Guild Wars 2

Archaon.6245:

Stealth.9324:

If they don’t dodge the leap,they will eat a full dam of Blurred Frenzy coming up,full dams Frenzy take like 1/3 of our Health to say the least. And if they use stun break,congratulation,he just have 1 less survival in his disposal tool

so 2 more ready up…not that bad considering you also have a whole bar of low cd healing/survival skills, kd, cc, a kittenload of protective boons and so on…you used one stunbreak you poor ele, how can you fight with just everything else considering that if you used a stunbreak it means that your opponent wasted something too, and probably more than you? And maybe he doesn’t have 20 weapons skills…just saying…

Talking about tpvp eles obviously, i don’t consider those straight from hot join who blow a mistform if you just run towards them…lol…they’re just free kills for pretty much everyone, except, maybe, a warrior…

Ah no,sorry we don’t have low Cd of everything.Cleansing Wave Cd is 35s CD and 32s CD if traited. All the cantrip is long CD too,mist form like 60s and armor of earth is 90s.Flash is on 36 s but honestly,what Flash does for you???Blurred Frenzy on Mesmer I believe it is like 15s CD,more or less.Do u see the huge difference.Maybe all other class don’t have 20 weapon skill but they can choose to stay at range or melee at will every 10s. Eles never have that choice,once u use D/D,u are forced to meele until dead.And they share Global cool down 0.5 s bf we can switch attunment as well as it takes 9s to gain access to the attunement we switch out for.During that interval,we are locked out all the skill on that attunment.

I don’t know but base on all ur opinion so far regarding Eles, it is safe for me to assume you NEVER play an Eles,not against . My advice is to roll one and understand the mechanic of the class.I am Kaane Moka in game,if you need some training,I will gladly to help,given u are good listener,open mind,and no more Elea is Op this,Op that.

cheer

The majority of posts about Ele being OP vastly exaggerate what a good ele can do. There is one specific Ele build that is slightly OP for tpvp w/ organized teams – that is the 0/0/10/30/30 build with clerics. This is the build that gives you 4 cantrips (the extra one from the armor of earth trait) and bunkers extremely well. The thing that is OP about this build is that it is also very mobile. This isn’t to say that bunker ele has no counters — it dies to high-pressure damage or conditions (HGH engy or condition necro), but then again so does every other bunker build.

My problem with the “ele is OP” posts is that people start conflating this one OP build with every other ele build. Suddenly people are talking about how this unkillable bunker ele is also giving perma fury/swiftness to their team with Zephyr’s Boon or that it’s doing high burst damage w/ arcane wave+blast. My fear is that A.net will nerf eles globally rather than target this specific bunker build.

Another common fallacy with the “Ele is OP” posts is that people refuse to change their builds. The most common example is this: A shantasm or even typical shatter mesmer build can defeat an ele 1v1 IF you are willing to forgo illusion of life. But people automatically dismiss this build as “not viable for tpvp.” This argument is misconceived — the fact that the build trades team support for enough 1v1 staying power to chase off an ele doesn’t diminish its viability. You are simply changing the mesmer’s role from team support to more of a bunker-buster.

Then we get the typical Ride-the-lightning complaints, which typicaly involve someone saying “I beat up the ele and he runs away, only to return and heal to full and we repeat this process all match.” I find this argument unpersuasive because, it seems to me, if you’re controlling the point then you’re winning. It doesn’t matter whether you control it by stomping the ele or by running him off repeatedly. In either case, your team is getting the points from the CP.

Anyway, I think the most important thing when talking about Ele balance is to really narrow down the specific OP build. That way we can come up with solutions that target that specific build without destroying all the other ele builds. I personally like others’ suggestions about increasing the ele’s base healing values on trident and cleansing wave while REDUCING the healing coefficient. This improves the viabilty of ele DPS builds while drastically reducing the sustain on Ele bunkers, which rely almost completely on spamming those two skills (namely, constantly cleansing wave via dodge roll, water attune, and dagger 5) to stay alive.

It is because as with many other classes their base dmg is higher than other classes and that combined with the broken scaling of bunker stats make a super high dmg tank. other classes that show the same are trap rangers, minion/well necro, thief, engi and mesmer.

Most if not all the issues are because of the broken scaling of bunker stats, its the reason people run around in a huge ball in wvw cause aoe doesn’t melt them its the reason that you see 5 bunker builds in tpvp it all equates to: The base defensive stats do not = the base offensive stats!!!

this can be fixed 2 ways

A. nerf the benefit of bunker stats

B. re-ajust base dmg for every skill in the game.

Thesilentflute.8761:

It is because as with many other classes their base dmg is higher than other classes and that combined with the broken scaling of bunker stats make a super high dmg tank. other classes that show the same are trap rangers, minion/well necro, thief, engi and mesmer.

Most if not all the issues are because of the broken scaling of bunker stats, its the reason people run around in a huge ball in wvw cause aoe doesn’t melt them its the reason that you see 5 bunker builds in tpvp it all equates to: The base defensive stats do not = the base offensive stats!!!

this can be fixed 2 ways

A. nerf the benefit of bunker stats

B. re-ajust base dmg for every skill in the game.

Yes bunkerstats are a problem. I testwise ran a 3.6k armor warrior with 22k health and turtles defense for additional 200 toughness when crippled, chilled or immobilized.
A mesmer burst was really weak against those 3.8k armor while immobilized. It just took 11k…

If anything toughness too weak at the moment. What bunker builds have in common is alot of passive regen (often 2 different kind of regen at the same time), alot, and I mean alot, of small 1~1.5k heals, alot of condi removals (hell and even they struggle against HGH condi engi, which is kinda sad isn’t it) and alot of vigor/prot uptime, and either high stability uptime or alot of stunbreaks.
They also have alot of CC, especially knockbacks, to push people off points.

If all else fails, they also have some invul tools.

If the stats would be the problem, then almost any class in the game could get an clerics amulet and become unkillable. I give you a hint: this is not the case.

ahuba.6430:

Caffynated.5713:

zone.1073:

Because when damage-dealers go all-in on them, they don’t die right away.

I’ve yet to meet a competently played bunker from any class that dies right away 1v1.

And when your whole team focuses them, they don’t die right away.

Only if your team is shockingly bad.

except even if the ele doesnt have all bunker traits and bunker amulet he still outlives everybody. a semi bunker ele can dishout 3/4 k fire 3 and 4, 4/5k fire grab, 7 k churning earth….

No. No, he does not. Glass eles die ridiculously quickly with a max hp of 10k and light armor.

The only thing “OP” about eles is that they bunker well while being more mobile than guardians. However, even now i fail to see that strength as OP. The “OPness” of the build is beyond inflated in people’s minds because bunker guards can push people off the point and keep them from going in – they don’t take the guard’s roles and take it to another level, they do it differently. Eles only get stun and 2 knockdowns total in 4 elements. If you’re saying, ele is op because the bunker doesn’t die in 1v1 situations, well, isn’t that what bunkers are good at? Look at the guardian/ bunker mesmer/engineer/necro. Same situation there. Eles melt faster than guardians under pressure, and can’t out point defense guards/engineers/ struggle against mesmers and necros – which are all very popular builds running in pvp right now.

It also irks me that people mash together rumors and different ele builds’ strengths and talk about it being how the ele is OP overall/ in that one specific build. Let me clear it up:
That build has only moderate mobility. It is more mobile than guards for sure, but it is far from the most mobile thing out there. You cannot run out of many man fights like before the March nerf anymore.
Healing is its greatest strength. Eles CAN heal from 0-100 and perhaps a little more if FULLY GEARED IN HEALING. That sacrifices a lot of dps and maximum tankiness – you run with about 13k hp with that build. In 2v1 fights especially against glasses, you melt very quickly. your dps is also far from the best. Many fights end in draws or end up very extended – but that is the point of a bunker and the ele is good at its role in a 1v1. It cannot, however, hold a point against an engineer or guardian/ better than they can.

Archaon.6245:

Kamata.5762:

Empathetic Fighter.2065:

Kamata.5762:

PistolWraith.6732:

Kamata.5762:

@Ahuba,

its funny cause its not true. Your hate for Eles makes you biased. best 1v1 class lololol.

So burst damage decides the best 1v1 class? The only class which is as good in 1v1 as an elementalist is mesmer with bad mobility, bad sustain and bad aoe.

https://forum-en.gw2archive.eu/forum/pvp/pvp/Analysis-of-Cantrips-Eles/first
Nice analysis of cantrip eles by Symbolic.

Have you ever see me say burst is best? No. Ele is clearly not the best at 1v1. It depends more on the player who is better. Hell, ive been beaten by a warrior in 1v1 once, he was not your typical 100b warrior. Ive been beaten by Eles, I have won from eles, Ive been beaten by Engineers and I have won from them, ivebeen beaten by every class in the game once and I have won from every class in the game.
Its not the class you play against that decides who is better, it is the player.

When a player push the class to the limit, the class is deciding about loosing or winning. On the same level a mesmer will never win against an ele, same with thief and guardian.

You sir, are too biased and illogical. Ofcourse a mesmer can win from an equally good ele. I have an ele friend who is much better than I am. But still, I manage to win often because he made a mistake and I took advantage of it.

You should complain less and practice more. Maybe then your QQ will stop.

Ehm no… 1vs1 with ele as mesmer, if he’s equally skilled, ends with a dead mesmer 90% of the times, once you shattered you have pretty much no dmg to send out (And it’s really easy to evade a shatter if you know just a little how shatter combo works, so pretty much everyone who plays at a decent level) and when it comes to healing and cond removal ele is just 10 times better than mesmers, if you’re a mesmer and you see an ele coming at side for 1vs1 all you have to do is call for backup while hoping that he’s worse than you..not mentioning that if you manage to fight him somehow (And problay your point would be already neutral cause you can’t keep it with someone spamming aoes all over the point) he can just rtl away and come back full hp while you have your healing still on cd and your point still neutral, and when backup finally arrives he can just rtl away going outnumber your team somewhere else in seconds…pretty lame uh?

Who says that every mesmer plays a shatter spec? I can blink an equal range as the ele uses RTL, ill be at his destination before the ele even arrives there. And all I have to do ( if im playing a shatter spec) is leap at him and immobilize him, and no I dont use it on the most predictable times, I send out my clone to cripple him wait for him to dodge maybe even spawn an iDuelist in the meantime and then leap at him and immobilize him, blurry and shatter while he is immobilized. If the ele uses mist form then ill just wait with the shatters a couple seconds and then shatter them, and since the clones are really close to the ele they will shatter immediately so you really cant see them coming. A good mesmer keeps his clones close to the enemy, not far away. Mesmer is a close combat fighter.

Oh, and I play a retaliation/confusion/tank mesmer. Imagine using your AOE on 3 clones and the mesmer with full time retaliation and chaos armor giving you confusion with almost every hit on EACH clone and mesmer. So your water dagger#2 will be a waste since it will do more damage than heal, #5 means nothing since you will just get the conditions once more if you use an AOE attack, cleansing flames same story. Even an ele has limited healing and condition removal.

Oh, and your armor and protection wont reduce condition damage. =]

zone.1073:

Because when damage-dealers go all-in on them, they don’t die right away. And when your whole team focuses them, they don’t die right away. However, when they decide to fight you back, they effectively set you up to be killed. Some may argue that they’re too effective at what they do.

zone.1073:

I’m obviously referring to Eles who trait deep into Water and Arcana (with remainders in Air and/or Earth traits), use Valkyrie’s amulet, and 1 or 2 Arcane utilities. Of course triple cantrip bunkers don’t, and should not, die right away. This isn’t about Bunkers specifically.

I dunno about you but this is flawless

A glass D/D Ele build ends up surviving more than my toughest Necro, cleanses all of it’s allies of conditions, does nonsensical burst/condition damage -AoE (Better than a Thief)-, heals itself better than any Guardian I’ve ever seen, CCs better than my Necro or my Engineer even when I BUILD for it, can turn invincible to stomp and res at any time MULTIPLE times, has access to an endless supply of boons and cleanses, and has better mobility/escape power than a pure stealth thief.

Sure, and people need to ask why people think Ele D/D is OP.

I just watched 2 D/D Elementalists kill 5 players in a time span of 13 seconds in tPvP, out of those 5 players:
2 Guardian bunkers/support
1 Necro in Lich form
1 Shatter Mesmer
1 Engineer (and all of his turrets)

It’s to the point to where every server I join has atleast 1 Elementalist, or as many as 4. They’re overpowered in every single map, but shine most specifically in both Temple of the Silent Storm and Spirit Watch.

Whenever I see an Elementalist, it makes me physically ill. I actually cheer and compliment any staff Elementalist I come across, and thank them for not being one of the ten thousand OP generic D/D abusers I’ve met. Whenever I actually kill an Elementalist by pure luck, I feel like I ran a Marathon and won 12 Olympic Gold Medals by pole vaulting on my peen over a 20 foot tall mound of CRAP that happens to be my current class. (Necro)

After reading all of the above, take a look at my Necro in comparison, I can’t even do 1/10th of the things other classes can do, let alone Elementalist… then look at warrior… good lord.

Warrior looks like a tiny spec of kitten particle compared to the monolithic D/D Elementalist.

Yet the developers do nothing to fix Necro (not just in balance), Warrior, Ele, or generally balance the game. This is why many of the veteran players I know left this game for other MMOs.

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

A glass D/D Ele build ends up surviving more than my toughest Necro, cleanses all of it’s allies of conditions, does nonsensical burst/condition damage -AoE-, heals itself better than any Guardian I’ve ever seen, CCs better than my Necro or my Engineer even when I BUILD for it, can turn invincible to stomp and res at any time MULTIPLE times, has access to an endless supply of boons and cleanses, and has better mobility/escape power than a pure stealth thief.

Sure, and people need to ask why people think Ele D/D is OP.

funny cos true

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

A glass D/D Ele build ends up surviving more than my toughest Necro, cleanses all of it’s allies of conditions, does nonsensical burst/condition damage -AoE (Better than a Thief)-, heals itself better than any Guardian I’ve ever seen, CCs better than my Necro or my Engineer even when I BUILD for it, can turn invincible to stomp and res at any time MULTIPLE times, has access to an endless supply of boons and cleanses, and has better mobility/escape power than a pure stealth thief.

Sure, and people need to ask why people think Ele D/D is OP.

I just watched 2 D/D Elementalists kill 5 players in a time span of 13 seconds in tPvP, out of those 5 players:
2 Guardian bunkers/support
1 Necro in Lich form
1 Shatter Mesmer
1 Engineer (and all of his turrets)

It’s to the point to where every server I join has atleast 1 Elementalist, or as many as 4. They’re overpowered in every single map, but shine most specifically in both Temple of the Silent Storm and Spirit Watch.

Whenever I see an Elementalist, it makes me physically ill. I actually cheer and compliment any staff Elementalist I come across, and thank them for not being one of the ten thousand OP generic D/D abusers I’ve met. Whenever I actually kill an Elementalist by pure luck, I feel like I ran a Marathon and won 12 Olympic Gold Medals by pole vaulting on my kitten over a 20 foot tall mound of CRAP that happens to be my current class. (Necro)

After reading all of the above, take a look at my Necro in comparison, I can’t even do 1/10th of the things other classes can do, let alone Elementalist… then look at warrior… good lord.

Warrior looks like a tiny spec of kitten particle compared to the monolithic D/D Elementalist.

Not sure if troll or just very bad at PvP……

Oh really bro? Let’s see your video of you killing 2 semi-competent D/D Elementalists with your hands tied behind your back. Try using conditions. I dare you. I double dare you, try using Necro on a pair of D/D Eles. Or Warrior. Or glass Thief. Or Mesmer.

Ah but of course you couldn’t do that, you love using it too much.

i’m so disappointed that Anet already declared that they’re goin to nerf cantrip ele, we have only one good build. I just hate all the whiners in the comunity that spend more time tiping on the forums than playing, elementalist is not better than mesmer, ranger, necro, engi and guardian.

Mijo.3274:

i’m so disappointed that Anet already declared that they’re goin to nerf cantrip ele, we have only one good build. I just hate all the whiners in the comunity that spend more time tiping on the forums than playing, elementalist is not better than mesmer, ranger, necro, engi and guardian.

Yet another delusional Elementalist thinks his class is balanced with the nonsensical D/D capability. You wouldn’t last 5 minutes using a Warrior against a premade Ele team.

The “Jack of all Trades” is your reason why people see the d/d ele as OP.

E.g. your team needs to change there strati you can’t just go hey engineer go bunker this point with your none bunker build. You can go hey d/d ele we need you to bunker this point, most d/d can as they bunker or hybrid bunker.

Just nerf Might across every class, make might half of what it is now.

Risk = reward.

The ignorance in this game is absolutely hilarious.

-D/D Elementalists are glass burst-

• They have a higher burst than Thief. And it’s AoE.
• Yet they have the survivability of a bunker Guardian
• They have better mobility than a Thief
• They have stronger conditions than a Necromancer.
• They have 4 weapon switches on short cooldowns
• They have the best condition cleanses in the game. And they’re AoE.
• They have the best healing in the game.

It’s OP as hell on paper, and OP as hell ingame.

If we are the jack of all trades, then the Elementalist is the master of everything. Don’t flaunt about your nonexistent knowledge of Necro or Warrior, I play every class and know how each class handles. Elementalist is irrefutably overpowered.

Nerfing Might across the board will accomplish kitten near nothing.

Stealth.9324:

I agree that Eles is in a Good Place but No Where is OP like most people complaining.

@ahuba:
-Best pblank AOE Dam : No comment on this because I think the roles of Eles that Anet want is to soften a number of Mobs for the pt to kill and plus I don’t know any other class that has AOE as many as Eles does. But, since that is our roles and Anet does not give us so many Option for Solo Skil, so we have no choice but to adapt it. The action Anet should be taken is to give other class some AOE, not Nerf AOE dams.

-Best Boons Sharing: Anet has designed Eles to be as Support Role. What else can we do as Support role with no Boon Sharing? And I think Engineer is better on this than us. Except Fury, Might, all of other boons, I believe is not useful in Melee Combat. And yes we need Vigor, Renegeration, Protection because we are LOWEST HP pool AND LOWEST Armor among all

-Best AOE Condition Cleaning: I belive only Water 5 in Dagger, and Water 5 in Staff that ACTUALLY AOE condition Cleaning, and by switching Attunement. Even so, Staff is not as good as Dagger in sPVP. That’s why people play D/D. Cleansing Flame and other Trait only applied to ELES himself. And Yes we do Need Conditon Cleaning because we have the LOWEST HP pool among all. Without it, we are DEAD.

-Best AOE party healing: Most of Eles that spec into 30 in Water which give +300 Healing power, that is why we heal so much. Read of my post about Healing to understand why. And Anet makes Eles as support role, think Eles like Healer in other MMO.

-2nd Best Holding Point: Sorry, I disagree with u on this. On my top list, Guard, and Engineer can do this job Better than ANYBODY. To Hold a Point, you need to stay inside the circle and knock opponent out of Circle, so what do we have? UPDRAFT? That’s it, only Updraft.. While Guard with their Shield Buble knock u down and give no access to the circle, Engine with all the Turret that Immbolize and guarding the Area, Shield 4. So on this matter, Guard and Engineer is the best candidates.

-Best 1vs1 Class: Again, most Eles spec for Bunker which is 0/10/0/30/30. And Bunker means to Survive more than 1+ enemy at anytime given. However, downside is, their Dams is so kitten. And by Kitten, I mean Really Kitten.If u are defeated by an Eles on 1vs1, either he is not Bunker Build or he is a very skill player. Rewarding for being Skillfully play which I find is fair enough. And I think Mesmer is Way Better than us on this matter.

-Mobility: I say Good, not Best. Reason why?Please read my post. Just a kind Reminder, with Lowest Health Pool and Lowest Armor and being Forced to Meelee, how else we can survive except mobility? Even then, all we have is RtL. Why RtL is Good but not Godly, pls read my post again. I am all ear if you have any new Suggestion on that matter.

-Good cd? You mean Crowd Control? Right, all we have is Updraft and Earthquake, what else do we have which you can think of, pls tell?

-Highest Room for Error in any class: Again, most Eles is Bunker Build, Bunker is what I understand you know. I believe EVERY class can do the same IF they spec as Bunker.

And Yes, I see all the patter you given and all of that I have explained on my post………

Yep, thats why ele’s are really, really good. Good summary all in all. Only thing you forgot that I can think of is that they stack. Another best at

Team play ele’s are phenomenal. 1v1 you can’t kill a good ele, they won’t let you. Good, OP….whatever, they are definately a top tier class by a far margin.

ele is one of the reasons i quit afew months back (still check the forums every once and awhile to see if anything has changed)
you’re there enjoying a relatively balanced game and then some ele comes along rolling his face on his keyboard, large heals, large damage, every boon, if you manage to get him low he’ll zip away and 2 seconds later he’s at full hp.
it’s these moments where you say “f%%k this s%%t” and go play a game where the devs care about pvp.

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Epic troll post

10/10

I think the sad part, is that with as exaggerated as your troll was, some people actually claim (and believe) the ele can do all of that and more.

Elementalist is essentially Thief on steroids, when you think about it.

Oh look it’s another Elementalist here to defend his broken build.

I wish I still had the screenshot of a Elementalist doing 9,000+ damage off an AoE, plus a 6 second burn. However, even at that point Elementalists would be going “It’s fiiiiine, you’re exaggerating”

Let’s see, with all of their invulnerability, their amazing healing skill, their armor of the Earth (Multiple access to it), constant regen, best AOE CLEANSING IN THE GAME, constant boon reapplication (making them immune to any stripping or conversion), and then ontop of all of it, they have a metric kitten tonne of escapes.

Sure, I’m ‘exaggerating’ when I say Elementalists have more survivability than a Guardian.

Sure, I’m ‘exaggerating’ when I see a glass D/D Ele murder 3v1 with little to no effort. In tPvP.

Also, scratch that, I was taking you seriously until I saw you were an Elitist know-it-all.

Firstly, I was never crying for Thief or Engineer to be nerfed, only Elementalist. Infact, I was defending Engineer, I only ask that Stealth be nerfed, but the other capabilities of Thief to be buffed to allow for a much more broader range of builds/uses shine through.

Now onto Stealth’s post: I meant tougher as in “More survivable” not actual toughness. Also, if you think Death Shroud brings as much survivability to the table as an Elementalist or Guardian, then I think YOU need to make a Necromancer and play it in PvP.

I for one have used both staff support, and different variations of D/D Ele. I find it highly OP. Granted it has a somewhat high learning curve, it’s still incredibly powerful for what it brings to the table. Also, Necromancers cannot cleanse conditions on teammates with ease. Plague signet is painful to use, and has a high cooldown. Putrid Mark requires your teammates to be standing inside of the circle, but is the only strong support removal we truly have. If you’re going to try and make Necromancers sound better than Elementalists, I’m just going to laugh at you from here on out.

Now, from there on out all your arguments degrade into “Nou” and “ur just bad” to fiercely defend your OP class. I have seen what I have seen, and I have seen Elementalists do kitten things.

Those aren’t lies, all of those things are achievable with build specification, and some are achievable at the same time through hybrids.

It’s hilarious, all I see are Elementalist mainers savagely defending their class from any form of criticism or belief of unbalance… it’s like they’re expecting a inevitable highly necessary nerf of some sort…

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Those aren’t lies, all of those things are achievable with build specification, and some are achievable at the same time through hybrids.

Please show me how, no need to Picture or anything. Just say what build you are and explain why it can HAVE ALL OF that.

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Firstly, I was never crying for Thief or Engineer to be nerfed, only Elementalist. Infact, I was defending Engineer, I only ask that Stealth be nerfed, but the other capabilities of Thief to be buffed to allow for a much more broader range of builds/uses shine through.

---

Now onto Stealth’s post: I meant tougher as in “More survivable” not actual toughness. Also, if you think Death Shroud brings as much survivability to the table as an Elementalist or Guardian, then I think YOU need to make a Necromancer and play it in PvP.

I for one have used both staff support, and different variations of D/D Ele. I find it highly OP. Granted it has a somewhat high learning curve, it’s still incredibly powerful for what it brings to the table. Also, Necromancers cannot cleanse conditions on teammates with ease. Plague signet is painful to use, and has a high cooldown. Putrid Mark requires your teammates to be standing inside of the circle, but is the only strong support removal we truly have. If you’re going to try and make Necromancers sound better than Elementalists, I’m just going to laugh at you from here on out.

Now, from there on out all your arguments degrade into “Nou” and “ur just bad” to fiercely defend your OP class. I have seen what I have seen, and I have seen Elementalists do kitten things.

Oh hey, please read my explain post and tell me why we can have more Survive than your what so called- Toughest Build Necro with 10k health, no Toughness Point and no Second Health Bar.

And Yes, I am playing around with my Necro atm.

kurtdg.2370:

Stealth.9324:

I agree that Eles is in a Good Place but No Where is OP like most people complaining.

@ahuba:
-Best pblank AOE Dam : No comment on this because I think the roles of Eles that Anet want is to soften a number of Mobs for the pt to kill and plus I don’t know any other class that has AOE as many as Eles does. But, since that is our roles and Anet does not give us so many Option for Solo Skil, so we have no choice but to adapt it. The action Anet should be taken is to give other class some AOE, not Nerf AOE dams.

-Best Boons Sharing: Anet has designed Eles to be as Support Role. What else can we do as Support role with no Boon Sharing? And I think Engineer is better on this than us. Except Fury, Might, all of other boons, I believe is not useful in Melee Combat. And yes we need Vigor, Renegeration, Protection because we are LOWEST HP pool AND LOWEST Armor among all

-Best AOE Condition Cleaning: I belive only Water 5 in Dagger, and Water 5 in Staff that ACTUALLY AOE condition Cleaning, and by switching Attunement. Even so, Staff is not as good as Dagger in sPVP. That’s why people play D/D. Cleansing Flame and other Trait only applied to ELES himself. And Yes we do Need Conditon Cleaning because we have the LOWEST HP pool among all. Without it, we are DEAD.

-Best AOE party healing: Most of Eles that spec into 30 in Water which give +300 Healing power, that is why we heal so much. Read of my post about Healing to understand why. And Anet makes Eles as support role, think Eles like Healer in other MMO.

-2nd Best Holding Point: Sorry, I disagree with u on this. On my top list, Guard, and Engineer can do this job Better than ANYBODY. To Hold a Point, you need to stay inside the circle and knock opponent out of Circle, so what do we have? UPDRAFT? That’s it, only Updraft.. While Guard with their Shield Buble knock u down and give no access to the circle, Engine with all the Turret that Immbolize and guarding the Area, Shield 4. So on this matter, Guard and Engineer is the best candidates.

-Best 1vs1 Class: Again, most Eles spec for Bunker which is 0/10/0/30/30. And Bunker means to Survive more than 1+ enemy at anytime given. However, downside is, their Dams is so kitten. And by Kitten, I mean Really Kitten.If u are defeated by an Eles on 1vs1, either he is not Bunker Build or he is a very skill player. Rewarding for being Skillfully play which I find is fair enough. And I think Mesmer is Way Better than us on this matter.

-Mobility: I say Good, not Best. Reason why?Please read my post. Just a kind Reminder, with Lowest Health Pool and Lowest Armor and being Forced to Meelee, how else we can survive except mobility? Even then, all we have is RtL. Why RtL is Good but not Godly, pls read my post again. I am all ear if you have any new Suggestion on that matter.

-Good cd? You mean Crowd Control? Right, all we have is Updraft and Earthquake, what else do we have which you can think of, pls tell?

-Highest Room for Error in any class: Again, most Eles is Bunker Build, Bunker is what I understand you know. I believe EVERY class can do the same IF they spec as Bunker.

And Yes, I see all the patter you given and all of that I have explained on my post………

Yep, thats why ele’s are really, really good. Good summary all in all. Only thing you forgot that I can think of is that they stack. Another best at

Team play ele’s are phenomenal. 1v1 you can’t kill a good ele, they won’t let you. Good, OP….whatever, they are definately a top tier class by a far margin.

Sorry, DID you actually read my post at all? And what stack are we talking about here?Boons or all the Ability they have which I listed?

1vs1, you can not kill a Good Eles because we are BUNKER,most of us. If you can kill a Bunker in 1vs1 Duel, Congratulation, you are better than most people playing Guild War 2 here,or should I say Hail to the King. Let ask a friend of yours play Berserk Eles (who he is experience with Eles) and play 30/30/0/10/0 and then, let me know.

If you have no further constructive idea to contribute rather than that close-mind of your or whatever, please leave as I said in the first post.

Cheer.

Armor of Earth. Mist Form. Constant Regen. Constant Healing. Constant Cleanses. Loads of stun breakers. A bunch of escapes.

How many times have I had to repeat this? ^^^ All of that can be on any build of varying degrees. A full beserk Elementalist can survive for a hell of a lot longer than any of my Necromancers can. Have you ever tried to get a decent condition burst on a good D/D Ele? But of course you’re going to go “ur exaggerating ur just bad” or something along those lines, as all overly defensive Elementalists do.

Tell you what, go into any tPvP match, fight any team focused around 2 or more Elementalists and Guardians (There are loads of them), WATCH THE MAGIC as you try to kill any of them. Then ask them for their build.

Elementalists are widely accepted as god tier for a kitten good reason.

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Those aren’t lies, all of those things are achievable with build specification, and some are achievable at the same time through hybrids.

It’s hilarious, all I see are Elementalist mainers savagely defending their class from any form of criticism or belief of unbalance… it’s like they’re expecting a inevitable highly necessary nerf of some sort…

Please don’t start a flame here. As long as some certain ones out there KNOW what he is doing, or NOT constantly Crying for Nerf, just Because he is NOT WILLING TO learn how to play, we are not here to waste our time to defend the fact.

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Those aren’t lies, all of those things are achievable with build specification, and some are achievable at the same time through hybrids.

It’s hilarious, all I see are Elementalist mainers savagely defending their class from any form of criticism or belief of unbalance… it’s like they’re expecting a inevitable highly necessary nerf of some sort…

The one who’s expecting excessive nerfs…would be you, if yout think the cantrip ele is what you need to be afraid of…what can I say
Anyway so far your own lack of knowledge of the game in general…it’s mindblowing, you say that with build specification an ele can have burst or go bunker, that’s funny because every profession can do it in their own way…BUT there is no burst/bunker build, do not confuse the damage a bunker can deal on a glass thief or mesmer with pure burst damage, most eles go hybrid ( valkrye) because the trait air line and fire have been poorly designed

And once again, Mr Stealth goes on with his amazing argument of “Ur just bad”

Whilst Arhuendel believes Elementalists are low tier and awful.

Bravo.

I’m done here, I’ve made my point. D/D Elementalist need a nerf, badly, and I think most of the GW2 competitive populace that DON’T main Elementalists would agree.

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Armor of Earth. Mist Form. Constant Regen. Constant Healing. Constant Cleanses. Loads of stun breakers. A bunch of escapes.

How many times have I had to repeat this? ^^^ All of that can be on any build of varying degrees. A full beserk Elementalist can survive for a hell of a lot longer than any of my Necromancers can. Have you ever tried to get a decent condition burst on a good D/D Ele? But of course you’re going to go “ur exaggerating ur just bad” or something along those lines, as all overly defensive Elementalists do.

Tell you what, go into any tPvP match, fight any team focused around 2 or more Elementalists and Guardians, WATCH THE MAGIC as you try to kill any of them. Then ask them for their build.

Elementalists are widely accepted as god tier for a kitten good reason.

Saying that means you know nothing about Eles. Sorry to have Cantrips Constant give you Regeneration, they have at least 20 in Water. (One for Cleansing Wave and one for Smoothing Mist).Does it sound familiar to you? And Constant Cleanes, if they want to achieve that, they need to put 30 In Water. So now you know what Build Now?? A bunchs of Escape, please list all what you know?

Again, how many times do I have to repeat myself???

“Have you ever tried to get a decent condition burst on a good D/D Ele” yes I did, try Signet Build (20/0/30/10/10) pls bf you speak. And please tell me how it is going for you in sPVP.

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

And once again, Mr Stealth goes on with his amazing argument of “Ur just bad”

Whilst Arhuendel believes Elementalists are low tier and awful.

Bravo.

I’m done here, I’ve made my point. D/D Elementalist need a nerf, badly, and I think most of the GW2 competitive populace that DON’T main Elementalists would agree.

Wonderful, thanks you for that. I would rather talk to someone who is listening rather than some QQ who have no idea. Again, Wonderful Leaving.

if you play against a team with eles, you allready know you have to outnumber the fight against the ele.

if the opponent runs 1 ele, me and my team allways go /sigh
if there are 2 or more we keep trying to win the match, but allmost from the start we all kind of know that this match is lost.
we even thought of sending anet a statement by leaving every single match with at least 1 ele – and somehow try to get other people in this boat – we never did, but only getting into such thoughts…

maybe anet realizes that there has to be something wrong about eles if we do so.

the current meta says “no ele, no glory” – thats sad because i really liked the philosophy of “no matter which class you roll, its viable”

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Why would I ever want to use something that isn’t overpowered when there is the one go-to beat-all build for Elementalist?

You make no sense, bro.

Make no sense to you, yes I agree because you refuse to accept the fact and with your Eles is op this, Eles is Op that. Only when you are open minded, you will understand.

Thanks

P/S: Any person with a half brain would understand what I means.

Cheer.

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Armor of Earth. Mist Form. Constant Regen. Constant Healing. Constant Cleanses. Loads of stun breakers. A bunch of escapes.

oh dear, did you check the skills and their cooldowns before posting this? i dont think so, because that word CONSTANT obviously doesnt fit there… maybe regen and vigor after wasting all full traited cantrips with very long cooldown…

Oh but Kito, don’t you know? According to Eles: Eles are underpowered. They need a huge buff to survivability, mobility, and damage. They’re worse than warriors at the moment.

Also, yes I did check the cooldowns on the skills, constant is a variable and vague term generally meaning “Happening with frequency”. Which you cannot deny Elementalists heal often, and can almost always have a Regen boon on them. Ah but what do I know, I’m just another ignorant peon that thinks Elementalist isn’t underpowered.

And according to someone who HAS No idea what he is talking about, Eles is OP. Fanstatic…..

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Mijo.3274:

i’m so disappointed that Anet already declared that they’re goin to nerf cantrip ele, we have only one good build. I just hate all the whiners in the comunity that spend more time tiping on the forums than playing, elementalist is not better than mesmer, ranger, necro, engi and guardian.

Yet another delusional Elementalist thinks his class is balanced with the nonsensical D/D capability. You wouldn’t last 5 minutes using a Warrior against a premade Ele team.

i used the warrior more than the ele, so i know what i say, and OF COURSE i cant “last 5 minutes using a Warrior against a premade Ele team” lol, and btw, if you got owned like nothing by an ele while using a necro, L2P, Corrupt Boon alone rip apart an ele

Mijo.3274:

if you got owned like nothing by an ele while using a necro, L2P, Corrupt Boon alone rip apart an ele

this, im dead almost instantly when im in midfight with a lot of boons

Mijo, did you know that Elementalists have condition removal? Like alot of it. Did you also know that they don’t stack incredible quantities of boons like Guardians? Did you also know that they can reapply boons as fast as they lose them?

Haha it was funny, I actually thought of that… corrupting boons… what a novel idea.

Of course I could just reverse that idea and say “Silly Elementalist, maybe you should l2p and not rely on so many boons.”

Also, I’m rather positive that the main topic was “Why people think Eles is OP” if I remember correctly, not “Tell everyone else to l2p rather than disprove or debate ideas you so blatantly call ignorant”

By the way, I was just curious, if Elementalist is so bad, then maybe you guys can explain to me why every match I ever play has atleast 1, or 4.

Gotta agree with Mighty here.

Hell i play necro….one of my mains. It’s early in the morning, and I laughed my kitten off. Comparing a necro to an ele…….lol.

No boon stripping fantasy, condition spreading wonderland, fairy tale reality, or necroworld of Oz could keep up with an ele’s boon generation and condition removal.

So funny.

Stealth.9324:

Being an Eles, a class that has LOWEST Hp Pool as well as LOWEST Toughness, plus being FORCED into MELEE, how can we stand a chance with all other melee class?We have no Stealth Ability like Thief, No Tanky as Guard or War, No making clone ability as Mesmer, No KB control as Engineer, No Pet protection as Ranger,No Second Health Pool as Necro,so again, how do we survive?

Coming from a thiefplayer:

- You have same health + toughness as Thief
- You have mind. 400 range, melee is something else

- You have protection for very long if traited correct
- You have perma vigor for perma dodge if traited correct
- You have blind + knockback
- You have condition removal without having to think about that if traited correct
- You have very nice heals
- You have great mobility
- You have chilled !!!!
- Your dmg agains other low-heal / toughness targets is very good !

Overall you have to much boons / mechanics you don’t have to think about.

I had very nice duels yesterday against some elementalists.
One lasted the whole time and noone was able to kill the other.

One thing i noticed there, and i already state that.
Ele has to much boons which come without using any util / weapon, its “just” changing attunements.
And thats stupid.

You have a condition on you, fine decide when to remove it-
You are stunned / rooted – fine think if you need to break it and use an ability for it.

As an ele you can do way to many mistakes and are still powerfull, and if someone can play
really well, this profession gives more then any other in the game !

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Mijo, did you know that Elementalists have condition removal? Like alot of it. Did you also know that they don’t stack incredible quantities of boons like Guardians? Did you also know that they can reapply boons as fast as they lose them?

Haha it was funny, I actually thought of that… corrupting boons… what a novel idea.

Of course I could just reverse that idea and say “Silly Elementalist, maybe you should l2p and not rely on so many boons.”

Also, I’m rather positive that the main topic was “Why people think Eles is OP” if I remember correctly, not “Tell everyone else to l2p rather than disprove or debate ideas you so blatantly call ignorant”

By the way, I was just curious, if Elementalist is so bad, then maybe you guys can explain to me why every match I ever play has atleast 1, or 4.

Ah hem. I was a bit over the top. After taking a shower, I am now calmed. Before we go any further, please list to me all the Condition Cleanser that Eles has. Please name at least 5 ways to obtain that with Berzerker Build, again Berzerk Build only.

“Did you also know that they can reapply boons as fast as they lose them?” Please enlight me how to that with 15s CD switching Attument and no point in Arcana.

The main topic here “Why Eles is Op”, correct, but it is created to understand people with reason. For those who claim thing that is UNTRUE,or COMPLETE LIE,like you, we can’t discuss anything with someone who is cluecless about the class or game.

“By the way, I was just curious, if Elementalist is so bad, then maybe you guys can explain to me why every match I ever play has atleast 1, or 4.”, Same I will ask you, If Necro is so bad, why I see Necro in every match, applied to all other class. You know that Queue for sPvP is random matching, (except for premade), the only way you won’t see Eles in every match is to request Eles to be removed COMPLETLY from the game.

Cheer.

Water.

Air.

Fire.

Earth.

That’s pretty much all I need to list, everything the Elementalist needs is within those schools. By the way, how long do you think the cooldown on Corrupt Boons is? Mesmer boonstrip? You reapply boons faster than we can strip them. Unless you dump all of your boons at once, in which case lol

As for the build, pretty much any basic hybrid Condition/Power Elementalist build will do. The glassiest Elementalist I’ve ever seen could heal himself fully and get away before anything bad happened to him. At the very least.

I don’t get why ppl still considering i-leap / blurred / shatter as a good combo. It’s the easiest and most obvious burst. Even bad eles dodge it because of vigor and energy-sigil. If a ele has at least some knowledge of his own class and of the core mechanics of mesmers, it’s impossible to die.

i remember someone (karl, J & J) who has mentioned somewhere (SotG) that in one patch (march 26th) there will be somewhat (boonhate) against something (bunker ele/guard)

im wandering why everybody – even the QQ community – forgot about it.
maybe we can get a dev reply on boonhate? (feels kind of dreaming away…)

lvis.3824:

Stealth.9324:

Being an Eles, a class that has LOWEST Hp Pool as well as LOWEST Toughness, plus being FORCED into MELEE, how can we stand a chance with all other melee class?We have no Stealth Ability like Thief, No Tanky as Guard or War, No making clone ability as Mesmer, No KB control as Engineer, No Pet protection as Ranger,No Second Health Pool as Necro,so again, how do we survive?

Coming from a thiefplayer:

- You have same health + toughness as Thief
- You have mind. 400 range, melee is something else

- You have protection for very long if traited correct
- You have perma vigor for perma dodge if traited correct
- You have blind + knockback
- You have condition removal without having to think about that if traited correct
- You have very nice heals
- You have great mobility
- You have chilled !!!!
- Your dmg agains other low-heal / toughness targets is very good !

Overall you have to much boons / mechanics you don’t have to think about.

I had very nice duels yesterday against some elementalists.
One lasted the whole time and noone was able to kill the other.

One thing i noticed there, and i already state that.
Ele has to much boons which come without using any util / weapon, its “just” changing attunements.
And thats stupid.

You have a condition on you, fine decide when to remove it-
You are stunned / rooted – fine think if you need to break it and use an ability for it.

As an ele you can do way to many mistakes and are still powerfull, and if someone can play
really well, this profession gives more then any other in the game !

Thanks for being constructive. As you said all above, you are correct with we can have them IF TRAITED Correctly. It all does not come for free, to be able to do that, we forced to be in Bunker. And please don’t tell me BUNKER can KIll you Thief. That will make my Thief heart broken.

As for being the same toughness as thief, I disagree, if that is the case, why Anet don’t make Thief wear Light Cloth but Medium????

You know that while Stun, you can’t use any Skill right?And with Rooted, you mean Immobolize or the Skill Entangle of Ranger? I believe any class can break away from Root, not just Eles.

Your dmg agains other low-heal / toughness targets is very good !, if you choose to go Berzerk, I think all other class will you harder than us EVER hit you.

TheMightyAltroll.3485:

Water.

Air.

Fire.

Earth.

That’s pretty much all I need to list, everything the Elementalist needs is within those schools. By the way, how long do you think the cooldown on Corrupt Boons is? Mesmer boonstrip? You reapply boons faster than we can strip them. Unless you dump all of your boons at once, in which case lol

As for the build, pretty much any basic hybrid Condition/Power Elementalist build will do. The glassiest Elementalist I’ve ever seen could heal himself fully and get away before anything bad happened to him. At the very least.

Hm.. Don’t know if u are trying to be not to smart or you actually not to smart, I was asking you list 5 at least Condition Cleanser on Berserker Build and you list all our Attunment which I think everyone know about….

sadly I played against a premade of 5 bunker eles… it made me want to quit this game

in the ctf map (which started as the leaderboards came out) all the ele would have to do is rtl blink pick the orb up before one of us was at it, his buddies would sit next to him aoe healing and wiping off conditions and he’d just rtl and blink to cap the orb… worse yet is when you see one of these or a pack of these roaming in wvw where they come out of nowhere blinking with their earth 5 get about 25 stacks of bleed before you know what hit you and run away whenever they want to – but back to spvp… I’ve seen what you guys are talking about where a good ele is unkillable and it’s sad that people defend this class even if most of them just button mash and target the ground immediately in front of them with no idea what they’re doing… if a player like that can survive then we have a problem

Empathetic Fighter.2065:

I don’t get why ppl still considering i-leap / blurred / shatter as a good combo. It’s the easiest and most obvious burst. Even bad eles dodge it because of vigor and energy-sigil. If a ele has at least some knowledge of his own class and of the core mechanics of mesmers, it’s impossible to die.

Thank you. All I neeed is " If a ele has at least some knowledge of his own class and of the core mechanics of mesmers, it’s impossible to die.", yet some people refuse to learn.

@ Emptahic Fighter

You still havent answered my reply to you.

Leap immobilizes in an aoe around the clone, and you dont have to use immediately after you spawn it. Since the clone has a sword main hand it will keep trying to stay close to the ele and then you have to immobilize him.