(edited by Grimreaper.5370)
A Demonstration of Power(Ele/video)
No, it’s not fair. Don’t drag Rangers here.
As I already said, I propose a couple changes to the elementalist traits.
1: Raise the icd of blinding ashes to 10s or so.
2: Raise the icd of soothing ice or remove the regen portion of it.
3: Rework diamond skin so it works as a resistance buff that procs for 4 secs every time you swap into earth while above the 75% health threshold to promote more skillful counterplay.
4: Rework burning across all professions aka scale it down.
5: Possibly rework the might stacking capabilities of ele by scaling it down a bit to promote more skillful play and more teamwork. Maybe by starting with the pyromancer’s puissance trait in fire.
6: I say keep the healing/sustain on ele since we have one of the lowest hp pools and armor anyways.
7: Remove protection altogether from the elemental contigency trait (which is rng) since we have enough access to protection anyways. So replace it with something like swiftness or regen.
8: Rework Ferocious Winds and revert it back to the trait it was pre patch aka gain healing power based on precision. That way we can give marauder/zerk eles some kind of sustain to encourage more build diversity.
And I think eles will be in a very good spot compared to the rest of the meta, reasonably speaking. Nerfed but not overnerfed to the point of uselessness like some people want.
(edited by Lettuce.2945)
I’m worried that bumping this post may be a mistake on my part, but I’ll bite.
In the first video you’ve shown a cele ele with energy runes (majority don’t take these) sustaining against a power ranger at range using only skills one and 2. While it is true that cele eles should usually win that matchup, that video blows that way out of proportion.
In the 2nd video you’ve shown a cele ele defeating 2 guardians, one that was running a weird mace symbol build and one that was probably running 11k hp. Neither could significantly pressure the ele outside of melee range. Cele eles have always outclassed medi guards for that reason.
For the record, I only play about 25% of my matches on ele.
You are trying to blow this perceived imbalance way out of proportion using deceptive videos in dueling servers. Please stop. There are several more pressing balance issues at the moment…..guardians that do 20k burn ticks by pressing one button….burn in general, the nades thing….rampage….shatter mesmers (which will hard counter your ele) There isn’t a shortage of legitimate things to complain about. Pick one of those instead maybe?
I hope you realize that myself and grim, we both mained eles since we started this game. And we are aware that ele is king at the moment. Shatter mesmers don’t hard counter eles anymore especially earth traited ones. It’s an even match up nowadays. (Tbh, I haven’t lost to one yet though).
And the reason the test came on my ranger was that I was dueling a guildie of mine on my ranger versus his ele. And he’s a well known pvper…Kronos Xnm…We both agreed that eles are too strong and at the top of the hill right now. We both want a reasonable nerf. So I was dueling him and no matter how hard I tried, I couldn’t kill him. So I had a theory that a full zerk ranger wouldn’t be able to dps the ele down to 0 anyways if he rotates right. So hence…the video. So what the video shows is that no matter how much the ranger could possibly outplay the ele, as long as the ele does what was done in the video…The ranger stands zero chance even if the ele doesn’t fight back. Now this is just a small example of what ele does to many professions. Same goes for thieves, necros, guards, rangers, warriors, engineers…I mean, come on. Where do you draw the line?
I have no issues dealing with rampage and 100 nades on my ele especially when I main d/f ele. Do not assume we’re noobs.
My ele even dueled Rytlock, one of the best mesmers in the game…And forced a tie on both fire and earth traitlines (testing both). He can confirm it. Mesmers and Eles are too strong at the moment. Everything else is subpar compared to those 2.
(edited by Lettuce.2945)
I’m worried that bumping this post may be a mistake on my part, but I’ll bite.
In the first video you’ve shown a cele ele with energy runes (majority don’t take these) sustaining against a power ranger at range using only skills one and 2. While it is true that cele eles should usually win that matchup, that video blows that way out of proportion.
In the 2nd video you’ve shown a cele ele defeating 2 guardians, one that was running a weird mace symbol build and one that was probably running 11k hp. Neither could significantly pressure the ele outside of melee range. Cele eles have always outclassed medi guards for that reason.
For the record, I only play about 25% of my matches on ele.
You are trying to blow this perceived imbalance way out of proportion using deceptive videos in dueling servers. Please stop. There are several more pressing balance issues at the moment…..guardians that do 20k burn ticks by pressing one button….burn in general, the nades thing….rampage….shatter mesmers (which will hard counter your ele) There isn’t a shortage of legitimate things to complain about. Pick one of those instead maybe?
I run in spvp with one of those guardians on a regular basis, he exploits burns as much as possible. Both guardians are from my guild and know how to play. I’m concerned with the overall effectiveness of my main class because I don’t feel skilled when I win fights. I attend spvp matches in pubs and premades on a regular basis these days and also find I am too strong there.
It is true an Elementalist almost always counters the guardian class. I’ll admit the amount of condition removal I was running is very strong.
Right now I feel like the d/d AND/OR d/f elementalist usually(depending on build) has a huge advantage over most builds coming from: rangers, thieves, guardians, necros, engineers; and soft counters the rest with the exception of a solid shatter mesmer. The class feels as though it is left with out any counters.
Its very possible that perhaps I have not ran into a few builds floating around which may counter my class, but after a week of going ham on this class after the most recent patch I am left feeling unaccomplished when defeating my opponents. Its unfortunate that the class feels even more locked into celestial stats when using d/d or d/f than ever before since stats were removed from trait lines. I feel that if I want to remain playing the Elementalist in competitive play I must either run a very yolo like build or run an amulet with balanced stats but then personally suffer from an overwhelming synergy from traits when accompanied by the celestial amulet.
(edited by Grimreaper.5370)
I struggle with Eles the most out of anything. At least the profs that can kill you in two shots can die in that many as well.
sorry but you can’t showcase such a video when all parties in this video were unskilled.. it doesn’t prove anything.
given d/d ele is atm a bit of a noob carry but the guardians should destroy you in any case in a matter of seconds.
while pyro d/d is quite potent in 1v1 it doesn’t have enough to stay alive in a 1v2.
Ex player of PeanutButterJellyTime, Heavenly Annoying and Visceral Gaming.
You two are hilarious really. Proving how ranger cannot kill an ele when the ranger is just playing badly.
1. Never actually preventing the ele from healing by not using interrupts right.
2. Using entangle when ele has avialable water.
3. Proving Blinding ashes needs a nerf when most of procs go to pet, not ranger itself.
4. Never swapping from longbow.
5. Never timing burst right.
Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying a ranger would have an ease killing a d/d ele, but this video is just silly. Basically just mindlessly pewpewing thinking it will have some result.
Second video just proved an ele can beat two bad guardians.
1. Not stunbreaking updraft.
2. Then eating burning speed.
3. Never dodging burning speed.
4. Not dodging fire grab.
5. Never actually dodging anything.
6. Ressing when ele is on 2K hp instead of putting some pressure and eating all the damage.
So what did you guys prove? Bad players are gonna have a bad time? Most prolly ye.
For the nerfs:
1. Blinding ashes ICD will only make the trait unused, not a skilled play. Bad idea.
2. Yep, definitely. 800 heal from Soothing ice every 20 second is the issue why ele has to much sustain.
3. If you want to kill the trait completely, then it’s a good idea.
5. Not like people actually use this, it’s inferior to both Blinding Ashes and Persisting flames. That’s not where the might comes from.
6. That’s actually the thing that would need shaving.
7. Then people won’t use it, rest of the boons is pretty much useless anyway. Much better solution would be to decrease the duration.
8. That’s a horrible idea. It’s not going to make zerker eles take healing power, they don’t even have a way to increase their healing power. It gives around 7% crit damage, that’s far from too strong. It’s also a trait mainly used in pve.
God, so glad you two are not on the balance team.
This is basically propaganda:
- A fight like this would never happen in a normal 5v5 game because fighting 1v1 on point isn’t what LB rangers are about.
- It’s common knowledge that rangers aren’t really happy with the state of their class, so it seems you’ve purposefully chosen one of the worst classes right now to “prove” your point.
- The ranger didn’t play particularly well either. Didn’t even weapon swap or open with surprise burst (yes in normal games you usually don’t see a ranger/thief/mesmer coming, dueling completely warps the game around this issue).
Now make a video like this against a signet necro or a mesmer and the game will look completely different. This was probably the worst demonstration you could have chosen. Some classes simply are countered harder by some specs than others. This is a fact and will probably never change.
This simply looks like another of those “nerf ele” crusades that we’ve seen every single time ele was viable. They only stopped once they were so unviable that you got flamed for playing one in pvp – and even then some people still asked for nerfs…
I too can make a video playing a Condi ranger against a thief that’s not allowed to weaponswap and doesn’t have any condi cleanses and the result will be that the thief gets owned hard by the evading, condi-spamming bunker ranger. Does this mean ranger is OP? Hell no. It simply means that some specs work better against some other specs, while some work worse.
This is commonly refered to as the METAGAME.
Last of the Red Hot Swamis
(edited by SchmendrickTheMagician.8247)
This is basically propaganda:
- A fight like this would never happen in a normal 5v5 game because fighting 1v1 on point isn’t what LB rangers are about.
- It’s common knowledge that rangers aren’t really happy with the state of their class, so it seems you’ve purposefully chosen one of the worst classes right now to “prove” your point.
- The ranger didn’t play particularly well either. Didn’t even weapon swap or open from stealth (yes in normal games you usually don’t see a ranger/thief/mesmer coming, dueling completely warps the game around this issue).
Now make a video like this against a signet necro or a mesmer and the game will look completely different. This was probably the worst demonstration you could have chosen. Some classes simply are countered harder by some specs than others. This is a fact and will probably never change.
This simply looks like another of those “nerf ele” crusades that we’ve seen every single time ele was viable. They only stopped once they were so unviable that you got flamed for playing one in pvp – and even then some people still asked for nerfs…
I too can make a video playing a Condi ranger against a thief that’s not allowed to weaponswap and doesn’t have any condi cleanses and the result will be that the thief gets owned hard by the evading, condi-spamming bunker ranger. Does this mean ranger is OP? Hell no. It simply means that some specs work better against some other specs, while some work worse.
This is commonly refered to as the METAGAME.
If you’re on NA, I’ll gladly demonstrate how inferior you are. 1 v 1?
Same goes for you Laraley.
This is basically propaganda:
- A fight like this would never happen in a normal 5v5 game because fighting 1v1 on point isn’t what LB rangers are about.
- It’s common knowledge that rangers aren’t really happy with the state of their class, so it seems you’ve purposefully chosen one of the worst classes right now to “prove” your point.
- The ranger didn’t play particularly well either. Didn’t even weapon swap or open from stealth (yes in normal games you usually don’t see a ranger/thief/mesmer coming, dueling completely warps the game around this issue).
Now make a video like this against a signet necro or a mesmer and the game will look completely different. This was probably the worst demonstration you could have chosen. Some classes simply are countered harder by some specs than others. This is a fact and will probably never change.
This simply looks like another of those “nerf ele” crusades that we’ve seen every single time ele was viable. They only stopped once they were so unviable that you got flamed for playing one in pvp – and even then some people still asked for nerfs…
I too can make a video playing a Condi ranger against a thief that’s not allowed to weaponswap and doesn’t have any condi cleanses and the result will be that the thief gets owned hard by the evading, condi-spamming bunker ranger. Does this mean ranger is OP? Hell no. It simply means that some specs work better against some other specs, while some work worse.
This is commonly refered to as the METAGAME.
I personally am not a fan of hard countering a class, I don’t think it should be allowed. My opinion…
I main Ranger and i dont know if i should cry or laugh..
I personally am not a fan of hard countering a class, I don’t think it should be allowed. My opinion…
I’m not a fan of it either, but two things: It seems to be what Arenanet intends for their balance, and ranger is FAR from hardcountered by eles. +1 an ele on a point and you’re gonna down him in seconds. Also, as I and others pointed out that ranger played exceptionally bad, not even once swapping his weapons – and rangers have lots of weapons for lots of reasons, one of them being so that they can swap to another weapon when fighting a spec that particularly good against one of their 2 chosen weapons.
A hard counter is stuff like Diamond Skin against a full condi necro – where the necro may as well just /afk because that’s how much damage he will do even when playing to his best against a bad ele.
There are a lot of soft counters in the game though – thieves counter basically all zerker specs (especially ele’s), DPS guardians counter thieves, condi necros counter engineers, etc.
Nerfing one spec because you don’t like it very much wouldn’t change this fact – all it would do is make ele unviable again – it’s not like they have any other viable specs, never had, it always was arcane+water+x d/d or d/f.
Last of the Red Hot Swamis
You two are hilarious really. Proving how ranger cannot kill an ele when the ranger is just playing badly.
1. Never actually preventing the ele from healing by not using interrupts right.
2. Using entangle when ele has avialable water.
3. Proving Blinding ashes needs a nerf when most of procs go to pet, not ranger itself.
4. Never swapping from longbow.
5. Never timing burst right.Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying a ranger would have an ease killing a d/d ele, but this video is just silly. Basically just mindlessly pewpewing thinking it will have some result.
Second video just proved an ele can beat two bad guardians.
1. Not stunbreaking updraft.
2. Then eating burning speed.
The guardian did not need to waste a stun break so early, she easily recovered if you didn’t notice.
3. Never dodging burning speed.
4. Not dodging fire grab.
Yes I’m sure you would have dodged a fire grab with the animation being covered up by a norn guardian obscuring your view :p Please re-watch and re-evaluate the video with an unbiased opinion if that is possible.
6. Ressing when ele is on 2K hp instead of putting some pressure and eating all the damage.
His judges intervention was down and I was waiting for him to turn around, I still had the advantage although it was a small one.
Please try and provide relative feedback opposed to hateful posts.
If you’re on NA, I’ll gladly demonstrate how inferior you are. 1 v 1?
Same goes for you Laraley.
If you want to argue, argue. Stop with the “I’ll show you, duel me nup!” speak, okay? No one is gonna take you seriously if that’s what all your arguments come down.
The game isn’t about dueling and will never be.
Last of the Red Hot Swamis
(edited by SchmendrickTheMagician.8247)
That was really painful to watch. Your ranger friend needs to learn how to use his pets properly. Standing in the open like that you could die vs a competent ranger. Though its still in the eles favor.
Ranger
Am I good?… I’m good.
Am I good?… I’m good.
You two are hilarious really. Proving how ranger cannot kill an ele when the ranger is just playing badly.
1. Never actually preventing the ele from healing by not using interrupts right.
2. Using entangle when ele has avialable water.
3. Proving Blinding ashes needs a nerf when most of procs go to pet, not ranger itself.
4. Never swapping from longbow.
5. Never timing burst right.Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying a ranger would have an ease killing a d/d ele, but this video is just silly. Basically just mindlessly pewpewing thinking it will have some result.
Second video just proved an ele can beat two bad guardians.
1. Not stunbreaking updraft.
2. Then eating burning speed.The guardian did not need to waste a stun break so early, she easily recovered if you didn’t notice.
3. Never dodging burning speed.
4. Not dodging fire grab.
Yes I’m sure you would have dodged a fire grab with the animation being covered up by a norn guardian obscuring your view :p Please re-watch and re-evaluate the video with an unbiased opinion if that is possible.6. Ressing when ele is on 2K hp instead of putting some pressure and eating all the damage.
His judges intervention was down and I was waiting for him to turn around, I still had the advantage although it was a small one.
Please try and provide relative feedback opposed to hateful posts.
This was actually relative feedback, it’s pointing out the bad plays and yes, they were bad.
Not wasting stunbreak early? That’s the only thing you should be strunbreaking, you can dodge earthquake and you’ll have to play around Shocking Aura. I’m sorry but not stunbreaking updraft is a basic mistake, ele will then proceed to Burning speed for free. And let me remind you that burning speed is one of the things that hits the most on d/d ele, you need to dodge it. If you don’t, it’s all your fault. Yep, you easily recoved, waste your cooldowns and you have nothing left. Which could have been all prevented by using one single stubreak and dodge, not really hard.
Well, that’s a nice excuse, but I’m sorry these things needs to be dodges, no arguments there.
If ele has 2K hp, you can burst them down as a meditation guardian. It was a mistake, stop acting like it wasn’t. It’s definitely a better solution than ressing and eating all the damage and dying. One of the things you need to know to be good in pvp is when to ress and when not.
I personally am not a fan of hard countering a class, I don’t think it should be allowed. My opinion…
I’m not a fan of it either, but two things: It seems to be what Arenanet intends for their balance, and ranger is FAR from hardcountered by eles. +1 an ele on a point and you’re gonna down him in seconds. Also, as I and others pointed out that ranger played exceptionally bad, not even once swapping his weapons – and rangers have lots of weapons for lots of reasons, one of them being so that they can swap to another weapon when fighting a spec that particularly good against one of their 2 chosen weapons.
A hard counter is stuff like Diamond Skin against a full condi necro – where the necro may as well just /afk because that’s how much damage he will do even when playing to his best against a bad ele.
There are a lot of soft counters in the game though – thieves counter basically all zerker specs (especially ele’s), DPS guardians counter thieves, condi necros counter engineers, etc.
Nerfing one spec because you don’t like it very much wouldn’t change this fact – all it would do is make ele unviable again – it’s not like they have any other viable specs, never had, it always was arcane+water+x d/d or d/f.
Perhaps you are right about your view on anets design, it justs leaves me a little sad.
It is true, he did not swap weapons, I should also note I have ran this same test with 6 other rangers now, some being some of the better players from the guild Wind and I still came out with the same result. Many of them did try to swap to great sword with their lb burst builds in mind, even with taunt I was simply too defensive to be brought down.
Oh nonono, I don’t want d/d to get nerfed because I don’t like it, I LOVE this class to death and I absolutely love d/d. Its one of the only classes I really spend any time playing. I simply am concerned about having too much of an advantage, I want my opponents to get a fair fight.
Also, I don’t think anything drastic needs to happen to the class in order to bring balance. Here are some suggestions…
8-9 second CD on blinding ashes( Allow a per target cd on blinding ashes instead of an ICD)
Regen duration slightly reduced (remove regen from soothing ice?)
Burning condition re-scaled across the board
Diamond skin reworked
Obsidian flesh CD slightly increased.
Drakes breath and Fire grab re-scaled so that drakes breath hits less hard and fire grab hits much harder. (its much harder to land a Fire Grab than drakes breath, and right now in some circumstances Drakes Breath hits just as hard as a fire grab if the full channel lands and burns are not cleansed, the CD on drakes breath is also very short while fire grab is a very long CD. It makes more sense to me for being heavily rewarded for landing a fire grab with a burn applied opposed to being heavily rewarded for spamming drakes breath)
…Would also be nice to get something a little more reliable than churning earth, that skill is almost a waste time now with how great the burning condition is. I have never been a fan of Churning Earth.
Sacrifice dagger water 5 sustain for 15 second RTL?
(edited by Grimreaper.5370)
That was really painful to watch. Your ranger friend needs to learn how to use his pets properly. Standing in the open like that you could die vs a competent ranger. Though its still in the eles favor.
I wasn’t fighting like I would duel. I was just simply trying to kill the ele. And using melee weapon against an ele especially a fire traited one is just suicide.
You’re free to try to duel my ele on your zerk ranger if you have a NA account. It would probably be a better confirmation anyways.
(edited by Lettuce.2945)
As I already said, I propose a couple changes to the elementalist traits.
1: Raise the icd of blinding ashes to 10s or so.
2: Raise the icd of soothing ice or remove the regen portion of it.
3: Rework diamond skin so it works as a resistance buff that procs for 4 secs every time you swap into earth while above the 75% health threshold to promote more skillful counterplay.
4: Rework burning across all professions aka scale it down.
5: Possibly rework the might stacking capabilities of ele by scaling it down a bit to promote more skillful play and more teamwork. Maybe by starting with the pyromancer’s puissance trait in fire.
6: I say keep the healing/sustain on ele since we have one of the lowest hp pools and armor anyways.
7: Remove protection altogether from the elemental contigency trait (which is rng) since we have enough access to protection anyways. So replace it with something like swiftness or regen.
8: Rework Ferocious Winds and revert it back to the trait it was pre patch aka gain healing power based on precision. That way we can give marauder/zerk eles some kind of sustain to encourage more build diversity.
And I think eles will be in a very good spot compared to the rest of the meta, reasonably speaking. Nerfed but not overnerfed to the point of uselessness like some people want.
great post (first time in a while i’ve been able to say this without any irony behind it).
on might stacking: i’ve suggested it in the past but i still think the best solution to nerfing it while still promoting skillful use in team environments is by hard limiting the amount of might you can stack by yourself to 10 stacks. this is still a sizable amount of power/condition damage (+300) but limits the absurdity of certain builds being able to dominate 1v1 fights thanks in part to their shear might stacking ability, which is what elementalist is foremost guilty of. this way, teamplay is still promoted by stacking might as a team but might is still nerfed without it negatively affecting weapon skills/utilities outside of their might stacking functionality.
i think with this nerf in conjecture with many of the nerfs you listed above, ele would be well balanced.
As I already said, I propose a couple changes to the elementalist traits.
1: Raise the icd of blinding ashes to 10s or so.
2: Raise the icd of soothing ice or remove the regen portion of it.
3: Rework diamond skin so it works as a resistance buff that procs for 4 secs every time you swap into earth while above the 75% health threshold to promote more skillful counterplay.
4: Rework burning across all professions aka scale it down.
5: Possibly rework the might stacking capabilities of ele by scaling it down a bit to promote more skillful play and more teamwork. Maybe by starting with the pyromancer’s puissance trait in fire.
6: I say keep the healing/sustain on ele since we have one of the lowest hp pools and armor anyways.
7: Remove protection altogether from the elemental contigency trait (which is rng) since we have enough access to protection anyways. So replace it with something like swiftness or regen.
8: Rework Ferocious Winds and revert it back to the trait it was pre patch aka gain healing power based on precision. That way we can give marauder/zerk eles some kind of sustain to encourage more build diversity.
And I think eles will be in a very good spot compared to the rest of the meta, reasonably speaking. Nerfed but not overnerfed to the point of uselessness like some people want.
great post (first time in a while i’ve been able to say this without any irony behind it).
on might stacking: i’ve suggested it in the past but i still think the best solution to nerfing it while still promoting skillful use in team environments is by hard limiting the amount of might you can stack by yourself to 10 stacks. this is still a sizable amount of power/condition damage (+300) but limits the absurdity of certain builds being able to dominate 1v1 fights thanks in part to their shear might stacking ability, which is what elementalist is foremost guilty of. this way, teamplay is still promoted by stacking might as a team but might is still nerfed without it negatively affecting weapon skills/utilities outside of their might stacking functionality.
i think with this nerf in conjecture with many of the nerfs you listed above, ele would be well balanced.
I do not think might stacking is an issue on elementalist because
1.) The fire trait line used to might stack is bugged and providing +150 (total of 300 in fire) more power than it is supposed to.
2.) Once burning is toned down the Elementalists dps will drop accordingly. most of the damage is coming from burns.
As I already said, I propose a couple changes to the elementalist traits.
1: Raise the icd of blinding ashes to 10s or so.
2: Raise the icd of soothing ice or remove the regen portion of it.
3: Rework diamond skin so it works as a resistance buff that procs for 4 secs every time you swap into earth while above the 75% health threshold to promote more skillful counterplay.
4: Rework burning across all professions aka scale it down.
5: Possibly rework the might stacking capabilities of ele by scaling it down a bit to promote more skillful play and more teamwork. Maybe by starting with the pyromancer’s puissance trait in fire.
6: I say keep the healing/sustain on ele since we have one of the lowest hp pools and armor anyways.
7: Remove protection altogether from the elemental contigency trait (which is rng) since we have enough access to protection anyways. So replace it with something like swiftness or regen.
8: Rework Ferocious Winds and revert it back to the trait it was pre patch aka gain healing power based on precision. That way we can give marauder/zerk eles some kind of sustain to encourage more build diversity.
And I think eles will be in a very good spot compared to the rest of the meta, reasonably speaking. Nerfed but not overnerfed to the point of uselessness like some people want.
great post (first time in a while i’ve been able to say this without any irony behind it).
on might stacking: i’ve suggested it in the past but i still think the best solution to nerfing it while still promoting skillful use in team environments is by hard limiting the amount of might you can stack by yourself to 10 stacks. this is still a sizable amount of power/condition damage (+300) but limits the absurdity of certain builds being able to dominate 1v1 fights thanks in part to their shear might stacking ability, which is what elementalist is foremost guilty of. this way, teamplay is still promoted by stacking might as a team but might is still nerfed without it negatively affecting weapon skills/utilities outside of their might stacking functionality.
i think with this nerf in conjecture with many of the nerfs you listed above, ele would be well balanced.
Thanks! Right now, most people are too concerned with immediate easy fixes like 100 nades bugs, and rampage…etc. I’m trying to think in the long term sense how to balance the classes. I don’t care about any “bugs”. They’ll fix it asap. They already said they’ll rework damage/condi damage. So now, I’m just focused on something that’s longer term. Some people just can’t see past 5 feet and that’s pretty sad.
1: Raise the icd of blinding ashes to 10s or so.
With per-target icd? Because otherwise we have this little trait.
8: Rework Ferocious Winds and revert it back to the trait it was pre patch aka gain healing power based on precision. That way we can give marauder/zerk eles some kind of sustain to encourage more build diversity.
That trait is bugged and scales off toughness right now (which will take at least 6 months to fix it). Besides, air line has nothing to do with sustain and pre-patch it was gain ferocity based on healing power, a candidate to worst trait ever award,
This is basically propaganda:
- A fight like this would never happen in a normal 5v5 game because fighting 1v1 on point isn’t what LB rangers are about.
- It’s common knowledge that rangers aren’t really happy with the state of their class, so it seems you’ve purposefully chosen one of the worst classes right now to “prove” your point.
- The ranger didn’t play particularly well either. Didn’t even weapon swap or open with surprise burst (yes in normal games you usually don’t see a ranger/thief/mesmer coming, dueling completely warps the game around this issue).
Now make a video like this against a signet necro or a mesmer and the game will look completely different. This was probably the worst demonstration you could have chosen. Some classes simply are countered harder by some specs than others. This is a fact and will probably never change.
This simply looks like another of those “nerf ele” crusades that we’ve seen every single time ele was viable. They only stopped once they were so unviable that you got flamed for playing one in pvp – and even then some people still asked for nerfs…
I too can make a video playing a Condi ranger against a thief that’s not allowed to weaponswap and doesn’t have any condi cleanses and the result will be that the thief gets owned hard by the evading, condi-spamming bunker ranger. Does this mean ranger is OP? Hell no. It simply means that some specs work better against some other specs, while some work worse.
This is commonly refered to as the METAGAME.
The motto:
“It’s balanced in TPvP, so lets not worry about balancing 1v1”
It’s what we disagree with and what this conversation is mainly about. If Ele’s do great in all areas vs a class that does “good” in a single aspect, it’s no wonder people stack the profession in tournaments more than any other class. You can’t say that this profession is balanced on a competitive level.
For the record, Rangers are inferior at their roles compared to Mesmers and Thieves. Not to mention he can get hard countered and out rotated by both. Just because the class is “a poor profession” (your words) doesn’t make it a terrible comparison, it only strengthens our point about class unbalances.
aka FalseLights
Rank: Top 250 since Season 2
#5 best gerdien in wurld
Rank: Top 250 since Season 2
#5 best gerdien in wurld
1: Raise the icd of blinding ashes to 10s or so.
With per-target icd? Because otherwise we have this little trait.
8: Rework Ferocious Winds and revert it back to the trait it was pre patch aka gain healing power based on precision. That way we can give marauder/zerk eles some kind of sustain to encourage more build diversity.
That trait is bugged and scales off toughness right now (which will take at least 6 months to fix it). Besides, air line has nothing to do with sustain and pre-patch it was gain ferocity based on healing power, a candidate to worst trait ever award,
Oh yeah, thanks for the reminder. Yeah, a 10s icd on blinding ashes PER target. Forgot about that. Otherwise it would be a pretty weak trait.
And the reason I mentioned the precision or ferocity to healing power was because pre patch, the water line for zerk eles gave healing power so they had some form of sustain especially s/f. But right now, the trait lines doesn’t give any stat boosts, so if you play anything but cele, you’re sitting with 0 healing power unless you take a healing rune. But you lose out on additional damage if you do. So it’s kind of like pick your poison. Also it would encourage more eles to go a zerkier path and go into air for more build diversity. That’s the main reason I suggested this. To promote more build diversity with various weaponsets instead of the standard s/f or s/d fresh air or d/f lighting rod.
1: Raise the icd of blinding ashes to 10s or so.
With per-target icd? Because otherwise we have this little trait.
8: Rework Ferocious Winds and revert it back to the trait it was pre patch aka gain healing power based on precision. That way we can give marauder/zerk eles some kind of sustain to encourage more build diversity.
That trait is bugged and scales off toughness right now (which will take at least 6 months to fix it). Besides, air line has nothing to do with sustain and pre-patch it was gain ferocity based on healing power, a candidate to worst trait ever award,
Oh yeah, thanks for the reminder. Yeah, a 10s icd on blinding ashes PER target. Forgot about that. Otherwise it would be a pretty weak trait.
And the reason I mentioned the precision or ferocity to healing power was because pre patch, the water line for zerk eles gave healing power so they had some form of sustain especially s/f. But right now, the trait lines doesn’t give any stat boosts, so if you play anything but cele, you’re sitting with 0 healing power unless you take a healing rune. But you lose out on additional damage if you do. So it’s kind of like pick your poison.
So you realize your rework to a trait would be bad, but still want to do it for some unknown reasons? I don’t know if I can facepalm enough.
1: Raise the icd of blinding ashes to 10s or so.
With per-target icd? Because otherwise we have this little trait.
8: Rework Ferocious Winds and revert it back to the trait it was pre patch aka gain healing power based on precision. That way we can give marauder/zerk eles some kind of sustain to encourage more build diversity.
That trait is bugged and scales off toughness right now (which will take at least 6 months to fix it). Besides, air line has nothing to do with sustain and pre-patch it was gain ferocity based on healing power, a candidate to worst trait ever award,
Oh yeah, thanks for the reminder. Yeah, a 10s icd on blinding ashes PER target. Forgot about that. Otherwise it would be a pretty weak trait.
And the reason I mentioned the precision or ferocity to healing power was because pre patch, the water line for zerk eles gave healing power so they had some form of sustain especially s/f. But right now, the trait lines doesn’t give any stat boosts, so if you play anything but cele, you’re sitting with 0 healing power unless you take a healing rune. But you lose out on additional damage if you do. So it’s kind of like pick your poison.
So you realize your rework to a trait would be bad, but still want to do it for some unknown reasons? I don’t know if I can facepalm enough.
Is english not a native language of yours? Doesn’t seem to be. Facepalming hard right now to your lack of comprehension. Why can’t your level of comprehension be the same of Sinject’s or grim? Are you just dense? It’s ok if you’re. If you are, we can just ignore you.
You basically only explained why it’s a bad idea, you didn’t say: ‘’Oh, I forgot you cannot get healing power anymore, I take that back.’’
1: Raise the icd of blinding ashes to 10s or so.
With per-target icd? Because otherwise we have this little trait.
8: Rework Ferocious Winds and revert it back to the trait it was pre patch aka gain healing power based on precision. That way we can give marauder/zerk eles some kind of sustain to encourage more build diversity.
That trait is bugged and scales off toughness right now (which will take at least 6 months to fix it). Besides, air line has nothing to do with sustain and pre-patch it was gain ferocity based on healing power, a candidate to worst trait ever award,
Oh yeah, thanks for the reminder. Yeah, a 10s icd on blinding ashes PER target. Forgot about that. Otherwise it would be a pretty weak trait.
And the reason I mentioned the precision or ferocity to healing power was because pre patch, the water line for zerk eles gave healing power so they had some form of sustain especially s/f. But right now, the trait lines doesn’t give any stat boosts, so if you play anything but cele, you’re sitting with 0 healing power unless you take a healing rune. But you lose out on additional damage if you do. So it’s kind of like pick your poison.
So you realize your rework to a trait would be bad, but still want to do it for some unknown reasons? I don’t know if I can facepalm enough.
Is english not a native language of yours? Doesn’t seem to be. Facepalming hard right now to your lack of comprehension. Why can’t your level of comprehension be the same of Sinject’s or grim? Are you just dense? It’s ok if you’re. If you are, we can just ignore you.
You basically only explained why it’s a bad idea, you didn’t say: ‘’Oh, I forgot you cannot get healing power anymore, I take that back.’’
I would strongly suggest you re read my post. Seems like it flew over your head. You clearly failed to comprehend what I said. Do you want me to bold it for you? The part you missed? I’ll be happy to do so.
1: Raise the icd of blinding ashes to 10s or so.
With per-target icd? Because otherwise we have this little trait.
8: Rework Ferocious Winds and revert it back to the trait it was pre patch aka gain healing power based on precision. That way we can give marauder/zerk eles some kind of sustain to encourage more build diversity.
That trait is bugged and scales off toughness right now (which will take at least 6 months to fix it). Besides, air line has nothing to do with sustain and pre-patch it was gain ferocity based on healing power, a candidate to worst trait ever award,
Oh yeah, thanks for the reminder. Yeah, a 10s icd on blinding ashes PER target. Forgot about that. Otherwise it would be a pretty weak trait.
And the reason I mentioned the precision or ferocity to healing power was because pre patch, the water line for zerk eles gave healing power so they had some form of sustain especially s/f. But right now, the trait lines doesn’t give any stat boosts, so if you play anything but cele, you’re sitting with 0 healing power unless you take a healing rune. But you lose out on additional damage if you do. So it’s kind of like pick your poison.
So you realize your rework to a trait would be bad, but still want to do it for some unknown reasons? I don’t know if I can facepalm enough.
Is english not a native language of yours? Doesn’t seem to be. Facepalming hard right now to your lack of comprehension. Why can’t your level of comprehension be the same of Sinject’s or grim? Are you just dense? It’s ok if you’re. If you are, we can just ignore you.
You basically only explained why it’s a bad idea, you didn’t say: ‘’Oh, I forgot you cannot get healing power anymore, I take that back.’’
I would strongly suggest you re read my post. Seems like it flew over your head. You clearly failed to comprehend what I said. Do you want me to bold it for you? The part you missed? I’ll be happy to do so.
I did read it. You stated that as a zerker ele you won’t have any healing power, only if you’re celestial, which is surprisingly correct. Your point? Still want it to scale from healing power?
That was really painful to watch. Your ranger friend needs to learn how to use his pets properly. Standing in the open like that you could die vs a competent ranger. Though its still in the eles favor.
? This was a test to observe lb dmg vs an ele build becoming somewhat common. He didn’t need to hide, I wasn’t even trying to fully take advantage of blocking as much damage as I actually could have, I was just spamming skills. So while what you may say is true about his demonstration of dps vs my defense, I also could have played better by simply trying to avoid as much damage as possible!
the main culprit IMO is ring of earth allowing more time to get back into water attunement and heal up. Keep in mind I tested this with a bunch of rangers and obtained the same result.
(edited by Grimreaper.5370)
1: Raise the icd of blinding ashes to 10s or so.
With per-target icd? Because otherwise we have this little trait.
8: Rework Ferocious Winds and revert it back to the trait it was pre patch aka gain healing power based on precision. That way we can give marauder/zerk eles some kind of sustain to encourage more build diversity.
That trait is bugged and scales off toughness right now (which will take at least 6 months to fix it). Besides, air line has nothing to do with sustain and pre-patch it was gain ferocity based on healing power, a candidate to worst trait ever award,
Oh yeah, thanks for the reminder. Yeah, a 10s icd on blinding ashes PER target. Forgot about that. Otherwise it would be a pretty weak trait.
And the reason I mentioned the precision or ferocity to healing power was because pre patch, the water line for zerk eles gave healing power so they had some form of sustain especially s/f. But right now, the trait lines doesn’t give any stat boosts, so if you play anything but cele, you’re sitting with 0 healing power unless you take a healing rune. But you lose out on additional damage if you do. So it’s kind of like pick your poison.
So you realize your rework to a trait would be bad, but still want to do it for some unknown reasons? I don’t know if I can facepalm enough.
Is english not a native language of yours? Doesn’t seem to be. Facepalming hard right now to your lack of comprehension. Why can’t your level of comprehension be the same of Sinject’s or grim? Are you just dense? It’s ok if you’re. If you are, we can just ignore you.
You basically only explained why it’s a bad idea, you didn’t say: ‘’Oh, I forgot you cannot get healing power anymore, I take that back.’’
I would strongly suggest you re read my post. Seems like it flew over your head. You clearly failed to comprehend what I said. Do you want me to bold it for you? The part you missed? I’ll be happy to do so.
I did read it. You stated that as a zerker ele you won’t have any healing power, only if you’re celestial, which is surprisingly correct. Your point? Still want it to scale from healing power?
8: Rework Ferocious Winds and revert it back to the trait it was pre patch aka gain healing power based on precision or ferocity. That way we can give marauder/zerk eles some kind of sustain to encourage more build diversity.
Bolded relevant part for you. Edited the or ferocity part, someone needs to confirm if it’s precision or ferocity. Any more questions or do you need me to guide you through each suggestion?
That was really painful to watch. Your ranger friend needs to learn how to use his pets properly. Standing in the open like that you could die vs a competent ranger. Though its still in the eles favor.
I wasn’t fighting like I would duel. I was just simply trying to kill the ele. And using melee weapon against an ele especially a fire traited one is just suicide.
You’re free to try to duel my ele on your zerk ranger if you have a NA account. It would probably be a better confirmation anyways.
There is no reason a pet cc should not land on a single target. Since all of them should land and none of them did… Of course the ele was able to survive no problem. If they all landed the ele would be forced to LoS, quite quickly (at least once the stab is gone). This patch, the pets can even have more cc than before. If the ele wants to just kill the ranger though, then of course the ele should win.
Ranger
Am I good?… I’m good.
Am I good?… I’m good.
That was really painful to watch. Your ranger friend needs to learn how to use his pets properly. Standing in the open like that you could die vs a competent ranger. Though its still in the eles favor.
? This was a test to observe lb dmg vs an ele build becoming somewhat common. He didn’t need to hide, I wasn’t even trying to fully take advantage of blocking as much damage as I actually could have, I was just spamming skills.
the main culprit IMO is ring of earth allowing more time to get back into water attunement and heal up.
Longbow is countered by blocks and reflects, other news at 11.
Last of the Red Hot Swamis
That was really painful to watch. Your ranger friend needs to learn how to use his pets properly. Standing in the open like that you could die vs a competent ranger. Though its still in the eles favor.
I wasn’t fighting like I would duel. I was just simply trying to kill the ele. And using melee weapon against an ele especially a fire traited one is just suicide.
You’re free to try to duel my ele on your zerk ranger if you have a NA account. It would probably be a better confirmation anyways.
There is no reason a pet cc should not land on a single target. Since all of them should land and none of them did… Of course the ele was able to survive no problem. If they all landed the ele would be forced to LoS, quite quickly (at least once the stab is gone). This patch, the pets can even have more cc than before. If the ele wants to just kill the ranger though, then of course the ele would win.
You’re joking right? I legit did a immobil + fear + taunt combo…more than once. You’re more than welcome to duel my ele on your ranger since you seem pretty confident you can win as a zerk ranger.
I main an ele and I’m trying to at least rework eles so that the ranger at least has a fighting chance. And you’re….
COMPLAINING?
(edited by Lettuce.2945)
1: Raise the icd of blinding ashes to 10s or so.
With per-target icd? Because otherwise we have this little trait.
8: Rework Ferocious Winds and revert it back to the trait it was pre patch aka gain healing power based on precision. That way we can give marauder/zerk eles some kind of sustain to encourage more build diversity.
That trait is bugged and scales off toughness right now (which will take at least 6 months to fix it). Besides, air line has nothing to do with sustain and pre-patch it was gain ferocity based on healing power, a candidate to worst trait ever award,
Oh yeah, thanks for the reminder. Yeah, a 10s icd on blinding ashes PER target. Forgot about that. Otherwise it would be a pretty weak trait.
And the reason I mentioned the precision or ferocity to healing power was because pre patch, the water line for zerk eles gave healing power so they had some form of sustain especially s/f. But right now, the trait lines doesn’t give any stat boosts, so if you play anything but cele, you’re sitting with 0 healing power unless you take a healing rune. But you lose out on additional damage if you do. So it’s kind of like pick your poison.
So you realize your rework to a trait would be bad, but still want to do it for some unknown reasons? I don’t know if I can facepalm enough.
Is english not a native language of yours? Doesn’t seem to be. Facepalming hard right now to your lack of comprehension. Why can’t your level of comprehension be the same of Sinject’s or grim? Are you just dense? It’s ok if you’re. If you are, we can just ignore you.
You basically only explained why it’s a bad idea, you didn’t say: ‘’Oh, I forgot you cannot get healing power anymore, I take that back.’’
I would strongly suggest you re read my post. Seems like it flew over your head. You clearly failed to comprehend what I said. Do you want me to bold it for you? The part you missed? I’ll be happy to do so.
I did read it. You stated that as a zerker ele you won’t have any healing power, only if you’re celestial, which is surprisingly correct. Your point? Still want it to scale from healing power?
8: Rework Ferocious Winds and revert it back to the trait it was pre patch aka gain healing power based on precision or ferocity. That way we can give marauder/zerk eles some kind of sustain to encourage more build diversity.
Bolded relevant part for you. Edited the or ferocity part, someone needs to confirm if it’s precision or ferocity. Any more questions or do you need me to guide you through each suggestion?
It was precision and it’s not really relevant.
You know what’s gonna happen if this change would actually go through? Yes, no one will pick it up, it would be a horrible change and all you would accomplish is making all elementalists in pve mad because they actually use this. In pvp, you will most likely take One with Air anyway. Still don’t get why it’s a bad idea?
The truth of the last patch is starting to come out lol
Here are some suggestions, I’m not saying all of these ideas should be implemented:
8-9 second CD on blinding ashes( Allow a per target cd on blinding ashes instead of an ICD)
Ring of Earth no longer blocks projectiles if it does NOT land on a target
Regen duration slightly reduced (remove regen from soothing ice?)
Burning condition re-scaled across the board
Diamond skin reworked
Obsidian flesh CD slightly increased.
Drakes breath and Fire grab re-scaled so that drakes breath hits less hard and fire grab hits much harder. (its much harder to land a Fire Grab than drakes breath, and right now in some circumstances Drakes Breath hits just as hard as a fire grab if the full channel lands and burns are not cleansed, the CD on drakes breath is also very short while fire grab is a very long CD. It makes more sense to me for being heavily rewarded for landing a fire grab with a burn applied opposed to being heavily rewarded for spamming drakes breath, as for focus offhand users potentially suffering from a change like this, they receive much more defense and flame wall is hitting pretty darn hard now anyhow, flame wall may need rework after a burning condition nerf.)
…Would also be nice to get something a little more reliable than churning earth, that skill is almost a waste time now with how great the burning condition is. I have never been a fan of Churning Earth.
I would also be up for taking a chunk out of ele sustain if it meant getting back 15 second CD on Ride the Lightning. EDIT: I realize I may sound selfish saying this, but I was considering removing the chunk of sustain from dagger 5 in water, cleansing wave.
(edited by Grimreaper.5370)
1: Raise the icd of blinding ashes to 10s or so.
With per-target icd? Because otherwise we have this little trait.
8: Rework Ferocious Winds and revert it back to the trait it was pre patch aka gain healing power based on precision. That way we can give marauder/zerk eles some kind of sustain to encourage more build diversity.
That trait is bugged and scales off toughness right now (which will take at least 6 months to fix it). Besides, air line has nothing to do with sustain and pre-patch it was gain ferocity based on healing power, a candidate to worst trait ever award,
Oh yeah, thanks for the reminder. Yeah, a 10s icd on blinding ashes PER target. Forgot about that. Otherwise it would be a pretty weak trait.
And the reason I mentioned the precision or ferocity to healing power was because pre patch, the water line for zerk eles gave healing power so they had some form of sustain especially s/f. But right now, the trait lines doesn’t give any stat boosts, so if you play anything but cele, you’re sitting with 0 healing power unless you take a healing rune. But you lose out on additional damage if you do. So it’s kind of like pick your poison.
So you realize your rework to a trait would be bad, but still want to do it for some unknown reasons? I don’t know if I can facepalm enough.
Is english not a native language of yours? Doesn’t seem to be. Facepalming hard right now to your lack of comprehension. Why can’t your level of comprehension be the same of Sinject’s or grim? Are you just dense? It’s ok if you’re. If you are, we can just ignore you.
You basically only explained why it’s a bad idea, you didn’t say: ‘’Oh, I forgot you cannot get healing power anymore, I take that back.’’
I would strongly suggest you re read my post. Seems like it flew over your head. You clearly failed to comprehend what I said. Do you want me to bold it for you? The part you missed? I’ll be happy to do so.
I did read it. You stated that as a zerker ele you won’t have any healing power, only if you’re celestial, which is surprisingly correct. Your point? Still want it to scale from healing power?
8: Rework Ferocious Winds and revert it back to the trait it was pre patch aka gain healing power based on precision or ferocity. That way we can give marauder/zerk eles some kind of sustain to encourage more build diversity.
Bolded relevant part for you. Edited the or ferocity part, someone needs to confirm if it’s precision or ferocity. Any more questions or do you need me to guide you through each suggestion?
It was precision and it’s not really relevant.
You know what’s gonna happen if this change would actually go through? Yes, no one will pick it up, it would be a horrible change and all you would accomplish is making all elementalists in pve mad because they actually use this. In pvp, you will most likely take One with Air anyway. Still don’t get why it’s a bad idea?
Nah I would actually take the precision to healing power especially with marauders to prevent people qq’ing about cele eles especially in a 1 v 1 context as a d/f ele. Sorry you want everything ez mode so you’re trying to deflect what actually needs to be reworked. Stone heart? Really? You just want them to nerf the wrong things so ele is basically the same as it is now. I see through you.
Here is what I think needs to be done…
8-9 second CD on blinding ashes( Allow a per target cd on blinding ashes instead of an ICD)Ring of Earth no longer blocks projectiles if it does NOT land on a target
Regen duration slightly reduced (remove regen from soothing ice?)
Burning condition re-scaled across the board
Diamond skin reworked
Obsidian flesh CD slightly increased.
Drakes breath and Fire grab re-scaled so that drakes breath hits less hard and fire grab hits much harder. (its much harder to land a Fire Grab than drakes breath, and right now in some circumstances Drakes Breath hits just as hard as a fire grab if the full channel lands and burns are not cleansed, the CD on drakes breath is also very short while fire grab is a very long CD. It makes more sense to me for being heavily rewarded for landing a fire grab with a burn applied opposed to being heavily rewarded for spamming drakes breath)
…Would also be nice to get something a little more reliable than churning earth, that skill is almost a waste time now with how great the burning condition is. I have never been a fan of Churning Earth.
Ring of Earth: So you want a skill to block projectiles in melee range? Do you not understand how the logic fails in that completely? If I want to block projectiles, most likely my target won’t be standing at my feet.
Again, Soothing ice gives you 800 heal from the regeneration in 20 seconds. Do you think that would actually do something?
Obsidian Flesh cooldown is completely fine and should not be increased, there’s seriously no reason to do so. A horrible idea.
Here is what I think needs to be done…
8-9 second CD on blinding ashes( Allow a per target cd on blinding ashes instead of an ICD)Ring of Earth no longer blocks projectiles if it does NOT land on a target
Regen duration slightly reduced (remove regen from soothing ice?)
Burning condition re-scaled across the board
Diamond skin reworked
Obsidian flesh CD slightly increased.
Drakes breath and Fire grab re-scaled so that drakes breath hits less hard and fire grab hits much harder. (its much harder to land a Fire Grab than drakes breath, and right now in some circumstances Drakes Breath hits just as hard as a fire grab if the full channel lands and burns are not cleansed, the CD on drakes breath is also very short while fire grab is a very long CD. It makes more sense to me for being heavily rewarded for landing a fire grab with a burn applied opposed to being heavily rewarded for spamming drakes breath)
…Would also be nice to get something a little more reliable than churning earth, that skill is almost a waste time now with how great the burning condition is. I have never been a fan of Churning Earth.
I would also be up for taking a chunk out of ele sustain if it meant getting back 15 second CD on Ride the Lightning.
The ring of earth suggestion is a bit extreme. D/D eles need something to help against rangers. Especially in wvw. You have to think in terms of the entire game, just not one game mode. I think my suggestions are sufficient and sinject has +1’ed it. Do you +1 it as well?
And you shouldn’t just nerf ele sustain based on one weaponset astro. I know you can think better than this. Rethink that.
I’m curious how the test would turn out if the Ranger timed his rapid fire with Taunt, rather than spamming RF and F2 off cooldown. The ele just has armor of earth on a 60s CD to deal with the taunt. After that, you’d just get a full, guaranteed rapid fire off every ~16s (with owl).
Also, I’d be interested in hearing about ways to reduce survivability on bunker/celestial D/D or D/F without making Fresh Air builds even worse than they already are.
(edited by ResJudicator.7916)
Here is what I think needs to be done…
8-9 second CD on blinding ashes( Allow a per target cd on blinding ashes instead of an ICD)Ring of Earth no longer blocks projectiles if it does NOT land on a target
Regen duration slightly reduced (remove regen from soothing ice?)
Burning condition re-scaled across the board
Diamond skin reworked
Obsidian flesh CD slightly increased.
Drakes breath and Fire grab re-scaled so that drakes breath hits less hard and fire grab hits much harder. (its much harder to land a Fire Grab than drakes breath, and right now in some circumstances Drakes Breath hits just as hard as a fire grab if the full channel lands and burns are not cleansed, the CD on drakes breath is also very short while fire grab is a very long CD. It makes more sense to me for being heavily rewarded for landing a fire grab with a burn applied opposed to being heavily rewarded for spamming drakes breath)
…Would also be nice to get something a little more reliable than churning earth, that skill is almost a waste time now with how great the burning condition is. I have never been a fan of Churning Earth.
Ring of Earth: So you want a skill to block projectiles in melee range? Do you not understand how the logic fails in that completely? If I want to block projectiles, most likely my target won’t be standing at my feet.
Perhaps, I was also considering how mobile the Elementalist is though. I never said my ideas were perfect, that is why we are discussing them.
Again, Soothing ice gives you 800 heal from the regeneration in 20 seconds. Do you think that would actually do something?
One less condition removed + potential downtime for regen, consider boon removal
Obsidian Flesh cooldown is completely fine and should not be increased, there’s seriously no reason to do so. A horrible idea.
With Geomancer’s Training the CD on Obsidian Flesh is reduced to ~33 seconds, and magnetic wave reduced to 16 seconds. I think a cd this short for a skill so powerful is a little too strong, a 40 second cd with geomancer’s trait in mind seems reasonable to me. thats 10 more seconds added to the ability with no trait and ~7 more with trait. This would prevent the ability from being almost immediately up every 3rd rotation into earth or so.
(edited by Grimreaper.5370)
Here is what I think needs to be done…
8-9 second CD on blinding ashes( Allow a per target cd on blinding ashes instead of an ICD)Ring of Earth no longer blocks projectiles if it does NOT land on a target
Regen duration slightly reduced (remove regen from soothing ice?)
Burning condition re-scaled across the board
Diamond skin reworked
Obsidian flesh CD slightly increased.
Drakes breath and Fire grab re-scaled so that drakes breath hits less hard and fire grab hits much harder. (its much harder to land a Fire Grab than drakes breath, and right now in some circumstances Drakes Breath hits just as hard as a fire grab if the full channel lands and burns are not cleansed, the CD on drakes breath is also very short while fire grab is a very long CD. It makes more sense to me for being heavily rewarded for landing a fire grab with a burn applied opposed to being heavily rewarded for spamming drakes breath)
…Would also be nice to get something a little more reliable than churning earth, that skill is almost a waste time now with how great the burning condition is. I have never been a fan of Churning Earth.
Ring of Earth: So you want a skill to block projectiles in melee range? Do you not understand how the logic fails in that completely? If I want to block projectiles, most likely my target won’t be standing at my feet.
Perhaps, I was also considering how mobile the Elementalist is though. I never said my ideas were perfect, that is why we are discussing them.
Again, Soothing ice gives you 800 heal from the regeneration in 20 seconds. Do you think that would actually do something?
One less condition removed + potential downtime for regen, consider boon removal
Obsidian Flesh cooldown is completely fine and should not be increased, there’s seriously no reason to do so. A horrible idea.
With Geomancer’s Training the CD on Obsidian Flesh is reduced to ~33 seconds, and magnetic wave reduced to 16 seconds. I think a cd this short for a skill so powerful is a little too strong, a 40 second cd with geomancer’s trait in mind seems reasonable to me. thats 10 more seconds added to the ability with no trait and ~7 more with trait.
If you take Geomancer’s training, that means you’re probably Earth/Water/Arcana, which means you’ll do negligible damage. It also means you’re running focus offhand, rather than OH dagger, so you lose updraft for throwing people off point. So basically you’ll be able to hold points already in your control, and will take forever decapping.
Here is what I think needs to be done…
8-9 second CD on blinding ashes( Allow a per target cd on blinding ashes instead of an ICD)Ring of Earth no longer blocks projectiles if it does NOT land on a target
Regen duration slightly reduced (remove regen from soothing ice?)
Burning condition re-scaled across the board
Diamond skin reworked
Obsidian flesh CD slightly increased.
Drakes breath and Fire grab re-scaled so that drakes breath hits less hard and fire grab hits much harder. (its much harder to land a Fire Grab than drakes breath, and right now in some circumstances Drakes Breath hits just as hard as a fire grab if the full channel lands and burns are not cleansed, the CD on drakes breath is also very short while fire grab is a very long CD. It makes more sense to me for being heavily rewarded for landing a fire grab with a burn applied opposed to being heavily rewarded for spamming drakes breath)
…Would also be nice to get something a little more reliable than churning earth, that skill is almost a waste time now with how great the burning condition is. I have never been a fan of Churning Earth.
Ring of Earth: So you want a skill to block projectiles in melee range? Do you not understand how the logic fails in that completely? If I want to block projectiles, most likely my target won’t be standing at my feet.
Perhaps, I was also considering how mobile the Elementalist is though. I never said my ideas were perfect, that is why we are discussing them.
Again, Soothing ice gives you 800 heal from the regeneration in 20 seconds. Do you think that would actually do something?
One less condition removed + potential downtime for regen, consider boon removal
Obsidian Flesh cooldown is completely fine and should not be increased, there’s seriously no reason to do so. A horrible idea.
With Geomancer’s Training the CD on Obsidian Flesh is reduced to ~33 seconds, and magnetic wave reduced to 16 seconds. I think a cd this short for a skill so powerful is a little too strong, a 40 second cd with geomancer’s trait in mind seems reasonable to me. thats 10 more seconds added to the ability with no trait and ~7 more with trait.
If you take Geomancer’s training, that means you’re probably Earth/Water/Arcana, which means you’ll do negligible damage. It also means you’re running focus offhand, rather than OH dagger, so you lose updraft for throwing people off point. So basically you’ll be able to hold points already in your control, and will take forever decapping.
A very good point ResJudicator, I have not taken this into much consideration. Right now I am left feeling d/f (earth, water, arcana) is a tad too tanky for spvp matches, but as someone else pointed out no one ran d/f in the latest ESL.
Here is what I think needs to be done…
8-9 second CD on blinding ashes( Allow a per target cd on blinding ashes instead of an ICD)Ring of Earth no longer blocks projectiles if it does NOT land on a target
Regen duration slightly reduced (remove regen from soothing ice?)
Burning condition re-scaled across the board
Diamond skin reworked
Obsidian flesh CD slightly increased.
Drakes breath and Fire grab re-scaled so that drakes breath hits less hard and fire grab hits much harder. (its much harder to land a Fire Grab than drakes breath, and right now in some circumstances Drakes Breath hits just as hard as a fire grab if the full channel lands and burns are not cleansed, the CD on drakes breath is also very short while fire grab is a very long CD. It makes more sense to me for being heavily rewarded for landing a fire grab with a burn applied opposed to being heavily rewarded for spamming drakes breath)
…Would also be nice to get something a little more reliable than churning earth, that skill is almost a waste time now with how great the burning condition is. I have never been a fan of Churning Earth.
Ring of Earth: So you want a skill to block projectiles in melee range? Do you not understand how the logic fails in that completely? If I want to block projectiles, most likely my target won’t be standing at my feet.
Perhaps, I was also considering how mobile the Elementalist is though. I never said my ideas were perfect, that is why we are discussing them.
Again, Soothing ice gives you 800 heal from the regeneration in 20 seconds. Do you think that would actually do something?
One less condition removed + potential downtime for regen, consider boon removal
Obsidian Flesh cooldown is completely fine and should not be increased, there’s seriously no reason to do so. A horrible idea.
With Geomancer’s Training the CD on Obsidian Flesh is reduced to ~33 seconds, and magnetic wave reduced to 16 seconds. I think a cd this short for a skill so powerful is a little too strong, a 40 second cd with geomancer’s trait in mind seems reasonable to me. thats 10 more seconds added to the ability with no trait and ~7 more with trait. This would prevent the ability from being almost immediately up every 3rd rotation into earth or so.
That’s great and all, sf fresh air actually depends on this skill. If you increase the cooldown, then it will fall behind even more. It doesn’t stunbreak, it’s just 4 sec invulnerability on 50 second cooldown, which is totally balanced. So please stop balancing around bunker builds that will do barely any damage to you. Most earth eles even ran d/d in the last tourney. I guess having invulnerability up as someone who should be standing on point is not such a great idea.
Here is what I think needs to be done…
8-9 second CD on blinding ashes( Allow a per target cd on blinding ashes instead of an ICD)Ring of Earth no longer blocks projectiles if it does NOT land on a target
Regen duration slightly reduced (remove regen from soothing ice?)
Burning condition re-scaled across the board
Diamond skin reworked
Obsidian flesh CD slightly increased.
Drakes breath and Fire grab re-scaled so that drakes breath hits less hard and fire grab hits much harder. (its much harder to land a Fire Grab than drakes breath, and right now in some circumstances Drakes Breath hits just as hard as a fire grab if the full channel lands and burns are not cleansed, the CD on drakes breath is also very short while fire grab is a very long CD. It makes more sense to me for being heavily rewarded for landing a fire grab with a burn applied opposed to being heavily rewarded for spamming drakes breath)
…Would also be nice to get something a little more reliable than churning earth, that skill is almost a waste time now with how great the burning condition is. I have never been a fan of Churning Earth.
I would also be up for taking a chunk out of ele sustain if it meant getting back 15 second CD on Ride the Lightning.
The ring of earth suggestion is a bit extreme. D/D eles need something to help against rangers. Especially in wvw. You have to think in terms of the entire game, just not one game mode. I think my suggestions are sufficient and sinject has +1’ed it. Do you +1 it as well?
And you shouldn’t just nerf ele sustain based on one weaponset astro. I know you can think better than this. Rethink that.
Lettuce, the sustain nerf can be taken out of dagger 5 cleansing water to compensate for lowwer CD on RTL.
I do not think might stacking is an issue on elementalist because
1.) The fire trait line used to might stack is bugged and providing +150 (total of 300 in fire) more power than it is supposed to.
2.) Once burning is toned down the Elementalists dps will drop accordingly. most of the damage is coming from burns.
in no world is being able to stack and maintain 20-25 stacks of might by yourself balanced (regardless of profession), with or without the fire traitline bug you mentioned. it’s as simple as that.
elementalist players need drop their grand tradition of trying put off their profession-specific imbalances as purely the results of overarching imbalances alone. yes, while burning as a whole is imbalanced, elementalist’s ridiculous rate of application coupled with their ridiculous might stacking ability as a result of the fire traitline and weapon skills is just as responsible for the imbalances as well.
I have never seen such a bad display of guardian and ranger. Sorry, you might be right at some points but these videos are just terrible. I do not play guardian at all, but even I know better than this. As for the ranger, it is really not good, friend.
As for the ele, I can understand that if you say the burning is op, it really is, for every class. Blinding Ashes is also a dangerous thing if you are not an engineer (immune to blindess thingy). But overall, this is not spvp that you have given us. One is just a duel, and not a very good one. Ranger just shooted you with twigs until you were bored.
Second one is I guess a bad display of pvp by guardians. I was never that lucky to meet those kinds of guardians.
For the TL/DR; Ele needs adjustments like every other class. But these videos are totally kitten . It would be better if you have never used the videos but only gave us your opinions (some of them I really agree by the way).
My main gripes:
Burning speed evade frames.
No way of knowing how long or when ring of earth destroys projectiles.
Those changes would help in the ranger ele match up.
Ranger
Am I good?… I’m good.
Am I good?… I’m good.
(edited by Eurantien.4632)
Here is what I think needs to be done…
8-9 second CD on blinding ashes( Allow a per target cd on blinding ashes instead of an ICD)Ring of Earth no longer blocks projectiles if it does NOT land on a target
Regen duration slightly reduced (remove regen from soothing ice?)
Burning condition re-scaled across the board
Diamond skin reworked
Obsidian flesh CD slightly increased.
Drakes breath and Fire grab re-scaled so that drakes breath hits less hard and fire grab hits much harder. (its much harder to land a Fire Grab than drakes breath, and right now in some circumstances Drakes Breath hits just as hard as a fire grab if the full channel lands and burns are not cleansed, the CD on drakes breath is also very short while fire grab is a very long CD. It makes more sense to me for being heavily rewarded for landing a fire grab with a burn applied opposed to being heavily rewarded for spamming drakes breath)
…Would also be nice to get something a little more reliable than churning earth, that skill is almost a waste time now with how great the burning condition is. I have never been a fan of Churning Earth.
I would also be up for taking a chunk out of ele sustain if it meant getting back 15 second CD on Ride the Lightning.
The ring of earth suggestion is a bit extreme. D/D eles need something to help against rangers. Especially in wvw. You have to think in terms of the entire game, just not one game mode. I think my suggestions are sufficient and sinject has +1’ed it. Do you +1 it as well?
And you shouldn’t just nerf ele sustain based on one weaponset astro. I know you can think better than this. Rethink that.
Lettuce, the sustain nerf can be taken out of dagger 5 cleansing water to compensate for lowwer CD on RTL.
That will hurt s/d eles though.