Guild Wars 2

(An extremely abbreviated version of this post is available a few posts down)

Part 1

Okay, I’ve been willing to give the benefit of the doubt and accept that many players don’t actually know what this kitten-holish behavior actually is. For a lot of players, those whom GW2 isn’t their first MMO at least, they likely cut their teeth on WoW (such that it is today and the past several years) or a game that doesn’t nerf your level according to zone such that when you visit the lowbie areas you are nigh god-like and really have few reasons to go there anyway. In WoW these days, for the most part, there is little reason to ever leave the capital city really, you can queue for any activity, you can queue to join queues now probably. If you are outside a capitol leveling an alt or something you’re probably nearly alone or at least far enough from other players for this to not really matter. Hence little interaction with mobs or at most it would be in a dungeon or raid and the rest of your party would quickly let you know if you pulled this little faux pas because you just wiped them, as you will here to some poor schmo in GW2 as we will see. In other games you aren’t likely sprinting through a zone unless you out-level it and then these mobs would never be able to slow you up to even attempt an attack (or un-mount you is more likely the case) so the cases of you doing this are likely rare and over-looked on those games as well.

In case you are one of the few wondering, "Well just what do you mean by “training” mobs Mayam? I train my character and that’s all! You make no sense!" Well my friend, in this sense of the term “training”, we here refer to the physical choo-choo type trains in that it is a long, heavy, object in motion, with it’s components lined up one after the other. “Still not following ya.” Stay with me here it’s a simple analogy really, you’ll see. When you run through an area without care for the mobs you aggro they of course follow you – one right after another (its making sense now yeah?) “So why is this an issue Mayam? They follow. I out-run them. They eventually de-aggro and I continue on my way saving time.” Yes! You are completely correct Sir or Ma’am BUT, in GW2 at least, when they de-aggro they don’t just re-set and return to their original spot on the map waiting for the next hapless adventurer to happen by their original orientation (that detail is key as we shall see). Here I think the principle of GW2 mechanics is best explained by a visual:

Have you ever seen the remake of Dawn of the Dead? Great horror flick, well at least I liked it, lightning fast zombies changed the whole template for the sub-genre in my opinion, but I digress. You remember the part at the beginning when the couple just wakes up? Little zombie girl gnaws half of dude’s neck off and he bleeds to death, dies, then un-dies? He chases his woman out to the car and she takes off with him hauling kitten behind her, remember? About half a block down the street, crazy zombie boyfriend realizes he has no hope of catching her car right? Now here’s where we draw the corollary to the world of the MMO mobs (and specifically the GW2 variety). Crazy zombie boyfriend, upon the realization that he’s still not quite that fast; breaks off the chase and pops a quick right then turns and tackles some poor dumb kitten-hole standing in his front yard with a stupid ’what’s going on guys uh-duuuhhh…’ look and proceeds to mangle and rip him apart with some of his other new zombie buddies. That my friends is the exact mechanic of mobs in the GW2 universe.

Part 2

To really crystalize this principle of GW2 mob mechanics for you: You’re the chick in the car in the beginning of Dawn of the Dead carelessly outrunning your now undead cannibal boyfriend (the mobs). And yes, there IS a poor schmo that gets mowed down behind you, as though by a… wait for it… speeding TRAIN. Or more accurately, it’s as though there was a multiple car pile up on this poor schmo’s face. You couldn’t know but he’s not standing there looking at his monitor saying, “hey, what’s going on guys uh-duuuhhhh….” No, he knows exactly whats about to happen and he knows that you are the sole cause of it and he’s raging at his monitor something like, “you stupid, selfish, bleep bleepin bleeeeeppp, bleepin kittin I hope you bleep in a fiery fiery bleep and your bleep gets kittened by a bleepin kitten with a bad case of bleeeepppp….”. Et cetera and so forth, you can imagine. You get the picture though. That player is not currently happy because of what just occured.

Now as I’ve said, it’s entirely possible some of you had no idea what “training” mobs was and had no intention to do it. Perhaps you’ve even been a victim a few times and were a bit fuzzy on the how’s and why’s. Even with experience in other games, because of different factors these unfortunate moments are relatively few and far between comparatively. Now I must also include this one very relevant factoid when comparing the mob behaviors of other games and those of GW2. That being chiefly that (and this is important for the purpose of our discussion here): MOBS IN OTHER GAMES TYPICALLY RESET TO THEIR ORIGINAL ORIENTATION ON THE ZONE MAP WHEN THEY DE-AGGRO FROM YOU THUS PREVENTING THESE INSANELY LARGE MOB “TRAINS” THAT CAN JUST TURN AND OBLITERATE AN UNSUSPECTING BY-STANDER ON A WHIM AS THEY SO COMMONLY DO IN GW2. I hope I’ve made that point particularly clear because even a player who considers themself well experienced in all things MMO may not have yet noticed nor expected a mechanic like we find in this game that leads to these traveling “nuclear bombs” of a mob train as can exist here in GW2.

So there it is in the most complete explanation oh the whats, hows, whys, and most importantly the who of mob training and the incredibly kitten-holish thing it is to pull on some stranger just grinding along in the same zone as you with the last thing he is wanting to happen being 15 mobs leaping on him like a pack of crazed, cannibal, undead, significant others who just “woke up” after getting their throat snatched out from the little girl turned zombie who lives next door. God knows we all know how that feels! Am I right?!?!

Thanks for reading and of course a TL;DR version will be posted immediately following

_P.S I don’t expect a sticky on this but I do feel it is of the greatest importance that this information be spread as far and wide as possible in the nation’s best interests of preventing nerd rage on a massive scale. I’m sure we can all agree that none of us wants to see that dark cloud descend on such an otherwise very well crafted and thought out MMO.

P.P.S Incidentally, I strongly feel that changing the mob mechanic to simply reset them to their original orientation on the zone map not allowing them to re-aggro on any player until they have reset is the best solution. Barring that, information is our best and only weapon against this evil friends._

TL;DR Version:

“Training” mobs is when you run across a zone aggroing several mobs who then follow you like a “train”. When they de-aggro, they don’t just return to their original spot on the map like they do in most MMOs. They turn instead and attack the next closest player that you just ran by. If you don’t turn to help (or at least wait til it’s over and rez the poor schmo if that’s the only thing you can effectively do), then you just ROYALLY KITTENED HIM!

Obviously this is a real kitten-hole thing to do and it would be great if you’d never do it again (or as mentioned at least help in the fight or rez the poor guy when its over). It’s entirely possible a lot of players were doing this unknowingly and no one can be mad at you for that. In an effort to stop this altogether though I’m trying to spread this info as far and wide as possible and any help in this effort would be VERY much appreciated.

Tell a friend and, at the very least, stop and help the poor unsuspecting victim with the fight or, at the very least, come back and rez them. I put this major faux pas on the level of ninja-looting personally to do otherwise.

Thank you all in advance and let’s do our best to enjoy the game as much as a community as we can personally with such well thought out and otherwise well implemented game mechanics.

Sincerely,

Mayam, the hapless victim of at least 2 dozen or more “drive by mob trains”

As the Sylvari say:
MORE VIOLETS, LESS VIOLENCE

I noticed some players making it a habit to circle around to tag and pick up 3 or 4 and run right up to you, take a hit or 2 on your target to wait for their train to arrive then run. Leaving the extras to be tagged by your aoe while your still fighting your main target.

When I see botters I train them on purpose. It’s fun.

That is defensible and understandable Sir. In fact I salute you for it!

Training other legit players though is just a downright kitteny thing to do. Especially intentionally as in ICE’s example. In other games we had “Realm Forums” where people like ninja-looters and the like could be publicly called out and with enough heat shone on them it would eventually destroy their rep and hopefully drive them off the server.

We lack that capability so far here on the GW2 forums though. So we need to first spread that info I believe and for people like ICE has pointed out it’s gonna take nothing less than the community, particularly the other players in that zone heeding a call when such a kitten kittening kitten hole is called out, to descend on that kitten and train him mercilessly and just make his game play utterly miserable in general until they log out. HOPEFULLY they will eventually get the hint and either stop what thet’re doing or stop playing GW2 altogether – sorry Anet to potentially deprive you of their potential income but we don’t want them wrecking our game.

I feel it only responsible to add though:

Of course you could always make the above noted change to your mob’s mechanics Anet – (hint hint). Or institute open world player killing. I definitely wouldn’t be opposed to that either. A noticeable percentage of players these days may find that feature distasteful but I’ve always considered it an integral part of any game with PvP of any stripe or flavor personally. In the interest of pleasing the most players possible though I have to admit that the former option for Anet would likely be the best all around. This is a problem that Anet can solve though. Until they do / or state that they won’t institute any such change the responsibility falls to us my fellow Guild Wars 2ians! (Yeah it’s a word! WHAT?!?!)

Come on guys, spread the word and lets keep this bumped and publicized!

As a Guardian I just laugh when people try to do this and proceed to kill all the mobs.

Thank you for this post, I have been trained multiple times in this game, died from it a couple times on an alt that couldn’t take all the mobs, and had wished I could have gotten their name as they ran by so I could thank them (yes, sarcasm).

I can only hope, and hope hard, that some kind person (that is of the same variety as them) returns the favor to them in double by training mobs on them.

Its not fun people when you are on the recieving end of that train and on a character that can’t handle that many mobs at a time, so please show some courtesy, please?

If you want to race through a zone without fighting, great, but the aggro you pick up on the way, don’t run over someone with it, run around them so you don’t get others killed in the process.

Thumbs up Mayam for this post!

I have had people do this to me many, many times. I have become a far better player as a result. You seem me fighting two enemies? You drop an extra five on me? No problem, I will start using my cool-downs :P The only time I was killed by this was when soloing a champion and his veteran adds and someone brought a few more creatures from the wilderness in. That one pushed me way beyond my limits!

However, it is a really moronic thing to do to people, and every time I see it I just shake my head in disgust.

1. I dont have time to kill every single thing I walk back when I am trying to get to a specific location.

2. If that person cant handle one mob, or run away, they probably are not adequetely prepared for the zone they are in and should go to an area they can handle.

Call it dragging. That makes a lot more sense.

Unfortunately, training of mobs is all to common in many an MMO. I still remember the massive trains in Blackburrow. Got slaughtered more than once by those. Works the same in this game. If you pull a train on a botter, kudos to you. If you pull a train on a legit player accidentally, try to learn not to do that in the future, assuming you even noticed you did it. If you train legit players on purpose, you need a perma-ban, cause that’s just plain rude.

Sometimes you will run across one of those people whou is aware of what they are doing, knows it can get people killed, but isn’t necessarily doing it on purpose. The just don’t care. If someone gets caught in the train they just say, “oh well, i guess that guy shouldn’t have been standing there, too bad, so sad, hate to be him but I’m not so I’m gone”. These people are almost worse that the ones doing in on purpose. These people know what they are doing, do nothing to prevent it, and don’t care. At least the intentional trainers are doing it for a reason. they may be jerks, but at least they are honest about it. The uncaring ones, that know about it but do nothing to prevent it, also need a punishment, albeit a different one. Intentional trainers are griefers, which is against the TOS anyway, and need a ban. Uncaring trainers need to have everyone in the zone train everything possible right in their face to let them know how it feels. They need to be shown that what they are doing is not cool. Then they need a 3-day suspension to think about what they did.

Keep in mind that this is coming from someone who started playing MMOs with UO and EQ1. My perspective on trains is a bit skewed and a little bitter. Take it with a grain of salt.

Doesn’t change my opinion though. Trains suck.

I’m fine with it happening to me, keeps me on my toes. And it’s very satisfying dispatching a large group of mobs.

Always be mindful of your surroundings. If you see a train incoming at your location, stop attacking immediately and wait until the danger is over. This does not always work but should help to at least reduce the number of accidents a little.

I wouldn’t say I train because sometimes I mean to get more than 2 creatures to give myself a challenge, sometimes I do notice I bit off more than I can chew and try and find the nearest player to give me a hand.

Does that make me a bad person??

Good suggestion aside, this is the most fun I’ve had reading a 3-posts-long OP. applauds

You must have never been to the Orr zones.
In many areas there, it is hard to nearly impossible to see if there are other players past the next pointy coral cliff. It is also nearly impossible to properly fight your way forward to whatever place you’re trying to reach, thanks to extremely fast respawns. Running like hell and praying you’ll live is the only thing you can do.
I never begrudge a player who trains Risen on me in these zones. They’re just trying to get to the next waypoint in under an hour, just like I do.

Likewise, many people you probably assume to be training are actually just running for their lives… more than once, I have seen people merrily killing some mobs, when suddenly Dynamic Event! 10 mobs spawn in front of you! (Been the victim of it too. Never managed to run. I’m a bit slow that way.)

In short: yes, this game’s system allows training, and newbies might be served well knowing this… but the game also forces running for your life sometimes, and as an unintended victim of angry mob trains, you’re well served to remember that. (Definitely served my own blood pressure well.)

Maybe this is too simple, but is the solution not to out-run the train too, possibly following the guy that got you that gift?

Fansy the Famous Bard, anyone?

Just wanna say if I drag others into a fight I do stick around to fight as well I don’t just run off.

Why exactly is this seen as “a problem” if you are here to enjoy dynamic events? This is likely not going to be a well received post but seems to me that a “train” of mobs coming down your way unexpectedly is no different that being out farming ore and having one “pop” on top of you when you weren’t prepared or planning for it. Meh. So what? It is an opportunity to have some fun at trying your hand in a different situation.

If there are simply too many for you to handle, you are going to know pretty fast. You can kite your way out of it, see if any others join you, or just take your lumps (unwelcome though they may have been) and rez at a waypoint.

Wanting more control over mob behavior to the point of asking ANet “fix it” so they don’t chase you instead of whoever originally aggroed them and just reset is tantamount to asking them to re-program the entire mechanic of dynamic events in the first place.

Bottom line is, if you know this occurs in the game, try to look at it as one more in a series of things in GW2 which are there for you to be aware of when out and about that can be fun – keeps you on your toes and can make for more interesting game play not necessarily a source of immediate annoyance and reason to flame other players and assume they are a__hats for interfering with YOUR experience.

You know the thing about training… after awhile, the combat mechanics get boring, no matter how good the developers try to make them.. when you kill thousands of trash mobs, it really starts feeling like you’re just going through the motions, and you can’t be bothered with killing every mob standing in your way from point a to point b, especially if you’re running to an event, or just plain mining orichalcum.

So you train. I dodge roll, scatter caltrops behind me and gain swiftness for doing so, and I pretty much don’t care.

Now I avoid other people when I’m doing it, and if I do happen to encounter another player and they hit the mob chasing me, I stop and help.

But otherwise.. why waste the time killing

Every.

Single.

Trash.

Mob.

On.

The.

Way.

From.

Point.

A.

To.

Point.

B?

Just imagine every period there is a mob from point a to point b and you’ll get an accurate representation of Orr.

I’m level 80, so the experience isn’t much of a reason (that said kill experience is the lowest amount of experience in the game.. experience is never a reason to kill anything in this game).. the 1-2% chance they drop something worthwhile?

So yeah, I’ll train, and I’ll try to avoid people, but if you happen to be on the mob’s path running back and I didn’t see you.. well… not my problem, you can run it off too.

I do see this too and in my opinion looks like most people are running for their lives. Like another poster said, If I accidentally kite some mobs because I got in over my head, I stay to fight them if someone else accidentally took my aggro.

I remember the days when people would kite mobs into entrances of towns and watch them tear apart unsuspecting players who are afk.

If your kiting mobs on purpose, have some ethics for the game and others and stop it.

EverQuest Necros, the GODS of training. Round them up, train to the offender and Fain Death…

I loved my EQ Necro.

I started MMOs with the release of EQ1. I know what trains are, and really the term doesn’t apply to the activity you are experiencing in GW2. That doesn’t mean having mobs dumped on you isn’t an issue, just there is rarely more than 1-2 that get dumped on you, hardly a “train”.

The issue is mobs in this game don’t need to lose aggro to change to you as target. All they need to do is find YOU as the closest target.

I believe the developers were completely aware of this behavior and didn’t just ignore it, but decided they wanted this in their game. Perhaps since WvW has mobs and they consider it a perfectly acceptable tactic to drag mobs onto an opponent.

If this behavior was not intended, it indeed needs to be changed.

Keep in mind Guild Wars is and has always been about PvP. They simply expanded on the PvE aspects of large level range and grinding because this is exactly what the majority of GW1 players said they wanted. In the end, it’s still a PvP game and thats the end game focus.

I miss the good ol’ days of pulling an entire dungeon to the entrance yelling “CHOO CHOO”.

Mark Love.6274 said

Maybe this is too simple, but is the solution not to out-run the train too, possibly following the guy that got you that gift?

Why should you have to leave the area you are intentionally in just because some loser ran a bunch of mobs at you.

Training is poor MMO etiquette, but some people are just MMO-schmucks and either oblivious to other gamers and this don’t care about any other player’s game experience or do it intentionally for the same reason.

Ive been guilty of this, though not always intentionally.

Sometimes I’ll forget to switch spells and hit a mob with Chain Lightning or some similar AOE. When an entire camp of bandits is agroed on me, do you really want me to stand there and die? Im going to run like hell, and if I happen to run past you, I suggest you run out of the way or turn tail with me.

There isn’t always a mountain to climb or a place to avoid mobs. Sometimes running is the only option, and stopping to plan a route that goes around you will get me killed, so I go the shortest route with the fewest additional mobs that result in me running even LONGER; quite often the area you just cleared out.

Devildoc.6721:

So yeah, I’ll train, and I’ll try to avoid people, but if you happen to be on the mob’s path running back and I didn’t see you.. well… not my problem, you can run it off too.

Pretty much agree with this. I’ve never had problems when people trained creatures onto me, so I don’t worry too much about training them into other people when I can’t be bothered to fight. If someone does stop to fight, I’ll usually help them, but more just to save them some time than out of concern for their safety.

Of course, if someone is actually in trouble then I’ll certainly go out of my way to help them.

Meh, I expect the current lot of MMO gamers to care little about other players so I tend to expect training in games that it matters.

Society promotes a ‘me-first’ attitude so we shouldn’t be surprised that it leaks into the way people play games. If getting you killed will save them then you are out of luck.

Not a problem if you are active in game.

Much of the time I run through an area to get through it alive and pick up a train — not on purpose. If some one is standing around AFK, I won’t say they deserve it, but they should have logged, or gone to a safer area. I always do so I don’t know why others shouldn’t.

What I would love to do is train mobs to bots, but usually they are too smart and strong to be killed.

Bluestone.7106:

Meh, I expect the current lot of MMO gamers to care little about other players so I tend to expect training in games that it matters.

Society promotes a ‘me-first’ attitude so we shouldn’t be surprised that it leaks into the way people play games. If getting you killed will save them then you are out of luck.

Yet you are asking people to stop and fight just because you can’t be bothered to also avoid the creatures they are avoiding. Is that not equally selfish?

Aseyhe.2948:

Devildoc.6721:

So yeah, I’ll train, and I’ll try to avoid people, but if you happen to be on the mob’s path running back and I didn’t see you.. well… not my problem, you can run it off too.

Pretty much agree with this. I’ve never had problems when people trained creatures onto me, so I don’t worry too much about training them into other people when I can’t be bothered to fight. If someone does stop to fight, I’ll usually help them, but more just to save them some time than out of concern for their safety.

Of course, if someone is actually in trouble then I’ll certainly go out of my way to help them.

only time I’ve had trouble with people training mobs is when they take their train b-line it into me while I’m already in the middle of a fight. That can kill you. People really should avoid doing that.

But you know, if you avoid other players while training it’s gravy, and if you happen to see that your train aggroed on someone, help.

Yeah, if they’re already fighting I’d stop to help. But if it’s two people traveling and one happens to be training things then there’s no real reason for either person to stop.

Aseyhe.2948:

Bluestone.7106:

Meh, I expect the current lot of MMO gamers to care little about other players so I tend to expect training in games that it matters.

Society promotes a ‘me-first’ attitude so we shouldn’t be surprised that it leaks into the way people play games. If getting you killed will save them then you are out of luck.

Yet you are asking people to stop and fight just because you can’t be bothered to also avoid the creatures they are avoiding. Is that not equally selfish?

I never said that. Please don’t make up things and attribute them to me.

Edit: not going to get caught up in an argument over phrasing. Suffice it to say that when you are throwing around insults in a discussion, you should expect to be attributed a position that actually opposes that of the side you are insulting.

Often times, when I find myself inadvertently training mobs, it’s usually because I want to head to an event before it ends in hopes of a getting a Gold reward, especially when the event is almost over. Depending on some situations, I have a tendency to value Karma and XP over any drops that the trained mobs could potentially drop. Sorry about that, but I’d like my Karma and XP.

On the other hand, I play a GS Warrior outside of dungeons, a rather overpowered glass cannon spec capable of critting with 100 Blades between 20 to 32k. Since almost all trained mobs are normal mobs, they die relatively quick.

Aseyhe.2948:

Edit: not going to get caught up in an argument over phrasing. Suffice it to say that when you are throwing around insults in a discussion, you should expect to be attributed a position that actually opposes that of the side you are insulting.

It is common to align people on one side or the other yes, that’s why I corrected the assumption or at least challenged it.

I don’t have a solution for the problem of training, but I understand it as a problem and I understand why people do it and don’t care about the consequences for other people. I think those people are selfish as what they do impacts on others negatively and forcibly, whereas wanting to not be the victim of a train does not directly have a negative effect on other players.

very interesting topic here! new to MMOs (and glad that gw2 is my first one everD).
i have noticed this and also aware that mobs are easily aggro-ed. esepcially with certain camera angles (surrounding depending) as well as AoE attacks. i guess it all boils down to “awareness” if you aren’t doing it intentionally. like driving a car, how do you know if you’re going to fit in that space or not? learn the range of your moves, etc.

that being said, if i do happen to be “training” – whether it be running for my life and/or getting from point a to b, or if i was just running through and someone aggro-ed some mobs and just bolts as i was nearing (intentional? perhaps since i see HUGE incentive in this, as they get XP if i take out the mobs, and if i don’t, no loss for them)…. if there’s no one around, i’ll run. if i DO see someone, i’ll judge if they’d be able to help me or not, or hold on their own and decide what course of action to take.

- if they’re already fighting mobs? i’ll always bring the mob elsewhere and try to take ’em on my own (usually i am able to, though i have chewed off more than i could bite sometimes); definitely lead the train elsewhere if said person is having a tough time already!

- usually i’ve been lucky enough where people come and aggro the mobs aggro-ed by me. and i stop and help dispatch all mobs. i say “tyty lol” and they go “just passing by lol” and we both proceed to merrily jump away lol haha small moments like these make the game awesome for me

- when i am going to point a to b, i try to avoid all mobs at all costs anyways if i don’t intend to fight them.

- what i DID not notice though, was when Ari mentioned the rushing to an event before it ends. KARMAAAA XPPPP!! everyone wants that, so i guess in the future i do need to be more aware of that.. though i fi do run past anyone while doing so (fortunately, hasn’t happened yet), i’ll try to “Retreat” right next to them, giving them swiftness and aegis lol.. and most people WOULD be rushing to the same event anyways, usually…

oops, writing a bit much here. haha, last question, how does one defferentiate between a legit player and a bot?

Oh wow,this subject takes me back to my EQ1 days lol.

At least back then,for the majority of train encounters,the offending party sent out a warning shout.In fact iirc,most of us had macros dedicated to the train Warning shout. haha

At any rate,mobs don’t aggro for long distances in GW2,like they used to in the older games,and it’s pretty easy to distance them and come back after.

The worse thing I have seen is players luring mobs to waypoints and leaving them sit on top of the waypoint for unsuspecting travellers.

I don’t think I’ve ever had a full-on train following me (lol!), but there certainly had been times when I wound up with 3 mobs or a veteran and then some on my squishy little Elementalist’s behind and have heroically, um, ran for my life. ^^; But if I see another player in my path, I will try my best to stay away from them, and won’t run to “safe” places like waypoints.

But on the rare occasion I accidentally do, well . . . so long as my health is out of the “going to die if I take one more hit” range, I will turn right around and help them kill said mobs. But honestly, if I accidentally run a couple of mobs into another player that wasn’t already fighting something, I don’t think it would be a huge deal anyway. People don’t just stand around AFK out in the world, y’know? If this was a bother to them, I’d say take it up with Anet and their spawning things on top of me. And I know I wouldn’t mind helping some person that was running for his/her life and had inadvertently deposited a couple of mobs in my lap.

The only time I’ve deliberately ran mobs into other players though is during DE’s, when somehow a bunch spawned on me while everyone else was on the other side of the wheat field, or what have you.

Ari Kagura.9182:

Often times, when I find myself inadvertently training mobs, it’s usually because I want to head to an event before it ends in hopes of a getting a Gold reward, especially when the event is almost over. Depending on some situations, I have a tendency to value Karma and XP over any drops that the trained mobs could potentially drop. Sorry about that, but I’d like my Karma and XP.

On the other hand, I play a GS Warrior outside of dungeons, a rather overpowered glass cannon spec capable of critting with 100 Blades between 20 to 32k. Since almost all trained mobs are normal mobs, they die relatively quick.

Just thought I’d point out you’re actually doing less damage than that. Attacks that are a combination of hits show the damage over the entire combo, not the damage per hit. That’s why the damage looks like it’s increasing on every hit. You’re not doing 10 hits that go from 600 to 9000 damage per hit, you’re seeing a combo that totals about 9000 damage.

I mainly solo, and on occasion found myself entering a cave with some other players and helping with clearing out the mobs. Then, while collecting resources and the like, I discover I am alone and the cave has re-spawned. Nothing to do, but get out asap. If a train develops while I’m running out and some poor kitten has just entered the cave, sorry but nothing else I could do. However, I will stop to help clear up the mess….

Another aspect is inadvertent aggro on mobs with AoE.

I play a Ranger, and I recall doing a ranged attack on 2 Ascalon ghosts. Just as I launched Barrage, a group of 5 Moas wandered into the AoE. Some poor bloke was collecting herbs off to my right, but slightly closer to the now aggroed Moas and they turned on him! Meanwhile the 2 original mobs were coming for me.

What to do? Go help the poor bloke I set 5 Moas onto and drag the 2 ghosts into the fray??

I did the ghosts first, then went to help with the Moas. When that was done, I had to revive the geezer .. I apologised and had a bit of a laugh afterwards …

There’s another similar behaviour perpetrated by players, especially in the Orrian areas.
Thankfully, it’s not a problem for me any more as I’ve done all the skill points, but before I had them, this annoyed me even more than training.
It’s kind of inverse training.
You’re fighting a hard fight, attempting to clear the mobs around a “Commune” style skill point, when some git sneaks in, communes with the skill point while you’re distracting the mobs, possibly training other mobs on to you to boot, then proceeds to exit area post-haste after claiming the skill point without even stopping to help you.
Oh the expletives that escaped my mouth when that happened to me. Numerous times.

These days, if I see someone looking to approach one of these types of skill points, I go out of my way to provide a distraction, and players are often thankful. But if I see someone trying to screw over someone else by doing this? Yeah, I’ll train ’em.

Snoring Sleepwalker.9073:

Call it dragging. That makes a lot more sense.

We called it Luring back in my day. Now I feel old.

In past games it was a reportable offense on certain servers. I never agreed with that rule. As it is a very strategic tactic in PvP. However, in PvE, non-contested areas, yah.. pretty inconsiderate.

I don’t see an issue. The game world is meant to feel dangerous and you’re meant to try and be constantly aware of your surroundings. Doing so keeps you alive in pretty much every aspect of the game.

I’ve created a few trains in my day, usually because I’ve over-agroed and I’m running for my life. Occasionally, that will take me past another player who was just minding their own business and gets caught up in my mistake. If I had a hotkey bound to yell “RUN!”, I’d use it. But I don’t. However, if they don’t follow my example, I’ll generally stop to assist and hopefully put the genie back in the bottle. I think I’d rather endure the pain of defeat than the guilt of dumping my error on someone else and letting them pay for it.

The problem isn’t the training mechanism.

It’s Orr with it’s “one mob for each square meter” density, coupled with their “I think I just saw something move across that planet” aggro distance.

Now, maybe it’s because my main’s only level 64 and things are different in Orr, but I haven’t died due to someone else’s train yet. If I see someone being followed by a horde of mobs, either I run as well or I go help if I think I can handle it. It’s possible that I’ve just gotten lucky, though.

That said, there’s no way I’m going to kill all the mobs I come across if I want to walk from point A to point B, because the waypoints are so expensive. If I see someone get caught in the mobs I’ve been dragging along, I stop and try to help of course, but that’s it.

Maybe I’ve just been lucky, but this is not an issue I’ve ever really noticed.