Guild Wars 2

Well, Phantaram had a solid post about necromancers. I think it’s about time someone actually speaks up for the rangers who actually plays a ranger.

In the past 3 metas for a ranger nothing has really changed. The first meta was traps where we lay down our traps, wait, and lay down more traps. The second meta was beastmaster where we evade spam and let our pet and conditions kill over time. The third meta is spirits where we essentially play the same as the beastmaster. We wait until the enemy gets within our aoe range and spam our spirit buttons. The only difference between this and beastmaster is that the ranger does a bit more damage through sun spirit, buffs allies, and no longer has any “burst” through the pet (for the most part) but instead replaces that lack of pet DPS with storm spirit (3k aoe non-crit).

Many players believe ranger has a very low skill floor because with either s/t, sb, or a/d with energy sigils (that is 7 dodges in a row, with LR that is about 9, with runes of the adventure its about 11 or 12). When a ranger procs a 3s burn every 6s, with a pet that hits for 700-1k autoattacks, and a storm spirit that hits for 3k (potentially twice from active and on death) then the ranger can dish out a good amount of damage while remaining tanky. However, it is not the damage:survivability ratio that is what makes rangers considered OP and easy to play. It is the evade spam. With a minimum of 7 dodges in a row its pretty hard to die and since people stand on point to try to kill the point holder it is very easy to have the pet/spirit/condis take them down. If the ranger wants even more “training wheels” then he/she can bring shaman amulet and say dwayna runes to get permanent regen going on the side and more toughness too.

Sadly, ranger is forced into this. We NEED condition removal so we have to trait 30 into our toughness/condition damage line. Then it becomes a waste to do anything besides be tanky and still dish out as much condition damage as we can. There are ranger power builds that can kill spirit rangers but they do require a lot more skill than the spirit ranger. If one mistake is made then the power ranger will die. Not to mention, if the ranger is traited into healing power and has a shaman amulet then the damage from the power ranger will never be enough to kill them because of the evade spam. Since the damage just isn’t there for power builds and the name of the game is to outlast and hold we have no choice but to use condition damage and our condition weapons which have evades built into them.

We lack the damage to do anything besides condition damage. But at the same time we don’t. When my autoattacks hit for 3-4k on a shatter mesmer or a thief from 1500 range then I think i’m doing alright. When I get moment of clarity to proc and I hit for an 8k maul then I think i’m doing alright. However, once I’m not at max range and I’m forced to stop autoattacking my DPS goes down. If the enemy has protection, toughness, or regen then I won’t kill them unless I get them stunlocked for about 8s first.

We lack strong traits to do anything besides tank and condis. Power damage just isn’t there for being that glassy, pets don’t do a considerable more amount of damage if traited into BM anymore, and traps are so easily walked out of. Our only good utilities are, lightning reflexes, signet of renewal, storm spirit, and sun spirit. We can’t run another viable build.

I don’t really think there are many ranger’s out there that have dared to run anything besides the FOTM. But if there are. Got any ideas?

I dunno, spvp is so easy to change class. they probably base buffs/nerf depending on the numbers playing each class. If a class is at the bottom of usage buff it if its at the top nerf etc. Considering people flock to “OP” classes this is a simple way of managing the classes. I think people on this forum really analyse too much with a few to buffing thier chosen class instead of trying to make the best use out of what they have.

Nikasaur.4713:

I dunno, spvp is so easy to change class. they probably base buffs/nerf depending on the numbers playing each class. If a class is at the bottom of usage buff it if its at the top nerf etc. Considering people flock to “OP” classes this is a simple way of managing the classes. I think people on this forum really analyse too much with a few to buffing thier chosen class instead of trying to make the best use out of what they have.

I’m not saying buff the ranger. I’m saying nerf the evade spam and then buff the ranger. Seems like you think people should just play the OP spec and people shouldn’t need skill to be good?

Expand the control a ranger has over the pet’s abilities. This has been said many times, but the only response is that they don’t want you to have to micro-manage the pet. The problem is a design flaw with the profession. You’re punished for having a pet, as they account for a percentage of your damage and utitility, but you have very little control over it to promote skillful play.

I run this,its still spirit based but it does power dmg and not cond….using storm spirit-drakes F2-Axe5 can do pretty big aoe burst.

It was a problem before cause i had to go meele to make spirits active hit but now with the stealth in Longbow i can engange more easy..also im a moving dmg boost for everyone…Sun spirit may seem odd but pets are getting too much benefit of it,the mights i stack on me are shared with pets and through Companions might i can stack even more..I pushed condition dmg into pets and i do the Power dmg..My average Rapid fire does like 7-8k dmg and my autohits 2k-3k on crits.Its glassy but forgiving,stealth in longbow and sword2 can build some distance to avoid bad situations….

http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-Fo-F7;0wEFv-n23Ek-0;9-8c;2T9T;20494;036A;1S-k0S;1CoF2CoF25BG

Pyriall.5027:

Expand the control a ranger has over the pet’s abilities. This has been said many times, but the only response is that they don’t want you to have to micro-manage the pet. The problem is a design flaw with the profession. You’re punished for having a pet, as they account for a percentage of your damage and utitility, but you have very little control over it to promote skillful play.

Which is funny because those of us that know our pets are aware that skill “4” is the first skill they want to use. That means with good F3, F1 control we can micro manage our pet to get them to do what we want. Sadly, it is way more difficult than if I could just hit a key or something for the kd instead of F1, F3, F1, F3, F1, ok now I want the kd so I won’t press F3 to stop the cast.

Things like hit bash and moment of clarity are great ways to have damage based on the player’s skill that can be evaded/countered. The pets hit hard not because the ranger moved some traits around but because they actively did something. Problem is that skills like that are not what the ranger is based on. The shortbow also gives the ranger the image of an autoattack class. I don’t know what anet was thinking making the auto attack as strong as the other skills (use to be more). How about nerf the auto a bit and make crippling a 4 stack of bleed and make quick,crippling and concussion do like (50,50,100)% more damage. Make the damage about landing skills.

Dardamaniac.1295:

I run this,its still spirit based but it does power dmg and not cond….using storm spirit-drakes F2-Axe5 can do pretty big aoe burst.

It was a problem before cause i had to go meele to make spirits active hit but now with the stealth in Longbow i can engange more easy..also im a moving dmg boost for everyone…Sun spirit may seem odd but pets are getting too much benefit of it,the mights i stack on me are shared with pets and through Companions might i can stack even more..I pushed condition dmg into pets and i do the Power dmg..My average Rapid fire does like 7-8k dmg and my autohits 2k-3k on crits.Its glassy but forgiving,stealth in longbow and sword2 can build some distance to avoid bad situations….

http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-Fo-F7;0wEFv-n23Ek-0;9-8c;2T9T;20494;036A;1S-k0S;1CoF2CoF25BG

Then along came a necro….

Eurantien.4632:

Dardamaniac.1295:

I run this,its still spirit based but it does power dmg and not cond….using storm spirit-drakes F2-Axe5 can do pretty big aoe burst.

It was a problem before cause i had to go meele to make spirits active hit but now with the stealth in Longbow i can engange more easy..also im a moving dmg boost for everyone…Sun spirit may seem odd but pets are getting too much benefit of it,the mights i stack on me are shared with pets and through Companions might i can stack even more..I pushed condition dmg into pets and i do the Power dmg..My average Rapid fire does like 7-8k dmg and my autohits 2k-3k on crits.Its glassy but forgiving,stealth in longbow and sword2 can build some distance to avoid bad situations….

http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-Fo-F7;0wEFv-n23Ek-0;9-8c;2T9T;20494;036A;1S-k0S;1CoF2CoF25BG

Then along came a necro….

Try it,im not a top player and i cant test it on good necros.. :/ im just using it in yoloq and having fun….

Nikkle.4013:

Things like hit bash and moment of clarity are great ways to have damage based on the player’s skill that can be evaded/countered. The pets hit hard not because the ranger moved some traits around but because they actively did something. Problem is that skills like that are not what the ranger is based on. The shortbow also gives the ranger the image of an autoattack class. I don’t know what anet was thinking making the auto attack as strong as the other skills (use to be more). How about nerf the auto a bit and make crippling a 4 stack of bleed and make quick,crippling and concussion do like (50,50,100)% more damage. Make the damage about landing skills.

I agree. The only skillful build I’ve ever felt on ranger was my BM Lb/Gs double raven spec. Sure my pet did good damage on its own but no one would ever have died if i didn’t have to snare with muddyterrain, F2, then follow that with a pet swap → GS stun (good positioning needed) → F2. However, it had to be after they used up their dodges/stunbreaks or else they could get away. Builds with strong CC have been the only ones where I have felt skill was required.

Dardamaniac.1295:

Eurantien.4632:

Dardamaniac.1295:

I run this,its still spirit based but it does power dmg and not cond….using storm spirit-drakes F2-Axe5 can do pretty big aoe burst.

It was a problem before cause i had to go meele to make spirits active hit but now with the stealth in Longbow i can engange more easy..also im a moving dmg boost for everyone…Sun spirit may seem odd but pets are getting too much benefit of it,the mights i stack on me are shared with pets and through Companions might i can stack even more..I pushed condition dmg into pets and i do the Power dmg..My average Rapid fire does like 7-8k dmg and my autohits 2k-3k on crits.Its glassy but forgiving,stealth in longbow and sword2 can build some distance to avoid bad situations….

http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-Fo-F7;0wEFv-n23Ek-0;9-8c;2T9T;20494;036A;1S-k0S;1CoF2CoF25BG

Then along came a necro….

Try it,im not a top player and i cant test it on good necros.. :/ im just using it in yoloq and having fun….

It’s just not gonna work man, sure it’s good at a range but once something starts training you, unless your on top of the CT and can position yourself well and get your pets to fear people off the edge, or cc off the edge, or get really good peels. Once you get an ele, a stunlock warrior, or a necro on you it’s over. Have no stunbreak and no stability. Sure, a good blind and a good knockback might keep you alive for awhile but the counter damage won’t be there. That doesn’t include the only condi removal is healing spring which is like 6 condis over 15 seconds and maybe your elite but if you are in a necro fear chain with no stunbreak and no condi removal then you won’t be in that healing spring for long and won’t be in control long enough to get that spirit elite up.

I’ve said this is a thread on the ranger forum that we need condi removal in other areas besides Wilderness Survival. That line is very strong but the rest are lackluster. I talk about some of it here: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/ranger/The-Ranger-Problem-PvP/first#post2462140

R E F L H E X wanted me to post this since he/she cannot:

What do you think about a real “camoflauge” for rangers > stealth. Just a basic idea.a camoflauge that worked similar to the gw1 lightning reflexes. basically the idea is something like replace all ranger stealths with camoflauge it reads : Blocks x% of attacks and attacks x% faster for x seconds, also, makes you blend into the environment and become harder to see. However before they would get something like this a small hit on the spirit rangers to not make them even stronger defensively would be nice. that type of camoflauge should help bring diversity a little it’d help the offensive type rangers out.

Last I checked, if your pet dies and your abilities from the spirits were still on cooldown (having used them) they didn’t go off a second time.

All the on death trait does for Spirits is insure you use the abilities automatically if you haven’t already used them.

So there is no real way to pop someone with the Call of Lightning, then have the pet die right afterward and pop it again.

Now I haven’t tested it since last patch, so maybe they changed it, but before the recent patch I tested it and that’s how it worked in PVE.

I don’t really have much to say. I’ve thought and thought about it. The evades are awesome especially in WvW. But in tPvP on small maps with conquest they just seem a bit OP and unskillful. Ironically, the only maps where evade spam tanky ranger isn’t good is temple of the silent storm, spirit watch, and skyhammer. Those are my favorite maps because there seems to be more skill involved. They all have spots where well timed knockbacks can win battles instead of just outlasting. Sure, it’s a completely different game and they all require a different meta than what I refer to as the “old” maps. Sadly, the community has rejected these maps and they are no longer in tourney rotation. Temple has yet to be in an official tourney yet it is a great map. I don’t really see what is wrong with spirit watch. Skyhammer just needs a dodgeable cannon. Actually, I think these maps would completely change the meta (except for s/d thief) in terms of “cheezy” builds (yes, i am aware skyhammer has its own cheez… but at least that felt like more skill than spam).

Xsorus.2507:

Last I checked, if your pet dies and your abilities from the spirits were still on cooldown (having used them) they didn’t go off a second time.

All the on death trait does for Spirits is insure you use the abilities automatically if you haven’t already used them.

So there is no real way to pop someone with the Call of Lightning, then have the pet die right afterward and pop it again.

Now I haven’t tested it since last patch, so maybe they changed it, but before the recent patch I tested it and that’s how it worked in PVE.

With the trait, even if on CD, the active will trigger again on death. I’m pretty sure it has always been this way… but i’m not certain so you could be right. However, at this point in time they will trigger on death even if the active is on CD. I just tested it.

Then it has changed, or it works that way in SPVP only.

I’ll sign on and test it in PVE again.

Its been changed alright, its now working in PVE.

That makes me wonder if that’s what has caused the uptick in Spirit Ranger complaints, so a little over a month ago, it wasn’t going off twice like that.

Too much of ranger success is in uncontrolled AI.
Not to say that the pet needs to go away, they need more control of the pet. OP, UP whatever bottom line the more control you give rangers of the pet, the better you control ranger success as the dev.

ensoriki.5789:

Too much of ranger success is in uncontrolled AI.
It’s not that the pet needs to go away, they need more control of the pet. OP, UP whatever bottom line the more control you give rangers of the pet, the better you control ranger success as the dev.

I don’t understand this. Ranger success comes from uncontrolled AI? The better the ranger the better he/she controls that AI. The more control the ranger gets the stronger the ranger will become.

Eurantien.4632:

ensoriki.5789:

Too much of ranger success is in uncontrolled AI.
It’s not that the pet needs to go away, they need more control of the pet. OP, UP whatever bottom line the more control you give rangers of the pet, the better you control ranger success as the dev.

I don’t understand this. Ranger success comes from uncontrolled AI? The better the ranger the better he/she controls that AI. The more control the ranger gets the stronger the ranger will become.

Let me rephrase it then.
A significant amount of the ranger’s offensive power is inside of the pet itself, which has minimal control options. I rather see the ranger’s offensive power transferred more from the pet to the ranger itself, but for the less power the pet has there would be more control over it.

ensoriki.5789:

Eurantien.4632:

ensoriki.5789:

Too much of ranger success is in uncontrolled AI.
It’s not that the pet needs to go away, they need more control of the pet. OP, UP whatever bottom line the more control you give rangers of the pet, the better you control ranger success as the dev.

I don’t understand this. Ranger success comes from uncontrolled AI? The better the ranger the better he/she controls that AI. The more control the ranger gets the stronger the ranger will become.

Let me rephrase it then.
A significant amount of the ranger’s offensive power is inside of the pet itself, which has minimal control options. I rather see the ranger’s offensive power transferred more from the pet to the ranger itself, but for the less power the pet has there would be more control over it.

Ya, I think a lot of us want that at this point.

Ok I do not currently run spirit meta. I do not even run condition removal(ooo scary right) But I tell you what I am hating. Length of Terror,Knockback,Stun …Cause I feel like a ping pong ball that just bounces around and can not take any actions before I am dead. Stabilty is so important now, and where do we get it? An elite or 1s cast time sigil if specced 30 pts in Marksmanship.
That being said I am enjoying Ranger and feel in it’s current state it is on par with 50% of the other professions Guardian, Warrior, Engineer (50-60%win rate in 1v1 or 2v2 situations vs Thieves,Mesmers,Elementalist,Necromancer (30%-50% win rate) Mesmers and Necromancers being the lowest.(I can accept this due to my lack of condition removal)

I run LB-AX/AX
0/30/0/30/10
Skirmishing II/IX/X
Nature Magic III/VI/XII
Beastmastery III
Cleric Trinkets with Dolyak on armor

Feel free to lead feedback like omg that build sucks or constructive feedback
I find both entertaining

Have you played direct dmg ranger? It was good before and its pretty killer now you can signet of renewal for condi removal. Your post was long winded and lacking focus, but it seemed like you were talking about min maxing (have to do this have to do that). When min/maxing there can be only one the most viable spec in the game seems the pass like the baaa from a sheep mouth where these kids watch a video that tells them how to play and how to spec, but any spec that works for you is a viable one since the combat here is fluid unlike wow most choices situational, and the comment about ai its your choice to run 3 spirits then dodge roll 7-13 times once you enter combat. As fun as that sounds I think I would be playing another class if that’s what i was left with. I am not going to post any of my build as direct dmg is pretty strait forward.

I hate it when people miss use Metagaming = a broad term usually used to define any strategy, action or method used in a game which transcends a prescribed ruleset, uses external factors to affect the game, or goes beyond the supposed limits or environment set by the game. Another definition refers to the game universe outside of the game itself.

whitespirit.9734:

Ok I do not currently run spirit meta. I do not even run condition removal(ooo scary right) But I tell you what I am hating. Length of Terror,Knockback,Stun …Cause I feel like a ping pong ball that just bounces around and can not take any actions before I am dead. Stabilty is so important now, and where do we get it? An elite or 1s cast time sigil if specced 30 pts in Marksmanship.
That being said I am enjoying Ranger and feel in it’s current state it is on par with 50% of the other professions Guardian, Warrior, Engineer (50-60%win rate in 1v1 or 2v2 situations vs Thieves,Mesmers,Elementalist,Necromancer (30%-50% win rate) Mesmers and Necromancers being the lowest.(I can accept this due to my lack of condition removal)

I run LB-AX/AX
0/30/0/30/10
Skirmishing II/IX/X
Nature Magic III/VI/XII
Beastmastery III
Cleric Trinkets with Dolyak on armor

Feel free to lead feedback like omg that build sucks or constructive feedback
I find both entertaining

You already know, doesn’t have the condi removal or the evade spam. The sustain/dmg just isn’t there your team.

I’ve mainly played a Necro to rank 51, but I also enjoy switching to my Ranger too.

Nothing you said is technically wrong about the evade spam, but I think you just need to look at things in perspective.

This game has ZERO gear gap and you can changed EVERYTHING on the fly. You don’t need to farm new gear, pay for respecs, or do any leveling to change classes.

It’s actually an amazing MMO for anyone who likes to just PvP.

With that said…instead of asking for a Ranger to be homogenized to be like other classes, you should embrace the evade playstyle and strength of your class.

It’s much like playing a Necro and relying heavily on Fear for your defense (and offense).

If you don’t like the evade play style, just play one of the other professions that are more suited to what you feel like playing.

Once I did this myself, I realized the genius of the game and appreciate it much more than the minor quibbles.

Thesilentflute.8761:

Have you played direct dmg ranger? It was good before and its pretty killer now you can signet of renewal for condi removal. Your post was long winded and lacking focus, but it seemed like you were talking about min maxing (have to do this have to do that). When min/maxing there can be only one the most viable spec in the game seems the pass like the baaa from a sheep mouth where these kids watch a video that tells them how to play and how to spec, but any spec that works for you is a viable one since the combat here is fluid unlike wow most choices situational, and the comment about ai its your choice to run 3 spirits then dodge roll 7-13 times once you enter combat. As fun as that sounds I think I would be playing another class if that’s what i was left with. I am not going to post any of my build as direct dmg is pretty strait forward.

I hate it when people miss use Metagaming = a broad term usually used to define any strategy, action or method used in a game which transcends a prescribed ruleset, uses external factors to affect the game, or goes beyond the supposed limits or environment set by the game. Another definition refers to the game universe outside of the game itself.

I have played zerker ranger. I believe I am the ONLY ranger to do so at a level considered to be TOP by the community. What I am saying is that the only viable build is one with WS and evade spams. That isn’t how it should be. Against a good ele there is nothing a zerker ranger can do because the damage isn’t enough and there is no way to get away. The ranger needs either more get aways or more damage if going to be able to handle every situation and be considered “viable”.

The change in hunters shot drops target to your pet every 9s not saying that it allows you do to enough dmg against a bunk ele, but it does increase def.

I run like 5 poisons to counter bunkers doesn’t always work though.

Edit: re written so some words used were not kitten???

I agree…I don’t player ranger often but their are a lot of cons it seems. Longbow seems very clunky an has no flow. I would love to see some more builds ( power) open up. I don’t think ranger fits the mold that Anet had made for it very well.

Eurantien.4632:

Well, Phantaram had a solid post about necromancers. I think it’s about time someone actually speaks up for the rangers who actually plays a ranger.

In the past 3 metas for a ranger nothing has really changed. The first meta was traps where we lay down our traps, wait, and lay down more traps. The second meta was beastmaster where we evade spam and let our pet and conditions kill over time. The third meta is spirits where we essentially play the same as the beastmaster. We wait until the enemy gets within our aoe range and spam our spirit buttons. The only difference between this and beastmaster is that the ranger does a bit more damage through sun spirit, buffs allies, and no longer has any “burst” through the pet (for the most part) but instead replaces that lack of pet DPS with storm spirit (3k aoe non-crit).

Many players believe ranger has a very low skill floor because with either s/t, sb, or a/d with energy sigils (that is 7 dodges in a row, with LR that is about 9, with runes of the adventure its about 11 or 12). When a ranger procs a 3s burn every 6s, with a pet that hits for 700-1k autoattacks, and a storm spirit that hits for 3k (potentially twice from active and on death) then the ranger can dish out a good amount of damage while remaining tanky. However, it is not the damage:survivability ratio that is what makes rangers considered OP and easy to play. It is the evade spam. With a minimum of 7 dodges in a row its pretty hard to die and since people stand on point to try to kill the point holder it is very easy to have the pet/spirit/condis take them down. If the ranger wants even more “training wheels” then he/she can bring shaman amulet and say dwayna runes to get permanent regen going on the side and more toughness too.

Sadly, ranger is forced into this. We NEED condition removal so we have to trait 30 into our toughness/condition damage line. Then it becomes a waste to do anything besides be tanky and still dish out as much condition damage as we can. There are ranger power builds that can kill spirit rangers but they do require a lot more skill than the spirit ranger. If one mistake is made then the power ranger will die. Not to mention, if the ranger is traited into healing power and has a shaman amulet then the damage from the power ranger will never be enough to kill them because of the evade spam. Since the damage just isn’t there for power builds and the name of the game is to outlast and hold we have no choice but to use condition damage and our condition weapons which have evades built into them.

We lack the damage to do anything besides condition damage. But at the same time we don’t. When my autoattacks hit for 3-4k on a shatter mesmer or a thief from 1500 range then I think i’m doing alright. When I get moment of clarity to proc and I hit for an 8k maul then I think i’m doing alright. However, once I’m not at max range and I’m forced to stop autoattacking my DPS goes down. If the enemy has protection, toughness, or regen then I won’t kill them unless I get them stunlocked for about 8s first.

We lack strong traits to do anything besides tank and condis. Power damage just isn’t there for being that glassy, pets don’t do a considerable more amount of damage if traited into BM anymore, and traps are so easily walked out of. Our only good utilities are, lightning reflexes, signet of renewal, storm spirit, and sun spirit. We can’t run another viable build.

I don’t really think there are many ranger’s out there that have dared to run anything besides the FOTM. But if there are. Got any ideas?

miss the constructive part..

your counting on evades is incorrect and false. all has a cooldown.. just that u can spam then in 2 seconds mean u can fight then without. calculate that for a minute and we can maybe talk.

if u want see spam take a look at s/d thiefs. there a plenty of duel vids, where the guy just spams evades.

Long bows 1 skill a bit clunky cause it counter intuitive it should do more dmg the closer you are not farther. It has that great knockback and the change in hunters shot allows a hunter to go melee when ever they choose instead of having to wait till the target comes to you. s/d

Eurantien.4632:

Dardamaniac.1295:

Eurantien.4632:

Dardamaniac.1295:

I run this,its still spirit based but it does power dmg and not cond….using storm spirit-drakes F2-Axe5 can do pretty big aoe burst.

It was a problem before cause i had to go meele to make spirits active hit but now with the stealth in Longbow i can engange more easy..also im a moving dmg boost for everyone…Sun spirit may seem odd but pets are getting too much benefit of it,the mights i stack on me are shared with pets and through Companions might i can stack even more..I pushed condition dmg into pets and i do the Power dmg..My average Rapid fire does like 7-8k dmg and my autohits 2k-3k on crits.Its glassy but forgiving,stealth in longbow and sword2 can build some distance to avoid bad situations….

http://intothemists.com/calc/?build=-Fo-F7;0wEFv-n23Ek-0;9-8c;2T9T;20494;036A;1S-k0S;1CoF2CoF25BG

Then along came a necro….

Try it,im not a top player and i cant test it on good necros.. :/ im just using it in yoloq and having fun….

It’s just not gonna work man, sure it’s good at a range but once something starts training you, unless your on top of the CT and can position yourself well and get your pets to fear people off the edge, or cc off the edge, or get really good peels. Once you get an ele, a stunlock warrior, or a necro on you it’s over. Have no stunbreak and no stability. Sure, a good blind and a good knockback might keep you alive for awhile but the counter damage won’t be there. That doesn’t include the only condi removal is healing spring which is like 6 condis over 15 seconds and maybe your elite but if you are in a necro fear chain with no stunbreak and no condi removal then you won’t be in that healing spring for long and won’t be in control long enough to get that spirit elite up.

I’ve said this is a thread on the ranger forum that we need condi removal in other areas besides Wilderness Survival. That line is very strong but the rest are lackluster. I talk about some of it here: https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/professions/ranger/The-Ranger-Problem-PvP/first#post2462140

Ive seen your thread and ive comment my opinion..I agree with you…Still tho i believe that GW2 is more complex than we think.Even the top players are pretty fresh in this game..Its not like LoL that many things have been tested through countless of tournaments and stuff.

I strongly believe that there is a Zerker Ranger build waiting to be discovered.

Sure will have some weakness,every build have pros and cons,its just that right now we are forced to build with a current meta in the back of our heads.Some roles have been there for a long time.What if the meta needed someone that can unload dmg from 1500 range,and was so vital that didnt matter if became oneshooted?What if meta needed no Guardian bunking mid?What if teams found out that 3 strong ranged power classes is the counter to Necros?(im not saying,just geussing).

In my small experience in competitive games ive seen a lot of strategies changing just because someone discover something that was there from the start..