Guild Wars 2

Iam a lvl 40 active pvp player.

Anyways, now with the new changes in most of the classes i can freely say that thief is not even in the top 5 professions to spvp.

Actually now the only good thing that thieves have is the roaming in WvW.

Then

If Terromancer is so OP with his combo.
If A Ranger Pet master is so OP with his alsmot instant healing
If a engi excels defending and attacking an specific area (can kill 3 easily)
If guardians . . . . well there a lot of OP things with them ill not say more.
If mesmer are good for every in the game (bust, heal, def, condition, CC, party support )
If Warriors hit like a truck with the burst combo (the highest AOE DPS ) and invencibility after it.
If Ele has a greate balance (like guardian)

Why is Anet constantly nerfing thieves if they are not even close to be as good as previous calses in spvp.

I really dont get the 4 seconds revelades in spvp.

You killed almost every single build of the thieves with the patches, now that thief is not the best choice in spvp…

… then why we still have this kitten nerf?

LOL , a thief is complaining about warriors!, the things that one sees in the forums.

I cannot agree to anything you just said right there, but Revealed was reverted in WvW, and they are constantly complaining about stealth spamming thieves. Why was Revealed not reverted here, when stealth spam is not even rewarded, and not complained about? To me it just seems like Anet forgot about it.

Im fine with the current reveal. Think it makes encounters with other thieves go by quicker.

Guys… thief isnt OP anymore we need to buff it….

Also, coming from a top 500 ranger… BM ranger is bad…

thief are still strong… most of them just continue going full GS with 0 survival and no condi removal

I’am not complaining about other classes.

Actually is fun to see in a patch a new OP class to fight.

I’am complaining of nerfing thieves every patch with no reason.

SPVP 4 sec revealed has no sense.

you need to be out of stealth any way to cap.

Please if you don’t have experience with all classes and SPVP stay out saying things that you dont understand.

Should be 10 second revealed in WvW

Lighter.5631 as i read you in other threads, your problem is definitely a L2P issue.

Let me guess, you are a warrior trying to roam in WvW that constantly got killed by a thief.

All because you dont know how to stand in the circle of black powder to stop the stealth chain.

Anyways, dont come here to troll my post like you did in the others that complains about warriors just because you dont know how to use your char.

The problem is with condi removal.

My experience right now tells me that what they need to do is

a.Reduce Hide in the Shadows to 20 seconds and put “remove 3 conditions” or have Withdraw remove 2 conditions.
b.Shadow Refuge needs to grant the thief stability

I honestly think that the change with the reveal in TPvP should stay because stealth-backstab, stealth-backstab without the enemy being able to track down where is the thief was absurd.

Well this thread has devolved into a kitten throwing contest. I didn’t really think thieves needed to be nerfed. I can’t remember the last time I died to a thief in a 1v1, and I probably deserved it when it happened. Thieves fit in a very odd niche, excelling in stomps and quickly destroying the other team’s dps when properly specced. I’m working on Champion Shadow right now and it’s definitely a profession that requires a lot of situational awareness.

SoLeciTO.3490:

Iam a lvl 40 active pvp player.

Anyways, now with the new changes in most of the classes i can freely say that thief is not even in the top 5 professions to spvp.

Actually now the only good thing that thieves have is the roaming in WvW.

Then

If Terromancer is so OP with his combo.
If A Ranger Pet master is so OP with his alsmot instant healing
If a engi excels defending and attacking an specific area (can kill 3 easily)
If guardians . . . . well there a lot of OP things with them ill not say more.
If mesmer are good for every in the game (bust, heal, def, condition, CC, party support )
If Warriors hit like a truck with the burst combo (the highest AOE DPS ) and invencibility after it.
If Ele has a greate balance (like guardian)

Why is Anet constantly nerfing thieves if they are not even close to be as good as previous calses in spvp.

I really dont get the 4 seconds revelades in spvp.

You killed almost every single build of the thieves with the patches, now that thief is not the best choice in spvp…

… then why we still have this kitten nerf?

Thanks for mentioning your rank because as we all know..only skilled people get to that rank..

You made my day when you complained about warriors, lol.

Man some people are so bad that the most broken stealth class in the history of mmorpg can’t carry them.

Thanks for the feedback.

About CnD→BS rotation; i don’t see this as a big problem now since they nerf mug.

in SPVP the space where you have to fight is very reduce compared to WvW, This makes thief really vulnerable for AOE attacks.

About the condi removal, i see your point but the problem is that thief has nothing else to remove condition (at least a functional one) than this.

Warriors… highest AoE dps? if you count 100blades, I laugh.

Besides, I am quite certain thiefs got more DPS then warriors, there is even a topic about in the thief forums O_O.

Now… back to revealed… as someone who plays a warrior, I had my fair share of fighting thiefs, who manage to spam stealth by simply letting their stealth to end to attack normally without the “revealed” status getting on them, allowing them attack and run much more easily in combat… so when a thief thinks it is a good idea to attack while in stealth to finish or make massive damage, and in the end doesn’t finish his opponent as he wants, that is his fault if the enemy manages to counter it.

Really sad how people still to this day say thief or any profession is OP and just refuse to l2p. This is why this game will never have a “real” metagame.

The current revealed is fine, but it is not like the 3 second revealed made thieves immortal with stealth, they were never immortal. They increased it with out any justifications for it (in sPvP). In WvW it was a problem, still is, not in sPvP, and I am just repeating myself.

EoNxBoNx.9213 exactly there is no logic justification.

If it is one please let me know . . . the best argument i have read is the one for the condi removal.

Rance Webster.2635 the post u are talking about was on 1v1 damage on certain time, not AOE. Also in order for a thief to hit more than a warrior has to go 100% GC, 1 root and u r dead. i Also read that post.

And dont get me wrong iam not searching nerf for other classes, iam just searching for a reason for revealed to 4 sec only SPVP .

Trust me, after being mainly a thief since the game started iam sick of ppl asking to nerf other classes because they dont know how to use their own.

… EoN, just because I don’t say that the thief doesn’t need a buff to something, it means I call them OP? I consider necros as too much powerful, not thiefs XD.

Now SoLeci, you do realize that a high DPS warrior is usually also a glass cannon?

And basically, you just explained yourself about the message on damage
If on one root and I am dead, then why when I manage to survive it, a thief can just go back to stealth again and wait to use such power again soon?

Let me explain- from what it seems, a thief can unleash his damaging attacks in about 2-3 seconds, so if the revealed was only 3 seconds long, then immediately after the attack is finished they can go stealth again and get some more initiative, which also mean about no time for the opponent to react and make a counter attack, and the one more second in revealed helps with making that counter-attack… and if you get it by that counter-attack, it’s your fault, simple as that

Also… speaking of differences between WvW and PvP… warrior’s off-hand axe skill “whirlwind axe” is about 50% weaker in WvW and PvE then in PvP, which while it makes sense in PvE, it is kind of absurd in WvW… what I am trying to say is, it seems Anet has a tendency to make chances and differences in a way that doesn’t make that sense…

Rance Webster.2635

What i mean is that if we don’t have shadow step (CD) we are dead is full glass canon, we don’t have enough health to hold those 4 seconds or an invincibility skill as warriors does taking 0 damage.

I actually have nothing against warriors or any other profession, i think each profession should have something unique to be good at.

I completely agree with ur last statement, anet should be more careful with this split issues between pve and pvp, most of them have no sense now.

Sorry for my bad english i try my best

Warriors don’t have that much sustain in the first place, and the utility still is in the end still a 60 stance with a duration of 4 seconds (6 if traited), so it is usually only used once or very occasionally twice – your still on the end doesn’t have that much of a long cooldown, and don’t forget you still have dodge to evade from a counter-attack, while you usually have on your weapon skills ways of defending yourself or avoiding close combat.

If you don’t know how to use what you have to defend yourself, such as a warrior that still uses what he got to defend itself (I count dodges, CC, and GS’s whirlwind in this as well), then as I said, it’s the thief’s fault

Rance Webster.2635:

… EoN, just because I don’t say that the thief doesn’t need a buff to something, it means I call them OP? I consider necros as too much powerful, not thiefs XD.

.

I was more talking to the people that literally came into this thread just to say thieves are OP and don’t need this change reverted, with no reasoning behind it.

Stop shadow refuge from stacking stealth. Stealth when in it, not when out. Apply stability to shadow refuge when standing in it.

As far as thieves go, I don’t mind them to much, usually they run up, hit me, then run off while I cap the point. Its the ones built for 1v1 that usually kill me. Or the ones built to do stupid crap (like constant dodge wtf)

I think mesmers should have invisibility completely removed and replaced with something else. Every Mesmer I’ve fought without invisibility has been an amazing fight. Everyone that exploits every possible form of invisibility is just a pain in the neck that makes me not want to continue playing the game after the 3rd invisibility.

Without the return of the old tactical strike it does not make sense.
p / d with only bleeding useless against retaliation.
d / p, too, does not make sense, since the initiative end faster.

2 sec daze <<< 2+ sec immobilize<<<bs damage
3 sec daze = bs damage

… Shadow refuge with stability?… yeah, not a chance, with stability there’ll be no way to stop them in shadow refuge when they use it to make the finishing animation on downed people, reviving people, or to just try and hit them while they are inside (I use my hammer’s 4th skill and burst skill to try and stop them, usually it works)

Rance Webster.2635:

… Shadow refuge with stability?… yeah, not a chance, with stability there’ll be no way to stop them in shadow refuge when they use it to make the finishing animation on downed people, reviving people, or to just try and hit them while they are inside (I use my hammer’s 4th skill and burst skill to try and stop them, usually it works)

So basically let me get this straight.

All classes have got stunbreaker for our 45 second elite = checked.
All classes can get us our 60 second refuge = checked
All classes have got/can gain stability (apart from Mesmers I think) = checked

So yeah no stability for thieves but it is alright to have for the rest. Makes sense.

45 second Elite, HELL YEA!
Back in ele town … 150 seconds later, oh crap I used the pile of faecal matter and died.

Authority.6145:

All classes have got/can gain stability (apart from Mesmers I think) = checked

So yeah no stability for thieves but it is alright to have for the rest. Makes sense.

hahaha ;D

Authority.6145:

Rance Webster.2635:

… Shadow refuge with stability?… yeah, not a chance, with stability there’ll be no way to stop them in shadow refuge when they use it to make the finishing animation on downed people, reviving people, or to just try and hit them while they are inside (I use my hammer’s 4th skill and burst skill to try and stop them, usually it works)

So basically let me get this straight.

All classes have got stunbreaker for our 45 second elite = checked.
All classes can get us our 60 second refuge = checked
All classes have got/can gain stability (apart from Mesmers I think) = checked

So yeah no stability for thieves but it is alright to have for the rest. Makes sense.

your dagger storm cry

Im used to cast dagger storm and ESC cancelled it to gain stability if needed.

4s revealed needs to go IMO. There really isn’t any point to it. D/d got killed by it and so did s/d stealth builds.

Thieves can’t run 10/30/30/0/0 anymore and insta gib people.

I’m sure the new 10/30/0/0/30 build will get nerfed next patch. Just like s/d and d/d after people started using it.

Pretty sure they added the 4 sec reveal for WvW since u literally cant touch a thief in wvw with d/d cloak and daggers.

But WvW thieves started Crying and they reversed it and left it in pvp where it didnt need the nerf

I think its a reasonable request after being one of the most complained about class for the sole reason that people dont know how to play and immediately cry when they get hit for more then 50% of there health

But besides that the nerf was intended for d/d in wvw NOT pvp and im still baffled why they mixed up the 2 when reverting wvw back to 3 sec and not pvp

SoLeciTO.3490:

I really dont get the 4 seconds revelades in spvp.

I don’t get it why revealed is 3 seconds in WvWvW. Stealth is much more powerful in WvWvW as it allows to exit fights, enter enemy surrounded buildings, place traps in front of enemy feet, hide inside enemy structures, do stealth stomps in the middle of hectic zerg fights etc.

If things would make any sense revealed should be longer in WvWvW and not in spvp/tpvp. Currently it is vice versa!

Arenanet developers: please explain your logic why revealed is 3 seconds in WvWvW?

PS. I disagree with many of the OP’s points about certain other professions being so super powerful. That is serious exaggeration (e.g. telling that engineer can kill 3 alone easily and warrior having best AoE dps and then invincibility after that. Warrior’s endure pain is far from being invulnerable).

I have almost 1000 tournament games on my thief and the highest rank I have reached rank is around 700 (nothing fancy). I don’t agree with everything above posted however; I do believe anet need to bring back the 3 seconds reveal debuff. They could have done this when they nerfed Mug since specing full glass cannon was not really viable after that.

Anyway, that was my two cents about the reveal debuff.

The funny thing is that in spvp (where the thief is nothing special) the thief has been nerfed several times. In WvWvW (where thief is like a god mode) the class has not been nerfed untill now, although the w3 players have heavily abused the culling issue for about 6 months.

Authority.6145:

Rance Webster.2635:

… Shadow refuge with stability?… yeah, not a chance, with stability there’ll be no way to stop them in shadow refuge when they use it to make the finishing animation on downed people, reviving people, or to just try and hit them while they are inside (I use my hammer’s 4th skill and burst skill to try and stop them, usually it works)

So basically let me get this straight.

All classes have got stunbreaker for our 45 second elite = checked.
All classes can get us our 60 second refuge = checked
All classes have got/can gain stability (apart from Mesmers I think) = checked

So yeah no stability for thieves but it is alright to have for the rest. Makes sense.

The problem isn’t that a thief shouldn’t have stability, it’s the fact that you want it with shadow refuge… that would make shadow refuge too powerful – stealth self and allies and grant stability? how on hell are we supposed to stop them from stomping our allies or from reviving their allies then? if someone uses just stability do to either, we can still focus our DPS on him in hopes of bringing him down, yet while also in stealth however, that isn’t possible (some melee moves require a target to hit properly, where ranged moves and weapons just won’t be able to hit)

Shadow-Refuge as it is now, is well balanced. It allows tactical play and some surprising moments, but also can be countered/negated with CC. With applying stability on it, this possibility would have gone.

Deniara Devious.3948 you are talking about WvW.

Engi in a small spot in SPVP with turrents is really really strong, can easily kill 3 ppl (i have seen it many times).

Anyways iam not trying to exaggerate, i just put some examples above, i know that every single professions and builds has a counter.

Is like P/D, that build for thief (the most boring one IMO) now is a joke.

People keep complaining abvout thieves in WvW saying they are gods.

Hell no! they are only good in 1 thing in this game, roaming and you still cry about it.

4 seconds revelealed has no sense in anyway in any situation.

Is like complaining and crying all the time because i like to make dungeons but my thief is a joke compared to a warrior, guardian or mesmer.

Warrios are greate in dungeons . . .. so?

There are too many QQ in this forums, and that is why thief has been nerfed continuosly every single patch.

How the heck did we get to dungeons? this is a PvP forum here? besides, can’t you just use blinds on an opponent in dungeons (the ones with dredge is more of a problem I admit, but I am sure you can try other builds as well)

And I already explained why 4 seconds revealed is reasonable, if you are just going to whine and not give explanations of why it should go back to 3 seconds, then do for all of us a favor and whine in private :O

Rance Webster.2635 i bring out the dungeons because of one previous comment -.-

Please read instead of trolling around.

I already gave a lot of reasons to bring back the 3 sec reveled and not only me.

My intention is not to talk trash of other classes, my only intention is to be fair here.

You will never see i go to other profession post trolling to nerf them, every class is different and i love that.

The one is whinning here is you, ate the moment someone touches your warrior you start attacking.

It is anoying that someone else talks trash of your profession right? well it is how we feel every single day reading people that dont know how to play their profession asking to nerf other classes.

Dear anet

Nerf Scissors,
Rock is Fine,
Sincerely Paper.

………..

even with the 4s revealed debuff, i still get “permastealth much?” whines (even though i’m far from permastealthing). took a while to get used to it, but it’s nothing gamebreaking. if it makes people shut up about thief stealth, then i’m all for it.

SoLeciTO.3490:

Hello, Everyclass but mine is Overpowered! Please buff me cause I can’t adapt to changes you’ve made to my class! I just want to roll my face on the keyboard and win game.

FTFY.

Hey everybody.
We had to delete several postings in here. Please try to keep your conversations healthy and constructive.

SoLeciTO.3490:

Rance Webster.2635 i bring out the dungeons because of one previous comment -.-

Please read instead of trolling around.

I already gave a lot of reasons to bring back the 3 sec reveled and not only me.

My intention is not to talk trash of other classes, my only intention is to be fair here.

You will never see i go to other profession post trolling to nerf them, every class is different and i love that.

The one is whinning here is you, ate the moment someone touches your warrior you start attacking.

It is anoying that someone else talks trash of your profession right? well it is how we feel every single day reading people that dont know how to play their profession asking to nerf other classes.

Dear anet

Nerf Scissors,
Rock is Fine,
Sincerely Paper.

………..

Wow… seriously, I don’t know if you are actually a troll yourself, or if you are a troll food that bring in all the trolls XD.

“I already gave a lot of reasons to bring back the 3 sec reveled and not only me.” … I’m sorry, but so far, your only reason here was basically “THIEFS WERE NERFED, THIEFS WERE NERFED – WE NEED A BUFF”, say it any way you you’ll like, but you didn’t give any good reason to bring revealed back to 3 seconds in terms of gameplay, instead of complaining that thiefs got nerfed, where those that try to buff warriors generally try to explain themselves in terms of the mechanics of the game.

Also, really? trying to ignore what I say by saying “The one is whinning here is you, ate the moment someone touches your warrior you start attacking.”
… The warrior has barely been touched at the slightest, expect by your first message when you tried to bring the message “look at us thiefs, we aren’t equal at all compared to the opness around”…

Yeah, hard for me to take you seriously like that, just get used to the other classes and work a way around the revealed, simple as that.

I will be more clear then, because i can see you dont understand.

P/D: This build needs to constantly stealth for the Sneak Attack, its main bleed attack (actually the only one that really stacks bleed)

D/D: GC thieves now are really bad in SPVP, they die really fast because we have no denfense or health, any other profession can easily kill you in 3 seconds.

General:

1.- Stealth is the only real defense we have, evading works only with 1 build S/D and we still get a lot of damage because of our abd defense and low health.

2.- P/D the only one that can permastealth will not permastealth in SPVP because they need to cap, but we really need our defense mechanic back to scape to the 3mx3m fight area in SPVP.

3.- The difference between WvW and SPVP in the revelaed time is anoying, because is hard to get use to the timming differences (i already learn this but for most is anoying).

4.- Now we dont have mug, the burst damage we had is gone, there is no reason to be scare for a backstab now because is not that strong anyways.

5.- Other classes recieve greate things, like a guardian, virtually imposible to kill if they go full tank, and we dont complain, is his roll and i love that, but what do we have FOR SPVP?.

And there are more reasons but i know only that people that plays thief will understand.

SoLeciTO.3490:

I will be more clear then, because i can see you dont understand.

P/D: This build needs to constantly stealth for the Sneak Attack, its main bleed attack (actually the only one that really stacks bleed)

D/D: GC thieves now are really bad in SPVP, they die really fast because we have no denfense or health, any other profession can easily kill you in 3 seconds.

General:

1.- Stealth is the only real defense we have, evading works only with 1 build S/D and we still get a lot of damage because of our abd defense and low health.

2.- P/D the only one that can permastealth will not permastealth in SPVP because they need to cap, but we really need our defense mechanic back to scape to the 3mx3m fight area in SPVP.

3.- The difference between WvW and SPVP in the revelaed time is anoying, because is hard to get use to the timming differences (i already learn this but for most is anoying).

4.- Now we dont have mug, the burst damage we had is gone, there is no reason to be scare for a backstab now because is not that strong anyways.

5.- Other classes recieve greate things, like a guardian, virtually imposible to kill if they go full tank, and we dont complain, is his roll and i love that, but what do we have FOR SPVP?.

And there are more reasons but i know only that people that plays thief will understand.

P/D: It is a bad set. It needs a rework and stealth buff won’t help it.
D/D: D/D thief still has stealth and evades. The time you can run 25/30/15/0/0 with zerker gear is over. You have to invest something more in defenses.

1. Stealth isn’t the only defense you have. You have LOADS of evades packed in pretty much every weapon set, plus the best endurance management in the game. You have the best disengage capabilities in this game, also.
Stealth is one of the defensive mechanic and it is fine as it is.

2. So what? Any set x/D set can permastealth.

3. It is just one second. Is it really hard to get used to?

4. The burst damage isn’t gone. It was reduced to be reasonable.

5. Man, have you ever seen any video of an acrobatic thief? That is really unkillable, not the guardian.

SoLeciTO.3490:

I will be more clear then, because i can see you dont understand.

P/D: This build needs to constantly stealth for the Sneak Attack, its main bleed attack (actually the only one that really stacks bleed)

D/D: GC thieves now are really bad in SPVP, they die really fast because we have no denfense or health, any other profession can easily kill you in 3 seconds.

General:

1.- Stealth is the only real defense we have, evading works only with 1 build S/D and we still get a lot of damage because of our abd defense and low health.

2.- P/D the only one that can permastealth will not permastealth in SPVP because they need to cap, but we really need our defense mechanic back to scape to the 3mx3m fight area in SPVP.

3.- The difference between WvW and SPVP in the revelaed time is anoying, because is hard to get use to the timming differences (i already learn this but for most is anoying).

4.- Now we dont have mug, the burst damage we had is gone, there is no reason to be scare for a backstab now because is not that strong anyways.

5.- Other classes recieve greate things, like a guardian, virtually imposible to kill if they go full tank, and we dont complain, is his roll and i love that, but what do we have FOR SPVP?.

And there are more reasons but i know only that people that plays thief will understand.

1) Positioning is and should be way more important then stealth when in a fight.
2) If your fighting 3v3 then refer to point #1. You need to position better to be effective in the fight, not worry about your escape route if things go bad. (Also shouldnt need perma stealth to disengage something)
3) PvP != the rest of the game, thats just a fact
4) There are still other burst builds, you shouldnt have to rely on a single skill to be the way to kill someone
5) This is just laughable. Guardian was already pretty balanced and the update did not change that fact.

Based on your comments about an engi playing turrets being strong, you are either not tPvPing or you are very new (as that build would get demolished in high level play). Almost everything you mention you need stealth for in PvP you dont, its so much more about positioning so Im sorry to say this really sounds like a learn to play argument. Just because other classes get buffs does not mean Thief gets one just because… thats called power creep and is very very bad long term for the game.

Rance Webster.2635:

but you didn’t give any good reason to bring revealed back to 3 seconds in terms of gameplay

4 sec revealed break rotation
p/d – only bleed condition damage (4/3 sec = 80%/100% damage)
s/d – nerf 3 sec dazed and 4 sec revealed completely destroy auto attack chain
d/x – so so
JonathanSharp:
Thieves are the masters of mobility, stealth and high single target damage. They can be very fragile if you counter their stealth with area of effects or large stacks of conditions, but they trade this fragility in order to have some of the highest burst damage in the game. They are able to help allies through traps, venoms and the mobility to flank most encounters..

now thief single target damage<<<<<mesmer/warrior/ele aoe damage<<<<condition damage

Speaking of an acrobatic thief, is there a build for one? I would like one for my own thief (not fond of stealth that much)

I know how to play my thief, don’t assume things you dont know.

P/D needs a reworks i agree but a greate way to start it will be having more access to sneak attack the only real attack this set has.

About positioning, god man don’t mix things, we need to be out stealth and in the area to cap, that makes very very vulnerable to a thief with no denfense or health.

And don’t exaggerate the evasion build, i also saw the video of this thief against 2 bad players winning easily.

If you play the evasion build you will see for real how much damage you get anyways.

I’am not saying we are the underdog of the game.
I’am not saying i want a buff because i cant kill anyone.

The only thing i say is that there is no reason to have 4 seconds revealed . . . if there is please let me know.

SoLeciTO.3490:

I know how to play my thief, don’t assume things you dont know.

P/D needs a reworks i agree but a greate way to start it will be having more access to sneak attack the only real attack this set has.

About positioning, god man don’t mix things, we need to be out stealth and in the area to cap, that makes very very vulnerable to a thief with no denfense or health.

And don’t exaggerate the evasion build, i also saw the video of this thief against 2 bad players winning easily.

If you play the evasion build you will see for real how much damage you get anyways.

I’am not saying we are the underdog of the game.
I’am not saying i want a buff because i cant kill anyone.

The only thing i say is that there is no reason to have 4 seconds revealed . . . if there is please let me know.

There is a reason. This reason is just to force bad thieves to turn their brain on and to not use the following rotation: CnD->Backstab->autoattack chain->CnD->…. so that autoattack works as a “revealed is over” warning.

Also, to avoid the stupid CnD+Tactical Strike combo every 3 seconds.
Also, to avoid to backstab someone every 3s.

There are tons of reason revealed is on 4s.

Marduh.4603:

now thief single target damage<<<<<mesmer/warrior/ele aoe damage<<<<condition damage

This is a completely senseless statement.
Thieves can still destroy someone just spamming HS when he’s below 50% health.
Name me a skill that hits harder and is more reliable than HS.

SoLeciTO.3490:

I know how to play my thief, don’t assume things you dont know.

P/D needs a reworks i agree but a greate way to start it will be having more access to sneak attack the only real attack this set has.

About positioning, god man don’t mix things, we need to be out stealth and in the area to cap, that makes very very vulnerable to a thief with no denfense or health.

And don’t exaggerate the evasion build, i also saw the video of this thief against 2 bad players winning easily.

If you play the evasion build you will see for real how much damage you get anyways.

I’am not saying we are the underdog of the game.
I’am not saying i want a buff because i cant kill anyone.

The only thing i say is that there is no reason to have 4 seconds revealed . . . if there is please let me know.

Why are you by yourself capping in the first place? Your a roamer, you should decap and out unless you know the number advantage everywhere and in both cases you dont need stealth because you’ll be alone.

There is a reason high level teams still bring a thief and thats because they are still effective. Just because you can no longer be in stealth and 1 hit a man down does not mean it needs a buff again to make the class effective. So sorry that bringing Thief on par with most every other class made it harder for you to face roll…

Also – I will continue to assume as you havent shown you know tPvP as a whole. You may know YOUR class but you clearly dont know other classes (BM Ranger and Turret Engi?! Really?!?!) and without that knowledge there is no way you can logically make an argument that your class needs a buff to compensate something.

Authority.6145:

The problem is with condi removal.

My experience right now tells me that what they need to do is

a.Reduce Hide in the Shadows to 20 seconds and put “remove 3 conditions” or have Withdraw remove 2 conditions.
b.Shadow Refuge needs to grant the thief stability

I honestly think that the change with the reveal in TPvP should stay because stealth-backstab, stealth-backstab without the enemy being able to track down where is the thief was absurd.

Yeah, obviously the answer is stealth needs to be stronger!