Guild Wars 2

Crowley.8761:

UmbraNoctis.1907:

But why would the system put all the bad players in the same team and all the good in the other for hundreds and thousands of games? I mean, according to you, the system can’t even know who is good and who is bad. You are basically saying, matchmaking doesn’t exist and never existed, because it is all rng. But if its all rng, it will be the same for all players in the long run. Because rng doesn’t give any advantages or disadvantages to anybody.

The system can’t judge who is good and who is bad, it’s not designed for that. It’s designed to judge am entire team so it would work great for full premades, but for individuals it is crap.

+1 this

Emdrix.6124:

zaced.7948:

suffish.4150:

Do you ever see pro league players like Helseth and sindrener going on huge loss streaks?

No, because they have high enough initial mmr to not be matched with complete potatoes. skill is a factor, yet. do you think helseth or sind can carry a match where one dude left, another one is afk at spawn while raging and you’re 3v5 with a hammer/staff guardian and a vanilla zerk ranger that only autoattacks and #5s?
if one of them can, i will worship him as god of guildwars forever.

He already did that on stream. He paired up with amber players in some previous season and carried a complete trash tier MMR game with ease where everyone was just plain bad and he could win 1v3s

I have won vs Sind/Misha duo this season – yes they lose when they have potatoes on team. Sure, he can maybe dominate in amber but issue is when you face opponents that are not completely bad and your own team is just… sry to say it potato, even best players in game can’t carry that.

But as said before, they don’t get bad teams as often due to their MMR. I also saw so many times how matchmaking would stack his duo + <insert another pro league> duo on same team and they would just 500-50 enemy team consisting of 1700+ solo players.

Crowley.8761:

UmbraNoctis.1907:

But why would the system put all the bad players in the same team and all the good in the other for hundreds and thousands of games? I mean, according to you, the system can’t even know who is good and who is bad. You are basically saying, matchmaking doesn’t exist and never existed, because it is all rng. But if its all rng, it will be the same for all players in the long run. Because rng doesn’t give any advantages or disadvantages to anybody.

The system can’t judge who is good and who is bad, it’s not designed for that. It’s designed to judge am entire team so it would work great for full premades, but for individuals it is crap.

Except system stacks 2100+ players vs 1700+ players pretty often – this shouldn’t be a thing but it is.

zaced.7948:

No, because they have high enough initial mmr to not be matched with complete potatoes. […]

Shadowstep.6049:

But as said before, they don’t get bad teams as often due to their MMR.

Nobody can carry all games. Nobody has to do so. If MMR is random, then good players won’t have a higher initial MMR that prevents them from getting terrible players. If their MMR is not random, then maybe your MMR isn’t completely random either, right?

Crowley.8761:

Uhm no it doesn’t. By your logic it’s only wintrading which means you stay at the same spot.

So the only difference is…me? Great! Please teach me how to carry in the following situations:

1. You hold mid and close, 1 enemy goes to your close, 1v1s the guy deffing it and then 3 guys leave mid to deal with him and all 3 stand on the point waiting for capture. Meanwhile you’ve gotten kittened trying to hold mid, even though you survived for 30 seconds against 4 people, you died. How do I carry this?

If enemy team stays mid, go far, make them split, hold them there while your team has time to deal with them on mid, ideally giving them at least a +1 situation for a bit while the other guy is dead and at least one person going for far to get you.

2. Your team loses the first teamfight and then run to mid 1 by 1. How do I carry this?

Be mobile, cap sides.

3. Your teammates are unable to 2v1 the enemy team. How do I carry this?

+1 their fights, bomb enemy, move on.

4. The situation I already described, your teammates ignore all other points and rush into 4 enemies standing at your close one at a time. How do I carry this?

Force them to split, (de)cap other points by playing a mobile class. +1 when you see a fight where you can easily burst 1-2 down, move on.

5. Your teammates will happily ignore point capture to chase kills and will even stand outside the cap zone autoattacking a downed player. How do I carry this?

Focus on capping or moving fights on points. Again, being mobile helps.

6. Enemy team has 3+ DH that instagib your teammates. How do I carry this?

Since you can see the 3 DHs before the game starts, bring some sort of counter against them, help your team or try to make sure the three DHs don’t run together.

7. Your team has 3 power warriors. How do I carry this?

So what? Ask one or two to reroll, if they don’t, try to help out the best you can.

8. People spread out to 2 far, 2 mid and 1 close. You lose the first teamfight 2v4 and the enemies then rotate to their close and take out the people there. 2 people get angry and go afk. How do I carry this?

Report and move on.

9. Your teammates get soloed by Svanir. How do I carry this?

Kill animals quick, hopefully before your teammates even get there, preventing them from dying. Sucks but what can you do.

10. Two teammates are constantly trying to rob treb from each other and that’s all they do all game. How do I carry this?

pull enemies over to destroy your treb idk, tell them that treb is bad.

You’re not gonna win every game, that’s not gonna happen. Communication is key and so is being able to adapt. If your team is kitten, work around them instead of flaming them. If you play supports/not as mobile classes and face issues of your team not being able to win fights or rotating properly, reroll. Competitive isn’t just about playing what you want, but also playing what’s necessary. If you don’t make the swap/calls in order to get out of the hellhole you’re in and not try your hardest to get out there, then why should you be able to “escape”?

i do agree some fight i had 2 afk last season and this seasonbut this is life and i try my best

with soloq after the first fight i see who dies fast and who stay alive and try to +1 and rotate where i think i do best even if its not my role. cause in pugs there is no communication.
so yes most my losses were cause bad roations of my team and being hardly farm in team fight.

play with it and see where YOU can do better and have fun

last season i hardly play and was in emerald. i group up with top players and had much fun and didnt understand why i am emerald. yes most of the time soloq, theorycraft builds and pugs who dont listen

its a hard knock life ….

maybe the personal score can be match to your mmr and not you win rate . kitten far i get 1-4 icons in personal score

UmbraNoctis.1907:

Shadowstep.6049:

No, because they have high enough initial mmr to not be matched with complete potatoes. skill is a factor, yet. do you think helseth or sind can carry a match where one dude left, another one is afk at spawn while raging and you’re 3v5 with a hammer/staff guardian and a vanilla zerk ranger that only autoattacks and #5s?
if one of them can, i will worship him as god of guildwars forever.

Nobody can carry all games. Nobody has to do so. If MMR is random, then good players won’t have a higher initial MMR that prevents them from getting terrible players. If their MMR is not random, then maybe your MMR isn’t completely random either, right?

Why is my name in the quote with message i didn’t post?

Because i screwed up with quoting. Corrected it now.

I agree with OP. I didn’t read through the entire thread, but I agree with the initial post. So many people in pvp like to play the blame game for their loss. They want to play the blame game for their low rating and/or low tier rank. It’s time people look at their own contribution to the team and come to terms with their own level of skill. I lose a lot. I think to myself that I could have done this or that better. I think it’s time we people took responsibility for their losses. That sentence “you guys didn’t do this or that…” or “my team is full of r-word” in map chat when you lose mid in the first group fight is, imo, childish. It’s like a child who hasn’t learned sportsmanship and responsibility yet so he/she lashes out at the people they are on a team with. They think I could have won this point if I were with better players. But you have to acknowledge that you are on this team because you are a little more, or a little less, just as good as these people. The matchmaking system is working.

This community is much smaller than other pvp communities. I would like to sportsmanship be a thing in spvp. I really would like to see sportsmanship brought back to the term “gg” when you see it in team chat. And I think the first step is accepting that we contribute to our own losses, as well as wins. In any case, I like the mmr system and I trust it to place me where I belong. Whichever tier that may be.

Hot Boy.7138:

I agree with OP. I didn’t read through the entire thread, but I agree with the initial post. So many people in pvp like to play the blame game for their loss. They want to play the blame game for their low rating and/or low tier rank. It’s time people look at their own contribution to the team and come to terms with their own level of skill. I lose a lot. I think to myself that I could have done this or that better. I think it’s time we people took responsibility for their losses. That sentence “you guys didn’t do this or that…” or “my team is full of r-word” in map chat when you lose mid in the first group fight is, imo, childish. It’s like a child who hasn’t learned sportsmanship and responsibility yet so he/she lashes out at the people they are on a team with. They think I could have won this point if I were with better players. But you have to acknowledge that you are on this team because you are a little more, or a little less, just as good as these people. The matchmaking system is working.

This community is much smaller than other pvp communities. I would like to sportsmanship be a thing in spvp. I really would like to see sportsmanship brought back to the term “gg” when you see it in team chat. And I think the first step is accepting that we contribute to our own losses, as well as wins. In any case, I like the mmr system and I trust it to place me where I belong. Whichever tier that may be.

Every loss I’ve had has a perfectly reasonable explanation, that doesn’t make it any less frustrating.

And honestly I think people that got lucky in placement that haven’t actually seen what it’s like to play below 1k should be telling others what it’s like.

Crowley.8761:

Hot Boy.7138:

I agree with OP. I didn’t read through the entire thread, but I agree with the initial post. So many people in pvp like to play the blame game for their loss. They want to play the blame game for their low rating and/or low tier rank. It’s time people look at their own contribution to the team and come to terms with their own level of skill. I lose a lot. I think to myself that I could have done this or that better. I think it’s time we people took responsibility for their losses. That sentence “you guys didn’t do this or that…” or “my team is full of r-word” in map chat when you lose mid in the first group fight is, imo, childish. It’s like a child who hasn’t learned sportsmanship and responsibility yet so he/she lashes out at the people they are on a team with. They think I could have won this point if I were with better players. But you have to acknowledge that you are on this team because you are a little more, or a little less, just as good as these people. The matchmaking system is working.

This community is much smaller than other pvp communities. I would like to sportsmanship be a thing in spvp. I really would like to see sportsmanship brought back to the term “gg” when you see it in team chat. And I think the first step is accepting that we contribute to our own losses, as well as wins. In any case, I like the mmr system and I trust it to place me where I belong. Whichever tier that may be.

Every loss I’ve had has a perfectly reasonable explanation, that doesn’t make it any less frustrating.

And honestly I think people that got lucky in placement that haven’t actually seen what it’s like to play below 1k should be telling others what it’s like.

I don’t understand why it’s so frustrating to some people. If it’s not your career, if your livelihood doesn’t depend on it. If you’re playing gw2 for fun, I really don’t get the frustration part. And ideally, with perfect mmr you should be losing half of all your matches. Win rate should be 50/50. Only one team can win. it’s either gonna be you or them. You win some, you lose some. That’s all there is to it.

People in general just need something to blame.

People need to realize that there are 10 people in a match. 5 of those people are on the enemy team, 4 of them are on your team. You have no control of either of those factors. What do you have control of is your contribution which equates to about 10%. For better or worse, you the player have control over your contributions.

As for afkers ragers, etc the enemy team always has a better chance of having this so long as you do not do these things. Yes it will happen and it will feel terrible. Just find some fun in those games(maybe duel someone is really good on the enemy team or see how long you can hold a point 3v1), look at what went wrong at the start and how to prevent that.

A 50% win rate is good and shows you are roughly where you belong and even still you can climb with 50% win rate. If your not where you belong you will climb with a win rate roughly 55% or plumet with a win rate of 45%. You will get to where you belong and climb so long as you take a big enough sample size. If you don’t like your rank… play more.

If you think it’s luck, watch this http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1iamx4_through-the-wormhole-is-luck-real_creation

Eval.2371:

If you think it’s luck, watch this http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1iamx4_through-the-wormhole-is-luck-real_creation

Nobody thinks it’s some cosmic force causing them to be placed into bronze. The placement matches are the worst thing ever and grinding out of them to get some decent teams is unfun.

These “got mine” people have no idea how infuriating the dice roll for the placement matches are.

The fact there was a PvE player in the top 5 only shows how random it feels to people.

Placement should have been 100 matches to at least make it seem less biased against a dice roll.

Hot Boy.7138:

Crowley.8761:

Hot Boy.7138:

I agree with OP. I didn’t read through the entire thread, but I agree with the initial post. So many people in pvp like to play the blame game for their loss. They want to play the blame game for their low rating and/or low tier rank. It’s time people look at their own contribution to the team and come to terms with their own level of skill. I lose a lot. I think to myself that I could have done this or that better. I think it’s time we people took responsibility for their losses. That sentence “you guys didn’t do this or that…” or “my team is full of r-word” in map chat when you lose mid in the first group fight is, imo, childish. It’s like a child who hasn’t learned sportsmanship and responsibility yet so he/she lashes out at the people they are on a team with. They think I could have won this point if I were with better players. But you have to acknowledge that you are on this team because you are a little more, or a little less, just as good as these people. The matchmaking system is working.

This community is much smaller than other pvp communities. I would like to sportsmanship be a thing in spvp. I really would like to see sportsmanship brought back to the term “gg” when you see it in team chat. And I think the first step is accepting that we contribute to our own losses, as well as wins. In any case, I like the mmr system and I trust it to place me where I belong. Whichever tier that may be.

Every loss I’ve had has a perfectly reasonable explanation, that doesn’t make it any less frustrating.

And honestly I think people that got lucky in placement that haven’t actually seen what it’s like to play below 1k should be telling others what it’s like.

I don’t understand why it’s so frustrating to some people. If it’s not your career, if your livelihood doesn’t depend on it. If you’re playing gw2 for fun, I really don’t get the frustration part. And ideally, with perfect mmr you should be losing half of all your matches. Win rate should be 50/50. Only one team can win. it’s either gonna be you or them. You win some, you lose some. That’s all there is to it.

Because it’s not fun… Is that really so hard to understand? Yes, I play games for fun. Losing games where there was nothing I could do to change the outcome is not fun. It is frustrating. I don’t really understand how you can not get that…

Supreme.7352:

Eval.2371:

If you think it’s luck, watch this http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1iamx4_through-the-wormhole-is-luck-real_creation

Nobody thinks it’s some cosmic force causing them to be placed into bronze. The placement matches are the worst thing ever and grinding out of them to get some decent teams is unfun.

These “got mine” people have no idea how infuriating the dice roll for the placement matches are.

The fact there was a PvE player in the top 5 only shows how random it feels to people.

I think you misunderstand the point of the video: luck is a myth, take a larger sample size and you’ll where you belong. Getting placed bronze or low silver means nothing. Which I’ll admit I got placed low silver with some terrible placement matches, I climbed to gold in a couple of days. I can see my self if I continue to play to easily make it plat. It’s not that hard.

A player getting placed in top 5 means nothing if he cannot play at the level and stay there. He will fall if he actually does not belong there when he continues to play games.

That’s the whole point I am saying, if you don’t like where you are play more. It is statistically likely you climb unless you play at a level well below your opponents.

I would challenge someone who is much better than I am and has much more free time than I have; to purposely get placed in low bronze for science. Then prove to the community how easy it is to climb.

Supreme.7352:

Placement should have been 100 matches to at least make it seem less biased against a dice roll.

Why aren’t you just playing those 100 games? The only difference between placement matches and normal matches is the hidden rating at the beginning. But if you can see your rating after 1, 10 or 100 games doesn’t really matter.

UmbraNoctis.1907:

Supreme.7352:

Placement should have been 100 matches to at least make it seem less biased against a dice roll.

Why aren’t you just playing those 100 games? The only difference between placement matches and normal matches is the hidden rating at the beginning. But if you can see your rating after 1, 10 or 100 games doesn’t really matter.

Because other people would be also be in the placement matches at mixed levels, instead of forced to play with only people of a certain league.

Eval.2371:

I think you misunderstand the point of the video: luck is a myth,.

Duh. But dice rolls aren’t, and that determines who you are paired with/against.

You people seem to misunderstand.

It’s not about where you are at the end of the league. The no-lifers already take care of eating all that space up. It’s about where you start and if you want to keep having fun.

I have already worked myself out of bronze and into mid-silver with only 60 games played. But it takes a considerable amount of effort and is blood boiling.

Look at it this way.

If you’re trying your very best, like no one ever was, the odds of your team winning are going to be much greater.

Why? Because in order for a team to win, they have to be better than the opposite team. Simple as that.

Supreme.7352:

Eval.2371:

I think you misunderstand the point of the video: luck is a myth,.

Duh. But dice rolls aren’t, and that determines who you are paired with/against.

You people seem to misunderstand.

It’s not about where you are at the end of the league. The no-lifers already take care of eating all that space up. It’s about where you start and if you want to keep having fun.

I have already worked myself out of bronze and into mid-silver with only 60 games played. But it takes a considerable amount of effort and is blood boiling.

Fun is completely subjective.

Being challenged to some people is fun. Steam rolling everything with minimal effort for some is fun. There are blow out matches at all levels of gameplay that are not fun. It happens.

In all honesty from the way some of you describe this issue, its like you guys think way to highly of your selves and let a near intangible number manages your level of satisfaction of the game. Which if that is the case, I feel truly sorry for you and don’t see how I can reason with that kind of logic at all.

He is right he is only slightly about avearge Ive beaten Emdrixx many time he is far from an expert. Usually he plays a whiney thief. Grats on the getting 250 though dude that is some major glitch in the system.

Supreme.7352:

Because other people would be also be in the placement matches at mixed levels, instead of forced to play with only people of a certain league.

Placement matches use the same matchmaking as other matches. There is litterally no other difference than the hidden (but still existent) rating.

Emdrix.6124:

Im far from being a pro player and I have 3 accounts in the top 250 full solo Q.

I think this only confirms how flawed the system is.

Pro players like Phantaram and Zoose are in the top 50. It isn’t a coincidence.

Crowley.8761:

Hot Boy.7138:

Crowley.8761:

Hot Boy.7138:

I agree with OP. I didn’t read through the entire thread, but I agree with the initial post. So many people in pvp like to play the blame game for their loss. They want to play the blame game for their low rating and/or low tier rank. It’s time people look at their own contribution to the team and come to terms with their own level of skill. I lose a lot. I think to myself that I could have done this or that better. I think it’s time we people took responsibility for their losses. That sentence “you guys didn’t do this or that…” or “my team is full of r-word” in map chat when you lose mid in the first group fight is, imo, childish. It’s like a child who hasn’t learned sportsmanship and responsibility yet so he/she lashes out at the people they are on a team with. They think I could have won this point if I were with better players. But you have to acknowledge that you are on this team because you are a little more, or a little less, just as good as these people. The matchmaking system is working.

This community is much smaller than other pvp communities. I would like to sportsmanship be a thing in spvp. I really would like to see sportsmanship brought back to the term “gg” when you see it in team chat. And I think the first step is accepting that we contribute to our own losses, as well as wins. In any case, I like the mmr system and I trust it to place me where I belong. Whichever tier that may be.

Every loss I’ve had has a perfectly reasonable explanation, that doesn’t make it any less frustrating.

And honestly I think people that got lucky in placement that haven’t actually seen what it’s like to play below 1k should be telling others what it’s like.

I don’t understand why it’s so frustrating to some people. If it’s not your career, if your livelihood doesn’t depend on it. If you’re playing gw2 for fun, I really don’t get the frustration part. And ideally, with perfect mmr you should be losing half of all your matches. Win rate should be 50/50. Only one team can win. it’s either gonna be you or them. You win some, you lose some. That’s all there is to it.

Because it’s not fun… Is that really so hard to understand? Yes, I play games for fun. Losing games where there was nothing I could do to change the outcome is not fun. It is frustrating. I don’t really understand how you can not get that…

I really can’t. I think it’s funny honestly that there are people that genuinely feel like that. That is the epitome of being a sore loser and a poor sport. I understand why professional gamers feel frustrated and upset by a loss. It’s their career. Their money and reputation is at stake. But for the majority of players, it’s really just great character flaw. And I’m competitive. I do want to win and try my best to. And I get wanting to make it to the top of the ladder. I’d like to get up there also. But poor sportsmanship ruins good matches, in any game and sport.

Abelisk.4527:

Pro players like Phantaram and Zoose are in the top 50. It isn’t a coincidence.

It’s not a pure coincidence. But there is a element of random that is outside of a player’s control.

Given that it’s less than a week that random element is still out in force for a lot of us and it sucks. (I spent the offseason playing unranked with and against some of the ESL guys, now I spend ranked season trying to carry a circus)

It does suck. I have an image around here where I had a full-list loss streak. Thinking my support build was supporting bad teammates, I dropped it and scrambled for builds to play with. I finally used my zerk build and got a whopping six win streak, after losing to a little mistake I made (reviving a teammate rather than killing the enemy, ughI was such an idiot)

Eval.2371:

In all honesty from the way some of you describe this issue, its like you guys think way to highly of your selves and let a near intangible number manages your level of satisfaction of the game. Which if that is the case, I feel truly sorry for you and don’t see how I can reason with that kind of logic at all.

I like how you misrepresent people in order to make yourself feel superior.

I honestly think I am high-silver to low-gold level of player. The fact that I have to slam my forehead against a concrete wall to get to even that level is super-frustrating. That’s not challenge. That’s grind.

There are people with 10 matches played in the top 10-20 range. 10 Placement matches shouldn’t have such a huge factor in matchmaking. If they started playing and were low level, eventually they would be dropped down, because the reason they lost would rest solely with them. But it would take a considerably less amount of time before they started winning matches and then would be placed in somewhere they belong.

Consider then someone who may belong in platinum, but gets stuck in bronze through no fault of their own. They would have to grind hundreds of matches in order to get there.

Rolisteel.1375:

Crowley.8761:

UmbraNoctis.1907:

But why would the system put all the bad players in the same team and all the good in the other for hundreds and thousands of games? I mean, according to you, the system can’t even know who is good and who is bad. You are basically saying, matchmaking doesn’t exist and never existed, because it is all rng. But if its all rng, it will be the same for all players in the long run. Because rng doesn’t give any advantages or disadvantages to anybody.

The system can’t judge who is good and who is bad, it’s not designed for that. It’s designed to judge am entire team so it would work great for full premades, but for individuals it is crap.

+1 this

Basically this.

I was thinking if put a lot of effort in the game, looking for a dude with my similar skill level (1700+ mmr) and try to duo queue, carrying like crazy, until legendary.

But a the end of the story I realized all this effort is pure meaningless, the only sense if you want to be a Pro player for the big prize money competition, honestly for a anonymous title all this effort is simply too much.

Probably I’ll move to other competitive pvp game, but without team involved, only 1vs1 or 2vs2, at least if I lose I can blame only myself and if I win is only for my skill. Dunno, I’ll think about it.

Tired to not have control on other people skill, These team games at the end are very fun all if you have a competition full team vs full team, in solo you lose a lot of fun.

Don’t get me wrong, on paper I like this system but is only bad implemented, with placements and old mmr too strong and duo queue too much important at higher level.

Maybe s6 will be better.

I can +1 the idea that ranked should solely be teams of 5. You certainly won’t get any salt on this forum about random DCs or scrub players, because the only one whos fault it is to play with scrub-tier players is your own.

…it is possible the the matchmaker has been reverted to the S2 design, where it puts all the highest rated players from the pool on one team against all the lowest rated! I am calling it now. This is what they did!

This must be the most effective way to make sure the best players rise to the top.

Supreme.7352:

I can +1 the idea that ranked should solely be teams of 5. You certainly won’t get any salt on this forum about random DCs or scrub players, because the only one whos fault it is to play with scrub-tier players is your own.

Sadly the full team can work only on paper, not in reality, full teams are the minority in every game because require a lot of life scheduling and practice to mantain the team, and this can work only on a pro tier level, not for the majority.

Personally I think the pure solo queue version with a better soft reset (less weight on previous mmr) and less volatily placement would be the best option for the ranked.

In this season I see 0, ZERO, NOTHING improvement about quality games, always the same level and a super frustrating progression at higher level for soloer, worst than ever.

vove.2768:

Emdrix.6124:

Im far from being a pro player and I have 3 accounts in the top 250 full solo Q.

I think this only confirms how flawed the system is.

Or a reality check on how active and small the community actually is.

Supreme.7352:

I like how you misrepresent people in order to make yourself feel superior.

I honestly think I am high-silver to low-gold level of player. The fact that I have to slam my forehead against a concrete wall to get to even that level is super-frustrating. That’s not challenge. That’s grind.

I am not trying to make my self feel superior I am just laying out things how I see them.
My perspective of the scene has always been the majority of the community suffers from dunning–kruger syndrome. My self at times included. I just choose not let outcomes of matches or a number control my enjoyment of the game. I make my experience an enjoyable and realistic one. You can too.

The fact that you describe ranked pvp as a grind and relate it to harming your self makes me question if you even enjoy pvp to begin with, and are just playing it for the rewards and prestige. If that’s the case then thats your own fault for forcing your self to do something you don’t enjoy.

Supreme.7352:

Consider then someone who may belong in platinum, but gets stuck in bronze through no fault of their own.

That’s like saying someone who never applies for a job, deserves to get the job. Yes there may be people that just get the job due to random luck and connections. Them keeping it is a totally different story. Some people have to work to get the job they deserve. It’s no different with MMR rank. The only thing you have control over is your performance and the number of times you pick you self up and try again. You can only be stuck in bronze by fault of your own, your either not good enough and not looking to improve, or your inactive and not playing.

Hot Boy.7138:

Crowley.8761:

Hot Boy.7138:

Crowley.8761:

Hot Boy.7138:

I agree with OP. I didn’t read through the entire thread, but I agree with the initial post. So many people in pvp like to play the blame game for their loss. They want to play the blame game for their low rating and/or low tier rank. It’s time people look at their own contribution to the team and come to terms with their own level of skill. I lose a lot. I think to myself that I could have done this or that better. I think it’s time we people took responsibility for their losses. That sentence “you guys didn’t do this or that…” or “my team is full of r-word” in map chat when you lose mid in the first group fight is, imo, childish. It’s like a child who hasn’t learned sportsmanship and responsibility yet so he/she lashes out at the people they are on a team with. They think I could have won this point if I were with better players. But you have to acknowledge that you are on this team because you are a little more, or a little less, just as good as these people. The matchmaking system is working.

This community is much smaller than other pvp communities. I would like to sportsmanship be a thing in spvp. I really would like to see sportsmanship brought back to the term “gg” when you see it in team chat. And I think the first step is accepting that we contribute to our own losses, as well as wins. In any case, I like the mmr system and I trust it to place me where I belong. Whichever tier that may be.

Every loss I’ve had has a perfectly reasonable explanation, that doesn’t make it any less frustrating.

And honestly I think people that got lucky in placement that haven’t actually seen what it’s like to play below 1k should be telling others what it’s like.

I don’t understand why it’s so frustrating to some people. If it’s not your career, if your livelihood doesn’t depend on it. If you’re playing gw2 for fun, I really don’t get the frustration part. And ideally, with perfect mmr you should be losing half of all your matches. Win rate should be 50/50. Only one team can win. it’s either gonna be you or them. You win some, you lose some. That’s all there is to it.

Because it’s not fun… Is that really so hard to understand? Yes, I play games for fun. Losing games where there was nothing I could do to change the outcome is not fun. It is frustrating. I don’t really understand how you can not get that…

I really can’t. I think it’s funny honestly that there are people that genuinely feel like that. That is the epitome of being a sore loser and a poor sport. I understand why professional gamers feel frustrated and upset by a loss. It’s their career. Their money and reputation is at stake. But for the majority of players, it’s really just great character flaw. And I’m competitive. I do want to win and try my best to. And I get wanting to make it to the top of the ladder. I’d like to get up there also. But poor sportsmanship ruins good matches, in any game and sport.

That made no kind of sense at all. If you’re the kind of person that has so little going on that losing five games in a row because someone got kittened off and quit is fun then I sincerely hope you retain that feeling. Or never stop drinking.

For the rest of us. Us normal people I mean, losses are frustrating. It has nothing to do with sportsmanship, just because something is frustrating doesn’t mean you go act like a kid and throw a fit. You can be a good sport even if it’s frustrating. Unless you’re 8 years old of course.

So I think your giant character flaw is that you can’t seperate between being frustrated and acting out. For us adults they’re not mutually exclusive and I hope you learn that or you can easily end up destroying your life over nothing.

There is so much miss information from people who want to claim skill.

Going 50/50 Is not where you suppose to be (See Screen shot), the ones that are saying they can single handly carry a game are completly full of it. I’m a thief, i can keep one point caped and one point neutral. It does not matter most games, since your teammates are constantly charging home point and dieing 4on3.

Supreme you should just ignore Locuz, He’s just a troll trying to boost his ego.

Eventally i will get motivated enough to post a video, Until then, let’s observe some “Quality match making”

Eval.2371:

I am not trying to make my self feel superior I am just laying out things how I see them.
My perspective of the scene has always been the majority of the community suffers from dunning–kruger syndrome. My self at times included. I just choose not let outcomes of matches or a number control my enjoyment of the game. I make my experience an enjoyable and realistic one. You can too.

Again, you don’t know me. You’re misrepresenting what I am talking about. It has nothing to do with thinking I (or anyone here) thinks that they are top 10 super-bad-cool-guy. It’s that they are trying to legit play some games and get better, but end up with really obviously flawed teams and it makes them feel helpless. It is something anet could address. This game isn’t DOTA2 or LoL. It doesn’t have the playerbase installed that anet can only use the numbers.

Now that I crawled out of bronze and are now into mid-silver. My matches have been a lot better. It feels like normal PvP again with our team losing because of skill, rather than dropouts and deadbeats. It’s a lot more fun. But it was frustrating at first and that’s why people are complaining on the forums.

Wait, what?
You (a good/better player) have a random amount of alternative characters on which you (the good/better player) beat other games with your obviously good PvP skills and then brag about it? Huh?

It’s like driving 5 different cars and brag how good they are for racing – but it’s still ONE driver, so you are not quite showing anything. We know you are better (from this post) but your skill is high anyways, you could have 87 characters there and that would proof nothing except of the basic conecpt of: If there are winners (you) there are losers (unsatisfied players) on the other side.

Excelsior.

Emdrix.6124:

People need to stop blaming matchmaking. Im far from being a pro player and I have 3 accounts in the top 250 full solo Q. If you re stuck in some scrub tier division that’s probably where you belong. You just need to be slightly above average to make it. The matchmaking works as intented.

Sometimes I get destroyed aswell or get 4v5s but that happens to everyone, you just need to win more than you lose, stop blaming matchmaking .

If you lose its YOUR fault, You were not able to carry hard enough. That’s about it. Sure some matches are uncarriable but most of them are if you are in a lower division.
If you cannot carry then that’s where you belong. because carrying means being significantly better than everyone in that division.

And btw on this account I had to climb to reach top 250 because the placement matches were a total mess, so I did get unlucky on this account unlike my other 2 but still climbed.

This is not a brag thread I’m literally just slightly above average and still made it solo Q on 3 accounts. for pro players this would be even easier. I believe Magic Toker has 3 or more? accounts in the top 10-20.

Im probably never gonna reach legend and in fine with that. People need to accept that and stop blaming matchmaking.

All of this just makes you sound like you have no idea what you’re talking about. You have no way to qualify or back up any of your ‘statements’.

So many people trying tell everyone else what is what when they have no idea how they get where they are themselves. Unless you were there or are provided context of some kind, you’re just making kitten up to be an kitten. Do better.

Crowley.8761:

Hot Boy.7138:

Crowley.8761:

Hot Boy.7138:

Crowley.8761:

Hot Boy.7138:

I agree with OP. I didn’t read through the entire thread, but I agree with the initial post. So many people in pvp like to play the blame game for their loss. They want to play the blame game for their low rating and/or low tier rank. It’s time people look at their own contribution to the team and come to terms with their own level of skill. I lose a lot. I think to myself that I could have done this or that better. I think it’s time we people took responsibility for their losses. That sentence “you guys didn’t do this or that…” or “my team is full of r-word” in map chat when you lose mid in the first group fight is, imo, childish. It’s like a child who hasn’t learned sportsmanship and responsibility yet so he/she lashes out at the people they are on a team with. They think I could have won this point if I were with better players. But you have to acknowledge that you are on this team because you are a little more, or a little less, just as good as these people. The matchmaking system is working.

This community is much smaller than other pvp communities. I would like to sportsmanship be a thing in spvp. I really would like to see sportsmanship brought back to the term “gg” when you see it in team chat. And I think the first step is accepting that we contribute to our own losses, as well as wins. In any case, I like the mmr system and I trust it to place me where I belong. Whichever tier that may be.

Every loss I’ve had has a perfectly reasonable explanation, that doesn’t make it any less frustrating.

And honestly I think people that got lucky in placement that haven’t actually seen what it’s like to play below 1k should be telling others what it’s like.

I don’t understand why it’s so frustrating to some people. If it’s not your career, if your livelihood doesn’t depend on it. If you’re playing gw2 for fun, I really don’t get the frustration part. And ideally, with perfect mmr you should be losing half of all your matches. Win rate should be 50/50. Only one team can win. it’s either gonna be you or them. You win some, you lose some. That’s all there is to it.

Because it’s not fun… Is that really so hard to understand? Yes, I play games for fun. Losing games where there was nothing I could do to change the outcome is not fun. It is frustrating. I don’t really understand how you can not get that…

I really can’t. I think it’s funny honestly that there are people that genuinely feel like that. That is the epitome of being a sore loser and a poor sport. I understand why professional gamers feel frustrated and upset by a loss. It’s their career. Their money and reputation is at stake. But for the majority of players, it’s really just great character flaw. And I’m competitive. I do want to win and try my best to. And I get wanting to make it to the top of the ladder. I’d like to get up there also. But poor sportsmanship ruins good matches, in any game and sport.

That made no kind of sense at all. If you’re the kind of person that has so little going on that losing five games in a row because someone got kittened off and quit is fun then I sincerely hope you retain that feeling. Or never stop drinking.

For the rest of us. Us normal people I mean, losses are frustrating. It has nothing to do with sportsmanship, just because something is frustrating doesn’t mean you go act like a kid and throw a fit. You can be a good sport even if it’s frustrating. Unless you’re 8 years old of course.

So I think your giant character flaw is that you can’t seperate between being frustrated and acting out. For us adults they’re not mutually exclusive and I hope you learn that or you can easily end up destroying your life over nothing.

If you only have fun when you’re on the winning side, then yes you are a poor sport. If you feel there is no fun to be had in a match because you’re on the losing side, then yes you are a poor sport. Win or lose, someone who has a healthy sense of competition will enjoy a match. Someone who did not develop a healthy sense of competition, usually as a child, will be a sore loser. A sore loser is someone that expresses their frustration of not being on the winning team in a nasty way. It’s all in the manner in which you express yourself after you win and after you lose. And most of the time, in a lot of the matches I’m in, poor sportsmanship is expressed in a very nasty way. It’s obvious. Everyone here has seen it. It makes perfect sense.

I don’t want to derail this thread so to drive it back to the original point. The issue here is that most people who haven’t accepted their own limits as a PvPer are blaming their losses on the matchmaking system. Blaming their losses on their 4 other teammates. They think they are always the best player on their team and if they lose, it must be the other people’s faults. And they contribute nothing to their low rating, losses, losing streaks. Their contributions are only counted when they win. So the matchmaking system is flawed in their eyes. It’s grouping them with a bad team, after bad team, after bad team. Endless bad teams. The system is fine. Now there may be just a few people who are correct in thinking their losses are totally the result of getting matched with experienced players over and over again. But that is only valid if they haven’t done a lot of matches and were very unlucky in them. My advice to them, play many more matches. And if it’s always the same result, then it’s time to face reality. You may not be as good as you think you are.

And let me tell you. I think i’m a phenomenal player lol. I really do. But i’m hovering at 1450 to 1500. Clearly, that’s my limit as Pvper. OP has 3 separate accounts and all of which are at the same high level. I don’t think that’s a coincidence.

Well, I am blaming the matchmaking system in the first few hours: I lost 7 or 8 of the ranking matches because most of the time, we were a teammember short.

Now, I’m slowly stepping up (between 10 and 15 ranking per game) which means that after 100 games, I might be where I should be (wins and loses considered). I’m fine with this because I do not play for bragging rights but for fun.

If you are looking to be in the Top 250 and had a terrible losing streak with the ranking matches, then sadly, you’ll have to do more than 100 games to reach the very best of the best, but with enough time and commitment, you might make it… if you’re skilled enough.

If you’re not playing for fun or don’t want to take the necesasry time to rank up, then I don’t know what to say.

No hot boy, the majority of us don’t even care about that.
All i want is an even matchup, where both sides have an equal shot at winning.
I’m not like you guy’s who want to win every single match and claim kitten, i could care less.

you guy’s are not even using fact’s, just basic bullkitten slander “git good” ect ect.
How do you think the new player’s that are stuck facing me (or any other player’s with 1000’s of games) feel? They sure as hell ain’t having a good old time being spawn camped now are they?

It’s amusing how desperate you guy’s are to cling on to the falsehood that this season is “skillful” it’s sad really.

Hot Boy.7138:

If you only have fun when you’re on the winning side, then yes you are a poor sport. If you feel there is no fun to be had in a match because you’re on the losing side, then yes you are a poor sport. Win or lose, someone who has a healthy sense of competition will enjoy a match. Someone who did not develop a healthy sense of competition, usually as a child, will be a sore loser. A sore loser is someone that expresses their frustration of not being on the winning team in a nasty way. It’s all in the manner in which you express yourself after you win and after you lose. And most of the time, in a lot of the matches I’m in, poor sportsmanship is expressed in a very nasty way. It’s obvious. Everyone here has seen it. It makes perfect sense.

Not at all. I never said that. Losing a good game can still be fun, but (and I am repeating what I said that you conveniently ignored) losing because someone gets angry and throws a fit and goes afk is not fun. Do you understand the difference or will you require more examples?

And you keep talking about being a “poor sport” although I’ve already explained to you that being frustrated because of losses you can’t prevent and “being a poor sport” are different. One does not follow the other. Are there more things I have to say again or do you get the point now? If not, let me know the aproximate number of times I need to repeat myself and I’ll spam them all in my next reply so we can move on in the discussion.

Emdrix.6124:

People need to stop blaming matchmaking. Im far from being a pro player and I have 3 accounts in the top 250 full solo Q. If you re stuck in some scrub tier division that’s probably where you belong. You just need to be slightly above average to make it. The matchmaking works as intented.

Sometimes I get destroyed aswell or get 4v5s but that happens to everyone, you just need to win more than you lose, stop blaming matchmaking .

If you lose its YOUR fault, You were not able to carry hard enough. That’s about it. Sure some matches are uncarriable but most of them are if you are in a lower division.
If you cannot carry then that’s where you belong. because carrying means being significantly better than everyone in that division.

And btw on this account I had to climb to reach top 250 because the placement matches were a total mess, so I did get unlucky on this account unlike my other 2 but still climbed.

This is not a brag thread I’m literally just slightly above average and still made it solo Q on 3 accounts. for pro players this would be even easier. I believe Magic Toker has 3 or more? accounts in the top 10-20.

Im probably never gonna reach legend and in fine with that. People need to accept that and stop blaming matchmaking.

Really? Carry your team or be stuck in some lower division? I got 7 out of 3 on my placement matches yet was still placed on higher tier silver… I dropped a few tiers because I was playing DH and honestly the class can’t carry…

So I switched to Ele to climb up to gold and I’m still working my way higher. I win most matches on bunker ele because that class/build can carry. Others cannot.

Has jack to do with skill since I’m admittedly better on a DH than I am on Ele. I main DH, I play Ele for laughs and giggles.

The point is you argue you should be significantly better than anyone else on your division and thus you should be able to carry… Really? You’re supposed to carry the other 4 scrubs that don’t look at map let alone follow simple instructions on chat?

The point here is if you were truly intended to carry, than ANet should introduce what I call “carry mechanics” where say not dying or reaching certain metrics actually buffs your character in order to be able to carry the rest of the team.

As it stands today, no matter how good you are, you cannot carry every team, in every situation. As an example, it’s common knowledge that in lower tiers, bunker specs outperform since you are rarely focused, and people in general don’t know how to fight you.
If you play a power spec like DH forget it, you can win every fight and every point you are on, yet the lack of mobility and squishiness of the class will make it impossible for you to carry your team to victory.

I’m not even complaining since I actually enjoy winning 90+% of matches as a bunker ele, this is actually fun.
But I hardly think this is how the game is intended to be played. I simply don’t belong in this division and I was placed here by this obscure MMR that honestly would be nice to know how exactly it’s calculated.

I would’ve loved to be placed on a division where I feel I’m actually challenged I get competent teammates/opponents.

Again, if you’re supposed to carry and that’s how the system is supposed to work, then please introduce proper carry mechanics because as it stands today, 2 average players will always get the pro, doesn’t matter how good they are, at best the match ends with the pro just leaving the fight. This is not a game where skill makes THAT big a difference if you’re saddled with a team that will fight off the points and use the weirdest most useless builds…

Highlie.7641:

There is so much miss information from people who want to claim skill.

Going 50/50 Is not where you suppose to be (See Screen shot), the ones that are saying they can single handly carry a game are completly full of it. I’m a thief, i can keep one point caped and one point neutral. It does not matter most games, since your teammates are constantly charging home point and dieing 4on3.

Supreme you should just ignore Locuz, He’s just a troll trying to boost his ego.

Eventally i will get motivated enough to post a video, Until then, let’s observe some “Quality match making”

Is this legit? Wow. I have no idea why you are in bronze for your skill level, I for one am in t3 silver lel.

StickerHappy.8052:

Highlie.7641:

There is so much miss information from people who want to claim skill.

Going 50/50 Is not where you suppose to be (See Screen shot), the ones that are saying they can single handly carry a game are completly full of it. I’m a thief, i can keep one point caped and one point neutral. It does not matter most games, since your teammates are constantly charging home point and dieing 4on3.

Supreme you should just ignore Locuz, He’s just a troll trying to boost his ego.

Eventally i will get motivated enough to post a video, Until then, let’s observe some “Quality match making”

Is this legit? Wow. I have no idea why you are in bronze for your skill level, I for one am in t3 silver lel.

If he thinks letting his team rush in 4v3 to their close is a good idea its no surprise he can’t climb. What he should’ve done is just +1 it, burst one or two down and then gtfo there because at that point, it would be impossible for your teammates to lose and they will move on after capping, even if they cap it together. With a thief’s mobility, he can be back to doing other things in no time.

NovaanVerdiano.6174:

StickerHappy.8052:

Highlie.7641:

There is so much miss information from people who want to claim skill.

Going 50/50 Is not where you suppose to be (See Screen shot), the ones that are saying they can single handly carry a game are completly full of it. I’m a thief, i can keep one point caped and one point neutral. It does not matter most games, since your teammates are constantly charging home point and dieing 4on3.

Supreme you should just ignore Locuz, He’s just a troll trying to boost his ego.

Eventally i will get motivated enough to post a video, Until then, let’s observe some “Quality match making”

Is this legit? Wow. I have no idea why you are in bronze for your skill level, I for one am in t3 silver lel.

If he thinks letting his team rush in 4v3 to their close is a good idea its no surprise he can’t climb. What he should’ve done is just +1 it, burst one or two down and then gtfo there because at that point, it would be impossible for your teammates to lose and they will move on after capping, even if they cap it together. With a thief’s mobility, he can be back to doing other things in no time.

You would be surprised. I have had teams that lost 4v2 fights.

Supreme.7352:

Eval.2371:

In all honesty from the way some of you describe this issue, its like you guys think way to highly of your selves and let a near intangible number manages your level of satisfaction of the game. Which if that is the case, I feel truly sorry for you and don’t see how I can reason with that kind of logic at all.

I like how you misrepresent people in order to make yourself feel superior.

I honestly think I am high-silver to low-gold level of player. The fact that I have to slam my forehead against a concrete wall to get to even that level is super-frustrating. That’s not challenge. That’s grind.

There are people with 10 matches played in the top 10-20 range. 10 Placement matches shouldn’t have such a huge factor in matchmaking. If they started playing and were low level, eventually they would be dropped down, because the reason they lost would rest solely with them. But it would take a considerably less amount of time before they started winning matches and then would be placed in somewhere they belong.

Consider then someone who may belong in platinum, but gets stuck in bronze through no fault of their own. They would have to grind hundreds of matches in order to get there.

This is it. the system works, but luck based placement results in grind even for experienced players and i constantly see as they can´t stand their terrible teammates. Or they think they are terrible making it worse ….
I myself was so blue eyed to solo placment with 6:4 and landed low silver now in the grind mill with about 60% win rate somtimes nearly solo blowing the oposing team up :-(.
My experience tells me i can make 100 at best 200 matches a season. This will barely bring me out of silver at an average of 10 points +/-. On the other side it might be accurate that i am a gold player ….

I had a match before yesterday(the last match of the day) where i as a dh brought downt o 30% health more or less a rev and a thief to 5% before i eventually died of cc and cds. AT this point 3 of my team members arrive for THA KILLS…. or so i thought. while i was defending our lord at respawn they all died to those 2 i left almost dead and the 4member of my team hd the same faith when he got there. I downed 2 of the 3 fighting the lord but they killed him and won the match. care to explain how can a i carry such a team? Give me more excuses on how the system works fine plz.

My team is blue…. As you can clearly see.

so before you try blaming someone for something they didn’t even do, perhaps take the time to look at the SS next time. Then it won’t appear that you have never played a game of pvp in your life…
Congratulations on proving that the people thinking ranking means something are completly clueless, and by default showing this league does not test skill.

Hilarious that you think that’s it’s possible for them to come back from a 400 point defect…
keep dreaming

Sticker i once rez’d someone on that same build and had 100% of the games total rez’s. It’s pretty hilarious down here. Which is my main gripe with this season. someone who can’t even Read the Mini map (or a screen shot) is a higher rank then me, which would be fine. if it wouldn’t take me 1000’s of games to climb out of this hole.

I posted this comment in another thread. It seemed appropriate to repost here.

FWIW I think there is a vast difference in playing environment from mid-top tier as opposed to mid-bottom. In the former group, players generally are adept on multiple classes, can reroll when necessary and do so. In the mid-bottom tier (where the majority of players reside) a lot of players are only adept on one (maybe two) classes, are hesitant to reroll and therefore rarely do.

Yes there are many wussy-sook complaints on the forums, but a lot are based in actual gameplay experience. From what I’ve seen recently, top-mid players can’t quite wrap their head around what is happening in lower tiers because it simply doesn’t happen at higher tiers. This comes across to lower tier players as “git gud, l2p” elitist bs.

I think we need to acknowledge that the play environment is very different between top and bottom tiers. Having done so, we can then move forward by seeking ways to even the playing field. (no pun intended)

Class stacking is something you see in Unranked and lower tiers of Ranked frequently. It really does need to be addressed. I don’t know what the answer is, I’m just a try-hard scrub.