Guild Wars 2

MrPersons.1560:

back on the topic of the OP, I am starting to get tired with the gay/lesbian stuff popping up everywhere. I mean, I am ok with it, I may disagree with it, but I wont hate them for it. Its just that I don’t want to have to see it. I would like to hear about it very little, if at all. almost every game has a gay/lesbian character in it, and its part of the main story so its unavoidable. its just getting annoying to me personally

Gonna play devil’s advocate here for a sec; humor me.

First of all, it’s not really part of the main storyline. The main storyline is the fight against the Elder Dragons (remember them?), and even Caithe’s relationship with Faolain is just a side note there. That was the game’s original selling point, though those of us who are fans of GW would have been sold if the fight was against a plague of drop-bears. Anet would have found a way to tell such a story with beauty and class.

Marjory, Kasmeer, and the rest of Destiny’s Edge Jr. are part of the Living Story, a clever and (mostly) enjoyable device to keep us all busy while the devs work on…whatever’s coming next. Both the main storyline and the LW storyline are true to GW2’s overall message…that disparate people, working together, can overcome any obstacle. Go back and look at the original trailers for the game and you’ll see it. And it’s an awesome message, I don’t think anyone has a problem with it.

What people are having a problem with…as I touched on in my earlier posts and also expressed in your post…is that some people will naturally fixate on the relationships in their favorite games. It’s understandable enough; we’re all wired differently and different things are important to us. Combat mechanics, the loot system, the lore…and yes, the romantic relationships of the characters. I call members of this last group “shippers”, for reasons too long and off-topic to go into here.

Shippers tend to be quite vocal, however. And the reason I worried briefly about an “agenda” is the impact I’ve seen them have on other franchises. It has nothing to do with homophobia (many of my favorite writers and artists are gay, and I honestly don’t care), but a concern for the product itself. Some may be snickering at this point, but I’m being serious. Shipperdom, in certain circumstances, can be destructive to a franchise.

And I’ll close by again saying that my previous posts in this thread were made before I’d watched the LA cutscene of Marjory, Kasmeer, and the others. That did a lot to alleviate my fears. I just hope I’ve done a good job of defining them a little better in this post.

BobbyStein.2315:

Chokolata.1870:

There is good writing and there is we put this in to cater to the XYZ crowd, but its all irrelevant as we should not be mixing moster slaying with silly and pointless real life crusades.

A few things here:

• We didn’t put this in to cater to anyone. We’re just trying to tell a good story.
• No crusade going on here.
• Interesting characters and character moments make for a better experience overall. We’re not doing it at the expense of putting other things in the game.

What people don’t understand is that we wrote and voiced a lot of these moments throughout the year. Some scenes and story instances were cut or never implemented in the final releases, which is why this particular story instance was longer than the typical one and filled with lots of exposition.

And that’s why you create good stories. Shame that you have to explain the basics of good storytelling because most people feel offended at every little thing going on.

MrPersons.1560:

BrunoBRS.5178:

a whopping two times as far as the main story goes, with one or two other cases.

yeeeeaaaah… i can’t side with you. even if your post wasn’t homophobic.

I don’t mean in only this game either, I mean in games in general.

I’d almost agree with you, if they didn’t keep “popping up” in real life too. I mean, really now, who gave them permission to intrude on my world with their lifestyle choices?

Yes, that’s sarcasm.

So long as the characters aren’t solely designed as “that homosexual guy/girl”? I don’t care.

BobbyStein.2315:

What people don’t understand is that we wrote and voiced a lot of these moments throughout the year. Some scenes and story instances were cut or never implemented in the final releases, which is why this particular story instance was longer than the typical one and filled with lots of exposition.

I sincerely hope that over course of the year there was an opportunity to get the Hero Voice Actors back into studio and allow the players to be more engaged in the climax of the arc than as mute witnesses.

Scavenge some clips from the existing Personal Story library if you have to, but please don’t leave us completely silent in the face of these world altering events!

Nike.2631:

Scavenge some clips from the existing Personal Story library if you have to, but please don’t leave us completely silent in the face of these world altering events!

it would be hilarious if the sound team just cropped a bunch of words from previous recordings and slapped them together to make new dialogue :P

Spoilers Logan doesn’t actually love Jenna.

BobbyStein.2315:

Nike.2631:

BobbyStein.2315:

What people don’t understand is that we wrote and voiced a lot of these moments throughout the year. Some scenes and story instances were cut or never implemented in the final releases, which is why this particular story instance was longer than the typical one and filled with lots of exposition.

I sincerely hope that over course of the year there was an opportunity to get the Hero Voice Actors back into studio and allow the players to be more engaged in the climax of the arc than as mute witnesses.

Scavenge some clips from the existing Personal Story library if you have to, but please don’t leave us completely silent in the face of these world altering events!

Funny that you mention player voice. I’ve had a few meetings recently about that. I can’t go into details but I will say that it’s on the list of things we’re looking to address. The current issue is more of a tech one and less of a “we don’t want the player to talk” decision.

I would expect it’s also a budgetary one to get those voice actors (all 10 or so) back for just that.

BobbyStein.2315:

Nike.2631:

BobbyStein.2315:

What people don’t understand is that we wrote and voiced a lot of these moments throughout the year. Some scenes and story instances were cut or never implemented in the final releases, which is why this particular story instance was longer than the typical one and filled with lots of exposition.

I sincerely hope that over course of the year there was an opportunity to get the Hero Voice Actors back into studio and allow the players to be more engaged in the climax of the arc than as mute witnesses.

Scavenge some clips from the existing Personal Story library if you have to, but please don’t leave us completely silent in the face of these world altering events!

Funny that you mention player voice. I’ve had a few meetings recently about that. I can’t go into details but I will say that it’s on the list of things we’re looking to address. The current issue is more of a tech one and less of a “we don’t want the player to talk” decision.

i heard the tech reason before, but why exactly can’t you just play the voice clips over the cutscene?

as far as i knew the problem was more “getting 10 actors to record voices at the same time for a couple releases only” than “our tech won’t let us”… unless i misunderstood what you meant by tech issue.

MrPersons.1560:

BrunoBRS.5178:

a whopping two times as far as the main story goes, with one or two other cases.

yeeeeaaaah… i can’t side with you. even if your post wasn’t homophobic.

I don’t mean in only this game either, I mean in games in general.

Funnily enough that can work both ways. You can be tired of seeing gay relationships in games and in real life – but think about this, even though you don’t like them, all of the gay people who you dislike seeing are bombarded with a LOT more images of straight couples than you are of gay couples every day. So whilst one or two gay characters popping up in video games might seem weird to you, it’s hardly an overload. It’s ok for you to not like it, as long as you’re not being mean about it.

Everyone just wants to feel as though they are represented. I think it’s ok if you personally don’t like something, but it’s not really fair to say that because you don’t like it it doesn’t deserve to be seen or represented.

Everyone deserves to be represented and included. At the end of the day we are all just people.

BobbyStein.2315:

Funny that you mention player voice. I’ve had a few meetings recently about that. I can’t go into details but I will say that it’s on the list of things we’re looking to address. The current issue is more of a tech one and less of a “we don’t want the player to talk” decision.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

I would expect it’s also a budgetary one to get those voice actors (all 10 or so) back for just that.

Its a LOT more than that. 10 actors for every language the game has been released in.

I don’t discount the cost and I wouldn’t begrudge them carefully managed repurposing of existing audio stocks. I just want for the endgame of a year-long world shaking tale to not come off as cheap.

Star Wars: The Old Republic is in a similar bind with a cast of fully voiced heroes, and it suffered terribly from “major events” that were completely ludicrous in their handling of the resounding silence of the heroes after launch. I’m a bit traumatized by it, really. It was bad.

BobbyStein.2315:

Funny that you mention player voice. I’ve had a few meetings recently about that. I can’t go into details but I will say that it’s on the list of things we’re looking to address. The current issue is more of a tech one and less of a “we don’t want the player to talk” decision.

I would personally prefer not to have my characters speak because then I can imagine my own voice for them.

Lasica.5068:

BobbyStein.2315:

Funny that you mention player voice. I’ve had a few meetings recently about that. I can’t go into details but I will say that it’s on the list of things we’re looking to address. The current issue is more of a tech one and less of a “we don’t want the player to talk” decision.

I would personally prefer not to have my characters speak because then I can imagine my own voice for them.

A lot of skipping scenes during the Personal Story then?

BobbyStein.2315:

Funny that you mention player voice. I’ve had a few meetings recently about that. I can’t go into details but I will say that it’s on the list of things we’re looking to address. The current issue is more of a tech one and less of a “we don’t want the player to talk” decision.

I’d also really welcome it if the players themselves had a more central role in future stories. Something that bothered me a lot in the personal story, was how everything kept revolving around Destiny’s Edge and Trahearne. It made me feel like I was a bystander, rather than the hero. And I also didn’t like those characters, which made it worse. It made it feel like they were stealing my spotlight, like Kormir did in Nightfall.

The Living Story is moving in the right direction, by making the npc’s the side characters, and making us important participants. I don’t think we’re there yet, but it is an improvement to see the other characters take a few steps back to allow us to shine.

Faowri.4159:

In a lot of cases where the fans will be saying “It’s so obvious!”, it usually isn’t // – especially if you have any experience with very close, affectionate friendship.

If it is heading that way, I certainly don’t have a problem with it and I’m all for encouraging diversity in storytelling.

This.

There are many levels of complication in relationships between members of the same and opposite sex that have nothing to do with sexual orientation. But if there was a strong friendship between two males and one of them happened to be gay, the general fanbase would just assume that they were gay together simply because the dialog between the two characters isn’t flooded with one member spurning the advances of the other.

BobbyStein.2315:

• Interesting characters and character moments make for a better experience overall. We’re not doing it at the expense of putting other things in the game.

I saw the lesbian relationship ‘reveal’ coming a mile away. The hints were there from the first introduction of Kasmeer being Marjorie’s detective agency partner. I feel it just fell flat at the beach scene, since as a player who never did any of the Southsun content, I just wasn’t invested enough in the Kasmeer character to care. I just wanted her to “shut up already!” The ‘reveal’ could possibly have been a little more romantic and a little less dramatic, since not all players have been with the game from the vaunted beta days.

I was once again a little disappointed in the writing team, as the pay-off was less stellar than the build up.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Something that bothered me a lot in the personal story, was how everything kept revolving around Destiny’s Edge and Trahearne. It made me feel like I was a bystander, rather than the hero. And I also didn’t like those characters, which made it worse.

I never felt that. Trehearne and DE was always dead or dying whenever they fought at my side, and Trehearne always deferred to my character when trying to lead us to victory. My character was the one the Pact cheered, not DE or even the ‘chosen one.’ While Trehearne was a little bit of a Marty Stu, he was always eclipsed by my character.

As for not liking them, yeah, about the only one I could stand was Caithe.

KyreneZA.8617:

The ‘reveal’ could possibly have been a little more romantic and a little less dramatic, since not all players have been with the game from the vaunted beta days.

Please note, the “reveal” as you say is so far only done via an out of game comment. They haven’t yet said in game “we are a couple/dating”, they have just behaved somewhat in line with it.

Heck their behavior isn’t even dissimilar from close friends.

I was once again a little disappointed in the writing team, as the pay-off was less stellar than the build up.

It hasn’t even paid off yet either

KyreneZA.8617:

I never felt that. Trehearne and DE was always dead or dying whenever they fought at my side, and Trehearne always deferred to my character when trying to lead us to victory.

Strangely, I never had any of that going on unless it was a total party wipe. I never had to pick up Traherne, or Logan. I had to pick up Rytlock on my charr’s story but then I was only lucky to rally instead of dying, THEN switch to Mace/Shield for a one on one against the opponent and stunlock them.

In short? They haven’t been a load. Even Logan.

My character was the one the Pact cheered, not DE or even the ‘chosen one.’ While Trehearne was a little bit of a Marty Stu, he was always eclipsed by my character.

(Snip)

Okay, that’s all I need for the next round of “Traherne stole my spotlight” conversations.

As for not liking them, yeah, about the only one I could stand was Caithe.

I like Rytlock, and Logan . . . when he’s not being Queen’s Champion with a head thicker than frozen mud. Eir I am mostly ambivalent towards, Caithe I don’t care about.

Zojja needs either some humility or to go follow Snaff.

BobbyStein.2315:

Nike.2631:

BobbyStein.2315:

Funny that you mention player voice. I’ve had a few meetings recently about that. I can’t go into details but I will say that it’s on the list of things we’re looking to address. The current issue is more of a tech one and less of a “we don’t want the player to talk” decision.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

I would expect it’s also a budgetary one to get those voice actors (all 10 or so) back for just that.

Its a LOT more than that. 10 actors for every language the game has been released in.

I don’t discount the cost and I wouldn’t begrudge them carefully managed repurposing of existing audio stocks. I just want for the endgame of a year-long world shaking tale to not come off as cheap.

Star Wars: The Old Republic is in a similar bind with a cast of fully voiced heroes, and it suffered terribly from “major events” that were completely ludicrous in their handling of the resounding silence of the heroes after launch. I’m a bit traumatized by it, really. It was bad.

Yup. There is always a cost factor involved, but right now the blocking issue is a technical one. It’s a totally solvable issue but we want to make sure we’re fixing it in an extensible way that supports our core design and story philosophies.

Does it have soemthing to do with the camera?
i am just looking back at the queens speech where you tried the more cinematic ingame approach and as i went in the wholet hing was a mess.
Now i do not know if you were able to fix that, since it was a one time thing (if you did not join someone else), in patches, however i can only asume that if you really want to get the artistic vision enough credit and include our heroes in something like that, then i can imagine that this will need a lot of work on the technical side.

But we are getting a bit offtopic here. The alure of a dev gets us everytime haha…

The representation of gay relationships in the over all game seems okay/well balanced/appropriately representative, but there’s definitely a huge over representation of homosexual relationships among non-single important/main characters.
I don’t want to see every important character paired off, but they do need to increase the representation of hetero relationships amongst the main cast. It’s kind lame if they just make every non-single main character homosexual to draw attention/make them “special”.
I’ve no problem with homosexual characters, but as the OP alluded to, it’s starting to feel “cheap”.

Not that’s a very important/pressing issue though.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

It feels forced? Really? Kasmeer left a lot of minor clues here and there, especially with Lord Faren hitting on her in Southsun . . .

Doesn’t everyone turn down Lord Faren?

Scarlet seems to have a fondness for him.

DarcShriek.5829:

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

It feels forced? Really? Kasmeer left a lot of minor clues here and there, especially with Lord Faren hitting on her in Southsun . . .

Doesn’t everyone turn down Lord Faren?

Scarlet seems to have a fondness for him.

He’s too easy to kidnap, is why. Especially for noble human characters – he’s willing to follow them off a cliff

Arewn.2368:

The representation of gay relationships in the over all game seems okay/well balanced/appropriately representative, but there’s definitely a huge over representation of homosexual relationships among non-single important/main characters.
I don’t want to see every important character paired off, but they do need to increase the representation of hetero relationships amongst the main cast. It’s kind lame if they just make every non-single main character homosexual to draw attention/make them “special”.
I’ve no problem with homosexual characters, but as the OP alluded to, it’s starting to feel “cheap”.

Not that’s a very important/pressing issue though.

Eir had a heterosexual relationship. I can prove it too, just let me wave this bacon around and summon Braham. (It’s his favorite food.)

So that’s:

- A potentially homosexual relationship which isn’t entirely steady or permanent with Marjory and Kasmeer.

- A former homosexual relationship between Caithe and Faolain . . . which could arguably not be homosexual since gender doesn’t seem to have any purpose for sylvari other than aesthetics.

- A one-sided heterosexual crush which is embarrassing to watch between Logan Thackeray and Queen Jenna.

- A former heterosexual relationship between Eir and Braham’s father (I forget the name), which ended amiably enough.

So we’re two and two. Doesn’t seem too bad to me.

Adding to the above list

- We have the gay couple in one of the Sylvari personal storylines
- Which is balanced out by a hetero couple in one of the other Sylvari storylines that comes from a different character creation choice

(There’s also a trio in the grove who run around having conversations and to me personally it looks like they’re a polyamorous trio…. But I don’t think it’s explicit. It’s really adorable anyway!)

BobbyStein.2315:

The story instance didn’t really have any pay-offs. It was really a series of character moments that are pushing them along their respective arcs. It’s also worth noting that they will not all resolve at the same time or in the same release.

Fair enough. A “no pay-off” could certainly have been misunderstood as a “failed pay-off” in my case. I would probably have been happy with the “come back to my place,” “I’ll never leave” exchange without the tears preceding it. The marionette fight was traumatic enough, that the added drama about Kasmeer’s dad’s birthday (or was it death anniversary?) wasn’t required to push one character to reach out to the other in such a way. It just felt a little jarring (or overplayed), regardless of the sexual orientation of the characters involved.

I guess I’m saying it just didn’t resonate (the scene itself, not the relationship growth it was meant to show) with this particular player. Not a big deal. I’ve been rooting for them to ‘come out’ for a while now, perhaps I’m just getting impatient.

KyreneZA.8617:

BobbyStein.2315:

The story instance didn’t really have any pay-offs. It was really a series of character moments that are pushing them along their respective arcs. It’s also worth noting that they will not all resolve at the same time or in the same release.

Fair enough. A “no pay-off” could certainly have been misunderstood as a “failed pay-off” in my case. I would probably have been happy with the “come back to my place,” “I’ll never leave” exchange without the tears preceding it. The marionette fight was traumatic enough, that the added drama about Kasmeer’s dad’s birthday (or was it death anniversary?) wasn’t required to push one character to reach out to the other in such a way. It just felt a little jarring (or overplayed), regardless of the sexual orientation of the characters involved.

I guess I’m saying it just didn’t resonate (the scene itself, not the relationship growth it was meant to show) with this particular player. Not a big deal. I’ve been rooting for them to ‘come out’ for a while now, perhaps I’m just getting impatient.

Death anniversary. And Kasmeer was already feeling down before the fight from what I remember. Also, that particular detail, about her father? Is payoff of a different sort – there’s been suggestions she’s had reasons to look down annoyedly at Lord Faren’s demeanor of “hey, live for the time of your life! Celebrate what’s good to get over the bad!” (an admirable quality in him and paints him as less of a buffoon than I took him for originally).

Could it have happened elsewhere? Yes, but not any earlier than this. Any later and it might get in the way of more serious matters coming up rather than being a somber note in an otherwise lighthearted part (like if she was doing it during Dragon Bash).

By the way, still taking bets on who’s dying this time when we do take down Scarlet. Rox, Kasmeer, Hobo-Tron, or Taimi.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

KyreneZA.8617:

BobbyStein.2315:

The story instance didn’t really have any pay-offs. It was really a series of character moments that are pushing them along their respective arcs. It’s also worth noting that they will not all resolve at the same time or in the same release.

Fair enough. A “no pay-off” could certainly have been misunderstood as a “failed pay-off” in my case. I would probably have been happy with the “come back to my place,” “I’ll never leave” exchange without the tears preceding it. The marionette fight was traumatic enough, that the added drama about Kasmeer’s dad’s birthday (or was it death anniversary?) wasn’t required to push one character to reach out to the other in such a way. It just felt a little jarring (or overplayed), regardless of the sexual orientation of the characters involved.

I guess I’m saying it just didn’t resonate (the scene itself, not the relationship growth it was meant to show) with this particular player. Not a big deal. I’ve been rooting for them to ‘come out’ for a while now, perhaps I’m just getting impatient.

Death anniversary. And Kasmeer was already feeling down before the fight from what I remember. Also, that particular detail, about her father? Is payoff of a different sort – there’s been suggestions she’s had reasons to look down annoyedly at Lord Faren’s demeanor of “hey, live for the time of your life! Celebrate what’s good to get over the bad!” (an admirable quality in him and paints him as less of a buffoon than I took him for originally).

Could it have happened elsewhere? Yes, but not any earlier than this. Any later and it might get in the way of more serious matters coming up rather than being a somber note in an otherwise lighthearted part (like if she was doing it during Dragon Bash).

By the way, still taking bets on who’s dying this time when we do take down Scarlet. Rox, Kasmeer, Hobo-Tron, or Taimi.

taimi just got introduced, ain’t happening. plus her, rox and braham are the ties to destiny’s edge, the best way to bring those guys into living story. so my money is on them staying.

which leaves us with our oft-discussed couple.

BrunoBRS.5178:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

KyreneZA.8617:

BobbyStein.2315:

The story instance didn’t really have any pay-offs. It was really a series of character moments that are pushing them along their respective arcs. It’s also worth noting that they will not all resolve at the same time or in the same release.

Fair enough. A “no pay-off” could certainly have been misunderstood as a “failed pay-off” in my case. I would probably have been happy with the “come back to my place,” “I’ll never leave” exchange without the tears preceding it. The marionette fight was traumatic enough, that the added drama about Kasmeer’s dad’s birthday (or was it death anniversary?) wasn’t required to push one character to reach out to the other in such a way. It just felt a little jarring (or overplayed), regardless of the sexual orientation of the characters involved.

I guess I’m saying it just didn’t resonate (the scene itself, not the relationship growth it was meant to show) with this particular player. Not a big deal. I’ve been rooting for them to ‘come out’ for a while now, perhaps I’m just getting impatient.

Death anniversary. And Kasmeer was already feeling down before the fight from what I remember. Also, that particular detail, about her father? Is payoff of a different sort – there’s been suggestions she’s had reasons to look down annoyedly at Lord Faren’s demeanor of “hey, live for the time of your life! Celebrate what’s good to get over the bad!” (an admirable quality in him and paints him as less of a buffoon than I took him for originally).

Could it have happened elsewhere? Yes, but not any earlier than this. Any later and it might get in the way of more serious matters coming up rather than being a somber note in an otherwise lighthearted part (like if she was doing it during Dragon Bash).

By the way, still taking bets on who’s dying this time when we do take down Scarlet. Rox, Kasmeer, Hobo-Tron, or Taimi.

taimi just got introduced, ain’t happening. plus her, rox and braham are the ties to destiny’s edge, the best way to bring those guys into living story. so my money is on them staying.

which leaves us with our oft-discussed couple.

I think Kasmeer is a dead woman walking.

FlamingFoxx.1305:

(There’s also a trio in the grove who run around having conversations and to me personally it looks like they’re a polyamorous trio…. But I don’t think it’s explicit. It’s really adorable anyway!)

Are you talking about the fellow who states that he wants to “leave a handsome corpse”? Yeah, they’re cute.

Well, this thread had now gone on for several pages, quite amiably despite the differing opinions presented in it, and has been visited by a number of Anet luminaries. I know only two have posted, but I’ll bet a pound of Braham’s favorite bacon that they’re all watching it. The fact that it hasn’t degenerated into text-based fisticuffs says something about us as a community.

Also, something I noted last night. My server’s overflow took down the BooBot, and I happened to be standing near Marjory and Kasmeer during the impromptu dance party that broke out afterward. Marjory asks Kasmeer if she’s all right and Kasmeer responds in a troubled voice—something along the lines of “I’m fine, don’t worry about it.”

I think there’s a storm on Kasmeer’s horizon.

Tanith.5264:

Also, something I noted last night. My server’s overflow took down the BooBot, and I happened to be standing near Marjory and Kasmeer during the impromptu dance party that broke out afterward. Marjory asks Kasmeer if she’s all right and Kasmeer responds in a troubled voice—something along the lines of “I’m fine, don’t worry about it.”

I think there’s a storm on Kasmeer’s horizon.

it’s her dad’s anniversary. that’s why she’s been troubled “all day”. she wanted to stay away from jory during the fight, and remained trouble throughout the whole event.

BrunoBRS.5178:

which leaves us with our oft-discussed couple.

. . . or Ellen Kiel and Evon Gnashblade.

Look, if they both go out together to save Lion’s Arch I will finally stop giving him crap about those taxes.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

BrunoBRS.5178:

which leaves us with our oft-discussed couple.

. . . or Ellen Kiel and Evon Gnashblade.

Look, if they both go out together to save Lion’s Arch I will finally stop giving him crap about those taxes.

would be hilarious if they became a couple.

and then the fanfic writers would rejoice.

BrunoBRS.5178:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

BrunoBRS.5178:

which leaves us with our oft-discussed couple.

. . . or Ellen Kiel and Evon Gnashblade.

Look, if they both go out together to save Lion’s Arch I will finally stop giving him crap about those taxes.

would be hilarious if they became a couple.

and then the fanfic writers would rejoice.

Not talking about them being a couple (though that would make the entire Cutthroat Politics arc hilarious in hindsight) . . . talking about who to offer up for the Required Dramatic Death Scene. Assuming it’s not Kasmeer or Marjory.

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

BrunoBRS.5178:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

BrunoBRS.5178:

which leaves us with our oft-discussed couple.

. . . or Ellen Kiel and Evon Gnashblade.

Look, if they both go out together to save Lion’s Arch I will finally stop giving him crap about those taxes.

would be hilarious if they became a couple.

and then the fanfic writers would rejoice.

Not talking about them being a couple (though that would make the entire Cutthroat Politics arc hilarious in hindsight) . . . talking about who to offer up for the Required Dramatic Death Scene. Assuming it’s not Kasmeer or Marjory.

make it a dramatic love confession death scene, like in japanese stories. they’ll die in each other’s arms :P

… I would TOTALLY ship Ellen and Evon together. XD One rules Lion’s Arch by might and force of arms, the other by the power of coin and trade. They’d be unstoppable together!

Zaxares.5419:

… I would TOTALLY ship Ellen and Evon together. XD One rules Lion’s Arch by might and force of arms, the other by the power of coin and trade. They’d be unstoppable together!

…and then scarlet kills them. and kiel was 2 days from retirement when it happened too.

DarcShriek.5829:

BrunoBRS.5178:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

KyreneZA.8617:

BobbyStein.2315:

The story instance didn’t really have any pay-offs. It was really a series of character moments that are pushing them along their respective arcs. It’s also worth noting that they will not all resolve at the same time or in the same release.

Fair enough. A “no pay-off” could certainly have been misunderstood as a “failed pay-off” in my case. I would probably have been happy with the “come back to my place,” “I’ll never leave” exchange without the tears preceding it. The marionette fight was traumatic enough, that the added drama about Kasmeer’s dad’s birthday (or was it death anniversary?) wasn’t required to push one character to reach out to the other in such a way. It just felt a little jarring (or overplayed), regardless of the sexual orientation of the characters involved.

I guess I’m saying it just didn’t resonate (the scene itself, not the relationship growth it was meant to show) with this particular player. Not a big deal. I’ve been rooting for them to ‘come out’ for a while now, perhaps I’m just getting impatient.

Death anniversary. And Kasmeer was already feeling down before the fight from what I remember. Also, that particular detail, about her father? Is payoff of a different sort – there’s been suggestions she’s had reasons to look down annoyedly at Lord Faren’s demeanor of “hey, live for the time of your life! Celebrate what’s good to get over the bad!” (an admirable quality in him and paints him as less of a buffoon than I took him for originally).

Could it have happened elsewhere? Yes, but not any earlier than this. Any later and it might get in the way of more serious matters coming up rather than being a somber note in an otherwise lighthearted part (like if she was doing it during Dragon Bash).

By the way, still taking bets on who’s dying this time when we do take down Scarlet. Rox, Kasmeer, Hobo-Tron, or Taimi.

taimi just got introduced, ain’t happening. plus her, rox and braham are the ties to destiny’s edge, the best way to bring those guys into living story. so my money is on them staying.

which leaves us with our oft-discussed couple.

I think Kasmeer is a dead woman walking.

Nyeh. In 90% stories I followed, be it games, shows, anime, book etc. whenever a supposed pairing becomes official one of them gets killed off. I think it’s because writers have no clue how to evolve them into a healthy relationship from that point.

So I hope this doesn’t happen here because it would fall under the said cliche… there are numerous jokes made about that. Fictional couples beware, if you become official, death flag for YOU. So stupid.

BrunoBRS.5178:

Zaxares.5419:

… I would TOTALLY ship Ellen and Evon together. XD One rules Lion’s Arch by might and force of arms, the other by the power of coin and trade. They’d be unstoppable together!

…and then scarlet kills them. and kiel was 2 days from retirement when it happened too.

SCAAAARLEEEEEEETTTT!!! /fistshake

Zaxares.5419:

BrunoBRS.5178:

Zaxares.5419:

… I would TOTALLY ship Ellen and Evon together. XD One rules Lion’s Arch by might and force of arms, the other by the power of coin and trade. They’d be unstoppable together!

…and then scarlet kills them. and kiel was 2 days from retirement when it happened too.

SCAAAARLEEEEEEETTTT!!! /fistshake

You have to do it right. (ahem)

“I’ve done far worse than killed you, Kiel. I’ve left you the same way I left him. Your worst rival with you, buried alive. Buried alive . . ..”

BobbyStein.2315:

BrunoBRS.5178:

Zaxares.5419:

… I would TOTALLY ship Ellen and Evon together. XD One rules Lion’s Arch by might and force of arms, the other by the power of coin and trade. They’d be unstoppable together!

…and then scarlet kills them. and kiel was 2 days from retirement when it happened too.

And she just bought her new airship, the Live Forever!

Followed by a very Special Guild Wars 2, Evon tries to kick his addiction to Omnomberries.

BobbyStein.2315:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

By the way, still taking bets on who’s dying this time when we do take down Scarlet. Rox, Kasmeer, Hobo-Tron, or Taimi.

I guess you’ll have to wait and see what happens.

Any chance you can say, in general, how you feel about ending characters. Do you think it’s possible, in the GW2 world, to kill off characters?

Shows like GoT are so good because anyone and everyone can die, and it’s not boring because you know that even the good guys can get the axe, or making mistakes will have drastic consequences as opposed to stories/shows where the good guy always wins.

It would be nice in future stories that we would have consequences to our actions (or even the NPCs) which result in extremely negative results such as a zone being permanently destroyed or a character being killed off.

BobbyStein.2315:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

By the way, still taking bets on who’s dying this time when we do take down Scarlet. Rox, Kasmeer, Hobo-Tron, or Taimi.

I guess you’ll have to wait and see what happens.

Of course I have to wait and see what happens

But I’m going to make a ton of gold in the process betting with Evon on this. I’d try to bet with Kiel but she keeps telling me I’m lucky to still have my spleen.

BobbyStein.2315:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

By the way, still taking bets on who’s dying this time when we do take down Scarlet. Rox, Kasmeer, Hobo-Tron, or Taimi.

I guess you’ll have to wait and see what happens.

Why? Why do you guys find it necessary to kill off characters? Given Most of the NPCs mentioned been around for a while, but (and it’s a big BUT) you just gave us any kind of connection to the characters in question. We just finally see their deeper side and we’re slowly connecting with their personalities. And you just kill them off right after you gave us something deeper?

If that’s the case, why should we bother connecting with characters to begin with? Why care for characters when you just gonna kill them off at any time in some kind of pointless sacrifice… And yes I am referring to the mentors from personal story. That was the only and (at least I was hoping till now) last time I personally cared for any character in this game. After I got to that scene in that mission I turned off the game hoping I did something wrong, maybe I picked a wrong line. I replayed that mission 4 times just to find out that there was no way around the fact in matter. Personal Story died for me then. And even though I finished PS 7 times now, everything past that moment is just more of a chore.

Now with Living Story we finally (after months of them being life-less NPCS) meet characters that have some depth into them that we can connect on. Some stories that we had no idea about until now are finally surfacing. And we already thinking which ones Anet will kill off?? What’s the point then? Why make characters that are deep, interesting and we finally learn to trust after what happened to our mentor (whichever one it might be) just to get hurt again?

Living Story is finally getting interesting. We’re practically starting it at this point when it comes to story part of it. Don’t make me regret it once again…

Romo.3709:

BobbyStein.2315:

Tobias Trueflight.8350:

By the way, still taking bets on who’s dying this time when we do take down Scarlet. Rox, Kasmeer, Hobo-Tron, or Taimi.

I guess you’ll have to wait and see what happens.

snip

who said anything about killing characters? he’s just saying he won’t spoil anything.