Guild Wars 2

Vayne.8563:

But a thread that says the expansion is falling apart, particularly a few weeks before a big patch is coming out to answer some of the complaints is at least a bit premature.

premature?? It’s been 5 months. And what big patch is coming out to answer some of the complaints???

What will there be in that patch that will answer some of our complain?

- WvW patch? The beta of that will maybe be up after that patch, not with that patch. We are still months aways from that complaints being answered.

- LS3? Nope. That will be in july.

- The last 2 legendary weapons? The way they talked, they are not yet finished. My bet is that they will be in the game in July

- Fractal leaderboard? Suspended

- New Fractals. Nope, they said they are not ready.

- Reworking Fractal instability? They say, they are on an early stage so no.

- Reworking agony? No, early stage only.

So what will be this April Update? Profession balance, some change to HoT Maps, but so far we only know that they will add a HoT daily and make adventure more accessible. Maybe some change to fractal, but they will be minor, maybe a 4th daily and more ascended drop? Maybe we will have the legendary back item finally.

April Update will probably bring a lot of small improve, but most problem from HoT will still be there.

Thaddeus.4891:

Vayne.8563:

But a thread that says the expansion is falling apart, particularly a few weeks before a big patch is coming out to answer some of the complaints is at least a bit premature.

premature?? It’s been 5 months. And what big patch is coming out to answer some of the complaints???

What will there be in that patch that will answer some of our complain?

- WvW patch? The beta of that will maybe be up after that patch, not with that patch. We are still months aways from that complaints being answered.

- LS3? Nope. That will be in july.

- The last 2 legendary weapons? The way they talked, they are not yet finished. My bet is that they will be in the game in July

- Fractal leaderboard? Suspended

- New Fractals. Nope, they said they are not ready.

- Reworking Fractal instability? They say, they are on an early stage so no.

- Reworking agony? No, early stage only.

So what will be this April Update? Profession balance, some change to HoT Maps, but so far we only know that they will add a HoT daily and make adventure more accessible. Maybe some change to fractal, but they will be minor, maybe a 4th daily and more ascended drop? Maybe we will have the legendary back item finally.

April Update will probably bring a lot of small improve, but most problem from HoT will still be there.

Because five months in game development is forever. lol

Vayne.8563:

Because five months in game development is forever. lol

Because the expansion was suppose to improve the current content, not cripple half of it because waiting 6 to 12 months to just fix it.

Thaddeus.4891:

Vayne.8563:

Because five months in game development is forever. lol

Because the expansion was suppose to improve the current content, not cripple half of it because waiting 6 to 12 months to just fix it.

But there are people who enjoyed the expansion. There’s a post on reddit right now with a guy saying he enjoyed the expansion with over 100 upvotes. Yes the expansion has flaws but there are still people enjoying it.

No one really knows the percentage of people actually dissatisfied with it, or how dissatisfied they are.

I have my reactions to the expansion too, but I don’t think it made the game worse. I don’t think most raiders think it made the game worse either. I think a lot of people think that gliding made the game better.

Even something like Fractals, I bet there are more people doing Fractals now then there were before the changes.

It’s all very nice to say it made everything worse, but it really didn’t. And if most of the stuff if fixed in the April patch, I’m not sure six months is a huge wait for major change either.

People want no grind, but a great reward. Then again they want to have something to do, but not too much for a reward. When they get no reward, they are bored though. If they are bored, they tell you there’s nothing to do although there is something to do, but grindy, which nets the reward. There is no solution for everyone.

I can only agree on one thing on this expansion what’s general consensus: it’s too little content. Far too few maps: usually you expect 6-8 new zones, new small party content like dungeons and – in this case – new fractals. Big MMOs generally add 5-8 new dungeons. And 2 raids. New PvP modes, professions etc.

We only got professions and a guild hall, one PvP mode. Which is okay. But the PvE content is very lackluster.

Here’s a hint about knowing who is and isn’t happy: dissatisfied players stopped playing and don’t post on forums where they don’t play. Happy players typically play the game and don’t post. Unhappy players still play, somewhat, and tend to be more vocal in their disappointing . . . because they’re still holding out for hope.

Just because you and your friends are happy doesn’t mean everyone lives in that bubble. Threads like that prove it out. And the backlash from that other thread and negative comments from hardcore supporters like Wooden Potatoes are the proverbial cherry atop this mess.

Everything gets overhyped these days, even negative news. There doesn’t seem to be a middle ground, either the building is falling apart and on fire or things will be super amazing to the point of high pitch screaming.

I would just say the expansion is mediocre.
Some people are happy some people are disappointed.
That’s really all it is.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Here’s a hint about knowing who is and isn’t happy: dissatisfied players stopped playing and don’t post on forums where they don’t play. Happy players typically play the game and don’t post. Unhappy players still play, somewhat, and tend to be more vocal in their disappointing . . . because they’re still holding out for hope.

Just because you and your friends are happy doesn’t mean everyone lives in that bubble. Threads like that prove it out. And the backlash from that other thread and negative comments from hardcore supporters like Wooden Potatoes are the proverbial cherry atop this mess.

I think their server population is dropping at an alarming rate, which is why Colin is gone and they are trying to rebuild the game with a second expansion. The next expansion will probably be titled "Guild Wars 2 “A Realm Reborn”.

I was one of the most addicted and dedicated fan, I pre-orderred HoT the minute I could even if I thought 50$ was 20$ more than what I wanted to invest, I had saved 4k gold for it and got character slots, transferred servers a dozen times for WvW using real money, and Anet managed to completely disappoint me and make me leave he game just after the xpac was released. What a short-sighted failure on their part to rush out an unfinished product with a super high price tag. They’ll lose that money in the long-term.

It was never really all there together anyways- half-baked , half- an expansion (Sorry MO – it is – in this case the Customer is Always RIGHT even when they are wrong !! Didnt they teach you that one ?
Ah – yeah you dont work in Retail – you work in IT).

Funny thing is CORE Tyria takes me longer to complete than HOT.
So CORE Tyria > HOT IMO – the Hours I spend in CORE > HOT.
The Hours I need to complete CORE > HOT.
The cost of CORE vs HOT = Same on Release.

So CORE > HOT.

HoT was a major fail.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Here’s a hint about knowing who is and isn’t happy: dissatisfied players stopped playing and don’t post on forums where they don’t play. Happy players typically play the game and don’t post. Unhappy players still play, somewhat, and tend to be more vocal in their disappointing . . . because they’re still holding out for hope.

Just because you and your friends are happy doesn’t mean everyone lives in that bubble. Threads like that prove it out. And the backlash from that other thread and negative comments from hardcore supporters like Wooden Potatoes are the proverbial cherry atop this mess.

I agree with this. The forum will always be inundated with people claiming that because THEY love everything about this game, there is obviously no real concerns going on. Well, for all the people excusing Anet’s recent decision by hinting that the company must be having financial problems, guess what? If they’re having financial problems at all, it’s not because everyone is so blinking happy.

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Just because you and your friends are happy doesn’t mean everyone lives in that bubble. Threads like that prove it out. And the backlash from that other thread and negative comments from hardcore supporters like Wooden Potatoes are the proverbial cherry atop this mess.

And just because you and your friends aren’t happy doesn’t mean the game is going to kitten. You said yourself, the only people who are particularly vocal are the ones who are dissatisfied, but not enough to just take a break. Which essentially means they just haven’t gotten their priorities in order, and are still willing to force themselves to do something they don’t enjoy because of some ridiculous notion of “loyalty” that simply doesn’t exist.

If the expansion was fine Anet would not need to assign a quarterly update to fixing it.

If the expansion was fine Anet would not need to announce cessation of development of aspects of it.

Falling apart does seem to have a touch of hyperbole though

Andred.1087:

Ardenwolfe.8590:

Just because you and your friends are happy doesn’t mean everyone lives in that bubble. Threads like that prove it out. And the backlash from that other thread and negative comments from hardcore supporters like Wooden Potatoes are the proverbial cherry atop this mess.

And just because you and your friends aren’t happy doesn’t mean the game is going to kitten. You said yourself, the only people who are particularly vocal are the ones who are dissatisfied, but not enough to just take a break. Which essentially means they just haven’t gotten their priorities in order, and are still willing to force themselves to do something they don’t enjoy because of some ridiculous notion of “loyalty” that simply doesn’t exist.

You make illogical assumptions here. Dissatisfaction doesn’t equal zero enjoyment. It doesn’t mean all dissatisfied players are “forcing” themselves to play. I mean, seriously? This has nothing to do with “priorities.” I’ve been annoyed by a lot of things in this game, all while still very much enjoying what I did choose to play. So…yeah. This makes no sense.

Xillllix.3485:

I think their server population is dropping at an alarming rate, which is why Colin is gone and they are trying to rebuild the game with a second expansion. The next expansion will probably be titled "Guild Wars 2 “A Realm Reborn”.

These made-up reasons of why Colin left are getting sillier and sillier.

Maybe it’s just to fit the situation, but still.

Andred.1087:

And just because you and your friends aren’t happy doesn’t mean the game is going to kitten.

This is true. Me and my friends are unhappy because it’s going to kitten. People don’t make up threads like this because everything is rainbows and unicorns, you know?. But, to be fair, most of my friends have started to play something else.

Myself included. Just logging in, getting my dailies, and logging right back out.

I know that can’t be what ANet wants, but we’ll see if they can get back on track. The expansion was a trainwreck. No question. Many of us saw it coming, but many others said otherwise. That the expansion would ‘be awesome with years and years of content.’

Funny. I don’t see them post anymore. Do you?

Antinegative.4872:

Right after the initial release of HoT, initial sentiment is that there is a lack of content, some being incomplete. However, people held onto hope as they waited for the coming future releases to fill out what’s missing. Instead, it seems like more and more stuff is getting delayed or outright gutted instead.

First, there were only 4 new zones in a expansion, and one of which is badly balanced and is little played. The rest 3 zones features only major meta events instead of small quests such as hearts that are all geared toward getting components for the coming legendarie weapons. Then you have the 2 newly raid zones, whose rewards are heavily direct toward collecting parts for the coming legendary armors. There was also 0 new dungeons in the expansion, and the only dungeons revamped are fractals, whose ultimate reward is the legendary backpack Ad Infinitum.

But right now, Ad Infinitum is not in the game, nor is mentioned when will be released. Legendary armor doesn’t seem anywhere close to being introduced, and you just outright cancelled the majority of the rest of the legendary weapons. So what you have now in the expansion is a heavily revamped dungeon that promises no end item, a new feature called raid whose rewards doesn’t exist(and by the look of things, might possibly not exist at all), and 3 major zones where people grinded endlessly for items that are never gonna happen.

As a long time MMO player, I’d like to remind you the most important thing in a RPG game is not the story, not the combat, not the social system, it’s the reward. The game needs everything mentioned above to be a good game, but you should get your priorities straight. No storyline is amazing enough that it will keep players coming back day after day, months after months to play the same quests, and no combat system is great enough for players to hack away at the same old monsters for hundreds, some times thousands of hours over and over. Everyone keeps playing the same content again and again because we are all chasing that pot of gold at the end of the rainbow(whether we ever get to it is another story, but at least we are all trying). So seriously, stop making dumb moves, please. Jesus.

First of all,hello to you.

Second,this is what i was saying to the people.In respond i got “don’t qq,don’t this,don’t that” And most annoying answer “if you do not like,leave” Well,leaving,is not the answer.Answer is finding solution.It is true,you can’t please everyone,and someone is going to complain no matter what,but…

If you have 50% unsatisfied customers,then something is wrong.

Arena Net said they are going to do things differently,and they wont do things other companies doing.That obviously is not working.They did things differently indeed,but in worst possible way.

I haven’t played before HoT too much.I bought GW2 when it came out and stopped couple months before HoT.2 days before HoT,i came back,and asked people in guild chat about things they adding in HoT.Never liked reading patch and update notes.

I asked guildies what’s profession level is going to be,which new dungeons they adding and if someone can link me new armors.People laughed at me.I had no idea they wont adding those stuff.In every mmo game i played,that’s main thing you add,besides new map.I played 3 different mmo’s,so i got use to MAJOR changes when comes to expansion,not minor patch.

They wanted to do things in a different way,so they excluded every single major thing,every expansion should have.Indeed its new way of doing things,because i haven’t seen game without new armor,new weapons and new dungeons.

We got couple items (horrible looking ones) Ley line set,bladed set,auric weapons and that’s it.

We got no new dungeon or new fractals.

We got 4 gold farming SW lookalike maps.What’s even worse,in sw you can earn 20/20+ gold in hour,in new maps you can’t earn even 5 gold in one hour.

After you complete maps with one character,you get bored and most people,including me,got no intention entering any of those maps no more.Especially those people who got max mastery level 1 month after game came out.What to do for next 10 months?(if we are going to have expansion every year)God help us if that is not the case,and we get next one in 3 years.

No one forced me to get max mastery level in one month?Indeed,but i wanted Nevermoore so i had no option.I want to do it and i do not want to do it,is removed from game.You must do it.

They had good marketing for HoT,and they lied a lot,that’s what sold their expansion.I just hope people wont be naive next expansion,as they were this one,including me.

What i cant understand is their bravery to lie like that in order to sell expansion.I have feeling they didn’t think what’s going to be after they sell HoT.

Me personally bought game because of reaper and new legendary items.Now,no more legendary items,so i got lied to.They made multi million dollar scam,and someone should pay for that.

I can’t understand how someone can defend them,and that’s what a lot people doing after they said no more lege items.If you do not care about legendary,someone else does.We are in same hole of lies,you ain’t any better than me,nor i am any better than you.We are in this together.You defending arena net,just because you like hot,doesn’t mean they will love you more,or they will say ’good guy",NO,they will laugh at you with these exact words “Look at this fool,we lied to them,they defending us”

When i heard about no more leges,i was disappointed.People in my guild laughed at me,when i said i bought game because of that and reaper,but at the same time,they crying on the forums about s3 story…

It goes in circle ,you laugh at me because of this,i laugh at you because of that,third guy laugh at us…everyone has its own priorities in game,and everyone thinks his wishes have priorities,and that’s ok…But what they promised are legendary items every 3 months,they didn’t promise season 3 story chapters every 3 months.

TPMN.1483:

Funny thing is CORE Tyria takes me longer to complete than HOT.
So CORE Tyria > HOT IMO – the Hours I spend in CORE > HOT.
The Hours I need to complete CORE > HOT.
The cost of CORE vs HOT = Same on Release.

And another one with the wrong price. The expansion was 10€ cheaper. Please get that straight.

But I understand the general resentment. Content in HOT was thin and then again we don’t get anything additionally for months or even a year to come. Although it’s ridiculous how people always call it doomsday after a drought of content. This happens all the time.

I don’t think anyone believes HoT was over all well-received. But falling apart is probably not the best description either.

HoT had a luke-warm reception. Even people who liked it, like me, found things to be really annoyed by. And that doesn’t happen easily to me, since I don’t play games to be annoyed.

So I tried some other MMOs. They annoyed me even more. lol

Hopefully the spring patch will plug some of the holes and people will give it a chance.

If you think about irt, t is very dangerous, can Anet rebuild trust of the players?

I bought HoT purely to play the new specs in WvWvW with my guild. I already knew going in that this expansion, like the core game, is largely PvE but I was genuinely annoyed at the heavy gating, the forced PvE to unlock HoT upgrades (for both characters and guilds) and just how little there was to actually do on these mere four maps before running into serious repetition.

While it was fun for my guildmates to create new builds and group comps and generally laugh about all the clearly unbalanced HoT additions, we all realized what it meant for WvWvW’s future and the enthusiasm was short lived. We’re still a guild, just officially not in GW2. Anet breaking communication droughts to promise post HoT WvWvW dev focus only to pop up months later with what’s tantamount to “we don’t know what we’re doing” has pretty much sealed their fate for a lot of the people I play with and the buyer’s remorse is real. From this player’s perspective, while really pretty, HoT was a feeble swing and a depressing miss in terms of gameplay and value.

Vayne.8563:

Celtic Lady.3729:

I’m less concerned with their intentions and more concerned with their penchant for selling content they don’t later deliver.

It hasn’t really happened often in this game though. This current legendary system is probably the worst example of it.

You know the wvw 2.0 overhaul has been cancelled right? ..

Zetsumei.4975:

Vayne.8563:

Celtic Lady.3729:

I’m less concerned with their intentions and more concerned with their penchant for selling content they don’t later deliver.

It hasn’t really happened often in this game though. This current legendary system is probably the worst example of it.

You know the wvw 2.0 overhaul has been cancelled right? ..

Actually I don’t know that even a little. That’s not what was said anywhere. They wanted to roll it out all at once and now it’ll be rolled out in stages to get parts of it into the game faster.

Vayne.8563:

Zetsumei.4975:

Vayne.8563:

Celtic Lady.3729:

I’m less concerned with their intentions and more concerned with their penchant for selling content they don’t later deliver.

It hasn’t really happened often in this game though. This current legendary system is probably the worst example of it.

You know the wvw 2.0 overhaul has been cancelled right? ..

Actually I don’t know that even a little. That’s not what was said anywhere. They wanted to roll it out all at once and now it’ll be rolled out in stages to get parts of it into the game faster.

Youve been here long enough to have heard them say that 3 years ago, dont tell me after all this time you still believe that PR crap.

Vayne.8563:

Zetsumei.4975:

Vayne.8563:

Celtic Lady.3729:

I’m less concerned with their intentions and more concerned with their penchant for selling content they don’t later deliver.

It hasn’t really happened often in this game though. This current legendary system is probably the worst example of it.

You know the wvw 2.0 overhaul has been cancelled right? ..

Actually I don’t know that even a little. That’s not what was said anywhere. They wanted to roll it out all at once and now it’ll be rolled out in stages to get parts of it into the game faster.

There was a leaked Reddit post about a potential guild alliance system that was not received well from the community and therefor scrapped the idea because after that they switched stance to releasing stages at a time. if they had a system ready to ship they would release the whole thing unless they started over in which case you would release in stages.

Sird.4536:

Vayne.8563:

Zetsumei.4975:

Vayne.8563:

Celtic Lady.3729:

I’m less concerned with their intentions and more concerned with their penchant for selling content they don’t later deliver.

It hasn’t really happened often in this game though. This current legendary system is probably the worst example of it.

You know the wvw 2.0 overhaul has been cancelled right? ..

Actually I don’t know that even a little. That’s not what was said anywhere. They wanted to roll it out all at once and now it’ll be rolled out in stages to get parts of it into the game faster.

There was a leaked Reddit post about a potential guild alliance system that was not received well from the community and therefor scrapped the idea because after that they switched stance to releasing stages at a time. if they had a system ready to ship they would release the whole thing unless they started over in which case you would release in stages.

Mistress Sird of [Vcy] by any chance? Long time no see

Zetsumei.4975:

Sird.4536:

Vayne.8563:

Zetsumei.4975:

Vayne.8563:

Celtic Lady.3729:

I’m less concerned with their intentions and more concerned with their penchant for selling content they don’t later deliver.

It hasn’t really happened often in this game though. This current legendary system is probably the worst example of it.

You know the wvw 2.0 overhaul has been cancelled right? ..

Actually I don’t know that even a little. That’s not what was said anywhere. They wanted to roll it out all at once and now it’ll be rolled out in stages to get parts of it into the game faster.

There was a leaked Reddit post about a potential guild alliance system that was not received well from the community and therefor scrapped the idea because after that they switched stance to releasing stages at a time. if they had a system ready to ship they would release the whole thing unless they started over in which case you would release in stages.

Mistress Sird of [Vcy] by any chance? Long time no see

Yes that is me though I have not been in VcY for over 2 years

ill never buy another product from Anet or ncsoft again, I only played the expansion for maybe 5-10 hrs. My gut was telling me not to buy it I should have listened to it, I knew Anet wouldn’t produce everything they said they were going to do.

If you enjoy the game that’s nice this all just my honest opinion

Core game had lot of content and is still the most enjoyable part of gw 2.

Map size: Core > HoT
Storyline: Core > HoT
Memorable characters: Core > HoT
Value for money: Core > HoT

Funny thing is some people paid more for HoT and gt less than they did when they bought the Core game.

Pus new players can play the best part of gw 2 for free as HoT is just a flop in most regards with only a handful of benefits.

Celtic Lady.3729:

They really need to fix their false advertising problem. People are never going to get their money’s worth for HoT now if they at all expected to have that legendary weapon content.

Sorry, but canceling content you advertised and then killed AFTER everyone paid for it and now will never get the content they paid for or even a refund is just all kinds of LAME.

Then again maybe they HAVE to cancel some content in order to remove the gating/grinding on the existing HoT content. The assumption being that little of the new HoTcontent is actually being utilised and that there has been a significant drop in population playtime and ofc $$$ spend.

It’s like leprosy, sometimes you have to cut bits off to save the rest of the body.

I certainly feel that on the Vabbi server there are far fewer people around now than pre-HoT – by a very long way! And note, Vabbi was a low population server pre-HoT!

I also feel that the only game in town nowadays is sPvP but really that is never going to work for casuals in the EU with it’s X language system. Maybe things are fine in the The States but there does seem to be a lot or broken – or undesirable or unenjoyable etc – content for a four year old game.

Was pre-HoT really that bad?

I didn’t think so. The thing that stuck me as odd about HoT was the complete failure to update the game architecture, something I have come to kinda expect from MMO expansions.

Lord Kuru.3685:

Well, Mark O’Brien himself invoked the manifesto in this last statement about cancelling Legendaries. So it’s fair game to complain about it.

You mean Mike. Though I’ve been meaning to ask Mike if he’s related to Mark, who is a judge and not so far as I know in any way involved in the gaming industry.

(Common names … common names … yes, I know there are zillions of M. O’Brien’s across the country … but it would be neat if there were a connection to the one I know).

I would be happy with an acknowledgement that HoT was a mess, and promise to make it right. They did it in FF14, and it’s worked out well for them. However, all we got was “HoT was a full expansion” and no acknowledgement of the mess they gave us.

Maximillian Greil.1965:

I would be happy with an acknowledgement that HoT was a mess, and promise to make it right. They did it in FF14, and it’s worked out well for them. However, all we got was “HoT was a full expansion” and no acknowledgement of the mess they gave us.

Well they acknowledged HOT didn’t fit with their core philosophies and it was more grindy than they anticipated, so they’re taking the time to fix it. I’m not sure how different that is.

Does the software industry have a tendency to over promise and under deliver? Yes. So much so that many people have a tendency to expect a degree of disappointment with new software.(Not if they’ll be disappointed, but how much they’ll be disappointed.) Does this excuse it? No. Does it excuse the degree to which Anet over promised and under delivered? Certainly not. We can debate over terms like “false advertising”, and “fraud”, but the simple fact is that things were explicitly mentioned in promotional materials, which have not been included or have been postponed/delayed indefinitely.(New legendary weapons holding at 4 of 16, for example. And where is Legendary Armor?) And worse, there are things which were delivered, but were not viable.(scribing, precursor journeys and WvW “upgrade” were just disasters)
We were warned that HoT would be a little thin on content, because the primary focus was changing the game infrastructure so it would be easier to expand and add new content.
The result:
Legendary journeys are so difficult and time consuming that they’ve been put on hold.
Raids are so difficult to make, the first one still isn’t complete.
WvW is so hard to fix that they’ve changed plans and are rolling it out a little at a time.
New armor sets are still so hard to make that they’ve swapped emphasis to outfits.
There has been a lot of hue and cry about the new legendaries hold/cancellation, but rather than being specifically about that particular thing, I think that the New Legendary Fiasco is that final straw that broke the camel’s back, and finally made many people wake up and realize how badly Anet has been under performing, and for how long. When 16 New Legendary Weapons are a bullet point on your glossy, and 5 months later you decide to stop at 4, there are major underlying problems that need to be addressed. When you break an entire game mode, and 5 months later there’s not only no fix, but no ETA on a fix, there are major underlying problems that need to be addressed. When the final Boss fight, the climax of your flagship product, still has major bugs (and stupid mechanics like a “penalty box”) 4 months or more after shipping, there are major underlying problems that need to be addressed. When you roll out a broken, non-viable crafting profession, and tie guild hall expansion to it, and it still isn’t fixed 5 months later, there are major underlying problems that need to be addressed.
Earlier someone proposed that it’s the right thing for Anet to do, forging ahead with a second expansion now (while many things are still badly broken)in order to save the franchise. And that sounds fairly reasonable, except that you need to realize that Anet must win back the trust, and interest, and fandom of their customer base. Or they’ll have to win over a whole new customer base to buy whatever comes next. I think they should flush the second expansion,(it won’t be relevant) and bring all those people over to fix Core Tyria and HoT. They need to make them viable, entertaining, and rewarding. And win back the trust of their customer base. Then(if they’ve done well) we’ll care enough to buy Guild Wars 3. Which IMO, should be the next product released. With a new engine, which will handle all the stuff they’re trying to shoehorn into and tack onto Guild Wars 2. And they’ll do a better job because they will have learned from all the mistakes that they made with Guild Wars 2.(They better learn from their mistakes – the ones with the game design and implementation, and with how they treat their customers. They really don’t have a choice if they want to continue making games.)
So while I don’t know that I would call all of this “fraud” or “false advertising”, it is a clear indication of an urgent need for improvement. And of a need to end wasteful distractions and focus on more important priorities.

Elden Arnaas.4870:

Does the software industry have a tendency to over promise and under deliver? Yes. So much so that many people have a tendency to expect a degree of disappointment with new software.(Not if they’ll be disappointed, but how much they’ll be disappointed.) Does this excuse it? No. Does it excuse the degree to which Anet over promised and under delivered? Certainly not. We can debate over terms like “false advertising”, and “fraud”, but the simple fact is that things were explicitly mentioned in promotional materials, which have not been included or have been postponed/delayed indefinitely.(New legendary weapons holding at 4 of 16, for example. And where is Legendary Armor?) And worse, there are things which were delivered, but were not viable.(scribing, precursor journeys and WvW “upgrade” were just disasters)
We were warned that HoT would be a little thin on content, because the primary focus was changing the game infrastructure so it would be easier to expand and add new content.
The result:
Legendary journeys are so difficult and time consuming that they’ve been put on hold.
Raids are so difficult to make, the first one still isn’t complete.
WvW is so hard to fix that they’ve changed plans and are rolling it out a little at a time.
New armor sets are still so hard to make that they’ve swapped emphasis to outfits.
There has been a lot of hue and cry about the new legendaries hold/cancellation, but rather than being specifically about that particular thing, I think that the New Legendary Fiasco is that final straw that broke the camel’s back, and finally made many people wake up and realize how badly Anet has been under performing, and for how long. When 16 New Legendary Weapons are a bullet point on your glossy, and 5 months later you decide to stop at 4, there are major underlying problems that need to be addressed. When you break an entire game mode, and 5 months later there’s not only no fix, but no ETA on a fix, there are major underlying problems that need to be addressed. When the final Boss fight, the climax of your flagship product, still has major bugs (and stupid mechanics like a “penalty box”) 4 months or more after shipping, there are major underlying problems that need to be addressed. When you roll out a broken, non-viable crafting profession, and tie guild hall expansion to it, and it still isn’t fixed 5 months later, there are major underlying problems that need to be addressed.
Earlier someone proposed that it’s the right thing for Anet to do, forging ahead with a second expansion now (while many things are still badly broken)in order to save the franchise. And that sounds fairly reasonable, except that you need to realize that Anet must win back the trust, and interest, and fandom of their customer base. Or they’ll have to win over a whole new customer base to buy whatever comes next. I think they should flush the second expansion,(it won’t be relevant) and bring all those people over to fix Core Tyria and HoT. They need to make them viable, entertaining, and rewarding. And win back the trust of their customer base. Then(if they’ve done well) we’ll care enough to buy Guild Wars 3. Which IMO, should be the next product released. With a new engine, which will handle all the stuff they’re trying to shoehorn into and tack onto Guild Wars 2. And they’ll do a better job because they will have learned from all the mistakes that they made with Guild Wars 2.(They better learn from their mistakes – the ones with the game design and implementation, and with how they treat their customers. They really don’t have a choice if they want to continue making games.)
So while I don’t know that I would call all of this “fraud” or “false advertising”, it is a clear indication of an urgent need for improvement. And of a need to end wasteful distractions and focus on more important priorities.

That pretty much sums up Guild Wars 2 post launch. Well said.

Vix.6730:

That pretty much sums up Guild Wars 2 post launch. Well said.

Posted in a very biased and negative view. For almost anything he said was a disaster I have found many people saying they thoroughly enjoyed said content.

Not to mention his solutions would basically mean no new content for the next year.

Though, yes, improvement is needed.

Vayne.8563:

Maximillian Greil.1965:

I would be happy with an acknowledgement that HoT was a mess, and promise to make it right. They did it in FF14, and it’s worked out well for them. However, all we got was “HoT was a full expansion” and no acknowledgement of the mess they gave us.

Well they acknowledged HOT didn’t fit with their core philosophies and it was more grindy than they anticipated, so they’re taking the time to fix it. I’m not sure how different that is.

When are these fixes due may i ask?

And why is it my server (Sea of Sorrows) is so dead these days, i’ve only just returned but the populations seem smaller than i’ve ever seen them.

My Guilds i’m joining have less than 10 online a day..

Dante.1508:

Vayne.8563:

Maximillian Greil.1965:

I would be happy with an acknowledgement that HoT was a mess, and promise to make it right. They did it in FF14, and it’s worked out well for them. However, all we got was “HoT was a full expansion” and no acknowledgement of the mess they gave us.

Well they acknowledged HOT didn’t fit with their core philosophies and it was more grindy than they anticipated, so they’re taking the time to fix it. I’m not sure how different that is.

When are these fixes due may i ask?

And why is it my server (Sea of Sorrows) is so dead these days, i’ve only just returned but the populations seem smaller than i’ve ever seen them.

My Guilds i’m joining have less than 10 online a day..

Fixes are due this month…most people are guessing April 19.

The guild situation is weird because the game went free to play. Join one of the big big guilds you’ll see more.

Still even though my guild has a hundred people logging in every week, we usually only have ten or so at at time except guild mission days.

Edit: What I mean by weird is that a lot of new people, instead of joining existing guilds what to make their own guilds. So there’s a lot of guilds all competing for the few people without guilds.

It means a lot of these guilds are pretty new and many have little to offer as far as organized events, or guild hall progress.

Because so many people want to make their own new guilds, people are spread pretty thin.

I have a serious bone to pick with HoT. My initial assessment after purchasing and playing for awhile was that the only worthy additions HoT brought for me were the elite specs – this havent really changed. Aesthetically I liked a necro with a gs, an engi with a hammer, a war going berserk etc. Apart from that I found a lot of things which genuinely annoyed the heck out of me. Mobs having any type off cc you can think of, every critter from big lizards to tiny mushrooms being able to knock you down (wtf). Guess that was the devs’ answer to harder mobs, give them all kinds of ways to disable the player with zero reason behind it. They just can cause we say so. That is a huge turn off for me. You want harder mobs? How about make them smarter, let them dodge us, block us, make us miss. Anything you meet knocking you on your bottom is flat out annoying. And this negative emotion builds up over time.

The other major turn off for me was making the expansion maps basically a giant JP. I dont like platforming, in the core game I can skip those most of the time but in HoT you cant because HoT is a jumping puzzle. Hey Anet, you guys may be huge fans of jumping but If I wanted that Id be playing supermario not a 3d mmorpg.

From all the other listed complaints, time gating is what really grinds my gears. Set timers for world monsters I got used to. You log in, you check if one is coming up, you port there, meet up with the player horde and get it done. Easy, smooth, no hassle.

Hours long metas in HoT? Heck no. Hey I dont know what % of the player base are kids with unlimited spare time to spend gaming but I kinda feel those solvent among us are limited on time. I personally want a hassle free, fast paced (being able to have a meaningful progression in a shorter time) game to fill my gaming time. GW2 core does that, HoT doesnt. Now, even if I do have buyer’s remorse I can live with it – If HoT is a one time tend to the more hardcore folks among us. But they did say HoT is paving the way for the future of the game. That my friends does not sit well with me. Not in the slightest. As such I’ve decided to stop my support for Guild Wars 2 until I see something, anything indicating a return to what made this game.

No offense to anyone. Lately i feel that GW2 is solely grind grind grind grind until you die. Dungeons used to be fun to run with hundreds of people doing them for tokens recipe drops and gold. Now no one does dungeons anymore. New Maps are awesome but = Grind Away for Loot Drops. Champ Trains get nerfed and changed ( Queensdale Mobs now Veterans not Champs and Frostgorge Champ Train changed quite a bit since i last tried it) Not sure when these things change or if anyone said anything already but i honestly don’t see why Anet needed to remove things that people loved for absolutely no reason. even SW Chest spawn rate and loot drop has been lowered as far as i understand and have heard from others. I only log into the game daily for the log in reward. Just now that will be removed cos that’s how Anet are -.-. Fix your stuff Anet this game is becoming extremely laborious extremely quick

@ broken Memory Dude, seriously, there has always been a grind in GW 2. You grinded WB to some rewards and stuff to sell, you grinded SW and dry top for the recipes, you grinded dungeons for liquidity and you grinded all the maps for crafting a legendary and you grinded world events/festivals to craft/obtain a skin…..stop beating a dead horse, the only problem with hot maps is the fact that the timers did not allow players to properly grind the way they wanted to grind the maps with currency requirements set up a bit too high. That is the only problem. Apart from that, no the expansion is certainly not falling apart

flog.3485:

@ broken Memory Dude, seriously, there has always been a grind in GW 2. You grinded WB to some rewards and stuff to sell, you grinded SW and dry top for the recipes, you grinded dungeons for liquidity and you grinded all the maps for crafting a legendary and you grinded world events/festivals to craft/obtain a skin…..stop beating a dead horse, the only problem with hot maps is the fact that the timers did not allow players to properly grind the way they wanted to grind the maps with currency requirements set up a bit too high. That is the only problem. Apart from that, no the expansion is certainly not falling apart

There’s always been grind but I don’t think anyone can deny the grind has increased. Even Anet admitted there’s more grind than they wanted, so I’m not really sure what else to say on that issue.

@ Broken Memory: everything you’re referring to (champ trains, SW cf, dungeon farming, etc etc) is uber grind…

Vayne.8563:

flog.3485:

@ broken Memory Dude, seriously, there has always been a grind in GW 2. You grinded WB to some rewards and stuff to sell, you grinded SW and dry top for the recipes, you grinded dungeons for liquidity and you grinded all the maps for crafting a legendary and you grinded world events/festivals to craft/obtain a skin…..stop beating a dead horse, the only problem with hot maps is the fact that the timers did not allow players to properly grind the way they wanted to grind the maps with currency requirements set up a bit too high. That is the only problem. Apart from that, no the expansion is certainly not falling apart

There’s always been grind but I don’t think anyone can deny the grind has increased. Even Anet admitted there’s more grind than they wanted, so I’m not really sure what else to say on that issue.

That, plus this grind is Timegated to beat heck. If you don’t show up at the right event, at the right time you get next to nothing for the reward currency, having to do it all over again, PLUS hoping to God that the stupid Megaserver system doesn’t decide to put you in a less populated map. I’m so kitten tired off all the Timegates for higher level crap in this game from dragon stand, to legendaries and ascended. It’s the reason I stopped playing,

@Vaynr Yeah I forgot to add this in my argument but hopefully the changes they will bring solve these issues, even though on a personal kevel I am not so bothered with that Side note : here is another thing that made the grind more frustrating, the inconsistencies with megaservers

Sir Mad.1092:

@ Broken Memory: everything you’re referring to (champ trains, SW cf, dungeon farming, etc etc) is uber grind…

True but taking 10 min to complete a dungeon is much easier than spending hours in ds and hoping it passes.

SW used to also have 90% maps in LFG now there hardly any and even though champ train was a grind it did have a good convo running during it when u had to wait for fish to spawn or something once or twice to happen also the loot was easier and it was faster and readily available. Its not necessarily the grind but the community in that grind and how slow or fast it is i guess…

This is last time I gave them money, this is the truth. Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me.

So I take it; the expansion isn’t worth the money?

Sir Jensen.2153:

So I take it; the expansion isn’t worth the money?

If you compare the expansion to the base game…it doesn’t add much. Mainly the biggest draw is elite specs and guilds halls. The maps are a wonder to navigate but after that wears off, you have to fight the Megaserver system using LFG to get to a map to do the map meta. You also have masteries, which while I do enjoy, you also have to get mastery points (think skill points in base game) by doing adventures (which are Locked behind events) or get to places to channel, some of which require masteries from other lines.

Overall, I feel the expansion is worth maybe 25 dollars in all. It was supposed to provide a foundation for them to more easily add in and update content, but that was the biggest line of the century.

Sir Jensen.2153:

So I take it; the expansion isn’t worth the money?

That’s not necessarily the case. From every thread I’ve seen about half the people think it is. For example, people who raid, definitely think its’ worth the money. People who enjoy large scale meta events and harder open world zones often think its’ worth it.

The problem is there are entire groups of people who don’t think it’s worth it. This month a patch will be coming out to make it a bit less grindy and that might satisfy some people.

Me, I enjoyed the expansion.

Vayne.8563:

Sir Jensen.2153:

So I take it; the expansion isn’t worth the money?

That’s not necessarily the case. From every thread I’ve seen about half the people think it is. For example, people who raid, definitely think its’ worth the money. People who enjoy large scale meta events and harder open world zones often think its’ worth it.

The problem is there are entire groups of people who don’t think it’s worth it. This month a patch will be coming out to make it a bit less grindy and that might satisfy some people.

Me, I enjoyed the expansion.

HoT is basically ok. Basically.
My worst offenders are the adventures, they just neither make sense lorewise, are just more jump stuff on a jump stuff heavy map, or are plain annoying and way to hard.
Maps are not really big. Most layers are actually pretty small.
Gating, layering, walls everywhere. Not cool.
Reverse engineering, aka learning to enjoy the expansion when your mastery points rise more and more is not a good selling point and makes absolutely no sense for me.