Guild Wars 2

To say that spvp is broken is a bit strong, but when you are hitting keys and they don’t work and then you click the corresponding icon on the screen madly and still nothing lets you dodge, you know that the mechanic is very broken.

Dodge didn’t work for most of the spvp games I played tonight – not one spvp game but several.

I can’t show you a screenshot of it not working but I have the screenshots for when it happened and I am sick and tired of the devs putting out podcasts with “high level” players but not taking care of the people who are paying and playing on a more “casual” level.

You promised balance in spvp – yeah, right.

Why am I still seeing things like dodge working in pvE but not PvP?

Why am I still seeing that there are five players on one side and eight players on the other?

Why am I seeing that a player can hit me 65 times and I can’t dodge when it’s just a single player hitting me?

Yep, the thief and it’s not funny any longer, sixty-five hits! is more than just "a bit unbalanced when I have a “pet” that can do nothing and I can do nothing to stop that one single player from hitting me.

This is not only “unbalanced” it’s frustrating compared to other pvp in other games.

When you make a game, the most used components in the long run will be the pvp aspect and the dungeon aspect.

I am an 80 Ranger who is tired of being laughed at and told in game and nastily that I am a bad player and to roll a “warrior”.

I don’t want to play a warrior, I want to be a great Ranger and this game is now allowing those of us with a passion for pets to play to our strengths with this more-than-kitten-broken-spvp.

Why is it I can help in pvE just fine, but when I get into spvp I am toast???

Fix spvp!

You cannot dodge conditions. Bleeding is a condition.

Zeke Minus.5720:

You cannot dodge conditions. Bleeding is a condition.

I hit my heal, it healed, I hit dodge, I can’t dodge…

You’re saying that even if I heal as much as I have it won’t matter? Are you kidding?

This isn’t pvp.

My posting stands and my pictures are a testiment to the unbalance that we are facing as “other” than thieves.

And if what you say is true why aren’t my bleeds hurting them as much as theirs are hurting me ?

No logic whatsoever on this one.

This can be called slaughter, murder and mayhem but it isn’t pvp.

You can dodge all other attacks for the most part, but conditions are the one thing you cannot dodge. Bleed, burn, poison, etc., they all hit you through immunity spells and dodges.

You have to learn to cleanse them when necessary and plan for them if they’re an issue. They can be very potent and sneak up on you since they keep hitting, but many professions have ways to cleanse reliably.

Edit: To be clear, you have tools to remove conditions and you need to find what works best. It’s a part of thinking ahead and not just hitting buttons.

Zeke Minus.5720:

You can dodge all other attacks for the most part, but conditions are the one thing you cannot dodge. Bleed, burn, poison, etc., they all hit you through immunity spells and dodges.

You have to learn to cleanse them when necessary and plan for them if they’re an issue. They can be very potent and sneak up on you since they keep hitting, but many professions have ways to cleanse reliably.

Excuse me but when I am applying bleeds they can dodge!

The more you say, the less sense it makes.

atheria.2837:

Zeke Minus.5720:

You can dodge all other attacks for the most part, but conditions are the one thing you cannot dodge. Bleed, burn, poison, etc., they all hit you through immunity spells and dodges.

You have to learn to cleanse them when necessary and plan for them if they’re an issue. They can be very potent and sneak up on you since they keep hitting, but many professions have ways to cleanse reliably.

Excuse me but when I am applying bleeds they can dodge!

You can dodge the hit that applies the bleed, but once it’s on you, you cannot dodge the bleed damage.

So thieves can mitigate bleeding but a Ranger CAN NOT, how is that remotely balanced????

Heal as One
Heal yourself and your pet.

Healing Spring
Create a spring that heals you, your pet, and your allies. It also cures conditions on allies.

Troll Unguent
You and your pet regenerate health over time.

Thief
Hide in Shadows

Vanish in stealth and gain regeneration. Cures burning, poison, and bleeding. —- Very specific – ours is not so am I being healed or not???

Signet of Malice
Signet
Passive: Heals when you attack.
Active: Gain health.

Withdraw
Roll backward while healing and evade attacks. Cures immobilized, chilled, and crippled.

I can see what you’re getting at, and how it might look. When you use your heal, your are definitely going to have health restored, but unless if says it cures conditions, that bleed is going to keep taking your health. That’s why they’re dangerous, because they keep going until they run out or you take them off.

You aren’t answering the question and neither has anything I’ve seen or researched.

After I have been hit and after I have healed, why can’t I “dodge”?

If you are “healed” you should be able to once again dodge, but when you are being hit by a computer’s freaky fast algorithms (sixty five hits in less than two-three seconds really?) one doesn’t stand a chance and again my post stands.

Pvp means you have a chance, but with most Rangers you will be on the losing side more often than not – not because I don’t know my skill-set or I am not “fast enough” but because the other person has tools that are specific and I do not.

Then spvp for Rangers is truly broken.

If we can’t mitigate a “condition” but the other player can (and they can specifically) then it’s so unbalanced as to be unplayable by many.

before we go for next discussion..

how long do you play the game in sPvP?
And what exactly we blame here?

the fact that you were hit by bleeds true dodge roll?
or you press your dodge button and nothing happened?

…and since “Signet of Renewal” is “supposed” to relieve those “conditions” it’s very broken – there’s nothing else I can do and neither can any other Ranger.

If our Signets don’t work then how in the world are we supposed to compete with those who have specific heals for conditions?

Traits that remove bleeding

Pure of Voice (upon activating a shout) Guardian
Automated Response (when your health reach 25%) Engineer
Empathic Bond (occurs periodically, requires living pet) —what’s periodic? Ranger (alive pet? are you kidding?)
Pain Response (when struck while under 75% health) Thief
Shadow’s Embrace (occurs periodically, must be in stealth) Thief

Again the Thief gets it all.

ah.. i see.. so this is the
“Im blaming everything topic”

ok.. enjoy..

Not blaming “everything” lol!

I am showing that the imbalances are real, they are wrong and they are stopping many from enjoying a game that is tilted to Thieves.

Aragiel.6132:

before we go for next discussion..

how long do you play the game in sPvP?
And what exactly we blame here?

the fact that you were hit by bleeds true dodge roll?
or you press your dodge button and nothing happened?

How about the fact that I have a signet that is supposed to “mitigate” conditions such as bleeds, poison and burning but they aren’t working, so even if I have a “signet” that heals and a “healing spring” going all at the same time I am not healed enough to “dodge” but the thief can and will get out of every single thing I can do no matter what and I will die from being rooted from something I can’t heal, I can’t see and I can’t stop.

If they have two mitigations for one condition how in the world is that “balanced”?

How much have you played Ranger? Since day one?

I have and I love my character and I have always loved pvp but again this is not pvp, it’s just plain old slaughter, no skills, completely unmitigatable damage.

If my signets and healing spring don’t “cure” then what does?

Dying.

nope, you are just showing how you can´t deal with conditions. While the first post was about dodging.. then bleeds, and later on we have some summary of cleansing skills.

Whats the point man? can you be clear and tell us whats your real issue? If you do so.. we might try to help you.

Aragiel.6132:

nope, you are just showing how you can´t deal with conditions. While the first post was about dodging.. then bleeds, and later on we have some summary of cleansing skills.

Whats the point man? can you be clear and tell us whats your real issue? If you do so.. we might try to help you.

You’re apparently not reading my posts, I am using every single “thing” I can to mitigate bleeds, poison and burning but it’s not working… but the thief can just roll away when I hit him with everything I’ve got… right.

The point here is spvp… I have no issues other than being stuck in pvE.

If I can’t dodge, heal or move after applying a healing spring and my signet is active in spvp then what else can I do?

Nothing.

And you didn’t answer…

Are you now and have you played a Ranger?

It’s not easy and sometimes it’s not even fun.

pvE isn’t the game for all of us, many of us are pvp lovers and we want it working correctly.

…that’s what I thought.

When you play Ranger to 80, then talk to me about the mechanics and skills working “properly”.

Right now Ranger isn’t working correctly and this game’s devs know it.

Ok, we are getting closer.
So Thief? How is that thief is getting so many bleeds on you? There is only one build i know so far who is able to do it and thats Caltrops build.

Is that the case? Because normally, thief is a class that can escape from fights.. pretty much like noone else. Its his role. he is this annoying guy who is jumping everywhere bursting and then he has to escape otherwise he is dead.

But your case seems more likely as Caltrops build, where the thief is applying lot of bleeds on you. In that case, its a bit different deal, but at the end its also very easy to handle this build. just stay out of range of caltrops and you will be fine.

btw.. im not high lvl ranger player, i play ranger proffesion lately (lvl 63 in WvW), but so far no issues with thiefes. Ranger is one of best 1v1 proffesions..

Aragiel.6132:

Ok, we are getting closer.
So Thief? How is that thief is getting so many bleeds on you? There is only one build i know so far who is able to do it and thats Caltrops build.

Is that the case? Because normally, thief is a class that can escape from fights.. pretty much like noone else. Its his role. he is this annoying guy who is jumping everywhere bursting and then he has to escape otherwise he is dead.

But your case seems more likely as Caltrops build, where the thief is applying lot of bleeds on you. In that case, its a bit different deal, but at the end its also very easy to handle this build. just stay out of range of caltrops and you will be fine.

The devs will have to tell you how it’s happening…

If my signet is working why am I bleeding out?

If my healing spring is working why aren’t others and myself being “cured” of conditions, why do they continue to “stack” rather than “heal”?

Imbalance isn’t imagined, it’s provable by the over 500 screenshots I’ve taken in the past month or two.

…And saying "stay clear " of a character that can stealth (when it should be just as easy for me to do as a “Ranger”) isn’t going to help one single bit.

Aragiel.6132:

Ok, we are getting closer.
So Thief? How is that thief is getting so many bleeds on you? There is only one build i know so far who is able to do it and thats Caltrops build.

Is that the case? Because normally, thief is a class that can escape from fights.. pretty much like noone else. Its his role. he is this annoying guy who is jumping everywhere bursting and then he has to escape otherwise he is dead.

But your case seems more likely as Caltrops build, where the thief is applying lot of bleeds on you. In that case, its a bit different deal, but at the end its also very easy to handle this build. just stay out of range of caltrops and you will be fine.

btw.. im not high lvl ranger player, i play ranger proffesion lately (lvl 63 in WvW), but so far no issues with thiefes. Ranger is one of best 1v1 proffesions..

I am not talking about WvW, I am talking about spvp, a whole different animal.

Coraliine.1597:

I am so entertained by this thread. /popcorn

Says the “Guardian” who can’t be killed.

Thanks for the griefing.

Thought that was against the rules.

I admire a few of the noble and patient souls here.

“If my healing spring is working why aren’t others and myself being “cured” of conditions, why do they continue to “stack” rather than “heal”?”

There are builds where thieves can apply stacks of bleeding quickly, and it is possible that they are “stacking” much faster than you are “healing”.

Chriswck.6490:

I admire a few of the noble and patient souls here.

---

“If my healing spring is working why aren’t others and myself being “cured” of conditions, why do they continue to “stack” rather than “heal”?”

There are builds where thieves can apply stacks of bleeding quickly, and it is possible that they are “stacking” much faster than you are “healing”.

So you’re saying, in essence, that I have no chance because my skills/traits/builds are no match for a Thief.

Yep, really a lot of help there.

Griefing isn’t washing here. Not at all.

Empathic Bond (occurs periodically, requires living pet) >>>periodic does not mean you will cleanse from condition after you are struck by a skill which gives you condition. It will cleanse you every 10 s. (in 2.5 s, it will cleanse you once).

Healing Spring’s conditions removal also works only once (but if it works like ele healing skill, then its every 3 s).

The problem with you cannot dodge from an attack which immobilized you (and you break it by and ability) but its rarely happen (the only thing I noted is usually you cannot move (which can be fix by dodge/moving your character with some skills).

Condition which had been applied to you cannot be dodged.

Sure you do. Those “bleeder” thieves usually apply a lot of bleeding through Death Blossom and the trait Uncatchable. Regardless of profession, one way is to stay away from them and keep them from coming close. If engagement is inevitable, dodge their Blossoms and avoid the Caltrops from Uncatchable.

Not sure if troll, but if not it’s clear you don’t have a basic understanding of this game mechanics, I’m sorry.

deviller.9135:

Empathic Bond (occurs periodically, requires living pet) >>>periodic does not mean you will cleanse from condition after you are struck by a skill which gives you condition. It will cleanse you every 10 s. (in 2.5 s, it will cleanse you once).

Healing Spring’s conditions removal also works only once (but if it works like ele healing skill, then its every 3 s).

The problem with you cannot dodge from an attack which immobilized you (and you break it by and ability) but its rarely happen (the only thing I noted is usually you cannot move (which can be fix by dodge/moving your character with some skills).

Condition which had been applied to you cannot be dodged.

So nothing I do will work, thanks, got it.

…And you aren’t understanding; I am not trying to “dodge” the effect after it’s on, I am trying to dodge after I’ve done all I can (signet and healing at the same time) and still can not dodge , that’s not just a balance issue, that’s making sure that the Ranger isn’t a viable character in the game at all.

Adwila.1392:

Not sure if troll, but if not it’s clear you don’t have a basic understanding of this game mechanics, I’m sorry.

What you just said * is trolling *

I have a very good understanding of the mechanics and saying I do not is wrong and extremely mean when you can’t see me playing.

No, you don’t have a “very good understanding” of the game mechanics, based on your posts and random ramblings it’s quite clear that you, in fact, don’t.
I’m sorry if I may seem rude but you just kept on saying you can’t dodge/heal those bleeding stacks…well you know that Bleeding is just ONE condition, so Healing Spring would suffice in removing it, and if it doesn’t you still have Spirit of Nature, which is quite strong aswell as you can use it just before you die and resurrect yourself.

Adwila.1392:

No, you don’t have a “very good understanding” of the game mechanics, based on your posts and you random rambling it’s quite clear that you, in fact, don’t.
I’m sorry if I may seem rude but you just kept on saying you can’t dodge/heal those bleeding stacks…well you know that Bleeding is just ONE condition, so Healing Spring would suffice in removing it, and if it doesn’t you still have Spirit of Nature, which is quite strong aswell as you can use it just before you die and resurrect yourself aswell.

When you are playing a Ranger and know what you are talking about, let us all know.

I am popping Healing Spring and my Signet of Renewal at the same time and it’s still not removing the conditions enough to dodge.

Tired of the griefing and the non-answers to the unbalances and the uber-power/stealthing of other characters.

When you play a Ranger to 80 then talk, until then you have no idea what you are talking about – and it shows – Guardian.

Hi everyone,

Please refrain from engaging in personal attacks or other non helpful behaviour. We have seen some unappropriate comments in this thread. Try to be constructive.

Thanks for your understanding

Aragiel.6132:

before we go for next discussion..

how long do you play the game in sPvP?
And what exactly we blame here?

the fact that you were hit by bleeds true dodge roll?
or you press your dodge button and nothing happened?

I play spvp more than I pvE.

What do you mean it’s not removing the conditions enough to dodge? What you keep saying in this thread makes no sense, we tried to help you, you keep babbling nonsense, and let me tell you one more thing, the fact that I main Guardian means nothing, as I know every single class since I had to learn them in order to play Paid TPvP in a competitive way.

Adwila.1392:

What do you mean it’s not removing the conditions enough to dodge? What you keep saying in this thread makes no sense, we tried to help you, you keep babbling nonsense, and let me tell you one more thing, the fact that I main Guardian means nothing, as I know every single class since I had to learn them in order to play Paid TPvP in a competitive way.

I answered – and showed what happened by way of my screenshots.

Hitting my “Signet of Removal” and my “Healing Spring” at basically the same time didn’t mitigate squat – so how is that “fair” when thieves have two mechanisms to specifically remove those conditions and I do not???

I am not talking about tPvP – did you even read my postings?

This is about sPvP not tPvP and they are two different animals.

Mechanics are the same in both tPvP and sPvP. If a Caltrop Thief is stacking 20+ stacks of bleeds on you because you stand on those nails, it’s true for both sPvP and tPvP, also I wasn’t talking about tPvP I was just telling you how things are since you judge other people based on what class they’re playing, and assume they have no knowledge of other classes whatsoever.
But I digress, we all tried to understand what the problem was here but nothing came out of it, I’m outta here.

Adwila.1392:

Mechanics are the same in both tPvP and sPvP. If a Caltrop Thief is stacking 20+ stacks of bleeds on you because you stand on those nails, it’s true for both sPvP and tPvP, also I wasn’t talking about tPvP I was just telling you how things are since you judge other people based on what class they’re playing, and assume they have no knowledge of other classes whatsoever.
But I digress, we all tried to understand what the problem was here but nothing came out of it, I’m outta here.

You didn’t answer a single part of my posting.

You didn’t answer how I can hit “both” of my “mitigation” skills and still not be able to dodge before going into a downed state… right.

Did you have enough endurance to dodge? did you completely remove the conditions? were you rooted?

3 stacks per attack + 3 attacks = 9 stacks, which will hit 63 times over 7 seconds, no doubt being reapplied in that time.

You can’t dodge a condition that is already active, and if you use condition removal you might not remove the bleed, but another condition instead.

I’m not sure how the ranger signet works, whether your pet pulls all conditions off you to itself or only allies, but what I’ve told you so far is facts.

Don’t get angry at people who are trying to help you bro.

Daltonymous.7259:

Did you have enough endurance to dodge? did you completely remove the conditions? were you rooted?

3 stacks per attack + 3 attacks = 9 stacks, which will hit 63 times over 7 seconds, no doubt being reapplied in that time.

You can’t dodge a condition that is already active, and if you use condition removal you might not remove the bleed, but another condition instead.

I’m not sure how the ranger signet works, whether your pet pulls all conditions off you to itself or only allies, but what I’ve told you so far is facts.

Don’t get angry at people who are trying to help you bro.

I am not a “bro” – very female here

Endurance is where in Ranger? Where do you see the bar if it’s a bar?

…And I am not the angry one.

Upset about the state of the pvp game-play, yes, angry, no.

I don’t know if I was rooted, but the conditions are supposed to be removed and I used all I had to remove them – popped after I was hit but the hits kept coming, I couldn’t move and my dodge should have worked somewhere in there….

It seems that it’s getting worse since I used to do better before the last patch.

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/8/88/Skill_bar.jpg

the yellow bars above health is endurance, it goes down when you dodge and refills slowly, if its empty you cant dodge.

I know you probably already know this, but always keep an eye on that.

Another thing, is most abilities that claim to remove conditions remove them one at a time. I do not know if thats the case for healing spring or your signet, but I’m presuming so.

65 hits from bleed isn’t unusual either, a higher health pool might help with that, although removing it is always the best way to go if you can. Also bear in mind that if its removed, it can sometimes be re-applied straight away if they are paying attention to your buff bar (as any decent condition spec player should be doing).

Hope this helps some.

Daltonymous.7259:

http://wiki.guildwars2.com/images/8/88/Skill_bar.jpg

the yellow bars above health is endurance, it goes down when you dodge and refills slowly, if its empty you cant dodge.

I know you probably already know this, but always keep an eye on that.

Another thing, is most abilities that claim to remove conditions remove them one at a time. I do not know if thats the case for healing spring or your signet, but I’m presuming so.

65 hits from bleed isn’t unusual either, a higher health pool might help with that, although removing it is always the best way to go if you can. Also bear in mind that if its removed, it can sometimes be re-applied straight away if they are paying attention to your buff bar (as any decent condition spec player should be doing).

Hope this helps some.

Yes, my endurance bar (which isn’t and never has been “labled” as such in game) was at full each and every time I popped both skills – no reason I should not have been able to dodge.

I was trying to understand this part “I can’t dodge” but still don’t get it. Is it that you can’t actually dodge (something wrong with mechanic), or you can’t dodge to avoid bleed condition being applied?
If it’s the first one, then maybe u spent your endurance, or you’re rooted, dazed etc…
If it’s the second one, as someone said, you can’t dodge those. Try to move from AoE bleed stacking fields, because those are just reapply those bleeds right after you remove those conditions.

One other thing…you asked how is that your bleeds don’t do as much damage is theirs do…you can also trait for +bleed duration and +bleed damage…

Hi atheria, I share your pain with those bleeding thieves….. Everyday its like a new ranger killer thief build comes out, but I think the challange and perhaps masachistic fun is to think of counter builds.

But I digress. I’m pretty certain you are facing a deathblossoming caltrop farter thief. They are usually slightly tougher than the average HS spammer. Is it one that farts out some caltrops, does some artsyfartsy deathblossoming and then disappears before you can lay three or four of your ranger burst abilities (err, I mean auto-attack) on them? Comes back out of steath fully healed and rinse and repeat? The best way to beat this guy is with the elite spirit and a boon-bot build and an axe. Healing spring is good because it removes a? condition, but because its fixed in one place, the thief is probably going to fart caltops on top of it, limiting its effectiveness.

Unfortunately, its easy-peazy for the thief to withdraw once he sees things aren’t going well, and also the boon-bot build is not really heaps of fun if you like to pew pew.

Alternatively you could try going for traps, actually thief is pretty weak to conditions as they don’t have a condition removal utility. You’ll have to run the renewal signet, 30 point trait in WS, and bring some wolves (fear gets them out of the invisible dome, and limits their postioning).

I say use axe, because as long as there is something to bounce off- treb, another enemy- you can keep the pressure on even when the caltrop farter is in stealth.

You will also need lots of luck. But be thankful you are only facing a caltrop farter and not a really powerful thief build……

Yasha.5963:

Hi atheria, I share your pain with those bleeding thieves….. Everyday its like a new ranger killer thief build comes out, but I think the challange and perhaps masachistic fun is to think of counter builds.

But I digress. I’m pretty certain you are facing a deathblossoming caltrop farter thief. They are usually slightly tougher than the average HS spammer. Is it one that farts out some caltrops, does some artsyfartsy deathblossoming and then disappears before you can lay three or four of your ranger burst abilities (err, I mean auto-attack) on them? Comes back out of steath fully healed and rinse and repeat? The best way to beat this guy is with the elite spirit and a boon-bot build and an axe. Healing spring is good because it removes a? condition, but because its fixed in one place, the thief is probably going to fart caltops on top of it, limiting its effectiveness.

Unfortunately, its easy-peazy for the thief to withdraw once he sees things aren’t going well, and also the boon-bot build is not really heaps of fun if you like to pew pew.

Alternatively you could try going for traps, actually thief is pretty weak to conditions as they don’t have a condition removal utility. You’ll have to run the renewal signet, 30 point trait in WS, and bring some wolves (fear gets them out of the invisible dome, and limits their postioning).

I say use axe, because as long as there is something to bounce off- treb, another enemy- you can keep the pressure on even when the caltrop farter is in stealth.

You will also need lots of luck. But be thankful you are only facing a caltrop farter and not a really powerful thief build……

I disagree with one thing you said:

Alternatively you could try going for traps, actually thief is pretty weak to conditions as* they don’t have a condition removal utility.*

Uh, yes they do, specific removal of conditions such as bleeding – Ranger’s don’t.

Ours seem to be more of a " remove “a” condition" and it doesn’t help.

Funny that I can’t see any of the postings in this thread now….

Here’s the screenshot:

Why isn’t the thread showing to me now?

sigh

sPvP isn’t the only thing broken.

This thread made my day. Thanks for the laughs.
I’m 100% sure that ranger condition remove skills work.
What is happening most likely is you not noticing the caltrops field, removing the conditions while standing inside the cripple/bleed AoE and instantly getting new bleeds on you. On the 2nd screenshot you posted you’re actually getting bleeds from mesmer illusions.

And the 50-60 hits you have on screenshots are from bleed ticks not direct attacks, they can’t be avoided after applied, only cleansed. I’ve had a deathscreen with near 300 hits from bleeds when I used a tanky build with loads of condition removals.

For the thief build just kite the LDB thief and range him down. That build has horrible mobility and you as a ranger should have no problem facing him.

Hate to say or use this term, but a pure example of L2P issue.