Guild Wars 2

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Currently, I think that if (and that’s still a big if) they do an expansion, it will actually be based between seasons of the Living World, probably using those seasons as build-up for the expansion’s plots.

For example, if the current rumoring of an expansion in progress is accurate, then the expansion will focus primarily on Mordremoth, using Seasons 1 and 2 as build-ins. And Season 3 will be based after the expansion.

Similar to Agents of Shield tv show and the current marvel movies – the tv show is based between the movies, and when the show begins to be based after a movie, there’s a notice saying that the following episodes take place after the events of <insert movie name here>.

This would also be a business ploy for obvious reasons if you care about proper storytelling and experiencing things in chronological order. If you want to understand the build-up, then you’ll have to buy (or remain playing) for the Living World; if you want to know the conclusions, you have to buy the expansions.

If they go with such a route – which currently to me seems to be the case (that or we’re not going to be killing Mordy until Season 5 which would just be utterly stupid) – then the future of plots I see is:

• S2 completes with confronting Caithe and re-obtaining the egg
• Expansion tells how we use the egg to save the world (at long last) and a final confrontation with Mordremoth
• S3 opens with a new plot that will at the very very end tie into the beginning campaign against the next dragon
• S4 said beginning campaign against said next dragon (basically Jormag/Kralk/Scleritethin/Primordus’ version of Claw Island and original greatest fear arcs of PS or E1-5 of S2), perhaps with a different focus akin to the egg.
• Expansion 2 will be the full campaign against said next dragon (effectively the other dragons’ version of assaulting Orr).

etc. etc. rinse repeat

you know what is problem with that kind of story telling?? it makes every living world season to be kind of similar to each other and you already know what is the story and lore of whole thing is all about including the story of expansion before even it gets released. so basically boring similar dragon slaying story over and over again.
expansions of games like wow,swtor,tera,ffx etc they all have new story to tell in fact the expansion of some them already released((swotor.wow)) or they are about to be released soon((tera)) so they revealed some stuff about it.
personally it would be really boring to me when i already know what is in store and no surprise. 5 dragon remaining and it takes 10 years to kill them all based on what you said. if expansion hits every 2 years or else like now it is gonna take even more.

Since you’re here… why does the Far Silverwastes, formerly Mamnoon Lagoon, no longer looks like a lagoon was there? I don’t mind but was really looking forward to seeing an old lagoon.

Edit: And any other naming trivia? ^.^

First, thank you for the quick and precise reply!
I would like to know if you had any plans for the unrevealed areas already while making the unrevealed map. Were there different plans for these areas before the Living Story got launched?

Wait, that was Mamnoon Lagoon?

DiogoSilva.7089:

Wait, that was Mamnoon Lagoon?

http://thatshaman.blogspot.com/p/historical-guide.html?m=1

Yes.

Edit: proper link

what if shing jea island WAS the deep sea dragon?(or at least part of it)
i mean if it has that name and appears armoured like a molisk or turtle or something
then people started to?

i dunno i just remember some giant turtle island concept art or something
it would be cool but unlikely

The DSD awoke in the deepest part of the seas. Shing Jea is well above sea level. Your idea just doesn’t float.

As for the concept art, do you mean this? Because that is Kralkatorrik.

Maybe he’s referring to an artwork for the Luxon turtles.

Wow, I didn’t realize there were so many replies to this.

I’m actually still working on the living story, so forgive me if I don’t know everything yet.

I really like the idea of the dragons as bad guys, but not as primitive forces of nature, since every one of them has their own unique variety of corruption. The fact that they have minions, claim territory, and seem to be personally motivated, means that they can be selfish, greedy, evil, etc… rather than “this is the natural order of things”.

It is the draconic corruption that fascinates me personally, they each have the potential to amass a colossal army. It actually seems strange to me that there’s been pretty much no interactions between the different elder dragons. If they’re allies, we may eventually see mixed bags of different dragon minions fighting together, and if they’re enemies, we may see epic battles between the different armies while being caught in the middle, either outcome sounds pretty awesome.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

The DSD awoke in the deepest part of the seas. Shing Jea is well above sea level. Your idea just doesn’t float.

As for the concept art, do you mean this? Because that is Kralkatorrik.

woa awesome iv never seen that image before and how do we know its kralk?

and yea i know i just thought it would have fit really well (another civilisation that poped up near an ed) but i know it dosnt fit i mean especialy the fact that now shing jea has a perma land bridge

and dsd DID pop up near a civ just not cantha as we know it was… largos/krait? (cant remember witch if not both)

We know it’s Kralkatorrik because that concept art matches his appearance in GW1.

Where the DSD was is subject to debate. Original lore implied – but not confirmed or outright stated – that it awoke near krait civilization. However, current lore suggests this isn’t the case. Dialogue implies that the DSD is now near largos civilization – or rather, its minions are.

oh wow thats really cool
i never actualy saw that stuff in gw1
heh there were to many things to do

perilisk.1874:

DarcShriek.5829:

No, we don’t need to kill them. We just need to keep the magic levels under control. We can put them to sleep and keep them there indefinitely buy controlling magic levels.

Worst. Environmental parable. Ever.

“Monsters are awakening because there is too much oil in the world! We have to burn copious amounts to put them back to sleep!”

It’s more like putting it back in drums and limiting how much you tap out and burn.

Konig Des Todes.2086:

If I were to guess seriously, I would say it’s an international misspelling/respelling of Scylla from Greek mythos. Just as Zhaitan and Jormag are such for other mythos.

Skalabdyss. Veil the origin by making it a respelled portmanteau of Scylla and Charybdis!

Erukk.1408:

I’m hoping the writers have Kralk show a bit more intelligence and maybe a scheming nature when we finally get around to him. DE showed him that the ants are very much a threat to his person…er….(Elder) dragonhood. He might have killed the ant that took control of his mind, but what’s stopping the numerous other ants from trying to follow its lead?

Plus, if he’s keeping tabs on the state of the other Elder Dragons, the death of Zhaitan and Mordremoth (in a couple of LS seasons or new expansion (whatever they’re going with)) proves this point loud in clear. An Elder Dragon makes a nuisance of itself, and the ants are going to rise up and kill them. It might take a different strategy for it to survive.

Well, Glint herself showed that Kralky was crafty enough to want to know what those ants were thinking – except last time he did it through an intermediary. Be interesting if his thought process went something like this:

2 weeks after EoD: My mind-reader betrayed me? FINE, I’LL FIGURE OUT A WAY TO DO IT MYSELF!!!

10 years after EoD: Actually, these ants are pretty interesting…

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Mickey Frogeater.1470:

The Deep Sea Dragon has an S in his name and since *S*hing Jea Island must be named after something so I would assume his name is Shing Jea…..

What’s more I think his corruption involves lillies(why else do Shing Jea’s Dragon Lilies look like Dragons) and vine-like tentacles.

Iirc, Shing Jea is Canthan. It translates to “Shining Jewel” – Shing Jea Island is named such as it is the shining jewel of Cantha.
Shing=Shining
Jea=Jewel

Edit: http://wiki.guildwars.com/wiki/Shing_Jea_Monastery “As the ancient Canthan name implies, Shing Jea is the jewel of Cantha.”

So by your theory, the DSD’s name is… Jewel.

Maybe she’ll sing for us then.

PeterFries.1057:

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Since you’re here… why does the Far Silverwastes, formerly Mamnoon Lagoon, no longer looks like a lagoon was there? I don’t mind but was really looking forward to seeing an old lagoon.

Edit: And any other naming trivia? ^.^

One of the names I suggested for the Silverwastes area was “Fractured Mamnoon”…

Why “Silver”? I mean, the “wastes” part is pretty obvious.

perilisk.1874:

PeterFries.1057:

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Since you’re here… why does the Far Silverwastes, formerly Mamnoon Lagoon, no longer looks like a lagoon was there? I don’t mind but was really looking forward to seeing an old lagoon.

Edit: And any other naming trivia? ^.^

One of the names I suggested for the Silverwastes area was “Fractured Mamnoon”…

Why “Silver”? I mean, the “wastes” part is pretty obvious.

It’s a reference to the GW1 zone that overlaps the western part of the map, Silverwood. Not sure where the silver came from there either, though.

Aaron Ansari.1604:

perilisk.1874:

PeterFries.1057:

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Since you’re here… why does the Far Silverwastes, formerly Mamnoon Lagoon, no longer looks like a lagoon was there? I don’t mind but was really looking forward to seeing an old lagoon.

Edit: And any other naming trivia? ^.^

One of the names I suggested for the Silverwastes area was “Fractured Mamnoon”…

Why “Silver”? I mean, the “wastes” part is pretty obvious.

It’s a reference to the GW1 zone that overlaps the western part of the map, Silverwood. Not sure where the silver came from there either, though.

There are a lot of metal references. Ignoring the breach bosses, Prosperity was a copper mining town, we’re in the Silverwastes, looking for some hypothetical Golden land.

PeterFries.1057:

One of the names I suggested for the Silverwastes area was “Fractured Mamnoon”…

That is so much better than Far Silverwastes… who made the final decision and why haven’t you replaced the guy/gal yet?^^

PeterFries.1057:

Konig Des Todes.2086:

Since you’re here… why does the Far Silverwastes, formerly Mamnoon Lagoon, no longer looks like a lagoon was there? I don’t mind but was really looking forward to seeing an old lagoon.

Edit: And any other naming trivia? ^.^

One of the names I suggested for the Silverwastes area was “Fractured Mamnoon”…

….Lost chance.

Can we get a petition going to rename Far Silverwastes as Fractured Mamnoon?

I admit I was a little disappointed when mapping out SW. All the regions were just (Direction) Silverwastes. I was hoping for area naming with more flavor and lore in it.

Pancake district. Pumpkin pie district! Those don’t help me orient myself. They just make me hungry.
I can see the need to use easy reference names for an area with no real waypoint system (other than Skritt tunnels I guess) but I think it becomes unnecessary after a while. I mean, the map might be confusing at first, but after spending about an hour, or maybe a day for people who are a little slower or just don’t pay attention, you kind of know where everything is. Sort of like how people who run champ trains in Frostgorge can name the sectors they visit without even looking at the map.
But I guess this naming system is better for speeding the learning curve along for everyone.

PeterFries.1057:

What would you have named those sectors? We (mostly) went with cardinal directions to help players orient themselves.

Would you mind elaborating on where that decision came from? To my knowledge, we’ve never struggled with orienting ourselves in a new zone before (getting from point A to point B, sometimes, but not knowing where we are in relation to the center of the zone), and the communication I’ve seen between players has almost always been in fort colors and the bosses. I’d rather not construct an opinion on this until I understand why you guys decided it would be for the better.

PeterFries.1057:

What would you have named those sectors? We (mostly) went with cardinal directions to help players orient themselves.

Good question. First, I’d think about how often players actually need to reference area names when navigating, and under what circumstances. On this map, players mostly reference the four forts when navigating on the fly. It’s easier for people to navigate by landmarks than cardinal directions. The sector names are used more by NPC’s and achievement guides.

Secondly, consider whether ending each sector name with “Silverwastes” is beneficial. If you want to keep the directions for the sake of teaching players the map, you can change the second word instead and keep or modify the first.

The areas containing the forts could be named to keep the color coding, even if it’s done subtly. Alternately, they could take after the legendary bosses beneath them. This will help players remember where they are. Also, don’t forget to hint at some sort of lore and maybe a lost purpose for the site.

Central Silverwastes, for example, could become “Indika’s Gilded Heart.” This hints at the Indigo Cave, the boss Gold beneath it, and its central location. Plus, it makes you wonder how it got the name, and creates a storytelling naming pattern that can be used across the map. Players are already curious about the local lore of who built these structures and why – give them something to nibble on.

perilisk.1874:

PeterFries.1057:

One of the names I suggested for the Silverwastes area was “Fractured Mamnoon”…

Why “Silver”? I mean, the “wastes” part is pretty obvious.

Have you even started hunting the golden badges yet, you’ll understand why it’s silverwastes afterwards… it’s got to do with how many times you need to WP

PeterFries.1057:

What would you have named those sectors? We (mostly) went with cardinal directions to help players orient themselves.

I don’t think cardinal directions is needed to help players orientate themselves. After all, players don’t have an issue organizing groups through even the Crown Pavilion which is without area names, or through any other map (such as Dry Top).

And with Silverwastes, players have continuously gone by fort colors as Aaron said – or boss type during Breach. The fact that players can also manage directing to the Tangled Labyrinth also shows that a name like “Far South Silverwastes” or “Underground Silverwastes” wasn’t necessary.

In fact, I’d argue the similar naming system creates a bigger issue. If the sectors were named uniquely, then players may be using them instead of/alongside fort colors (if they weren’t hard to type out at least). But with everything being <XYZ> Silverwastes, you can’t really do that. And if you type out say, “NE champ” – well… northeast of what exactly? Sector names? NE of you? NE portion of the area you’re in (how folks denote north or south champion spawns at Coiled Watch chain)? Lots of variances.

So yeah, I’d say the current system makes it harder rather than easier to navigate and orientate due to shared naming, but players bypass this harder factor by using PoI names instead.

TL;DR
Trying to direct players via repetitive names is not a good idea, and cardinal directions is very subjective in communications – you need a basis point to direct folks from (in your concept, that would effectively be Indigo Cave – the very center of the zone – but such wouldn’t be known to all players, especially newly joined ones, though it theoretically wouldn’t take too long to figure out, but the same can thus be said for unique named areas), and it only gives a 2d directional pad, so once you add in, say, a huge underground area -coughs-, it becomes less useful if not useless.

This goes double when you’re using the same naming scheme for locations irrelevant to the main course of the goal (i.e., Northeastern Silverwastes and Northern Silverwastes has no forts or purpose beyond the skritt Scratch and bandit champ respectively – there’s no need, even by your reasonings, to really use the same naming scheme; this also, if not far more so, goes for the Far Silverwastes as of now).

As for what I would name them….

• Far Silverwastes: Fractured Mamnoon (I do like that name – alt: Mamnoon Chasm/Canyon; either one would point to saying ‘hey, this is where Mamnoon Lagoon once was, but it’s dried up and gone’)
• Northwestern Silverwastes: Silverwoods’ Remains (out of the western edges, this is the most forested still)
• Northern Silverwastes: Blasted Wastes (of all of Silverwastes, this area feels the most desert-like, thus a name befitting of that desolation and earthy concept that emphasizes “this is the Wastes” feel most appropriate here and coincides with the PoI name “Wailing Sands”)
• Northeastern Silverwastes: New Krytan Frontier (a nod to the note found in Amber Sandfall, and to the bandits that are excavating, hinting to this being an edge of the “New Kryta” areas)
• Southeastern Silverwastes: Crimsonstone Cliffs (to give a sense for Red Rock’s name, and the geography of overhanging cliffs to the southwest of the fort)

I can’t think of anything decent (imo) for Central and Southwestern Silverwastes off the top of my head. I’d probably name Central at a subliminal hint to the nature of the ruins, while Southwestern a nod to the White Mantle (to add to the suggested name for Northeastern – pure opposites named after the WM/bandit lore).

Your TL;DR was longer than your initial post, KDT

As for naming alternatives; why couldn’t the area names in The Silverwastes just have been named for its forts?

After all, the entrance to the area is called “Camp Resolve” – clearly a staging area camp going into The Silverwastes.

So changing the map names to

Northwestern Silverwastes – Blue Oasis
Central Silverwastes – Indigo Cave
Southwestern Silverwastes – Amber Sandfall
Southeastern Silverwastes – Red Rock Bastion
Northeastern Silverwastes – Picaroon Canyon (it’s sort of like a canyon around that POI, right?)
Northern Silverwastes – Quarrel Falls (nod to GW1 hub in the south west)
Far Silverwastes – Fractured Mamnoon (because I liked this suggestion)

So… unique area names were “too confusing for players”. Where have I heard that before? =D

I thought it had no unique names because Silverwastes is basically a warzone and no one had bothered to give it unique names yet.

I too very much like the suggestion of “fractured Mamnoon” – at least it kind of aknowledges GW1 and its lagoon ever existed…

Dondarrion.2748:

perilisk.1874:

PeterFries.1057:

One of the names I suggested for the Silverwastes area was “Fractured Mamnoon”…

Why “Silver”? I mean, the “wastes” part is pretty obvious.

Have you even started hunting the golden badges yet, you’ll understand why it’s silverwastes afterwards… it’s got to do with how many times you need to WP

Hey, I think you nailed it. It does sound a lot more poetic than “Goldsink Gorge”.

Dondarrion.2748:

Your TL;DR was longer than your initial post, KDT

It was two paragraphs…. I guess I should have put my suggested names before the TL;DR as the two were separate.

Added a separation line between the two. There, now my TL;DR isn’t longer! :P

Dondarrion.2748:

As for naming alternatives; why couldn’t the area names in The Silverwastes just have been named for its forts?

After all, the entrance to the area is called “Camp Resolve” – clearly a staging area camp going into The Silverwastes.

The difference, to me, is that the entire area called Camp Resolve is, indeed, Camp Resolve. However, only a small part of the Northwestern Silverwastes is Blue Oasis.

The only sector that would make sense to follow Camp Resolve’s naming would be Northern Shelf/Northeastern Silverwastes – and arguably the PoI shouldn’t exist for them. They’re repetative.

Central Silverwastes could arguably work since most of it is the cave, but it’d be the only one.

PeterFries.1057:

We went with cardinal directions on the map because we were going to be sending people through a network of skritt tunnels and seeing the option to go to the Eastern Silverwastes seemed easier to understand than seeing something like “Take skritt tunnel to Goosepinch Gulch.”

I can definitely understand the forts and I don’t htink that was a bad move. Only Blue Oasis really feels out of place (perhaps “Blue Oasis Fort” wouldn’t though), and somewhat Amber Sandfall (“Amber Sandfall Camp”?). But I digress with that tiny bit.

I can understand the point for the sectors, but just as people aren’t confused by the skritt tunnel to Camp Resolve, I don’t think they would be confused for any sector not relevant to the forts. One could easily have simply had NE/NW/SE/SW/Central Silverwastes (Northern being renamed to Northeastern) and then have present Northeastern and Far renamed to something more thematic. That would then give the feel of “hey, it’s this portion that’s the real Silverwastes (most of which overlaps with Silverwood), the rest are just outliers part of the zone (including Mamnoon)”.

Though I think any confusion would have only been during the first few hours/days of gameplay, thus unnecessary in the long run.

But I suppose it’s too late to fix here, so just feedback for the future. Just my 2 cents.

PeterFries.1057:

Goosepinch Gulch

The next time you get to name places on a map, you better not forget this gem!

PeterFries.1057:

Thanks for your feedback, everyone.

In development, I’d given the various forts much more nondescript names like Derelict Enclave and Desolate Bastion, but feedback from testing the content wisely suggested renaming the forts so that players could organize themselves by something more distinctive, like colors. By then, it helped that the environment art was far enough along to actually tell what these forts were going to look like and we could collaborate to make the chosen colors make some sense, like “Blue Oasis.”

We went with cardinal directions on the map because we were going to be sending people through a network of skritt tunnels and seeing the option to go to the Eastern Silverwastes seemed easier to understand than seeing something like “Take skritt tunnel to Goosepinch Gulch.”

Here’s a real ‘inside baseball’ story: when it came time to add a sector for the new sector where you plant the third memory seed, I was stumped on how to name that place so that it was easy to describe where to go in dialogue. We already had a “Northern Silverwastes”—was I going to have to send players north of north? Luckily someone reminded me that we have the “Far Shiverpeaks,” and then I had my place name.

That’s where you could have called it Mamnoon Bowl or similar, in my opinion. There’s no organisational reason why players go there, so the direction is not important – except that the Far Silverwastes implies to me that it’s a long way from something in particular. Far Shiverpeaks were as far north as you could go before freezing to death, so it made sense. I didn’t see a clear link for the Silverwastes though.

You know, if the war with Mordremoth ever ends, it might be possible to give the SIlverwastes areas unique names.