Guild Wars 2

so a counter build to a meta is bad for the game ? :| Thats the kind of silly comments that makes people wanna prove you wrong just because.

if you try it forreal you will see AR is really situational and not all that great, play it for one night and you’ll find yourself taking it out your build in no time ;p it only works against noobs :)

No, it’s not a counter. A lot of condi removal and cleanse at 25% and wiping them clean with an elixir is a counter. Immunity to is not a counter. Again with the whole (even if its “more OP”) Perma power damage IMMUNITY under 25% and the answer being burst hard enough from 26%→0 or get help from a condi from, it’s just not acceptable answers. It’s not a counter. It’s a total wall. Even if you can “stack condies at 30%” if its possibly to mass wipe them off (which it is) it becomes less of a counter and just a broken mechanic.

ronpierce.2760:

Right? I mean if no one uses it, why do you guys care if we ask for it to be changed a bit in functionality from immunity to a cooldown but a little stronger (clearing condies too). I mean, who’d know?

oh my no…..your already complaining about a rarely used trait with very specific viability that has only shown up really during this condition meta….which its still rarely used.

Then suggesting for it to clear conditions, when there’s already claims that we already have excessive condition clearing…….your just trying to get our class nerf, we already get nerfed directly and indirectly every patch

sorrow.2364:

You know why engineer still die when in a 1vs2/3 against condition classes? Because they heal, just like the guy who posted a video a couple of pages ago.

He took no damage at all when AR was on, then he made the incredibly stupid decision to heal back.
The mesmer stacked all the bleeds he had in the meantime, the engineer had no condition removal at all (good idea to bring no condition removal against a condition spec, but whatever) and then he died.

You know why people who are screaming this trait needs to be looked at plays Necros? Guess which profession is completely built to rely on conditions to be effective? I’ll give you an hint. It starts with “Necrom” and ends with “ancer”.
The survivability of this mysterious is tied to conditions (chill, weakness, cripple, blindness, fear), the control is all tied to conditions (fear, immobilized) and damage is tied to conditions (bleed, burning, torment and vulnerability).
Guess why the profession who is more hurt by AR is this unknown one.

Also, I don’t know what would change if the bleeds in the ronpierce video damaged for 140, or even 63746, instead of 87. The engineer still won’t get any damage at all.

So we are back to because one build of one class is completely negated by another build of another class…. It is OP?

So because engineers have seen what the meta has become (mindless AOE condition spam) and they start building for it they are OP?

And I am sorry bleeds from a mesmer=phantasm attacks which means phantasms were critting which means phantasmal fury which means engi <25% would have been dead anyways so it was not a “stupid” mistake to heal it was a survival decision alone.

And all of necro damage is not tied to their conditions. I have seen some scary axe mh power necro builds that can just wreck face. You don’t see them that often because the FOTM meta is condition spam condition spam. And speaking of classes that are amazing counters to condition builds…. I’ll give you a hint it starts with “Necrom” and ends with “ancer” guess how many trait points they have to spend to get the nice neat condition manipulation that engis get at 25% with a 30 trait point cost, a big whopping zero. Staff, Dagger OH, Consume Conditions, Plague Signet, Well of Power. That is just off the top of my head and half of those skills the necro doesn’t even half to sacrifice a slot skill for…. Guess what they get If they do spend 30 points into the same trait line. One condition removed every 2seconds with enough minions. OH and btw they can still have two condition clears in their weapons… That isn’t OP at all right?

Now let us not forget that necros are the most condition heavy class in the game (makes sense) but they are also one of the best classes in manipulating and removing conditions from themselves.

Also a properly built bunker engineer will likely not take several key things that Mr. Pierce had simply because his build lacked any legitimate team utility.
This things are Healing turret. This alone gives an engi two water fields to blast finish. A bunker that can heal their entire team with good timing and knowledge of combo fields>A med kit elixir S (lol) untraited bombkit (more lol) and elixir C (even more LOL) engineer. Then we also have elixir gun (super elixir can heal for 4k over 10s that is godly) Chances are you will see a bunker engi use that. And they will also take the traited bomb kit to make them have bigger explosions. And lastly they will have either elixir R or a third tool kit depending on the res abilities of their team.

People seem to be so narrow sighted in this thread and they forget this is a team based game mode. And a bunker that has great group support with good survivability is much better than a bunker with no group support and marginally better survivability.

@ Sorrow Pt II
What this trait does is give a class that has marginal condition removal abilities (in comparison to everything but mesmers and maybe warriors) some breathing room until either
A. A power based player comes in and wipes the floor with them.
B. They get some support so that they can heal up and not worry about being condition nuked.
C. They can sit in a never ending battle against a poorly built condition build or LASTLY

Their enemy should be watching their heal skill (engis are pretty obvious) and know they likely don’t have a condition removal after that (Ron Pierce’s example of a bunker engi is the most selfish bunker build ever) then directly burst them with every condition they have. Then when the engi gets to 25% they have a few options. They can either
A. Cleanse the conditions by healing (Heal skill recharges at 25% on an ICD) hoping the necro wasted everything on that burst.
B. Be using runes of melandru and hope that is enough to clear the conditions off which usually it won’t.
C. Sacrifice a large amount of their team utility by replacing elixir R (no team super res) or elixir gun (No team heal and bye bye blast finisher) for the selfish elixir C which if facing more than one necro is a giant “KILL ME NAO” sign especially if they don’t know the exact threshold for their 25% health.

Do some mixing up in your build necros have good power builds and good hybrid builds especially after this last patch. Don’t come running and screaming to the forums because some players are finally building to counter the Condition spam meta. It isn’t just necros. Every single class that has somewhat decent condition builds (even warriors lol) is doing it. It is out of hand. This does a little bit of something to give survivability while letting the engi keep some team utility.

echo.2053:

ronpierce.2760:

Right? I mean if no one uses it, why do you guys care if we ask for it to be changed a bit in functionality from immunity to a cooldown but a little stronger (clearing condies too). I mean, who’d know?

oh my no…..your already complaining about a rarely used trait with very specific viability that has only shown up really during this condition meta….which its still rarely used.

Then suggesting for it to clear conditions, when there’s already claims that we already have excessive condition clearing…….your just trying to get our class nerf, we already get nerfed directly and indirectly every patch

Just shut up already… I gave (as Google said) an over powered acceptable alternative that’s stronger… I don’t care when it’s used, how it’s used, 100% immunity to an entire build is NOT okay in a game, get it? Do you have any sense of balance or developing a proper game? If it’s not used, then just get over it. No one will mind.

i wish warrior had direct damage immune at 25% without cooldown.
i mean, the meta now is condition right? who cares about direct damage.

ronpierce.2760:

I dont’ care if it’s good. I don’t play engi and I’d be fine with my own suggested change. (Perhaps 60 sec CD instead? Not sure it’d have to be tested, maybe not even.) But I just don’t like anything in the game to be immune to another build. Just isn’t good for the game.

What also isn’t good for the game is entire teams being wiped by two condition spam classes nuking an entire point without that team actually having a chance. (Double epidemic anybody?)

jportell.2197:

ronpierce.2760:

I dont’ care if it’s good. I don’t play engi and I’d be fine with my own suggested change. (Perhaps 60 sec CD instead? Not sure it’d have to be tested, maybe not even.) But I just don’t like anything in the game to be immune to another build. Just isn’t good for the game.

What also isn’t good for the game is entire teams being wiped by two condition spam classes nuking an entire point without that team actually having a chance. (Double epidemic anybody?)

I’m not going to disagree with that… I never discussed or even defended the current meta… There’s a lot of things that are over the top. Necros ESPECIALLY conditions are very over the top… But they’re also going to be nerfed as said by a dev, so I don’t see your point…

ronpierce.2760:

echo.2053:

ronpierce.2760:

Right? I mean if no one uses it, why do you guys care if we ask for it to be changed a bit in functionality from immunity to a cooldown but a little stronger (clearing condies too). I mean, who’d know?

oh my no…..your already complaining about a rarely used trait with very specific viability that has only shown up really during this condition meta….which its still rarely used.

Then suggesting for it to clear conditions, when there’s already claims that we already have excessive condition clearing…….your just trying to get our class nerf, we already get nerfed directly and indirectly every patch

He mad XD

Just shut up already… I gave (as Google said) an over powered acceptable alternative that’s stronger… I don’t care when it’s used, how it’s used, 100% immunity to an entire build is NOT okay in a game, get it? Do you have any sense of balance or developing a proper game? If it’s not used, then just get over it. No one will mind.

ROFL and who are you exactly? your complaining about condition immunity ( still rarely used) and wont accept use power instead DESPITE you admitting you use a power dagger.

This is how the nerfstorm comes about ( as if it wasn’t in full swing already)

ronpierce.2760:

jportell.2197:

ronpierce.2760:

I dont’ care if it’s good. I don’t play engi and I’d be fine with my own suggested change. (Perhaps 60 sec CD instead? Not sure it’d have to be tested, maybe not even.) But I just don’t like anything in the game to be immune to another build. Just isn’t good for the game.

What also isn’t good for the game is entire teams being wiped by two condition spam classes nuking an entire point without that team actually having a chance. (Double epidemic anybody?)

I’m not going to disagree with that… I never discussed or even defended the current meta… There’s a lot of things that are over the top. Necros ESPECIALLY conditions are very over the top… But they’re also going to be nerfed as said by a dev, so I don’t see your point…

Once the necro damage/condition spam is nerfed watch this trait fade back into the background to be never used again except by a few specific players that are trying to run very specific team support bunker builds. If this trait gets nerfed along with the condition spam then engis will have no viable bunker builds (every other bunker build in the game has a passive condition removal which is usually more than 1 every 5s or less class dependant) and engis do not.

People are failing to realize that nobody absolutely nobody cared about this trait in one little bit until condition spamming became the way to win a fight.
And every thing in this game should have a counter right. Well let me break this list down for you.

Condition Spammer (no power which…?) Countered by Automated Response Bunker
Automated Response Bunker Countered By High DPS burst damage build
High DPS burst Build Countered by High Healing Bunkers (guards/eles/BM rangers) Which in turn are countered by
Condition Spam Builds…..

This is analysis basically lays out how each build type is countered by another strong build type that is it’s polar opposite. Polar oppositions should exist in games. Without one the other becomes so blatantly over powered that it dominates the meta and makes the game extremely stale and mindless… Oh wait.

jportell.2197:

Condition Spammer (no power which…?) Countered by Automated Response Bunker
Automated Response Bunker Countered By High DPS burst damage build
High DPS burst Build Countered by High Healing Bunkers (guards/eles/BM rangers) Which in turn are countered by
Condition Spam Builds…..

Thats balance. rock-paper-scissors. all people want to do is continually buff their own class while nerfing the things they might have problems with.

ronpierce.2760:

echo.2053:

ronpierce.2760:

Right? I mean if no one uses it, why do you guys care if we ask for it to be changed a bit in functionality from immunity to a cooldown but a little stronger (clearing condies too). I mean, who’d know?

oh my no…..your already complaining about a rarely used trait with very specific viability that has only shown up really during this condition meta….which its still rarely used.

Then suggesting for it to clear conditions, when there’s already claims that we already have excessive condition clearing…….your just trying to get our class nerf, we already get nerfed directly and indirectly every patch

Just shut up already… I gave (as Google said) an over powered acceptable alternative that’s stronger… I don’t care when it’s used, how it’s used, 100% immunity to an entire build is NOT okay in a game, get it? Do you have any sense of balance or developing a proper game? If it’s not used, then just get over it. No one will mind.

If you don’t see it that often, just get over it. 1 build is Hard Counter to one other build, no one will mind. Do you have any sense of balance or developing a proper game? Then just shut up already.

echo.2053:

jportell.2197:

Condition Spammer (no power which…?) Countered by Automated Response Bunker
Automated Response Bunker Countered By High DPS burst damage build
High DPS burst Build Countered by High Healing Bunkers (guards/eles/BM rangers) Which in turn are countered by
Condition Spam Builds…..

Thats balance. rock-paper-scissors. all people want to do is continually buff their own class while nerfing the things they might have problems with.

And people think fights should be won by nothing but “skill.” If they want nothing but who can press buttons faster and out heal the other person before they die then they need to play a game with no traits/stat distribution/and build types. There should be some mystery when going into a fight against any class you should wonder if they are going to be able to counter your build by either being built to bunker through everything you throw at them. Or you are the bunker and they have figured out what kind you are and time their skills off that. And not just mindlessly throw AOE conditions on the ground hoping you die soon to them.

This is what I mean. There’s no middle ground with you people. I’m not sure you even give a kitten, I think you’re just here to argue. Which is fine, I guess. it’s fun, but eh this specific topic is just getting pretty old. We’ve been saying the same thing back and forth for 11 pages and just increasingly getting more rude. I’m done.

I don’t think you understand what the word rare means, which is perfectly fine this is a world-wide game now. its something that seldomly occurs, infrequent, uncommon. So yes the majority aka everyone who isn’t the 4 trying to get it nerfed most likely do not remotely care about the trait.

We care more about the unnecessary nerfing merely because someone is inconvenienced by it despite its rare use, extremely limited viability.

lol rudeness XD darn me i shouldn’t have told you to shut up frist out of the blue…. oh wait, must of been imagining someone else XD

Couple things. The rudeness has been going on for pages now, myself not excluded, thanks. But also I suggested ways to BUFF it that isn’t a 100% immunity with no cooldown. The thing is, non of you are willing to budge even for a BETTER all around trait, BECAUSE right now it’s a mindless free-be. I’m not just trying to nerf it, in fact, I’ve stated MULTIPLE times that I would be totally cool with buffing it/making it a better trait, given that you don’t have an immunity to a type of build. MMOs are not the place for that type of power, REGARDLESS of how “rarely” its used… Rarity is not an issue, the fact that it exists is the issue. I didn’t say leave it as is and give it a cooldown. I said make it better, more rounded and THEN give it a cooldown. But no, you don’t want reasoning, you don’t want upgrades, you just want your trolly trait left alone.

Your suggestion.
Clear all and gain immunity for 6s with a 40s CD….
I think you are missing the amount of skill that it takes to stay at 25% health with out dying in a viable tourney comp. Your hyperbole build is disregarded because any engi would never ever run it in tourneys because it has absolutely NO and I mean NO team utility which is something engineers are amazing at.
The only “buff” in your proposed change is the clearing all at 25% everything else is a nerf. And a massive one at that.

@jportell:
Your arguments are a joke.
You are comparing the Necromancer, which is by class description the profession with better condition management in this game, to Engineer and use it as justification for the 100% immunity to conditions…

Also, you seem to lack the base knowledge of the profession.
Axe builds rely on Vulnerability much much more than any other power build in this game.

Also lol @ “Necros have good hybrid builds”. Make a freakin Necro and test for yourself how a condition weapon deals damage.

Leaving aside your false convictions about Necro, you still avoid to address what we are criticizing about the skill and you are keep focusing on something we’ve never said it was wrong (condition counter).

So, to avoid you post again another time without addressing the core issue of the trait, I’ll nail it down for you: Why is it fine that the immunity is potentially unlimited? Why do engis have access to a potentally permanent 100% immunity instead of some extra active condition cleanses?

This is the point you have to address and what we are criticizing in about 11 pages, understood?

ronpierce.2760:

Advent Leader.1083:

KarlaGrey.5903:

Some of the arguments invoked by certain users around here in favour of AR are so dumb, not to mention self-contradicting and completely ignoring all counter arguments, that it makes my brain cells commit suicide by jumping out my ears.

If the trait is so kitten, and no one uses it, then no harm will be done either way to have it reworked.
I also find it rather funny how engis accuse necs of spamming conds, when they themselves can stack and spam conds just as much (including confusion stacking), while also seeing damage numbers non-power condispecced necros can only dream of.
And I won’t even start with the aoe grenade aoe on downed targets. Stop kidding yourself already. Mind this is meant in general, not strictly in connection with AR.

P.S. At above, your cond-inflicting phantasms should be unable to damage the endi with AR when under 25%, but if that is not the case, it proves even more how much condi necros are being kitten on for lacking any real raw damage.

Let me remind you again of this major issue everyone tends to dismiss (in addition to how permanent immunities are trash for the balance in any game):

The >RAW< DAMAGE of all CONDITION-INFLICTING SKILLS is COMPLETELY NEGATED.

The >RAW< DAMAGE of all CONDITION-INFLICTING SKILLS is COMPLETELY NEGATED.

The >RAW< DAMAGE of all CONDITION-INFLICTING SKILLS is COMPLETELY NEGATED.

The >RAW< DAMAGE of all CONDITION-INFLICTING SKILLS is COMPLETELY NEGATED.

The >RAW< DAMAGE of all CONDITION-INFLICTING SKILLS is COMPLETELY NEGATED too.

The >RAW< DAMAGE of all CONDITION-INFLICTING SKILLS is COMPLETELY NEGATED.

Maybe it’ll actually sink in this time.

The only time damage from a skill is NOT negated is when the said skill only has a CHANCE to inflict a condition (on crit, etc.), which is why DS no4 works to start with and which is why (certain?) phantasms can still hit the engi under 25%. I don’t know whether damage negation also happens with shatter mesmers, but their spike damage ought being FULLY negated too, because all their shatter skills also inflict conditions (Illusionary Retribution). But is that actually the case?

Just going to chime in here – it is not ‘total’ immunity, it’s immunity to standard duration conditions, ergo now that you know that this trait does exist, you can actually still kill the bunker by having modified and longer conditions, and stacking them as fast as you can to the engie.

I don’t have math yet, but sacrificing a little bit of cond damage to increase cond duration by half a tick or full tick will still kill the engie, aside from the direct damage that necro skills have.

Incorrect, I tested it with a Necro having + condition duration, it’s likely bugged, but the -100% condition duration is currently multiplicative and not additive. He had some (little) but still some condition duration, and his scepter 1 (which applies like 3-4 second bleeds) didn’t even try to place a condition on me. It’s about 3:00 into the video maybe a little before/after.

But does the direct damage from the scepter still hit?

No, it does not, because condition-inflicting is part of its innate function (i.e. not granted by a trait).
The only auto attacks hitting are staff auto (gl with that) and DS auto, both of which hit like a wet noodle in condispecs (and we all know the fast pace at which DS is drained).

Advent Leader.1083:

ronpierce.2760:

Advent Leader.1083:

KarlaGrey.5903:

Some of the arguments invoked by certain users around here in favour of AR are so dumb, not to mention self-contradicting and completely ignoring all counter arguments, that it makes my brain cells commit suicide by jumping out my ears.

If the trait is so kitten, and no one uses it, then no harm will be done either way to have it reworked.
I also find it rather funny how engis accuse necs of spamming conds, when they themselves can stack and spam conds just as much (including confusion stacking), while also seeing damage numbers non-power condispecced necros can only dream of.
And I won’t even start with the aoe grenade aoe on downed targets. Stop kidding yourself already. Mind this is meant in general, not strictly in connection with AR.

P.S. At above, your cond-inflicting phantasms should be unable to damage the endi with AR when under 25%, but if that is not the case, it proves even more how much condi necros are being kitten on for lacking any real raw damage.

Let me remind you again of this major issue everyone tends to dismiss (in addition to how permanent immunities are trash for the balance in any game):

The >RAW< DAMAGE of all CONDITION-INFLICTING SKILLS is COMPLETELY NEGATED.

The >RAW< DAMAGE of all CONDITION-INFLICTING SKILLS is COMPLETELY NEGATED.

The >RAW< DAMAGE of all CONDITION-INFLICTING SKILLS is COMPLETELY NEGATED.

The >RAW< DAMAGE of all CONDITION-INFLICTING SKILLS is COMPLETELY NEGATED.

The >RAW< DAMAGE of all CONDITION-INFLICTING SKILLS is COMPLETELY NEGATED too.

The >RAW< DAMAGE of all CONDITION-INFLICTING SKILLS is COMPLETELY NEGATED.

Maybe it’ll actually sink in this time.

The only time damage from a skill is NOT negated is when the said skill only has a CHANCE to inflict a condition (on crit, etc.), which is why DS no4 works to start with and which is why (certain?) phantasms can still hit the engi under 25%. I don’t know whether damage negation also happens with shatter mesmers, but their spike damage ought being FULLY negated too, because all their shatter skills also inflict conditions (Illusionary Retribution). But is that actually the case?

Just going to chime in here – it is not ‘total’ immunity, it’s immunity to standard duration conditions, ergo now that you know that this trait does exist, you can actually still kill the bunker by having modified and longer conditions, and stacking them as fast as you can to the engie.

I don’t have math yet, but sacrificing a little bit of cond damage to increase cond duration by half a tick or full tick will still kill the engie, aside from the direct damage that necro skills have.

Incorrect, I tested it with a Necro having + condition duration, it’s likely bugged, but the -100% condition duration is currently multiplicative and not additive. He had some (little) but still some condition duration, and his scepter 1 (which applies like 3-4 second bleeds) didn’t even try to place a condition on me. It’s about 3:00 into the video maybe a little before/after.

But does the direct damage from the scepter still hit?

Actually, I think the power portion wakittenting, but it wakittenting me for like 70 damage. I was gaining 10 second of regeneration from the hits, and literally outhealing it, but there was no bleed-based damage being dealt. Staff could hit me… for like something pitiful. With fleshgolem never being in the situation I could have used c at 25% and Akitten and never died IF I didn’t actually out heal him by Regen putting me back over 25% after a little while of him auto attacking me.

IIrc, I haven’t seen any damage displayed from any skill that also inflicts conditions.

That may be correct, I didn’t test that much, I just tested if conditions were being applied with + duration, and they weren’t, and anything they MAY have been doing, I was outhealing via passive regens.

Yea, a condi spec won’t be able to take down anything with raw damage alone anyway.

Well, even scepter with Rampagers, the damage coefficient just isn’t in it for these types of weapons… I don’t know what they were thinking suggesting we could just spec hybrid.. I run a full power MM and my staff hits for next to nothing…

Actually, when checking for damage, you really have to check the combat tab. The UI is bugged as hell when it comes to immune prompts. It would be nice if there is a vid which shows the combat tab being tracked. My earlier test was with a guardian slapping me with a virtue’d auto (applies burn on hit), and the auto damage still hit through.

Gonna test it later once I have my friend necro up, or we can test it now if you have a necro and a private arena. I’m on Piken Square (EU).

Interesting. If that is actually the case, then the damage must have simply been so negligable then that it didn’t manage to outdamage the regen, so I didn’t even notice it.
It’d be much appreciated, if someone could test that.

Also @ronpierce: IMO, another change that would help melee but still stick with the general theme of the trait would be that mobility-imparing conditions don’t get reduced to zero, or not get reduced at all, and that the other conditions are the only ones granted immunity.

So I did a test just now with a Mesmer. They had 30% increased bleed duration, and some others, under 25% I was taking Winds damage and chaos strorm damage, but no condition damage was taken and no conditions were ever remotely applied. That said, it is 100% certainly immunity, so condition duration will not help you.

They had 30-40% condition duration, it still didn’t land. I was only taking Chaotic Winds damage.

you need over 100% duration for condi to be applied

Not sure why that was even brought up, then to be perfectly honest for sPvP.

lol Ron… This thread is gonna get buried once people start QQ about stealth spamming BM rangers! xP

Warriors need more survival, a net gives them more dmg
Rangers need more dmg, anet gives them more survival (stealth)

oh yah… greater marks nerds was kinda hash..my perma fear build got a huge buff

gotta love these drunk balance changes <3

It’s all overshadowed by the DS nerf. No more forever falling and living with DS or escaping boss 1 hit kills with it. It’s a sad day.

ronpierce.2760:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-2zW_A_w_I

They had 30-40% condition duration, it still didn’t land. I was only taking Chaotic Winds damage.

Yes, because when I see someone immune to condis I use Cry of Frustration instead of just insta-jibbing them with Mind Wrack. Your videos keep getting worse.

Grackleflint.4956:

Yes, because when I see someone immune to condis I use Cry of Frustration instead of just insta-jibbing them with Mind Wrack. Your videos keep getting worse.

Where do you see Cry of Frustration in the combat log?
It’s me or there is no Cry of Frustration at all?

Grackleflint.4956:

ronpierce.2760:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x-2zW_A_w_I

They had 30-40% condition duration, it still didn’t land. I was only taking Chaotic Winds damage.

Yes, because when I see someone immune to condis I use Cry of Frustration instead of just insta-jibbing them with Mind Wrack. Your videos keep getting worse.

Your arguments keep getting worse and that’s certainly not an easy thing to accomplish.

ronpierce.2760:

It’s all overshadowed by the DS nerf. No more forever falling and living with DS or escaping boss 1 hit kills with it. It’s a sad day.

yah lol but still, having to go 20 points into death magic for greater marks is gonna suck. not ever dying from fall dmg was always fun tho

Maybe it wasn’t the confusion (condition) shatter, but my point still stands that if Mind Wrack was used instead of one that applies a condition, the Engineer would have fallen over dead.

ronpierce.2760:

I don’t think he got the point of why I was even posting that video, Jesus Christ. It was to show that condition duration wasnt a factor. Just grow up already.

Easy big fella. I get why these videos are being staged. I’m just here to poke holes in their flimsy veneer.

Grackleflint.4956:

Maybe it wasn’t the confusion (condition) shatter, but my point still stands that if Mind Wrack was used instead of one that applies a condition, the Engineer would have fallen over dead.

He used Mind Wrack with 3 clones two times in the video.
Have you really watched it?

sorrow.2364:

Grackleflint.4956:

Maybe it wasn’t the confusion (condition) shatter, but my point still stands that if Mind Wrack was used instead of one that applies a condition, the Engineer would have fallen over dead.

He used Mind Wrack with 3 clones two times in the video.
Have you really watched it?

Did. I must have missed the part where we get to watch it from the Mesmer’s PoV.

I have to admit, you guys have a point. When someone is at 25% I never use CC, burst, or weapon swap. Nothing but that sweet auto attack.

There was nothing to watch man… I wasn’t dueling him… I was just showing that with condition duration, they weren’t being applied… Neither of us were TRYING to do anything. That’s all it was…

I’ve told you 3 times now, you’re thinking I’m trying to show a Mesmer not able to kill me, I wasn’t…

Grackleflint.4956:

Did. I must have missed the part where we get to watch it from the Mesmer’s PoV.

I have to admit, you guys have a point. When someone is at 25% I never use CC, burst, or weapon swap. Nothing but that sweet auto attack.

There is the combat log in the bottom left corner, showing you all the skills mesmer used.

I…. (ugh) WASN’T EVEN HAVING HIM TRY TO KILLL MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE. I was showing that the conditions weren’t applying…. You’re making this really hard to stay civil.

ronpierce.2760:

I…. (ugh) WASN’T EVEN HAVING HIM TRY TO KILLL MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE. I was showing that the conditions weren’t applying…. You’re making this really hard to stay civil.

If he wasn’t trying to kill you, what bearing does this have on the game—the one we all play—where we try to kill things?

I just told you what the point was, if you can’t pick it out of there, I’m not saying it for a 10th time.

ronpierce.2760:

I just told you what the point was, if you can’t pick it out of there, I’m not saying it for a 10th time.

Your point was that you were getting no condition ticks from WOC. Even tho the mesmer had 40% duration…. Well at 25% you have -100% the mesmer had +40% so that comes out to still being -60% duration.

Also as for things that have counterplay how about greater marks…. You can’t block it and unless you see it on the ground before hand you aren’t evading it either. (Even with the patch just had to throw this in their!) Also even though terror got nerfed at least runes of melandru no longer double up on it. How much counter play does fear have?

What about 20 stacks of bleeding in 5 seconds…. I could go on and on about the things with necros that have no counter play. One of the only things that counters necros is this trait. Other conditon classes have found away around it (funny I still die in tourneys against 3 necros… I thought I was supposed to be a god). Seriously even if the engi is immune at 25% to conditions 3 condition classes can still wipe the floor with them real quick. And 1v2 may take a little bit longer but a bunker defeats his purpose if he just /cowers and dies when 1v2. Seriously, would you allow a bunker guard on your team if he couldn’t hold a 1v2 for about a minute or 2?