid, Cantha, After Cantha, Elona, After Elona and a bit more could be revealed in the future. That’s enough story content to last the game for 15 years or more.

{This is going to be the new “We didn’t kill Zhaitan” isn’t it}

You didn’t read Reason 1, did you?

{Completely agree with OP. I’ve said before Mordremoth dying on day 2 of “Heart of Thorns” Is like if Arthas was killed on day 2 of Wrath of the Lich King. If we actually did beat Mordremoth the writers really need to think about ways to make it much more convincing. Mordremoth had so many ways to easily prevent what happened so if it wasn’t a trap/plan that’s just some bad writing.
Or another comparison. Imaging if Sauron died in the first chapter of LotR. Or if Voldemort died in the first book of Harry Potter. What would you expect from the rest of the series? If Mordremoth is actually gone I will be extremely disappointed.}

^This.

{So, Scarlet, a mere living form and a puppet, a minion, makes a war that last for 1 or 2 years in real time, and this Elder so Powerful dragon, the real deal, the Big Boss, just struggle for a week? Seriously I need more of Mordremoth, we deserve this or the whole Heart of Thorns tittle lose all the sense. Maybe too early to complain? The time will tell then….I was having fun with the story, is a shame that “ended” this way.
Actually, the “fight” with Mordremoth took months if you follow the LS from the events that leads to Dry Top, at the start of Mordrem attacks, the tendrils invasions on other regions, waypoints destroyeds, and so on…
When the commander (you, me and everyone else) and his group made their way to find the Dragon, it was inevitable that an end wouldn’t happen, like the path on to lvl 0 to 80 then fighting Zaithan, unless Anet have something for us like Mordy still living, i think in future living stories, more secondary enemies will emerge, like Scarlet… even tied to Mordremoth.}

I don’t think Season 2 really counts as the ’’fight’’. It’s mostly dealing with the aftermath of Scarlet and learning about Mordremoth himself IMO. And you didn’t really do anything to weaken him rather than kill a bunch of his lesser minions (which he can easily summon more of), unlike Zhaitan.

{You probably need to realize that Mordy probably used a lot of ley-line energy to take down the Pact Fleet. Do you really think he didn’t use any energy at all? It’s like you having unlimited ammo and taking down the enemy without reloading. If that was the case, Mordy would have taken down Rata Sum and Divinity Reach without any issue as Mordy would be able to spawn hordes and hordes of Mordrem to overwhelm any army.
And from Sylvari players, it seem Mordy is continuously calling out to those Sylvari that did not get corrupted by the call. Do you really think that call does not use energy? Again, unlimited ammo situation again. And again, if that was the case, Mordy could just use it’s full power and continuously call out to all those Sylvari and continuously wear them down without any issues.}

Ok, lashing out at the Pact may have taken a his energy away, but he’s supposed to be the jungle itself. So doing that in his own playground must not have taken away much, and he could easily just consume more magic from the ley lines that he’s plugged into. As for the mordrem, I disagree. The dragons do this all the time with their servants. It should not take away any magic to simply tell a minion to ’’go stand over there and do this thing".

{you’re putting WAY too much thought into this. I’m willing to bet that anet just rushed the story because of some stupid reason, and added too many fragmented plot points and lore inconsistencies.
What about how every dragon has a weakness? we starved zhaitan to the ground, destroyed his army production site, and cooked him alive by firing LAVA at him after CUTTING HIS TAIL OFF.
And then there’s kralky: snaff forcibly grounded him via mind control, which let plenty of people wail on him. At least until logan happened.
Now, i’m no expert. But being the victim of such a severe guerrilla-tactic attack and then was shot at by lava, or being attacked by a group of people while being rendered completely immobile isn’t exactly a specific weakness unique to a single dragon.}

We didn’t do the same thing to Mordremoth as we did with Zhaitan, though. And for Kralkatorrik, Destiny’s Edge, a group of 6 people, had a big dragon helping them. We did not.

{The Mouth of Mordremoth is supposed to be the main body of Mordremoth, however, Mordremoth can regrow his body from his corruption is what Trahearne was saying. You have to either destroy all of his corruption – or as the dues ex machina revelation the PC had, kill his brain.}

I wouldn’t really call the Mouth of Mordremoth being the physical version of Mordremoth himself. Consider: If Zhaitan could have multiple mouths, then what’s stopping Mordy from doing the same?

{The idea is supposed to be that was what Mordremoth had planned. But as we saw with Logan and Zojja he didn’t have time to make those clones just yet.
Mordremoth was intending to create an army of Trahearnes, Logans, and Zojjas to attack the world. Probably Eirs and Faolains too but we put a stop to that too fast.}

Except Mordremoth is easily capable of cloning sylvari. Trahearne is a sylvari. Logan and Zojja are not. The reason why it took longer to make clones of them is because they aren’t sylvari. Also, we saw Trahearne getting multiplied in the egg cinematic and not Zojja/Logan.

Now for some things to add:
First off: I like the idea of the Pact Commander slowly becoming Mordremoth’s puppet without realizing it.Most of the Pact (and members of DE 2.0) could realize this and turn on you. Heck, one of the pact NPCs even says that the commander needs to stick around longer, so they might be starting to reflect that your doing a bad job. Take notes, Arenanet.

Second:The expansion is called Heart of Thorns and not Raids and Elite Specs:The Expansion or even Mind of Thorns. As reapex pointed out, the egg cinematic showed what seemed to be Mordremoth’s heart. We already beat up his mind and (one of) his mouth(s) but we didn’t kill his heart.(And the egg even showed a city with Mordremoth’s ’’influence’’ over it at the very end, which could foreshadow something later.)

Third: Arenanet and others kept saying ‘’Ohmygosh, you people NEED to make a sylvari! You’ll encounter prejudice from other pact members and hear Mordremoth speak to you!" But in the ’’story’’, we got prejudice from 3 pact members, got stunned a couple of times and heard Mordy speak for only 4 chapters (even then he doesn’t have much to say). That’s just pathetic.

Fourth: The HoT launch trailer. At the beginning, it showed what looked like Mordy’s foot, yet we never saw anything like that in the expansion. Not to mention the big viney creature (which I’m guessing will be either a raid boss or have something to do with LS) who appeared at the end.

I’m just sitting here praying that Arenanet’s writers aren’t as terrible as I fear they are. Because if they pull a ‘’welp the dragon is dead that’s it everyone go home’’ on us, I will be extremely furious. They only way that Anet can save this story now is a complete reboot, or a complete turnaround.

[PS I have no clue on how to quote multiple people in a reply as I don’t go to the forums often, so I just copied and pasted everyone that I wanted to answer to.]

The whole HoT story feels like it went by a little too fast, yes, but you have to consider nearly the entirety of Living Story thus far has been dealing with Mordremoth. Outside the Southsun happenings, Season 1 was about Mordremoth influencing a sylvari into awakening him early, Season 2 involved his rise, his immediate actions upon the world and the main characters starting to mobilize against him

HoT is us finally off to facing him in his own tuf before things get even worse than they already are. It’s the culmination of the last couple years of story. That we would fight and very possibly kill Mordremoth once and for all was something a lot of people predicted and should’ve seen coming

Not saying that you shouldn’t be disappointed, because you got a point with all the speeding along and hanging plot threads, but some of you are reading too hard into this. Just accept we did actually kill Mordremoth, just like how the game goes out of its way to prove that yes we did kill Zhaitan despite all the speculation

Besides, LS3 is definitely coming, so whatever happens just wait and see

don’t forget about the story raids will bring too =)

Felix.7586:

The whole HoT story feels like it went by a little too fast, yes, but you have to consider nearly the entirety of Living Story thus far has been dealing with Mordremoth. Outside the Southsun happenings, Season 1 was about Mordremoth influencing a sylvari into awakening him early, Season 2 involved his rise, his immediate actions upon the world and the main characters starting to mobilize against him

HoT is us finally off to facing him in his own tuf before things get even worse than they already are. It’s the culmination of the last couple years of story. That we would fight and very possibly kill Mordremoth once and for all was something a lot of people predicted and should’ve seen coming

Not saying that you shouldn’t be disappointed, because you got a point with all the speeding along and hanging plot threads, but some of you are reading too hard into this. Just accept we did actually kill Mordremoth, just like how the game goes out of its way to prove that yes we did kill Zhaitan despite all the speculation

Besides, LS3 is definitely coming, so whatever happens just wait and see

Yea, well, that’s good and everything but there’s something no too “friendly” about that. I have some friends that are new playing gw2 and they are interested in the story, but they are mad because they can’t play it completely right now. There’s no way to play Season 1 and I don’t know why, they are selling season 2.

Maybe at that time it has some sense, but right now, they should just unlock all the chapters so new players and old ones that don’t have them, can play that important part of the story, story that, is like you said, part of the story of this expansion, expansion that is a FAST conclusion of a story that was in development through this years (still waiting to be able to play season 1). I mean, I know they have to make money, but, charge for play the story? Help us with this Arenanet please.

MeNDoX.8031:

Maybe at that time it has some sense, but right now, they should just unlock all the chapters so new players and old ones that don’t have them, can play that important part of the story, story that, is like you said, part of the story of this expansion, expansion that is a FAST conclusion of a story that was in development through this years (still waiting to be able to play season 1). I mean, I know they have to make money, but, charge for play the story? Help us with this Arenanet please.

I don’t see the issue with Anet charging for LS2. It’s additional content that is entirely optional. If you don’t want to or can’t buy it, you’re free to read a summary or watch a Let’s Play. If you want to go through it yourself, why shouldn’t Anet receive compensation for their work? There was an opportunity for players to unlock it for free, but if a player missed that opportunity for whatever reason, that doesn’t mean Anet has to give it away for free forever. I think being able to unlock it for gems is a pretty reasonable compromise actually… again, it’s not required and you don’t have to buy it.

Yes there is more than one commander of the Pact.
In LS2 I belive Chapter 8, 2nd to last mission Trahere is waiting for one of the commanders. He even named him/her by the name.

Its the mission where pact sets off. Its right before the mordrem attack Camp Resolve in silverwastes

1. Mord is dead. You need to accept it; Trahearne and the other party Sylvari confirmed it.

2. If Mord’s power (significant portion) has been absorbed by the egg , what we really need to understand is where did Zhaitan’s power go? That’s the BIG HUGE GAPING plot hole in the several smaller plot lines/questions (who is ‘E"?, how did we make the leap of faith that Dream was the weakness?, what’s the reason for the vision of Zhaitan/Mord orbs colliding in LS@?, etc.) story continuity issues.

Don’t expect a LS3 for quite some time/never again. That ship has sailed.

Artaz.3819:

1. Mord is dead. You need to accept it; Trahearne and the other party Sylvari confirmed it.

2. If Mord’s power (significant portion) has been absorbed by the egg , what we really need to understand is where did Zhaitan’s power go? That’s the BIG HUGE GAPING plot hole in the several smaller plot lines/questions (who is ‘E"?, how did we make the leap of faith that Dream was the weakness?, what’s the reason for the vision of Zhaitan/Mord orbs colliding in LS@?, etc.) story continuity issues.

Don’t expect a LS3 for quite some time/never again. That ship has sailed.

Actually i think i kinda figured it out earlier, but i dont know if posted in this thread about it

Glints egg is absorbing the death energys from the deaths of all the elder dragons, it just absorbed Zhaitans off screen, and when it gets all six of the energys, a new much more powerful elder dragon will be born. purely speculation of course, but its interesting to think about, if its true!

Juular.4729
Hows your repackaged DLC going.

It’s going just great. Even this ending which should be viewed in totality, not just the last fight

Repackaged DLC is only a crime when it was already in game and then dissected and resold to us…ala Bungie.

The expansion was rushed. There is more to come, but Mordremoth is dead. People can come up with convincing ideas on how things will continue, but unless there is really solid evidence (i.e. Braham, Eir and the Dragonhunter elite spec); then they’re as good as a bad fanfic.

Eir shouldnt die for sake of some longbow for guardians. But if they went that way why they dont revitalize her with druid magic and in the same time introducing this class. That would be awesome and would leave more ppl satisfyed, I’m sure of it becasue there is a lot of Eir fans out there that are not accepting her demise. Whats done is done they say but I have so much hope ANET will bring back her somehow:). PLS SIR COLIN!

Zabiyaka.2567:

Eir shouldnt die for sake of some longbow for guardians. But if they went that way why they dont revitalize her with druid magic and in the same time introducing this class. That would be awesome and would leave more ppl satisfyed, I’m sure of it becasue there is a lot of Eir fans out there that are not accepting her demise. Whats done is done they say but I have so much hope ANET will bring back her somehow:). PLS SIR COLIN!

As per ANet, the spec is based on the plot point and not the other way around. Development on elite specs seemingly didn’t start until very recently, so any of them lining up with characters is more of a coincidence than anything.

Eir died for some short lived drama and so Braham would shave his head. Nothing more.

So I have the exact same feelings right now as i did when I completed the Zhaitan fight at the end of the OG release, only… worse.

The PS was so short, so easy, a handful of hours and the entire story is over. Compare that to the massive story and grind to go from 0-80 and kill zhaitain, at least when that boss fight was (lets be honest) underwhelming, we could say, but the journey was awesome.

This time I just feel let down. Anet, please. You have such great ideas, but just like the freaking Deus Ex Machina airship that saved our kittens in the first dragon fight, being able to magically use a rift to tear open the dragons mind… wasn’t even close to satisfying… and he really wasnt ever even a dragon…

whatever, I am holding out for PS3, but it’s likely this will be the last money I ever spend on gw2, which is sad, because I wanted SOO MUCH for it to be good

In regards to point 1, the Dragon’s Stand meta event takes place at the same time. The Mouth of Mordremoth is his physical body. That’s there your epic Elder Dragon fight is. Admittedly, the PS does a poor job of elaborating on this.

OP here. I found another reason as to why Mordremoth isn’t dead.

7.No one in your party got corrupted.
Arenanet stated that if any sylvari gets too close to the dragon, they WILL become mordrem. No exceptions. Yet when we simply waltzed into his “epicenter”, Caithe and Canach (and your sylvari character) didn’t become corrupt or showed signs of it. Not even Trahearne, who retained himself until the very end. Though we were in Mordremoth’s "center’’ for a couple of weeks and in his BRAIN….we STILL didn’t turn into his slaves. You don’t even have an excuse when an effing HERO POINT establishes this.

Daralii.8940:

Zabiyaka.2567:

Eir shouldnt die for sake of some longbow for guardians. But if they went that way why they dont revitalize her with druid magic and in the same time introducing this class. That would be awesome and would leave more ppl satisfyed, I’m sure of it becasue there is a lot of Eir fans out there that are not accepting her demise. Whats done is done they say but I have so much hope ANET will bring back her somehow:). PLS SIR COLIN!

As per ANet, the spec is based on the plot point and not the other way around. Development on elite specs seemingly didn’t start until very recently, so any of them lining up with characters is more of a coincidence than anything.

Eir died for some short lived drama and so Braham would shave his head. Nothing more.

That is such a massive load it’s amazing it even fits on these forums.

Braham is a Guardian. Braham assisted in taking down an Elder Dragon and is planning to move forward with Elder Dragon extermination. Eir used a bow which is now in the hands of her son. Dragonhunter is a Guardian spec that uses a bow and has some connection to hunting dragons.

That’s not a coincidence, that is premeditated.

AESOkami.1072:

OP here. I found another reason as to why Mordremoth isn’t dead.

7.No one in your party got corrupted.
Arenanet stated that if any sylvari gets too close to the dragon, they WILL become mordrem. No exceptions. Yet when we simply waltzed into his “epicenter”, Caithe and Canach (and your sylvari character) didn’t become corrupt or showed signs of it. Not even Trahearne, who retained himself until the very end. Though we were in Mordremoth’s "center’’ for a couple of weeks and in his BRAIN….we STILL didn’t turn into his slaves. You don’t even have an excuse when an effing HERO POINT establishes this.

Mordremoth’s full attention and power was not on your characters, he legitimately could not corrupt you without causing himself some serious problems in the battle at Dragon’s Stand outside. So he had to keep his energy divided, and his best chance of corrupting anybody could only happen when one or both sides were taken out. But the battle raged on outside, and we entered his section of The Dream to defeat him.

If you took Canach with you, you’ll notice that during his fight he outright states that he cannot fight back anymore after 25%, he didn’t have the resistance to Mordremoth enough to fight his corrupted illusion and avoid being taken over, so he left the illusion to us to avoid being taken over, signs that any sylvari who isn’t a firstborn may have problems. Caithe meanwhile has no problems, which we can assume is due to her being a Firstborn, thus she has more of the Pale Tree’s protection by being one of the first children she passed her magic to. This also explains why Trahearne held out as long as he did. The only excuse our PC has as a sylvari for avoiding this is that we held Glint’s egg, it gave us its energy at one point, and chose us to defend it. It gave us more resistance to his corruption.

The only time Mordremoth had enough power to corrupt anybody close was when both his body and his mind were taken out, meaning both battles were won. The only place left he was in at this point was inside Trahearne, so it was a concentrated source. But we destroyed him here.

There are no exceptions to being corrupted if Mordremoth is at full power, but he had to handle an army at his mouth while dealing with some of the most powerful fighters in the world in his head. He couldn’t do both at once.

RyuDragnier.9476:

AESOkami.1072:

OP here. I found another reason as to why Mordremoth isn’t dead.

7.No one in your party got corrupted.
Arenanet stated that if any sylvari gets too close to the dragon, they WILL become mordrem. No exceptions. Yet when we simply waltzed into his “epicenter”, Caithe and Canach (and your sylvari character) didn’t become corrupt or showed signs of it. Not even Trahearne, who retained himself until the very end. Though we were in Mordremoth’s "center’’ for a couple of weeks and in his BRAIN….we STILL didn’t turn into his slaves. You don’t even have an excuse when an effing HERO POINT establishes this.

Mordremoth’s full attention and power was not on your characters, he legitimately could not corrupt you without causing himself some serious problems in the battle at Dragon’s Stand outside. So he had to keep his energy divided, and his best chance of corrupting anybody could only happen when one or both sides were taken out. But the battle raged on outside, and we entered his section of The Dream to defeat him.

If you took Canach with you, you’ll notice that during his fight he outright states that he cannot fight back anymore after 25%, he didn’t have the resistance to Mordremoth enough to fight his corrupted illusion and avoid being taken over, so he left the illusion to us to avoid being taken over, signs that any sylvari who isn’t a firstborn may have problems. Caithe meanwhile has no problems, which we can assume is due to her being a Firstborn, thus she has more of the Pale Tree’s protection by being one of the first children she passed her magic to. This also explains why Trahearne held out as long as he did. The only excuse our PC has as a sylvari for avoiding this is that we held Glint’s egg, it gave us its energy at one point, and chose us to defend it. It gave us more resistance to his corruption.

The only time Mordremoth had enough power to corrupt anybody close was when both his body and his mind were taken out, meaning both battles were won. The only place left he was in at this point was inside Trahearne, so it was a concentrated source. But we destroyed him here.

There are no exceptions to being corrupted if Mordremoth is at full power, but he had to handle an army at his mouth while dealing with some of the most powerful fighters in the world in his head. He couldn’t do both at once.

You’ve got it wrong. It’s the influence that the dragons radiate that corrupts, rather then the dragons acting themselves.
Look at Zhaitan. Any dead body that came in touch with his influence immediately became a risen even though he didn’t react at all.

If they pull a surprises, he’s not dead. It would be the worst thing they could do. If I kill something, I expect it to stay dead. not brought back in some cheesy way, because of some weak story idea, or lack there of.

An edit to number 4: The place in Dragon’s Stand where you do Hearts and Minds is still there even when you finish the quest. You can tell it’s the aftermath of it because Destiny’s Edge 2.0 has different dialogue if you talk to them.

There is a suspicion going around that Heart of Thorns is only half the content we were promised.. and a large chunk of it was cut out and reserved for Living World Season 3

Im not saying it’s true or not.. just something I heard and thought was worth sharing

I still feel that this story wasn’t the true end, is too simple no? It was to easy to kill him. I the story didn’t give us the right ending like with Zhaitan. And I have to many questions too.

(My character is a sylvari)
So first of all what happen with the pale tree? Is she okay?
Trahearne and Caithe they were close but I didn’t saw Caithe being upset with Trahearne dead, I was really upset and I even cried, and I don’t hate caithe for the stuff that she did, in fact I wanted to know her reasons, I am a sylvari and caithe and Trahearn were of course the npcs that my character have more contact too. I feel Caithe as a big sister and Trahearne too. When caithe did what she did I was like: ‘’Are you serious caithe? Why? I’m your best friend right? Why you don’t say what is happen why you don’t trust me?’’

I wish I could choose more how my character react to the events especially in the speech. Because she doesn’t react how I feel and see the story. When I had to kill Trahearne I was really like ‘’what? Noo!’’

But well, I want to know what happen to Zodja and Logan and where is Taimi? And what happen to the egg and the pale tree.

I feel that my character should participate in a funeral to Eir and Trahearne. I was really upset about Eir too.

And where is the final feast to commemorate the end of Mordremoth.

I kinda think that the Theory of the OP can be possible. About Trahearne being a clone I don’t know and I don’t think so.

I love the story of GW2 I just wanted more freedom about choosing the speech like in others game we always have like three options to choose. And my character is suppose to be charming and I feel that the charming or furosity and dignity thing doesn’t do any difference to my character personality.

AnimangaGirl.5348:

(My character is a sylvari)
So first of all what happen with the pale tree? Is she okay?
Trahearne and Caithe they were close but I didn’t saw Caithe being upset with Trahearne dead, I was really upset and I even cried, and I don’t hate caithe for the stuff that she did, in fact I wanted to know her reasons, I am a sylvari and caithe and Trahearn were of course the npcs that my character have more contact too. I feel Caithe as a big sister and Trahearne too.

So now imagine that your character is a Norn, Eir is your freakin favourite over favourites character. Your main character is her clone. And now expansion for your favourite everyday played game since over 2 years is released. You have so much fun with it. Untill obvious moment that made GW2 blunt and pointless for you -_-’

The way I see it, based on what happened in the open world stories and the story instance itself, plus the final cinematic, Mordremoth is pretty much dead. The explosion of magic, which went in four different directions (and only one of those was absorbed by Glint’s Egg in Tarir), shows that Mordremoth was struck a fatal blow as Elder Dragons don’t let magic out in such vast quantities unless something bad happened to them. Where the three other lines of magic went remains unknown for now, but at least one may have gone to Bubbles the Deep Sea Dragon.

The writers could always try to retcon it by stating later that Mordremoth hid his seed in someone else than just Trahearne, but this seems unlikely to me, considering how big a deal the story made about the Trahearne revelation as well as Mordremoth’s angry/shocked gasp of “What have you done?” when you strike the final blow and kill his vessel Trahearne which was, according to the story, meant to be the dragon’s last hiding place after both his physical manifestation (the Mouth) and his mind (in the Dream) were dealt severe blows.

What we could potentially see regarding the mordrem is to have one or more of Mordremoth’s champions absorb the released magic from their dragon master just like Glint’s egg absorbed one fourth of it already. It would be similar to Tequatl who also grew stronger after his dragon master’s demise by leeching on the magic released from Zhaitan’s demise. That way Mordremoth’s legacy would continue as one or more mordrem champions would begin competing with Glint’s Egg over who gets to ascend to become the new Jungle Dragon, assuming that’s the story direction Anet wanted to go for. That in turn would lead us as the Commander to slay these would-be candidates to ensure that the magic wasn’t abused and Glint’s baby would have no serious competition for the title of Elder Dragon.

Whether any of the raids or Living World season 3 touches on this type of story development remains to be seen, however, or if they choose to go a different route. At least based on what we’ve learned of the upcoming Spirit Vale raid so far, the focus seems to be more on the bandits (with a potential link to White Mantle) as well as whatever soul stuff Gorseval (the Tongue Boss Guy) is linked to and if the Bloodstones will play any part in it.

AESOkami.1072:

I wouldn’t really call the Mouth of Mordremoth being the physical version of Mordremoth himself. Consider: If Zhaitan could have multiple mouths, then what’s stopping Mordy from doing the same?

What differentiates the Mouths of Zhaitan from the Mouth of Mordremoth is that the Mouths of Zhaitan were risen minions specialized in feeding the magic to their master by absorbing artifacts and whatnot, which explains why multiple Mouths existed at the same time in the Zhaitan campaign. In contrast there is only one Mouth of Mordremoth which is, essentially, directly grown and linked to Mordremoth in a gigantic vine body, which effectively makes it Mordremoth’s physical manifestation in Dragon’s Stand.

During the final battle in Dragon’s Stand, you hear the Mouth of Mordremoth speak multiple times and react to damage done to his mouth, and in the chat window it’s always named Mordremoth. Not only that, but several Pact NPCs refer to the Mouth as either Mordremoth or the Elder/Jungle Dragon, which further proves that the Mouth of Mordremoth is not simply a specialized mordrem but an extension of the Elder Dragon himself.

Artaz.3819:

1. Mord is dead. You need to accept it; Trahearne and the other party Sylvari confirmed it.

2. If Mord’s power (significant portion) has been absorbed by the egg , what we really need to understand is where did Zhaitan’s power go? That’s the BIG HUGE GAPING plot hole in the several smaller plot lines/questions (who is ‘E"?, how did we make the leap of faith that Dream was the weakness?, what’s the reason for the vision of Zhaitan/Mord orbs colliding in LS@?, etc.) story continuity issues.

It’s implied, but not outright stated, that Tequatl the Sunless absorbed at least some of the magic that was leaking out of Zhaitan’s fallen body, which explains why Tequatl got stronger during Living World season 1 when that boss fight was revamped. The devs did state back then that the power boost wasn’t random and that there was a lore reason for it but never elaborated on it afterwards, so us fans had to piece the clues together from scraps of information given to us during LW S1 and S2. What happened to the rest of the magic that must’ve come out of Zhaitan’s body after his death, however, is a mystery, although it’s possible that some of it may have gone to some of the other Elder Dragons (e.g. Kralkatorrik, Bubbles).

Let’s not forget that he likely resurrected Scarlet.

TheHeretic.3529:

Let’s not forget that he likely resurrected Scarlet.

I will lose my kittens, all of them, if they pull this.

TheHeretic.3529:

Let’s not forget that he likely resurrected Scarlet.

I don’t think we’ll ever see Scarlet again. Arenanet’s done enough with her already.

I see a lot of people saying how the Mordremoth was focused on the battle outside so he wasn’t aware of your presence, and yet when you get to Trahearne and decide to attack his mind you hear his growl and Canach says that he understands what you want to do. Which implies he was aware of you and was tracking your progress the whole time. As for the Mouth, yes, it was his physical body, but considering that he is immortal as long as his mind is intact he could’ve simply abandon the Mouth and focus completely on your character. He can regrow another Mouth anyway. If it even is true that he has to divide his presence between you and the fight outside.

Love the expansion, but the story is lame. With Zhaitan we had to weaken him completely before taking him on, but with Mordremoth, and it’s said that he could be stronger that Zhaitan, we just bash in the Jungle, slash, burn, stomp, suddenly Rata Novus and their research on the dragons out of the blue, some more slashing and we’re done, with no explanation what happened to Taimi, what happened to Kass and the company etc. I would like that the beginning of S3 would show us celebrating Mordremoth’s defeat and then Taimi shows up with bad news (in my case, good news). Or something like that.