Guild Wars 2

I’ve ran through the labyrinth enough to notice that the rewards do not weigh up against the armor repair grind. Constant instant kills, and every death damages your armor? No thanks! Not to mention that when you do have the key, the central room is crawling with enemies, so it’s pretty much a trial and error affair to get to that nightmare pod alive, plus it also has terrible loot!

You simply get better rewards from digging up buried treasure. So it there any reason to do the labyrinth, after getting the achievement? I don’t see any reason.

What do you mean? There is repair anvil right next to the entrance and repairing is free.

The chest also drops the gloves box.

And indeed there is a repair anvil at the start (and repairs are free). It is also fully possible to not die in there by playing smartly and/or (dare I even say it?) work together with others.

Ameepa.6793:

What do you mean? There is repair anvil right next to the entrance and repairing is free.

Is it really? So wait, if I repair using that anvil the repairs are free? But if I repair anywhere else, it costs money? Argh! Why is this game so inconsistent?!

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Ameepa.6793:

What do you mean? There is repair anvil right next to the entrance and repairing is free.

Is it really? So wait, if I repair using that anvil the repairs are free? But if I repair anywhere else, it costs money? Argh! Why is this game so inconsistent?!

Repairing has been free everywhere for a long time now. At least over a year, can’t remember exactly when they removed the cost.

Edit: Not a year but it was removed in march
https://www.guildwars2.com/en/news/say-goodbye-to-armor-repair-costs-and-hello-to-free-trait-resets/

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Ameepa.6793:

What do you mean? There is repair anvil right next to the entrance and repairing is free.

Is it really? So wait, if I repair using that anvil the repairs are free? But if I repair anywhere else, it costs money? Argh! Why is this game so inconsistent?!

repairing armor is free everywhere, has been for awhile now.

This is just so confusing. I’m pretty sure I was paying for my armor repairs yesterday at Camp Resolve.

The design seems all over the place. Now you pay for armor repairs, now you don’t. Now you have magic find, now you don’t, and now every boss drops champion bags which negate magic find entirely. Now we have bosses that have indomitable, and pretty much negate half the game’s combat mechanics entirely! Some items are account bound, some are not, and some are character bound on acquire. Some items can be salvaged, some cannot, even if they are of the same item-type as items that you can salvage (which is especially fun after doing Fractals, and getting that gold item that you cannot sell, thanks!). Some transformation tonics can be traded, some cannot, because they are account bound. Now we have dye drops, now we don’t, but now we do because they still drop from quest rewards. Now we unlock skills as we use a weapon, and now we unlock them with every few levels. Now we buy traits with skill points, and now we have to unlock them by killing certain champions.

-Breaths deeply-

Speaking of which! Veteran enemies, Champion enemies, Elite enemies, Legendary enemies! Some champions and elites take a lot of players to take down, some can be easily taken down solo. I no longer know the difference. Now we have red rings of death that you have to dodge, but we also have red rings that hardly do any damage at all. And now with the living story we have orange rings of certainly death, and we have exceptions where the orange attacks are still painful, but not deadly. And now we have a maze filled with enemies that insta-kill people, for no apparent reason. Want to bet that these very same enemies will not be insta-killing us in the next Living Story chapter?

This game has turned into such an inconsistent mess!

the “only” thing you pay is the silver and some copper for the waypoint

They changed the repair cost quite long ago and since then there have been no price for repair anyway.

Dyes have always been said to drop from quest rewards. Which was also announced back when they made dyes account-bound.

Feels like complaining for the sake of complaining to me.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

This is just so confusing. The design seems all over the place. Now you pay for armor repairs, now you don’t. Now you have magic find, now you don’t, and now every boss drops champion bags which negate magic find entirely. Now we have bosses that have indomitable, and pretty much negate half the game’s combat mechanics entirely! Some items are account bound, some are not, and some are character bound on acquire. Some items can be salvaged, some cannot, even if they are of the same item-type as items that you can salvage (which is especially fun after doing Fractals, and getting that gold item that you cannot sell, thanks!). Some transformation tonics can be traded, some cannot, because they are account bound. Now we have dye drops, now we don’t, but now we do because they still drop from quest rewards. Now we have red rings of death that you have to dodge, but we also have red rings that hardly do any damage at all. And now with the living story we have orange rings of certainly death, and we have exceptions where the orange attacks are still painful, but not deadly. And now we have a maze filled with enemies that insta-kill people, for no apparent reason. Want to bet that these very same enemies will not be insta-killing us in the next Living Story chapter? This game has turned into such an inconsistent mess!

Yea that is how it goes, things and mechanics change many times during the life span of any mmo. That is one good reason to check the patch notes after larger patches.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

This is just so confusing. The design seems all over the place. Now you pay for armor repairs, now you don’t. Now you have magic find, now you don’t, and now every boss drops champion bags which negate magic find entirely. Now we have bosses that have indomitable, and pretty much negate half the game’s combat mechanics entirely! Some items are account bound, some are not, and some are character bound on acquire. Some items can be salvaged, some cannot, even if they are of the same item-type as items that you can salvage (which is especially fun after doing Fractals, and getting that gold item that you cannot sell, thanks!). Some transformation tonics can be traded, some cannot, because they are account bound. Now we have dye drops, now we don’t, but now we do because they still drop from quest rewards. Now we have red rings of death that you have to dodge, but we also have red rings that hardly do any damage at all. And now with the living story we have orange rings of certainly death, and we have exceptions where the orange attacks are still painful, but not deadly. And now we have a maze filled with enemies that insta-kill people, for no apparent reason. Want to bet that these very same enemies will not be insta-killing us in the next Living Story chapter? This game has turned into such an inconsistent mess!

Actually most of the things mentioned here are explained in patch notes, and as others have mentioned, armor repair is free for about a year now (no offense intended, but I imagine how much this has bothered you if you haven’t even noticed).

For the rewards, I found it really underwhelming (gold wise) the first time around. Then I organized a map with killing all 5 breach bosses. Turns out you get a big key (for the big chest in the middle) if you kill all 5 breach bosses, so that’s a nice bonus. With a little practise, and the bonus of running thief/mesmer (access to invis) which make the Labyrinth a lot easier you’ll get a decent amount of loot (less dying = more loot or in other words the better you are more the loot).

All in all I didn’t like it at first. But turns out if you organize it, put in effort, work together with others it actually gets good. Still the same old champ bag, dragonite 2 blues and a green rewards (which I’m not happy about I got a thread o nthat), but the quantity is okay.

Ameepa.6793:

Yea that is how it goes, things and mechanics change many times during the life span of any mmo. That is one good reason to check the patch notes after larger patches.

Of course they do, and that is to be expected. I expect them to improve on the game. But there are so many conflicting ideas in the game right now. Like those insta-kill enemies. I get it, it’s a game of pac-man. But why do they insta-kill players? And will we be seeing the same enemies in regular content in the next episode? Because if they don’t insta-kill outside the labyrinth, that is just highly inconsistent. It confuses the heck out of me, and I’ve been playing this game since launch. Why is the design so all over the place? Can’t the designers agree on just one thing, and then consistently apply that change to the whole game?

And now we have this magic find buff in the Silver Wastes which gives us extra magic find when opening bandit chests… but Anet has been pretty explicit regarding the fact that magic find “does not affect chests”. So now they’ve added an exception to that rule just for this one zone. Make up your mind anet! And this leads to all sorts of confusion. Is the buff the only thing that affects your magic find when opening those chests, or are the chests affected by your total magic find value as well? If not, why?

I had the same at start died a lot but after figure out the mechanics is was ok

but still no big fun and it feels way out of story

A tower defense game would be better IMO or even switching sides we become the enemy and attack the Fortress

I had the same at start died a lot but after figure out the mechanics is was ok

but still no big fun and it feels way out of story

A tower defense game would be better IMO or even switching sides we become the enemy and attack the Fortress

I agree Balsa. I think I would have liked to see something that was less gimmicky, and more about using existing game mechanics, rather than negating them. I feel the designers are doing that too much: Negating existing game mechanics, because they don’t work very well, and coming up with exceptions. I don’t want exceptions. Either fix the existing game system, or work with what you got. But don’t negate it, and don’t constantly add exceptions to the rules.

So yeah, a basic tower defense game, or something where the whole zone battles their way into the labyrinth, would have been much more fitting.

Now we have a game of basically pac-man, as the climax to an event where we defend fortresses WvW-style, against hordes of enemies. This doesn’t fit.

It makes more sense to me, that after defending a bunch of fortresses, that the logical conclusion to that, is that you strike back. I wanted to see an epic finale, where we assault the underground labyrinth, and face off against a big boss. Running around in a labyrinth does not feel like a fitting follow up.

Sorry to nitpick again, but if you mean by “gimmicky” that you can’t use your own skills (which you can btw), or not using game machanics (not sure what you mean), than how would a Tower defense be less of that?

As for the story, you went in after the Peacemaster dude and for the egg, I think the Labyrinth was just there to show how “complex” the vines are and how corrupted underground is.

The final boss fight is yet to come, as a cutscene idicated in Echoes of the past (at the chopper thing, huge purple flower). This thread here has something figured out already: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/livingworld/s2/So-That-West-of-Silverwastes-Reminded-Me

So it will come, just not yet.

Bubi.7942:

Sorry to nitpick again, but if you mean by “gimmicky” that you can’t use your own skills (which you can btw), or not using game mechanics (not sure what you mean), than how would a Tower defense be less of that?

Tower Defense, I assume, would simply be us running around fighting enemies, while building defensive structures. Just like how Toy-pocalypse still has us running around, fighting enemies.

I’m not saying tower defense is a great idea, since it has been done to death already in countless other games. But it’s in my opinion a better alternative.

And no, you can’t use your skills. Not while transformed, which you need to survive against the hordes of insta-kill enemies. Anything in between is just you popping a running skill, or invulnerability. But you are not fighting any enemies. That is what I mean with gimmicks. Anything that disables normal game play, in favor of something else. The game’s mechanics are combat oriented. So making you unable to fight for what ever reason, feels like a departure from what the game is about.

I wonder why the developers seem so eager to abandon the core game play of their own game? Just make regular game play fun! Don’t disable our skills, make use of our skills!

Think labyrint more as a kind of mini-game (like southsun survival, crab toss, etc), but in normal outworld. It is just a little break time activity. Something a bit different than nonstop combat that the rest of the silverwaste “round” is.

Underdark.3726:

the “only” thing you pay is the silver and some copper for the waypoint

Except if that waypoint happens to be in the same town you are in, because then it is for free. See, this is what I mean. It feels like almost everything in the game has some sort of exception. It’s full of inconsistent design.

Ameepa.6793:

Think labyrint more as a kind of mini-game (like southsun survival, crab toss, etc), but in normal outworld. It is just a little break time activity. Something a bit different than nonstop combat that the rest of the silverwaste “round” is.

I understand that it is meant as a sort of minigame, but it doesn’t seem like a very fitting place to put a minigame. Currently it is the conclusion of a long row of fortress defense phases, and a lot of fighting. Right after we beat all the bosses on the map, this area opens up, where we suddenly are not fighting, but running around in a maze. It’s a nice idea, but this does not feel like the appropriate place to put such a minigame. It feels like an anti-climax (plus I don’t like the mini game, it is too much trial and error, with poor rewards).

I think you need to get rid of your glass cannon build…

Very few players are capable of staying alive long in SW with a full DPS build.
You are clearly one of the many.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Tower Defense, I assume, would simply be us running around fighting enemies, while building defensive structures. Just like how Toy-pocalypse still has us running around, fighting enemies.

I’m not saying tower defense is a great idea, since it has been done to death already in countless other games. But it’s in my opinion a better alternative.

And no, you can’t use your skills. Not while transformed, which you need to survive against the hordes of insta-kill enemies. Anything in between is just you popping a running skill, or invulnerability. But you are not fighting any enemies. That is what I mean with gimmicks. Anything that disables normal game play, in favor of something else. The game’s mechanics are combat oriented. So making you unable to fight for what ever reason, feels like a departure from what the game is about.

I wonder why the developers seem so eager to abandon the core game play of their own game? Just make regular game play fun! Don’t disable our skills, make use of our skills!

Hm.

Toypocalypse. Didn’t you have gimmicky weapons there? Like toy rifle, candy cane thing, repar guns etc..?

Also I fail to see why that would be a good idea, after you’ve been doing exactly the thing that you are describing: You’ve been defending (tower defence) forts from waves of incoming enemies the last 30 mins to 1 hours (depends on map).

The Labyrtinth is actually a good change of pace now that I think about it, instead of the endless defenses phases out there (which you can somewhat still continue with champ hunting cause they spawn while Lab is on).

As I mentioned earlier, the rewards are quite good if you/your map is doing good.

“I wonder why the developers seem so eager to abandon the core game play” – and this is just überhyperbole, and you know it.

Edit: I’m not even sure at this point what this thread is about.

Novuake.2691:

I think you need to get rid of your glass cannon build…

Very few players are capable of staying alive long in SW with a full DPS build.
You are clearly one of the many.

What…? No I’m not. I’m wearing full knights, and nearly everything about my build is about survival. I have about as much tanking power as is possible in the game (plus I am a necromancer, so I can also hide in Death Shroud, and my runes turn me to Mist Form at low health). I have excellent staying power in the Silverwastes, and hardly die at all. But all that is irrelevant, that was not under discussion at all. It seems odd how you would instantly jump to that conclusion that that is what this thread is about. As if you casually glanced over the title, instantly dropped a quick standard reply to bash the skills of the poster, and then scampered out of the thread again. Its a pretty cheap thing to do. And it couldn’t be further from the truth.

The labyrinth insta-kills anyone, regardless of their equipment. That is the entire point of the labyrinth. The labyrinth, which we were discussing. Not the Silver Wastes, but that sub-area of the Silver Wastes that was recently added.

Bubi.7942:

“I wonder why the developers seem so eager to abandon the core game play” – and this is just überhyperbole, and you know it.

How so?

Bubi.7942:

Edit: I’m not even sure at this point what this thread is about.

Still about the labyrinth.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Bubi.7942:

Edit: I’m not even sure at this point what this thread is about.

Still about the labyrinth.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Underdark.3726:

the “only” thing you pay is the silver and some copper for the waypoint

Except if that waypoint happens to be in the same town you are in, because then it is for free. See, this is what I mean. It feels like almost everything in the game has some sort of exception. It’s full of inconsistent design.

is it about the labyrinth or is it not? decide.

Underdark.3726:

is it about the labyrinth or is it not? decide.

That was a bit of a tangent, I do apologize for any confusion. But it is related to the topic at hand. The inconsistencies. Up to this point, I had no idea that the armor repairs were free. I assumed that it still required money. I can’t be alone in thinking this. But the way points do still cost money. Why? This is inconsistent.

WP costs money coz the Asura had to invest in R&D and outsourced bookah labor to have them constructed all over Tyria. Gotta pay licensing fees and royalties to Asura, technology aint cheap. Other option is for you to walk instead…

Okay, there are separate issues here mushed together, for which I think 1 thread is not sufficient and should be treated individually.

I think the the original problem of this thread, namely armor repair costs has been dealt with.

If you would like to discuss other things such as:
- Inconsistent attributes of mobs
- The Labyrinth not fitting in the story
- Not enough info on game changes
- Free armor repair
- Waypoint costs
- Not using your own skillset but a bundle (in general)
- Not using your own skillset but a bundle (in the Labyrinth)
then I recommend opening new threads for them, as this is getting very messy and deterring from the original issue.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Now we have a game of basically pac-man, as the climax to an event where we defend fortresses WvW-style, against hordes of enemies. This doesn’t fit.

It makes more sense to me, that after defending a bunch of fortresses, that the logical conclusion to that, is that you strike back. I wanted to see an epic finale, where we assault the underground labyrinth, and face off against a big boss. Running around in a labyrinth does not feel like a fitting follow up.

Thanks very much. After I read the above I realised that this is exactely what I do not like about the pac-man-minimap and could not put into words.

Greetings.

Bubi.7942:

For the rewards, I found it really underwhelming (gold wise) the first time around. Then I organized a map with killing all 5 breach bosses. Turns out you get a big key (for the big chest in the middle) if you kill all 5 breach bosses, so that’s a nice bonus.

That’s what I did as well. I helped command one of the fortresses the day after this episode went live, and we killed all 5 bosses on our first try, and got a key. I went into the labyrinth, died about twenty times trying to get to the center, and then got some green items from the chest for all my trouble.

So let me get this straight.

• The whole map organizes itself, and defends the fortresses.
• They then defeat these 5 bosses within the time limit, and are awarded with a key.
• And that key opens up a chest, that is annoying to get to, and gives a few greens, with a very minor chance to drop a box with armor.

All I need to do is use one shovel, to dig up a better reward. Is there really any reason to do the labyrinth? I don’t like the game play, so is there any real gain?

I’m really sorry but this is: It’s either the hyperbole ride again, or you are not paying attention at all what happens in game, or just plain ly… … hiding away parts of the truth to make your argument look better.

So I guess this thread is about rewards now, fine.

1. You get rewarded throughout the whole defense section of the meta event. Meaning you get shovels, bags of gear, bandit crests and an occasional rare from completing events.
2. You get rewarded for killing your own breach boss.
3. You get rewarded for how many breach bosses your map has killed. Killing all 5, contrary to your statement, does not award you with 1 key. It awards you with Champ bags (5 I think? not sure), 3 rare bags, Bags of gear (again, not sure about the number), and Bandit Crests. You get the 1 Key on top of that.
4. I’m sorry to say, but if it took you 20 tries to get to the chest to the middle, you have some serious issues. Getting there: get the first flower transfer thing, run straight. You have arrived, congrats. For that you get rewarded with 2 champ bags, I think some bags of gear, and some junk.
5. The Labyrinth has 3 phases where people open chest, if enough opened, you get rewarded for each phase (if you participated). The rewards are (yet again) champ bags, junk and I think a rare bag.
6. You get rewards for opening the small chests. During a full Labyrinth run it’s possible to open 50+ small chests – meaning you not only get the (mostly junk) rewards from the small chests, but you can combine the thigns you get from them and open middle chest 2 more times.
7. With the small chests, your “skill” is rewarded. The less you die, the more you get. If you really died 20 times during the time you wanted to get to middle (which I highly doubt) I do advise you to stay away from the Labyrinth or to revise the mechanics of the Labyrinth or basic game machanics. I find it fair that more experienced, dextrous (not sure if word exists) people are rewarded more.

Bubi.7942:

I’m really sorry but this is: It’s either the hyperbole ride again, or you are not paying attention at all what happens in game, or just plain ly… … hiding away parts of the truth to make your argument look better.

I’m relaying my experience. I don’t see how you would come to the conclusion that I was lying. Hyperboles, lying, hiding the truth…. How about discussing the issue, rather than attacking the person for expressing her opinion?

Bubi.7942:

So I guess this thread is about rewards now, fine.

It’s about the labyrinth in general. The rewards are part of that discussion.

Bubi.7942:

1. You get rewarded throughout the whole defense section of the meta event. Meaning you get shovels, bags of gear, bandit crests and an occasional rare from completing events.
2. You get rewarded for killing your own breach boss.
3. You get rewarded for how many breach bosses your map has killed. Killing all 5, contrary to your statement, does not award you with 1 key. It awards you with Champ bags (5 I think? not sure), 3 rare bags, Bags of gear (again, not sure about the number), and Bandit Crests. You get the 1 Key on top of that.

The rewards of the defense is not under discussion. It’s the reward for the labyrinth that I’m discussing. Yes, killing the 5 bosses rewards you with a key. That is true, and most definitely not a lie, or hiding the truth. Yes, it also rewards you with champ bags…. but that is NOT under discussion. I was making a point about the rewards from the nightmare pod in the labyrinth, and not the rewards that you receive before the labyrinth.

Bubi.7942:

I4. I’m sorry to say, but if it took you 20 tries to get to the chest to the middle, you have some serious issues. Getting there: get the first flower transfer thing, run straight. You have arrived, congrats.

And that’s not always true. See screenshot.

Bubi.7942:

IIf you really died 20 times during the time you wanted to get to middle (which I highly doubt)

Why do you doubt it? Dozens of players that joined me also died, and a lot more than 20 times. See screenshot. The flowers do not give you enough time to reach the middle, if the monsters are in the middle corridor (which is where they start). Which means it becomes an annoying affair of trial and error to make it past the monsters, to the pod.

Further more, with that many players running to the middle, the monsters do not move away from the center of the labyrinth. They stay there, killing players over and over again.

The screenshot shows players running to the pod for about the 15th time. These people would soon die shortly after, because as you can see in the screenshot there is a huge mob of monsters waiting for us, and the flower is about to run out for all of us.

That place in the center of the labyrinth has 2 entries and the shortest way is not always the best.

And I´ve opened the big pod there about 5 times so far and always received one rare and some other things. But Necromancer for sure isn´t the best class for the labyrinth, that´s certainly a little downside.

When I entered the labyrinth for the first time I died within 30 secs. Once I realized how to play I could go everywhere and get to the center no problem. Was a really fun game and cool addition to the map. Sounds a lot like complaints about something you’re not good at. Got tons of blues/greens and a little over a dozen rares. Nothing amazing but fun and not like it’s hard. Repair is free everywhere (you may have been mistaken about a cost), waypoint is around 1 silver (waypoints always been based on distance and free within capital cities since launch), and the flower ability is a fun mechanic to add strategy. If you don’t enjoy it (or just aren’t good at the labyrinth) then keep farming chests. From this thread sounds like most people really enjoyed it. Why would you want a game that doesn’t change and mix things up?

hydeaut.1758:

That place in the center of the labyrinth has 2 entries and the shortest way is not always the best.

In this particular case, there was an equal amount of monsters camping this entrance, as the other. When I finally did make it to the pod, I tried to leave through the other path, and noticed a dozen dead players there as well, with monsters camping their position.

I think maybe they should have made the central chamber a safe zone.

jblade.6470:

Why would you want a game that doesn’t change and mix things up?

I never said that I did.

I just give up.

You are talking about an incosistent mess, yet you change the subject in each of your posts, contradict your self within them, selectively awnser to what you feel like, claim half-truths and just hide away facts. Nice.

“I’m relaying my experience. I don’t see how you would come to the conclusion that I was lying.” + “They then defeat these 5 bosses within the time limit, and are awarded with a key.”

- You said you are awarded with a Key. That is not true, the key is the bonus you get on top of the usual rewards

“The rewards of the defense is not under discussion”

Oh okay, then why the … fluffly little kitten did you bring it up? Was this part there for just show: “The whole map organizes itself, and defends the fortresses.
They then defeat these 5 bosses within the time limit, and are awarded with a key.”

For the rest of your post:
You get the buff for like 10 seconds (dunno exact, too lazy to Wiki it up), which is more than enough to get to midde (lie number 2), you also get to stun the flower dogs with the skill you get. You could also try no going to the middle when you enter, you got 12 mins to do it (or 13?).

Well that’s it for me. I’ll return when you start to make sense.

/wave

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Bubi.7942:

For the rewards, I found it really underwhelming (gold wise) the first time around. Then I organized a map with killing all 5 breach bosses. Turns out you get a big key (for the big chest in the middle) if you kill all 5 breach bosses, so that’s a nice bonus.

That’s what I did as well. I helped command one of the fortresses the day after this episode went live, and we killed all 5 bosses on our first try, and got a key. I went into the labyrinth, died about twenty times trying to get to the center, and then got some green items from the chest for all my trouble.

So let me get this straight.

• The whole map organizes itself, and defends the fortresses.
• They then defeat these 5 bosses within the time limit, and are awarded with a key.
• And that key opens up a chest, that is annoying to get to, and gives a few greens, with a very minor chance to drop a box with armor.

All I need to do is use one shovel, to dig up a better reward. Is there really any reason to do the labyrinth? I don’t like the game play, so is there any real gain?

Trolling? The center chest give you 3 champ bags and a rare with a chance at the gloves skin. The little chests give you greens.

Bubi.7942:

I just give up.

You are talking about an inconsistent mess, yet you change the subject in each of your posts, contradict your self within them, selectively answer to what you feel like, claim half-truths and just hide away facts. Nice.

Noticed that when he/she picked one sentence out of what I said instead of discussing anything in my post. Think it’s a troll XD

Just as a note, Stealth seems to be perfectly functional against those Luminescent wolves or w/e they are in the Labyrinth.

My suggestion: Find yourself a pair of thieves who are built for stealth and tag along with them. Get enough thieves and you can actually perma-stealth through there, I’d imagine.

Bubi.7942:

- You said you are awarded with a Key. That is not true, the key is the bonus you get on top of the usual rewards

I was trying to illustrate the amount of things that need to be done, before having access to the labyrinth at all. And making a point that the rewards for doing so, do not weigh up against the effort needed to open the pod. This is not about the details of whether or nor you get anything else apart from the key from killing those 5 bosses. You are derailing the actual point. And further more, you are claiming I am lying, because I left out that you also get other drops from killing the 5 bosses.

Bubi.7942:

“The rewards of the defense is not under discussion”

Oh okay, then why the … fluffly little kitten did you bring it up? Was this part there for just show: “The whole map organizes itself, and defends the fortresses.
They then defeat these 5 bosses within the time limit, and are awarded with a key.”

I think it is painfully clear that I was illustrating the chain of events needed to access the nightmare pod. Does that really need to be explained?

Bubi.7942:

You get the buff for like 10 seconds (dunno exact, too lazy to Wiki it up), which is more than enough to get to midde

Which is not true. Try it, I dare you. In fact, look at the screenshot. Notice the players whose buff have already ran out BEFORE they’ve reached the room.

jblade.6470:

Noticed that when he/she picked one sentence out of what I said instead of discussing anything in my post. Think it’s a troll XD

When I respond to a particular point, I am attacked for not addressing everything else.
When I reply to every single line in someone’s post, people complain that it is too much of a quote war. When I post multiple responses, people lose track of the discussion. Further, I had to look if you actually made any other points, and you really didn’t There was NOTHING else in your post to reply to, at all. You expressed an opinion that you liked it, which is fine. But I have nothing to add to that, you are perfectly entitled to like the labyrinth when others don’t.

These are all dishonest forum tactics. Just discuss the point, or don’t post at all.

It is patently dishonest to attack someone, because they didn’t respond to all of your points. ESPECIALLY, if they did address those points, by replying to someone else who made the same point. If you feel a particular point needs answering, then by all means say so. But please stay clear of personal dishonest attacks.

Ykfox.3825:

Just as a note, Stealth seems to be perfectly functional against those Luminescent wolves or w/e they are in the Labyrinth.

My suggestion: Find yourself a pair of thieves who are built for stealth and tag along with them. Get enough thieves and you can actually perma-stealth through there, I’d imagine.

That might work, but it indicates a bit of a design flaw, when this sort of strategy is called for.

The green guys were coming into the center, as well. Killed my poor lil mes after she got there safely. Are they supposed to do that?

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

This is just so confusing. I’m pretty sure I was paying for my armor repairs yesterday at Camp Resolve.

The design seems all over the place. Now you pay for armor repairs, now you don’t. Now you have magic find, now you don’t, and now every boss drops champion bags which negate magic find entirely. Now we have bosses that have indomitable, and pretty much negate half the game’s combat mechanics entirely! Some items are account bound, some are not, and some are character bound on acquire. Some items can be salvaged, some cannot, even if they are of the same item-type as items that you can salvage (which is especially fun after doing Fractals, and getting that gold item that you cannot sell, thanks!). Some transformation tonics can be traded, some cannot, because they are account bound. Now we have dye drops, now we don’t, but now we do because they still drop from quest rewards. Now we unlock skills as we use a weapon, and now we unlock them with every few levels. Now we buy traits with skill points, and now we have to unlock them by killing certain champions.

-Breaths deeply-

Speaking of which! Veteran enemies, Champion enemies, Elite enemies, Legendary enemies! Some champions and elites take a lot of players to take down, some can be easily taken down solo. I no longer know the difference. Now we have red rings of death that you have to dodge, but we also have red rings that hardly do any damage at all. And now with the living story we have orange rings of certainly death, and we have exceptions where the orange attacks are still painful, but not deadly. And now we have a maze filled with enemies that insta-kill people, for no apparent reason. Want to bet that these very same enemies will not be insta-killing us in the next Living Story chapter?

This game has turned into such an inconsistent mess!

It isn’t really an inconsistent mess though, changes happen and you can learn about those both in the patch notes as well as just by playing and paying attention.

Armor repairs have been free for about a year now, just because you didn’t notice it doesn’t mean it is confusing, just that paying a bit more attention would help a lot of heartache.

All those things were either explained during their respective intro-patch or have been so since the start of the game which means there’s been plenty of time getting used to it all

The reason why champs/elites/etc can sometimes be easier with lower amount of people is scaling. While sure it may seem bit weird that its easier with less than more ppl it also make sense that the more people who are there the harder the boss should be to avoid a complete steamrolling of the bosses.

Red rings = bad, no need to know any more than that, orange rings are just fancy red rings. Whether they kill you instantly or do little dmg still better to avoid them.

Now to the Labyrinth, no it isn’t enough to get to the center with the first flower buff, there is a second near the center path you can pass through to extend it if you really want to get to the center at the very start (bad idea since those wolves come from the center , so better to walk around a bit first) but besides the buff which doesn’t always last long enough, here’s where your skils do sort of matter, speedboosts to outrun, invulnerabilities/dodge abilites to avoid dmg and dodging the wolves works too. A simple speedboost can keep you ahead of a wolf long enough to find another blossom (if you don’t trip or make a mistake ofc)

And no these creatures likely won’t be in the next living story, they weren’t in the story part this week either. The labyrinth is basically a nice minigame you can do after defending those towers and the rewards arent that bad. The little chests gives you greens and T5 mats sometimes T6 mats and champion bags and even a full key for the center. The center gives 3 champ bags a rare and some other stuff which isnt too shabby.

As to your idea that a tower defense kind of game would have been better i couldn’t disagree more. There is no reason why everything should be the exact same thing, defend here, defend that, kill those, kill that. We’ve got plenty of that ingame already and its nice to actually have something else to do. I enjoy very much trying my hardest to stay alive as long as possible. My best on my ranger was dieing only twice the whole time (i’m not counting attempts on my thief coze its quite easy with stealth) It’s a nice change of pace and still gives nice stuff to do. You’ve spent about an hour killing and defending stuff, now here you can ust try surviving and having fun doing it. It may not be you thing and thats okay hopefully they’ll add something more to your liking next patch.

How do you not see that repair costs are free? I mean. Making a giant thread about it even.

Anyway. Not all content is meant to suit all players. If you don’t dig it, oh well. Other people do. Claiming its bad design or whatever is a little silly.

Maybe slow down a bit, read the notes. see how things work and all that. Might prove to be more enjoyable.

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

I’ve ran through the labyrinth enough to notice that the rewards do not weigh up against the armor repair grind. Constant instant kills, and every death damages your armor? No thanks! Not to mention that when you do have the key, the central room is crawling with enemies, so it’s pretty much a trial and error affair to get to that nightmare pod alive, plus it also has terrible loot!

You simply get better rewards from digging up buried treasure. So it there any reason to do the labyrinth, after getting the achievement? I don’t see any reason.

If armor doesn’t protect you there, why not take it off? Or at least wait until you’re done to repair it on the way out.

Or why not simply not damage the armor of players? Isn’t that a more sensible solution? If armor repairs are free, and armor is not needed in the maze, then why damage the armor at all?

Because without any sort of consequence of death people would just run in again and again and again and again and again against bosses or whatever until it was killed. With the need for repairs you have to at least think a bit.

I understand what you’re getting at Mad Queen Malafide. I mean, the Anet’s communication about any changes is basically nill. We have no idea they have done something half the time till long after the fact. I’m pretty sure I paid for armor repairs just the other day too. It’s not a universal swap yet.
And actually, as a new players starting out the inconsistencies do build up. I remember the other week, trying to help my friend and her husband sort out how to do a few fights. Both of them were veteran gamers, but the issue was that the consistency between creatures changes. With the Mordrim we’ve been learning to go ranged on the wolves, close on the squid plants (thrashers?). Otherwise death happens. WoW had a creature once, Anubisites or something like this, which spawned with a random set of abilities. Some of the combinations were impossible to defeat. That meant the raid was over for that week or until a means to go around the creature was figured out impromptu.

I don’t really complain about the new goat-dragon with this week’s patch: new creature, new mechanics. However, when the mechanics are arbitrarily swapped it is pretty confusing what is to be done.
Now, could players work together? Yeah, sure, but I’ve quit blaming players a long time ago. If you don’t make your game so that players have to learn to work their brains they won’t have brains. That’s like a parent doing their child’s homework and then being upset at the child for failing their tests in school. “But they do fine at home…”

Mad Queen Malafide.7512:

Or why not simply not damage the armor of players? Isn’t that a more sensible solution? If armor repairs are free, and armor is not needed in the maze, then why damage the armor at all?

if you don’t want to go to repair everytime you get killed in the maze, get naked doesn’t make a difference.

As for the rest of the game, the repair function is to make dead matter, the more you die in a fight, the more armor breaks. Hence, pushing the players not to die so tehy don’t break there armor and have to face a bos naked.

Eirdyne.9843:

I understand what you’re getting at Mad Queen Malafide. I mean, the Anet’s communication about any changes is basically nill. We have no idea they have done something half the time till long after the fact. I’m pretty sure I paid for armor repairs just the other day too. It’s not a universal swap yet.
And actually, as a new players starting out the inconsistencies do build up. I remember the other week, trying to help my friend and her husband sort out how to do a few fights. Both of them were veteran gamers, but the issue was that the consistency between creatures changes. With the Mordrim we’ve been learning to go ranged on the wolves, close on the squid plants (thrashers?). Otherwise death happens. WoW had a creature once, Anubisites or something like this, which spawned with a random set of abilities. Some of the combinations were impossible to defeat. That meant the raid was over for that week or until a means to go around the creature was figured out impromptu.

I don’t really complain about the new goat-dragon with this week’s patch: new creature, new mechanics. However, when the mechanics are arbitrarily swapped it is pretty confusing what is to be done.
Now, could players work together? Yeah, sure, but I’ve quit blaming players a long time ago. If you don’t make your game so that players have to learn to work their brains they won’t have brains. That’s like a parent doing their child’s homework and then being upset at the child for failing their tests in school. “But they do fine at home…”

Any change is always written down in the patch notes, it takes a couple of minutes to read through them at most. And i’m pretty sure you didn’t pay for armor repair awhile ago, since its been about a year or so that’s its free and its not a process that takes time, it was a one time change taking immediate effect.

Really? I always go melee on the wolves (since tehy are pretty kitten hard to get away from anyway) and range the trashers to avoid the gooey path they leave behind and the healing circle on the other one different tactics, that isn’t an inconsistency.

Not quite sure what you mean by mchanics being arbitrarily swapped so won’t comment on that

Eirdyne.9843:

I understand what you’re getting at Mad Queen Malafide. I mean, the Anet’s communication about any changes is basically nill. We have no idea they have done something half the time till long after the fact. I’m pretty sure I paid for armor repairs just the other day too. It’s not a universal swap yet.
~Snip~

I’m guessing someone doesn’t pay attention to patch notes or announcements, I know for a fact this was announced with the April 15th Feature Pack, and here’s the patch notes on the wiki(will be the same on the forums): http://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Game_updates/2014-04-15
https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/info/updates/Game-Update-Notes-April-15-2014

I have only one bone to pick with the labyrinth: it’s boring as hell. Even slightly more boring than what happens in the rest of the zone when there’s no breach event in progress. Who’d have thought the war against an elder dragon could be so boring. Yawn.

Read patch notes.