Guild Wars 2

I think the downed state adds a level of much needed chaos to pvp. I’d hate it to be removed, and all you do is pewpew, guy dies, disappears.

There’s something inherently satisfying about stomping someone. And there’s something inherently social about lying on the floor virtually helpless, not wanting to die, and some hero on your team gets there just in time to save you.

Whether you’re stomping, or someone is trying to stomp you and you get saved, it’s an awesome system. I hope Arenanet never remove it.

Truth be told its casual game for casuals so yea it propably stay the same.
Too bad cose the competetive part of games like this keeps them afloat, which GW2 atm lacks.
Soon there will be little players going PvP becouse sucha nonsenses as downstate (but not only) and then its just small step to abandoning the game.
Keep your rock solid “Anet is great and even kitten they make is made of gold” guard and soon only ppl like will play it.

They keeps saying how much they want to PvP to be balanced and down-state is not the way period.

EDIT: Ohhh the kittenCensorship :*

Down state is good. If you die accidentally you still have a changed to get revived with help. And this is about helping each other. It is a MMORPG. Of course if you solo and meet someone 1 vs 1 there are problems. But his teammembers could come to help while you still are fighting him while alive. This problem is not only in down state.

How is it in sPvP? Never tried this. So far only WvW. Maybe this should not be in sPvP. Or is this even possible with the smaller teams attacking each other there should be no rezzing possible. Or are the maps big enough to not see each other and being able for 2 people to rez while enemy is somewhere else?

Toast.6324:

I was wondering if I am the only one that scream and shout when ppl go /chillinOnTheGround in PvP fights insteed being DEAD…

Howkitten is that ?!

U win a duel or 2vs1 and then even if youre more then 50% of HP u have to w@nk around so the guy can drop dead…. But he wont, cose he will teleport, invi, make clone or interrupt while you are casting banner of death or slaping his second health bar with another CD/Energy Points or whatevah.

Result ?

1# Your 50% hp is long gone and youre near death.
2# Hes buddies come for help and wipe their seats(got kittenCensored) with your face then ress the guy and teabag u a bit
3# He drop dead and u with your 5% hp and kittenloads of bleeds have to wait X time cose youre still in combat fighting I HAVE NO IDEA WHAT becouse there is nothing and noone around me, but hey being a freekill for a minute is cool.

P.S. I am Thief and im doing the same thing to the ppl that cast banner of death on me… and it’s still stupid

If you press F when they are downed you can finish them

The stupidity of down-system is that it force ZERG groups.
As I mention before in one of my posts its better to leave a point for players to take it then defend it. And its all becouse you CANNOT take one of the with u to the grave.
You outplay them get one down and even nuke him a bit in down state but it wont matter cose u will end up on ground too and die from DMG or F-inisher.
Result? One less alive soul on battlefield for your team while they have 2.

ZERG ZERG … such fun

Im talking mostly about sPvP not WvWvW since I dont enjoy it at all becouse the lack of purpose. WvWvW feels kinda like “Running Simulator 2012”…

I just got an IDEA!

To all ppl that are afraid of NUKE speccs and stuff. Since we already have 2 healthbars to get down why not just increase normal bar. Lets say 1.5 x normal bar?
Simple enough. Dead is dead and u should not get nuked, two birs with one stone.
It even promote balance becouse we are getting rid of stupid down-skills!

Toast.6324:

Truth be told its casual game for casuals so yea it propably stay the same.
Too bad cose the competetive part of games like this keeps them afloat, which GW2 atm lacks.
Soon there will be little players going PvP becouse sucha nonsenses as downstate (but not only) and then its just small step to abandoning the game.
Keep your rock solid “Anet is great and even kitten they make is made of gold” guard and soon only ppl like will play it.

They keeps saying how much they want to PvP to be balanced and down-state is not the way period.

EDIT: Ohhh the kittenCensorship :*

Fascinating concept. We enjoy the “downed state” more than “omg blind x, poly y, burst the kitten (I knew it’d be censored so I wrote it myself :P) out of z”, we are casuals? What kind of thinking is that?

We can in that case argue that all that fail to addapt to the “downed state” are noobs? Does that make sense to you?

Anyways, it’s a matter of taste tbh. I prefer that over WoW style (obviously) and I think it brings a little “extra something” to the game. I don’t consider a player dead till he is dead, not downed. In my opinion, you don’t really have to kill him every time either. As others mentioned, sometimes it’s a good idea to let someone try to get him up and then kill them both. You know, like bait.

EDIT;

The stupidity of down-system is that it force ZERG groups.
As I mention before in one of my posts its better to leave a point for players to take it then defend it. And its all becouse you CANNOT take one of the with u to the grave.
You outplay them get one down and even nuke him a bit in down state but it wont matter cose u will end up on ground too and die from DMG or F-inisher.
Result? One less alive soul on battlefield for your team while they have 2.

ZERG ZERG … such fun

Im talking mostly about sPvP not WvWvW since I dont enjoy it at all becouse the lack of purpose. WvWvW feels kinda like “Running Simulator 2012”…

You constantly make 3 vs 1 situations instead of 1v1. Your problem seems to be that the other team is better than yours, or you have extremely bad luck with your partner choice. You down a player, great… you’re doing fine. All of a sudden, 2 more of the other team come and you die. What I see here is the failure of your teammates, and not the problem with the game.

And higher HP or lower dmg wouldn’t work as it would be literally impossible to kill some professions. I’d suggest you learn to play with the benefits “downed state” can bring as it will make your gametime better. The other option would be to leave the game. Your choice.

And higher HP or lower dmg wouldn’t work as it would be literally impossible to kill some professions. I’d suggest you learn to play with the benefits “downed state” can bring as it will make your gametime better. The other option would be to leave the game. Your choice.

But this is exacly what the down-state is! Even u have more chance of doming something useful becouse you have all your skills insteed of 4 from which 1 is attack and 1 is a channel heal.

Also the scenario i gave u its a SCENARIO i made it up so you can see the issue in the down-system. I know fonboys like u are going to protect the Anet vision for all costs but comon EXPLAIN me how in this scenario its fair?!
How its “cool” to leave points insteed of defending them becose there is another player on the horizont insteed of the one that youre fighting with.
Are your density it so high that u cannot even think of it in open mind ?

I totally agree with you. It also makes it very hard to do a 1v2 fight as well. Even if you kill one of them, when you are dealing with the other one, first one gets up, runs away, or does something like that.

Toast.6324:

And higher HP or lower dmg wouldn’t work as it would be literally impossible to kill some professions. I’d suggest you learn to play with the benefits “downed state” can bring as it will make your gametime better. The other option would be to leave the game. Your choice.

But this is exacly what the down-state is! Even u have more chance of doming something useful becouse you have all your skills insteed of 4 from which 1 is attack and 1 is a channel heal.

Also the scenario i gave u its a SCENARIO i made it up so you can see the issue in the down-system. I know fonboys like u are going to protect the Anet vision for all costs but comon EXPLAIN me how in this scenario its fair?!
How its “cool” to leave points insteed of defending them becose there is another player on the horizont insteed of the one that youre fighting with.
Are your density it so high that u cannot even think of it in open mind ?

Why would ANY scenario in which you are 3v1 be fair? Tell me one game where it is. Is an RMP vs a ret/holy paladin fair?

If anyone is “dense” here my friend, it’s you. We could argue (again) that your inability to adapt is a strong indicative that indeed you lack some skills (in the brain department as well as game). But, I’m not here to call you names, nor do I appreciate you calling me names either. So let’s go beyond that.

I told you a situation (and not only me) where the “downed state” is preferable to “go zerg x”. Even from a standpoint of the one who killed an opponent (obviously, the downed player feels “better” with how the game currently works). But, let’s discuss when you’re the one who is downed. Would you really, in the current setting of the game, change that?

Let’s take a rogue back in WoW. You’re in a battleground, you’re protecting a node… a rogue comes, kills you and tries to cap a base. Your friends come and try to kill him. He doesn’t die, but runs away. End result: No node taken, you’re dead.

Theif in GW2 comes, downs you, tries to cap/hold a node. Your friends show up, shoo him away and most likely kill him (unless he is good and runs away or fights somehow 2&1/2 vs 1 (remember, you’re not dead but downed, that’s why 1/2)). End result: No node taken, you’re being resurected, enemy is likely dead.

Do you see why it’s better from a standpoint of a defender? Good, we got that clear.

On the other hand, 2 of you attack a base. You get to fight some kitten warrior and he downs you. While he’s trying to fight with your partner you either get up ur help kill him(and by doing so lowering a chance of a single prof killing the 2 of you, making it easier for “casuals” as you put it to put up a good fight) therefore helping you out. Think of WoW (sorry, but this is the game I came from, and most of my examples will be from there) in where a single rogue can kill a spec while his partner is blinded into disarmed and then unable to do dmg due to rogue being under CoS. You get a rogue vanish afterwards and voila, a single class killed two (ofc, doesn’t always work, but in GW2 it can NEVER work…unless completely outplayed, which is ok with me).

So, I just gave you two situations where it is benefitial for you to have a “downed state” vs “straight up dead”… what now?

As I said previously, it’s a matter of taste. Do you see why I told you the option is to either adapt or change the game?

If anyone is “dense” here my friend, it’s you. We could argue (again) that your inability to adapt is a strong indicative that indeed you lack some skills

I stopped here u took it too personal and the rest it prolly a personal jurney of whatever…

And 2vs1 scenario is perfectly fine and balanced becouse thouse two can be color blind(there is a problem for thouse ppl in GW2), doing work, eating along the playing or just plain bad.

Since youre not here to make any interensting point i will just ignore you :>

EDIT: Forced myself and read it…

Let’s take a rogue back in WoW. You’re in a battleground, you’re protecting a node… a rogue comes, kills you and tries to cap a base. Your friends come and try to kill him. He doesn’t die, but runs away. End result: No node taken, you’re dead.

You got outplayed!
And this how it should be! YOU got outplayed by a rogue and result less player on the field and NEED to defend node.
Simple as that.

Oh I’m sure you read the rest. You can pretend you didn’t to avoid what I said, but the point still stands. There are benefits to the way the game works. There are cons also. It’s a matter of taste. Live with it or leave.

Also, funny how “no interesting point” comes down to “doesn’t agree with me”.
Ah well.

Vexus.5423:

You’re not the only one getting upset. But, you’re only getting upset because you think in terms of old style gaming. Health bar goes down and you win, gg. But GW2 has expanded that.

Why fix something that isn’t broken? Why expand it when it doesnt need expanding?
When you die, you die. Downed state is ruining the “flow” in pvp.

The only “good” thing about downed state is in WvW… when the unorganized zerg enemy is trying to ress their downed players while you are pounding them..

Finishing is awesome.

Poor thieves. Must be hard to Heartseeker spam and then have to deal with someone in downed state.

Lanvall.9157:

Vexus.5423:

You’re not the only one getting upset. But, you’re only getting upset because you think in terms of old style gaming. Health bar goes down and you win, gg. But GW2 has expanded that.

Why fix something that isn’t broken? Why expand it when it doesnt need expanding?
When you die, you die. Downed state is ruining the “flow” in pvp.

The only “good” thing about downed state is in WvW… when the unorganized zerg enemy is trying to ress their downed players while you are pounding them..

Actually Guild Wars 2 has no-one EVER dying. You are downed and then defeated. There is no ‘Death’.

the down-state adds strategy to PvP, sure press F takes no skills but that’s not the only way to do it, you can also just hit him every 5 seconds or so to cancel his bandage and let him die, the addition of this choice makes a good player think about what is the best approach on each situation.

Siveon.8759:

the down-state adds strategy to PvP, sure press F takes no skills but that’s not the only way to do it, you can also just hit him every 5 seconds or so to cancel his bandage and let him die, the addition of this choice makes a good player think about what is the best approach on each situation.

It does not add strategy, it slows the pvp down and makes it by definition, worse.
If you think downed state is good, you are probably a carebear.

one thing i did notice thats pretty awesome about the downed state is that if youre the person that put them in that state you get credit for the kill even if you arent the one to finish them.
noticed it last night when as a thief i was knocking people down left and right, and when id go to finish them id get interupted and somebody else would plant but i would still get the credit.

as for complaints about a downed player getting you down, you need to realize that when a person goes down they arent out. KEEP ON THEM!
keep moving and finish the job rather than getting sloppy and thinking “oh they fell down, next target please”

Lanvall.9157:

Siveon.8759:

the down-state adds strategy to PvP, sure press F takes no skills but that’s not the only way to do it, you can also just hit him every 5 seconds or so to cancel his bandage and let him die, the addition of this choice makes a good player think about what is the best approach on each situation.

It does not add strategy, it slows the pvp down and makes it by definition, worse.
If you think downed state is good, you are probably a carebear.

By YOUR definition, worse.

If you think downed state is bad, you’ve probably never had to play a skill-based game before.

See? I can make random generalizations too. Bottom line is, simply because you dislike it, does not make the system bad, unbalanced, or flow-breaking.

I’m much, much more concerned with the unbalanced PVP than the downed state. I would rather sit in queue for 10 mintes that tueue up in a 2vs2 match, or worse a 3 vs 1. The games should be full when they start, or should not start. Autobalancing by switching people off of their teams is also a very stupid idea that may work in shooters like MW3, but not in real team based PVP. It also makes it near impossible to play with friends.

SuperLuigi.3720:

Lanvall.9157:

Siveon.8759:

the down-state adds strategy to PvP, sure press F takes no skills but that’s not the only way to do it, you can also just hit him every 5 seconds or so to cancel his bandage and let him die, the addition of this choice makes a good player think about what is the best approach on each situation.

It does not add strategy, it slows the pvp down and makes it by definition, worse.
If you think downed state is good, you are probably a carebear.

By YOUR definition, worse.

If you think downed state is bad, you’ve probably never had to play a skill-based game before.

See? I can make random generalizations too. Bottom line is, simply because you dislike it, does not make the system bad, unbalanced, or flow-breaking.

My definition? How about the pvp community in general?

Edit;

Bottom line: it is a bad system.

Lanvall.9157:

SuperLuigi.3720:

Lanvall.9157:

Siveon.8759:

the down-state adds strategy to PvP, sure press F takes no skills but that’s not the only way to do it, you can also just hit him every 5 seconds or so to cancel his bandage and let him die, the addition of this choice makes a good player think about what is the best approach on each situation.

It does not add strategy, it slows the pvp down and makes it by definition, worse.
If you think downed state is good, you are probably a carebear.

By YOUR definition, worse.

If you think downed state is bad, you’ve probably never had to play a skill-based game before.

See? I can make random generalizations too. Bottom line is, simply because you dislike it, does not make the system bad, unbalanced, or flow-breaking.

My definition? How about the pvp community in general?

Edit;

Bottom line: it is a bad system.

So, you’re the self appointed community spokesman now?

You left out In your opinion when you said “Bottom line it is a bad system”

Just because you do not like something doesn’t mean it is bad.

I must wonder, did you ever follow the development of this game? I mean these things aren’t a surprise.

And I must wonder, are people complaining about such things, and wanting to change/add features, just waiting around for an expansion to come out towards the end of this month?

I wonder this, because I have seen this type of thing over and over again, by players who are just taking a break from their home game or waiting for expansion to hit. Go in demand changes, changes are made, then they are back to thier home game anyway.

daemonlama.5413:

Lanvall.9157:

SuperLuigi.3720:

Lanvall.9157:

Siveon.8759:

the down-state adds strategy to PvP, sure press F takes no skills but that’s not the only way to do it, you can also just hit him every 5 seconds or so to cancel his bandage and let him die, the addition of this choice makes a good player think about what is the best approach on each situation.

It does not add strategy, it slows the pvp down and makes it by definition, worse.
If you think downed state is good, you are probably a carebear.

By YOUR definition, worse.

If you think downed state is bad, you’ve probably never had to play a skill-based game before.

See? I can make random generalizations too. Bottom line is, simply because you dislike it, does not make the system bad, unbalanced, or flow-breaking.

My definition? How about the pvp community in general?

Edit;

Bottom line: it is a bad system.

So, you’re the self appointed community spokesman now?

You left out In your opinion when you said “Bottom line it is a bad system”

Just because you do not like something doesn’t mean it is bad.

I must wonder, did you ever follow the development of this game? I mean these things aren’t a surprise.

And I must wonder, are people complaining about such things, and wanting to change/add features, just waiting around for an expansion to come out towards the end of this month?

I wonder this, because I have seen this type of thing over and over again, by players who are just taking a break from their home game or waiting for expansion to hit. Go in demand changes, changes are made, then they are back to thier home game anyway.

I did follow the development of the game, and I love what Arena.net have done with 95% of the game.

I cried alot during all the BWE about the downed system and I intend to continue crying until it is changed to such extent that it no longer slows down pvp. This is my “home game” – thats why I even bother trying to change it for the better.

What I want to know is.. @the people that like the downed system…what is it that you like about it?

Until the player has respawned, you haven’t outplayed them. Period. If they are downed that means you are winning, but you still have to play well if you want to defeat them. Taking away some of their health isn’t a kill, it is an inconvenience. If you want to kill them, kill them. People are complaining that XX amount of damage means that you could still lose. Yes, and? If I hit you with an opening crit does that mean I have outplayed you? Do I get to come on the forums and kitten because I beat you fair and square and then you ended up beating me? No. Don’t count your chickens before they’ve hatched, and don’t think you’ve beaten someone until they’ve respawned. Pvp in GW2 isn’t a deathmatch, it is about area control. If you control the area, defeated players will respawn at their base when they know they can’t revive on site. If you don’t control the area, you haven’t won. Sure, you may have been doing really well, but it isn’t a victory until you have area control. You haven’t outplayed someone until they have to respawn.

Why dost thou speaketh of kittens?

Deadpoint.4751:

Until the player has respawned, you haven’t outplayed them. Period. If they are downed that means you are winning, but you still have to play well if you want to defeat them. Taking away some of their health isn’t a kill, it is an inconvenience. If you want to kill them, kill them. People are complaining that XX amount of damage means that you could still lose. Yes, and? If I hit you with an opening crit does that mean I have outplayed you? Do I get to come on the forums and kitten because I beat you fair and square and then you ended up beating me? No. Don’t count your chickens before they’ve hatched, and don’t think you’ve beaten someone until they’ve respawned. Pvp in GW2 isn’t a deathmatch, it is about area control. If you control the area, defeated players will respawn at their base when they know they can’t revive on site. If you don’t control the area, you haven’t won. Sure, you may have been doing really well, but it isn’t a victory until you have area control. You haven’t outplayed someone until they have to respawn.

This is a perfect explanation.

Deadpoint.4751:

Until the player has respawned, you haven’t outplayed them. Period. If they are downed that means you are winning, but you still have to play well if you want to defeat them. Taking away some of their health isn’t a kill, it is an inconvenience. If you want to kill them, kill them. People are complaining that XX amount of damage means that you could still lose. Yes, and? If I hit you with an opening crit does that mean I have outplayed you? Do I get to come on the forums and kitten because I beat you fair and square and then you ended up beating me? No. Don’t count your chickens before they’ve hatched, and don’t think you’ve beaten someone until they’ve respawned. Pvp in GW2 isn’t a deathmatch, it is about area control. If you control the area, defeated players will respawn at their base when they know they can’t revive on site. If you don’t control the area, you haven’t won. Sure, you may have been doing really well, but it isn’t a victory until you have area control. You haven’t outplayed someone until they have to respawn.

Finally somebody that actually speaks pvp.
Yes, PvP in Gw2 is basicly all about area control, all about area control.
But PvP in general is about so much more then area control. So much of the PvP experience is lost due to this.

All I see here is people complaining that they have to finish off a downed player. Bet these same people don’t mind it when they are downed and get a chance to get back into the fight.

dcypher.2590:

All I see here is people complaining that they have to finish off a downed player. Bet these same people don’t mind it when they are downed and get a chance to get back into the fight.

I was writing that in my previous post but deleted it cause it would have been messy..
There was a perfect example of me getting “owned” today in WvW… I got downed… but then from nowhere came a group of friendlies and I rallied.. I then finished off the players that had so clearly beaten me.. and it gave me no satisfaction whatsoever. ( a beautiful 2v1 that got completely ruined by me “cheating”.)

All my objections against the downed state really come down to one point.. I need to stop pvp’ing… click F, get interupted, click F again.. and wait 2 seconds.. 5 seconds that could be better spent trying to kill the next enemy.. (And thats if I am in melee range.. lets not talk about the amount of time you need to waste if you want to finish of a downed player from a distance.. )

Downed State – It slows pvp down.. and slow pvp is bad pvp. (back to my original post, it ruins the “flow”)

Lanvall.9157:

Finally somebody that actually speaks pvp.
Yes, PvP in Gw2 is basicly all about area control, all about area control.
But PvP in general is about so much more then area control. So much of the PvP experience is lost due to this.

I see it as a tradeoff. Think of it as battle inertia.

In some games, a massive burst of damage from one player can effectively end the conflict. The fight will continue, but it is increasingly one sided as one team loses combatants. Battles are more easily pushed one way or another, but once they have been pushed past a certain point they develop inertia and it becomes increasingly hard to reverse the course of events.

In GW2 it is much harder to reach the point of “(almost) certain victory.” Short of a large difference in numbers or an even more massive difference in skill, the losing side will typically have a chance for a come from behind victory. How large that chance is will vary, but it will always be a larger chance than would exist without the rally/revive mechanic.

Battles are harder to decisively win based on a few seconds, but they are also harder to lose. This has the effect of prolonging the serious part of the battle and allowing for more dynamic reversals. I can totally understand how some people don’t like it, but it isn’t necessarily bad. There are things I don’t like about GW2, but I’m trying to cope. Overall it is an awesome game and I am quite glad I bought it.

Deadpoint.4751:

Until the player has respawned, you haven’t outplayed them. Period. If they are downed that means you are winning, but you still have to play well if you want to defeat them. Taking away some of their health isn’t a kill, it is an inconvenience. If you want to kill them, kill them. People are complaining that XX amount of damage means that you could still lose. Yes, and? If I hit you with an opening crit does that mean I have outplayed you? Do I get to come on the forums and kitten because I beat you fair and square and then you ended up beating me? No. Don’t count your chickens before they’ve hatched, and don’t think you’ve beaten someone until they’ve respawned. Pvp in GW2 isn’t a deathmatch, it is about area control. If you control the area, defeated players will respawn at their base when they know they can’t revive on site. If you don’t control the area, you haven’t won. Sure, you may have been doing really well, but it isn’t a victory until you have area control. You haven’t outplayed someone until they have to respawn.

Wow dude nice job

Lanvall.9157:

All my objections against the downed state really come down to one point.. I need to stop pvp’ing… click F, get interupted, click F again.. and wait 2 seconds.. 5 seconds that could be better spent trying to kill the next enemy.. (And thats if I am in melee range.. lets not talk about the amount of time you need to waste if you want to finish of a downed player from a distance.. )

You’re doing it wrong on TWO counts.

You’re wasting time getting interrupted by the person on the ground and his allies, and you’re putting yourself at risk to revive him by rally if his allies focus you.

Lanvall.9157

All my objections against the downed state really come down to one point.. I need to stop pvp’ing… click F, get interupted, click F again.. and wait 2 seconds.. 5 seconds that could be better spent trying to kill the next enemy.. (And thats if I am in melee range.. lets not talk about the amount of time you need to waste if you want to finish of a downed player from a distance.. )

Downed State – It slows pvp down.. and slow pvp is bad pvp. (back to my original post, it ruins the “flow”)

but youre forgetting the cruicial part about it being a team effort, you shouldnt be the only person trying to finish off opponents, there should be a couple people doing that work to guarentee handing out a defeat
as i said in my earlier post that even when i got interupted there were other people planting the banners and finishing off the opponent but i was still getting credit, one reason i like running with premade groups is that you get people who understand that there is an objective beyond getting kills/defeating opponents
even playing a thief i dont just run around beating the kittens out of people, i actually go and cap points and such as well

Moonthrower.1406:

You’re doing it wrong on TWO counts.

You’re wasting time getting interrupted by the person on the ground and his allies, and you’re putting yourself at risk to revive him by rally if his allies focus you.

1 – I should not be interupted at all, the downed player should be dead.
2 – Combat ress – remove rally.

Zaxafel.5728:

Lanvall.9157

All my objections against the downed state really come down to one point.. I need to stop pvp’ing… click F, get interupted, click F again.. and wait 2 seconds.. 5 seconds that could be better spent trying to kill the next enemy.. (And thats if I am in melee range.. lets not talk about the amount of time you need to waste if you want to finish of a downed player from a distance.. )

Downed State – It slows pvp down.. and slow pvp is bad pvp. (back to my original post, it ruins the “flow”)

but youre forgetting the cruicial part about it being a team effort, you shouldnt be the only person trying to finish off opponents, there should be a couple people doing that work to guarentee handing out a defeat
as i said in my earlier post that even when i got interupted there were other people planting the banners and finishing off the opponent but i was still getting credit, one reason i like running with premade groups is that you get people who understand that there is an objective beyond getting kills/defeating opponents
even playing a thief i dont just run around beating the kittens out of people, i actually go and cap points and such as well

What is it with all you people and the team/group effort?!
Teamplay is a cruicial part of pvp, but it isn’t the ONLY part of pvp. Gw2 seems to have forgotten that.

One of my favourite things to do in any MMO is beating the living kitten out of somebody! (followed by the mandatory corpse-jumping session)

The downed system requires you to have a team, it slows you down, the animation takes all the excitement out of the kill… I could carry on for ages naming stuff thats wrong with the downed system and how it makes pvp worse.

I can’t say one thing about it thats better then the classic “healthbar 0 – death – wait for ress or release” system.

I would have prefered that they invest the time they used on downed system and acuatic gameplay/weapons on some other cool features.
I couldn’t care less about my acutaic weapons, and this half dead state is annoying in many levels. Not only in BGs. PvE bosses are balanced taking this state into consideration. Which sucks.

Toast.6324:

Do u feel like u killed a guy when u downed him? NO!

That may be because you haven’t actually killed him yet.

In real life, bodies are pretty tough things. Sometimes it can be quite hard to kill a person. Plus, players are tough warriors with armour, mages with magic, etc., they’re shouldn’t be easy to kill.

I think this mechanic mimics that really well, with a chance for a downed player to rally, and an extension of gameplay for the victor who has to decide whether to call mates, continue pummelling as normal, or stomp with great justice.

I think all you have to do is shift your perception of when a player is “killed” to when they’re actually killed.

It ain’t over till it’s over, things have a chance to turn around at the last minute That, to me, is exciting, and such a refreshing change from the digital on/off condition “kills” have been up till now in games.

You can’t compare it to real life mate (and no, this mechanic does not mimic it well.)

You have to base mechanics on how they effect gameplay.
(and in this case, badly, in case you haven’t been paying attention)

Lanvall.9157:

Zaxafel.5728:

Lanvall.9157

All my objections against the downed state really come down to one point.. I need to stop pvp’ing… click F, get interupted, click F again.. and wait 2 seconds.. 5 seconds that could be better spent trying to kill the next enemy.. (And thats if I am in melee range.. lets not talk about the amount of time you need to waste if you want to finish of a downed player from a distance.. )

Downed State – It slows pvp down.. and slow pvp is bad pvp. (back to my original post, it ruins the “flow”)

but youre forgetting the cruicial part about it being a team effort, you shouldnt be the only person trying to finish off opponents, there should be a couple people doing that work to guarentee handing out a defeat
as i said in my earlier post that even when i got interupted there were other people planting the banners and finishing off the opponent but i was still getting credit, one reason i like running with premade groups is that you get people who understand that there is an objective beyond getting kills/defeating opponents
even playing a thief i dont just run around beating the kittens out of people, i actually go and cap points and such as well

What is it with all you people and the team/group effort?!
Teamplay is a cruicial part of pvp, but it isn’t the ONLY part of pvp. Gw2 seems to have forgotten that.

One of my favourite things to do in any MMO is beating the living kitten out of somebody! (followed by the mandatory corpse-jumping session)

The downed system requires you to have a team, it slows you down, the animation takes all the excitement out of the kill… I could carry on for ages naming stuff thats wrong with the downed system and how it makes pvp worse.

I can’t say one thing about it thats better then the classic “healthbar 0 – death – wait for ress or release” system.

It doesn’t require you to have a team? Are you seriously that ______ (insert word, as currently I don’t even know how to describe you) to not manage to “down someone”?

I understand that you think this slows down the game, it’s a valid reason (I don’t agree with it, but hell, not everyone thinks/does the same) but you can’t tell me it’s impossible to down someone.

Roll a mage/ret/rogue in WoW and go burst stuff down if that’s what you like. Don’t try to force the change on the rest of us who enjoy it.

FANBOY level is too kitten high!

You want down-state to stay, I dont.
But in a month or two there will be fewer ppl to play PvP with.
Fanboys will stay no matter what, change or no change.
New players that came here for some competetive PvP will be gone.

I’am done with PvP, tbh I dont even play GW2 much since there is nothing interesting to do.(Excluding PvP)

P.S.

gurugeorge.9857:

Toast.6324:

Do u feel like u killed a guy when u downed him? NO!

That may be because you haven’t actually killed him yet.

In real life, bodies are pretty tough things. Sometimes it can be quite hard to kill a person. Plus, players are tough warriors with armour, mages with magic, etc., they’re shouldn’t be easy to kill.

I think this mechanic mimics that really well, with a chance for a downed player to rally, and an extension of gameplay for the victor who has to decide whether to call mates, continue pummelling as normal, or stomp with great justice.

I think all you have to do is shift your perception of when a player is “killed” to when they’re actually killed.

It ain’t over till it’s over, things have a chance to turn around at the last minute That, to me, is exciting, and such a refreshing change from the digital on/off condition “kills” have been up till now in games.

Sentence out of context, dont twist ppl words.

Rock.7324:

Lanvall.9157:

Zaxafel.5728:

Lanvall.9157

All my objections against the downed state really come down to one point.. I need to stop pvp’ing… click F, get interupted, click F again.. and wait 2 seconds.. 5 seconds that could be better spent trying to kill the next enemy.. (And thats if I am in melee range.. lets not talk about the amount of time you need to waste if you want to finish of a downed player from a distance.. )

Downed State – It slows pvp down.. and slow pvp is bad pvp. (back to my original post, it ruins the “flow”)

but youre forgetting the cruicial part about it being a team effort, you shouldnt be the only person trying to finish off opponents, there should be a couple people doing that work to guarentee handing out a defeat
as i said in my earlier post that even when i got interupted there were other people planting the banners and finishing off the opponent but i was still getting credit, one reason i like running with premade groups is that you get people who understand that there is an objective beyond getting kills/defeating opponents
even playing a thief i dont just run around beating the kittens out of people, i actually go and cap points and such as well

What is it with all you people and the team/group effort?!
Teamplay is a cruicial part of pvp, but it isn’t the ONLY part of pvp. Gw2 seems to have forgotten that.

One of my favourite things to do in any MMO is beating the living kitten out of somebody! (followed by the mandatory corpse-jumping session)

The downed system requires you to have a team, it slows you down, the animation takes all the excitement out of the kill… I could carry on for ages naming stuff thats wrong with the downed system and how it makes pvp worse.

I can’t say one thing about it thats better then the classic “healthbar 0 – death – wait for ress or release” system.

It doesn’t require you to have a team? Are you seriously that ______ (insert word, as currently I don’t even know how to describe you) to not manage to “down someone”?

I understand that you think this slows down the game, it’s a valid reason (I don’t agree with it, but hell, not everyone thinks/does the same) but you can’t tell me it’s impossible to down someone.

Roll a mage/ret/rogue in WoW and go burst stuff down if that’s what you like. Don’t try to force the change on the rest of us who enjoy it.

It does require you to have a team, unless its 1v1, but when was the last time that happend in WvW?

And you can’t disagree with the fact that it slows down pvp, its a fact not an opinion. (?!)

I do admire Arena.net for trying new things, getting rid of the holy trinity (tank – dps – healer) is the best example of this gone well, downed state is an example of it gone bad.

(I am unsure if you are allowed to post links, but I’ll risk it.)
Change to the death system gone well:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2X_SbZCHpc

Toast.6324:

FANBOY level is too kitten high!

You want down-state to stay, I dont.
But in a month or two there will be fewer ppl to play PvP with.
Fanboys will stay no matter what, change or no change.
New players that came here for some competetive PvP will be gone.

As a representative for a large competative pvp community I support this message.
Fanboys will always be fans, thats not the case for the other 95% of the people, the people that dislike the downed system.

Edit;
Just wanted to add that even if things stay the same, we’ll stay, but I wouldn’t hold it against other communities/players if they got tired of WvW and left.

So don’t get me wrong, I love Gw2. It just pains me to see a game that is so close to being the best MMO to date.. all it needs is 3-4 changes to get there.

Toast.6324:

FANBOY level is too kitten high!

You want down-state to stay, I dont.
But in a month or two there will be fewer ppl to play PvP with.
Fanboys will stay no matter what, change or no change.
New players that came here for some competetive PvP will be gone.

I’am done with PvP, tbh I dont even play GW2 much since there is nothing interesting to do.(Excluding PvP)

P.S.

gurugeorge.9857:

Toast.6324:

Do u feel like u killed a guy when u downed him? NO!

That may be because you haven’t actually killed him yet.

In real life, bodies are pretty tough things. Sometimes it can be quite hard to kill a person. Plus, players are tough warriors with armour, mages with magic, etc., they’re shouldn’t be easy to kill.

I think this mechanic mimics that really well, with a chance for a downed player to rally, and an extension of gameplay for the victor who has to decide whether to call mates, continue pummelling as normal, or stomp with great justice.

I think all you have to do is shift your perception of when a player is “killed” to when they’re actually killed.

It ain’t over till it’s over, things have a chance to turn around at the last minute That, to me, is exciting, and such a refreshing change from the digital on/off condition “kills” have been up till now in games.

Sentence out of context, dont twist ppl words.

The sentence is totally in context. It shows that you’re not prepared to go with GW2’s particular flow, your mindset requires a singular “kill” event. I’m not saying that makes you bad or wrong, but there are two approaches – either the game changes or you change. The game is unlikely to change, so that just leaves you, and the question of whether you want to adapt and keep playing the game, or go play something else.

It’s like that with all games really, only in this game the divorce is painless for all parties concerned.

tl;dr: in GW2, nobody cares what various players who have been “leet” or “pro” in previous games think about this game. Nobody has to care what they think, because they’re not paying a subscription.

Arenanet have made the game they’ve made, almost as a work of art (possibly the first true MMO-as-art works in gaming, comparable to the works of art that are single-player games like PS:T, Half Life, Deus Ex, etc.); so the choice of whether to continue after you feel you’ve gotten your money’s worth out of it so far is up to you, but I doubt Arenanet are going to change the game, PvE or PvP, to encourage anybody to stay any longer than they naturally want to.

I love the downstate, yesterday it was driving me mad through. In PvP I had 2 guys on me, a engi and a theif. I kept getting one of them down, and the other get him rev. I mean I got both down more then once during the fight. It was a longkitten fight, however I really had fun in it. So I don’t mind even at times like that.

Sadly in the end a warrior came, and I had to run. Dont like 1v3, however it was a epic battle. That I was close to winning on multpy times.

@gurugeorge.9857

Are you for real? o.O
Im not sure if stupid or trolling.
And yes the sentence is out of context. I was talking about Leader calling one man to finish downed players while rest where focused on brining ppl to down state.

I doubt Arenanet are going to change the game, PvE or PvP, to encourage anybody to stay any longer than they naturally want to.

If Anet dont care what happends to the game then why would they even bother to relese?

EDIT: Your TL:DR is longer then actual post >.<

Lanvall.9157:

Rock.7324:

Lanvall.9157:

Zaxafel.5728:

Lanvall.9157

All my objections against the downed state really come down to one point.. I need to stop pvp’ing… click F, get interupted, click F again.. and wait 2 seconds.. 5 seconds that could be better spent trying to kill the next enemy.. (And thats if I am in melee range.. lets not talk about the amount of time you need to waste if you want to finish of a downed player from a distance.. )

Downed State – It slows pvp down.. and slow pvp is bad pvp. (back to my original post, it ruins the “flow”)

but youre forgetting the cruicial part about it being a team effort, you shouldnt be the only person trying to finish off opponents, there should be a couple people doing that work to guarentee handing out a defeat
as i said in my earlier post that even when i got interupted there were other people planting the banners and finishing off the opponent but i was still getting credit, one reason i like running with premade groups is that you get people who understand that there is an objective beyond getting kills/defeating opponents
even playing a thief i dont just run around beating the kittens out of people, i actually go and cap points and such as well

What is it with all you people and the team/group effort?!
Teamplay is a cruicial part of pvp, but it isn’t the ONLY part of pvp. Gw2 seems to have forgotten that.

One of my favourite things to do in any MMO is beating the living kitten out of somebody! (followed by the mandatory corpse-jumping session)

The downed system requires you to have a team, it slows you down, the animation takes all the excitement out of the kill… I could carry on for ages naming stuff thats wrong with the downed system and how it makes pvp worse.

I can’t say one thing about it thats better then the classic “healthbar 0 – death – wait for ress or release” system.

It doesn’t require you to have a team? Are you seriously that ______ (insert word, as currently I don’t even know how to describe you) to not manage to “down someone”?

I understand that you think this slows down the game, it’s a valid reason (I don’t agree with it, but hell, not everyone thinks/does the same) but you can’t tell me it’s impossible to down someone.

Roll a mage/ret/rogue in WoW and go burst stuff down if that’s what you like. Don’t try to force the change on the rest of us who enjoy it.

It does require you to have a team, unless its 1v1, but when was the last time that happend in WvW?

And you can’t disagree with the fact that it slows down pvp, its a fact not an opinion. (?!)

I do admire Arena.net for trying new things, getting rid of the holy trinity (tank – dps – healer) is the best example of this gone well, downed state is an example of it gone bad.

(I am unsure if you are allowed to post links, but I’ll risk it.)
Change to the death system gone well:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T2X_SbZCHpc

Actually yday. I ended up killing some mesmer 1v1. But, that’s besides the point.

Ok, you say that the “problem” is that it slows down PvP in WvWvW? Are you one of the people who rushes in the middle of 10 opponents because “omg I downed him!”. What’s the problem with letting him stay down and finish him off when there is no immediate threat?

No, do not confuse fact with your opinion. It’s the game mechanic. By what you’re saying, we can conclude that every single cc ability in WoW is “slowing down PvP”. In which case PvP would be left with who can mash buttons quicker.

I ask you again, do not ask for something you are not going to enjoy (because it will be too similar to what we have out there).

EDIT;
Which community are you a representative of?

EDIT 2;
Because we all know Toast is gonna come in here and say I’m a fanboy, I’ll still play WoW. I care for entertainment, not where (which company) it’s coming from.

Yeah, I agree with OP somewhat.

I don’t mind the downed mechanic, it should just be tweaked a bit because hot-join is way, way too zerg-tastic.

Here’s some thoughts:

1) Gain health when you down someone - or-

2) Gain health when you rally without having to talent for it (as most professions can’t, even if they wanted to).

3) Revive timer should be longer than the stomp timer. Stomp should generally only be a second or so, revive should be around 5 seconds. This does two things – it forces people to use their self heal (instead of attacking) and it means if your buddies aren’t immediately around to interrupt you won’t survive long – which means I don’t feel obligated to bring dedicated stomper builds into fights.

4) Even out the downed state skills. Warriors can get back up and continue fighting, and even rally at that point if spec’d and stay alive, wut? But an elementalist can…immobilize? With like a 12 second later mist transfer…I don’t understand that, it’s like saying warriors aren’t balanced enough in actual fights so they need to be better while dead…which is both not true and would be a horrible experience if it was. I don’t know about you but I’m not picking my profession because the downed state is good…

So much rage here. Chill.

You can’t stunlock and/or spike people down. About time a game had something like this to be honest, I’m so glad .

If it’s a one on one, then you have won. If you really can’t finish the kill then you’re doing something wrong. You’ll get what? Interrupted once. Or they teleport once. Then you kill them.

If a fight is won, a fight is won – you will easily manage to finish everyone you need to.

If it’s a 1 vs 2 and you get one of the two down, you’ve not won. Maybe you’re not meant to be able to beat more than one person as one person? Oh, snap!

It’s still possible, sure, I’ve done it. Finisher and all. Yes, not just in a 1 vs 2 either, even in the infamous 1 vs 3! Theives can chuck down their stealth circle and avoid all attacks, as can Mesmer. Guardians have shield bubbles. Many classes have the Stability boon they can apply to themselves which prevents all interrupts, all stuns and all knockbacks, allowing them an easy kill on all but Mesmers and Theives – check it out. There are tricks of the death blowing trade that really work. Get used to it, prepare accordingly.

In a group battle situation then they might get rezzed if your team is bad, but one stun or fear or daze or knock back or knock down or… pretty much anything will stop the rez. Cry less, play better, get kills. And that rezzing player is so open to attack for the duration of the rez. It’s like a free invite for a second kill.

It does slow down fights, sure it does. It means you need more complex tactics, more strategy in a fight in terms of positioning, being able to get that Finisher off whilst not going down yourself, whether that be by speed or backing off to heal and then going for it and the like. If you want a quick game when you point, shoot and just kill people then there’s Call of Duty. I like CoD, I’ve spent many hours on those games. But there is kitten all in the way of thinking and planning there. This game has hundreds of skills, weapons, traits and profession combos for a reason.

Practice makes perfect.

Deadpoint.4751:

Until the player has respawned, you haven’t outplayed them. Period. If they are downed that means you are winning, but you still have to play well if you want to defeat them. Taking away some of their health isn’t a kill, it is an inconvenience. .

This would be true if two professions were exactly even in their downed state but that is not the case. If you consider a warrior downed state versus an elementalist, where the warrior alone has the ability to get back up and finish off the elementalist for a rally and continue on his merry way, it’s effectively a handicap system. If both professions are perfectly balanced, that means that the elementalist is better fighting than the warrior such that the warrior needs a better down state to compensate. In this case, it’s the exact opposite but either way it’s a pretty revolting idea that a profession is designed to be stronger while downed than another class. If all classes are balanced in combat than all should be likewise balanced in their down state – which means the only way to be better in your downed state would be to specifically build your character that way.

I like the idea of shorter channel on F-inisher.
Also if there is such big need of down-state lets cut 2 – proffesion skills and leave it with only attack and selfheal.
This way PvP is getting balanced around proffesions and this stupid gimmick is getting less annoying.
I dont know how long the channel is atm but i would say about 3 sec.
Make it 1,5sec and we are fine (not great, I still think its not for PvP).